Marilyn and Sara examine rituals of trials (all–sorts) and home, and the testing of faith. We see parents and children who keep talking past each other, recognize that Pharazôn is walking on a path of seawater as the rituals of power-over fail him, and wonder if Nenya really would work with Morgoth’s crown. And once again, the sea is always right.
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00:13 --> 00:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Hello and welcome back to Rings and Ritual Season 2, where today we will be examining where is he, Episode 6 of Season 2 of the pain-immigase series Rings of Power, and we're doing this in preparation for the introduction of Season 3 in November.
00:29 --> 00:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Marilyn, the librarian of Revendale, and I'm Sarah, she'll maiden of Rohan.
00:35 --> 00:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And whether you've listened to all of our episodes from Season 1, or this is the first time you've ever heard of us, we're delighted you're here.
00:43 --> 00:51 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be following our pattern from Season 1 by reviewing what we mean by ritual and then applying those concepts to the different examples of ritual that we find in the series.
00:53 --> 00:58 [SPEAKER_00]: From this, we'll discuss how pain and decay depicted the cultures that they were adopting to their series.
00:59 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_01]: do get in touch with us.
01:00 --> 01:04 [SPEAKER_01]: The feedback is flowing in now which is lovely and we're always happy to receive more.
01:05 --> 01:13 [SPEAKER_01]: You can email us at rings and rituals at the lorehounds.com or you can join our rings and rituals channel on the lorehounds discord.
01:14 --> 01:16 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll include all that information the show notes for you.
01:17 --> 01:30 [SPEAKER_00]: And we want to say that we are a proud affiliate of the Laura Hound's Barovian Broadcasting Network, where you will find all sorts of interesting podcasts on TV, films, books, video games, and other stories.
01:32 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So as we said, we'll be identifying any rituals that we see in this episode, and wow, is there a doozy of a ritual in this episode, for really is.
01:41 --> 01:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Hold on to your hats and get your
01:46 --> 01:50 [SPEAKER_00]: and we will be discussing all of the rituals from the perspective of the intention.
01:51 --> 01:56 [SPEAKER_00]: The outcomes, the musical background, and what the ritual tells us about the culture it is depicting.
01:57 --> 02:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And we may come up with some other discussion points along the way.
02:00 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we've done that once or twice before, so I would just think.
02:03 --> 02:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Just one sort of twice.
02:04 --> 02:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a rarity, obviously, because you and I, we don't really talk about this sort of thing all that much.
02:11 --> 02:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, digression, anything, body, context.
02:14 --> 02:15 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, carry on.
02:16 --> 02:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Now before all of that we'll have a quick break and when we come back we'll bring you the meat or the tofu for our vegan and vegetarian listeners without that quail sauce
02:36 --> 02:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back.
02:38 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_00]: While our main focus is on ritual, to aid our listeners' memories, we'll begin each section with a synopsis of events.
02:45 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Please note, we are doing full-on spoilers from both seasons throughout these episodes.
02:51 --> 02:57 [SPEAKER_00]: If that isn't what you want, then go back and binge the entire day of seasons one and two, and then come back and join us.
02:58 --> 02:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Shall I get us started?
02:59 --> 03:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, please do.
03:01 --> 03:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Around their dispatches, three works, and finds a map of the Uruk's plans to attack Eureggen.
03:09 --> 03:13 [SPEAKER_00]: In Eureggen, Kilobrimbor's strain is clearly showing.
03:14 --> 03:23 [SPEAKER_00]: And after he refuses to hold an audience with his people, and the Tart encourages him to go deeper into his own mind to complete the work on the nine.
03:23 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_00]: And allow Anatart to take care of all the details.
03:28 --> 03:37 [SPEAKER_00]: The delegation tells Anathod that all foot-traffic has ceased coming into the city, and only one scout returned from the party sent out to learn more.
03:38 --> 03:45 [SPEAKER_00]: The scout has a message carved on his chest, too, which only Sauron can read.
03:46 --> 03:48 [SPEAKER_00]: It says, where is he?
03:50 --> 04:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Anna-Tar tells Murdhania that the Smiths have been stripped of their duties, and she must tell no one else about that, or about what has been found, thus completing Kelebrimbor's isolation.
04:01 --> 04:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Anna-Tar stares into the forest beyond the river, it appears to see something that no one else can.
04:05 --> 04:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Dandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandandand
04:15 --> 04:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh, then Adara tells Galagia that he believes that the power of Morgoth's crown can bind with that of the three Elven Rings would be strong enough to defeat Sauron, which is their mutual goal.
04:26 --> 04:35 [SPEAKER_01]: He tells her that Halbrand is Sauron, and is now in the heart of Eregion, and Urges her to put aside her pride and join forces with the Uruks to defeat him.
04:35 --> 04:41 [SPEAKER_01]: So we've got a meanwhile over here going on while all of that is happening between Sauron,
04:44 --> 04:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, we do, and I noticed in this scene with Adar and Galadriel as in the first season, we get this Dutch camera angle again.
04:54 --> 04:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Hmm, do you want to explain that for the folks in case anyone's not sure what that is?
04:58 --> 05:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely, it's like they took the camera and they tilted it sideways for about, I don't know, not 90, maybe 45 degrees, 40 degrees, something like that.
05:07 --> 05:08 [SPEAKER_00]: It just is very unsettling.
05:09 --> 05:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really discombobulating.
05:11 --> 05:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and I think it's a visual language to say, these two are not on the same level.
05:20 --> 05:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
05:21 --> 05:22 [SPEAKER_00]: They're not on the same plane.
05:22 --> 05:27 [SPEAKER_00]: They're just, if that is ever going to happen, is highly doubtful.
05:28 --> 05:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, and that angle makes us feel unsettled as we're watching it because it feels totally unnatural.
05:35 --> 05:36 [SPEAKER_00]: It's, it is, it's utterly unnatural.
05:38 --> 05:47 [SPEAKER_00]: So, excellent technique for creating this sense of tension and disease and how, how you think these two people can sit at either end of a table loaded with food.
05:48 --> 05:53 [SPEAKER_00]: and come to any kind of agreement is puzzling to say the least, if he is.
05:53 --> 05:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so we had to mention a Morgos crown.
05:59 --> 06:04 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know the rituals involved in the making of Morgos crown and frankly, I don't want to know.
06:04 --> 06:09 [SPEAKER_01]: No, not so much because I have a feeling there a bit grim to say the least.
06:10 --> 06:13 [SPEAKER_00]: But we do know that its intended purpose was domination.
06:16 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_00]: by contrast, the intended purpose of the oven brings is healing.
06:21 --> 06:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Although that healing means stopping a natural process of fading, so healing with a bit of mhm, and balls, perhaps.
06:30 --> 06:35 [SPEAKER_00]: In any case, definitely more healing than vodka's crowd ever could be.
06:36 --> 06:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm just wondering, so I could two such powerful creations be used together for one purpose when they seem to be so diametrically opposed.
06:44 --> 07:02 [SPEAKER_01]: That whole idea makes me feel incredibly uncomfortable, actually, because the idea that you could have the crown of morgoth working in any way alongside the Elven Rings, that no, I don't like that idea at all.
07:02 --> 07:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And I honestly really hope that that's not intended in any way by the showrunners because I find that a disturbing idea.
07:12 --> 07:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think it's an idea that comes whole cloth out of Adha's own mind.
07:18 --> 07:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And it just no accrues to me.
07:19 --> 07:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm wondering if they're using that as a means of telling us just how much Adha still feels like an elf.
07:26 --> 07:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe.
07:27 --> 07:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you think about it, the first thing he said to her in greeting this in this season was that classic elders greeting.
07:35 --> 07:38 [SPEAKER_01]: That's in a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit.
07:38 --> 07:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
07:39 --> 07:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, exactly.
07:41 --> 07:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe he's kind of trying to telegraph, to go lauderele, hey, I really am one of you, despite the looks and oh, by the way, the blood shed, the blood children have been engaged in, and not very small detail.
07:53 --> 07:58 [SPEAKER_00]: On the other hand, you haven't exactly kept your hands clean when it comes to blood shed, either.
07:58 --> 08:06 [SPEAKER_00]: She has not, so maybe not quite so far apart as she would like to think, and he was
08:09 --> 08:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, good luck with that.
08:11 --> 08:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I think so.
08:13 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_01]: That does not seem to be the collagerial that we're getting in this particular series.
08:18 --> 08:20 [SPEAKER_00]: No, much assuredly not.
08:20 --> 08:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Much assuredly not.
08:23 --> 08:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So do you want to do the meanwhile in Numenor?
08:26 --> 08:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, absolutely.
08:28 --> 08:30 [SPEAKER_00]: On trial for the crime of treason.
08:31 --> 08:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Elendale confesses to that crime, but refuses to acknowledge Thadason, saying that the only true ruler of Numanor is myrial daughter of Taraparanthir.
08:43 --> 08:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Lord Bells-Ligar suggests that since the faithful wish to live by the old ways, Elendale should be tried by the old ways.
08:52 --> 08:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Depicted in a text with a sea monster.
08:55 --> 09:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm, and some body of some human type form, very close to its things.
09:02 --> 09:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, which I think it just depicts exactly what Lord Bell's a guard would like to have happen to a lendial, actually.
09:09 --> 09:12 [SPEAKER_01]: You think power is just going on here?
09:12 --> 09:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, monster show, monster show.
09:15 --> 09:18 [SPEAKER_01]: But we do have some really interesting stuff now.
09:18 --> 09:21 [SPEAKER_01]: This is where that doozy of a ritual begins.
09:22 --> 09:28 [SPEAKER_01]: We have this contrast of the ritual of law and the ritual of trial by sea monster.
09:28 --> 09:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And that should be a great contrast, shouldn't it?
09:31 --> 09:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the ritual of law should be that which follows something that is laid down
09:39 --> 09:45 [SPEAKER_01]: that people have followed for a long time because this is what we believe to be right and just.
09:46 --> 09:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And we have trial by Seem monster on the other side of that.
09:51 --> 09:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, interest to the first word that came to my mind when you were speaking was precedent.
09:56 --> 09:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I think of law having precedent.
10:00 --> 10:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think of law coming from texts.
10:02 --> 10:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, obviously they have written texts.
10:10 --> 10:22 [SPEAKER_00]: of, you know, potentially executing a man for treason because he is following one monarch instead of the other, carefully not looking at the questionable way in which
10:23 --> 10:28 [SPEAKER_00]: the original monarch has been um sidelines shall we say?
10:28 --> 10:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm, where is the legal precedent in that please?
10:31 --> 10:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Can you show me in your texts anywhere?
10:34 --> 10:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Whereas the trail by sea, there it is.
10:36 --> 10:38 [SPEAKER_00]: It's written down with color illustration.
10:39 --> 10:44 [SPEAKER_00]: So it seems there's a much longer history of ritual trial by sea monster.
10:45 --> 10:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Then there is of whatever form they're using here it just seems to me they're only form of law is might makes right
10:54 --> 11:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and it's interesting that Lord Bell's Agar says that these are, in fact, the old ways.
11:02 --> 11:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, carefully says the old ways, doesn't necessarily mean the ways of the faithful.
11:08 --> 11:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that those might be two different things.
11:12 --> 11:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.
11:13 --> 11:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I hadn't thought about that.
11:14 --> 11:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Good catch.
11:16 --> 11:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So I like the fact that you've pointed out that this
11:23 --> 11:25 [SPEAKER_01]: but it's written down.
11:25 --> 11:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's clearly something that at some point was an accepted way of dealing with things.
11:32 --> 11:37 [SPEAKER_00]: But law, law is the thing that we're supposed to follow surely.
11:38 --> 11:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you'd like to think so.
11:40 --> 11:44 [SPEAKER_00]: And notice neither of these trials involves a jury of one's peers.
11:45 --> 11:47 [SPEAKER_00]: No, especially the sea monster ones.
11:47 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_00]: But I mean, I really hope the sea monster has no peers.
11:50 --> 11:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's a scary thought.
11:53 --> 11:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But both of them are intended to determine the truth in a very public way.
11:59 --> 12:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Reminds me of old rituals, like...
12:03 --> 12:23 [SPEAKER_01]: things like tying up a suspected witch and throwing them in the river and then if they sink, whoops, sorry you were innocent too bad and if you floated well in that case you were lifted up by the devil and we're going to hang you or burn you depending on when and where exactly this takes place.
12:23 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean that's an old way of doing things.
12:27 --> 12:37 [SPEAKER_01]: doesn't really involve jury ones peers and it's a way of determining truth and you can notice the scare quotes in my voice.
12:37 --> 12:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I did tell him that truth in a very poppin way, but that truth is defined by somebody here, isn't it?
12:44 --> 12:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it absolutely isn't.
12:45 --> 12:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I noticed that they don't even take time to weigh a lentil to see if he weighs more or less than a half can't go wood.
12:51 --> 12:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, I
12:54 --> 13:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think there's much to support this particular, well, let's call it a kangaroo court because that's kind of what it is at least in US terms.
13:06 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if there's another term for that in other cultures, but kangaroo court is something that we recognize, although interesting that's an American cultural thing when kangaroo,
13:18 --> 13:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, it comes all from all the way halfway around the world indeed.
13:22 --> 13:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so I suspect we might have to call this more sea monster court Then kind of cool court.
13:28 --> 13:39 [SPEAKER_00]: It is a sea monster court, but I think a bunch of the people in that hall are well Maybe it's offensive to call them kangaroos to the animal to the creature But yeah, thanks.
13:39 --> 13:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, they're all playing parts.
13:41 --> 13:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's put it that way
13:43 --> 13:49 [SPEAKER_01]: They are, and most of them have an interest in a lendiel being found guilty.
13:50 --> 14:16 [SPEAKER_00]: it seems to be so it seems that they've packed the court with supporters of photos on although every so often they do show us shots of I think there was a shot of three women sitting together huddled in a corner and kind of saying oh no oh no oh no but that's as much resistance as they feel comfortable giving at this point and and that's the point isn't it um I think showing us three women sitting in a corner just shaking their heads but not saying
14:17 --> 14:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that tells us the powerlessness of those who believe in a lentil and agree with him there's very little that they can do the power is not on their side which of course is not how law is supposed to be absolutely not.
14:34 --> 14:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So Sara what's happening to the stranger right now?
14:37 --> 14:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well, the strangers having some bad dreams, dreams of Norrie.
14:42 --> 14:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And Tom, remember he's with Tom Bomberdill, tells him that the secret fire can speak to people through dreams, but is impatient with the strangers persistent desire to master that fire.
14:55 --> 15:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And he decides to take the stranger to face one more trial, find his staff among hundreds of branches of a grove of dead trees.
15:03 --> 15:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Tom tells the stranger that he will only find his staff when his heart is dedicated entirely to the service of the secret fire.
15:12 --> 15:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And the stranger tells Tom that he saw a vision of Nori's death and feels he is responsible for saving her.
15:18 --> 15:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Tom tells him that if he leaves now he can never return to the party is currently on and promptly disappears.
15:25 --> 15:27 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so helpful, very helpful.
15:27 --> 15:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Nice one, Todd.
15:28 --> 15:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Not.
15:30 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And yet there's layers within layers of all these statements of Tom.
15:35 --> 15:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, they're very careful with their rich voice here, but in what ways, if any, do you think that the strangers' trials are rituals?
15:45 --> 15:53 [SPEAKER_01]: They feel like their rituals because there seems to be kind of almost like a set path that you have to take through these trials.
15:54 --> 16:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, this is a path that has been trotting before and not just by the stranger, in which case, if they are somehow laid down,
16:05 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And then I am a pentameter, then I think that we could actually point to them as being ritualistic.
16:12 --> 16:20 [SPEAKER_01]: If this is something that the stranger must get through before he can achieve what it is that he needs to achieve.
16:22 --> 16:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I have the feeling I can't point to a place where I was made explicit, but I thought that Tom had indicated that this is what he had done with the first wizard to show up at his house.
16:35 --> 16:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it does seem to have been others that have trodden this path before the strange official.
16:41 --> 16:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And seeing how that wizard ended up, I'm not sure why Tom is continuing to use the same method.
16:48 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the very definition of madness remind me, remind me, yes.
16:52 --> 16:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yes, something about doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result.
16:57 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Hmm, yeah.
17:00 --> 17:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if your ritual has just produced like evil wizard, maybe change up the ritual, just a thought.
17:08 --> 17:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Just a part, just a hint there for Mr. Bombadil if you'd like to pay attention.
17:13 --> 17:20 [SPEAKER_00]: So he's clearly, or at least expresses that he is clearly familiar with the secret fire.
17:27 --> 17:46 [SPEAKER_01]: It is, and here is one of the places in this particular episode, where I had a few problems, because the idea of the strangers desire to master the secret fire, surely not.
17:47 --> 17:51 [SPEAKER_01]: The secret fire resides with the Louvre Tar, it is for him to use.
17:52 --> 17:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And the wizards are servants on the secret fire.
17:57 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And how master something and be a servant to it?
18:01 --> 18:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Not so much.
18:02 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I'm wondering if initially when the first wizard came over, maybe his meteorite was a little more gentle, but it may be that he retained a memory of the secret fire.
18:21 --> 18:26 [SPEAKER_00]: And so Tom didn't feel like he had to keep telling you.
18:26 --> 18:28 [SPEAKER_00]: He walked in saying, I am a servant of the secret fire.
18:29 --> 18:30 [SPEAKER_00]: And Tom.
18:30 --> 18:30 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll be brave.
18:31 --> 18:31 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be brave.
18:31 --> 18:32 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be brave.
18:32 --> 18:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably not.
18:33 --> 18:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably not that.
18:35 --> 18:40 [SPEAKER_01]: But Tom was full of the first time if one can wrap one's mind around such an interesting concept.
18:47 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So this time he feels he does have to do something else to determine what is actually inside this person And you kind of think that Tom is pretty good at reading people both what they say and they don't say, but You would either know I don't know they're not giving us a lot of information on this score of afraid so we just have to take what we get And move along
19:11 --> 19:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Nauri asks the gun, why the stores can't just leave and fight your new place.
19:17 --> 19:20 [SPEAKER_00]: The gun explains that this isn't just a place.
19:21 --> 19:22 [SPEAKER_00]: This is home.
19:23 --> 19:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Nauri is thinking that it would have been better if she just gave herself up to the raiders.
19:27 --> 19:27 [SPEAKER_00]: But Poppy.
19:28 --> 19:42 [SPEAKER_00]: who let us also say is having feelings for Metermack tells her that she herself has started to believe not his insistence that the stranger is important and that the dark wizard will only use nori to find the stranger.
19:43 --> 19:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Poppy says they must fight.
19:45 --> 19:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yay Poppy!
19:46 --> 19:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Yay Poppy!
19:47 --> 19:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, she's really coming into her self-isn't she?
19:50 --> 19:52 [SPEAKER_00]: She's no longer being led by the nose, by Nori.
19:53 --> 19:58 [SPEAKER_00]: No, she absolutely is and I mean we know that she had been designated as the pathfinder.
20:00 --> 20:16 [SPEAKER_00]: after Sadduq and so she's stepping at she's claiming her family heritage because remember it was her mother's song that turned out to be the you know the oral recollections of the directions
20:17 --> 20:31 [SPEAKER_00]: and the whole backstory of where the hardwoods came from and maybe this is why the hardwoods are wandering out because at some point Nortie tells the gun, you know, we never did find our home.
20:32 --> 20:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So she doesn't understand what home means, but the gun does tell her some things.
20:38 --> 20:41 [SPEAKER_00]: about why this is home, right?
20:41 --> 20:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm, she talks about your her parents dug out this place.
20:46 --> 20:47 [SPEAKER_00]: She was born there.
20:48 --> 20:56 [SPEAKER_00]: She planted the tree, which is now this great big arching thing with a trunk, a big around his eye, I'm, et cetera, et cetera.
20:56 --> 21:00 [SPEAKER_00]: She married her husband under that tree and she buried him under that tree.
21:01 --> 21:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Now this takes me back to one of my very earliest comments about the hardwoods.
21:07 --> 21:13 [SPEAKER_00]: They can't bury their beloved debt because they are wandering people, so they just don't have that kind of a concept.
21:15 --> 21:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Physical home becomes a very small, it becomes that wagon, that unit, that's the family unit, and it's the closest that they will come to home.
21:35 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm, I'm, it seems to be like a new idea for Nauri.
21:40 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think?
21:41 --> 21:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yes, definitely.
21:43 --> 21:51 [SPEAKER_01]: The idea of putting down roots, staying in one place, and calling that place home is completely alien to her way of life.
21:52 --> 22:05 [SPEAKER_01]: kind of not a surprise that she doesn't really understand and that she tries to persuade the gun that the best thing to do is upsticks and go because that's exactly what her people would do if she was trouble danger on the horizon.
22:05 --> 22:06 [SPEAKER_01]: They would just go.
22:07 --> 22:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And it may be that Nori's grandfather made their traveling care of end for their particular family.
22:14 --> 22:16 [SPEAKER_00]: So there might be some similarities.
22:16 --> 22:19 [SPEAKER_00]: But I think the distinctions are really clear.
22:19 --> 22:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm really glad that they gave us this opportunity to get yet another understanding of how these two cultures, though both presumably Proto-Vabits and the end, have developed very differently.
22:31 --> 22:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And as a result, have developed different rituals.
22:37 --> 22:41 [SPEAKER_01]: So this is home for this particular people.
22:42 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_01]: What rituals make a home for them?
22:46 --> 22:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
22:47 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's all the things that I listed, you know, the fact that you have an ancestral line connecting you to the origin of this structure that was made for you.
22:58 --> 23:03 [SPEAKER_00]: You can bury your dead in a place that remains stable and you can go and visit them and honor it.
23:03 --> 23:07 [SPEAKER_00]: You can plant a tree and watch it grow over decades.
23:08 --> 23:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It's that sense of permanence.
23:10 --> 23:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
23:10 --> 23:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Rooching your memories in that land.
23:13 --> 23:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
23:15 --> 23:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And you notice that it's very easy for the gun to to name these things.
23:19 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't actually see this, but I could picture a blessing of a threshold when, say, a new couple comes together.
23:29 --> 23:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know, decides to maybe dig their own home, or maybe that's the gift of the community to them, and they cross that threshold from an old place to a new place.
23:40 --> 23:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think there could be a lot of those kinds of things going on.
23:45 --> 23:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree.
23:46 --> 24:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's one of the things I quite enjoyed about looking at these protahobbit people during this season was the way in which these differences were so very carefully laid out so that we totally understood that they have points of commonality, but in many ways they
24:09 --> 24:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's not just their respective environments, it goes deeper than that because they still have the same basic you know food clothing, shelter kinds of needs, different materials because different environments.
24:26 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_00]: And yet the environment starts to shape you after a while.
24:29 --> 24:30 [SPEAKER_00]: And as your
24:37 --> 24:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so I move on to the next section.
24:39 --> 24:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Please do.
24:40 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so we are back with the dwarves and Anna tar.
24:45 --> 24:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Because Anna tar has asked King Doran in person to provide him with more me thrill so that the project for the nine rings could go forward and offers timber in exchange to build platforms and shore up mine shafts.
24:57 --> 25:03 [SPEAKER_01]: King Doran says, nah, not gonna do that, which greatly relieves the prince.
25:04 --> 25:07 [SPEAKER_01]: And at all though, he's kind of keen on that me thrill, isn't he?
25:07 --> 25:08 [SPEAKER_00]: He would like to know.
25:08 --> 25:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yes.
25:10 --> 25:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yes.
25:12 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But as he leaves, And at all, he's a vision of a ball-rock in the flames of a brazier.
25:18 --> 25:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And smiles gently on his way out.
25:21 --> 25:24 [SPEAKER_01]: He must think he's going to get that me thrill one way or another.
25:25 --> 25:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, come subtle for she's in with gently smiling jaws.
25:29 --> 25:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Prince Doran is a bit more deterred when the King says he said no, because he knew that the offer would soon increase, now that's not what Prince Doran was hoping, I'm sure, that Middle-earth was heading towards war, and the armies with mutual weapons would be very difficult to defeat.
25:45 --> 25:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The Prince tells the King to take off the ring, saying that he has become owned by it, and then tries to take it off when the King refuses.
25:53 --> 25:55 [SPEAKER_01]: The King backhands Prince Doran
25:57 --> 25:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That's an unpleasant little scene that one.
26:00 --> 26:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a real shock and to viewers as well as to Prince Doran, I'm sure.
26:06 --> 26:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And yes, at their each time they're upping the evidence of how much this ring has taken over his father.
26:14 --> 26:18 [SPEAKER_01]: It's completely changing his personality, isn't it?
26:18 --> 26:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know that there's been tension between a father and son since, you know, before season one even started.
26:26 --> 26:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But this is a next level.
26:29 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It really is.
26:30 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It really is.
26:31 --> 26:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, when I have expected him to demand the prince crown, I mean, the prince necklace back again, the collar, the prince collar, that's what it is.
26:39 --> 26:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Unfortunately, he doesn't go quite that far,
26:44 --> 26:48 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, it was a cause of you that I listened to the elves and all this has happened.
26:48 --> 26:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So in his sense, there's still some way for him to connect to his son, but don't touch that ring.
26:56 --> 27:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Do not touch daddy's ring because there will be consequences with that.
27:00 --> 27:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is a terrible situation for Prince Doran because what does he do here?
27:06 --> 27:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, does he go charging back up the steps and, you know, smack his father?
27:11 --> 27:12 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not him.
27:12 --> 27:14 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not what he would want to do.
27:14 --> 27:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And, and, uh,
27:16 --> 27:19 [SPEAKER_01]: and yet he's humiliated by what his father does to him.
27:20 --> 27:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and even more, I think he's utterly shocked.
27:22 --> 27:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm, I think he's absolutely shocked.
27:25 --> 27:30 [SPEAKER_01]: He's been shouted out before, but we don't think he's been hit like this before.
27:30 --> 27:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think so.
27:32 --> 27:32 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think so.
27:33 --> 27:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So what does DC think he should do?
27:36 --> 27:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, she's convinced that they must confront the king where all can see that he is no longer fit to rule, but Dorin cannot bring himself to shame his father.
27:44 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So, Disa tells him lovingly that if he does not, the king will destroy himself and the realm.
27:50 --> 27:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Disa then confronts Narvey at his contingent doors who are trying to follow the orders of the king and dig.
27:56 --> 27:59 [SPEAKER_01]: She summons a flock of bats to drive them back and
28:02 --> 28:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, um, she's right.
28:05 --> 28:06 [SPEAKER_01]: She's a wise woman that Disa.
28:07 --> 28:12 [SPEAKER_00]: She absolutely is, and the scene between the two of them is just heartbreakingly loving.
28:13 --> 28:16 [SPEAKER_00]: It is too, are so committed to one another.
28:18 --> 28:29 [SPEAKER_00]: and to be able to lovingly confront and even comfort your partner, even as you tell them, you have to do something that you really don't want to do.
28:31 --> 28:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Because of this other larger reason,
28:35 --> 28:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And ultimately, you know, your father's going to destroy himself, oh, in the realm, by the way, you know, yeah, just, you know, as a society.
28:43 --> 28:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.
28:45 --> 28:49 [SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, Disa's got her strength, bless her, bless her.
28:49 --> 28:57 [SPEAKER_00]: And she shines the bat signal, though, in her case, it's a, it's a vocalization rather than, you know,
28:58 --> 29:01 [SPEAKER_00]: putting a torch in the sky kind of thing, and it's a lovely moment.
29:01 --> 29:03 [SPEAKER_00]: It really is a lovely moment.
29:03 --> 29:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It really is, and it reminds us that Disa has her own power.
29:08 --> 29:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes, yes, it's not just simply the power of her love with Do it and I notice I don't say overdoing because genuine love is not about power over it is power with And that's what she has Yes, even if on occasion she looks like she would quite like to kick her own husband's butt It's still lovingly
29:30 --> 29:33 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll saw it, don't we all have those moments with my partner?
29:33 --> 29:36 [SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, come on, I'm part of the drill.
29:37 --> 29:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Part of the comment, well, my partner's sitting in listening.
29:42 --> 29:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So I feel fine.
29:44 --> 29:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel fine.
29:46 --> 29:48 [SPEAKER_00]: My partner is our engineer by the way, listeners.
29:48 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_00]: If this is your first time, and we haven't gone to the credits yet.
29:52 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_01]: So do we want to do the mean while in Numenol?
29:55 --> 29:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I would because we have here another, um,
29:59 --> 30:03 [SPEAKER_00]: parent child, father, child, situation going on here.
30:04 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_00]: A remarkable be similar because it's both the children begging the parents to do something.
30:10 --> 30:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yad and begs her father to drop his pride and swear a fealty to photos on.
30:16 --> 30:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Asking him to not make her lose another family member.
30:30 --> 30:36 [SPEAKER_00]: The Ariel enters at the request of Aarion, and orders a lendil to bow to Thartazon.
30:37 --> 30:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But he refuses, putting his faith in the Valar to judge him rightly.
30:43 --> 30:49 [SPEAKER_00]: The Ariel is afraid that he will be killed and the lendil responds, the sea is always right.
30:52 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Talk about putting your faith on a line.
30:55 --> 31:01 [SPEAKER_01]: right, but this is, this is a belief that a lendil holds to his heart.
31:01 --> 31:03 [SPEAKER_01]: The idea that C is always right.
31:03 --> 31:06 [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't just say this is like a trite, oh, throw away line.
31:06 --> 31:08 [SPEAKER_01]: This is something truly believes.
31:08 --> 31:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
31:09 --> 31:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And in this scene, I think it is, he also tells Muriel, you're the one who re-let the flame of the faithful in me.
31:20 --> 31:42 [SPEAKER_00]: and you did a real good job here because I'm this is this is it now and I'm sure this is also mixed in with his sense of right and wrong he knows who the rightful monarch is and also all of his life as a captain in the sea guard how many times has he shouted the sea is always right
31:42 --> 31:48 [SPEAKER_00]: He knew that in, you know, a physical world context if you like, of per se, a context.
31:49 --> 31:58 [SPEAKER_00]: But now he is taking it a step deeper and is a model for her, in a sense, as we'll see.
32:00 --> 32:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Would you like to read this section or shall I?
32:02 --> 32:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you go ahead, because I know you'll enjoy reading this ritual.
32:08 --> 32:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Elendil stands forth, ready to face the judgment of the Valor on the shore of the sea.
32:16 --> 32:23 [SPEAKER_00]: But Muriel interrupts the ceremony, saying that since his loyalty was to her, then she is the one who should be judged.
32:24 --> 32:29 [SPEAKER_00]: The Arin and Abel Zagar tell Fadazon that this is in accord with a written law of the faithful.
32:32 --> 32:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Muriel steps into the rounded pool at the edge of the open ocean and is drawn under the
32:39 --> 32:41 [SPEAKER_00]: The warm looks at her closely.
32:42 --> 32:49 [SPEAKER_00]: On land, Elendil begins to despair, until Neuriel is shocked back in a burst of water and lands on the staircase.
32:50 --> 32:56 [SPEAKER_00]: People begin to call her name, and Elendil proclaims her tar-Miriel, Queen of the Sea.
32:58 --> 33:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Those present take up the cry, both the people and some soldiers, as Elendil escorts her back between them.
33:09 --> 33:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Fatas on once again consults the Palantir, which sends out an electric blue net of light until fire begins to burn within the ball.
33:19 --> 33:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Fatas on seas the figure of how brand-looking over his shoulder at him.
33:25 --> 33:30 [SPEAKER_00]: He struggles to remove his hand from the ball and eventually succeeds, but is clearly shaken.
33:31 --> 33:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Well now, this is one of the biggest rituals of this season yet.
33:38 --> 33:41 [SPEAKER_00]: it is indeed massive in every scale.
33:42 --> 33:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
33:42 --> 33:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I love the way the horns that they use to summon the serpent are shaped like sea serpents themselves.
33:49 --> 33:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I wonder what all things were in storage, just in case they ever needed it for another trial by serpent.
33:56 --> 33:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I think so.
33:56 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's the way if you are in a position where you're not quite, you're not following your faith as much as you once did.
34:05 --> 34:08 [SPEAKER_00]: You still don't want to altogether throw away those things.
34:08 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, they have some or a sacredness about them still, even if you're never going to use them again.
34:14 --> 34:16 [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, somewhere in the back closet somewhere.
34:16 --> 34:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Presumably, if a audience and Bell's a guard had worked so hard to dig this ritual out in the first place, they would have dug out all the aquichroma to perform it.
34:25 --> 34:32 [SPEAKER_01]: So, well, the might as well make this ritual look amazing in front of all the people, indeed, indeed.
34:34 --> 34:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And here we come back to this question of trials, of ritual, of trials.
34:39 --> 34:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Elendial states that he will accept the judgment of the Valor.
34:45 --> 34:46 [SPEAKER_00]: So we have a different judge now.
34:49 --> 34:50 [SPEAKER_00]: You could say we have a different standard.
34:51 --> 35:00 [SPEAKER_00]: We have a judge or a set of judges who can presumably see into the hearts and minds of the people who are standing forth for judgment.
35:02 --> 35:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure that that makes Fadazon kind of nervous.
35:05 --> 35:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure it does.
35:07 --> 35:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And the other thing is that there's like a heavy blanket of irony over all of this.
35:12 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the non, yeah, the blanket would get soggy in the ocean.
35:16 --> 35:18 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a terrible metaphor, but you see what I mean.
35:21 --> 35:31 [SPEAKER_01]: What we have to remember is that Farazon and his ilk are trying to steer the people as far away from Elvis's and the Valar and all of that as they can.
35:32 --> 35:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Meanwhile, he's agreed to have this entire huge ritual that involves trusting in the Valar to make the judgment.
35:47 --> 36:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, yeah, if he is going to declare that, you know, if it was going to be a lendil, if a lendil was eaten by the serpent, is he going to declare that he has been judged by the valla?
36:02 --> 36:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, I mean, he'd have to, but that's totally antithetical to everything that he's trying to get people to believe.
36:11 --> 36:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And if a Lendil was as merely as deposited, sop is there, deposited, stopping wet on the stairs.
36:19 --> 36:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Then that means that
36:23 --> 36:28 [SPEAKER_01]: the Valar have judged him as good to go.
36:28 --> 36:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Now what?
36:30 --> 36:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Is he going to say, well, I don't believe in the Valar anyway, so this all is moot.
36:35 --> 36:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not entirely sure he can do that because he's sanctioned this entire ritual, which is based on the idea.
36:43 --> 36:57 [SPEAKER_01]: that the sea serpent itself must be in some way a servant of the vallar because if it is the vallar in judgment then the serpent will be following what the vallar has judged or have judged.
36:59 --> 37:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this what makes sense?
37:00 --> 37:02 [SPEAKER_00]: The serpent is the executor, if you will.
37:03 --> 37:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly, so that we get artificial execution.
37:06 --> 37:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
37:08 --> 37:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I think this is showing in very brilliant and subtle ways
37:14 --> 37:30 [SPEAKER_00]: the dangers of power over as an approach, and I think this is fatt as on grasping at anything because I don't think he expected to have an eagle of manway up here.
37:31 --> 37:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's got to
37:33 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I clearly he was expecting the coup in the beginning so that Miria was not going to receive this after.
37:39 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
37:40 --> 37:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And he had to stop him.
37:42 --> 37:43 [SPEAKER_00]: He had to spin the eagle.
37:43 --> 38:00 [SPEAKER_00]: He had enough people that he thought that, you know, Mike makes right, and with enough power he could squelch these remaining, I guess, he's had no concept of what a person of faith might do, or not do.
38:01 --> 38:10 [SPEAKER_00]: based upon their beliefs and it is really bizarre I can almost see his wheels turning when the idea is first presented.
38:11 --> 38:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this a good thing or a bad thing?
38:13 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't believe the sea worm is anything other than a wild creature and you know we some if he still comes on me some and then we throw him some monster chow and be done with it.
38:23 --> 38:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so you can just see so much slipping away from him.
38:27 --> 38:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, because he will have been expecting.
38:30 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he will have been expecting the sea monster to just be a sea monster.
38:34 --> 38:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And therefore, if you throw it a snack, it's going to eat the snack and it's got nothing to do with the Valor.
38:39 --> 38:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's going to have a major problem in just a few minutes.
38:43 --> 38:49 [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know what rituals of power thought his own might put his trust in.
38:50 --> 38:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But because he has evoked the rituals of the faithful, they know where their power is coming from.
38:56 --> 38:58 [SPEAKER_00]: They know in whom they believe.
39:00 --> 39:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And by doing this, he took a huge risk, and he lost the bat.
39:06 --> 39:06 [SPEAKER_00]: He did.
39:06 --> 39:10 [SPEAKER_00]: And now he's frantically looking for something to guide him.
39:10 --> 39:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And what does he turn to?
39:12 --> 39:24 [SPEAKER_00]: This elf stone that has already been condemned and been a focal point for the supposed inappropriateness of Todd Muriel to take up her scepter.
39:26 --> 39:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I just, I see him frantically at this point, scrambling and grabbing for anything.
39:31 --> 39:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just looking for something that will be on his side that he can use to make his position stronger somehow, because, as we heard earlier, Elangio telling his daughter, Earian, the path that he is treading has turned to see water.
39:48 --> 39:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And suddenly his whole credo of Mike makes right is just not working anymore.
39:54 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_01]: No, because the C doesn't pay any attention to what it is that you want.
40:01 --> 40:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, then you can't control the C. You can only hope that the C will do what you would like it to do.
40:09 --> 40:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Or you can learn the ways of the C and do your best to work with them a form of power with.
40:17 --> 40:23 [SPEAKER_00]: And recognize when your power is not big enough, which is why you have the power to return on your ship.
40:24 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_00]: you do and a sense of humility.
40:29 --> 40:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Now back to the ritual, what color dress is virile wearing for this trial?
40:34 --> 40:36 [SPEAKER_00]: White, perfect.
40:36 --> 40:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is the color of humility.
40:38 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_00]: And there's gold trim on it for royalty.
40:42 --> 40:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
40:43 --> 40:49 [SPEAKER_00]: A lovely ritual visual statement that royalty can be humble.
40:51 --> 40:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It does not have to be a mighty monarch imposing down upon the people.
40:56 --> 41:01 [SPEAKER_00]: A fatter's on, they're talking a language fatter's on, doesn't even understand.
41:02 --> 41:13 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it's so out of his comprehension, this idea of humility in leadership is not something he would even contemplate because it just doesn't speak to him at all.
41:14 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're going to be a might is right, kind of person, then yeah, that's the kind of leadership you're going for, which is steam rolling everybody until they do what you tell them to do and that's it.
41:24 --> 41:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
41:25 --> 41:29 [SPEAKER_00]: And so, Fadder's on co-ops,
41:29 --> 41:48 [SPEAKER_00]: the sign of the valour being the eagle decides to rely on another symbol of the valour thinking that he can somehow co-op that as well, but Elendil declares her new title to confirm the judgment of the valour.
41:50 --> 41:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Oops, it's all going horribly wrong for far as all of them, you know, check and mate.
41:57 --> 41:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
41:57 --> 41:59 [SPEAKER_00]: It's an albrough, what are you going to do now?
41:59 --> 42:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And power over so often ultimately relies on violence.
42:03 --> 42:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it just becomes its only recourse in the end.
42:08 --> 42:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas here we have the queen.
42:12 --> 42:16 [SPEAKER_01]: who has been judged by the valor and found to be innocent.
42:17 --> 42:21 [SPEAKER_01]: The sea monster did not fancy a Muriel snack today, puts her back on the steps.
42:22 --> 42:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And without having to wield a set-ter or declare anything, or do anything apart from get rather wet, people are bowing to her as she has escorted past them.
42:36 --> 42:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and cheering.
42:38 --> 42:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And affirming her queen ship.
42:41 --> 42:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Oops!
42:42 --> 42:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Oops!
42:43 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
43:11 --> 43:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Not necessarily as high up for the chain of command as the bow-order, but yeah, I don't think I'm going to try conclusions with him.
43:19 --> 43:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Bye-bye!
43:20 --> 43:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yep, I think even a C-worm knows its limitations.
43:25 --> 43:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And, uh, Helbran Sauron, one of those limitations, and the C is always right.
43:31 --> 43:33 [SPEAKER_00]: The C is always right.
43:34 --> 43:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm beginning to like that expression a lot more than I did in season one.
43:38 --> 43:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I have to say it's it's definitely growing on me and I can see that there is a more subtle application of it that they're doing.
43:47 --> 43:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I really like this.
43:49 --> 43:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I really like this.
43:50 --> 44:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I have a lot of sympathy for it because I'm one of those people who absolutely 100% believes in the power of nature, and that we are nothing but ants, and that we think that we what rule over nature and we bend it to our will.
44:08 --> 44:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, oh boy, is there a reckoning for that one?
44:13 --> 44:17 [SPEAKER_01]: So when it comes to the ocean, which is one of the ultimate in,
44:18 --> 44:22 [SPEAKER_01]: terrains, if you're pardoned that, because it certainly isn't terrain.
44:22 --> 44:25 [SPEAKER_01]: You cannot have power over the ocean.
44:25 --> 44:33 [SPEAKER_01]: You can only work with it and then try to respond to moments when the ocean decides that, you know, I'm just done with you.
44:35 --> 44:41 [SPEAKER_01]: It has no patience for billionaires who want to descend to the depths to have a look at Titanic in a plastic bucket.
44:42 --> 44:55 [SPEAKER_01]: actually no no you know and I have no sympathy for those people either because good lord that some level of stupid what it shows is no respect
44:56 --> 45:00 [SPEAKER_01]: for the power, the sheer power of nature.
45:01 --> 45:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And we have, if you'll pardon the TED talk, don't our best to, to wreck, knowing, biting, breaking, hacking burning.
45:10 --> 45:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm, thank you.
45:11 --> 45:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you very, really.
45:12 --> 45:12 [SPEAKER_01]: You're reckoning.
45:13 --> 45:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes.
45:14 --> 45:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I very much appreciate your TED talk, sorry.
45:16 --> 45:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
45:17 --> 45:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
45:17 --> 45:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for coming to it.
45:19 --> 45:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Let us note, the C is the one element.
45:24 --> 45:27 [SPEAKER_00]: that cannot be contained, water cannot be contained.
45:27 --> 45:31 [SPEAKER_00]: You can build containers temporarily, but they eventually will crumble.
45:32 --> 45:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And so here's this culture, a sea culture, trying to control the sea itself.
45:42 --> 45:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Super bad idea.
45:44 --> 45:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Ah, yeah.
45:45 --> 45:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why sea captains like a lendil, that's not what they do.
45:49 --> 45:54 [SPEAKER_01]: they know the power of the ocean and they work with it.
45:54 --> 45:58 [SPEAKER_01]: They understand it as much as anybody truly can.
45:58 --> 46:00 [SPEAKER_01]: But the idea of controlling it?
46:01 --> 46:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh no.
46:02 --> 46:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if Fadazon had had, you know, gone swimming on a sandy beach somewhere when he was a lad and got knocked over and over as of a tea kettle by a massive wave.
46:14 --> 46:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Early on, I
46:16 --> 46:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe he might have picked up a different message, I don't, who knows?
46:20 --> 46:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Counter-fact monster is always fun, could frankly.
46:23 --> 46:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it might have at least got his attention, you think?
46:26 --> 46:27 [SPEAKER_00]: True.
46:28 --> 46:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So, how is Galagheril getting at all its attention?
46:32 --> 46:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, they're still having the Galadriel Adar Tea Party, as far as I can tell.
46:37 --> 46:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Galadriel confirms to Adar that Halbrond is Sauron, so that's not news to her, that he is currently in a region and that Elrond is leading a legion from Lindon to defeat Sauron.
46:48 --> 46:51 [SPEAKER_01]: She also tells him that Elrond is bringing her ring Nadia.
46:52 --> 46:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Adar asks what will happen to his children, once Gilgallard succeeds in removing Sauron,
46:58 --> 47:03 [SPEAKER_01]: He tells that all he wanted was confirmation how Brand is Sauron and the location of her ring.
47:04 --> 47:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And now that he has both, he shows Galadriel the entire army not simply a legion of Uruk's that he has led and orders her to be taken back into prison.
47:13 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Like Galadriel realizes this was Sauron's plan all along to tempt Adar.
47:18 --> 47:28 [SPEAKER_01]: to bring him and army, which is the only thing he lacks, which Sauron will then take over and use to complete his conquest, but Adar is just not going to listen.
47:29 --> 47:31 [SPEAKER_01]: But Gluge is listening.
47:32 --> 47:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Nonetheless, he brings Adar the Battlehorn to summon his army to move on the city, which finally detects the imminent arrival of the army of Uruk.
47:46 --> 47:52 [SPEAKER_01]: We have bring me, bring me an army, yes, and it works.
47:54 --> 48:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It certainly does, you know, playing nine dimensional chests for these people who've never gone beyond fifth dimensional.
48:01 --> 48:12 [SPEAKER_00]: But the Lathariel's insight, I think, has improved not only from her own brush with satan, but also from her wearing of Naughtya.
48:13 --> 48:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yeah, that she has more understanding perhaps of the ways in which these minds are working.
48:22 --> 48:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, she was always sharp.
48:25 --> 48:29 [SPEAKER_01]: You can tell that she's always been very good at reading battles and things like that.
48:29 --> 48:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But she has made mistakes, many, and you're right.
48:36 --> 48:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I think wearing
48:41 --> 48:47 [SPEAKER_01]: greater insight into what is going on with other beings.
48:47 --> 48:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Because the ways in which their mind works, it's all complex and manipulative and moving constantly, but she suddenly clicks into what's out on's doing.
48:59 --> 49:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And we do have one ritual here, which is the blowing of the Warhorn.
49:05 --> 49:21 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, so it has to be carried out ceremoniously and it has that sound that echoes on and on and on and on and on and on and it only gets blown when okay, this is the moment getting ready to roll it really reminded me of the horn of Helm Hammerhand
49:22 --> 49:23 [SPEAKER_00]: It did, didn't it?
49:24 --> 49:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, that idea, you know, a ritual horn, blown at certain moments, great sounding, all of that, it, obviously it's a very different horn, but it has a similar kind of effect.
49:37 --> 49:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, and put it away.
49:39 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_00]: We just recently saw another ritual blowing of horns, did we not?
49:44 --> 49:46 [SPEAKER_00]: in the summoning of the seaworm.
49:47 --> 49:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh yes of course, yes we did.
49:50 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_01]: This is quite a contrast, isn't it?
49:54 --> 50:01 [SPEAKER_01]: One in which the horns are blown to summon a seaworm and one in which horns are blown
50:01 --> 50:03 [SPEAKER_01]: to send an army out.
50:03 --> 50:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But what it reminds us is the way in which this kind of instrument has been used, primary world, as well as secondary world, to do something momentous.
50:16 --> 50:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And whereas, well, in a way, they're both going to participate in rendering judgment.
50:23 --> 50:38 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the judgment of the Valarthu to see where the judgment of Adba, perhaps through the success or failure of his grand venture, but the momentum starts with the blowing of a horn.
50:39 --> 50:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
50:41 --> 50:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, would you like to pick up on the last bit?
50:45 --> 50:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I'm not sure like is the right word, but never mind.
50:47 --> 50:49 [SPEAKER_01]: No, okay, that's fair, given what it is.
50:50 --> 50:55 [SPEAKER_00]: In his study, Kele Brimboer hears the sound of Siege bells ringing and people shouting in fear.
50:56 --> 51:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And the talk tries to convince him that he will take care of things, but Kele Brimboer will not accept it.
51:03 --> 51:09 [SPEAKER_00]: In a final burst of strength of the Lord of Eurugian, he shoves Anatara's side.
51:10 --> 51:19 [SPEAKER_00]: and Anatara works some powerful magic to get cast on Caleb Rinpoche's mind, so that all he sees is sunlight on a happy courtyard with children playing.
51:21 --> 51:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Anatara says that he needs Caleb Rinpoche to craft the nine rings because he and self cannot.
51:28 --> 51:34 [SPEAKER_00]: He also presents him with what appears to be a jar of material or from the best load in Khaza Doom.
51:36 --> 51:43 [SPEAKER_00]: He then brings out fan-or-semer and urges his grandson to finish the work that will exceed the cellarilles.
51:44 --> 51:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Caleb Rimbor is fooled by the illusion and goes back in to continue the work.
51:50 --> 52:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Once the door is closed, the illusion fades, and Annatar walks out to look a long distance to see the armies of Adar as they load the first trebuchets with burning missiles, and begin to take down the towers of Euragion.
52:08 --> 52:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, boy, dramatic ending much.
52:11 --> 52:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Very, very much.
52:11 --> 52:20 [SPEAKER_01]: So, um, what has always interested me about this scene is the way in which Keller Brimbo is fooled by this illusion.
52:20 --> 52:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I wonder how much his own mind needed to be fooled by the illusion.
52:28 --> 52:56 [SPEAKER_01]: that he wanted to be able to do this great work because that's always been part of his personality, part of his character since the beginnings as we first met him, is this desire to create something that puts him at least somewhere near Fayanor because he hasn't quite reached that yet and this could be it and I think that part of the reason why the illusion succeeds as well as it does,
52:57 --> 53:03 [SPEAKER_01]: is because Anatar, like his ring will later on, obviously, he knows the weaknesses of his opponent.
53:03 --> 53:14 [SPEAKER_01]: He plays upon them and I think that Calabrimbors desire to create these rings is part of the reason why the illusion is so powerful on him.
53:15 --> 53:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I agree completely and I think Anatar was surprised by the strength of Calabrimbors' rejection.
53:25 --> 53:27 [SPEAKER_00]: of his attempt to take over.
53:27 --> 53:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, we already know that already he is the Lord of everything on now is Anna Potter, but they found out for sure.
53:33 --> 53:35 [SPEAKER_00]: They facto, but tell a brimboard doesn't know that yet.
53:36 --> 53:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And the only thing that could bring him back from this, not just wounded pride, although I think there's some of that there, but this recognition of your denying my identity.
53:49 --> 53:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I am the Lord of a Region, thank you very much.
53:53 --> 54:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And only the pull on this other thread of his personal desire to best his grandfather, or whatever genealogy you cared to expect, and the spending on which version of the story we're going for, yes, exactly.
54:07 --> 54:09 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the only thread that could reel him back in.
54:10 --> 54:13 [SPEAKER_00]: and doesn't, and that's how it's out on, just know that.
54:14 --> 54:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
54:15 --> 54:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but he is the master manipulator.
54:18 --> 54:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And the science that they give us for, and the thought are enacting this deception or very, very subtle, I mean, it's not subtle when he slices the knife across his hand, of course.
54:28 --> 54:38 [SPEAKER_00]: But he just sort of goes and focus, and he concentrates, and it's definitely blink and you miss it moment.
54:40 --> 54:50 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's utterly goadia, because blood magic and deception, domination, power over all the things that we've talked about.
54:52 --> 54:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And his power over will continue.
54:56 --> 54:57 [SPEAKER_00]: It will.
54:57 --> 54:58 [SPEAKER_00]: And only increase from now on.
54:59 --> 55:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'd love to say that this is heading wonderfully towards a happy ending, probably folks know I'd be lying.
55:07 --> 55:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Not so much.
55:08 --> 55:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Not so much.
55:10 --> 55:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So, anything else you'd like to say about episode 6?
55:14 --> 55:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm all episode 6 out.
55:17 --> 55:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, all right.
55:18 --> 55:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, once again, we've got all kinds of delightful feedback.
55:22 --> 55:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So, would you like to take Falco or Phillips?
55:28 --> 55:31 [SPEAKER_00]: feedback from the discord rings and rituals channel?
55:31 --> 55:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure, he says, I am rethinking my position on the halflings.
55:37 --> 55:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if anyone has pointed this out before, but Mary Mac calls himself nobody.
55:43 --> 55:48 [SPEAKER_01]: When you found Nori and Poppy, you can say that nobody was going off trail and nobody was walking alone.
55:49 --> 55:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe the half-foot's use of these phrases is out of context.
55:53 --> 55:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Do the stores recognise the individual more and celebrate the odd marginalized person striking out alone.
56:00 --> 56:05 [SPEAKER_01]: and the half what's changed it over time to don't deviate because it is dangerous and unsafe.
56:06 --> 56:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Using the phrases about an individual called nobody gives it a very different meaning.
56:11 --> 56:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It becomes an affirmation of the person's courage.
56:14 --> 56:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this fourth level detail or what?
56:16 --> 56:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I just write this.
56:18 --> 56:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I absolutely love this idea.
56:21 --> 56:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a fascinating idea, because I'll be honest, I hadn't thought of it this way.
56:25 --> 56:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I was more, oh my goodness, these people have, you know, treated this Marymax so badly that he now thinks he's no one at all and nobody, and nobody interesting.
56:37 --> 56:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
56:39 --> 56:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And yet, um,
56:42 --> 56:51 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems to me that humility, not humiliation, but a humble approach to life, is prized very highly in this series and in Tolkien.
56:52 --> 57:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, that is also true, because one of the things we know about the hobbits that we know from the future, humility, for the most part, is one of their characteristics.
57:03 --> 57:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
57:04 --> 57:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes it gets up listeners or watchers or readers noses because that's not something our culture's tend to celebrate these days, but, well, this is true.
57:13 --> 57:21 [SPEAKER_00]: This is, I think this is a really great way of looking at this, but also of seeing how cultural messages and concepts shift over time.
57:23 --> 57:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and the original meanings of something can definitely change as your situation changes and the culture changes as well.
57:32 --> 57:38 [SPEAKER_00]: By the way, I just wanted to mention that Falco is the one who does an amazingly good.
57:40 --> 57:43 [SPEAKER_00]: YouTube show called Words and Magic of Music in Rings of Power.
57:44 --> 57:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I've mentioned this before, but if you haven't checked this out, do so.
57:50 --> 58:02 [SPEAKER_00]: You can also get it as a podcast for those of us who like to listen to these things while we're mowing a lawn or fixing a mule or whatever, but yes, I highly recommend that to you all.
58:04 --> 58:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Next we have Furlycia, who also posted on the Discord channel.
58:10 --> 58:15 [SPEAKER_00]: She writes, a rondeur called Theo Lord of Pelaghear, hmmm, some portelling there?
58:16 --> 58:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, there is that fan theory that Theo is going to end up being one of the nine.
58:24 --> 58:30 [SPEAKER_00]: There is that, I tend more towards another fan theory that says he is going to be the Lord of the Dead.
58:32 --> 58:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Because they've already established this connection between him and Isil Dora.
58:36 --> 58:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And I could easily see them saying, he's ill, though, to go's away from Pilagin, with this memory of this really strong connection that he made with this guy.
58:46 --> 59:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And probably knows little to nothing about the colonial abuse that's about to be meted upon Pilagin as a whole, and outlining kingdoms, and comes back to a very, very different situation.
59:03 --> 59:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And Theo, saying, I don't want to hear from you.
59:06 --> 59:16 [SPEAKER_00]: you're one of those seafoak and circumstances not allowing them to say hey wait a minute this wasn't my idea I'm one of the faithful and he isn't you know.
59:16 --> 59:19 [SPEAKER_00]: all those kinds of agonizing confusions and so forth.
59:19 --> 59:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So, that's where my thoughts are currently tending.
59:23 --> 59:28 [SPEAKER_00]: And as always, it's a cage of waffle, watch and find out.
59:28 --> 59:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Indeed, yes.
59:31 --> 59:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But it is, I think, notable that for some reason, Theo is being called Lord of Pilargear, is a form Pilargear.
59:42 --> 59:43 [SPEAKER_01]: But for
59:46 --> 59:48 [SPEAKER_01]: It's check-off's gun, isn't it?
59:48 --> 59:51 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't just hang it on the wall and then not do something with it.
59:51 --> 59:57 [SPEAKER_01]: You call it the olor de pelage, therefore there must be a really good reason that we're going to find out later on down the line.
59:57 --> 01:00:01 [SPEAKER_00]: And he doesn't even just call him, you're Lord of the Larger now, right?
01:00:01 --> 01:00:11 [SPEAKER_00]: You, he does the physical honorific of the elves of putting his hand on his heart, basically, his breast, or lower shoulder, whatever you want to call it.
01:00:16 --> 01:00:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he's a formal dude anyway, but still, I think it was very pointed and as you say, we're meant to remember this.
01:00:23 --> 01:00:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So, that's my theory for the moment.
01:00:26 --> 01:00:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's a great theory.
01:00:28 --> 01:00:41 [SPEAKER_00]: So now we have much loved number of many discord channels and many Tolkien communities, Sarah Jay, who has joined us in the Lohan's community.
01:00:41 --> 01:00:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Yay, joined us on the discord channels now and rights.
01:00:44 --> 01:00:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Hello, Marilyn and Saara.
01:00:47 --> 01:00:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a happy series of events, recently starting a rewatch of Rins of Power with my Duluth kids, and then being reminded of this podcast, which I've not had the brain or calendar space for until now.
01:00:57 --> 01:01:03 [SPEAKER_00]: However, I've binge watched Season 1 with breaks between episodes to listen to the appropriate podcast discussion.
01:01:04 --> 01:01:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I love this lens of ritual while watching and thinking about pain and the case adaptation.
01:01:09 --> 01:01:12 [SPEAKER_00]: You asked for listener responses, so here goes.
01:01:12 --> 01:01:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Just be glad I'm not starting back in season one.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, Sarah.
01:01:16 --> 01:01:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, Sarah.
01:01:17 --> 01:01:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll be putting in my thoughts for each season two episode as I catch up with you all.
01:01:22 --> 01:01:27 [SPEAKER_00]: You discussed Sauron creating a bond and control over the work.
01:01:28 --> 01:01:32 [SPEAKER_00]: The warg's behavior totally changes once Sauron begins to use the black speech.
01:01:33 --> 01:01:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I read this as the black speech being inathely, one of the domination and control.
01:01:39 --> 01:01:50 [SPEAKER_00]: To my mind that poor hideous beast was reacting with a fun type of trauma response, recognizing souder on and souder on's treatment of itself as familiar from past experiences, if not at all comfortable.
01:01:52 --> 01:01:56 [SPEAKER_00]: And that souder on's power marked this person as the alpha that one must appease.
01:01:58 --> 01:02:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I completely agree.
01:02:00 --> 01:02:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, not really.
01:02:01 --> 01:02:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Total sentence that the black speech is one of domination and control
01:02:05 --> 01:02:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Track for me, too.
01:02:06 --> 01:02:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I am not deeply versed in the current practices of dog training and so forth, but I believe command words and tone of voice.
01:02:15 --> 01:02:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that different language comes into it, but by extension, the same kind of thing.
01:02:20 --> 01:02:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Could results from training in a triggering of certain responses.
01:02:26 --> 01:02:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
01:02:27 --> 01:02:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah.
01:02:28 --> 01:02:29 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I think that makes sense.
01:02:34 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_01]: She did, she did, she did.
01:02:37 --> 01:02:39 [SPEAKER_01]: She says, hello folks, me again.
01:02:39 --> 01:02:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I went down a mass physics rabbit hole concerning seismic surveying, the physics of musical dissonance and how metal detectors work after watching rings a power and listening to rings and rituals episode two.
01:02:51 --> 01:02:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Can I just say this is classic, Sarah J.
01:02:54 --> 01:02:56 [SPEAKER_01]: It really is, and we love you for it, Sarah.
01:02:56 --> 01:02:58 [SPEAKER_00]: We love you for it so much, thank you.
01:02:59 --> 01:03:17 [SPEAKER_01]: She says, I will say happily continuing in my math geekdom that having three stone singers may be significant in that three is a stable number from the point of view of three points define a plane, which is a point I wanted to make in response to Galadriel's suggestion and season one about making three rings.
01:03:18 --> 01:03:23 [SPEAKER_01]: 3 is a very stable number, a three-legged stool worked well even if the legs aren't exactly the same length.
01:03:24 --> 01:03:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Two legs for a support is unstable, four is hard to get correctly balanced or manufactured.
01:03:31 --> 01:03:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Now she has a little aside here.
01:03:33 --> 01:03:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I experienced three points to find a plane in an intimately embodied way when I had a bike accident.
01:03:39 --> 01:03:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Slid right out and my contact
01:03:46 --> 01:04:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow, ow
01:04:03 --> 01:04:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, definitely reading the vibes literally, literally indeed, and have me still whinsing about the accident you had Sarah, but all of this is great.
01:04:14 --> 01:04:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, having seen her understanding of sound and resonance in stone, it makes perfect sense to me that she would be the first one to pick up on the fact that, oh, oh, oh,
01:04:29 --> 01:04:33 [SPEAKER_00]: this stone is vibrating in a very bad way if it's not good.
01:04:34 --> 01:04:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Take a stable position everybody and hope for the best.
01:04:39 --> 01:04:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, thank you so much, Sarah Jay.
01:04:41 --> 01:04:44 [SPEAKER_00]: We will look forward to future missives from you.
01:04:44 --> 01:04:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
01:04:45 --> 01:04:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And more maths, nerdery, that's absolutely fine.
01:04:49 --> 01:04:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
01:04:49 --> 01:04:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean,
01:04:51 --> 01:04:55 [SPEAKER_00]: a bunch of literary people here, you have to bring some scientific reality into this, right?
01:04:55 --> 01:05:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's a long, long, so that's it for this episode, right, and let us know what you think.
01:05:04 --> 01:05:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Any suggestions you might have for rituals to look at, and anything else you'd like to share with us.
01:05:10 --> 01:05:21 [SPEAKER_00]: We welcome your feedback at rings and rituals at TheLoreHands.com or on TheLoreHands Discord server where we have a special channel set up just for rings and rituals.
01:05:22 --> 01:05:25 [SPEAKER_01]: On the Lorehound's website, there's also a contact form and a voicemail feature.
01:05:26 --> 01:05:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Look for the contact us link at the bottom of the page.
01:05:29 --> 01:05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: We're on track to publish an episode each Wednesday between now and the season three opener.
01:05:33 --> 01:05:37 [SPEAKER_01]: But if you follow any of the Lorehound's podcasts, you will hear mentions of us.
01:05:37 --> 01:05:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And they'll let you know with the next episode is approaching.
01:05:41 --> 01:05:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Also, be sure to check out the other affiliate podcasts supported by the Barovian Broadcasting Network.
01:05:47 --> 01:05:53 [SPEAKER_00]: And of course, the podcast done by John David and Alicia on the main Lohan's podcast channel.
01:05:54 --> 01:05:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Links for all of these are also in the show notes.
01:05:57 --> 01:06:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Now our thanks to our recording engineer and editor bulb.
01:06:00 --> 01:06:07 [SPEAKER_01]: to David and John our producers, and to John for arranging our theme music, as well as all those who support us along the way.
01:06:08 --> 01:06:15 [SPEAKER_00]: If you would like to support us, and the podcast, find us on Patreon at patreon.com-slash-thalorehands.
01:06:16 --> 01:06:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Subscribers will get access to ad-free versions, as well as many other benefits.
01:06:20 --> 01:06:25 [SPEAKER_01]: But until next time, then remember, once again, the C is always right.
01:06:26 --> 01:06:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Although, so well for now, that can mean until we meet again.