Best in Show (2000) - Catherine O’Hara - Into the West

[00:00:16] [SPEAKER_09] Welcome to The Lorehounds and our Into the West podcast. This is our episode on Best in Show, which is going to complete our Catherine OHara cycle. I'm David, I'm one of the main hosts of The Lorehounds. And with me, as always, for our Into the West coverage, our community co-host, Loremaster, both Loremaster, both brother and sister team, Brian, aka

[00:00:47] [SPEAKER_09] Brian8063 and Alicia, aka Red Zippy. How are you guys doing? Hey, bro. Good. Hey, sis. How are you doing? Good to see you, David. Yeah, you guys were just visiting together or something, right? You got to see the new Nathan Fielder You Can See Everything movie together. We did. Yes, we did. I insisted that. I told my family, I said, I don't know what y'all are planning today, but I have to go see this movie. If y'all want to come, that's great. But I am going to this movie because I cannot get on the internet ever again until I see this movie.

[00:01:14] [SPEAKER_04] Exactly. Because all of my circle of people are pop culture people and I can't even check Facebook. It's ridiculous. So, yeah.

[00:01:22] [SPEAKER_06] Yep. And we said, okay, let's do it. I brought my daughter with me. She loved it. So, it was great. Wow. So, yeah.

[00:01:31] [SPEAKER_09] Wow. That's great. That's awesome. So, strong recommendations. So, you'll see if you can't. It's three hours now.

[00:01:37] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. It does not feel like three hours. Three and a half. Nobody says that. Right? Three and a half because you got to throw in the ads. Oh, right. Right. Oh, whoo.

[00:01:45] [SPEAKER_09] Our local doesn't do as many of those kinds of preview stuff. Yeah. But I don't know if we're getting it. I know it wasn't on the schedule the other week. Oh, no. It's here. It's arriving. Yeah, I was going to say. Yeah. Dude. You know, sometimes they're a little bit behind the ball on stuff. And if something's buzzing, then they'll be able to pick it up, which is really nice with digital release now because you don't have to cart film canisters around and wait for another theater to be done with them.

[00:02:13] [SPEAKER_04] And it was so expensive to reprint. I was working in film when it was just switching over to digital. And it's like, yeah, sorry, there's only like 300 prints available in the entire United States and it costs a lot of money down.

[00:02:25] [SPEAKER_09] And then shipping them around. Shipping them around. Yeah. That'd be an interesting job to have had like bike messenger or airline ticket printing thing or, you know, things like that. That just don't exist. Right. Video store clerk. Video store clerk. Yes. So, yeah, delivering this. Anyway, we're here to talk about Catherine O'Hara. We're here to talk about our Into the West podcast.

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_09] If you're new and haven't heard this before, this is our Lorehounds show where we commemorate the lives of actors, actresses, directors. Other significant people in film and television who have passed on. It's our community grieving space to recognize those individuals that really had an impact on our viewing history. I don't know how to say like, you know, entertainment. Life experiences, entertainment.

[00:03:18] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Like we were talking about, I got a number of comments from our Tim Curry candle lighting ceremony. Sometimes we do short form and this is one of our long form ones, but from the Tim Curry, several comments of people saying, oh my God, like, I'm so glad you guys talked about that because Tim Curry for me was XYZ something. And so this is a way for us to kind of process these attachments that we have to people who we have very strong, sometimes parasocial relationships with.

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_09] Yes. That's right.

[00:03:50] [SPEAKER_06] Been fans for a long time. Been fans. Yeah. Yeah. It's strong.

[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_09] Strong. Strong. So all the other past episodes are available on our, you can find them on our cinema feed or also on the main feed. They always have into the West in the title. If you would like to send us feedback about past episodes or upcoming episodes, you are welcome to do so. We'll just roll feedback forward. And the email address for that is into the West. All one word into the West at the lorehounds.com.

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_09] Of course, we have our community Discord where we have a lot of conversations. We just launched a new Monster Island thread set up thing, forum thing for all of the different Godzilla related and King Kong properties. Brian is very excited about that. Thank you again for your help for getting all that set up. You picked some great images, key images for that.

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_06] Good.

[00:04:42] [SPEAKER_09] So, and of course, Brian is one of our moderators on there. And yeah, we have a big sprawling server, but it's pretty well organized. But it's because our tastes and our interests are so widespread. Exactly. And we can't not cover something. We can't not have conversations about some stuff. So we try to find that balance. Anyway, we have a great community. It's a lot of fun. A lot of ongoing conversation. The Vision Quest stuff seems like it's hopping right now. We had some great conversations around lanterns.

[00:05:11] [SPEAKER_09] That was really fun. So yeah, it's a great place to hang out with like-minded individuals. So swing on by if you have not been before, and we'll have some great coverage of Rings of Power when that's coming up. As always, we are an independent podcast.

[00:05:26] [SPEAKER_09] So we survive and are able to share the wealth such as it is and pay for our bills, more importantly, because we can either do advertising-supported podcasts or subscriber-supported podcasts. And the subscribers get ad-free stuff, and they get some bonus episodes, some extra movie coverage, and some other sort of behind-the-scenes conversations with the hosts.

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_09] And what you're watching episodes where they're sort of our short-form stuff. So there's lots of upsides for subscribers in terms of content. But more importantly, you are connected to us in a way that you're like, wow, these folks really work hard. And the entertainment, it's very inexpensive relative. You can go out and have two drinks and maybe some bar snacks and pay more than what it would cost for an annual membership to support this podcast.

[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_09] The inversion of value for your money is pretty crazy. So if it's within your wherewithal and you feel like doing it, then check out the links in the show notes. We'd love to have you as a subscriber and to have your support so that we can keep doing what we all really love to do. And if you can't, but you still want to help out the podcast, give us a rating or a review.

[00:06:45] [SPEAKER_09] Like literally, ratings help with searchability and the reviews help with engagement. Be nice. We're human beings over here. We'll leave a review. Give us a little bit of a grace. But, you know, we would love those. Or share a podcast.

[00:07:04] [SPEAKER_09] Like, you know, that's one of the best ways for us to be discovered by other people is if you share, hey, like I have a friend who's into that movie or into that television show or a family member. And we have the same vibe about certain things. Share the podcast. And that's another really great way. And we are a big network. We've got a whole bunch of affiliate podcasts. We've got Dungeons & Do-Rags. We've got Rings & Rituals. We've got Wolf Shift Dust covering a lot of different variations.

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_09] We've got Nevermind the Music, which is psychology and music. So, if you go to the show notes for this episode, there's a link. That is a Linktree link. It's like a little mini webpage that makes it easy for us to update things. Go there and you can see the Discord link, the subscriber links, the blog. Brian is also our Lorbrarian.

[00:07:54] [SPEAKER_09] We've got a new blog post up about the semiotics of the form of Godzilla, how Godzilla changes over time and what that means. It's a great resource for auxiliary information. But it's all in the show notes in that Linktree link. You can find all the affiliates and all that kind of stuff. So, done with the housekeeping. Sorry if I'm a little long-winded, but we've got to get it in somewhere. We get it in the beginning and if you need to skip ahead, it's fine. Anyway, here we are.

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_09] So, this is our process for Into the West for our long-form ones. We choose somebody that we're going to talk about. We do a biography and their filmography. Then we three pick a film off that list. And then we put that to a vote on the Discord. We put a link. It's a publicly available link, but we usually just link it in the Discord. And then folks can vote on the movie.

[00:08:52] [SPEAKER_09] And then we watch that movie and then we talk about it. So, today we're going to be talking about Best in Show from the year 2000, which it's an ensemble cast, but it is starring Catherine O'Hara. So, Lisa, I'm going to toss it to you to give us a little brief introduction about the film.

[00:09:11] [SPEAKER_04] Best in Show was released in 2000 and it was directed by Christopher Guest, co-written by Guest and Eugene Levy. People were probably familiar with Christopher Guest for writing – oh, well, this is Spinal Tap was his first go at this mockumentary. And he also wrote The Princess Bride, which was directed by Rob Reiner.

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_04] And Eugene Levy, for me, up until that point, was probably his character in the movie Splash with Tom Hanks. He played the scientist who's like, you know, trying to prove that the mermaid was real.

[00:09:50] [SPEAKER_07] That's right.

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_04] You know. Erotic. Erotic.

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah.

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. Yeah. He was very – well, that's Eugene Levy for you.

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_06] That's Eugene, yeah.

[00:10:00] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah, exactly. So, it's a mockumentary.

[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_06] Which is on display in this movie.

[00:10:05] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. Big time. Yes, he does that very good. So, it's what we call a mockumentary about competitors at the fictional Mayflower Kennel Club dog show in Philadelphia. So, the budget was about $10 million and it made $20 million worldwide, about 18.5 in the U.S. So, it doubled its money. That's cool. That's good. Yeah.

[00:10:31] [SPEAKER_04] And, as I said, in the guest canon, following Spinal Tap, Waiting for Guffman, and then Best in Show, which really put him on the map. Later, it was followed by A Mighty Wind in 2003 and For Your Consideration in 2006. So, Waiting for Guffman was the one about theater, like a community theater. A Mighty Wind was the folk music festival circuit.

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_04] And For Your Consideration, of course, is the independent film, you know, a thing like that. So, that's one thing that guest was really known for, was taking these little intense, passionate micro-slices of life, you know, where these people, they live, breathe, and eat this stuff. But it's, you know, contained in this small circle. So, anyway.

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_04] But Catherine O'Hara appears in all four of the guest-directed films, and Eugene Levy shares the screen with her in each one. So, in Best in Show, Catherine O'Hara plays Cookie Fleck, one of her funniest performances. So, it's Cookie and Jerry Fleck, a suburban couple with a Norwich terrier, Winky. Jerry is famously awkward, Eugene Levy.

[00:11:53] [SPEAKER_04] And Cookie has a long, well-known romantic history that keeps resurfacing.

[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_01] Well, the first time we met was at this big dance. And I just thought she was the prettiest thing that I'd ever seen. And she was there with somebody else. She was very popular back then. She had dozens of boyfriends. Hundreds. Hundreds. Yeah, hundreds. I did not know that.

[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_08] Oh, my God.

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_06] That's great. So, that theme, as Lisa was saying, just keeps resurfacing throughout the film. And it's just hilarious. As I get into this film, it's just, I want to say thank you to the community for picking this movie. Because I think it really illustrates her improv, her genius. So, I've got my sandwich from Lee's comeuppance. And I got a goat roasting in the room.

[00:12:56] [SPEAKER_06] So, I'm ready to talk about this film.

[00:12:59] [SPEAKER_04] Oh, my gosh.

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_06] Wow. Okay.

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_04] That's fabulous.

[00:13:05] [SPEAKER_06] Yes. Okay. Okay. So, the method of this film is not conventional. Because it's a guest and Levy worked out a detailed outline for story points. And the dialogue was largely improvised.

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. It was just like a 15-page outline. Yes. And literally most of the dialogue in this movie is improvised, as you noted.

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. And they worked together, this group, for so long that the actors learned not to laugh or crack themselves up. You know, there's no, there's very little, apparently, bloopers. And they were just, you see like Saturday Night Live when something funny is. They're like cracking up and you get to see it online. But they, you know, Levy was saying in an interview that, hey, you know, we just went with it. I'm just making stuff up.

[00:14:03] [SPEAKER_06] So, we just went. It was just amazing.

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. Professional improvisation. I had no idea that this was that improvised. Yes.

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_09] That's pretty incredible.

[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. Each actor set would definitely work, as Brian noted, like on their backstory themselves. So, it's not like they would say things to each other that was completely out of left field. So, they kind of knew what their characters were like and what they thought the character's own backstory was. But what you shot on film was first time hearing about it. And I think I read somewhere that there was like thousands of hours.

[00:14:41] [SPEAKER_06] Yes.

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_04] You know, of footage from guest directed films like this. And, you know, so it's crazy.

[00:14:49] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. The editing must have been really challenging because like any documentary, right? You have all this stuff that you have to decide. You have to make these decisions what to put in and what to leave on the cutting room floor. Right. So, that's really impressive.

[00:15:04] [SPEAKER_09] And you might be looking at four or five, six or seven takes of the same scene and finding that right one where the joke and the timing lands perfectly or the variation of the line is more funny than another one. Right. But then, which is where, you know, editors are incredible. And obviously, a lot of times directors and other people will be involved in the editing process.

[00:15:28] [SPEAKER_09] But to stay fresh in that moment is an incredible skill. Discipline. Yeah. It really is incredible. Like maybe a guest judging on a cooking show, like Great British Baking Show. How do you – you've eaten 47 desserts by the time the round is over. How do you maintain a fresh perspective all the way through that instead of just being completely numbed by, you know, after a dozen?

[00:15:56] [SPEAKER_09] And so, like seeing all these clips and just the hours and hours and hours in a dark editing bay, finding that one where that joke is just right. Because every note on this show, in this movie is just perfect. Pitch perfect.

[00:16:13] [SPEAKER_04] And to also understand that the actors were trusted, as I said, with the backstory. So, sometimes a couple might have had a completely different tangent, you know, and so they – maybe they acted as a couple who had these kind of problems. And later they brought in these other problems because the two actors thought that this would be funny backstory. And so, you know, Christopher Guest gives them, you know, a rough outline of what they're like.

[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_04] But, you know, there's things that Parker Posey was doing with her character. They're like, yeah, that was great, but we're not putting that in the film. So, you know. So good. So good.

[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_09] I really recognize the couple from the 80s, you know.

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_04] Oh, my God.

[00:16:55] [SPEAKER_09] Wow. Carry on.

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_04] So, Brian, that goes into the ensemble.

[00:16:59] [SPEAKER_06] Yes. And you said it very well, Sis, that it's a discipline. And because of that, you build like a repertoire company, you know, Levy, O'Hara, Michael McKeon, Fred Willard, Parker Posey, and others. It's small, right? It's hard, I imagine. I can't imagine, really. But it must be really hard to find actors of this quality.

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_06] So you definitely want to keep using them because they work so well together and it's just amazing. So this is, you know, reason why you have Christopher Guest using these same actors in the repertoire, movie after movie after movie. And they go back to the SCTV years. So it's really so impressive. And the reception and legacy of this movie, it was, you know, well-received. It's widely quoted.

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_06] 93% on Rotten Tomatoes. An average rating of 7.5 out of 10. Letterboxd average is 3.8. And Metacritic gives it a score of 78 out of 100. Rolling Stone ranked this film 80th on its recent list of the 100 best movies of the 21st century. And just recently, last year, the New York Times ranked it number 57 best films of the 21st century.

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah.

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_04] So in the last 25 years. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:18:26] [SPEAKER_06] That's significant.

[00:18:28] [SPEAKER_04] Yes. It is just considered one of the best comedy films of the modern era, for sure. So again, we thank the Discord, the Lorehound community for watching this with choosing, choosing this film to watch with us. It's the best.

[00:18:45] [SPEAKER_09] So we had 13 total votes, which is pretty average for this. I mean, we get maybe double this for the 11z movie poll. So that's about average. You know, Brian, the state of voting in the world and in our country in particular, how do we encourage more people to engage in participatory democracy? Maybe that's another podcast. Exactly. But thank you for everyone who did vote.

[00:19:08] [SPEAKER_09] This best in show crushed ACOD and for your consideration by 10 votes to two votes to one vote.

[00:19:19] [SPEAKER_07] There we go.

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_09] So hands down, people are like, no, this is this is the one. And it's strange because Catherine O'Hara is just one of a number of people in this thing. But without her bit, she she doesn't have as many lines nearly as a lot of folks. But man, she is really a force in this movie. Yeah.

[00:19:41] [SPEAKER_06] Yes, absolutely. And that that takes us to the fresh takes. And I I'm hearing fresh takes from you, David.

[00:19:50] [SPEAKER_09] I had never seen this movie before. This is not my cup of tea. A little bit like Ted Lasso, just sort of spitting out the top of that. No, thank you very much. This is disgusting. I can't handle it. Whatever. Because it's great. It's right. It's right. We need a cringe meter. We need a cringometer for me in some way. There we go. with the office being the, you know, peak scale. This was just inside my tolerance level.

[00:20:18] [SPEAKER_09] And I was watching it with my wife and I watched it together. She had seen it before. She doesn't like to rewatch movies for whatever. She always wants to watch something new. But for some reason, she was like down for this one. That was great. So we watched it. And if I had been watching it on my own, I probably would have paused it at some point and then come back to it and watch it in bite sized chunks.

[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_09] So as I got agitated, you know, that slow return to baseline and then I could sort of like be calm again and then come back to it. Maybe I need to talk to Nicole about my inability to deal with cringe. So it was a little bit challenging. But then once I got into it, I was like, oh, this is fantastic. This is amazing. I had no idea that it was unscripted.

[00:21:10] [SPEAKER_09] Ed Bagley Jr. was perfect in it. All of the bits and the gags were hilarious. That they got it. I mean, in the dog show, I suppose we should say, is this spoiler free?

[00:21:25] [SPEAKER_04] We are spoiler free.

[00:21:26] [SPEAKER_09] No, no spoilers. No spoilers. Yes. Okay.

[00:21:29] [SPEAKER_06] We're just doing, yeah, fresh takes. Got it. Yeah.

[00:21:31] [SPEAKER_09] I forgot to give a spoiler warning up at the top here where our spoiler breaks were going to be. So we'll talk more after the break. So this is just fresh takes. So, yeah, I super enjoyed it. I thought it was funny. I thought it was fresh. It felt very accurate. They must have had real dog trainer people in there because there were some people that you were like, wow, these people really know what they're doing. The actors handling the dogs and all that. It was just an incredible feat. And I can't believe that it was unscripted.

[00:22:01] [SPEAKER_09] It just blows my mind. So I'm glad I saw it. It's not my typical cup of tea, but I really enjoyed the experience. And then my wife and I are talking this cast, man, this cast. Yeah. Bonkers.

[00:22:16] [SPEAKER_04] It is stacked.

[00:22:17] [SPEAKER_09] It is insane.

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah.

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_09] And they're just all phenomenal. And then I think about, you know, what's the state of comedy today? And, you know, it's a lot of it's on YouTube now. And, you know, for skits, I mean, most people don't watch Saturday Night Live end to end anymore, it seems like. They watch, you know, all their little shorts on YouTube and stuff.

[00:22:37] [SPEAKER_09] But anyway, regardless of the formatting of comedy, these this era and these people defined for years and years the shape of comedy for all of us. And it just like the Devil Wears Prada scene where in from the first movie where the cerulean blue scene where Meryl Streep is talking about how this blue was picked for you and you fished it out of a bin at the not the value.

[00:23:07] [SPEAKER_09] What was the oh, what was the name of the shop? Anyway, you fished it out of a cheap bin for it, you know, millions. So these people set created the comedy that we're the inherit. I don't think you would have the office without this kind of, you know, these people doing this kind of comedy at this stage.

[00:23:26] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah, yeah, definitely. To see, you know, Jane Lynch, who really became famous from Glee, you know. We were like, oh my God. Yeah, yeah. And then of course, Jennifer Coolidge, who is, you know, originally a guest, you know, superstar who just went on to, you know, I think she really broke out in Legally Blonde. And then, you know, we know her from the Mike White, White Lotus. Right. Yes. Episodes or whatever. Fred Willard.

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_04] I mean, we're talking superstars, you know, Parker Posey again from White Lotus. But yeah, you can't get better than this. And I think it's safe to say maybe Catherine O'Hara is maybe the second of this group, I think, to pass away. I'm going down another rabbit hole. But I think McKean has passed. But anyway, yeah. So I'm glad that you saw this. David, had you seen any other Christopher Guest mockumentaries before you watched Best in Show?

[00:24:24] [SPEAKER_09] Let me look up the – go ahead with your takes and then let me look up Christopher Guest's filmography.

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_06] Okay, Lisa, let's tug on that string that David had about storytelling. And, you know, it's hard to see these nowadays.

[00:24:39] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah.

[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. If you want to do your fresh takes because I think you're thinking about that too.

[00:24:44] [SPEAKER_04] For sure. I mean, I don't know – I didn't know until I saw this that you could do movies like this. I understood sketch comedy, you know, and stand-up and that world. But I didn't know that you could bring such an improvisational, unscripted style to a feature-length film.

[00:25:05] [SPEAKER_04] You know, the ensemble storytelling, like I mentioned, the social situations in a niche society that are just so specific to those people in that world. The spontaneous conversations. And he really – Christopher Guest really – and the actors themselves really treat their characters with a combination of affection and absurdity.

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_04] You kind of have to if you're like looking into the fishbowl of these people. It's like, oh my God, who are these people? But he, you know, he never makes fun of them or anything like that. So to see so many of my favorites all in one film was just amazing. Before I rewatched it, after Catherine O'Hara passed, my most memorable scenes, which we'll talk in the full spoiler, but they involved Frank Willard and Parker Posey. Frank Willard was phenomenal.

[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_04] Oh my God. Genius, genius. But once I saw Best in Show, I went back to rewatch Guest's mockumentaries, including Spinal Tap. I had not seen it until I had seen Best in Show and I went back. I mean, I knew of it culturally and the cowbell and all that. And then ever since Best in Show came out, I've never once missed seeing a Christopher Guest mockumentary in the theater. So, yeah. How about you? You had seen it before, right?

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_06] I have, you know, and that's interesting because I, you know, in this right around this time period of 2000, we had SNL, which has always been around. Living Color was the 90s. And then, but the, also the aughts when this movie came out, you begin to see David Chappelle and K. And Peel, but you don't see this kind of comedy shows.

[00:26:59] [SPEAKER_06] I think like television comes in waves and, you know, and ebbs and flows. I think there's like now there's SNL and maybe a black lady sketch show on HBO, but you don't see the prominence that you did when you were in 2000 doing these kinds of things. Yeah. And, and this film is much funnier than I remember. It's been probably 10, 20 years since I've seen it.

[00:27:24] [SPEAKER_04] Oh, wow. Yeah.

[00:27:24] [SPEAKER_06] So yeah, I watched it with my daughter and she said it was one of the best movies she ever saw. And David, I think, yeah, I think you make a good point that being, I would have laughed, but with my daughter there, it just like escalates the, the share. There's like that shared group, like being in a movie theater kind of thing.

[00:27:45] [SPEAKER_09] I'm sure some academics somewhere have gone, done work on the psychology of comedy of us being in a social space as opposed to watching it solo. Exactly.

[00:27:57] [SPEAKER_04] If I interject when I was in the film industry and I scheduled, you know, a lot of press screenings for several years and for critics, we would never ever, we would do everything possible to make sure if we're screening a comedy that is within a big group. Even if it meant, even if it was only one, maybe two film critics who RSVP'd for us, we would bring in like, you know, VIPs or, you know, or even employees because just to see a comedy in a theater with like one or two people, it's not the same thing. So, yeah.

[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. I think you invited me once or twice to come to a showing for a comedy or something because.

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_04] Just touching seats. Come on in.

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_06] Yep.

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_09] We'll have to talk about that another time. So you, you organized junkets for press. I was a stringer for an international reporter. Once this LA, this guy in LA who has worked for the German media and he would have me go to New York showings for him because he was busy with family life and he couldn't always do the flights and stuff. So I got a few hotel nights and got to see some shows, got to get to do some one-on-one interviews. Oh, what was, sorry. Senior moment. Duki Hauser actor. Oh, yes.

[00:29:03] [SPEAKER_09] Yes. That guy. I got to do a one-on-one with him. Oh my gosh. One-on-one. Who was the new Spock? I'm sorry. I'm having a brain blip this morning. Yeah. The guy who played the new Spock. Yeah. Zachary Quinto. Something. Yes. That sounds right. Yeah. I got to do one-on-one with him and a bunch of other people. It was really a very, very cool experience to have had. So anyway. Anyway. Thanks for all the work that you did on that because that's hard work. It was hard work.

[00:29:29] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. Yeah. And I was in the film industry when this came out. So.

[00:29:33] [SPEAKER_06] Cool. Oh my gosh. Anyway, that's right.

[00:29:34] [SPEAKER_04] Back on track.

[00:29:35] [SPEAKER_06] Yes. So this movie, it's brilliant. And the facts that most of the scenes were improv just showed you how amazing, as we were saying, this troupe in O'Hara is. It is a true comedy classic. And I would put it in my top 25 of all times. It was just so. Wow. Funny. Joyful. Just right on point. Everything was just landing. Except my joke of the sandwich and goat. Sorry about that, folks.

[00:30:05] [SPEAKER_06] But if you've seen the movie, you get it. But. If you know, you know. Yeah. And what's interesting is I just came off of watching a full rewatch of Veep. Now, David, talk about cringe. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Probably. That's probably.

[00:30:21] [SPEAKER_09] I watched a few episodes of cringe. I don't know. I could handle that one. I didn't didn't get under my skin as much. So anyway. But it's not something that I would intentionally go out and seek.

[00:30:29] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Very explicit with language and. Yeah. And scenarios. But it's brilliant.

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_09] Maybe because Julie Louise Dreyfuss is. I enjoy her so much. And it's political. So there's. There's an absurdism to it that I can kind of.

[00:30:43] [SPEAKER_06] Right.

[00:30:43] [SPEAKER_09] Because politics are absurd.

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. And mirrors kind of today. Yeah.

[00:30:48] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. You couldn't. You tried to pitch. Yeah. No. Moving on. Moving on. Moving on.

[00:30:54] [SPEAKER_06] So I was right in the. I was in a good mindset. Yeah. For this movie because I saw Veep and it was. It was fabulous.

[00:31:02] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. All right. Is that our fresh takes out of the way? Yeah. Yes, it is. Well, let's take a quick commercial break and then when we come back, we'll get into some more details around the film. And this is a spoiler warning. So from here on out, we're going to get into deeper spoilers. If you've not seen the movie, go see it. Come back. Finish the podcast. OK, we'll be right back.

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[00:33:03] [SPEAKER_09] We are back. So we're going to get into full spoiler discussion of the characters, the movies, and some of the stuff that we enjoyed watching. So take it away, Brian and Lisa.

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_04] All right. Cookie and Jerry Fleck, O'Hara and Levy. I felt so bad for Jerry because they could go nowhere, not even the grocery store. without some dude recognizing Cookie. And like, oh, oh, did we? And she's like, yeah.

[00:33:39] [SPEAKER_07] It was just the entire movie.

[00:33:42] [SPEAKER_04] You know, her poor husband is just, you know, and he handled it quite well, I think. You know, for a character that really lacked, you know, confidence in his appearance and and all of that, he literally had two left feet, which they covered in a funny skit. And so, you know, it just, it was just, you know.

[00:34:03] [SPEAKER_09] Is Gary Fleck, I think his character is the only one that actually has an arc in this. Because he goes from the two left foot cuckolded husband kind of thing. Right. To being the one who. Has to present. Has to present. And then they ultimately win. Yes. The top cup, you know, the best in show. And so that is an arc where everybody else is a pretty straight line.

[00:34:31] [SPEAKER_09] I mean, I guess Parker Posey and Michael Hitchcock. Well, and Jane Lynch. Yeah. Yeah. I guess they all have arcs. They all do have arcs. That's, sorry, that's a misstatement. Yeah. But he does. He has a definite arc, though.

[00:34:46] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. Christopher Gaston, Eugene Levy definitely like to write about very ordinary situations where something rather extraordinary happens to those ordinary people and how they cope and pivot with it. As we see, like with the bumblebee dog toy and these other things, you know, if there are any story points. Oh, my God. We're going to have to talk about this poor wine rammer. Yes. Oh, my God. Oh, my gosh.

[00:35:13] [SPEAKER_04] It's just, in fact, they're the next we have to go to Meg and Hamilton Swan. Sure.

[00:35:19] [SPEAKER_09] Well, with Cookie, too, it was interesting because, like I said at the top, she's in it for so little, but she's really a spine of the whole show and that running gag. And the gag, she doesn't have lines. She has reactions. Yes.

[00:35:35] [SPEAKER_06] Oh, yes. Well said. Very true. Exactly.

[00:35:38] [SPEAKER_09] She's reacting to whenever somebody comes up and there's the memory of, oh, yeah, we did. And, oh, yeah, you were good. You know, that kind of stuff. And there's a kind of interesting sex positive ethical sort of thing. She's like, yeah, I had lots of experiences. There's nothing wrong with that. I am with you now and I'm affirmatively with you.

[00:36:02] [SPEAKER_09] So your feelings, your natural feelings of jealousy and inadequacy and discomfort with all of this are valid. And yet I am choosing to be with you, you know, actively. I might fall into some nostalgia from time to time. That's fine. But I'm not breaking our vows. And I found that actually really sort of positive and progressive in a number of ways.

[00:36:31] [SPEAKER_09] And again, it's a subtle thing throughout the whole show where she's like, well, yeah, 100. The clip we played. Yeah. She was like, right. No, it wasn't dozens. It was it was hundreds. Yeah. No. Matter of fact, you know, it's OK. So like that's kind of awesome because, you know, human beings, you know, like wide range of experience. And she just is normal about it.

[00:36:55] [SPEAKER_09] So I thought it was an interesting twist of all the sub stories, especially with the Parker Posey, the Swans and their, you know, neuroses and especially around the sex stuff, which is also pretty funny.

[00:37:07] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah, that's right. Yeah. It is a dichotomy of storylines for sure. Seeing one couple being, you know, sex positive, as you say, or being OK with it or to talk about it versus our next pair, you know, of Megan Hamilton. Sex positive in a way.

[00:37:24] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. That's true.

[00:37:28] [SPEAKER_09] But it's sort of in a neurotic sort of way. The neuroses were other things driven as well. I mean, his.

[00:37:35] [SPEAKER_06] Yes.

[00:37:36] [SPEAKER_09] His that metrosexual kind of thing. Oh, what brand is that? And, you know, should I wear this one with this particular material? I remember the 80s and being a young adult and guys trying to figure out our fashion and doing some of the very I'm trying to think of some of the various stores. But there was a very much. Berks Brothers. Yeah. Well. No. I want to say Jake.

[00:38:03] [SPEAKER_09] Anyway, I can't remember the mall brands that you went to. But there was a kind of leaning into the 80s new wave flock of seagull kind of stuff where guys could sort of get up to some costume wear level of stuff that was beyond jeans and sweatshirt kind of stuff. Yeah. You know, or sweatpants and sweat top like I'm wearing right now. But guys could actually lean into fashion in a way. Yeah.

[00:38:32] [SPEAKER_09] And so I recognized his character quite, quite well. Yeah.

[00:38:38] [SPEAKER_04] And you guys most recently rewatched it or watched it. If I'm not mistaken, the film opens with Megan Hamilton in a therapy session. Yes. That's right.

[00:38:51] [SPEAKER_09] And then they turned to the dog. They turned to the dog. Yeah.

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_04] Because they were freaking out because that someone had seen them having sex and that someone or that third party hasn't quite. It hasn't quite been the same sense, the same sense. And they were very concerned about that person's or that entity's welfare, you know, and the camera pans down and there's this dog. Beatrice, you know, the Weimaraner. You know, you're like, oh, my God, they're these kind of people.

[00:39:23] [SPEAKER_04] You know, this is the dog.

[00:39:26] [SPEAKER_06] The dog has its own couch. Yes. Yes.

[00:39:30] [SPEAKER_09] Absolutely. I could predict what's coming because of just whatever watching too much TV. But I can imagine that if you're in the theater and you were only vaguely aware of what this was about. And then they turn. Like, it sets an immediate tone. Yes. For the whole movie. That it's these people who we're going to all eventually meet. Right.

[00:39:53] [SPEAKER_09] But that they're how their lives are intertwined with these animals and how the human identity and the dog identities, they can't necessarily perform in the world and be recognized in the world. But they can get that experience through transference with their animal. 100%. Yeah. And you see them when they're running and they're prancing as much as the dog is prancing when they're out, when they're taking their dogs out and around.

[00:40:22] [SPEAKER_09] It's like, oh, they're on show. These human beings are on show, which is the interesting arc for Eugene Levy because he's not used to being on show. Two left feet, buck tooth, sort of awkward guy. He gets to be recognized through this transference process. Yep.

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. And you get the real strong vibe and understanding that these dogs are their children. Right. You know, they play that such an important part of their lives, either, you know, because they're in this community of dog shows, but also because of their own psychological issues. Right. Not saying not good or bad.

[00:41:05] [SPEAKER_06] You know, I don't want to don't don't have me people because dog, you know, pets are very important to our lives. But, you know, in this kind of, as Lisa says, in the fishbowl, right, you get to see kind of this in another higher level.

[00:41:19] [SPEAKER_04] Yep. Yep. And I think one of the more famous scenes is, as you're saying, they're they're in Philadelphia and, you know, they're all waiting for their breed to show and everything like that. And they could not find Beatrice's favorite dog toy. Yeah.

[00:41:39] [SPEAKER_04] And they presume that Beatrice is anxious because of not having said dog toy, not ever understanding that this poor dog is getting freaked out through the entire film, that all of this yelling and argument and frenetic energy is just whirling around all the time. And that's probably what Beatrice is reacting to.

[00:42:00] [SPEAKER_04] And I can totally see how Parker Posey, who then went to like a drugstore or pet store nearby after she completely accosts someone in the hotel for not having dog toys in their gift shop. And so, you know, she goes.

[00:42:17] [SPEAKER_09] He's a comedian, too, who we've seen on a book. I recognized him. Yes.

[00:42:21] [SPEAKER_04] I'm sure there's no one in this film that, you know, doesn't have some level of. But she goes into that one store and then the clerk is trying to say, you know, well, this butterfly kind of looks like a bee. And she's like, that's not a bee. That's a butterfly. You know, I mean, freaking out. Level 11. And the actor whose name I don't have played off of it so well. He just kept trying to substitute.

[00:42:49] [SPEAKER_09] See if I can get the syllables right. Kana Agua, who has an amazing filmography. He's got some great roles and he's been around for quite a while. Cool. He's great. You know, did either of you get dead parrot Monty Python skit vibes from this?

[00:43:14] [SPEAKER_04] Oh, Brian and I go wave an act on the Monty Python dead parrot. Yes, we do. For Monty Python period. Oh, my God. It's a parrot.

[00:43:20] [SPEAKER_03] Never mind that man, Ned. I wish to complain about this parrot, what I purchased not half an hour ago from this very boutique. Oh, yeah. That's the Norwegian blue. What's wrong with it? I'll tell you what's wrong with it. It's dead. That's what's wrong with it.

[00:43:33] [SPEAKER_09] To me, this was an inheritor of it wasn't maybe an intentional homage, but it certainly borrowed from that. They were talking to each other. For me, it talked across time and space.

[00:43:44] [SPEAKER_06] Yes.

[00:43:45] [SPEAKER_09] Oh, my God. Absolutely.

[00:43:47] [SPEAKER_04] And I think, again, we're in full spoilers. I don't remember if the couple, they made it. Their marriage, I think, was okay, but they decided that it was the dog that was causing all of the problems. And so, therefore, when they got a new dog, a new breed, things were just so much better, you know? So, it was all the dogs. That's right.

[00:44:09] [SPEAKER_09] That their marriage was. That's right.

[00:44:41] [SPEAKER_06] And that was like a huge no-no in competition. Right. So, it's like, I have no choice. We've got to get rid of this dog if we want to continue to compete at this level.

[00:44:50] [SPEAKER_09] Right. Yep. Yeah. Completely out of bounds behavior for that scenario.

[00:44:55] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah.

[00:44:56] [SPEAKER_09] For the show. Not allowed. So, disqualified.

[00:44:59] [SPEAKER_07] That's right. Disqualified.

[00:45:03] [SPEAKER_04] Oh. And then, Christopher Guest is always in his own films. And so, he plays a solo dog owner in this. And he is Harlan Pepper, who is a Southern bloodhound owner. So, he prides himself on being an amateur ventriloquist. Although, I'm sure he would love to be a professional at it. And his full-time job is a fishing supply shop owner.

[00:45:31] [SPEAKER_04] And so, he was very, very proud of his bloodhound. That was a really interesting character. Probably among great pairings or great storylines. I forget about this one the most. Yeah. So, it's like, okay, I knew that there was a bloodhound, you know, and that Harlan Pepper's there. But, you know.

[00:45:54] [SPEAKER_09] And he really leans into the bit with the dog and, you know.

[00:45:58] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah.

[00:45:59] [SPEAKER_09] With the video, like licking with the face and hugging it and petting it. The voices.

[00:46:06] [SPEAKER_07] He had no hesitation.

[00:46:07] [SPEAKER_09] I was watching for when he was kissing with the dog, you know, in the way that an owner, not in the BCI, but in a normal way. Right. When the dog was licking his face and he didn't, like, I don't like that. You know, I know some people do. And I was watching for that flinch reaction and it wasn't, it was, he played it. He played right through it. Yep. Sure did. Which goes into the improv stuff that we were talking about. Right.

[00:46:35] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Absolutely. And of all these guests, I think Harlan has the more natural relationship with his dog, you know, that you would say, oh, yeah. You know, there are dog owners out there that will, you know, talk sweet things and, you know, kiss their dog and everything. It's like, that's cool. And that was my daughter's favorite character. Oh, really? Yeah. I don't, she really liked Bloodhound, the Bloodhound. And she just like, just really enjoyed seeing him interact.

[00:47:04] [SPEAKER_06] And of course, it was funny with the, with the dummies, you know, the.

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_09] That was a weird twist, wasn't it? The ventriloquist thing.

[00:47:12] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah, it was.

[00:47:13] [SPEAKER_09] That was, he just wanted to do it. Maybe he had a.

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_06] Maybe. Yeah.

[00:47:16] [SPEAKER_09] I was an interesting ventriloquism at the time. He's pretty good. He's pretty good. That's for sure. Yeah.

[00:47:20] [SPEAKER_06] And he's got these, you know, right at the end of the show, he's got these veterans are looking at him thinking, this is really crazy. He's awful. The cactus falling down. I mean, it's just like, oh my gosh. What was he thinking? You know, it's like, well, it's like. Uh, Levy was talking to guests, you know, about the left feet and Levy was just saying, you know, they were just bantering back and forth. And I think guests brought up like two left feet.

[00:47:49] [SPEAKER_06] I can't remember who brought up the left feet. And he's like, can we do this? Well, it's funny, but can we do that? You know, Levy is saying two left feet. Uh, yeah, we could do that. You know? So you wonder like Pepper, right? Like guests were singing, oh, ventriculism. Yeah. Where did that come from? Dummies. Let's, let's pull out the mouth. Yeah. Funny. Uh, yes. Let's do it.

[00:48:13] [SPEAKER_04] Oh, it'd be up there. Yeah.

[00:48:14] [SPEAKER_06] Oh my gosh. Yeah.

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_04] And as we continue to talk about the marriage or the healthy relationships or non-healthy relationships between our characters, uh, up next is Stefan and Scott, who are. They're pretty healthy. Yeah, they were.

[00:48:31] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Yes, they were.

[00:48:32] [SPEAKER_04] You know, very supportive of each other, embraced each other, knew their yin and their yang, you know, and everything like that.

[00:48:39] [SPEAKER_09] And odd couple, but then odd couple of that worked. Absolutely.

[00:48:43] [SPEAKER_04] You know, and so they had a Shih Tzu, Miss Agnes, uh, you know, and so, um, you know, one character was, uh, a hairdresser in real life. So he was definitely into the theatrics, uh, of, of, you know, the dog and doing the photo shoots and dressing her up and so forth and so on, you know?

[00:49:08] [SPEAKER_04] And, um, um, uh, uh, McKean character was more, more straight laced, but he, he, you could tell he just loved what, um, the other character brought out in him because I, I think they share in a couch episode that, you know, that they met later. Like I think, um, yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That Stefan was in a heterosexual.

[00:49:34] [SPEAKER_06] They were introduced to each other.

[00:49:35] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah.

[00:49:36] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. That's right. And the arguments that they would have is like normal. I love the scene where they were packing like six kimonos, right? It's like, we're, you know, it's only 48 hours. And then we see later, they have these, they bring their own artwork and they're hanging it in the hotel room.

[00:49:55] [SPEAKER_09] They had to create their space. And I love that, that whole, um, uh, co-opting of Eastern philosophy and quasi sort of religious practices to try to, you know, uh, only West the way that we can only do as, as Westerners. I remember one time, uh, driving and I was in a hurry, uh, and I just was struck by the irony that here I am not full on road rage, but I was like hustling to get to yoga.

[00:50:23] [SPEAKER_09] And I was like dodging and weaving in the car and trying to find a parking spot. Like get out of my way. I got to get to my yoga class. Just the, the sort of the irony. And then just the way, just the way that we just sort of unthinkingly grabbed these cultural, you know, elements like Lego blocks. And here they, it was just a hilarious scene creating their space. So yeah. Oh my God. Yeah.

[00:50:48] [SPEAKER_04] Great characters. There's that scene where they both visit the butcher and they're trying to ask for a certain cut of meat. Oh yeah.

[00:50:57] [SPEAKER_09] And again, playing, you know, he's Higgins is playing the, the super flamboyant, super camp gay man, but we see them in a healthy relationship. So they're really doing a lot to normalize a gay relationship in the open. They're having fun with it. They're winking and nodding with it and just sort of living, leaning into who they want to be as people in the world. And, and that was kind of cool.

[00:51:24] [SPEAKER_09] And it, but like, yeah, just seeing that flamboyance of Higgins character was, was so much fun. He was so funny. His little zings and one liners were, were amazing.

[00:51:35] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:51:37] [SPEAKER_09] And McKeon is a big time regular for this crew. He's a, he's one of the heavy hitters.

[00:51:42] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. He was a spinal tap major character. Yeah.

[00:51:47] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. And around. Yeah. A bunch of stuff. So.

[00:51:51] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. And Higgins, I believe it was, it's funny because I turned to my daughter and said, you know, he's now hosting a game show, uh, called America says he's a game show host now. No, I didn't know that. Yeah. The actor. And it's like, we recognize him from that because once in a while we'll put it on just to kill some time or something, it's like, it's like, and then see him in this movie. We're just like, oh my gosh.

[00:52:18] [SPEAKER_09] Wow. He has got quite, McKeon's got quite the filmography as well. Yeah.

[00:52:27] [SPEAKER_06] He goes back. I wasn't he in Laverne and Shirley. Yes. Yeah.

[00:52:31] [SPEAKER_09] Right. Lenny Klasinowski. Yep. 149 episodes. Yep. Oh, and even a crossover for Fonzie's funeral. Spoilers. Yeah. Oh man. Yeah. His TV, uh, work is an, and theater. So dang. Yes. A bunch of awards, Grammys and, uh, yeah.

[00:52:57] [SPEAKER_09] A bunch of other sort of, uh, B tier Grammys, but, uh, I mean not Grammys, but, uh, of awards, but still a bunch of award winners. Yeah.

[00:53:04] [SPEAKER_04] So he's really, wasn't he the brother better call Saul?

[00:53:07] [SPEAKER_09] Yes, he was. Yeah. I forgot about that. He totally was. Yeah. It's right there on his list. Yeah. Such a good role too. Yeah.

[00:53:15] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Yeah. Again, being, uh, you know, a comedic, but also good to straight and, and it's just, just amazing. Yeah. Actors.

[00:53:24] [SPEAKER_04] He could do eccentric just at the right note that was asked of him depending on the project. Yeah.

[00:53:32] [SPEAKER_06] That's right. Well said. Yes, absolutely.

[00:53:34] [SPEAKER_04] Yep. Okay. Then. Okay. We move on to Sherry Ann Cabot and Christy Cummings played by Jennifer Coolidge and Jane Lynch. So Coolidge, uh, Sherry Ann is the trophy wife, uh, who's married to a very elderly man, uh, a marriage she defends in the first, uh, scene that we see them in, you know, he is basically sitting there without any teeth and she's like, you know, I got to fight him off.

[00:54:04] [SPEAKER_04] He, I mean, he's the, he's the sexual dynamo in this relationship. So, um, and then Jane Lynch is the handler, uh, and she has won best in show before they have a poodle Rhapsody in white. Um, so there's a lot of expectations there that this poodle will come in again. And so Jane Lynch's character, uh, Christy is the one that all the rest of the handlers in our movie, uh, defer to and want to meet.

[00:54:34] [SPEAKER_04] And she's also very competitive. So she has that backhanded way of saying, you're doing such a good job. I'm great that you're here with me, but, and we'll just dig in. I can see then in a few more years, your dog will be able to X, you know? Uh, and so she played that and, uh, you know, and definitely.

[00:54:53] [SPEAKER_09] And so the way they don't wonder if she was, she, did she trip, uh, Catherine O'Hara's character? Did she set that fall up? I wonder. Yes.

[00:55:05] [SPEAKER_04] It was insinuated, I think.

[00:55:08] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Yeah.

[00:55:09] [SPEAKER_04] Very competitive. We'll do whatever she needs to, to take someone else down. Oops. Sorry. Yeah. And Catherine O'Hara trips and, uh, improvs the whole thing where she can no longer, uh, walk. Well, she tries to walk Catherine O'Hara cookie. And in one of the more physical parts of the film, Catherine O'Hara's kind of wiggling around, breaking down on her, you know, with her knee, you know, and that's what makes, uh, that's a good scene too. Yeah.

[00:55:36] [SPEAKER_04] And that's what makes Jerry have to be the one to handle the dog in the best show. Yeah. Uh, but, but they were great. And, um, you know.

[00:55:46] [SPEAKER_09] Either of you, have either of you watched Heated Rivalry?

[00:55:51] [SPEAKER_06] She's got a shirt on. Oh, nice. Nice. I've yet to see it.

[00:55:55] [SPEAKER_09] Yes, David, I have.

[00:55:57] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah.

[00:55:57] [SPEAKER_09] Okay. So there is a scene. Is it the last episode, Lisa? Or a second to the last episode? It's near the end of the show. Okay. Where there is an on-camera reveal. Brian, I'm navigating around this. There's an on-camera reveal of two other characters that affects our two main protagonists. Do you know what I'm talking about, Lisa? The kiss.

[00:56:24] [SPEAKER_04] Oh, that.

[00:56:26] [SPEAKER_09] Yes. Yes. That Scott.

[00:56:27] [SPEAKER_04] They thought we're, oh, oh, yes. Okay. Episode five.

[00:56:31] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Episode five. Yes. Lockdown. Oh, 100%. So, so when, uh, when Coolidge and Lynch have their kiss. Yeah. I got big Heated Rivalry vibes when Scott and Stefan see it. Yeah. They're like, oh. Oh. And this film just keeps opening up these spaces for communities that, you know, like in normalizing gay culture. Right.

[00:57:01] [SPEAKER_09] And allowing it to just be normal and to flourish. And so I loved that scene when she just runs over there and throws herself at her and they just start making out in the aisle way.

[00:57:15] [SPEAKER_04] Uh, as a, as a funny note, the, uh, only quote unquote actor that ever had to be fired from this film was the poodle. Oh.

[00:57:26] [SPEAKER_06] Rhapsody in white. Oh no.

[00:57:27] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. They, they had to, they had to go through several. I mean, they already do have, you know, lookalike dogs for these, but, um. Right. Yeah. The original cast of Rhapsody in white, uh, did not stick around long. So. Did not work out. Okay. Did not work out. So, yeah.

[00:57:43] [SPEAKER_09] What's the magazine that, uh, Sherry Ann is annoying. Christy starts, um, at the end.

[00:57:52] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Something bitch. Right. Bitch, I think. Yeah. No, there was something. It was two.

[00:57:57] [SPEAKER_09] It was something bitch. And I was just like, oh my God, this is so perfect. It was so eighties, you know, fat, high fashion magazine kind of thing. And, and, but, you know, just, Hey, this is, you know, this lesbian lifestyle magazine, or a lifestyle magazine for lesbian dog breeder and dog owner things. And so I was just like, this is so great. This is so awesome. And, uh, you know, again, a good arc. Like actually I was wrong in the, in the sense that Levy is the only one that has an arc because these two definitely have an arc.

[00:58:24] [SPEAKER_04] Yes, they do.

[00:58:25] [SPEAKER_09] American bitch.

[00:58:27] [SPEAKER_06] American bitch. Thank you. Yes. Yeah. So proud. They've got only two, two issues. Yes, exactly. They're both hanging there behind them on the interview.

[00:58:41] [SPEAKER_04] Yes. The dog magazine for women and their dogs.

[00:58:44] [SPEAKER_06] Yes. So good. Yes. Yeah. And this is like 15 years or so before gay marriage was solidified in federal law of the Supreme court, which is like, it just, as you said, David, they're just normalizing this lifestyle and it's a wonderful thing to see.

[00:59:00] [SPEAKER_09] Well, not to call lifestyle and seeing the lifestyle, but being gay is more than just lifestyle. Yeah. That's right. Right. Sorry. Exactly.

[00:59:10] [SPEAKER_06] No, no, exactly. Absolutely. And a guest found Lynch in a, uh, frosted flakes commercial. No. Yes.

[00:59:20] [SPEAKER_04] What was it about a frosted flakes commercial?

[00:59:24] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Yeah. She was standing next to someone, uh, in front of a building and she was like a college student or something. And she's like, I love my frosted flakes. And she had this like plastic bowl and she was eating it and he saw it and it's like, this is, she's good. Oh my God. Yeah.

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_04] Talk about an eye for talent. Right. It's bonkers. Yeah. Oh my God. All right.

[00:59:49] [SPEAKER_09] Lynch in Lynch's. Yeah. Only murders. Right. That's a, I love her role in, in. Yes. Yeah.

[00:59:55] [SPEAKER_04] She's Steve Martin's best friend. Yeah. Stunt double. Yes. Yeah.

[00:59:59] [SPEAKER_09] And again, we wouldn't have, um, only murders if we didn't have this SCTV crew and that is true. You know, all of these, these folks, they really, this, this crew in this era, well, this is 2000, so it's a little bit later, but that, you know, they broke open so much. They established so much for the world of comedy.

[01:00:19] [SPEAKER_04] Yep.

[01:00:19] [SPEAKER_09] Anyway, moving on.

[01:00:20] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. So that brings us to some of the best lines.

[01:00:26] [SPEAKER_09] The last couple. They're a couple. I didn't think about that.

[01:00:29] [SPEAKER_04] Yes, absolutely. Uh, so we have, uh, Buck Laughlin played by Fred Willard and, uh, Trevor Beckwith, who is played by Jim Piddick. They're the mismatched, uh, broadcast team. So Fred Willard's Buck has a complete and total lack of dog knowledge, uh, and zero. And, uh, you know, and so how Trevor plays that, like a part of him is appalled with the

[01:00:57] [SPEAKER_04] phrases that come out of his, uh, Fred Willard's mouth, but he, he doesn't want to insult him. He just kind of says, well, yes, Buck, that is true. But, you know, and he just tries to keep everything really straight, you know, and it is just, it's, it's crazy.

[01:01:15] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. The, there's an important part of this film, and I'm sure it must be the same with The Mighty Wind and, and, uh, a couple of these other, uh, mockumentaries is that you're not, you're playing everything straight. Right. Everything has to be played straight and you allow the comedy to arise in the audience. The, the, the watcher completes the, the comedy cycle. You're not doing stupid stuff.

[01:01:44] [SPEAKER_09] No, you know, winking and nodding. It's not, airplane's different, but there's a way that they're doing this deadpan flatness that allows the comedy to arise. And I think it's best showed with Willard's complete, his portrayal. He's so obtuse. He's so, he's such a kind of slime ball character too.

[01:02:09] [SPEAKER_09] Oh, you know, and making all these suggestive things and, uh, it's, but he's not doing it. There's a way that he's just doing it. Right. And then with Jim Piddick just being flat, playing the straight man, doing that vaudevillian straight man thing. It were, they're really smart about how they do this kind of comedy. And I think the, the, uh, the, the highest or the most distilled form is with Laughlin

[01:02:37] [SPEAKER_09] and Beckwith here in this, in this, uh, this duo, this mismatched broadcast team. Yeah.

[01:02:43] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. We, we, we only, we get this hint before that with the deadpan with Levy and O'Hara and Ed Bagley that you mentioned David earlier, the hotel manager, he is straight. He is a straight man. Yep. And, but this, this team here, a broadcast team takes it to a higher level. Yeah. It's just so good. So good.

[01:03:06] [SPEAKER_04] And how he didn't crack up every time Fred Willard opened his mouth. I have no idea, like on the size of thousands of cutting room hours. Exactly. Like the size of the winner's trophy. Uh, he says, I've taken a sponge bath in smaller bowls than that. You know, um, it's, it's just, and then of course, uh, you know, the, I don't think I could ever get used to being poked and prodded like that, you know, as a proctologist joke

[01:03:35] [SPEAKER_04] in there somewhere and, uh, you know, all this other kind of stuff. But, uh, and then of course he wants to always talk about his own prowess and athletic abilities. You know, there's a lot of those kinds of lines. Go ahead.

[01:03:48] [SPEAKER_03] Oh, I was going to say they get into the whole thing with the Mayflower. Doctor question. That's always bothered me and a lot of people, uh, Mayflower, uh, combined with Philadelphia, no brainer, right? Cause this is where the Mayflower landed. Not so it turns out Columbus actually set foot somewhere down in the West Indies. Little known fact. How does the name Mayflower get up to the Quaker city?

[01:04:08] [SPEAKER_02] Well, it wasn't actually Columbus, uh, the Mayflower, as you probably remember. And, uh, and he, he did land in Plymouth Rock.

[01:04:15] [SPEAKER_03] Well, they landed several places cause there's the Nino, the Pinta, uh, there are a couple of them. They, they all landed in different places, but really the, the, well, I'm not the historian. Let the people in the production booth deal with that one. It doesn't matter.

[01:04:27] [SPEAKER_06] It really does. Yeah. It's like, no, so wrong. He's saying, uh, there were three ships and, oh my gosh, it was just kept going on and on. Oh my gosh. And Willard, uh, I was, I loved it. I, you know, the fact that he mentions just off the cuff that, you know, I, I covered the show last year. So it was like, he's like none learn from every year.

[01:04:56] [SPEAKER_06] It's like just static, uh, ignorance. Yeah. Exactly. Hilarious. Exactly.

[01:05:02] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. I'm curious. I want to think that because the show or the film was such a hit and Fred Willard's character, I think Fred Willard actually later on did like guest spots on the actual Westminster kennel show. I mean, he wasn't like serious, but you know, they, they kind of brought him in, you know, just for one of those little skits, you know, that they do whatever.

[01:05:25] [SPEAKER_09] But that would be really, really smart marketing and a really great way to sort of wink and nod and bring in some different audience and stuff like that. Because, you know, how far does Willard go with the bit? Yeah. And does he just hint at it or, you know, with a light sort of dusting or does he like lean into the, the ridiculousness or does he play it straight and, and actually be a serious commentator?

[01:05:46] [SPEAKER_04] You know, I would watch some of that to see a hundred percent YouTube playlist on Fred Willard's buck interviewing the handlers behind the scenes or something like that would just be fabulous. If I do find that, I will put it in discord.

[01:06:01] [SPEAKER_09] Sounds good. But nice. Perfect.

[01:06:03] [SPEAKER_04] So no, they were great.

[01:06:06] [SPEAKER_06] All right. Yeah. Yeah. I was just going to say, finally, just, you know, as sports watchers, you know, there's that, David, you were saying like, you know, we, we've seen, you know, some of them have seen dog shows before, or you've seen sporting events, you know, the importance of commentary and that just layers in the, the funniness, the, the, the closing of that comedic loop.

[01:06:28] [SPEAKER_07] Right.

[01:06:28] [SPEAKER_06] With your sports fans, you know, you really appreciate. The color commentary is really important. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:06:35] [SPEAKER_04] And no one, yep. No one does color commentary like Fred Willard.

[01:06:38] [SPEAKER_09] The other, the one other thing that I, we don't have on our list here is, and I mentioned this at the, my fresh takes is the actual dog handlers that were, that they were in and around. And there were at least two other dogs in the final best in show run that those looked like real competitors, real people, the way that they were moving and handling their dogs.

[01:07:03] [SPEAKER_09] And so to have all of these, uh, people who are very serious about this competition, this kind of competition, these, these best in show types of competitions, having, I would hope a good time being part of this production and, you know, following direction and being among these, these stars. I could not tell the, the way that they edited and the way that all of the extras operated.

[01:07:31] [SPEAKER_09] It was perfectly smooth. It felt really, really nice. And I, I just, I don't know. I just kind of hope that they got to have some fun with this. They did. Yeah. And, and have some fun, uh, making fun of themselves and their, their culture, their little subculture.

[01:07:45] [SPEAKER_04] Yeah. They were game. There were, uh, real dog show judges and breeders and handlers, you know, throughout the film. And, uh, I, I'm, I can imagine the, the cast list for, or, you know, the extras shout out, Hey, if you want to be in this film, you know? Uh, so they, they picked from a lot of them, but, uh, most of the judges about evaluating the dogs on screen, uh, were actual licensed dog show judges. And you had to be to kind of, you know, um, uh, work with Christopher Guest on making

[01:08:14] [SPEAKER_04] the film, you know, real or whatever.

[01:08:16] [SPEAKER_09] I think Don Davis was the only person who was an actor. He was the final judge.

[01:08:20] [SPEAKER_06] Okay.

[01:08:21] [SPEAKER_09] Uh, Everett judge, Everett Bainbridge, uh, at the end, he was the only non-actor judge, I think. Yeah. Uh, and he's a, uh, uh, pretty, you know, well-known face among a lot of television and movie stuff. A great character actor.

[01:08:35] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, in an interview, Guest said that the, they couldn't afford to fill the whole, uh, arena. So he had like cardboard people. Oh, that's funny. Yeah. So there's a bunch of cardboard people apparently in the stands. He said, they're the hardest to direct because it just wouldn't take any direction whatsoever.

[01:08:57] [SPEAKER_04] That's Christopher Guest.

[01:08:59] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah.

[01:09:00] [SPEAKER_09] Better. Well, they would have done that now with CGI to fill in, but there's a, there's something that, that worked as well that the, um, the, their, the stands weren't full.

[01:09:12] [SPEAKER_07] Mm-hmm.

[01:09:13] [SPEAKER_09] Right. That tells you something that is also communicating something to us about what this is that, you know, they have this huge venue, uh, and there's, you know, it's pretty full, two thirds full. Yeah. Right. But, uh, that, that says something anyway. Good stuff. Uh, so you've got a few notes about Ohara here. When I just sort of wrap up with this.

[01:09:34] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. You know, we just had some, just a lot of this we covered before about her improv background. For example, we talked about in the first podcast or SCTV career and how it fits guests improvisation. And what's interesting as I learned from this podcast, putting it together, guess what? I thought he was, uh, SCTV, but he's SNL. He comes from the SNL group. Yes, does. Okay. Yeah. So he, but Ohara comes from SCTV. That's right.

[01:10:02] [SPEAKER_09] And Lee comes from SCTV as well. Right.

[01:10:04] [SPEAKER_06] Yes. That's right. Exactly.

[01:10:06] [SPEAKER_09] And McKeon comes, where's McKeon's background? I wonder. Anyway.

[01:10:11] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Yeah. I know it's, it's skit, but I can't remember which, where he gets it from up here.

[01:10:17] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. I'll look him up real quick.

[01:10:19] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. And, uh, yeah, we mentioned about the absurdity and sincerity of cookie and, and her walking improv with a knee. I put a note on that because it was hilarious.

[01:10:30] [SPEAKER_09] The way she is, is, is, is SNL. Oh yes. Okay. He's an American actor. Yeah.

[01:10:36] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. All right. Excellent. And just the, you know, creativity about working with O'Hara and Levy, the shared timing, and they've been working together for two decades. So it just fit in and, and Levy wrote the Terrier songs, you know, and she just joined in. She said, I just harmonized. Yeah.

[01:11:04] [SPEAKER_06] And, uh, so I don't want to play that clip, David, but that's a kind of a last wonderful fitting tribute as we watch her.

[01:11:12] [SPEAKER_09] Well, why don't we end on that note? I'll play that as we go out. Anything else, uh, Lisa, you want to add for O'Hara?

[01:11:19] [SPEAKER_04] No, other than, uh, I'm thrilled that, uh, we got to see her work with Levy again on Schitt's Creek, which is probably what she's most known for and things like that. But, um, uh, being able to review best in show and, uh, this has been an absolute delight. And I'm so glad that we took the time to do this and to recognize this entire cast of

[01:11:45] [SPEAKER_04] characters for sure, you know, and you can now use O'Hara as a gateway to exactly.

[01:11:52] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah.

[01:11:52] [SPEAKER_04] No, a hundred percent. And it's really made me even more understand and be sympathetic to what a devastating loss this was, you know, to the Eugene Levy's and the Christopher guests and everybody that worked with her for so long. And I think the last time we mentioned it in the last pod, but, um, the last of us, I think was the last thing that she did where she played this. Yeah.

[01:12:11] [SPEAKER_06] That's right. Yeah.

[01:12:12] [SPEAKER_04] Anyway, but fabulous film, highly recommend, um, and, you know, thrilled to have been able to talk to you guys about it.

[01:12:20] [SPEAKER_09] Right. And Catherine O'Hara will be missed. Uh, I'm really going to miss her on the studio. She was such a great presence on that as well. Yes. Television show. Yep. So cool. All right. Well, uh, let me give some, uh, thank yous and some shout outs to our community and to our subscribers. Uh, definitely. Uh, well, we should also mention what's coming up next. What is our next, um, into the West, uh, show, uh, activities. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:12:49] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Go ahead. We're working. Yeah. We're, I think Robert Duvall is next. Okay. So we're going to be, uh, working on, excuse me, working on that. So we'll, you know, queue up some biography and some, uh, movies for him and we'll be picking that and we'll do a Robert Duvall completely different. Uh, and now for something completely different, uh, Robert Duvall. Uh, so we're looking forward to that.

[01:13:15] [SPEAKER_09] Okay. And, uh, recently, um, of course, um, uh, Tom Skerritt, uh, passed away. Yeah. Is he going to be, make the list?

[01:13:26] [SPEAKER_04] I'm wondering, I think that will definitely be, uh, a candle. Okay. Okay. Yeah. I agree. Service for sure. You know, and it's to be reminded that he was in steel magnolias with Dolly Parton, you know, it's just kind of a nice way, but yeah, Tom Skerritt, I think is definitely worth lighting a candle for.

[01:13:44] [SPEAKER_09] I agree. Captain Dallas and alien. That's a film in the community, uh, obviously in top guns in a small part there, but yeah, quite a, quite a filmography. So, okay. We'll do a candlelight for him. Yeah. Very good. Okay. Uh, so look for, uh, our next coverage for Robert Duvall. We'll do, uh, our two part for him. We'll talk about his life and his career, and then we'll do a movie selection. We'll put that out to a vote for everyone.

[01:14:12] [SPEAKER_09] And then, uh, we'll have a similar conversation about the movie. And, uh, now I will just give a quick shout out to some, uh, key folks around here. Our community volunteers, Nancy, who's our hand of the pod, Peter O H who's captain of the pull here, um, uh, keeper of the show tracker, sub zero, Lord Brarian, Brian, 80, 63. And our discord moderators, Brian, 80, 63, Aaron K and Audrey on and, uh, our discord server booster.

[01:14:42] [SPEAKER_09] So folks who donate a little bit of extra something, something to make the server more fun and enjoyable for the community, Aaron K tiller, the thriller do 71, Athena, Adela, the stew, Nancy M ghost of partition, radioactive Richard and Audrey on and to our lore master top tier subscribers, uh, who are our real cornerstone for the whole community.

[01:15:04] [SPEAKER_09] So Martian, Michael G, Michelle E, SC, Peter O H, Nancy M do 71, Brian, 80, 63, uh, Sarah L or sorry, Frederick H, Sarah L, Gareth C, Andrew B, Kwong U, Nathan T, sub zero, Aaron K, Dally B, mothership 61, gnarles, Kathy W, Lestu, Jeffrey B, Elisa U, Ben B, Scott F, Stephen

[01:15:26] [SPEAKER_09] N, Julia, Julia F, Koli S, Ilmariel, Rocky Zim, Jessica A, Red Zippy, the TCS, LNR, Ms. Tennant, AC Wilson, Eli W, Cassie K, Chumbaruni, Katila, Josh Liu, Paint, PDX, Corey G, Quinch, Chini L, Slavinator, Cassandra C, and forever last, but never least, Adrian. Thank you all so very much. And we'll see you all on the next into the West podcast.

[01:15:55] [SPEAKER_08] God loves a terrier. Yes, he does. God loves a terrier. That's because small, sturdy, bright and true. They give their love to you. God didn't miss a stitch, be it dog or be it bitch, when he made the Norwich merrier with its cute little derrier.

[01:16:22] [SPEAKER_08] Yes, God loves a terrier.

[01:16:32] [SPEAKER_05] The Lorehounds podcast is produced and published by the Lorehounds. You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at thelorehounds.com slash contact. Get early and ad-free access to all Lorehounds podcasts at patreon.com slash thelorehounds. Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any employers or other entities. Thanks for listening.