Jean and Elysia kick off the new season of "horrible people doing horrible things to each other" – aka House of the Dragon season 3, episode 1 – with a dive even deeper than a dragon's fall into the Gullet. They discuss character motivations, the meanings of new revelations, one misused quote, Green Men lore, our new favorite dragon, and arguably the most beautiful battle ever committed to screen.
Stick around until after the outro music for the final full-book-spoiler discussion of these events and what might be coming next.
Links Discussed
- HBO BTS: How to Film An Epic Sea Battle
- Backrooms (2026) pod (incl. discussion of “The Yellow Wallpaper” short story)
- Podcast discussing the Green Men (Electric Bookaloo)
Contact Us Questions or comments? Send emails to: hotd@thelorehounds.com
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00:17 --> 00:22 [UNKNOWN]: welcome to the lower-hounds podcast your guides to the Dragon Warfare of the Targaryen family bush.
00:23 --> 00:27 [UNKNOWN]: I'm Alicia just back from hanging out with some green men on the island faces.
00:27 --> 00:30 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know how I feel about this family bush the two weeks.
00:33 --> 00:35 [UNKNOWN]: I got to re-evaluate what pod we do it here.
00:36 --> 00:41 [UNKNOWN]: And I'm just headed to Finland, you favorite dragon from Indian all slander.
00:42 --> 00:44 [UNKNOWN]: You know, I can't yet.
00:45 --> 00:53 [UNKNOWN]: I haven't worked out the name, but we're not going to do this sheep stealer the whole season long.
00:53 --> 01:00 [UNKNOWN]: We're not going to do it because we said that it's profiling sheep, let's profile with a loan.
01:03 --> 01:11 [UNKNOWN]: And this is our breakdown of episode one of season three of HBO's House of the Dragon, Salt and Sea Fire in Blood.
01:12 --> 01:16 [UNKNOWN]: So I am standing in as a substitute host for the first two weeks.
01:16 --> 01:23 [UNKNOWN]: Jean, you will be here all season and joined by David from four episodes three and after.
01:23 --> 01:24 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, yes.
01:24 --> 01:25 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, looking forward to it.
01:25 --> 01:28 [UNKNOWN]: I think we're going to have a wonderful season.
01:28 --> 01:30 [UNKNOWN]: The discord is already popping.
01:31 --> 01:33 [UNKNOWN]: It's going to have fun with this.
01:33 --> 01:37 [UNKNOWN]: It's going to be some great convos and I think we're going to laugh a lot.
01:38 --> 01:45 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and after when David comes back, I will be still checking in regularly.
01:45 --> 01:47 [UNKNOWN]: I think I'll send in voice mails each week.
01:47 --> 01:52 [UNKNOWN]: Just yeah, lots of the vampire list at and silo going on.
01:54 --> 02:11 [UNKNOWN]: But if you haven't yet, dear listeners at home, I recommend checking out our season preview, which was the three of us together, where we gave an overview of the season to come, starting with a spoiler-free discussion before getting into trailers and eventually book discussion.
02:11 --> 02:15 [UNKNOWN]: This time, we will get right into the spoilers for all episodes aired today,
02:20 --> 02:24 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, we're free to bring up Game of Thrones or a night of the Seven Kingdoms.
02:24 --> 02:27 [UNKNOWN]: I'm not sure we necessarily, well, actually, I'm going to bring up Game of Thrones.
02:28 --> 02:34 [UNKNOWN]: No, in the book spoiler section now, because there is a major book spoiler in Game of Thrones if you don't know that yet.
02:35 --> 02:44 [UNKNOWN]: But we will avoid any future book spoilers in the main part of the podcast and save that for after the credits.
02:45 --> 03:07 [UNKNOWN]: Right now, though, unleashing all season three premier spoilers, stop listening now if you're not ready for those, because, yeah, the some major stuff happened this episode, which, how do you feel about this being the first episode of the season versus what we all assumed that this was meant to be originally the finale of last season?
03:07 --> 03:08 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, I'm cool with it.
03:09 --> 03:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
03:09 --> 03:11 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I didn't bother me now, not in the least.
03:14 --> 03:19 [UNKNOWN]: I think it was a great way to jump into the season.
03:19 --> 03:23 [UNKNOWN]: I really felt like we jumped in right into the stakes.
03:24 --> 03:28 [UNKNOWN]: You know, there was no tip-toeing around what's going on.
03:29 --> 03:31 [UNKNOWN]: It's really on, right?
03:31 --> 03:39 [UNKNOWN]: We're really here with the midst of this, and I think it's a great way to start because these last two seasons have been leading to these things happening.
03:40 --> 03:43 [UNKNOWN]: And I think, yeah, I was totally cold with it, totally.
03:44 --> 03:45 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, where are you?
03:48 --> 03:49 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
03:49 --> 03:57 [UNKNOWN]: I do think it would have worked better as a season finale, but obviously it was visually a strong season opener.
03:58 --> 04:03 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, we're going to get into our fresh shakes for a second, but first I have to, I told you have to shave myself.
04:04 --> 04:10 [UNKNOWN]: So I have to thank Abbey for a gentle correction from the season preview bookbitch in section.
04:10 --> 04:17 [UNKNOWN]: So only people who listen to the book spoiler section heard this, it is relevant to this episode note where he knows spoilers.
04:18 --> 04:21 [UNKNOWN]: I kept saying baila when I meant her sister Reina.
04:22 --> 04:26 [UNKNOWN]: when we were talking about this being combined with another character.
04:26 --> 04:41 [UNKNOWN]: So just to clarify, since it's of course very important for this episode, and beyond Bala is the older one, Damon's older daughter, Jason Betroth, Rides, Moon Dancer, Raina is her younger sister.
04:41 --> 04:43 [UNKNOWN]: They're twins in the book, but they're not here.
04:44 --> 04:47 [UNKNOWN]: And she was the one with Rainera's kids in the Vale.
04:47 --> 04:51 [UNKNOWN]: Seeing this episode bonding with, I'm sorry, he's called Sheep Stealer.
04:51 --> 04:57 [UNKNOWN]: and he's the one being given storylines from a book only character.
04:57 --> 04:59 [UNKNOWN]: You've probably heard a lot of Bruhaha about called Nettles.
05:00 --> 05:11 [UNKNOWN]: Um, so on behalf of Abby and any other listeners who clocks that in the previous episode, uh, Septa Unella would like to issue me a
05:20 --> 05:34 [UNKNOWN]: So, okay, now that that is cleared up, we will, if you have feedback, we also want to hear it's gentle corrections and courage, just elaborating on what's been discussed here.
05:34 --> 05:41 [UNKNOWN]: Also warmly welcomed, we will be discussing some feedback we've already gotten about the first episode at the end of the episode.
05:42 --> 05:48 [UNKNOWN]: If you want to add your own for next time, please send it to HOTD at thelorhounds.com,
05:50 --> 05:57 [UNKNOWN]: or you can use our website contact form, and we will include that in a future episode voicemails definitely encouraged.
05:57 --> 06:00 [UNKNOWN]: You'll hear a couple today from Dobominie.
06:01 --> 06:11 [UNKNOWN]: Hand of the pod Nancy is our feedback Wrangler for this show, so she will gather and organize it and you'll hear back from her if you email it in.
06:13 --> 06:16 [UNKNOWN]: Let's get into the episode itself, Sean.
06:16 --> 06:18 [UNKNOWN]: Spoilers, of course, completely on the table.
06:18 --> 06:21 [UNKNOWN]: We already said this, you gave some teases.
06:21 --> 06:23 [UNKNOWN]: You thought this was an awesome way to kick off this season.
06:23 --> 06:25 [UNKNOWN]: Tell me what did you really like about this?
06:25 --> 06:27 [UNKNOWN]: Other than, of course, your new favorite dragon.
06:27 --> 06:28 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah.
06:28 --> 06:31 [UNKNOWN]: Besides, you don't have the sheepy.
06:32 --> 06:37 [UNKNOWN]: We are placed right in the middle of...
06:38 --> 06:41 [UNKNOWN]: everything that is important to these folks.
06:42 --> 06:56 [UNKNOWN]: And when I say that, I mean that we see how Allison and Reinaura, how their relationship is really the center of everything here.
06:57 --> 07:03 [UNKNOWN]: Because she believes that Allison is trying to avoid something here.
07:07 --> 07:11 [UNKNOWN]: right, Reinaura is like, this is still my friend.
07:12 --> 07:17 [UNKNOWN]: And I really want to believe what she's telling me.
07:18 --> 07:26 [UNKNOWN]: And we see how the people around them are jeopardizing and sabotaging what they are trying to do.
07:27 --> 07:32 [UNKNOWN]: So this is very much to me a story of these two women, these two
07:37 --> 07:49 [UNKNOWN]: to get an outcome that is I would say you know I don't know if at this point we're not wants to you know destroy her entire family, her entire bloodline, you know what I mean?
07:50 --> 07:52 [UNKNOWN]: Alison obviously decided she doesn't want that.
07:52 --> 07:53 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, right.
07:53 --> 08:02 [UNKNOWN]: So it just seems for me that this was a way to really cement that this is really about the two of them.
08:03 --> 08:08 [UNKNOWN]: And how the people around them are continually are continuing to fail them.
08:10 --> 08:17 [UNKNOWN]: By withholding information, by subterfuge, all these things that they are doing,
08:17 --> 08:28 [UNKNOWN]: behind their backs and they're stuck with the consequences of those other people's shenanigans.
08:29 --> 08:38 [UNKNOWN]: So I just thought that this, for me, made it really clear who this story is about this episode.
08:39 --> 08:44 [UNKNOWN]: It's everything else that happened in the battles, of course, that amazing,
08:44 --> 08:48 [UNKNOWN]: But the core of the story is Rinaura, and that was it.
08:50 --> 09:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I do think one of the best things that this adaptation did in terms of, you know, fleshing out the the history-style material it's based on is, well, they aged Alice and down, but in this, they created
09:10 --> 09:20 [UNKNOWN]: that friendship, that founding friendship that we enjoyed at the beginning of the first season, and that really creates so much richness and complexity for everything that follows.
09:22 --> 09:22 [UNKNOWN]: I think...
09:23 --> 09:31 [UNKNOWN]: I'm not thrilled with the way women are treated in this world in general, but that's... Oh no, absolutely.
09:31 --> 09:33 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, you know, like, oh, but it's historical.
09:33 --> 09:34 [UNKNOWN]: No.
09:34 --> 09:47 [UNKNOWN]: First of all, this is fantasy, but you know, I'll talk about some of that, and I saw some of that in this episode, so I have some hesitancy about some things there that we can talk a bit about a bit.
09:48 --> 10:01 [UNKNOWN]: more as we go but overall like what do I go into this show for um this is the dragon show with all that spectacle and this was i have in my notes here very battle much dragon
10:03 --> 10:10 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I do so wishes had been the finale, but I understand that it was a practical decision to move it to this season opener.
10:10 --> 10:16 [UNKNOWN]: I just it's also because like I can't help writing in my head and I'm like, no, but at least for the finale.
10:16 --> 10:21 [UNKNOWN]: This would have been the season opener and that's on me.
10:21 --> 10:21 [UNKNOWN]: That's on me.
10:22 --> 10:23 [UNKNOWN]: It's not my job to write this show.
10:24 --> 10:28 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but of course, you know, I can't take that away from my experience as a viewer.
10:28 --> 10:33 [UNKNOWN]: So I do wish HBO just put that money into the last end of the last season.
10:33 --> 10:37 [UNKNOWN]: So we went out with a bang there and then we're starting out off with the next thing here.
10:37 --> 10:39 [UNKNOWN]: But repercussions.
10:39 --> 10:40 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
10:40 --> 10:47 [UNKNOWN]: But this was one of the most gorgeous hours of television that I've seen in quite some time.
10:49 --> 10:50 [UNKNOWN]: I did, I watched it twice.
10:51 --> 10:56 [UNKNOWN]: So I watched it once on my TV and once on my computer screen.
10:56 --> 10:58 [UNKNOWN]: And I noticed a drastic difference.
10:58 --> 11:01 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like, actually, my TV's pretty nice at lighting.
11:04 --> 11:10 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but when when the lighting was was on, it was there was just some really fantastic cinematography too.
11:10 --> 11:23 [UNKNOWN]: I just I loved the immaculate detail of the dragons and and I love how different they all look, you know, I'm sure is one of the reasons you love sheep stealer because he looks kind of chunky.
11:25 --> 11:27 [UNKNOWN]: I'm not going to call sheepy, janky.
11:27 --> 11:28 [UNKNOWN]: You know what I'm saying?
11:28 --> 11:30 [UNKNOWN]: We're not going to do that.
11:30 --> 11:31 [UNKNOWN]: I do love an underbite.
11:32 --> 11:33 [UNKNOWN]: This is extreme, but I love an underbite.
11:36 --> 11:39 [UNKNOWN]: I love sheep, sheepy for many reasons.
11:40 --> 11:45 [UNKNOWN]: Thunderbite is not one of them, but there are many reasons why I love sheepy.
11:46 --> 11:51 [UNKNOWN]: I'm not going to lie, the underbite might be one of the things that I love most about this dragon.
11:52 --> 11:55 [UNKNOWN]: It's kind of like, it's Habsburg jaw thing going on anyway.
11:55 --> 12:04 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, very, to your point about the visuals, I don't know how much money they put into this episode.
12:05 --> 12:05 [UNKNOWN]: A lot.
12:13 --> 12:27 [UNKNOWN]: There's not one for me, there's not one scene that I did not, that I thought was not just absolutely gorgeous, even when people are not fighting, even when they're not riding the dragons.
12:39 --> 12:49 [UNKNOWN]: the people with the money, put the money into the product, the kind of product that you can actually get, because the story and the visuals for me matched.
12:50 --> 12:59 [UNKNOWN]: You know, sometimes we get the visuals that we're like, oh, it's with the story, but everything here just really worked in my opinion.
12:59 --> 13:02 [UNKNOWN]: And just seeing, you know,
13:09 --> 13:17 [UNKNOWN]: just the way that they maneuvered in the air over the ships is just really, really something, something else.
13:18 --> 13:23 [UNKNOWN]: And then we get the elderly, you know, starts the elder wolves.
13:25 --> 13:25 [UNKNOWN]: They come through.
13:25 --> 13:28 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, the way to what I call them the elder wolves.
13:29 --> 13:41 [UNKNOWN]: And when they come through banging and it's a host of them, and it's just like, yeah, these, and I'm looking, and for a minute, it was just like, oh, wait a minute.
13:42 --> 13:45 [UNKNOWN]: Everybody's kind of like about 60.
13:45 --> 13:47 [UNKNOWN]: There's reasons for that, right?
13:47 --> 14:10 [UNKNOWN]: So we'll, you know, I'm sure we'll talk about that, but it just looked, coming out of the forest when they came out the forest, demons face when he called his soldiers to arms, to get ready for another battle and to relieve that he shows when they declared their allegiance, it's just, it's just great stuff.
14:13 --> 14:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, if I'm going to have one criticism, it's not enough starts in general in the show.
14:19 --> 14:24 [UNKNOWN]: They show like because I was so excited when Jay Sarah's went up to the wall, you know?
14:24 --> 14:24 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
14:25 --> 14:27 [UNKNOWN]: I was like, oh, we're going to get a whole episode up there and no.
14:28 --> 14:31 [UNKNOWN]: No, but no.
14:31 --> 14:32 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, they have to focus.
14:32 --> 14:44 [UNKNOWN]: We'll talk about some decisions that they made adaptation choices because it's obviously making this sort of this battle like this as episode like this.
14:44 --> 14:48 [UNKNOWN]: It takes so much planning and coordination, obviously we talked about the money.
14:49 --> 14:59 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, shout out to VFX producer Thomas Horton, who I believe over saw, especially this battle, just an enormous amount of practical VFX too.
15:00 --> 15:05 [UNKNOWN]: I'll put a link to a video in the show notes about how they put all this together.
15:05 --> 15:06 [UNKNOWN]: But I'll say, I am
15:07 --> 15:24 [UNKNOWN]: you know I'm very pro practical and that was great how they did that but I do notice as I was going through my favorite shots from this episode that I was like oh I really like to see what they did with the CGI huh um I like like they there's a soft lighting throughout
15:24 --> 15:29 [UNKNOWN]: It does not all see jive, of course, but there's, but I love the water shots.
15:29 --> 15:40 [UNKNOWN]: I'm a sucker for water shot, so like all the gullet shots and especially there's this god die water shot as they come and you see hair and haul in the distance and it's just oh beautiful.
15:41 --> 15:57 [UNKNOWN]: Um, although my favorite shot overall, again, we're in this weather section, it's when Alan is under the boat and he's just killed Lohar and she's sinking into the water and the way that light hits and the way that like, the remnants of the boat are framing him.
15:57 --> 16:05 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like, oh, I like, I watched, I don't want to like, I'm a little sad about Lohar dying because she's an interesting character.
16:05 --> 16:06 [UNKNOWN]: I would have liked to have seen more of
16:10 --> 16:13 [UNKNOWN]: I watched her die over and over just because I love that shot.
16:18 --> 16:25 [UNKNOWN]: But, you know, when it comes to the characters though, you, I mean, you know me, we are always getting into discussions.
16:25 --> 16:27 [UNKNOWN]: I'm always defending some questionable characters.
16:27 --> 16:30 [UNKNOWN]: I am not defending any of these people except maybe Alice.
16:30 --> 16:31 [UNKNOWN]: I did defend Alice.
16:34 --> 16:35 [UNKNOWN]: In the chat.
16:37 --> 16:38 [UNKNOWN]: But in general, like,
16:39 --> 16:42 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, these people, oh, I don't know.
16:42 --> 16:47 [UNKNOWN]: At some point, I'm like, sheep steal your right, burn them all, just burn them all, just burn them all.
16:47 --> 16:49 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, that's the thing.
16:50 --> 17:03 [UNKNOWN]: When they're on the ship with Alan and the surf steasnake, he's that whole conversation that they have at the table.
17:04 --> 17:09 [UNKNOWN]: I just wanted to reach through the screen and choke out coreless, you know what I mean?
17:09 --> 17:27 [UNKNOWN]: Just like, so condescending and he's, and I think he's actually trying not to be, which made it more infuriating and Alan, the look on his face as he, you know, listens to this,
17:33 --> 17:38 [UNKNOWN]: He watches him on the ship, his high tide is burning, right?
17:39 --> 17:43 [UNKNOWN]: And then he sees him like, freeze in the moment, right?
17:44 --> 17:50 [UNKNOWN]: Totally looking at his father diminished in that moment.
17:51 --> 17:57 [UNKNOWN]: And he rises up to their occasion to rally, you know, the crew to repel the attack.
17:58 --> 18:00 [UNKNOWN]: And then that moment is just like,
18:01 --> 18:10 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, your father is not all that, and you know it, but right now it just cemented it, right?
18:10 --> 18:17 [UNKNOWN]: But then, Corn is does something that totally won me over again.
18:17 --> 18:26 [UNKNOWN]: The standing at the bow, he's directing his, his husband to steer the ship, right?
18:27 --> 18:29 [UNKNOWN]: And he sees he can't do it.
18:30 --> 18:31 [UNKNOWN]: He sees he's afraid.
18:31 --> 18:34 [UNKNOWN]: He sees that he's not up to the task.
18:34 --> 18:35 [UNKNOWN]: And he doesn't beret him.
18:36 --> 18:37 [UNKNOWN]: He doesn't yell at him.
18:38 --> 18:39 [UNKNOWN]: He doesn't do any of those things.
18:39 --> 18:42 [UNKNOWN]: He just softly puts his hand on the on the steer.
18:44 --> 18:47 [UNKNOWN]: Move this his hand aside and takes command.
18:48 --> 18:53 [UNKNOWN]: And I said, God, Seast naked is in the mother fucking house.
18:53 --> 18:53 [UNKNOWN]: Right?
18:56 --> 18:59 [UNKNOWN]: I appreciate that they reminded us that he is a master-ships.
18:59 --> 19:03 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, yes, I say Godness, he snake is in the mother fucking house.
19:04 --> 19:10 [UNKNOWN]: just one hand, it's steering that joint like, yeah, I didn't need a soundtrack to that.
19:10 --> 19:13 [UNKNOWN]: You know, there's like, you know, some jay, you put on some biggie to that.
19:13 --> 19:14 [UNKNOWN]: This is the season.
19:14 --> 19:16 [UNKNOWN]: He just like, listen, low heart.
19:16 --> 19:17 [UNKNOWN]: These are my waters.
19:17 --> 19:19 [UNKNOWN]: You came to my part of town.
19:19 --> 19:25 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like, oh, this is so, and in that moment, it's just like, you, you, you see.
19:27 --> 19:37 [UNKNOWN]: in the span of, you know, whatever 20 minutes of viewing on TV, somebody can go from, oh, get this motherfucker out of here.
19:37 --> 19:40 [UNKNOWN]: So, wow, look at this motherfucker.
19:41 --> 19:44 [UNKNOWN]: Two motherfuckers, but totally different in 10 in my words.
19:45 --> 19:54 [UNKNOWN]: The way that I'm saying it, you know, and it's just really a testament to how the story is being shown to us.
19:56 --> 20:06 [UNKNOWN]: There are many small scenes that mean a lot to me and things that we view and this was one of those.
20:06 --> 20:07 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
20:08 --> 20:10 [UNKNOWN]: No, yeah, I agree.
20:10 --> 20:13 [UNKNOWN]: I love that he took the wheel there as well.
20:14 --> 20:28 [UNKNOWN]: Um, yeah, I mean, you were just making me think because I think like for me the most frustrating thing is, you know, like, I would make this subtitle of this episode, boys stop thinking you know better than your mothers or end up underestimating them.
20:29 --> 20:35 [UNKNOWN]: So it is interesting to contrast, you know, particularly Aiman and Jace and their
20:44 --> 20:46 [UNKNOWN]: parallel journeys of generational trauma.
20:47 --> 20:48 [UNKNOWN]: Generational trauma man.
20:50 --> 20:54 [UNKNOWN]: All right, let's take a quick break here.
20:54 --> 21:01 [UNKNOWN]: And when we come back, we're going to go a plot by a backstabbing plot and our deep dive through this episode.
21:01 --> 21:02 [UNKNOWN]: You're right back.
21:18 --> 21:21 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, we're going to be talking plot by plot not seen by scene.
21:21 --> 21:24 [UNKNOWN]: Don't take us away with your baby.
21:27 --> 21:27 [UNKNOWN]: Stealing sheep.
21:27 --> 21:29 [UNKNOWN]: I mean.
21:30 --> 21:41 [UNKNOWN]: At the end of season two, Reina Targaryen stepped away as her young half-brothers boarded a boat to Pentos, determined to find and tame the wild, sheep still in Dragon, living in the Vale.
21:42 --> 21:53 [UNKNOWN]: Eventually bonding with this sheep still at over Charglam, she mounts the massive dragon and is carried off to a ledge where sheep still brings back livestock for the two of them to share.
22:02 --> 22:09 [UNKNOWN]: Um, first of all, I'll just say, well, we'll talk about this more in the book spoiler section, but I was really surprised.
22:09 --> 22:10 [UNKNOWN]: I think all book readers were surprised.
22:10 --> 22:15 [UNKNOWN]: There's no mention of Agen and Viserys and their ship, the gay abandon.
22:15 --> 22:20 [UNKNOWN]: So I don't know if we were to suppose to think they just got to pentose.
22:20 --> 22:22 [UNKNOWN]: I guess that's what I'll assume for now.
22:23 --> 22:24 [UNKNOWN]: And still I'm told otherwise.
22:25 --> 22:27 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, they have to let us know what happened to the boys.
22:28 --> 22:38 [UNKNOWN]: So yeah, I was I wasn't too pressed about not knowing what I was pressed about is and Raina look, man, she's she struggling out here.
22:38 --> 22:45 [UNKNOWN]: She is struggling out here and I mean, and I think that's one of the reasons why I don't like the book change.
22:46 --> 22:51 [UNKNOWN]: Um, we'll talk about it later, I guess, but yeah, we said that she's combined with another character.
22:51 --> 22:53 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so I think that's one of the reasons why I don't like it.
22:54 --> 22:59 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but yeah, she's gone through it and seeing her.
22:59 --> 23:06 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know if it's overcoming fear or what they're trying to, to tell us about her.
23:07 --> 23:10 [UNKNOWN]: And her, you know, dance with sheep's dealer.
23:11 --> 23:11 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
23:13 --> 23:17 [UNKNOWN]: So I'm still kind of confused as to who she is.
23:18 --> 23:18 [UNKNOWN]: Hmm.
23:19 --> 23:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
23:19 --> 23:22 [UNKNOWN]: I'd maybe to be fairer she is as well.
23:23 --> 23:24 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, maybe maybe.
23:25 --> 23:30 [UNKNOWN]: It's interesting because she is also in the book kind of portrayed as a more timid one.
23:30 --> 23:32 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, whereas the... A lot more pampered.
23:33 --> 23:57 [UNKNOWN]: character she's being combined with is very much not that exactly exactly I think she's a little you know princessy and the princessy way that people think about princesses right and to have her not be that is kind of jarring to me yeah I guess to her too I guess it shows her desperation to you know claim her right as a Targaryen or something
23:58 --> 24:01 [UNKNOWN]: Um, I do love that sheepy feeds are like a baby bird.
24:03 --> 24:07 [UNKNOWN]: I know you can't hunt on your own, so here's the food that I tried to look at.
24:08 --> 24:12 [UNKNOWN]: I tried to pause and see what kind of animals it was, it was tough to tell but maybe some sort of dog.
24:13 --> 24:15 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
24:15 --> 24:17 [UNKNOWN]: They got a sheepy taking everything.
24:17 --> 24:20 [UNKNOWN]: She'd be, you gotta bring back some water to next time though.
24:20 --> 24:23 [UNKNOWN]: She's a more important one.
24:23 --> 24:24 [UNKNOWN]: She needs some hydration.
24:24 --> 24:25 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, God.
24:25 --> 24:26 [UNKNOWN]: She needs some hydration.
24:26 --> 24:27 [UNKNOWN]: She's gone through it.
24:27 --> 24:28 [UNKNOWN]: She's gone through it.
24:29 --> 24:29 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
24:29 --> 24:31 [UNKNOWN]: Out of all the characters right now, she's gone through it.
24:32 --> 24:32 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
24:33 --> 24:37 [UNKNOWN]: Well, then, yeah, we'll talk about Aegean too, but yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, before that.
24:38 --> 24:44 [UNKNOWN]: But just abandon and left to on her own and totally lost.
24:45 --> 24:46 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, she wasn't abandoned.
24:46 --> 24:47 [UNKNOWN]: She snuck off.
24:48 --> 24:51 [UNKNOWN]: She was like, I'm not going with you to protect these kids.
24:51 --> 24:52 [UNKNOWN]: I'm going to go dragon hunting.
24:53 --> 24:55 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, okay.
24:55 --> 24:56 [UNKNOWN]: All right, I give you that.
24:56 --> 24:57 [UNKNOWN]: That's okay.
24:59 --> 25:00 [UNKNOWN]: All right, that's true.
25:00 --> 25:00 [UNKNOWN]: That's true.
25:00 --> 25:01 [UNKNOWN]: She could have been on penthouse.
25:01 --> 25:03 [UNKNOWN]: That's all right.
25:04 --> 25:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so I mean, I guess it is like a character journey that she chose.
25:08 --> 25:14 [UNKNOWN]: She could have be living that princess life on penthouse and she chose not to.
25:14 --> 25:15 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, something else.
25:16 --> 25:18 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but we still don't know why though.
25:19 --> 25:23 [UNKNOWN]: because it is a big, it's a big decision to have her make.
25:24 --> 25:31 [UNKNOWN]: And I'm still wondering, you know, she, it isn't clear to me why she chose a path that she chose.
25:32 --> 25:37 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I think it's just like she wants to fit in with her family.
25:37 --> 25:41 [UNKNOWN]: And I think to a certain degree too, you know, she's like, I'm a Targaryen, where's my dragon?
25:43 --> 25:43 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
25:46 --> 25:51 [UNKNOWN]: She gets a different, small dragon in the book that's probably not going to be in this show.
25:51 --> 25:59 [UNKNOWN]: So, she has a somewhat similar journey in the book, but in a more pampered princess way.
25:59 --> 25:59 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
25:59 --> 26:00 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
26:01 --> 26:05 [UNKNOWN]: Well, speaking of royalty, let's talk about the royal fugitive.
26:05 --> 26:08 [UNKNOWN]: Laris has escaped King's Landing with King.
26:09 --> 26:13 [UNKNOWN]: question mark, Aegon, who is still crippled by the pain of his full body burn.
26:14 --> 26:28 [UNKNOWN]: Their carriage is stopped by soldiers from house stonten, a house loyal to Reneera, while Laris is happy to pretend fealty to the black queen, Aegon can't bring himself to swear or even fake allegiance to his older sister.
26:28 --> 26:31 [UNKNOWN]: And the guards are ordered to kill the obvious Aegon supporters.
26:32 --> 26:34 [UNKNOWN]: In a bid to save their lives, Laris tells the
26:38 --> 26:43 [UNKNOWN]: telling him to pull the crown of Aegon the Conqueror out of their bag as proof.
26:43 --> 26:53 [UNKNOWN]: Laris convinces the guard that Aegon are worth more to them as living hostages than dead, but the rest of their entourage are nobody's who can die in their place.
26:54 --> 26:56 [UNKNOWN]: What did you think of this storyline?
26:59 --> 27:03 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Laura says a POS, right?
27:03 --> 27:04 [UNKNOWN]: Always out for number one.
27:04 --> 27:05 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah.
27:05 --> 27:25 [UNKNOWN]: And, you know, I recognize that in the show, the shows, you always have to have this sort of character, you know, what's the Russian priest name?
27:28 --> 27:31 [UNKNOWN]: Rasputin, excuse me, Rasputin.
27:31 --> 27:46 [UNKNOWN]: You always have to have this sort of character that is always trying to pull the strings so that they can get ahead without the royalty knowing that they're really just trying to get ahead.
27:48 --> 27:52 [UNKNOWN]: So he's really so good in his role.
27:53 --> 28:05 [UNKNOWN]: like he is the epitome of someone that you don't want to make an enemy of because this is a person that will do anything to win.
28:07 --> 28:11 [UNKNOWN]: And I think Aegon is taking a back by that.
28:14 --> 28:15 [UNKNOWN]: Like how could we do this to me?
28:16 --> 28:31 [UNKNOWN]: Let me ask you, do you think Laris actually forgot the milk of the poppy or is this a way to try to control a gun or or is it a way to try to keep a gun's mind sharper while they're playing.
28:31 --> 28:32 [UNKNOWN]: Try to control them.
28:34 --> 28:35 [UNKNOWN]: I don't think he forgot it.
28:36 --> 28:39 [UNKNOWN]: Or is it sadistic because he's like, listen, yeah, keep calling me cripple.
28:41 --> 28:42 [UNKNOWN]: I see if I find any milk of the pop people.
28:42 --> 28:44 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I don't think he forgot it.
28:44 --> 28:51 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know if it's sadistic, but I do know it's meant to keep a guard in the state where he's off balance.
28:52 --> 28:53 [UNKNOWN]: Hmm.
28:54 --> 28:59 [UNKNOWN]: Do you think Lars has anyone in the world he actually likes or admires or even loves?
29:00 --> 29:00 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:02 --> 29:05 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, if not his brother and his father who he killed, hardly.
29:05 --> 29:06 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:07 --> 29:07 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:08 --> 29:08 [UNKNOWN]: Not Allison.
29:08 --> 29:09 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:09 --> 29:09 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:10 --> 29:10 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:10 --> 29:10 [UNKNOWN]: No.
29:11 --> 29:18 [UNKNOWN]: No, because he would destroy her to gain, if it were to gain him something, he would destroy her as well.
29:19 --> 29:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
29:22 --> 29:22 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, no.
29:24 --> 29:35 [UNKNOWN]: I'll say it's interesting that it's House Stanton who stopped them because they are the house and control of a place called Rooks Rest, which is where we last saw Agon's
29:48 --> 29:49 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's just interesting.
29:49 --> 30:00 [UNKNOWN]: I wonder what they're doing with the pop because you know, I say this with genuine wonder as a book reader because they are doing their own thing and their own order mix and things up.
30:00 --> 30:02 [UNKNOWN]: So I really don't know.
30:03 --> 30:05 [UNKNOWN]: I will say one thing that's different in the book is Larry's
30:06 --> 30:30 [UNKNOWN]: Also got Agons surviving children, Jayhara and Malor out of the house and Malor is the son who after the blood and cheese episode, George R. Martin posted that blog post saying like these things have not having medals not having Malor these things have rolling forward consequences and we would have seen those consequences come into play with one of the most horrific deaths.
30:34 --> 30:39 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I wonder if that's one reason why they didn't do it is they want to have like a horrible, horrible child death.
30:40 --> 30:41 [UNKNOWN]: That's possible.
30:41 --> 30:42 [UNKNOWN]: That's really possible.
30:42 --> 30:46 [UNKNOWN]: But that death also has consequences, the role forward, so yeah.
30:47 --> 30:48 [UNKNOWN]: That's really possible.
30:50 --> 30:54 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so um, but that is obviously different.
30:54 --> 31:05 [UNKNOWN]: So Jayhara is still in the castle with Elisant and her mother Helena and uh, Maylor just doesn't exist and obviously the other brother with skill with the blood and cheese thing.
31:07 --> 31:14 [UNKNOWN]: We know, you know, I brought up how Stanton that they are from Brooks Rest, but they say they're taking a gun to Dragonstone via dusk and Dale.
31:15 --> 31:20 [UNKNOWN]: My only question about that is I thought Christen call already sacked dusk and Dale last season.
31:20 --> 31:33 [UNKNOWN]: So if any listeners remember that bit, I'm not sure if it may be how Stanton doesn't know this for some reason or yeah, we'll see.
31:38 --> 31:45 [UNKNOWN]: I don't remember, so please call us right in, discord us, any of those things.
31:46 --> 31:48 [UNKNOWN]: Gentle corrections, always welcome.
31:48 --> 31:49 [UNKNOWN]: Email, we're here for it.
31:50 --> 31:50 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
31:51 --> 31:52 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
31:52 --> 31:54 [UNKNOWN]: Let's turn to Allison's other son.
31:54 --> 31:55 [UNKNOWN]: You want to set us up?
31:55 --> 31:56 [UNKNOWN]: Sure, sure.
31:56 --> 31:57 [UNKNOWN]: Son of Allison.
31:57 --> 32:11 [UNKNOWN]: Allison, back from her trip to visit Rinaura at the end of season 2, is surprised to find Aegon has absconded from the castle, and her younger son, Eman, the one I, sitting on the throne, claiming his brother has advocated.
32:12 --> 32:30 [UNKNOWN]: Alyssa knowing she's promised Reynar as she would leave the gate to King's Landing open to her, so that this horrible feud in between their families can end, ask why Amon isn't at the Harun Hall as planned, Amon though has been told by his dream and sister that he will die at the gods' eye.
32:31 --> 32:33 [UNKNOWN]: So he's less keen on this idea.
32:33 --> 32:42 [UNKNOWN]: So Alexandre forges a letter from Amon to send her cousin or men high tower asking him to delay the high tower on me smart.
32:44 --> 32:47 [UNKNOWN]: So I think it's interesting that Amon
32:48 --> 33:04 [UNKNOWN]: It seemed like he was more sympathetic to loose serous when he kind of vague or he kind of accidentally because like we see in this show, I do like this addition also that we see that the Targaryens do not have magical control of their dragons.
33:04 --> 33:05 [UNKNOWN]: And so we saw
33:07 --> 33:15 [UNKNOWN]: Aiman was like, oh shit, when Vega killed Lucerus and, and yeah, it's dragon arcs.
33:16 --> 33:28 [UNKNOWN]: And now we see, not, I don't know, it's hard to tell sometimes how much time is passed in the show, but it seems like he's gotten a lot more bloodthirsty and power hungry and
33:28 --> 33:40 [UNKNOWN]: Do you think it's like, has he always hated his brother more than Jay Sarah's because his brother is kind of a dick or do you think it's just a reflection of how Amund has become more twisted inside?
33:41 --> 33:56 [UNKNOWN]: I think a little bit of both, I've always felt that he resented his brother's ascension to the throne and I know he felt the ways about Alison favoring his brother.
33:57 --> 33:59 [UNKNOWN]: So I think there's a little bit of it.
33:59 --> 33:59 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, it's older brother.
33:59 --> 34:01 [UNKNOWN]: It's, yeah.
34:01 --> 34:02 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but that's, I know.
34:03 --> 34:08 [UNKNOWN]: But, you know, from his standpoint, his viewpoint is just like, this isn't fair.
34:10 --> 34:12 [UNKNOWN]: He could love me a little bit too, right?
34:12 --> 34:22 [UNKNOWN]: So, and I think there is a bit of a of sadistic blood curdling, villainry to, hey, Mon, at this point.
34:24 --> 34:38 [UNKNOWN]: But to your question about your statement about not having control over the dragons, is it, do you think it's because he didn't hatch the dragon?
34:39 --> 34:44 [UNKNOWN]: No, I think it's just that dragons are animal, you know, they're independently.
34:44 --> 34:45 [UNKNOWN]: They have their own minds.
34:46 --> 34:50 [UNKNOWN]: It's like, um, like, I have two cats here in this room.
34:50 --> 34:52 [UNKNOWN]: And I can communicate with them.
34:52 --> 34:55 [UNKNOWN]: And I can direct them to do things in most of the time to be honest.
34:55 --> 35:02 [UNKNOWN]: They will do what I direct them to do because we have a bond and they trust me and they know that it's usually like going to work out well for them.
35:02 --> 35:03 [UNKNOWN]: It's going to be food involved or something.
35:04 --> 35:11 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but it doesn't mean that I can, you know, I think the, I always think of dragons like giant cats.
35:11 --> 35:24 [UNKNOWN]: They, they can be loving, but they're independent and they, they have their own minds and at the end of the day, you can't pretend that you have, you can control the flying nuclear bomb with a brain.
35:35 --> 35:40 [UNKNOWN]: Who does not have a dragon that they hatched?
35:42 --> 35:47 [UNKNOWN]: Um, quite a few, I mean, Vega obviously are right here.
35:47 --> 35:47 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
35:47 --> 35:51 [UNKNOWN]: Current dragon, Tally at the bottom, will come back to us.
35:51 --> 35:58 [UNKNOWN]: Let me just see, um, I mean, yeah, I'm thinking of them to be honest, most of them.
35:59 --> 35:59 [UNKNOWN]: Most of them, okay.
36:00 --> 36:00 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
36:01 --> 36:01 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
36:02 --> 36:07 [UNKNOWN]: especially that are still alive, because the don't look at your own, that they're so aged.
36:09 --> 36:09 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
36:09 --> 36:10 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
36:11 --> 36:20 [UNKNOWN]: I'm, although we get this quote from Helena that I think is great, she says, after he claimed Vagar, he forgot what fear was referring to Amen, of course.
36:20 --> 36:21 [UNKNOWN]: But he remembers now.
36:21 --> 36:24 [UNKNOWN]: He knows that if he has to face Reineira's dragons, he'll die.
36:26 --> 36:43 [UNKNOWN]: And I think, yeah, that's, I thought, you know, I know you are lining up rocks for Alice and Tickick and I understand I'm with you, but in a twisted way, watching her manipulation of her son in this episode was masterful.
36:44 --> 36:49 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, in the twisted way, yes, twisted.
36:49 --> 36:50 [UNKNOWN]: It's the key word.
36:51 --> 36:53 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, it's hard to feel bad for him.
36:53 --> 36:57 [UNKNOWN]: He almost being a grand master or a while for what reason.
36:58 --> 37:07 [UNKNOWN]: But it goes back to your point that who is redeemable in this world that we're watching and enjoying so so much.
37:08 --> 37:10 [UNKNOWN]: Who is the redeemable character?
37:14 --> 37:15 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
37:16 --> 37:16 [UNKNOWN]: So...
37:17 --> 37:24 [UNKNOWN]: But I mean, I think Allison knows how to play her son like a fiddle and entertaining to watch or I'll give it that.
37:24 --> 37:35 [UNKNOWN]: Because he's like, yeah, he obviously wants to throw and he's clutching black fire this sword of a gun the conquer that he took from his brother and he's like, it's not in now.
37:35 --> 37:46 [UNKNOWN]: It like basically he's like, gallum and, you know, she knows how to play that, she's like, you should have been king and just the flattery of like,
37:47 --> 37:50 [UNKNOWN]: I don't, obviously she wants him to go, but okay, here's the question.
37:50 --> 37:58 [UNKNOWN]: We'll get to the people waiting to ambush him, but what do you think she, why do you think she wants him to go?
37:58 --> 38:06 [UNKNOWN]: She wants to be, does she want there to not be battle at King's Landing where a bunch more people die and he dies?
38:08 --> 38:11 [UNKNOWN]: Or does she know about the ambush?
38:11 --> 38:12 [UNKNOWN]: I guess not.
38:16 --> 38:32 [UNKNOWN]: My initial thought was that she set up a agreement with Reinaura to end this war with the best possible outcome for her and her children.
38:34 --> 38:41 [UNKNOWN]: I do not believe in my heart of hearts that when she set this up, it was with Amanda in mind.
38:44 --> 38:47 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, she thought he was just, she didn't expect him to be there.
38:47 --> 38:48 [UNKNOWN]: That's for sure.
38:48 --> 38:58 [UNKNOWN]: No, she didn't expect him to be there, but if he dies, I don't, I think she recognises that he's sadistic.
38:59 --> 39:01 [UNKNOWN]: And I think she sees it.
39:02 --> 39:05 [UNKNOWN]: And it's very, it's given very normal debates in his
39:13 --> 39:29 [UNKNOWN]: Like, this is a mother who knows that her son is a satis, is, you know, and we'll need them at different points in order to bring it out.
39:30 --> 39:31 [UNKNOWN]: As it serves her.
39:32 --> 39:33 [UNKNOWN]: As it serves her.
39:34 --> 39:35 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
39:35 --> 39:38 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, but it's also at the same time.
39:40 --> 39:44 [UNKNOWN]: We we had we got that throw back to the end of last season when she shows up.
39:44 --> 39:47 [UNKNOWN]: She's been you know warning Reneera.
39:48 --> 39:50 [UNKNOWN]: I were telling her like come to King's Landing.
39:50 --> 39:55 [UNKNOWN]: I'll set it up so you can just like walk right in, which obviously huge betrayal to her family.
39:55 --> 39:56 [UNKNOWN]: Not from the book, obviously.
39:57 --> 40:03 [UNKNOWN]: But Amand now is like where have you been mother and I have to laugh.
40:03 --> 40:08 [UNKNOWN]: Every time I see her deer in the headlights look where she just pauses for an awkward amount of time.
40:10 --> 40:17 [UNKNOWN]: was in the guts would because you told me that woman's place wasn't in the world of boring room or in the council.
40:20 --> 40:31 [UNKNOWN]: So I can't help it be on her side, especially as a woman, but at the same time I can't read what genuine
40:39 --> 40:42 [UNKNOWN]: or if she just thinks that both sons are lost cause.
40:42 --> 40:46 [UNKNOWN]: Like, Helena's still a nice girl, both the sons lost cause.
40:49 --> 40:54 [UNKNOWN]: I think that she, I'm not gonna say that she doesn't love her children, right?
40:56 --> 40:56 [UNKNOWN]: I won't say that.
40:58 --> 41:04 [UNKNOWN]: But I think she does make decisions about who is worth keeping around.
41:05 --> 41:07 [UNKNOWN]: And then what capacity she keeps them around.
41:09 --> 41:32 [UNKNOWN]: Like, she's very strategic with the placement of her children around her, and I couldn't personally, me, I would not be able to function as a well-adjusted human being if my mom were like that.
41:39 --> 42:03 [UNKNOWN]: a motor come of love as much as she can give but what she's also giving them is a tremendous amount of fuel to not only hurt her but to hurt people around her because that's the way this world operates.
42:04 --> 42:06 [UNKNOWN]: We're going to hurt people.
42:07 --> 42:08 [UNKNOWN]: before they can hurt us.
42:10 --> 42:20 [UNKNOWN]: And she made a great big step in trying to break that pattern by making this deal with Ray Nara.
42:21 --> 42:25 [UNKNOWN]: Right, she said, I'm gonna stop trying to hurt you.
42:26 --> 42:28 [UNKNOWN]: So we can stop trying to hurt each other.
42:29 --> 42:35 [UNKNOWN]: They came to that agreement and now that Amon, her son, who is totally not about that.
42:37 --> 42:39 [UNKNOWN]: He's not about that, right?
42:41 --> 42:50 [UNKNOWN]: He's here and she sees that everything that she has just worked at Poof is gone.
42:50 --> 42:52 [UNKNOWN]: It's just because of his mere presence.
42:54 --> 43:02 [UNKNOWN]: That's got to hurt, that's got to be so painful, that's got to be so, like, fuck, you know, what do I do now?
43:03 --> 43:04 [UNKNOWN]: What do I do now?
43:05 --> 43:07 [UNKNOWN]: How do I salvage this?
43:09 --> 43:10 [UNKNOWN]: How do I make this right?
43:11 --> 43:11 [UNKNOWN]: Hmm.
43:12 --> 43:15 [UNKNOWN]: What did you think about the addition of the kiss moment?
43:16 --> 43:18 [UNKNOWN]: Oh God, God.
43:19 --> 43:20 [UNKNOWN]: Just, just.
43:24 --> 43:41 [UNKNOWN]: totally expected from him quite honestly, not surprising, and she recognises the power imbalance, and that's what makes it even more disgusting.
43:44 --> 43:47 [UNKNOWN]: I need you to start watching the Vampire Listat.
43:48 --> 43:51 [UNKNOWN]: It started getting started with the interview with the Vampire Watch, the first few seasons.
43:51 --> 44:06 [UNKNOWN]: They're on Netflix and then jump into the Vampire Listat and to say all of the Vampire Listat friends, when this happened and the show were giggling, because we're like, yeah, Listat says, hold my blood and fire and let me show you where mommy issues look like.
44:06 --> 44:08 [UNKNOWN]: Oh my god, oh goodness gracious.
44:08 --> 44:10 [UNKNOWN]: It's very chaste, but um.
44:12 --> 44:26 [UNKNOWN]: But it is important to, I do think, you know, I know people have controversial feelings about it being added, and you know, and I have also said that with all of the Targaryen incessed, the mother child would be the worst.
44:26 --> 44:39 [UNKNOWN]: And at least in this case, it's not coming from her, but the fact that she's willing to allow it to happen to manipulate him, maybe that is to save his life because she's just like trying to be like, get out the door and go.
44:40 --> 44:50 [UNKNOWN]: Reneira's dragons are coming, also just, yeah, let's try to say in this moment, let me ask you a question, she's trying to save his life or hers.
44:52 --> 44:57 [UNKNOWN]: I think in this moment, she's trying to save his life.
44:57 --> 44:59 [UNKNOWN]: This is all part of her plan.
44:59 --> 45:03 [UNKNOWN]: You're not supposed to be here, Reneira's coming with those dragons that you're afraid of, to the dollar.
45:04 --> 45:05 [UNKNOWN]: So you've got to go.
45:07 --> 45:20 [UNKNOWN]: Allison's face also with like that eye acting, but it's also like she saw him leaning in and just stayed still for it, didn't you know, just yeah, the manipulation and obvious like.
45:21 --> 45:29 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know, but I do think that it's important to who aim on the is is a character we've seen him.
45:30 --> 45:47 [UNKNOWN]: I understand people say it's kind of problematic to portray his mommy issues this way, but like we saw, for example, his relationship in the past with the brotha owner named Sylvie, who I just felt like at he who was getting mothering out of her.
45:47 --> 45:48 [UNKNOWN]: So he obviously has
45:51 --> 45:53 [UNKNOWN]: He's tying those two things together.
45:53 --> 45:54 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
45:54 --> 45:58 [UNKNOWN]: I think it just like in a way of seeking her ultimate approval.
45:59 --> 46:04 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know, but I didn't think in the moment that she was manipulating him.
46:04 --> 46:06 [UNKNOWN]: I really felt in that moment she was fearful.
46:08 --> 46:08 [UNKNOWN]: Mm.
46:08 --> 46:11 [UNKNOWN]: Got it, got it, got it, got it.
46:11 --> 46:12 [UNKNOWN]: I can see both, yeah.
46:13 --> 46:15 [UNKNOWN]: Working on hostels, yeah.
46:15 --> 46:16 [UNKNOWN]: She looked horrified.
46:18 --> 46:22 [UNKNOWN]: She looked horrified and resigned to the fact that shit.
46:23 --> 46:24 [UNKNOWN]: This is what I've raised.
46:25 --> 46:25 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
46:27 --> 46:31 [UNKNOWN]: I do wish we got more from Helena in this show overall.
46:32 --> 46:35 [UNKNOWN]: Justice for the unseen dream fire dragon.
46:35 --> 46:38 [UNKNOWN]: Just a quote, Georgia, our martens blog.
46:38 --> 46:43 [UNKNOWN]: He said, in the book, she is a plump pleasant and happy young woman cheerful and kindly,
46:47 --> 46:51 [UNKNOWN]: Helena's greatest joy in life is to take to the skies on the back of her dragon dream fire.
46:52 --> 46:56 [UNKNOWN]: None of the strangeness she displays in the show was an evidence in the book, nor is her gift for prophecy.
46:57 --> 47:02 [UNKNOWN]: Those were born in the writer's room, but once I met the show's version of Helena, I could hardly take issue.
47:03 --> 47:10 [UNKNOWN]: Fia Saban's Helena is a richer and more fascinating character than the one I created in fire and blood.
47:10 --> 47:12 [UNKNOWN]: So I agree, so I want to see her like
47:13 --> 47:14 [UNKNOWN]: still want to see a fire dragon.
47:15 --> 47:16 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
47:16 --> 47:22 [UNKNOWN]: And the thing is she stopped flying her dragon when the blood and she's thing happened.
47:22 --> 47:24 [UNKNOWN]: So I'm like, are we so we're past that?
47:24 --> 47:26 [UNKNOWN]: And I understand it's probably a budgetary thing.
47:26 --> 47:28 [UNKNOWN]: But this is so many damn dragons.
47:28 --> 47:30 [UNKNOWN]: But it's a big part of her character though.
47:31 --> 47:31 [UNKNOWN]: I know.
47:31 --> 47:32 [UNKNOWN]: I know.
47:32 --> 47:33 [UNKNOWN]: So it's such a big part.
47:34 --> 47:40 [UNKNOWN]: It's a shame that, you know, it's just knowing that there's like this theoretical drag that exists there.
47:40 --> 47:43 [UNKNOWN]: I don't think we're going to see dream fire at all because well, actually I think.
47:45 --> 47:47 [UNKNOWN]: Anyway, yeah, there's one thing where we might.
47:47 --> 47:48 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
47:49 --> 47:58 [UNKNOWN]: All right, let's take a quick pause here and when we come back, we're going to talk about that ambush that's waiting for Amen and the revelations that come out in that scene.
47:59 --> 47:59 [UNKNOWN]: Be right back.
48:00 --> 48:01 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you for watching.
48:17 --> 48:34 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, waiting for Amund, team Blacks, Dragon Seeds, Adam, Seesmoaks writer, Hugh Hammer, writer of Vermithor, and Wolf the White, Silver Wings writer, wait on the Isle of Faces for Amund and Beigar to arrive on Beigar so that they can ambush them.
48:34 --> 48:36 [UNKNOWN]: But Amund, of course, never arrives.
48:37 --> 48:42 [UNKNOWN]: Alice Rivers, however, is so called Witch of Heron Hall, does show up urging them to leave.
48:45 --> 48:51 [UNKNOWN]: So it is, why do you think Alice wanted them to leave?
48:51 --> 48:54 [UNKNOWN]: Like, does she seem to be helpful to Damon last season?
48:54 --> 49:04 [UNKNOWN]: So is she really team black or is was this just like a get off my lawn because the Isle of Faces is supposed to be a protected religious site?
49:04 --> 49:06 [UNKNOWN]: No, she's like, don't come tromping around here with your tracts.
49:08 --> 49:09 [UNKNOWN]: Get off my lawn.
49:11 --> 49:12 [UNKNOWN]: You can let's get off my phone.
49:13 --> 49:16 [UNKNOWN]: Like you guys, not welcome here, please leave.
49:16 --> 49:21 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know what y'all doing here, but this is not the place for you to be.
49:21 --> 49:27 [UNKNOWN]: So the quicker you can, most young and fly to these dragons out, the better off we all be.
49:28 --> 49:28 [UNKNOWN]: And so yeah.
49:30 --> 49:34 [UNKNOWN]: I thought she was, I thought she, when she came through, she was so cool.
49:35 --> 49:35 [UNKNOWN]: You know what I mean?
49:36 --> 49:40 [UNKNOWN]: They look on her face, I was like, man, you're like, who are you?
49:41 --> 49:41 [UNKNOWN]: Moved.
49:44 --> 49:46 [UNKNOWN]: I laughed, I laughed as she said that.
49:46 --> 49:46 [UNKNOWN]: I'm Moved.
49:47 --> 49:47 [UNKNOWN]: No.
49:47 --> 49:50 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I think she called herself a witch.
49:50 --> 49:56 [UNKNOWN]: I said, I think when Alice calls herself a witch in this episode, she means I know what my reputation is.
49:56 --> 50:01 [UNKNOWN]: And I'm spoken to you right now, so to like get them to go out of there.
50:01 --> 50:07 [UNKNOWN]: But she knows if she's like, yeah, I'm a witch that they'll take her more seriously, cause they're
50:07 --> 50:10 [UNKNOWN]: She was very much trying to spook them.
50:10 --> 50:13 [UNKNOWN]: There was another goat sighting.
50:14 --> 50:19 [UNKNOWN]: And yeah, we'll talk about also the green man, the pop stuff, it spook them.
50:19 --> 50:21 [UNKNOWN]: We're gonna talk about both those things in the feedback section.
50:22 --> 50:24 [UNKNOWN]: So don't worry, we're not ignoring them.
50:25 --> 50:30 [UNKNOWN]: But I think also, I do think it was like to get off the protected aisle thing.
50:30 --> 50:33 [UNKNOWN]: But I do also think we saw last season.
50:33 --> 50:35 [UNKNOWN]: She basically showed,
50:36 --> 50:57 [UNKNOWN]: Damon the end of Game of Thrones because she's like there's something much greater at risk here and I think I think at least at this point it seems that she thinks helping Damon or Team Black in general and the short run helps move the entire story towards the goal of defeating the Night King basically.
50:59 --> 51:01 [UNKNOWN]: It's kind of wild if you think about it.
51:01 --> 51:07 [UNKNOWN]: Like, I just, just thinking about like the history of Westeros and it's just one wave of conquering after another.
51:08 --> 51:16 [UNKNOWN]: And then it's like, well, who are you to say that the night king is worse than the handles or the first member for that, right?
51:17 --> 51:18 [UNKNOWN]: That's an interesting question.
51:19 --> 51:23 [UNKNOWN]: You know, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna stand tantos down and say,
51:24 --> 51:25 [UNKNOWN]: than that King's worse.
51:26 --> 51:28 [UNKNOWN]: If you kill and everyone in your path, what's with the difference, really?
51:29 --> 51:36 [UNKNOWN]: I was like, the back King's worse, I don't want to, if I die, don't bring me back to just be a mindless.
51:37 --> 51:37 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, okay, that's true.
51:38 --> 51:40 [UNKNOWN]: I saw him be creeped, I don't want to do that, no.
51:40 --> 51:41 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, that's fair.
51:42 --> 51:42 [UNKNOWN]: That's fair.
51:42 --> 51:49 [UNKNOWN]: The fact that he's controlling, you know, yeah, people against their wills, that's a problem too, especially, yeah.
51:51 --> 52:16 [UNKNOWN]: you know what else is the problem we got we got some heavy backstories from two of our dragon seeds here um so we already knew that he was the we learned previously he is the bastard son of princess Sarah Targaryen who basically is was one of Jay Harris's daughters so in the book Jay Harris is sort of
52:17 --> 52:20 [UNKNOWN]: But he's kind of arguably the best of the Targaryens.
52:21 --> 52:37 [UNKNOWN]: He's the grandson of Aegon the Conquer, and his father and uncle were kind of tour, part the realm in their contention for the throne, where his uncle was make are the cruel, so he was especially bad.
52:37 --> 52:41 [UNKNOWN]: And then Jiharis comes and he's immediately even as a teenager.
52:41 --> 52:43 [UNKNOWN]: He's like, I have opinions, I want,
52:44 --> 52:48 [UNKNOWN]: to bring peace to the realm and he achieves this long piece.
52:48 --> 52:51 [UNKNOWN]: But still, even him, he's a shitty father.
52:51 --> 53:03 [UNKNOWN]: He's a shitty girl to add, I'll say, at least, because he basically, like, slut-shamed his daughter Sarah into brothel work, and Hugh was apparently born out of that.
53:04 --> 53:07 [UNKNOWN]: And now he's writing his grandfather to Harris's Dragon Vermithor.
53:08 --> 53:09 [UNKNOWN]: So that's interesting.
53:10 --> 53:17 [UNKNOWN]: And that makes him first cousins with Oof, the White, who we find out.
53:18 --> 53:23 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, we find out he never knew his mother, but he always said that his father was bail on the brave.
53:23 --> 53:29 [UNKNOWN]: And so Oof rides his grandmother's bail on some others, Dragon Silver Wing now.
53:30 --> 53:37 [UNKNOWN]: Do you think that dragons can smell, and this would be a show thing, but why not?
53:37 --> 53:44 [UNKNOWN]: Do you think that they can smell genetics and that they choose someone who is genetically similar to the previous writer?
53:44 --> 53:50 [UNKNOWN]: Because we also have, for example, Seasmoke, choosing Lainer's half-brother, Adam.
53:51 --> 53:58 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's, I was asking myself, why two of the arguably,
53:59 --> 54:02 [UNKNOWN]: most powerful dragons, at least, you know, in terms of size, right?
54:02 --> 54:04 [UNKNOWN]: They're, they're two of the biggest dragons, right?
54:04 --> 54:05 [UNKNOWN]: Why would they choose often you?
54:05 --> 54:06 [UNKNOWN]: As opposed to someone who is...
54:06 --> 54:07 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I understand you, but why off?
54:07 --> 54:20 [UNKNOWN]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
54:22 --> 54:47 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's just, yeah, right, but why, why don't, and I don't know if it's because of what you just said that they can sense like a genetic marker from a previous writer, because it just, to me, just doesn't, it didn't make sense for the two of them to, to be able to
54:53 --> 54:53 [UNKNOWN]: yeah.
54:54 --> 54:55 [UNKNOWN]: I never understood why.
54:57 --> 55:02 [UNKNOWN]: No, and yeah, and I suppose we didn't get that much time with the with the claiming process, too.
55:02 --> 55:05 [UNKNOWN]: So it happened rather quickly.
55:05 --> 55:10 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but I do, I do, I'm going with head cannon genetic smelling.
55:10 --> 55:12 [UNKNOWN]: Like, yeah, you smell like someone.
55:12 --> 55:13 [UNKNOWN]: What's it do it?
55:13 --> 55:13 [UNKNOWN]: What can do that?
55:13 --> 55:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
55:14 --> 55:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
55:14 --> 55:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
55:14 --> 55:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
55:16 --> 55:39 [UNKNOWN]: I do have problems with the fact that we have this princess Sarah back story, you know, we're once again, we have, I'll say, George R. Martin has written some fantastic female characters in this world, but it is also true that owning and working in brothels is one of the only ways women are allowed to exert power and western us outside of Doran, I'll say, Doran is better about that.
55:41 --> 55:51 [UNKNOWN]: And I just think that there could be more variety in that storytelling because, while it is true, that there's been truth to that in the past.
55:52 --> 55:55 [UNKNOWN]: There's also, yeah, you don't have to be
55:56 --> 56:02 [UNKNOWN]: have a dragon and you know, choose violence or choose sex.
56:03 --> 56:06 [UNKNOWN]: There are even in places where I don't know.
56:06 --> 56:09 [UNKNOWN]: I just would like, where's the journalist of Westeros?
56:09 --> 56:13 [UNKNOWN]: So that's sort of like, who's carving out that kind of life?
56:13 --> 56:15 [UNKNOWN]: No, I think I agree with you.
56:15 --> 56:19 [UNKNOWN]: I think there are many ways that cute all.
56:20 --> 56:29 [UNKNOWN]: women throughout history when oppressed have been able to wield power without being a dragon rider or a sex worker.
56:30 --> 56:41 [UNKNOWN]: And we should see one of those options available to the characters that he that we're watching on screen or reading about.
56:42 --> 56:45 [UNKNOWN]: It's just the fact to relegate them to
56:49 --> 56:51 [UNKNOWN]: You know, it's just not true, right?
56:52 --> 57:01 [UNKNOWN]: And we can expand our fantasy by including so much more variety and people's lives.
57:01 --> 57:01 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
57:03 --> 57:07 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, sometimes it feels like the way sex is portrayed in this world.
57:07 --> 57:10 [UNKNOWN]: Just normalize it in a way that bothers me.
57:11 --> 57:12 [UNKNOWN]: Like, oh, no, it's just okay.
57:12 --> 57:12 [UNKNOWN]: That's how things were.
57:12 --> 57:14 [UNKNOWN]: And like, no, no.
57:14 --> 57:14 [UNKNOWN]: No.
57:14 --> 57:14 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
57:15 --> 57:16 [UNKNOWN]: Anyway, I'll stop harping on that.
57:18 --> 57:21 [UNKNOWN]: We got some other disturbing backstory from all.
57:21 --> 57:22 [UNKNOWN]: We found out that
57:24 --> 57:30 [UNKNOWN]: Basically, there was a red priest, so think like Melisandra, the serving roller, the Lord of Light from Essos.
57:32 --> 57:38 [UNKNOWN]: And this priest was attracted to Ulf, said he had the blood of kings, and it sounds like paid him for sexual favors.
57:39 --> 57:46 [UNKNOWN]: But this is during Ulf's childhood in Fleabottom, which is a place that probably sucks most in this world out of all the places we have described for us.
57:48 --> 58:01 [UNKNOWN]: So this backstory is new for the show and it is something like I'm going to get back to it in minute, but I have to be perfectly honest and I promise this is the last time during the breakdown, I'm going to bring this up.
58:02 --> 58:08 [UNKNOWN]: But this had the misfortune of coming out on the same day as what John and I called the best episode of the year.
58:08 --> 58:09 [UNKNOWN]: Oh my.
58:10 --> 58:18 [UNKNOWN]: which is episode three of the vampire list at which has one of the most and I'm not going to spoil that episode.
58:18 --> 58:27 [UNKNOWN]: Obviously I'm not going to spoil it, but I am going to share the content warning that was generally shared before this came in and also a recommendation to watch it anyway.
58:27 --> 58:32 [UNKNOWN]: It's one of the most complex and nuanced and somehow like one moment funny,
58:33 --> 58:43 [UNKNOWN]: before being stunningly devastating portrayals of the aftermath of sexual assaults that I've ever seen on screen.
58:44 --> 58:55 [UNKNOWN]: So, like, I've just been, I've watched that episode like three times now, did like, break down of, uh, so we should, so we just pause, so I can go watch.
58:56 --> 58:59 [UNKNOWN]: Just watch it all two and a half seasons.
58:59 --> 59:02 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, it will be better.
59:03 --> 59:18 [UNKNOWN]: But so I'll say that in that's unfair to this show, that to that rich, powerful for me, cathartic expiration there that if you're interested watch the show, you can hear John and I talk about it on the Vampireless.podcast.
59:18 --> 59:21 [UNKNOWN]: So then when this one came out, I was like, okay, you too.
59:22 --> 59:24 [UNKNOWN]: which is not the way it should be.
59:24 --> 59:27 [UNKNOWN]: And I think it is because this show does.
59:29 --> 59:46 [UNKNOWN]: It's not superficial, I don't think it's superficial because we've obviously been having a lot of deep character conversations, but I think the size of the cast and the fact that so much emphasis is also on how do we work this dragon budget to make the story works.
59:47 --> 59:55 [UNKNOWN]: Sometimes it just doesn't necessarily have things like this just get skimmed over quickly.
59:58 --> 01:00:07 [UNKNOWN]: But I will say, like, so I thought I was like, okay, stop thinking about that episode of the Vampire List ad, and just think about all of story on its own.
01:00:07 --> 01:00:15 [UNKNOWN]: And like the stat, his abuse is intrinsically tied to the thing that gives him this liberating power.
01:00:16 --> 01:00:19 [UNKNOWN]: And in this case, it's the Dragonblood.
01:00:22 --> 01:00:27 [UNKNOWN]: The question is, would he even have gone for the dragons without the priest telling him he's special?
01:00:27 --> 01:00:33 [UNKNOWN]: Because he wouldn't have been going around saying I'm a dragon seed if the priest hadn't told him that growing up, basically.
01:00:37 --> 01:00:48 [UNKNOWN]: But then, you know, we see like, this guy was complimenting this kid who had nothing, who came from nothing and all liked to hear that he was special.
01:00:48 --> 01:00:56 [UNKNOWN]: And so he did this thing, the probably he didn't necessarily want to do, or, you know, he didn't say, like, oh, I thought there's older priest was hot.
01:00:57 --> 01:00:58 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:00:59 --> 01:01:05 [UNKNOWN]: He, but he, this, this priest was giving him something that probably stick to him.
01:01:05 --> 01:01:06 [UNKNOWN]: Was grooming him?
01:01:06 --> 01:01:07 [UNKNOWN]: He was growing.
01:01:07 --> 01:01:08 [UNKNOWN]: He was grooming him.
01:01:08 --> 01:01:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:01:09 --> 01:01:13 [UNKNOWN]: But also he gave all the nice words when he needed to hear them, and no one else was giving it to him.
01:01:13 --> 01:01:21 [UNKNOWN]: So he can see there's like the self-discuss mixed with hope for something better, and that's kind of the most insidiously gross thing about it.
01:01:22 --> 01:01:22 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:01:23 --> 01:01:23 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:01:24 --> 01:01:24 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know if he,
01:01:27 --> 01:01:41 [UNKNOWN]: It's an interesting question to ask, would he have gone, if he knew of his lineage, I, without the priest, and he knew where he came from, I still believe he would have gone.
01:01:42 --> 01:01:43 [UNKNOWN]: When the call came out.
01:01:43 --> 01:01:45 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know that he knew without the priest, though.
01:01:45 --> 01:01:47 [UNKNOWN]: No, that's what I'm saying.
01:01:47 --> 01:01:51 [UNKNOWN]: I said, if he knew, if he didn't know without the priest, I think he would have gone.
01:01:52 --> 01:01:52 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:01:54 --> 01:02:01 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, now that we've given the nuanced time for all false ass still like the dude, I mean, I love him as a character.
01:02:01 --> 01:02:02 [UNKNOWN]: He's interesting.
01:02:03 --> 01:02:22 [UNKNOWN]: I find him a very interesting character, a wild card and yeah, obviously a character that I worry about interacting with the other characters because he seems very selfish and we hear now he's just learned that nights don't get castles and he's very upset about it.
01:02:23 --> 01:02:30 [UNKNOWN]: I'll be upset too, I'll be upset too, like I want a castle, why can't I get a car?
01:02:31 --> 01:02:31 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, sure.
01:02:31 --> 01:02:32 [UNKNOWN]: I'm upset.
01:02:32 --> 01:02:35 [UNKNOWN]: I don't have a castle, but I didn't expect someone to give it to me.
01:02:36 --> 01:02:36 [UNKNOWN]: I'm right in the dragon.
01:02:36 --> 01:02:38 [UNKNOWN]: I deserve a castle.
01:02:38 --> 01:02:39 [UNKNOWN]: He's all in a row.
01:02:39 --> 01:02:40 [UNKNOWN]: I want a castle, yes.
01:02:41 --> 01:02:43 [UNKNOWN]: What he says specifically, I have so many mixed feelings about.
01:02:43 --> 01:02:47 [UNKNOWN]: He says men would have to show me respect because of the big fucking dragon.
01:02:47 --> 01:02:50 [UNKNOWN]: I can't live in a title or drink it.
01:02:50 --> 01:02:55 [UNKNOWN]: So the part with that that resonates with me is I can't live in a title.
01:02:55 --> 01:02:57 [UNKNOWN]: And, you know, it makes me think of like,
01:02:58 --> 01:03:02 [UNKNOWN]: like I'm a freelance writer and you know how many people are like, oh, give you exposure.
01:03:03 --> 01:03:05 [UNKNOWN]: And like, well, that doesn't pay the rent.
01:03:06 --> 01:03:09 [UNKNOWN]: So like, I get, you know, the same vibes, I get that.
01:03:11 --> 01:03:21 [UNKNOWN]: But, and I understand like, because he felt powerless in this childhood, that we are just discussing, that's probably explains a lot of why he wants to have this on a
01:03:29 --> 01:03:35 [UNKNOWN]: To me, there's a weakness of character in that if you have to hide behind a dragon for the course.
01:03:36 --> 01:03:40 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, absolutely, which makes, you know, people to worse.
01:03:42 --> 01:03:50 [UNKNOWN]: You know, you get, you get people who have not gone through their trauma, the ability to really harm others, a lot of times they will harm others.
01:03:50 --> 01:03:52 [UNKNOWN]: Because he hasn't dealt with his trauma.
01:03:54 --> 01:03:58 [UNKNOWN]: So, yeah, elf is not, I would not have wanted elf to have a dragon.
01:04:00 --> 01:04:02 [UNKNOWN]: It wouldn't have been my choice now.
01:04:02 --> 01:04:03 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:04:03 --> 01:04:05 [UNKNOWN]: I wouldn't say, yeah, off you get a dragon.
01:04:05 --> 01:04:07 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, no, no, no.
01:04:08 --> 01:04:08 [UNKNOWN]: Absolutely.
01:04:08 --> 01:04:13 [UNKNOWN]: You're not the, you're not the type we need to be riding a how he will dragons.
01:04:14 --> 01:04:16 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, bro.
01:04:17 --> 01:04:17 [UNKNOWN]: Not you.
01:04:21 --> 01:04:23 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but it is what it is.
01:04:24 --> 01:04:25 [UNKNOWN]: It is what it is.
01:04:26 --> 01:04:29 [UNKNOWN]: All right, do you want to set up Damon and the Winter rolls?
01:04:29 --> 01:04:33 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Damon and the Winter rolls are as I like to call them.
01:04:34 --> 01:04:37 [UNKNOWN]: The Elder Wolves are the monks from up north.
01:04:37 --> 01:04:40 [UNKNOWN]: You know, they're from up north.
01:04:40 --> 01:04:51 [UNKNOWN]: Meanwhile, Damon defeats the Lannister Army in battle, and Team Black's allies from the north, the Winter Wolves deliver Jason Lannister's head to him.
01:04:52 --> 01:04:57 [UNKNOWN]: So first of all, fantastic work on creating that practical lion model.
01:04:57 --> 01:04:58 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, guys, yes.
01:04:59 --> 01:05:01 [UNKNOWN]: But in universe, leave the poor lion.
01:05:01 --> 01:05:04 [UNKNOWN]: And thank you, yes, let's leave the world.
01:05:04 --> 01:05:05 [UNKNOWN]: We contain the lion.
01:05:06 --> 01:05:09 [UNKNOWN]: We can let the lion roam.
01:05:09 --> 01:05:16 [UNKNOWN]: It's OK. Yeah, just like had the right around in these shitty small lannister games, nice fall.
01:05:16 --> 01:05:17 [UNKNOWN]: Poor lion.
01:05:17 --> 01:05:19 [UNKNOWN]: But the lion's fault, man.
01:05:19 --> 01:05:19 [UNKNOWN]: No.
01:05:22 --> 01:05:32 [UNKNOWN]: So yeah, the assumption is they didn't name it, but this must be the Battle of the Red Bork because that's where Jason Lannister dies in the book.
01:05:32 --> 01:05:46 [UNKNOWN]: Jason being the Lannister twin who tried to propose to Reneera when she was young, but with them was picked out when she was covered in Boris blood and it's like, if you don't like her and covered in Boris blood, you don't deserve her, dresses a princess.
01:05:47 --> 01:06:08 [UNKNOWN]: Um, so yeah, we're not super sad about losing Jason, we'll talk about his brother, obviously, later, I have questions about his status, but, um, then yeah, the Roderick Dustin, Roddy the ruin, as he's known, shows up and tosses Jason's head at Damon's feed, as he thought, he, as he thought he's gotten away and he's got the winter wolves behind him.
01:06:08 --> 01:06:11 [UNKNOWN]: So do you reference this earlier?
01:06:11 --> 01:06:14 [UNKNOWN]: Who, what, what's the deal with the winter wolves?
01:06:14 --> 01:06:14 [UNKNOWN]: Why are they
01:06:17 --> 01:06:23 [UNKNOWN]: are they, they're starts, Benjamin, and they come from the north.
01:06:24 --> 01:06:25 [UNKNOWN]: And why?
01:06:26 --> 01:06:27 [UNKNOWN]: So they can die.
01:06:28 --> 01:06:29 [UNKNOWN]: Winter is coming.
01:06:29 --> 01:06:30 [UNKNOWN]: Winter is always coming.
01:06:30 --> 01:06:31 [UNKNOWN]: Let's mouse the feed.
01:06:32 --> 01:06:32 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:06:33 --> 01:06:34 [UNKNOWN]: Let's mouse the feed.
01:06:34 --> 01:06:38 [UNKNOWN]: So the arms from north came to fight in die.
01:06:39 --> 01:06:45 [UNKNOWN]: So those they left behind can survive without the extra
01:06:47 --> 01:06:48 [UNKNOWN]: That's some hard core shit.
01:06:49 --> 01:06:50 [UNKNOWN]: That is some hard core shit.
01:06:52 --> 01:06:52 [UNKNOWN]: It's sad.
01:06:53 --> 01:06:54 [UNKNOWN]: Grandpa's leaving no grandpa coming back.
01:06:55 --> 01:06:55 [UNKNOWN]: Probably not.
01:06:57 --> 01:06:58 [UNKNOWN]: Not even probably not.
01:06:58 --> 01:06:58 [UNKNOWN]: No.
01:06:59 --> 01:07:00 [UNKNOWN]: You got to tell them no.
01:07:02 --> 01:07:03 [UNKNOWN]: Because they're not coming back.
01:07:04 --> 01:07:07 [UNKNOWN]: Even if they survived the a battle, they're not coming back.
01:07:08 --> 01:07:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, sad.
01:07:10 --> 01:07:11 [UNKNOWN]: Sad and harsh.
01:07:13 --> 01:07:16 [UNKNOWN]: But they are so resigned to their purpose.
01:07:17 --> 01:07:28 [UNKNOWN]: You know, not just to have renaura on the throne, but their purpose to the North.
01:07:30 --> 01:07:37 [UNKNOWN]: And death there is purpose, and we provide for our loved ones as we die.
01:07:39 --> 01:07:42 [UNKNOWN]: And they're like, we like dressing in black.
01:07:42 --> 01:07:46 [UNKNOWN]: So we choose team black, so easily, because Jay Sarah's went up there.
01:07:46 --> 01:07:48 [UNKNOWN]: And we should have seen him boarding them more, but we saw a little bit.
01:07:48 --> 01:07:50 [UNKNOWN]: It's a little bit of him at the wall.
01:07:50 --> 01:07:51 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:07:52 --> 01:07:54 [UNKNOWN]: I like seeing Oscar Tully back.
01:07:54 --> 01:08:05 [UNKNOWN]: He's given me, remember, lay on a more month from Fair Island in the original show, the first Bella Ramsey rule.
01:08:06 --> 01:08:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Oscar Tully's giving me those vibes.
01:08:09 --> 01:08:13 [UNKNOWN]: Another young kid who last season, we saw him put Damon in his place.
01:08:13 --> 01:08:16 [UNKNOWN]: And here he is, like, you know, he's also, I was talking about Jeharis.
01:08:16 --> 01:08:19 [UNKNOWN]: I think I, I feel like Jeharis was probably like that as a team, too.
01:08:19 --> 01:08:21 [UNKNOWN]: Just very selfish, short, you know.
01:08:21 --> 01:08:25 [UNKNOWN]: Like I deserve respect, you know, I have a good head on my shoulders.
01:08:25 --> 01:08:26 [UNKNOWN]: I know him young, but still.
01:08:27 --> 01:08:35 [UNKNOWN]: And I find this exchange he had with Damon interesting because they have a field full of dead bodies.
01:08:35 --> 01:08:38 [UNKNOWN]: And Damon's like, um, let's just burn them all and be done.
01:08:39 --> 01:08:42 [UNKNOWN]: You know, keeps it clean and simple to do.
01:08:43 --> 01:08:46 [UNKNOWN]: And Oscar is like, no, Rifferman must be returned to the mud.
01:08:46 --> 01:08:49 [UNKNOWN]: You return your Targaryens to fire.
01:08:49 --> 01:08:50 [UNKNOWN]: We return our to the mud.
01:08:51 --> 01:08:51 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:08:51 --> 01:08:51 [UNKNOWN]: And Damon, of
01:08:52 --> 01:09:06 [UNKNOWN]: course rolls his eyes, which is a small thing to show that how Targaryens they expect others to respect their traditions, like Incess, which it's caused for us in the past.
01:09:07 --> 01:09:12 [UNKNOWN]: But they don't return that same respect to the customs and cultures of others.
01:09:13 --> 01:09:15 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's very
01:09:17 --> 01:09:20 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, a lot of ruling classes don't, right?
01:09:20 --> 01:09:35 [UNKNOWN]: Some incorporate other people's ways and cultures and into the greater scheme, but then most others completely wash away what was there before us so they can do as we do.
01:09:36 --> 01:09:41 [UNKNOWN]: So it's, yeah, to the spoils go to Victor, right?
01:09:41 --> 01:09:42 [UNKNOWN]: Right, right.
01:09:43 --> 01:09:44 [UNKNOWN]: Everything you knew was no longer
01:09:45 --> 01:10:06 [UNKNOWN]: you know, respected or necessary even, but, yeah, it's a harsh reality, it's a harsh reality, but I like that Oscars like, no, it's not what we call it, no, no, they died for your cause and we're going to respect, we're going to respect the contradictions.
01:10:10 --> 01:10:22 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and I think the fact that like I don't think Damon would have been able to win that that handily, even with the Winter Wolf showing up if Team Green weren't spread all over the freaking place right now.
01:10:24 --> 01:10:31 [UNKNOWN]: Because we've got, we've got obviously Amon hanging back at the castle with his big dragon.
01:10:32 --> 01:10:34 [UNKNOWN]: We've got the lannisters here.
01:10:35 --> 01:10:35 [UNKNOWN]: We're here.
01:10:40 --> 01:10:50 [UNKNOWN]: And our other team green reinforcements, we've Kristen Cole, had orders to march on hair and haul, but he knows it's another death trap unless he waits for at least aimond and his dragon to arrive.
01:10:51 --> 01:10:59 [UNKNOWN]: Meanwhile, the rest of the green army, the 15 high tower reinforcements waits upon quote-unquote king aimond's alleged commands.
01:11:00 --> 01:11:00 [UNKNOWN]: So basically,
01:11:01 --> 01:11:04 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Alice, it was just like, sit tight.
01:11:04 --> 01:11:12 [UNKNOWN]: Why do you think she did that to avoid battle or to learn, to learn, amened out of the castle?
01:11:12 --> 01:11:14 [UNKNOWN]: Or why did she tell them, just stay where you are?
01:11:15 --> 01:11:18 [UNKNOWN]: Because she still wants Rinaura to come through.
01:11:18 --> 01:11:25 [UNKNOWN]: But she, as she happens to come through with the high tower army,
01:11:27 --> 01:11:46 [UNKNOWN]: laying away then she's basically, you know, let her into a trap and I think she's trying to avoid that, um, that look, she's not trying to give, oh, I lied to you and everything that I said was to get you here so we could kill you.
01:11:48 --> 01:11:48 [UNKNOWN]: Hmm.
01:11:50 --> 01:11:50 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:11:51 --> 01:11:59 [UNKNOWN]: I guess it's also, it's interesting so we've, we've got this pairing of Chris and Cole and Goaine High Tower, which is a show thing putting them together and I like that.
01:11:59 --> 01:12:02 [UNKNOWN]: I wish they gave us more like odd couple energy time between them.
01:12:03 --> 01:12:06 [UNKNOWN]: But of course, Goaine is Allison's brother.
01:12:07 --> 01:12:12 [UNKNOWN]: Do, I think it seems like Allison, she might love her brother more than her sons.
01:12:12 --> 01:12:13 [UNKNOWN]: Can I pause at that?
01:12:14 --> 01:12:16 [UNKNOWN]: I, yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:12:17 --> 01:12:17 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:12:18 --> 01:12:30 [UNKNOWN]: So maybe she's just trying to like, if I keep the armies apart, she doesn't care about losing lannisters, but she can protect the parts of it she cares about, which are the high towers and her own people.
01:12:31 --> 01:12:33 [UNKNOWN]: Can I confess something?
01:12:35 --> 01:12:40 [UNKNOWN]: I would not, I would not be upset at all.
01:12:41 --> 01:12:44 [UNKNOWN]: If I never have to lay eyes on Christian coal, again,
01:12:47 --> 01:12:54 [UNKNOWN]: I would not be upset if I never saw Kristen and Cole on screen and get, I hate that guy.
01:12:55 --> 01:13:10 [UNKNOWN]: I just, you know, I'm trying to be better, I'm trying to be better, you know, I'm trying to grow, but, oh, I can't stand it.
01:13:11 --> 01:13:15 [UNKNOWN]: I can't stand him with every fiber of my being.
01:13:16 --> 01:13:25 [UNKNOWN]: His condescending swarming, like, just, uh, don't like him.
01:13:25 --> 01:13:26 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:13:27 --> 01:13:28 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you.
01:13:29 --> 01:13:31 [UNKNOWN]: Mrs. Ben, John's TED Talk.
01:13:32 --> 01:13:33 [UNKNOWN]: Why Kristen calls sex?
01:13:34 --> 01:13:36 [UNKNOWN]: I didn't even get into the wise, he just sucks.
01:13:37 --> 01:13:59 [UNKNOWN]: Well, let's get into the wise right now, because to be honest, I have been someone who, like, I didn't necessarily, I didn't, you know, I think he's an interesting character, but he's an infuriating character, but I think I hated him more in this episode than anything else, which is funny because it's now he's like, he's having his PTSD moment where he's like scorched earth, dragons or nuclear weapons.
01:14:00 --> 01:14:12 [UNKNOWN]: Um, and so he's he's like, I'm just going to sit here and work on my shield painting project for a minute, which, like, you're just painting a few circles like how long is this going to take what I'll see you up to do and um,
01:14:21 --> 01:14:25 [UNKNOWN]: one of the local women and grains like you have to intervene and do something about this.
01:14:25 --> 01:14:26 [UNKNOWN]: We have to say that this is not okay.
01:14:27 --> 01:14:30 [UNKNOWN]: And Kristen calls like, uh, I don't care about honor anymore.
01:14:30 --> 01:14:32 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like, are you kidding me?
01:14:32 --> 01:14:33 [UNKNOWN]: Exactly.
01:14:33 --> 01:14:42 [UNKNOWN]: You, you all like, yeah, who are going to ruin other people's lives, ruin entire kingdoms because of your freaking precious honor.
01:14:43 --> 01:14:49 [UNKNOWN]: Now, if you don't care about it now, when you've seen the devastation that it, that it has
01:14:51 --> 01:14:58 [UNKNOWN]: then you never cared about it in the first place to be exactly exactly I hate Christian Cole.
01:14:59 --> 01:15:17 [UNKNOWN]: I still don't have the hatred for him that you do, but I see him now as this like a very empty person who he used that honor as something to cling to to have some to define himself and give him some feeling of purpose, but it was fake.
01:15:17 --> 01:15:17 [UNKNOWN]: That's what
01:15:19 --> 01:15:33 [UNKNOWN]: Man, give me Kenneth Cole, Cole Han, just get rid of Christian Cole, give me, give me, give me, give me, give me, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give, give
01:15:35 --> 01:15:40 [UNKNOWN]: What do you think about the addition of this high tower contingency?
01:15:40 --> 01:15:46 [UNKNOWN]: We've got Ormond High Tower, who is, I guess she, he's first cousins with Alicent.
01:15:47 --> 01:15:51 [UNKNOWN]: And I'll say, I mean, I'm just going to name who's standing behind him.
01:15:51 --> 01:15:54 [UNKNOWN]: If for some reason, you don't want to hear this flash forward.
01:15:55 --> 01:16:01 [UNKNOWN]: But like, I don't know whether or not saying this kid's name, but it's Alicent's son, Darren, is the one in green behind him.
01:16:01 --> 01:16:04 [UNKNOWN]: And the dragon to Sarian belongs to Darren.
01:16:05 --> 01:16:08 [UNKNOWN]: Um, so we're getting greens are getting another dragon in the mix.
01:16:08 --> 01:16:12 [UNKNOWN]: Although it was like just seeing to carry and Pend up the whole time.
01:16:12 --> 01:16:14 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like yeah, no, let the dragon go man.
01:16:14 --> 01:16:20 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, this is even more reason that, you know, they stink these greens.
01:16:21 --> 01:16:25 [UNKNOWN]: Are you going to have the dragon in the pen like that?
01:16:25 --> 01:16:26 [UNKNOWN]: Like what are we doing?
01:16:27 --> 01:16:27 [UNKNOWN]: What are we doing it?
01:16:29 --> 01:16:38 [UNKNOWN]: I'll say, I look forward to seeing more of Darren, especially because the actor who plays him Benjamin Evin, Eindworth, is going to be playing Link in this older movie that's coming out.
01:16:38 --> 01:16:46 [UNKNOWN]: So, I've seen him as a kid in the haunting a blind manner, but I'm looking forward to seeing how he's developing and picturing him as Link.
01:16:47 --> 01:16:50 [UNKNOWN]: But what did you think about the introduction of these characters?
01:16:51 --> 01:16:56 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, a hormone does not look like somebody that I'm going to enjoy.
01:16:56 --> 01:16:57 [UNKNOWN]: That's great.
01:16:59 --> 01:17:02 [UNKNOWN]: Smelling salt or whatever he sniffing to tell people they'd stink.
01:17:02 --> 01:17:04 [UNKNOWN]: delicate little or mom.
01:17:04 --> 01:17:04 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:17:05 --> 01:17:10 [UNKNOWN]: Tell them people you think I've got a small these things because you think of my presence go take a bath like.
01:17:10 --> 01:17:13 [UNKNOWN]: Thanks for the bath, but you don't have to be a big about it.
01:17:13 --> 01:17:13 [UNKNOWN]: Exactly.
01:17:14 --> 01:17:26 [UNKNOWN]: Um, so yeah, and I think, you know, obviously they're going to play a huge role and, you know, the upcoming episodes and the intrigue and the battles that are to come.
01:17:27 --> 01:17:27 [UNKNOWN]: Um,
01:17:27 --> 01:17:34 [UNKNOWN]: But yeah, this is, I'm not, I'm, I'm not team high tower, you know what I mean?
01:17:34 --> 01:17:36 [UNKNOWN]: Like they all can get it, like,
01:17:37 --> 01:17:41 [UNKNOWN]: bring sheepy over here and let's burn everybody, you know what I'm saying?
01:17:42 --> 01:18:02 [UNKNOWN]: Let my son sheepy loose, let my guy loose and just do it because I'm not a fan of the high towers, I don't like them, I don't want to see them succeed and I just need them all to be, you know, either put in some sort of stocks or burnt.
01:18:03 --> 01:18:05 [UNKNOWN]: That's all I'm feeling right now.
01:18:05 --> 01:18:14 [UNKNOWN]: So all mine is here and with his, you know, smell goods, but I don't like him.
01:18:14 --> 01:18:18 [UNKNOWN]: I don't like them, but they're rolling deep.
01:18:19 --> 01:18:28 [UNKNOWN]: You got, they're rolling deep, they're well fed, they're well provisioned, they're gonna be a tough out.
01:18:28 --> 01:18:30 [UNKNOWN]: They're gonna be a tough out, so it's gonna be interesting to see.
01:18:31 --> 01:18:39 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean it's this was very much just like a set up of them and that way I did feel like a new season like here Some new characters are gonna be important this season.
01:18:39 --> 01:18:54 [UNKNOWN]: I'll say though one other one that they introduced he hasn't really done anything yet but Was with our mom was john rockston played by joplin siptaine and the reason I point him out is a lot's of people pointing him out because he played bra so in and or
01:18:56 --> 01:18:57 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, I didn't even cast it.
01:18:58 --> 01:19:01 [UNKNOWN]: A lot of affection for this actor built into our community.
01:19:02 --> 01:19:04 [UNKNOWN]: Check out our hand or coverage if you haven't yet.
01:19:07 --> 01:19:13 [UNKNOWN]: If this is a good place to take another break and when we come back, we're going to get into its battle time.
01:19:13 --> 01:19:14 [UNKNOWN]: It's time to talk to the battle.
01:19:14 --> 01:19:15 [UNKNOWN]: Be right back.
01:19:26 --> 01:19:34 [UNKNOWN]: All right, you want to set up the Dragonstone drama?
01:19:35 --> 01:19:56 [UNKNOWN]: Absolutely, on Dragonstone, Rhinara and Jaceris are on prepareful battle, but Jace has other plans, lacking trust for his step-gram mother's elephant word that she will let Rhinara have King's landing, believing it's a trap, and incredulous that his mother would fly, where first fly off into another seemingly trap of the triarchy fleet at the gullet.
01:19:57 --> 01:19:59 [UNKNOWN]: Jace commands the sir and
01:20:04 --> 01:20:05 [UNKNOWN]: until the battle is done.
01:20:05 --> 01:20:10 [UNKNOWN]: And they listen, then Jason Bala fly off to war.
01:20:13 --> 01:20:17 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, obviously this was meant to infuriate us.
01:20:19 --> 01:20:24 [UNKNOWN]: He says to Sir Lawrence, you swore to protect her from all threats, including herself.
01:20:24 --> 01:20:32 [UNKNOWN]: And I was like, that's some real, this is the second time I brought up this short story recently, but it's some real the yellow wallpaper energy.
01:20:34 --> 01:20:43 [UNKNOWN]: This yellow wallpaper is this short story from the 19th century, 19th century feminist literature basically, but it is a favorite of mine.
01:20:44 --> 01:20:58 [UNKNOWN]: happened to reread it a couple of months ago, happened to be extremely relevant to back rooms, David and I talked about it in our episode about that film, not just because of the yellow wallpaper, but thematically, it's about
01:20:59 --> 01:21:23 [UNKNOWN]: It's about a woman who, I don't know, she's unwell in a vague kind of 19th century way, her husband's a doctor and her husband doctor and her brother decide that for her own protection, she needs to be locked in this room and kept away from all stimulation, like other people are reading or things like that, and she goes crazy because of it.
01:21:23 --> 01:21:27 [UNKNOWN]: And I think that's what's kind
01:21:29 --> 01:21:54 [UNKNOWN]: showing yeah that Reneera after everything that she's been through and all the battles against the patriarchy to have her own son turn on her like that and have that be their last interaction like I think that that's their last interaction it sucks is so heartbreaking but it is so infuriating
01:21:59 --> 01:22:03 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like, sir, Lauren, what are you doing?
01:22:03 --> 01:22:08 [UNKNOWN]: You don't take your orders from the prince when the king is still here.
01:22:09 --> 01:22:10 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:22:10 --> 01:22:11 [UNKNOWN]: Can you talk about it?
01:22:11 --> 01:22:13 [UNKNOWN]: Can you talk about it?
01:22:13 --> 01:22:15 [UNKNOWN]: Like, what's going on here?
01:22:15 --> 01:22:18 [UNKNOWN]: Like, how do you even, how does that even square?
01:22:19 --> 01:22:20 [UNKNOWN]: How does that not tie?
01:22:22 --> 01:22:23 [UNKNOWN]: He's the prince.
01:22:23 --> 01:22:24 [UNKNOWN]: He's not the king.
01:22:29 --> 01:22:34 [UNKNOWN]: they would not have done that to the king, right?
01:22:36 --> 01:22:37 [UNKNOWN]: They wouldn't have done that to the king.
01:22:38 --> 01:22:39 [UNKNOWN]: But he's the queen.
01:22:40 --> 01:22:42 [UNKNOWN]: So we get to decide for her.
01:22:43 --> 01:22:45 [UNKNOWN]: What type of fucking bullshit is that?
01:22:45 --> 01:22:48 [UNKNOWN]: I just can't believe that, yeah, Jace would do that.
01:22:48 --> 01:22:53 [UNKNOWN]: And please, I'm a bit disappointed in Baylor too, because Baylor is like, oh, second.
01:22:53 --> 01:22:57 [UNKNOWN]: Like, no, this isn't cool, then Jace is like, oh, but is for own protection.
01:22:57 --> 01:22:59 [UNKNOWN]: And she's like, oh, okay, that's fine.
01:22:59 --> 01:22:59 [UNKNOWN]: Then let's go.
01:23:00 --> 01:23:08 [UNKNOWN]: And also, Ms. Saria, we got like in our previously on flashback at the beginning, they showed us again, Ms. Saria and Reneera kissing.
01:23:09 --> 01:23:17 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but then we didn't see any more intimacy between them in this episode, and she was locked in that room.
01:23:17 --> 01:23:19 [UNKNOWN]: With her, this called for some.
01:23:20 --> 01:23:24 [UNKNOWN]: But she seemed more on Jay's side at some, she's like, he wishes it's only to protect you.
01:23:24 --> 01:23:25 [UNKNOWN]: That's right.
01:23:25 --> 01:23:29 [UNKNOWN]: I can't take that coming from you, Missaria, of all people.
01:23:29 --> 01:23:34 [UNKNOWN]: And all of the struggles I know you have gone through as a woman in this world, who chose this
01:23:37 --> 01:23:38 [UNKNOWN]: limited objects.
01:23:39 --> 01:23:45 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, it's just, it's just, you know, jace man, I've known jaces.
01:23:47 --> 01:23:58 [UNKNOWN]: You know, I've known, I've known some jaces who think they know, who think they have the right to make decisions for other people, especially the women in their lives.
01:23:59 --> 01:24:00 [UNKNOWN]: And that
01:24:07 --> 01:24:13 [UNKNOWN]: because taken agency from someone, never bodes well for you.
01:24:15 --> 01:24:22 [UNKNOWN]: And I just hate that, I don't know how old is Jay supposed to be in this world?
01:24:24 --> 01:24:27 [UNKNOWN]: In the show version, who it's tough to say, like let's say elder team.
01:24:28 --> 01:24:30 [UNKNOWN]: Right, so not yet 20.
01:24:31 --> 01:24:31 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:24:31 --> 01:24:32 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
01:24:33 --> 01:24:36 [UNKNOWN]: So maybe early 20s, the brightness of use.
01:24:36 --> 01:24:38 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, great.
01:24:38 --> 01:24:40 [UNKNOWN]: That's a wonderful way to say it.
01:24:41 --> 01:24:51 [UNKNOWN]: But also, the having the temerity to even think that you can make this decision for your mom, who's the fucking queen.
01:24:51 --> 01:24:52 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:24:57 --> 01:24:57 [UNKNOWN]: It's infuriating.
01:24:57 --> 01:25:02 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's me on Ballsy to give Jace that power.
01:25:04 --> 01:25:07 [UNKNOWN]: Especially since he hasn't shown to anyone.
01:25:09 --> 01:25:09 [UNKNOWN]: Anyone.
01:25:11 --> 01:25:14 [UNKNOWN]: To be worthy of anything approaching that sort of power.
01:25:16 --> 01:25:19 [UNKNOWN]: And it's not just standing there like a big old dumbass.
01:25:22 --> 01:25:22 [UNKNOWN]: And fun to the door.
01:25:22 --> 01:25:23 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:25:24 --> 01:25:24 [UNKNOWN]: Like.
01:25:25 --> 01:25:30 [UNKNOWN]: Really, the young Prince Ling says that this is my duty so I do it.
01:25:30 --> 01:25:30 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:25:30 --> 01:25:31 [UNKNOWN]: Come on.
01:25:32 --> 01:25:36 [UNKNOWN]: Come on in, you know, it didn't take me out of the show.
01:25:36 --> 01:25:38 [UNKNOWN]: It didn't take me out of the show.
01:25:40 --> 01:25:45 [UNKNOWN]: But I am really trying to wrap my head around.
01:25:50 --> 01:26:01 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so one thing I'm sorry, and it just can't be, you know, sexism for sexism steak.
01:26:02 --> 01:26:02 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:26:03 --> 01:26:03 [UNKNOWN]: You know what I mean?
01:26:03 --> 01:26:06 [UNKNOWN]: Like we have to protect this woman from herself.
01:26:07 --> 01:26:15 [UNKNOWN]: It just can't, I refuse to believe that that is the rudimentary, you know, way that
01:26:20 --> 01:26:36 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, this world is a sexist world, but in the round that we're in this sort of set-up that we're living in, that they're living, that we're witnessing, she's the fucking queen.
01:26:38 --> 01:26:41 [UNKNOWN]: If she says off with your head, your head is off.
01:26:44 --> 01:26:45 [UNKNOWN]: You are going to this
01:26:48 --> 01:26:51 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, they heard the wreck order in order to obey her son?
01:26:52 --> 01:26:53 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:26:54 --> 01:26:55 [UNKNOWN]: I can't wrap my head around it.
01:26:56 --> 01:27:02 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I'm against absolute power, but she deserves the same respect.
01:27:02 --> 01:27:05 [UNKNOWN]: She deserves more respect than her son, frankly.
01:27:05 --> 01:27:06 [UNKNOWN]: Absolutely.
01:27:06 --> 01:27:11 [UNKNOWN]: She's earned it, not just by being older, but by all the things that you do.
01:27:11 --> 01:27:13 [UNKNOWN]: By deed, by deeds.
01:27:13 --> 01:27:13 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:27:14 --> 01:27:16 [UNKNOWN]: But actual deeds.
01:27:17 --> 01:27:28 [UNKNOWN]: like there's no no one in her circle should at this point of the story, doubt her capacity to lead.
01:27:30 --> 01:27:52 [UNKNOWN]: But it is, I mean, I do understand that Jace was worried about losing her and worried also for selfish reasons about it because he knows that, well, all the strong jokes that without her, he loses all claim, like people are not going to take him seriously without his mother, because he is the wrong color hair or whatever.
01:27:54 --> 01:28:06 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so okay, but we do have to talk about one thing in the scene that did rub me and some other people a bit the wrong way, which is a misplaced reference like I did the reference they pulled out.
01:28:06 --> 01:28:08 [UNKNOWN]: I do not dig how they used it.
01:28:10 --> 01:28:13 [UNKNOWN]: And that is that Queen Elizabeth quote that they slipped in.
01:28:13 --> 01:28:21 [UNKNOWN]: So the version that we heard in this episode is I may appear to have the weak and feeble body of a woman, but I possess the heart and spirit of a king.
01:28:21 --> 01:28:29 [UNKNOWN]: And before we get back to how it's used in this episode, I just want to talk a bit about where this quote comes from.
01:28:30 --> 01:28:54 [UNKNOWN]: Um, and so this, this is a speech, the Queen Elizabeth I gave in 1588 until Bury at the defeat of the Spanish Armada, Maryland pointed out in the chat that, uh, their motto had already been destroyed at this point, but there was still a possibility of an invasion forced a lead by the Duke of Parma, the English didn't know that the, uh, the Armada had been chased from their southern shores and, uh, had been followed and
01:28:57 --> 01:29:01 [UNKNOWN]: but the point is that this was a rallying cry.
01:29:02 --> 01:29:07 [UNKNOWN]: Like think Brae part style except my Scottish friends say that the Brae part style rallying cry wasn't real, but this one is real.
01:29:07 --> 01:29:08 [UNKNOWN]: This comes from history.
01:29:10 --> 01:29:21 [UNKNOWN]: We have probably the most accurate version of the original speech, which I'm going to give to you, was found in a letter from Lionel Sharpe to the Duke of Buckingham and because basically Sharpe was there.
01:29:22 --> 01:29:29 [UNKNOWN]: And was, yeah, with tasked with writing this down and rallying the troops also in her wake.
01:29:30 --> 01:29:32 [UNKNOWN]: So this is the version that he wrote down.
01:29:32 --> 01:29:36 [UNKNOWN]: There's other accounts too, but this one's considered probably the most.
01:29:37 --> 01:29:38 [UNKNOWN]: through the most accurate.
01:29:39 --> 01:29:57 [UNKNOWN]: And so just picture Queen Elizabeth, flaming red hair in battle armor on horseback, and she says, my loving people, we have been persuaded by some that are careful of our safety to take heed how we commit ourselves to armed multitudes for fear of treachery.
01:29:58 --> 01:30:05 [UNKNOWN]: But I assure you, I do not desire to live to just trust my faithful, loving people, let tyrants fear.
01:30:05 --> 01:30:14 [UNKNOWN]: I have always so behaved myself that, under God, I have placed my cheapest strength and safeguard in the loyal hearts and goodwill of my subjects.
01:30:14 --> 01:30:21 [UNKNOWN]: And therefore, I am come amongst you as you see at this time, not for my recreation and discord.
01:30:21 --> 01:30:33 [UNKNOWN]: but being resolved in the midst and heat of the battle to live and die amongst you all, to lay down for my God and for my kingdom and my people, my honor and my blood, even in the dust.
01:30:34 --> 01:30:55 [UNKNOWN]: I know I have the body, but of a weak, feeble woman, but I have the heart and stomach of a king, and of a king of England, too, and think foul scorn that Parma or Spain or any prince of Europe should dare to invade the borders of my realm to which rather than any dishonor shall grow by me, I myself will take up arms.
01:30:55 --> 01:31:01 [UNKNOWN]: I myself will be your general, judge, and rewarder of every one of your virtues in the field.
01:31:02 --> 01:31:11 [UNKNOWN]: I know already, for your foradness you have deserved rewards and crowns, and we do assure you on a word of a prince they shall be duly paid.
01:31:12 --> 01:31:25 [UNKNOWN]: In the meantime, my lieutenant general shall be in my stead, then whom never prince command a more noble or worthy subject, not doubting, but by your obedience to my general, by your concord in the camp,
01:31:26 --> 01:31:34 [UNKNOWN]: and your valor in the field, we shall shortly have a famous victory over these enemies of my god of my kingdom and my people.
01:31:36 --> 01:31:45 [UNKNOWN]: So this is like, I love the idea of referencing this powerful speech that has survived through history.
01:31:46 --> 01:32:07 [UNKNOWN]: But the way it was used here is to her to say it to Missaria like crying in a room and you know like the source of like you they could have used it with when she's is actually rallying people to battle that would have been the appropriate time to use it but here on a mother fucking dragon
01:32:07 --> 01:32:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, she, her, she's being locked up by her son, which is so thick and so it ends up making her sound feeble indeed.
01:32:14 --> 01:32:18 [UNKNOWN]: And I just, I think it just completely misses the point of why the original so famous.
01:32:18 --> 01:32:22 [UNKNOWN]: So sorry to be critical at that point, but had to have it out.
01:32:22 --> 01:32:24 [UNKNOWN]: No, it deserves all the criticism.
01:32:25 --> 01:32:28 [UNKNOWN]: It deserves all the criticism because I heard her say these words.
01:32:29 --> 01:32:31 [UNKNOWN]: And it was just like, huh?
01:32:38 --> 01:32:59 [UNKNOWN]: the body of a what and and the look on her face like totally resigned and sad and not even upset not even angry no righteous fury just like defeated teriyard fuck out of here yeah that's not linear yeah
01:33:01 --> 01:33:10 [UNKNOWN]: Although I feel for her because obviously we'll get into it and say she lost a son today, but how disappointing is it going to be when she gets to King's Landing?
01:33:10 --> 01:33:15 [UNKNOWN]: She's like going on and on about like, I'll have Aegon's head at one strike.
01:33:15 --> 01:33:16 [UNKNOWN]: You get them both and Aegon's not there.
01:33:16 --> 01:33:17 [UNKNOWN]: Sorry.
01:33:17 --> 01:33:17 [UNKNOWN]: Not there.
01:33:18 --> 01:33:19 [UNKNOWN]: Not there.
01:33:22 --> 01:33:22 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
01:33:22 --> 01:33:24 [UNKNOWN]: So we get into the battle itself.
01:33:24 --> 01:33:25 [UNKNOWN]: You want to set up a mission of her own?
01:33:26 --> 01:33:26 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:33:26 --> 01:33:26 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:33:26 --> 01:33:27 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:33:28 --> 01:33:37 [UNKNOWN]: Tyler and Namister returned some assholes to Characco, Lohar, and her flea tri-alki-ships, ready to break call-its for Laryan's blockade at the gullet.
01:33:37 --> 01:33:40 [UNKNOWN]: That's blocking their ships from reaching King's Landing.
01:33:40 --> 01:33:45 [UNKNOWN]: However, as they near their target, it becomes clear that Lohar has her own agenda.
01:33:45 --> 01:33:52 [UNKNOWN]: She breaks off from the rest of the beginning of the battle at Target High-Tide, the seat of the House of Laryan.
01:33:53 --> 01:33:56 [UNKNOWN]: to punish Cornish for as many years of killing her people at the stepstones.
01:33:57 --> 01:33:58 [UNKNOWN]: She's ready to make it personal.
01:33:59 --> 01:34:01 [UNKNOWN]: Everyone else in this battle be damned.
01:34:02 --> 01:34:05 [UNKNOWN]: We're Cornish, our boats are in his home turf.
01:34:06 --> 01:34:17 [UNKNOWN]: And despite her during Thailand and his soldier aboard, letting the heavy armor drag them into the sea instead of her boat, she gives up any advantage by immediately ramming Cornish's ship,
01:34:21 --> 01:34:29 [UNKNOWN]: Call this secret son, Alan, sees his father knocked over board and assuming he's died, goes after Lohar, killing her.
01:34:31 --> 01:34:39 [UNKNOWN]: Um, so we talked about this already a bit, you know, this was obviously a favorite sequence of ours this episode.
01:34:39 --> 01:34:41 [UNKNOWN]: You talked about Coralist taking the wheel.
01:34:41 --> 01:34:49 [UNKNOWN]: I talked about that shot of Alan Killing, Lowe R. Um, is there anything else you want to shout out about this, this sequence of events?
01:34:49 --> 01:34:56 [UNKNOWN]: I love that, that, that Coralist was holding, uh, what, like, to be the documentary, um,
01:34:58 --> 01:34:59 [UNKNOWN]: sword, not sword.
01:35:00 --> 01:35:07 [UNKNOWN]: I'm blanking on the name of the weapon, but it wasn't a with starry sea weapon.
01:35:07 --> 01:35:11 [UNKNOWN]: It just goes to show you how much well travel this man is.
01:35:12 --> 01:35:12 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:35:13 --> 01:35:15 [UNKNOWN]: And what he's seeing that other people haven't seen.
01:35:16 --> 01:35:16 [UNKNOWN]: True.
01:35:17 --> 01:35:19 [UNKNOWN]: He broke out that I've been liquor to.
01:35:19 --> 01:35:22 [UNKNOWN]: I've been, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
01:35:25 --> 01:35:43 [UNKNOWN]: So, just paying a lot of homage to the cease snake and his travels and the world that he seen that much of, you know, the Targaryens even as we know them now haven't even on their dragons.
01:35:43 --> 01:35:44 [UNKNOWN]: You know what I mean?
01:35:45 --> 01:35:46 [UNKNOWN]: He's been around the world.
01:35:47 --> 01:35:48 [UNKNOWN]: He's been around the world.
01:35:50 --> 01:35:50 [UNKNOWN]: How many of the
01:35:56 --> 01:36:02 [UNKNOWN]: What did you think about Alan going after to avenge his father after Low Har, after Coralist whenever board?
01:36:03 --> 01:36:04 [UNKNOWN]: I think it makes sense.
01:36:05 --> 01:36:05 [UNKNOWN]: I think it makes sense.
01:36:06 --> 01:36:07 [UNKNOWN]: I really do.
01:36:07 --> 01:36:19 [UNKNOWN]: I think in the moment, we spoke about it earlier when he saw his father, you know, just completely look out of it as he's watching high-tech burn.
01:36:20 --> 01:36:20 [UNKNOWN]: Right?
01:36:21 --> 01:36:27 [UNKNOWN]: That was a moment where he saw a person who did not have everything together.
01:36:28 --> 01:36:35 [UNKNOWN]: Did not have, you know, the power did not have the confidence.
01:36:36 --> 01:36:46 [UNKNOWN]: He saw his father as a man, as a regular person, then not the person he had placed on this pedestal of this person that was so important in society.
01:36:47 --> 01:37:02 [UNKNOWN]: And I think that's who he was avenging, or trying to avenge in that moment, the person who was hurt, even though his father had hurt him in so many ways, he still was like, you know,
01:37:06 --> 01:37:11 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, I think we saw some real progress in their relationship here.
01:37:12 --> 01:37:15 [UNKNOWN]: I do wonder who Encoreless and Adam are going to get some time together, too.
01:37:15 --> 01:37:20 [UNKNOWN]: But I think it makes sense that, you know, Alan is the ship guy.
01:37:20 --> 01:37:24 [UNKNOWN]: He's the one who's really really in at heart too.
01:37:24 --> 01:37:24 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:37:24 --> 01:37:25 [UNKNOWN]: So to speak.
01:37:25 --> 01:37:25 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:37:25 --> 01:37:30 [UNKNOWN]: And he takes control, you know, in the moment that the call is can't, he does.
01:37:31 --> 01:37:32 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:37:32 --> 01:37:32 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:37:32 --> 01:37:33 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:37:33 --> 01:37:49 [UNKNOWN]: I was, as I said, as said, that we didn't get more of Characco lo-harr play by, I have to shout up play by Abigail Thorn, Luke always shouts out when Abigail Thorn shouts up because Luke is a fan of her philosophy to YouTube channel.
01:37:51 --> 01:38:00 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but yeah, I thought that she was fun in this, um, whatever like more, you know what her bow is called the bitch fist, which is the best boat name I've ever heard.
01:38:07 --> 01:38:10 [UNKNOWN]: But yeah, that's um, I wasn't bad that he killed her.
01:38:10 --> 01:38:10 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, it made sense.
01:38:10 --> 01:38:12 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, that's how the story goes.
01:38:13 --> 01:38:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's how the story goes.
01:38:14 --> 01:38:14 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:38:14 --> 01:38:15 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's how the story goes.
01:38:15 --> 01:38:16 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's how the story goes.
01:38:16 --> 01:38:17 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's how the story goes.
01:38:18 --> 01:38:22 [UNKNOWN]: You know, it's, it's, it's had, we lost the, the, the boat, the Queen, who never was.
01:38:22 --> 01:38:34 [UNKNOWN]: It was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh, it was, uh
01:38:34 --> 01:38:41 [UNKNOWN]: Like, what point was did Corlyce go and like cheat on his wife with this woman?
01:38:41 --> 01:38:43 [UNKNOWN]: What was the situation?
01:38:43 --> 01:38:44 [UNKNOWN]: He's like, I cared for her in my own way.
01:38:44 --> 01:38:45 [UNKNOWN]: Like, what does that mean?
01:38:45 --> 01:38:47 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, it was fun.
01:38:47 --> 01:38:49 [UNKNOWN]: And of her, I was fond of your mother.
01:38:49 --> 01:38:49 [UNKNOWN]: What?
01:38:53 --> 01:38:56 [UNKNOWN]: I didn't look at them like, what are you talking about?
01:38:56 --> 01:38:56 [UNKNOWN]: You were fun.
01:38:57 --> 01:38:58 [UNKNOWN]: You were fond of my mother.
01:38:58 --> 01:39:05 [UNKNOWN]: Like, if he, I could have reached through the screen, like I said earlier, I would have reached through the screen and then I'm open and choked them out.
01:39:05 --> 01:39:06 [UNKNOWN]: And he was just looking at it.
01:39:07 --> 01:39:11 [UNKNOWN]: Is that supposed to feel good about that you said that?
01:39:11 --> 01:39:13 [UNKNOWN]: Is that supposed to be feel good?
01:39:14 --> 01:39:15 [UNKNOWN]: That you were fond of my mother?
01:39:16 --> 01:39:17 [UNKNOWN]: What are you talking about?
01:39:17 --> 01:39:25 [UNKNOWN]: While you were cheating on your wife for what you were using to, yeah, and not giving us your name, which we're fond of her.
01:39:26 --> 01:39:28 [UNKNOWN]: Come on man, come on man.
01:39:28 --> 01:39:40 [UNKNOWN]: These are terrible people, and like you said earlier, who make terrible decisions for the in regards to how they see and raise their children.
01:39:40 --> 01:39:41 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:39:41 --> 01:39:41 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:39:43 --> 01:39:52 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, low-har though, I have to say I liked low-har last season, but this, I do get annoyed with a character who's only motivation as revenge.
01:39:53 --> 01:40:01 [UNKNOWN]: It's just people who are only motivated by revenge or characters, especially who are only motivated by revenge are so boring and predictable to me, because you just know
01:40:02 --> 01:40:11 [UNKNOWN]: you know always what they're going to do and it's going to mess things up for everyone else in ways that don't even necessarily help them and you're just like, oh, stop it.
01:40:12 --> 01:40:13 [UNKNOWN]: So, fine.
01:40:14 --> 01:40:15 [UNKNOWN]: Get rid of Laura.
01:40:16 --> 01:40:21 [UNKNOWN]: It is sad that Laura got to take out um spice town on Driftmark.
01:40:21 --> 01:40:22 [UNKNOWN]: We know from the book.
01:40:23 --> 01:40:25 [UNKNOWN]: It's never rebuilt after this battle.
01:40:26 --> 01:40:32 [UNKNOWN]: So RIP, this is sort of obviously putting a major chink in the Valerian legacy.
01:40:34 --> 01:40:37 [UNKNOWN]: Do we think, low-harbord, Thailand, Lennister, about the armor?
01:40:38 --> 01:40:38 [UNKNOWN]: It did.
01:40:39 --> 01:40:39 [UNKNOWN]: It did.
01:40:39 --> 01:40:39 [UNKNOWN]: It did.
01:40:40 --> 01:40:46 [UNKNOWN]: Do we think, he was not present in the book at this battle, but do we think he is dead?
01:40:46 --> 01:40:47 [UNKNOWN]: His brother died this episode.
01:40:48 --> 01:40:51 [UNKNOWN]: Did Thailand, Thailand go down with him?
01:40:52 --> 01:40:56 [UNKNOWN]: Like, does this world hate, does it TV version of this world hate twins?
01:40:57 --> 01:40:59 [UNKNOWN]: I hadn't thought about that.
01:40:59 --> 01:41:01 [UNKNOWN]: I, like, I assumed he's dead.
01:41:03 --> 01:41:05 [UNKNOWN]: So, but now you raise an interest.
01:41:05 --> 01:41:09 [UNKNOWN]: I wouldn't be surprised if he watched that on some show.
01:41:09 --> 01:41:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:41:09 --> 01:41:12 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, like I said, he wasn't there.
01:41:12 --> 01:41:13 [UNKNOWN]: He was in King signing at this point.
01:41:13 --> 01:41:14 [UNKNOWN]: So,
01:41:17 --> 01:41:17 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:41:18 --> 01:41:18 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
01:41:19 --> 01:41:21 [UNKNOWN]: I genuinely do not know.
01:41:21 --> 01:41:26 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, now you, you've caused me to question because I just assumed that he was.
01:41:27 --> 01:41:27 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:41:27 --> 01:41:29 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
01:41:29 --> 01:41:31 [UNKNOWN]: Well, let's get into the other side of the battle.
01:41:31 --> 01:41:34 [UNKNOWN]: We've got some dragon and our parents during this battle of the Gallet.
01:41:34 --> 01:41:38 [UNKNOWN]: Jace and Bayliffe lie their dragons to Coralus' aid.
01:41:38 --> 01:41:43 [UNKNOWN]: When Reina spots the battle and progress as she nears dragon stone on sheep sailors back,
01:41:47 --> 01:41:59 [UNKNOWN]: The untrained dragon, however, sees nothing but threats and begins indiscriminately burning her grandfather's ships as well as their enemies, nearly napping her sister with the dragon's claws.
01:42:00 --> 01:42:11 [UNKNOWN]: And then Vermex is hit with a scorpion arrow sinking into the sea, although Jace is able to free himself from the dying dragon's saddle when he surfaces he finds himself amidst
01:42:17 --> 01:42:20 [UNKNOWN]: RIPJs, the biggest RIP of the episode.
01:42:21 --> 01:42:25 [UNKNOWN]: Man, yeah, it's RIPJs, but that's what you get.
01:42:25 --> 01:42:27 [UNKNOWN]: I'm saying that's what you get.
01:42:27 --> 01:42:30 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, you are here thinking that you just
01:42:31 --> 01:42:32 [UNKNOWN]: I'm going to save the day.
01:42:33 --> 01:42:34 [UNKNOWN]: I'm riding this dragon.
01:42:35 --> 01:42:36 [UNKNOWN]: Can nobody tell me nothing.
01:42:37 --> 01:42:37 [UNKNOWN]: You know what I'm saying?
01:42:37 --> 01:42:38 [UNKNOWN]: I'm here.
01:42:39 --> 01:42:40 [UNKNOWN]: I'm announcing myself.
01:42:40 --> 01:42:42 [UNKNOWN]: Everybody needs to know who I am.
01:42:42 --> 01:42:44 [UNKNOWN]: Nah, Jason, no bro.
01:42:44 --> 01:42:45 [UNKNOWN]: That's not how it goes.
01:42:46 --> 01:42:52 [UNKNOWN]: You severely overestimated your capabilities.
01:42:52 --> 01:42:56 [UNKNOWN]: Surveily, you are not that guy.
01:42:57 --> 01:43:00 [UNKNOWN]: And you desperately want to show that you're that guy.
01:43:00 --> 01:43:03 [UNKNOWN]: And you got got, you know what I'm saying?
01:43:04 --> 01:43:05 [UNKNOWN]: She's still a sheep.
01:43:06 --> 01:43:13 [UNKNOWN]: She became out of the, out of the wheel, just flew down and just started lacing everybody.
01:43:14 --> 01:43:20 [UNKNOWN]: You'll get some fire, you'll get some fire, you'll get the fire, everybody gets the fire.
01:43:20 --> 01:43:22 [UNKNOWN]: You don't say this where sheepy was doing.
01:43:22 --> 01:43:23 [UNKNOWN]: But you'll chase.
01:43:31 --> 01:43:53 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, the frustrating thing about the book difference is they've removed something that I'll save for the book's boiler section, but it makes it brief, with removing that and with adding the thing where he locks his mother in his room, kind of reframes the context of Jason's death in this in a way that made me, it feels similar to the way I felt after
01:43:58 --> 01:44:03 [UNKNOWN]: Uh, it missed the thing that really made me feel things in, you know, the original version.
01:44:03 --> 01:44:04 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I felt things.
01:44:04 --> 01:44:06 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I felt bad for him.
01:44:06 --> 01:44:10 [UNKNOWN]: I did expect it obviously, you know, just like, well, and they faked us out, too.
01:44:10 --> 01:44:15 [UNKNOWN]: They faked us out the book readers, because there was a scorpion at first, and then Bella comes in like,
01:44:16 --> 01:44:18 [UNKNOWN]: I thought that was the one that was going to get them.
01:44:18 --> 01:44:18 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:44:18 --> 01:44:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, saving it.
01:44:19 --> 01:44:21 [UNKNOWN]: And then one's bail is saves him from the scorpion.
01:44:21 --> 01:44:23 [UNKNOWN]: You're like, Oh, no, it's Jay's going to live in this version.
01:44:23 --> 01:44:26 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, no, no, no, no, no, just the same.
01:44:26 --> 01:44:27 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, no, no, no.
01:44:28 --> 01:44:29 [UNKNOWN]: Just like, you know, what are you?
01:44:29 --> 01:44:31 [UNKNOWN]: What are you doing, man?
01:44:31 --> 01:44:32 [UNKNOWN]: What are you doing?
01:44:32 --> 01:44:34 [UNKNOWN]: This I, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you,
01:44:35 --> 01:44:40 [UNKNOWN]: You have a little brother, you have, you know, a nephew, a cousin who's younger than you.
01:44:41 --> 01:44:48 [UNKNOWN]: And they're in this stage that they're just like, I have to prove myself, I have to prove myself.
01:44:49 --> 01:44:50 [UNKNOWN]: No, you don't, bro.
01:44:51 --> 01:44:54 [UNKNOWN]: No, you are the last person who needs to prove you.
01:44:54 --> 01:44:58 [UNKNOWN]: You have a dragon dog, relax, like chill out.
01:44:59 --> 01:45:01 [UNKNOWN]: Chill out, you are the prince and you have a dragon.
01:45:02 --> 01:45:05 [UNKNOWN]: You actually don't need to prove yourself now.
01:45:06 --> 01:45:07 [UNKNOWN]: There will be a point.
01:45:08 --> 01:45:11 [UNKNOWN]: There will be a time where you're going to have to prove yourself.
01:45:11 --> 01:45:12 [UNKNOWN]: I give you that.
01:45:13 --> 01:45:14 [UNKNOWN]: This wasn't the time.
01:45:16 --> 01:45:17 [UNKNOWN]: This wasn't the time.
01:45:20 --> 01:45:23 [UNKNOWN]: that I'm going to show everybody.
01:45:24 --> 01:45:31 [UNKNOWN]: And you show everybody that you got some arrows in your ass in the middle of the water.
01:45:32 --> 01:45:32 [UNKNOWN]: Thanks.
01:45:36 --> 01:45:38 [UNKNOWN]: I did, I mean it was interesting.
01:45:38 --> 01:45:38 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, so
01:45:39 --> 01:45:51 [UNKNOWN]: The other thing that, like, as a book reader, may me go, oh, okay, that's so that didn't happen, is an understand that there was a practical and financial reason, like you can tell, we've complimented.
01:45:51 --> 01:45:59 [UNKNOWN]: I think this is one of the best looking battles I've ever seen on television in general, just with not only
01:46:00 --> 01:46:17 [UNKNOWN]: the the fact that it's dragons and ships, which is really freaking cool, let's just say that, but also as we've talked about before, the care and detail that when into realizing this into staging this into the visuals themselves and every aspect of it, great battle.
01:46:18 --> 01:46:20 [UNKNOWN]: Clearly we're all the money went, but they didn't
01:46:21 --> 01:46:35 [UNKNOWN]: have the money still, despite all that dragon money, they didn't have enough money for three more dragons, actually two more dragons in this battle, because in the version Bala is not there, because Moon dancer isn't even big enough to ride at this point.
01:46:35 --> 01:46:37 [UNKNOWN]: She would have loved to have been there, but she couldn't.
01:46:39 --> 01:47:02 [UNKNOWN]: there's like this hero moment where the dragon seeds who were just playing out waiting for good dough in this episode um i thought a lot of us expected them to like come in as the calvary and sort of save the day in the end and have this big heroic moment and that didn't happen so i understand why it didn't happen but you can't help it feel like oh do you think that will happen that they will get their moment
01:47:03 --> 01:47:07 [UNKNOWN]: Um, they're gonna get a moment, but I don't know, no, no, no, I'm talking about that moment.
01:47:07 --> 01:47:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
01:47:08 --> 01:47:12 [UNKNOWN]: You think they get that, they're gonna get a moment, but it will be this type of moment.
01:47:13 --> 01:47:14 [UNKNOWN]: But that's the story.
01:47:14 --> 01:47:18 [UNKNOWN]: If they don't get this type of moment later, moments are going to feel different.
01:47:18 --> 01:47:19 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, it's ugly.
01:47:19 --> 01:47:21 [UNKNOWN]: And I think that's the intent.
01:47:22 --> 01:47:22 [UNKNOWN]: You think?
01:47:23 --> 01:47:23 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:47:24 --> 01:47:25 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:47:25 --> 01:47:25 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:47:25 --> 01:47:26 [UNKNOWN]: I think that's it.
01:47:26 --> 01:47:27 [UNKNOWN]: I think it's intentional.
01:47:28 --> 01:47:29 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
01:47:29 --> 01:47:29 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
01:47:29 --> 01:47:32 [UNKNOWN]: To make us feel what, what we feel.
01:47:33 --> 01:47:33 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:47:34 --> 01:47:35 [UNKNOWN]: Layed on.
01:47:35 --> 01:47:36 [UNKNOWN]: Maybe.
01:47:36 --> 01:47:36 [UNKNOWN]: Maybe.
01:47:37 --> 01:47:47 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, if it works in that way, it's a happy accident of, you know, basically it's been said that, uh, I would have been too expensive to have all of them there.
01:47:47 --> 01:47:48 [UNKNOWN]: And I get it.
01:47:48 --> 01:47:48 [UNKNOWN]: I understand.
01:47:49 --> 01:47:49 [UNKNOWN]: I understand.
01:47:49 --> 01:47:54 [UNKNOWN]: You know, George Armarton can go wild on the page and put as many dragons as he wants.
01:47:54 --> 01:47:54 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:47:54 --> 01:47:54 [UNKNOWN]: Of course.
01:47:55 --> 01:47:58 [UNKNOWN]: But Liz, another thing we had to about, we had to about Raida.
01:47:59 --> 01:47:59 [UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
01:48:00 --> 01:48:00 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:48:02 --> 01:48:02 [UNKNOWN]: talk about it.
01:48:03 --> 01:48:08 [UNKNOWN]: I like, have you ever flown a dragon?
01:48:09 --> 01:48:09 [UNKNOWN]: No.
01:48:11 --> 01:48:13 [UNKNOWN]: Have you ever rid in the dragon in your life?
01:48:13 --> 01:48:15 [UNKNOWN]: Have you have you ever had a dragon?
01:48:16 --> 01:48:19 [UNKNOWN]: Have you ever rid in this dragon before other than that one time?
01:48:19 --> 01:48:26 [UNKNOWN]: This dragon, this dragon took you somewhere you didn't want to go and drop you and just shrugged you off.
01:48:27 --> 01:48:27 [UNKNOWN]: Right?
01:48:33 --> 01:48:37 [UNKNOWN]: And talk about, you see the smoke, we have to go help.
01:48:37 --> 01:48:37 [UNKNOWN]: What?
01:48:40 --> 01:48:47 [UNKNOWN]: I said to myself, wait a minute, who's we, and why you bring a sheepy down there?
01:48:49 --> 01:48:52 [UNKNOWN]: They have weapons that can harm sheepy, what are we doing?
01:48:52 --> 01:48:57 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, no, no, this is not a good idea, this is not a good plan.
01:48:58 --> 01:49:00 [UNKNOWN]: You don't know what you're doing.
01:49:01 --> 01:49:12 [UNKNOWN]: you don't know what you're doing you are as an adequate, even less so than Chase, like what are we doing children?
01:49:12 --> 01:49:17 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, Chase has been writing this dragon for a while, so you're still horrible.
01:49:18 --> 01:49:22 [UNKNOWN]: You can do a but you did find dragon writing, he just was horrible to his mom.
01:49:23 --> 01:49:25 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, all right, okay, yes.
01:49:29 --> 01:49:39 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, can we, can we stop and think for a moment, can we stop and think for a moment?
01:49:41 --> 01:49:41 [UNKNOWN]: What?
01:49:43 --> 01:49:45 [UNKNOWN]: What you really go to accomplish?
01:49:46 --> 01:49:49 [UNKNOWN]: No, that's my sister.
01:49:49 --> 01:49:49 [UNKNOWN]: Hey.
01:49:52 --> 01:49:55 [UNKNOWN]: Sheepies, like everybody can get some fire.
01:49:55 --> 01:49:56 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know these people.
01:49:57 --> 01:49:58 [UNKNOWN]: I really know you.
01:49:59 --> 01:50:01 [UNKNOWN]: We just met, and you tell me that's you.
01:50:02 --> 01:50:02 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know your sister.
01:50:03 --> 01:50:04 [UNKNOWN]: She can get these claws.
01:50:04 --> 01:50:07 [UNKNOWN]: I'm here for the drama.
01:50:07 --> 01:50:08 [UNKNOWN]: Let's go.
01:50:09 --> 01:50:10 [UNKNOWN]: Let's go.
01:50:11 --> 01:50:11 [UNKNOWN]: Sheepies.
01:50:11 --> 01:50:12 [UNKNOWN]: Sheep at the end of this.
01:50:13 --> 01:50:16 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, yes, I mean sheep, but I'm here for this drama.
01:50:17 --> 01:50:18 [UNKNOWN]: What are you talking about?
01:50:18 --> 01:50:19 [UNKNOWN]: I can eat those boat people too.
01:50:22 --> 01:50:23 [UNKNOWN]: I wouldn't, that's your sister.
01:50:24 --> 01:50:25 [UNKNOWN]: Who's your sister?
01:50:25 --> 01:50:28 [UNKNOWN]: I don't, when will you see her before we talk about it?
01:50:28 --> 01:50:36 [UNKNOWN]: But then here's the question, if the dragons have the smell thing we were talking about earlier, shouldn't she be, be like, oh, smells like you?
01:50:38 --> 01:50:40 [UNKNOWN]: Not in the middle of the battle.
01:50:41 --> 01:50:46 [UNKNOWN]: Or to sheepy, just not, sheepy can't smell beyond that underbite.
01:50:47 --> 01:50:48 [UNKNOWN]: Not in the middle of the fire.
01:50:48 --> 01:50:50 [UNKNOWN]: Nah, I'm not the underbite.
01:50:50 --> 01:50:51 [UNKNOWN]: Nah, nah, nah, nah.
01:50:51 --> 01:50:52 [UNKNOWN]: I'm not going to do sheepy like that.
01:50:52 --> 01:50:55 [UNKNOWN]: She becomes smell just like everybody else can smell every dragon.
01:50:55 --> 01:50:57 [UNKNOWN]: Nah, nah, nah, nah, we're not going to put sheepy as a non-smaller.
01:50:57 --> 01:51:09 [UNKNOWN]: Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah
01:51:09 --> 01:51:15 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, you think, like, someone was saying, I'm going to say a modification of something I saw someone share from social media.
01:51:15 --> 01:51:18 [UNKNOWN]: Sorry, I don't forget who I forget who you credit.
01:51:18 --> 01:51:21 [UNKNOWN]: But it's kind of like, a rena...
01:51:23 --> 01:51:35 [UNKNOWN]: got like a pivotal rescue from the fighting circuit, a traumatized dog, and then took it to the dog park and let it off the leash, like the dog does not know how to deal with other dogs right now.
01:51:35 --> 01:51:39 [UNKNOWN]: You got to work on that and face this.
01:51:39 --> 01:51:44 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, yes, yes, just really like, what are we doing?
01:51:45 --> 01:51:46 [UNKNOWN]: What are we doing, kids?
01:51:47 --> 01:51:48 [UNKNOWN]: The kids are not all right.
01:51:49 --> 01:51:51 [UNKNOWN]: We need to follow out, it's going to be for Rayna.
01:51:54 --> 01:51:55 [UNKNOWN]: I think she has to run.
01:51:57 --> 01:51:59 [UNKNOWN]: Well, I think she has to run.
01:51:59 --> 01:52:00 [UNKNOWN]: I think she has to run.
01:52:01 --> 01:52:02 [UNKNOWN]: I think she has to run.
01:52:02 --> 01:52:04 [UNKNOWN]: She can't, she can't go to Raynara.
01:52:05 --> 01:52:06 [UNKNOWN]: She can't go home.
01:52:06 --> 01:52:07 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I just kill.
01:52:07 --> 01:52:08 [UNKNOWN]: Well, she didn't kill.
01:52:09 --> 01:52:09 [UNKNOWN]: She didn't.
01:52:09 --> 01:52:10 [UNKNOWN]: No, she didn't.
01:52:10 --> 01:52:11 [UNKNOWN]: She definitely didn't help.
01:52:12 --> 01:52:12 [UNKNOWN]: Exactly.
01:52:12 --> 01:52:13 [UNKNOWN]: She made it worse.
01:52:14 --> 01:52:14 [UNKNOWN]: She made it worse.
01:52:15 --> 01:52:17 [UNKNOWN]: And I don't think she can go home.
01:52:18 --> 01:52:22 [UNKNOWN]: Maybe she can go, you know, far her dad.
01:52:24 --> 01:52:43 [UNKNOWN]: But yeah, she's got to put it in that side of the discussion and talk about that more in the book's boiler section because obviously we know where hers and another character story goes and we might have some indications of how they're going to be combining them exactly.
01:52:44 --> 01:52:48 [UNKNOWN]: Um, all right, let's check in with the the current dragon tally.
01:52:49 --> 01:52:56 [UNKNOWN]: We've still got, okay, so green team green, they've got Vega, which is the biggest, yeah, for you on that.
01:52:57 --> 01:53:00 [UNKNOWN]: And we've see they've got Tissari and coming Darren's dragon.
01:53:02 --> 01:53:03 [UNKNOWN]: So they will have two dragons.
01:53:04 --> 01:53:08 [UNKNOWN]: They have dream fire that's just sitting there unused.
01:53:09 --> 01:53:10 [UNKNOWN]: Honestly, that is the same in the book.
01:53:11 --> 01:53:15 [UNKNOWN]: And then, yeah, sunfire assumed dead.
01:53:16 --> 01:53:19 [UNKNOWN]: So basically, they've got Vagar into Sarian.
01:53:20 --> 01:53:39 [UNKNOWN]: team black still definitely in the lead dragon wise like we they've lost our ex Lucerus is dragon and obviously Lucerus on a mid lease with rainys and remarks with chase Iris so they've lost three dragons but they still have Syrax, Reneira's dragon,
01:53:43 --> 01:53:44 [UNKNOWN]: Moon dancer, Baila's dragon.
01:53:45 --> 01:53:46 [UNKNOWN]: Now we've got sheep stealer in the fold.
01:53:47 --> 01:53:47 [UNKNOWN]: Maybe.
01:53:47 --> 01:53:50 [UNKNOWN]: I mean yeah.
01:53:51 --> 01:53:56 [UNKNOWN]: Seesmoke, Adam's dragon, Vermithor with hue and silver wing with all.
01:53:57 --> 01:54:06 [UNKNOWN]: And I mean there's, we there's the two baby dragons with Veneres, younger sons, a storm cloud with Aegon and Terexis with Joffrey, but they're too small.
01:54:06 --> 01:54:07 [UNKNOWN]: We can't count them yet.
01:54:07 --> 01:54:08 [UNKNOWN]: They're babies.
01:54:12 --> 01:54:18 [UNKNOWN]: And we won't speculate on how that stays, but you can imagine the war is not over.
01:54:18 --> 01:54:20 [UNKNOWN]: We've got two more seasons.
01:54:20 --> 01:54:21 [UNKNOWN]: Just got started.
01:54:23 --> 01:54:32 [UNKNOWN]: We know within, I mean, not within this show, but we know by the time of a night of the seven kingdoms, all the dragons are gone.
01:54:32 --> 01:54:33 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, go on.
01:54:33 --> 01:54:35 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:54:35 --> 01:54:37 [UNKNOWN]: More dragon casualties incoming.
01:54:37 --> 01:54:37 [UNKNOWN]: Sure.
01:54:37 --> 01:54:38 [UNKNOWN]: Unfortunately.
01:54:39 --> 01:54:39 [UNKNOWN]: Unfortunately.
01:54:39 --> 01:54:40 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:54:40 --> 01:54:41 [UNKNOWN]: Unfortunately.
01:54:41 --> 01:54:49 [UNKNOWN]: I could deal with Jace, I could deal with that, but to see the dragons go down, man.
01:54:50 --> 01:54:50 [UNKNOWN]: Mmm.
01:54:51 --> 01:54:51 [UNKNOWN]: That's tough.
01:54:53 --> 01:54:57 [UNKNOWN]: I could see the Jace's, but guess tough to see the dragon go.
01:55:00 --> 01:55:13 [UNKNOWN]: All right, let's take one final break here and when we come back, we're going to check in on the community thoughts about this episode and share our own final thoughts and then after the final outro, there will be as we said, the book spoiler section.
01:55:13 --> 01:55:15 [UNKNOWN]: So see you in just a moment.
01:55:33 --> 01:55:46 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you again to Hand of the Pod Nancy for collating this feedback if you want your own thoughts included in future episodes, please send your emails to hotd at thelarhounds.com.
01:55:47 --> 01:55:51 [UNKNOWN]: And Nancy will collect it, uh, do also check out our discord.
01:55:51 --> 01:55:59 [UNKNOWN]: You'll find that in the link tree in the show notes where we have a dedicated forum for House of the Dragon with spoiler chats per episode.
01:55:59 --> 01:56:02 [UNKNOWN]: So you can jump in wherever you happen to be in your watch.
01:56:04 --> 01:56:15 [UNKNOWN]: Um, okay, so we, let's start with, we got a voicemail from dopamini, and I haven't listened to it yet, but the title is Sheep Steyler.
01:56:16 --> 01:56:18 [UNKNOWN]: So let's see what dopamini has to say about Sheep Steyler.
01:56:21 --> 01:56:29 [UNKNOWN]: Hey yo, I am sending you a raven to share some thoughts about sheepsealer.
01:56:30 --> 01:56:35 [UNKNOWN]: I absolutely love his design and I was so offended when I heard on
01:56:36 --> 01:56:43 [UNKNOWN]: Another podcast they described him as derpy and like a dumb dumb because of how he looks.
01:56:43 --> 01:56:47 [UNKNOWN]: And I just think he looks absolutely perfect.
01:56:50 --> 01:56:58 [UNKNOWN]: He reminds me of a deep sea creature from like the midnight zone where they never see sun.
01:56:58 --> 01:57:02 [UNKNOWN]: And I've watched a lot of the behind the scenes, things,
01:57:02 --> 01:57:09 [UNKNOWN]: where they talk about the influence and design of the various dragons.
01:57:09 --> 01:57:27 [UNKNOWN]: And like for example, I know that Syrax was inspired by a bird of prey, specifically an eagle, and there's obviously a lot of reptilian influence in the design of some of the other dragons.
01:57:29 --> 01:57:34 [UNKNOWN]: you know, sheepsealer is just totally his own thing.
01:57:36 --> 01:57:39 [UNKNOWN]: And I mean, we've got this modeled skin.
01:57:40 --> 01:57:41 [UNKNOWN]: We've got the under bite.
01:57:42 --> 01:57:47 [UNKNOWN]: We've got all these crazy spikes, the teeth that jut backwards.
01:57:48 --> 01:57:59 [UNKNOWN]: I thought that it was just a perfect and beautiful, visual representation that we're dealing with a different kind of dragon here.
01:57:59 --> 01:58:03 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, he has been hanging out in the veil.
01:58:04 --> 01:58:28 [UNKNOWN]: like away from other dragons, which seems to be a very deliberate choice, and so I think it all just shows us that the claiming of him and the writing of him is going to be a very different experience from what we've seen with the other dragons, and
01:58:30 --> 01:58:41 [UNKNOWN]: You know, I wouldn't judge who sheep stealer can be based on this one experience that we saw of him writing.
01:58:41 --> 01:58:57 [UNKNOWN]: I think he was probably really scared, like I said, it seems like he's intentionally alone being where he is, at least in the show, and you know, so he was probably just terrified
01:59:00 --> 01:59:09 [UNKNOWN]: eros and fire and other dragons and all of this when the first time having somebody ride him.
01:59:10 --> 01:59:13 [UNKNOWN]: I also am really curious what you guys think.
01:59:13 --> 01:59:14 [UNKNOWN]: I thought it was so
01:59:16 --> 01:59:33 [UNKNOWN]: To me, bizarre when Rana started singing the song, we've heard Damon sing and we've heard the dragonkeeper sing in Hyville, Rianne, as part of her claiming of sheep sealer, again, a wild dragon.
01:59:35 --> 01:59:40 [UNKNOWN]: Why do we think that Hyville, Rianne is going to work
01:59:43 --> 01:59:53 [UNKNOWN]: Like, do they just under, like, is there some sort of lore that the dragons just automatically understand how the Larian
01:59:54 --> 02:00:06 [UNKNOWN]: I don't recall this, it's so bizarre to me, and especially considering that we've seen egg on on sunfire using the common tongue.
02:00:08 --> 02:00:19 [UNKNOWN]: So I'd be really curious to hear what you guys think of that, but I am so stoked to see sheep sealer in the mix, and I'm really curious.
02:00:20 --> 02:00:26 [UNKNOWN]: what is to come for his story as well as Reina's story as a Dragon Rider.
02:00:28 --> 02:00:44 [UNKNOWN]: And I'll say, don't put me any road enough to that to say, I forgot to say that I wonder if the deep sea was an inspiration for his design, small thing, but yeah, I hope we get one of HBOs little behind the scene specials on Cheap Stealer and the inspirations for this look beyond the book description at some point.
02:00:44 --> 02:00:57 [UNKNOWN]: And yeah, I love, I love also like the audio engineers talking about how they make up the Dragon Roars and things like that, like there are people working on this show who really care about the dragons and it's just, yes.
02:00:58 --> 02:01:01 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you for the voicemail, that's awesome.
02:01:02 --> 02:01:05 [UNKNOWN]: Insight, because I love how Sheepie looks.
02:01:05 --> 02:01:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah.
02:01:08 --> 02:01:16 [UNKNOWN]: Sheepie is so dragging me, and I think that is really cool, though, the way the spikes get out.
02:01:19 --> 02:01:33 [UNKNOWN]: the teeth, just so benesign, and yet, you know, you see this peacefulness also, I really, really dig the desire to sheepy.
02:01:34 --> 02:01:38 [UNKNOWN]: And then, um, I think they do respond to the high
02:01:48 --> 02:01:51 [UNKNOWN]: because of how they were created, no?
02:01:52 --> 02:01:54 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I don't want to exist.
02:01:54 --> 02:02:01 [UNKNOWN]: I guess I'm less than thinking like that the dragons have this magical knowledge and more that like humans just like to think that.
02:02:02 --> 02:02:09 [UNKNOWN]: But I think the other dragons have been had high malaria and shouted at them since they were hatched, and sheep still are not.
02:02:10 --> 02:02:12 [UNKNOWN]: I think I think it was magic in it.
02:02:13 --> 02:02:14 [UNKNOWN]: I could be wrong.
02:02:14 --> 02:02:14 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
02:02:14 --> 02:02:15 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
02:02:15 --> 02:02:16 [UNKNOWN]: No, I know.
02:02:16 --> 02:02:21 [UNKNOWN]: We always have this debate, you and I, um, Ram Lank, you're like, get your science out of my magic.
02:02:21 --> 02:02:22 [UNKNOWN]: You're not.
02:02:23 --> 02:02:32 [UNKNOWN]: But I think there is magic in how the dragons were created and the high Valerian was the language of the magic.
02:02:33 --> 02:02:33 [UNKNOWN]: Hmm.
02:02:34 --> 02:02:35 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
02:02:36 --> 02:02:38 [UNKNOWN]: Do you want to walk us through the other sheep stealer feedback?
02:02:39 --> 02:02:44 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, so we have a message from Rocky Zim from our discord.
02:02:45 --> 02:02:46 [UNKNOWN]: I like sheep's dealer.
02:02:47 --> 02:02:51 [UNKNOWN]: It was not a good idea for a rain that to go to battle without knowing how to control the dragon.
02:02:52 --> 02:02:53 [UNKNOWN]: And I think that was the point.
02:02:54 --> 02:02:58 [UNKNOWN]: Sheep's dealer is free and doesn't have a side yet.
02:03:00 --> 02:03:04 [UNKNOWN]: I guess he's on Reina's side ostensibly.
02:03:04 --> 02:03:09 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, he doesn't want to eat Reina, so that's a step.
02:03:09 --> 02:03:10 [UNKNOWN]: Right, direction.
02:03:10 --> 02:03:12 [UNKNOWN]: He's feeding Reina.
02:03:12 --> 02:03:15 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, he's feeding Reina, it's a baby bird.
02:03:18 --> 02:03:32 [UNKNOWN]: people been saying it's like it is true it's like when your cat brings you a dead bird you're like oh thank you for that but except Reina was actually hungry yes exactly and she put that for her.
02:03:32 --> 02:03:44 [UNKNOWN]: yeah my cats have never cooked me Craig it's like they don't even love me like I know you don't eat raw so here medium well he's cooking for himself too
02:03:44 --> 02:03:45 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's true, too.
02:03:45 --> 02:03:46 [UNKNOWN]: He's cooked for himself, too.
02:03:46 --> 02:03:47 [UNKNOWN]: That's true.
02:03:47 --> 02:03:48 [UNKNOWN]: He's like, I like it chart and crispy.
02:03:50 --> 02:03:53 [UNKNOWN]: And then we have another message from Abby on our discord.
02:03:54 --> 02:03:56 [UNKNOWN]: I was not a huge fan of the whole reign of thing.
02:03:57 --> 02:03:59 [UNKNOWN]: ugly cute cat like sheeps deal with could talk.
02:03:59 --> 02:04:05 [UNKNOWN]: It would tell her I am a free dragon It will burn many indiscriminately.
02:04:05 --> 02:04:05 [UNKNOWN]: I love it.
02:04:06 --> 02:04:06 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:06 --> 02:04:07 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:07 --> 02:04:07 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:07 --> 02:04:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:09 --> 02:04:10 [UNKNOWN]: Indiscriminately.
02:04:10 --> 02:04:11 [UNKNOWN]: You get some fire.
02:04:12 --> 02:04:13 [UNKNOWN]: You get some fire.
02:04:13 --> 02:04:14 [UNKNOWN]: Fire for everyone.
02:04:15 --> 02:04:17 [UNKNOWN]: Everybody gets the fire.
02:04:17 --> 02:04:18 [UNKNOWN]: I love it.
02:04:18 --> 02:04:18 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:19 --> 02:04:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:19 --> 02:04:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:19 --> 02:04:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:19 --> 02:04:20 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:04:21 --> 02:04:27 [UNKNOWN]: Uh, um, I'll just pop him with a general feedback from Ken W. via email.
02:04:27 --> 02:04:28 [UNKNOWN]: Wow.
02:04:28 --> 02:04:30 [UNKNOWN]: Let the kids rain fire.
02:04:30 --> 02:04:31 [UNKNOWN]: What the hell wrong?
02:04:34 --> 02:04:43 [UNKNOWN]: We also have a message from Peter O. H. Um, sheep still a scenes pretty generous with his possessions, but unfortunately not a great listener.
02:04:44 --> 02:04:45 [UNKNOWN]: How wild is he?
02:04:46 --> 02:04:47 [UNKNOWN]: Did he have a previous writer?
02:04:48 --> 02:04:48 [UNKNOWN]: No.
02:04:49 --> 02:04:50 [UNKNOWN]: All the way wild.
02:04:50 --> 02:04:50 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:04:51 --> 02:04:51 [UNKNOWN]: The wild.
02:04:51 --> 02:04:56 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, so there are in the book, there's three wild dragons.
02:04:58 --> 02:05:02 [UNKNOWN]: I think this might be the only one we really see.
02:05:02 --> 02:05:03 [UNKNOWN]: There's a rumor.
02:05:03 --> 02:05:05 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, wait, we got a glimpse of cannibal, didn't we?
02:05:05 --> 02:05:06 [UNKNOWN]: Or no, that was Vermithor.
02:05:08 --> 02:05:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:05:08 --> 02:05:08 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:05:09 --> 02:05:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:05:10 --> 02:05:15 [UNKNOWN]: But yeah, anyway, she, she'd, she'd still are definitely never had a writer before.
02:05:15 --> 02:05:23 [UNKNOWN]: So good for Reina, for breaking through to this dragon who's never bonded with a human, that's a huge deal.
02:05:23 --> 02:05:28 [UNKNOWN]: But yeah, take it one step at a time, in that case, especially.
02:05:29 --> 02:05:29 [UNKNOWN]: No.
02:05:31 --> 02:05:35 [UNKNOWN]: Abby also said, I feel overall ambivalent about this episode.
02:05:35 --> 02:05:39 [UNKNOWN]: Maybe I even skipped some of the fighting folks who love battle will love it.
02:05:39 --> 02:05:45 [UNKNOWN]: And I'll say, yeah, I am also someone, yeah, I'm more into usually the character moments than the battles.
02:05:46 --> 02:05:57 [UNKNOWN]: So I appreciate the battle side, but I, there's a high likely who did a different episode this season will be my favorite that just has more, uh, more grounded character drama.
02:05:57 --> 02:05:58 [UNKNOWN]: You know, no.
02:06:00 --> 02:06:05 [UNKNOWN]: And Ayas Sadai says, I cannot deny that this episode looked incredible.
02:06:05 --> 02:06:10 [UNKNOWN]: They've been promising this at the started season and it's delivered from a pure spectacle standpoint.
02:06:11 --> 02:06:13 [UNKNOWN]: I've never been more grateful for having a big TV.
02:06:14 --> 02:06:20 [UNKNOWN]: The details were so clear on the ships and on the dragons, it was never confusing as to what was going on.
02:06:20 --> 02:06:27 [UNKNOWN]: Again, shout out to them for doing this in the daytime because you couldn't hide any bad CGI under cover of Darkness.
02:06:27 --> 02:06:27 [UNKNOWN]: Good plan.
02:06:28 --> 02:06:37 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I loved that the triarchy ships look totally different from Western rosy ships, the sales, the prow, the decks, and everything.
02:06:37 --> 02:06:38 [UNKNOWN]: I love ships.
02:06:39 --> 02:06:42 [UNKNOWN]: I wonder if others didn't care for this, but I love it.
02:06:42 --> 02:06:44 [UNKNOWN]: Nah, we love it too.
02:06:44 --> 02:06:52 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, ramen, jawati is killing it yet again with the music in the battle scene where we first see the season eight.
02:06:52 --> 02:06:52 [UNKNOWN]: So.
02:06:53 --> 02:06:56 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I can sign on with all of that.
02:06:56 --> 02:06:59 [UNKNOWN]: So all of the looks fantastic as I say.
02:06:59 --> 02:07:02 [UNKNOWN]: And I didn't credit the music, so I'm glad she did.
02:07:02 --> 02:07:02 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:07:04 --> 02:07:07 [UNKNOWN]: So we have, but you have to say about Renera.
02:07:08 --> 02:07:10 [UNKNOWN]: So this is from I.
02:07:10 --> 02:07:10 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, said that.
02:07:11 --> 02:07:15 [UNKNOWN]: I hate that Renera was sideline by being locked at her room.
02:07:16 --> 02:07:19 [UNKNOWN]: I can watch Emma Darcy do their thing all day long.
02:07:19 --> 02:07:22 [UNKNOWN]: I had such a hard time connecting with the characters in their motivation.
02:07:23 --> 02:07:31 [UNKNOWN]: Other than adolescence continued despair at this latest wrinkle, and Reinaura's frustration would be entreated, like again, like a woman.
02:07:32 --> 02:07:34 [UNKNOWN]: I love the dress shedding scene.
02:07:35 --> 02:07:36 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, frustration.
02:07:36 --> 02:07:40 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, she's like, you will not put me in the female trepings.
02:07:40 --> 02:07:41 [UNKNOWN]: I have a battle queen.
02:07:43 --> 02:07:46 [UNKNOWN]: But it's a theory, yeah, yeah.
02:07:48 --> 02:07:54 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's intentional, it's meant to make us feel the feelings, but still, it's just like, yeah.
02:07:58 --> 02:08:11 [UNKNOWN]: And I, yes, that I continue about low-harren corollus, I absolutely loved the chase between them tense and exciting to me anyway, and once again showing the futility of pursuing revenge, both low-harren and Allen.
02:08:12 --> 02:08:18 [UNKNOWN]: Starting with this battle, had for me the effect of sitting back and enjoying the action, but having no deep emotions about any of it.
02:08:19 --> 02:08:26 [UNKNOWN]: If you had fallen prey to their marketing from season two, and picked aside, maybe you would have experienced some victorious joy.
02:08:27 --> 02:08:34 [UNKNOWN]: But there I was willing low-heart to win and do more damage to Cornelius in that part of the story, which I don't think I was supposed to think.
02:08:35 --> 02:08:42 [UNKNOWN]: They did a great job humanizing low-harr in their introduction last season and what a treat to see Abigail Thorne in this role.
02:08:43 --> 02:08:51 [UNKNOWN]: So perhaps low-har is sympathetic, but then am I supposed to now be like, oh well, back-to-team black now that low-har is dead, unsatisfying.
02:08:51 --> 02:08:53 [UNKNOWN]: This might be an unpopular take.
02:08:53 --> 02:08:58 [UNKNOWN]: It's just hard because this is not something that Game of Thrones suffered from in the early seasons.
02:08:58 --> 02:09:02 [UNKNOWN]: Anyway, I'm team black with a soft spot for tragic Allison.
02:09:02 --> 02:09:02 [UNKNOWN]: Always.
02:09:03 --> 02:09:03 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:09:05 --> 02:09:06 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I feel you.
02:09:06 --> 02:09:13 [UNKNOWN]: I feel like there is a lot of, uh, I, I don't know that you agree, but I know a lot of team black or like asterix, but poor Allison show Allison.
02:09:14 --> 02:09:15 [UNKNOWN]: What do you mean?
02:09:17 --> 02:09:17 [UNKNOWN]: What do you mean?
02:09:17 --> 02:09:18 [UNKNOWN]: What do you mean?
02:09:18 --> 02:09:21 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, like you have no sympathy for her, you do.
02:09:22 --> 02:09:22 [UNKNOWN]: You're six.
02:09:22 --> 02:09:26 [UNKNOWN]: No, I do, I have expressed it this episode.
02:09:26 --> 02:09:28 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, you're saying I'm not being fair by saying you do this.
02:09:29 --> 02:09:29 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:09:29 --> 02:09:30 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, okay, fair for fair.
02:09:30 --> 02:09:32 [UNKNOWN]: I told you I'm trying to be...
02:09:32 --> 02:09:34 [UNKNOWN]: I'm trying to tell you.
02:09:34 --> 02:09:34 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:09:34 --> 02:09:35 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:09:35 --> 02:09:35 [UNKNOWN]: Greenly.
02:09:38 --> 02:09:48 [UNKNOWN]: We got a message from Davey Mac, one aspect I really liked about this episode is characters making decisions based on imperfect or delayed information.
02:09:49 --> 02:09:56 [UNKNOWN]: What you know to be true, one minute is no longer true by the time you've written out a letter, sealed it, and sent it on his way.
02:09:57 --> 02:10:00 [UNKNOWN]: And characters are also waiting for orders that may or may not come.
02:10:01 --> 02:10:01 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:10:01 --> 02:10:01 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:10:03 --> 02:10:04 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's a good point.
02:10:04 --> 02:10:08 [UNKNOWN]: There was, I mean, I made the waiting for Gado joke, but it really does show.
02:10:08 --> 02:10:13 [UNKNOWN]: I do think that a lot of wars is just waiting around for somebody to tell you what to do.
02:10:15 --> 02:10:16 [UNKNOWN]: Where are we going to go now?
02:10:16 --> 02:10:17 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:10:19 --> 02:10:20 [UNKNOWN]: Um, okay.
02:10:20 --> 02:10:33 [UNKNOWN]: So Marilyn, who Marilyn does not watch the show because we have something called the Pokela scale, which is like where on emotional and physical violence does his rank, and this is obviously at the top.
02:10:33 --> 02:10:36 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but she is very interested in the lore.
02:10:36 --> 02:10:44 [UNKNOWN]: So she has read the original books, uh, the Game of Thrones, you know, in that the song of Ice and Fire Books, um, and follows along.
02:10:44 --> 02:10:44 [UNKNOWN]: And, um,
02:10:45 --> 02:10:47 [UNKNOWN]: reads also media about the show.
02:10:47 --> 02:10:52 [UNKNOWN]: So she shared this, she showed this recap from the New York Times.
02:10:53 --> 02:11:01 [UNKNOWN]: And she said, there's a New York Times review of the opening episode that mentions Alice Rivers and a figure that sounds suspiciously like the horned one.
02:11:02 --> 02:11:06 [UNKNOWN]: And thank you to Nancy for including a little clip about that in here.
02:11:06 --> 02:11:22 [UNKNOWN]: in the article says, at their camp, they receive a cryptic visit from Black Alice Rivers, Gail, Rankin, the self-professed witch who be deviled, Damon last season, accompanied by a Black Philip type goat and a strange ant-flared humanoid.
02:11:22 --> 02:11:24 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know what that is either, man.
02:11:24 --> 02:11:26 [UNKNOWN]: That's coming from the New York Times.
02:11:26 --> 02:11:27 [UNKNOWN]: We actually do know what that is a bit.
02:11:29 --> 02:11:31 [UNKNOWN]: Um, the Maryland continues.
02:11:31 --> 02:11:40 [UNKNOWN]: Well, it sounds as though the show is going with the traditional medieval view of, which is as evil or the very least, bringers of, uh, dissension who enjoy stirring up people.
02:11:41 --> 02:11:50 [UNKNOWN]: And I, I pushed back on that part when we were discussing it because, um, again, Maryland's not watching this is based on the description, the second video description.
02:11:50 --> 02:11:51 [UNKNOWN]: But I think,
02:11:52 --> 02:11:58 [UNKNOWN]: I honestly think Alice is one of the more moral characters in this show, I said that earlier, but I stand by it.
02:11:59 --> 02:12:03 [UNKNOWN]: I think that she is one of the characters that we see.
02:12:03 --> 02:12:11 [UNKNOWN]: There is a trope in this series or in this world in general, where there are the characters who have visions of the future.
02:12:11 --> 02:12:16 [UNKNOWN]: And maybe this is just basically an allegory, people who look ahead at the long-term
02:12:20 --> 02:12:21 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, they're thinking bigger picture.
02:12:21 --> 02:12:23 [UNKNOWN]: They're less petty, I suppose.
02:12:24 --> 02:12:26 [UNKNOWN]: And so we do see her last season.
02:12:26 --> 02:12:29 [UNKNOWN]: I think she helped Damon a lot.
02:12:31 --> 02:12:32 [UNKNOWN]: So we'll see where it goes from here.
02:12:35 --> 02:12:42 [UNKNOWN]: Marilyn continues, I definitely had the impression that Alice was enjoying displaying her power because it made the men uncomfortable to be in the presence of a woman with power.
02:12:43 --> 02:12:46 [UNKNOWN]: I also had the impression that she enjoys using her power tremendously.
02:12:46 --> 02:12:49 [UNKNOWN]: This, of course, is now the good-ner-bad or trait in and of itself.
02:12:49 --> 02:12:52 [UNKNOWN]: Anyhow, I won't disagree with that.
02:12:52 --> 02:13:00 [UNKNOWN]: She says, mockery is also a fairly common trait for witches in this context, interesting that she should bring both a black male goat and the horned one figure.
02:13:02 --> 02:13:10 [UNKNOWN]: A lot of people think that she somehow shapeshifts into the goat because we also saw that goat last season wandering her hair and haul.
02:13:10 --> 02:13:10 [UNKNOWN]: So what do you think?
02:13:10 --> 02:13:11 [UNKNOWN]: That's what I thought.
02:13:11 --> 02:13:12 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:13:12 --> 02:13:12 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:13:12 --> 02:13:13 [UNKNOWN]: That's what I thought.
02:13:14 --> 02:13:15 [UNKNOWN]: Could be.
02:13:15 --> 02:13:15 [UNKNOWN]: Could be.
02:13:15 --> 02:13:17 [UNKNOWN]: And we've never seen her in the goat together, right?
02:13:21 --> 02:13:23 [UNKNOWN]: Could also be her working into the goat.
02:13:24 --> 02:13:34 [UNKNOWN]: But Marilyn says Medievaly speaking black goats were strongly associated with women in evil witchcraft kissing the goat was a term for women who decided to give themselves over to evil magic.
02:13:35 --> 02:13:40 [UNKNOWN]: Because yeah, this is a leash interjecting that it's often, there's a satanic link.
02:13:40 --> 02:13:42 [UNKNOWN]: We've talked about that with Marvel stuff.
02:13:42 --> 02:13:42 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:13:43 --> 02:13:46 [UNKNOWN]: Um, Maryland says I really wish I could have seen some images of the horn.
02:13:46 --> 02:13:48 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, we did show Maryland some images.
02:13:49 --> 02:13:50 [UNKNOWN]: Um, yeah, okay.
02:13:50 --> 02:13:53 [UNKNOWN]: Well, we'll get back to what the horned one is.
02:13:53 --> 02:13:58 [UNKNOWN]: Um, but indeed, as Maryland says he's associated, we did the horned one.
02:13:58 --> 02:13:59 [UNKNOWN]: Sorry, the green man.
02:14:00 --> 02:14:06 [UNKNOWN]: who is honed, associated with Westeros, lower in the island of the pact was made between the first humans and children of the forest.
02:14:06 --> 02:14:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, we'll do a little lured eye for that in a second.
02:14:10 --> 02:14:18 [UNKNOWN]: She says there's a strong sense of guardianship about the horned one, particularly guardians of the forest, but also a great deal of what we might call wild magic.
02:14:18 --> 02:14:20 [UNKNOWN]: And I think that definitely applies here.
02:14:21 --> 02:14:25 [UNKNOWN]: She says, in some versions, he likes nothing better than a good bloody battle.
02:14:25 --> 02:14:27 [UNKNOWN]: In other versions, he is more of a protector image.
02:14:28 --> 02:14:32 [UNKNOWN]: Perhaps he came along with Alice to make certain that she would not be assaulted in a large camp.
02:14:33 --> 02:14:35 [UNKNOWN]: No, so it wasn't a large camp of men, Marilyn.
02:14:35 --> 02:14:36 [UNKNOWN]: It was only three of them.
02:14:36 --> 02:14:41 [UNKNOWN]: And I think he came with Alice to help her spook them away from the style of faces.
02:14:41 --> 02:14:42 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:14:44 --> 02:14:46 [UNKNOWN]: She said, I believe the green men are considered good.
02:14:46 --> 02:14:53 [UNKNOWN]: There's a range of ways in which they have been interpreted when I said that in medieval images were essentially evil.
02:14:53 --> 02:14:59 [UNKNOWN]: I did not necessarily mean that they were intended to be presenting Alice in the green men as evil in the series.
02:14:59 --> 02:15:06 [UNKNOWN]: She's certainly uncanny and I don't think anybody feels particularly comfortable around her with the possible exception of Damon.
02:15:06 --> 02:15:06 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
02:15:06 --> 02:15:08 [UNKNOWN]: She freaked Damon out last year.
02:15:08 --> 02:15:09 [UNKNOWN]: I think so too.
02:15:09 --> 02:15:09 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:15:11 --> 02:15:13 [UNKNOWN]: It probably is more comfortable around her than most people.
02:15:13 --> 02:15:14 [UNKNOWN]: They're most people.
02:15:14 --> 02:15:15 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:15:16 --> 02:15:22 [UNKNOWN]: At the same time, Marilyn says, I'm afraid that my limited exposure to Damon does not lead me to consider him to be a particularly good character.
02:15:22 --> 02:15:28 [UNKNOWN]: So the fact that Alice is helping him out doesn't necessarily endure him or her to me as well.
02:15:28 --> 02:15:34 [UNKNOWN]: It could be that she is playing a longer game of trying to bring about his downfall, though I really don't know why.
02:15:35 --> 02:15:38 [UNKNOWN]: As I say, I'm pretty ignorant of all the threats for this series.
02:15:38 --> 02:15:41 [UNKNOWN]: I was a bit easier with Game of Thrones as I read this book.
02:15:41 --> 02:15:42 [UNKNOWN]: So say about
02:15:45 --> 02:15:46 [UNKNOWN]: about her with Damon.
02:15:46 --> 02:16:06 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I said it earlier, and I think I do think she's thinking long-term, and so I don't necessarily think she's 100% on Damon's side per se, but more she knows that team Black needs to do well at the moment for the long-term vision of escaping eventually the
02:16:12 --> 02:16:39 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, the green men are something that really interests me and also it's oddly enough, I recently was on the house of the dragon bald move podcast with Anthony talking about these green men in the aisle of faces because we talked about a brand chapter from a storm of swords where Mira and Jojan tell brand about this this story of the night of the laughing tree.
02:16:40 --> 02:16:46 [UNKNOWN]: which is whether a crannog man from their marshy place visited the green men.
02:16:47 --> 02:17:00 [UNKNOWN]: So I will put a link to that in the show notes because we do go a bit more into speculating about this green men lore, but just quickly, this is one of the most mysterious things in the lore.
02:17:01 --> 02:17:04 [UNKNOWN]: The book makes it ambiguous whether it's the
02:17:05 --> 02:17:09 [UNKNOWN]: whether it's humans dressed up or whether it's something else.
02:17:10 --> 02:17:11 [UNKNOWN]: It's not quite human.
02:17:11 --> 02:17:24 [UNKNOWN]: And here, we get this clear view where we see this sort of satire figure with the goat legs, but also with the sort of tree bark skin and antlers definitely not human.
02:17:25 --> 02:17:34 [UNKNOWN]: Just to quote the wiki on this, some nursery tails claim that they are horned and have dark green skin, according to old man, the green men ride elx, and sometimes have antlers.
02:17:35 --> 02:17:39 [UNKNOWN]: Most maesters believe their clothes are green, and they wear headdresses with horns.
02:17:39 --> 02:17:43 [UNKNOWN]: So it's interesting they take aside, and I wonder how George R. Martin feels about this?
02:17:44 --> 02:18:00 [UNKNOWN]: But basically, as Marilyn was saying, they are a sacred order entrusted with the guardianship of this Isle of Faces Island, where we saw the three dragon seeds, this episode, and this was indeed where there was a hard fought peace.
02:18:00 --> 02:18:04 [UNKNOWN]: Packed, made between the first men and the children of the forest.
02:18:05 --> 02:18:22 [UNKNOWN]: So the children of the forest were originally in Westeros and then the first men came, they fought with the children of the forest, and then they made this pact where they decided the first men would get the clear lands, but they were not allowed to cut down any more trees, and then the children got the forest that were left.
02:18:23 --> 02:18:46 [UNKNOWN]: But then the Andals came and they're the ones who are mostly running things now and so they killed most of the children But it is believed some took refuge on the aisle of faces and obviously we know in Game of Thrones that there are some north of the wall as well Or at least by that time there are so there's a lot of theories that I don't know like will this show
02:18:48 --> 02:18:52 [UNKNOWN]: tell us what exactly these green men are now that we've gotten a good look.
02:18:52 --> 02:18:55 [UNKNOWN]: We got a glimpse less season and now we've gotten an even better look this time.
02:18:57 --> 02:18:58 [UNKNOWN]: There are people who think
02:18:59 --> 02:19:06 [UNKNOWN]: that they could be a hybrid of like the descendants of the first men and children of the forest mixing together.
02:19:07 --> 02:19:13 [UNKNOWN]: Now approaching this from science, I'm like, do they have the same number of chromosomes?
02:19:14 --> 02:19:15 [UNKNOWN]: And I know you're like, get out of here with that.
02:19:20 --> 02:19:28 [UNKNOWN]: But they do look like a combination of children of the forest and humans, but also with like, but also like living literal green
02:19:29 --> 02:19:30 [UNKNOWN]: Right, right.
02:19:30 --> 02:19:35 [UNKNOWN]: Like they literally pulled it from, yeah, they did this sort of Celtic lore.
02:19:37 --> 02:19:40 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know, any thoughts, Joan?
02:19:40 --> 02:19:40 [UNKNOWN]: You know what?
02:19:40 --> 02:19:41 [UNKNOWN]: I'm not sure.
02:19:43 --> 02:19:53 [UNKNOWN]: I think most of the this comes from that area from Celtic lore.
02:19:55 --> 02:19:57 [UNKNOWN]: So I would assume yes.
02:19:58 --> 02:20:10 [UNKNOWN]: Because there are so many themes that go along with what I've known of, you know, that time period from that part of the world.
02:20:10 --> 02:20:15 [UNKNOWN]: So I can only assume you know, that that is what he was going for.
02:20:15 --> 02:20:17 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that seems to be.
02:20:19 --> 02:20:24 [UNKNOWN]: Well, we're going to put a pin in the feedback there because the other bits we have are spoilery.
02:20:25 --> 02:20:31 [UNKNOWN]: So Sean, do you have any final non-book spoiler thoughts about this?
02:20:31 --> 02:20:32 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, no.
02:20:32 --> 02:20:36 [UNKNOWN]: I think thank you for the feedback.
02:20:36 --> 02:20:47 [UNKNOWN]: And yeah, one thing I will keep saying is Raina, Jason, they just proved that the kids are not all right.
02:20:50 --> 02:20:50 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:20:52 --> 02:20:52 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:20:53 --> 02:20:55 [UNKNOWN]: Well, we will be back.
02:20:55 --> 02:20:57 [UNKNOWN]: If you're leaving us now, don't worry.
02:20:57 --> 02:20:58 [UNKNOWN]: We'll be back next week.
02:20:58 --> 02:21:00 [UNKNOWN]: We don't have screeners.
02:21:00 --> 02:21:04 [UNKNOWN]: So you can expect episodes to release on Tuesdays or Wednesdays.
02:21:04 --> 02:21:10 [UNKNOWN]: It's about as fast as we can turn them around, but we promise to give you good depth for your weight.
02:21:11 --> 02:21:17 [UNKNOWN]: And of course, again, David will be taking over starting with episode three, but I'll still be setting in voicemails.
02:21:18 --> 02:21:21 [UNKNOWN]: We've got lots of other stuff going on on the network.
02:21:21 --> 02:21:26 [UNKNOWN]: Like I said, we are also doing weekly the Vampire Lestat coverage.
02:21:26 --> 02:21:31 [UNKNOWN]: And that is, I think I was thinking about it today, and it's possible.
02:21:31 --> 02:21:33 [UNKNOWN]: It's my favorite television show ever.
02:21:34 --> 02:21:36 [UNKNOWN]: Whoa, wow.
02:21:37 --> 02:21:45 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, like I was trying to think of anything that challenges it and you know, I have just said I love, but I know that's why.
02:21:45 --> 02:21:46 [UNKNOWN]: Interview with the vampire, the most.
02:21:46 --> 02:21:48 [UNKNOWN]: And I'm not like talking about,
02:21:49 --> 02:22:11 [UNKNOWN]: The books per se, although I'm enjoying rereading them now, I'm definitely not talking about that 90s movie, although I loved it at the time and had a fun time revisiting it recently, but this show, my God, the writing is, I don't know that I've ever seen better writing from the character perspective and also they do a lot with, you know, they don't have that dragon money, but they do a lot with,
02:22:12 --> 02:22:28 [UNKNOWN]: with, you know, obviously vampires are cheaper for practical effects, but the way that they edit things and they're just just the creativity from production design to, in this season is all, as a music season.
02:22:29 --> 02:22:32 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, yeah, you were familiar with Moses Somnay.
02:22:32 --> 02:22:34 [UNKNOWN]: I didn't, I wasn't familiar with him before.
02:22:34 --> 02:22:38 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, he props up as a new minor character in this season.
02:22:38 --> 02:22:40 [UNKNOWN]: It's still waiting to see where this is going,
02:22:42 --> 02:22:54 [UNKNOWN]: it's funny I want I hope so far it's it's all a stats singing this season which makes sense because that's the book plot and it's his tour but I'm like you have so many musical people in there make them all sing
02:22:56 --> 02:23:02 [UNKNOWN]: Anyway, yeah, as I said, you can check out the first two seasons of interview with the Vampire on Netflix.
02:23:03 --> 02:23:10 [UNKNOWN]: The Vampire List Dad is releasing weekly right now on AMC and we are doing weekly coverage.
02:23:11 --> 02:23:15 [UNKNOWN]: We do have screeners for that one, so that's why that comes out before these episodes.
02:23:15 --> 02:23:23 [UNKNOWN]: But if you like House of the Dragon, then you have the stomach for all of the dramatic
02:23:25 --> 02:23:31 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, all of the ups and downs of this vampire world so definitely I recommend checking it out.
02:23:31 --> 02:23:32 [UNKNOWN]: It's it's okay
02:23:33 --> 02:23:34 [UNKNOWN]: It's got some humor in it, too.
02:23:34 --> 02:23:39 [UNKNOWN]: It's a bit lighter in some ways, but then also gets deeper of like I was talking about this week's episode.
02:23:39 --> 02:23:42 [UNKNOWN]: Anyway, I'll stop talking about the Vampire of the Stat.
02:23:42 --> 02:23:42 [UNKNOWN]: For now.
02:23:44 --> 02:23:49 [UNKNOWN]: We've also got, we just David and I recently put out a disclosure day discussion.
02:23:49 --> 02:23:52 [UNKNOWN]: We've got Supergirl coming out soon.
02:23:52 --> 02:23:55 [UNKNOWN]: We're gonna go see the movie the next week or so.
02:23:55 --> 02:23:56 [UNKNOWN]: I'm playing on recording.
02:23:56 --> 02:23:57 [UNKNOWN]: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
02:23:57 --> 02:23:58 [UNKNOWN]: Can't wait for that.
02:23:59 --> 02:23:59 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:23:59 --> 02:24:04 [UNKNOWN]: And John just put out a similar alien stories episode about Doria.
02:24:04 --> 02:24:06 [UNKNOWN]: You can see the grim dark side of Tolkien.
02:24:06 --> 02:24:10 [UNKNOWN]: So if you like this, you'll probably like that side of Tolkien.
02:24:11 --> 02:24:15 [UNKNOWN]: And John's also starting at the end of July Cosmere Corner.
02:24:15 --> 02:24:28 [UNKNOWN]: It's going to be a new feed with the Brendan Sanderson books just reading through a few chapters at a time to help prep for we've now found out there's TV shows and movie coming and we're getting the whole Sanderson world.
02:24:30 --> 02:24:37 [UNKNOWN]: He and some of the guys from radioactive ramblings are We're gonna be walking all this through that.
02:24:37 --> 02:24:42 [UNKNOWN]: I even though Brendan Tennyson finished the wheel of time I've not read any of his other books, so I'm gonna finally do it.
02:24:43 --> 02:24:43 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
02:24:43 --> 02:24:44 [UNKNOWN]: I'm gonna finally do it.
02:24:44 --> 02:24:53 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and Those are also going to be there's gonna be video options to watch those John's experimenting with video.
02:24:53 --> 02:24:56 [UNKNOWN]: We'll see where we go from there, but you'll be able to see them on YouTube
02:24:57 --> 02:24:58 [UNKNOWN]: Yay!
02:24:58 --> 02:24:58 [UNKNOWN]: Yay!
02:25:01 --> 02:25:07 [UNKNOWN]: Um, so we've, yeah, my affiliate feeds have never mind the music where psychology meets music.
02:25:07 --> 02:25:10 [UNKNOWN]: We've got a new affiliate dungeons and do rags.
02:25:11 --> 02:25:13 [UNKNOWN]: Um, they are also covering house of the dragon as well.
02:25:13 --> 02:25:16 [UNKNOWN]: And they also have a video feed on YouTube.
02:25:17 --> 02:25:23 [UNKNOWN]: Um, rings and rituals come back soon to prep for the next season of rings of power.
02:25:24 --> 02:25:28 [UNKNOWN]: And, uh, silo, you can be tuning into silo.
02:25:29 --> 02:25:29 [UNKNOWN]: Absolutely.
02:25:30 --> 02:25:31 [UNKNOWN]: absolutely.
02:25:31 --> 02:25:34 [UNKNOWN]: Luke and I will be doing our usual silo coverage.
02:25:34 --> 02:25:36 [UNKNOWN]: Actually, we've already started.
02:25:37 --> 02:25:39 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, we've already started prepping for the new season.
02:25:39 --> 02:25:40 [UNKNOWN]: We have screeners.
02:25:40 --> 02:25:42 [UNKNOWN]: So we're going to be next week of that.
02:25:42 --> 02:25:45 [UNKNOWN]: July 3rd is the last episode.
02:25:45 --> 02:25:45 [UNKNOWN]: Travel mine.
02:25:45 --> 02:25:47 [UNKNOWN]: See in the first episode.
02:25:48 --> 02:25:48 [UNKNOWN]: and it's good.
02:25:49 --> 02:25:50 [UNKNOWN]: It's good.
02:25:50 --> 02:25:50 [UNKNOWN]: I'm excited.
02:25:50 --> 02:25:51 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:25:51 --> 02:25:53 [UNKNOWN]: I'm excited for this season.
02:25:53 --> 02:25:56 [UNKNOWN]: It's based on it's like the answers are going to start rolling out.
02:25:57 --> 02:25:57 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
02:25:57 --> 02:26:01 [UNKNOWN]: I love the book that it's based on, so very excited for this season of silo.
02:26:01 --> 02:26:05 [UNKNOWN]: Anyway, you can find that coverage on the separate wool shift dust feed.
02:26:06 --> 02:26:15 [UNKNOWN]: And there's also separate supercast and Patreon feeds for anyone who wants to help us out a little bit by becoming a subscriber.
02:26:15 --> 02:26:19 [UNKNOWN]: You will find their ad-free access to all of these episodes.
02:26:19 --> 02:26:23 [UNKNOWN]: Everything we cover, there's also a house of the dragon character guide.
02:26:23 --> 02:26:28 [UNKNOWN]: I will put it at the very bottom of the subscriber versions of the show notes.
02:26:28 --> 02:26:34 [UNKNOWN]: So you can find the link to that house of the dragon character guide if you are a subscriber and also get, you'll get,
02:26:35 --> 02:26:46 [UNKNOWN]: extra episodes like we did hard-boiled for a movie club last month, July is my month, it's wine month, so I'm going to be giving wine recommendations and we're going to be talking about a wine movie.
02:26:47 --> 02:26:50 [UNKNOWN]: And y'all, what is it?
02:26:50 --> 02:26:53 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, masters of the universe, soon we got to see it.
02:26:53 --> 02:26:55 [UNKNOWN]: I know where it's so busy.
02:26:56 --> 02:26:57 [UNKNOWN]: You've seen it?
02:26:57 --> 02:26:58 [UNKNOWN]: Oh no.
02:26:58 --> 02:26:59 [UNKNOWN]: Oh no.
02:27:01 --> 02:27:02 [UNKNOWN]: Is this the what you're watching?
02:27:04 --> 02:27:05 [UNKNOWN]: I got the power.
02:27:06 --> 02:27:08 [UNKNOWN]: You got the power.
02:27:09 --> 02:27:15 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, how do you compare it with the 80s one?
02:27:15 --> 02:27:17 [UNKNOWN]: Oh, man, that's tough.
02:27:18 --> 02:27:23 [UNKNOWN]: It's can't be, look, it's fun, it's fun, it's fun.
02:27:23 --> 02:27:28 [UNKNOWN]: I think if anyone was a fan of the cartoons, the animation,
02:27:29 --> 02:27:32 [UNKNOWN]: Um, you'll have a, you'll have a fun watch.
02:27:32 --> 02:27:36 [UNKNOWN]: Would I tell you to go pay upwards of $20 to see the spectacle?
02:27:38 --> 02:27:40 [UNKNOWN]: Uh, maybe not, but it's a wait for it to be honest.
02:27:40 --> 02:27:43 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but it's, but it's a, it's a fun movie.
02:27:43 --> 02:27:46 [UNKNOWN]: It's, yeah, not much to think about.
02:27:46 --> 02:27:48 [UNKNOWN]: Not much to, you know, wonder about.
02:27:48 --> 02:27:51 [UNKNOWN]: Not much to contemplate, but yeah.
02:27:52 --> 02:27:54 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, then I don't feel bad that I still haven't seen it yet.
02:27:55 --> 02:27:56 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, no, no.
02:27:56 --> 02:27:58 [UNKNOWN]: I'm going to see Toy Story in Supergirl this week.
02:27:59 --> 02:28:02 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, I think those are would be priorities over this one.
02:28:03 --> 02:28:04 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, all right.
02:28:04 --> 02:28:10 [UNKNOWN]: In my opinion, all right, we're going to do our musical thank you.
02:28:10 --> 02:28:13 [UNKNOWN]: Let's see, I pulled out of the fantasy folder.
02:28:14 --> 02:28:14 [UNKNOWN]: Enemy.
02:28:17 --> 02:28:36 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you to, first of all, to our community volunteers, our Dunedine, Pand of the Pod, Nancy, aka two kids, two dogs, captain of the Polkirum, Pudero H, keeper of the show, track her sub-zero, Moorbury and Brian 863 and moderators, Brian 863 and Aaron K.
02:28:37 --> 02:28:45 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you to our Discord server boosters Aaron K to live a thriller due to 71 Athena Agilev, Stu Nancy and Ghost Partition Radio Activ Richard and Andrean.
02:28:46 --> 02:28:57 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you to all of our listeners, you make it possible for us to keep doing this most of our subscribers, especially Laura Masters, Samarish and Michael G. Michelle E. S. C. Peter O'H.
02:28:57 --> 02:29:01 [UNKNOWN]: Nancy M. Duke's everyone, Brian 863 Frederick V. Sarah L. Garasi,
02:29:06 --> 02:29:14 [UNKNOWN]: Naurals, Kathy W. Listoo, Jeffrey Bealy, Sioux, Ben V, Scott F. Steven and Julia F. Colle S. Illmariel, Rocky Zim, Jessica A.
02:29:14 --> 02:29:17 [UNKNOWN]: Red Zippy, the TCS, Dopa Meaning.
02:29:17 --> 02:29:29 [UNKNOWN]: LNR, Mrs. Tenet, AC Wilson, E.L. W. Cassie K., Chumberrooney, Katia, Josh Liu, Peyton Pidex, Cory G. Quinch, Jenny L. Slavinator, and always last Adryon.
02:29:29 --> 02:29:30 [UNKNOWN]: All right.
02:29:30 --> 02:29:35 [UNKNOWN]: We'll be back with our spoiler discussion, Fajon.
02:29:35 --> 02:29:38 [UNKNOWN]: Do you want what do you want to say to the people who are leaving us now?
02:29:42 --> 02:29:46 [UNKNOWN]: Hey, thank you for starting this journey.
02:29:48 --> 02:29:55 [UNKNOWN]: And please, if you know a chase, pull them to the side and tell them to chill.
02:29:58 --> 02:30:00 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you for listening to the lorehounds.
02:30:00 --> 02:30:10 [UNKNOWN]: Please send any questions and feedback to lorehounds at the lorehounds.com or hotd at the lorehounds.com and check out our supercast and patreon feeds for at-free access and bonus episodes.
02:30:11 --> 02:30:16 [UNKNOWN]: Look out for all of those links including links to all other podcasts in our network in the link tree in the show notes.
02:30:17 --> 02:30:21 [UNKNOWN]: Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any
02:30:31 --> 02:30:35 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, if you're still here, we are about to break out full spoilers.
02:30:36 --> 02:30:45 [UNKNOWN]: And we're going to try to not spend too much time on this because we are running long, but let's start with we got another voicemail from Dopamine.
02:30:45 --> 02:30:50 [UNKNOWN]: This time about the characters that's missing, that's being combined in Terena, Nettles.
02:30:52 --> 02:31:09 [UNKNOWN]: Hey, I'll double mean you again, um, okay, bookstuff, so this again pertains to Reina and sheepsealer and kind of how Reina and Nettles have been folded into one character.
02:31:09 --> 02:31:18 [UNKNOWN]: Um, I think that the show actually did a really good job at setting up how
02:31:20 --> 02:31:29 [UNKNOWN]: that story is going to move forward, um, you know, so Rainiera is going to have
02:31:29 --> 02:31:36 [UNKNOWN]: some very real reasons to be just absolutely furious with Reina.
02:31:37 --> 02:31:49 [UNKNOWN]: So she obviously did all this damage, the gullet unintentionally with Sheep Stealer, Jason's dead, and she has abandoned her post with the younger children.
02:31:49 --> 02:31:51 [UNKNOWN]: I have a question.
02:31:51 --> 02:31:54 [UNKNOWN]: Are the children still en route to Penthouse?
02:31:57 --> 02:32:00 [UNKNOWN]: Specifically, remember, hearing Lady Jane Erin.
02:32:01 --> 02:32:13 [UNKNOWN]: at the end of last season say that they got a note from, she got a note from Prince Regio and the gay abandoned the ship was waiting to take them all to Pentos.
02:32:13 --> 02:32:22 [UNKNOWN]: However, I heard on another podcast that there was a secret raven that Lady Jane Erin got and the kids are actually en route to Dragonstone.
02:32:23 --> 02:32:28 [UNKNOWN]: So if you guys have any clarification there, I would be very curious to hear about it.
02:32:29 --> 02:32:41 [UNKNOWN]: In a way it kind of doesn't matter because no matter what they're going to be running in the ships and Reina is not there to protect the kids or the eggs, although what protection would she be against pirates?
02:32:43 --> 02:32:46 [UNKNOWN]: I don't really know, but at any rate, she abdicated her job.
02:32:47 --> 02:32:52 [UNKNOWN]: So Reina is going to have so many reasons to be furious with her.
02:32:53 --> 02:32:58 [UNKNOWN]: And I don't think Dragonstone is going to feel like a welcome place for her
02:32:59 --> 02:33:13 [UNKNOWN]: And, you know, we know what suspect know that Day Men is going to be coming back from the Riverlands to assist Rainier at in the taking of King's Landing pretty soon.
02:33:15 --> 02:33:19 [UNKNOWN]: And I'm thinking that would be a really good opportunity for Day Men.
02:33:21 --> 02:33:29 [UNKNOWN]: to connect with Reina and be like, look, it's not very cool for you to be staying here on Dragonstone.
02:33:30 --> 02:33:31 [UNKNOWN]: You have this dragon.
02:33:31 --> 02:33:34 [UNKNOWN]: I can teach you to red.
02:33:34 --> 02:33:35 [UNKNOWN]: I can help you with this.
02:33:35 --> 02:33:49 [UNKNOWN]: Come with me to the Riverlands and then we kind of get into the Damon Nettles Reina dynamic, potentially.
02:33:51 --> 02:33:56 [UNKNOWN]: which in the book is often described as kind of like a father-daughter relationship.
02:33:56 --> 02:34:02 [UNKNOWN]: So I think they've kind of set that up nicely And it'd be curious to hear your thoughts on that.
02:34:02 --> 02:34:14 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you guys so much for the question and your insights and for all the hard work you are doing on the podcast and I'll talk to y'all again soon.
02:34:15 --> 02:34:15 [UNKNOWN]: Take care.
02:34:15 --> 02:34:15 [UNKNOWN]: Bye.
02:34:17 --> 02:34:21 [UNKNOWN]: about the, yeah, about the, they're on their way to dragons soon.
02:34:22 --> 02:34:25 [UNKNOWN]: That's news to me, unless I miss something on the show.
02:34:26 --> 02:34:27 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I didn't catch that.
02:34:27 --> 02:34:29 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I didn't catch that either.
02:34:29 --> 02:34:36 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so I'll say in the books, since we're in the book spoiler section, the book version is that they are caught up in this battle.
02:34:37 --> 02:34:37 [UNKNOWN]: Right.
02:34:38 --> 02:34:46 [UNKNOWN]: And they make it to Pentos, basically, Aigan, the younger, sorry, the older of the two,
02:34:46 --> 02:34:53 [UNKNOWN]: He's got his dragon who's slightly bigger and he just kind of clings to him and ends up flying back to Dragonstone.
02:34:53 --> 02:35:03 [UNKNOWN]: Maybe that's what you heard that Aegon ends up flying back to Dragonstone on this dragon and the dragon buys and Aegon is so traumatized.
02:35:03 --> 02:35:06 [UNKNOWN]: He never flies another dragon again after that.
02:35:07 --> 02:35:13 [UNKNOWN]: But his younger brother is actually kidnapped and taken back to this for a while.
02:35:15 --> 02:35:26 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and Essos, and then Reneera thinks she's lost two sons, and then only later finds out that he was actually been alive and living over there for ages.
02:35:26 --> 02:35:32 [UNKNOWN]: So, do you want to be on our last piece of feed from Eon?
02:35:32 --> 02:35:33 [UNKNOWN]: It's directly about this.
02:35:34 --> 02:35:48 [UNKNOWN]: So the change where Naira's and Damon's children Joffrey and Aegon the Younger, not being caught in the battle of the Colette was poor because it resulted in them making Jace feel completely unsympathetic and looking like an idiot.
02:35:49 --> 02:35:54 [UNKNOWN]: The show has enough problems with most of the characters being completely unsympathetic.
02:35:57 --> 02:35:58 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's what we were referring to earlier.
02:35:58 --> 02:36:03 [UNKNOWN]: We were like, yeah, Jason, no longer looks as heroic as he does in the book version.
02:36:03 --> 02:36:14 [UNKNOWN]: Which could be absolutely the case, you know, that a more heroic version is reported in this history book versus what actually happens, which is the whole premise of the show.
02:36:16 --> 02:36:17 [UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
02:36:17 --> 02:36:19 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I'm also feeling questionable about that.
02:36:21 --> 02:36:21 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:36:23 --> 02:36:23 [UNKNOWN]: about nettles.
02:36:23 --> 02:36:24 [UNKNOWN]: What do you think?
02:36:24 --> 02:36:35 [UNKNOWN]: Okay, so nettles has been folded into Reina and you've made some references to that she might be flying off to bond with her father.
02:36:35 --> 02:36:37 [UNKNOWN]: What do you think?
02:36:37 --> 02:36:42 [UNKNOWN]: Like, which direction do you think her story is going to follow?
02:36:51 --> 02:36:55 [UNKNOWN]: I think she goes to look for her father.
02:36:56 --> 02:37:06 [UNKNOWN]: Now, one, you know, to your point earlier about her wanted to show she's a true target area by claiming a dragon to show them that she's done that.
02:37:07 --> 02:37:12 [UNKNOWN]: And two, for help and protection.
02:37:15 --> 02:37:29 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I was thinking, I mean, it always made sense to me that so this nettles character ends up flying off and being with Damon around Heron Hall or trying to hunt down Amin and Vega.
02:37:30 --> 02:37:38 [UNKNOWN]: And there's some people say they had a father daughter relationship, so that tracks here, some people said they had a romance, which could be celacious.
02:37:38 --> 02:37:41 [UNKNOWN]: I don't think they will go the romance route.
02:37:41 --> 02:37:42 [UNKNOWN]: No, I don't think so.
02:37:42 --> 02:37:46 [UNKNOWN]: even with the Allison Kiss, I don't think that's Damon and Reina's vibe at all.
02:37:47 --> 02:37:59 [UNKNOWN]: But I was wondering, so the implication in the book is that Reinaura is jealous of Nettles and Damon, and that's why one of the reasons why she's like, fuck all the dragon seeds, basically.
02:37:59 --> 02:37:59 [UNKNOWN]: Get out of here.
02:38:00 --> 02:38:00 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:38:00 --> 02:38:00 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:38:00 --> 02:38:01 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:38:01 --> 02:38:06 [UNKNOWN]: I'm wondering if here it ends up being because of what Sheepie did.
02:38:07 --> 02:38:12 [UNKNOWN]: and Rainier blames her because she's so angry about losing Jace.
02:38:13 --> 02:38:14 [UNKNOWN]: I think that's where we're headed.
02:38:15 --> 02:38:17 [UNKNOWN]: Could be wrong, but I think that's where we're headed.
02:38:20 --> 02:38:27 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's not so much about her and Damon's relationship, but it is about what she's lost.
02:38:28 --> 02:38:29 [UNKNOWN]: Yep, yep.
02:38:31 --> 02:38:40 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I do, the fact that the young Targaryen princes aren't seen or mentioned, I do wonder, like, will they just end up in pentos?
02:38:40 --> 02:38:47 [UNKNOWN]: And that's just a way to thin the character heard a bit and their little baby dragons and stuff?
02:38:47 --> 02:38:50 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, at this point, that would make the most sense for me.
02:38:51 --> 02:39:03 [UNKNOWN]: But then like because so egg on the younger, sorry, we're doing full spoilers, egg on the younger is the one who's going to end up on the throne at the end of all of this, followed them by his brother.
02:39:05 --> 02:39:10 [UNKNOWN]: And is that going to be a meaningful ending if these characters are just off screen for most of the show?
02:39:11 --> 02:39:16 [UNKNOWN]: I, I think so, because the ending, the show is not about,
02:39:18 --> 02:39:22 [UNKNOWN]: because I think it's really, it's really allicent and renourous story.
02:39:23 --> 02:39:28 [UNKNOWN]: So I think everything else that happens is in service to that.
02:39:29 --> 02:39:47 [UNKNOWN]: So yeah, I don't think we need, I mean personally, I don't need to have them present throughout every season to feel the story we complete if they ended with the younger on the throne.
02:39:49 --> 02:40:01 [UNKNOWN]: Because I think the story itself is about Alison and Rhinara, not about who ultimately ends up on the throne, but just what they do to each other to get to that point.
02:40:03 --> 02:40:07 [UNKNOWN]: I do, I mean, we're definitely seeing the turn of Ranir and right now.
02:40:08 --> 02:40:11 [UNKNOWN]: I think the fact that she wasn't at the battle.
02:40:12 --> 02:40:15 [UNKNOWN]: A lot of people in the book blame her for this battle and all the death.
02:40:16 --> 02:40:19 [UNKNOWN]: It's like the Deadly's battle, I think, in West Dorisi history, perhaps.
02:40:21 --> 02:40:31 [UNKNOWN]: And this, I wonder, I think that they chose the locking her up by her son thing to sort of push her toward the triggering of this Targaryen cruelty gene.
02:40:33 --> 02:40:35 [UNKNOWN]: but doesn't mean I have to like to see it.
02:40:35 --> 02:40:36 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, exactly.
02:40:37 --> 02:40:48 [UNKNOWN]: And then, you know, the big game of Throne Spoiler that I referenced at the beginning that you may or may not remember is that we hear the whole story of how this ends and it ends with a gum feeding Reneera to Sunfire.
02:40:48 --> 02:40:51 [UNKNOWN]: So, Sunfire, oh, still alive.
02:40:51 --> 02:40:54 [UNKNOWN]: Never learned to fly again, but not well, not well.
02:40:54 --> 02:40:56 [UNKNOWN]: Wing does not go right, you know.
02:40:58 --> 02:41:08 [UNKNOWN]: What do you think about the fact that so in the book, Agen ends up hiding out on Dragonstone for this whole, and then Renera finds out much later.
02:41:08 --> 02:41:11 [UNKNOWN]: He's been under his notes the whole time while she was in King's Landing.
02:41:12 --> 02:41:20 [UNKNOWN]: Why, if Halstonton, Renera's supporters, Bannerman, have them, why would she not know?
02:41:20 --> 02:41:24 [UNKNOWN]: Do you think they would turn on her and keep him a secret?
02:41:24 --> 02:41:24 [UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:41:26 --> 02:41:29 [UNKNOWN]: Just because everyone turns on everyone turns on everyone turns on everyone.
02:41:29 --> 02:41:35 [UNKNOWN]: There are no true alliances within the game, within this world.
02:41:36 --> 02:41:37 [UNKNOWN]: Everything is up for grabs.
02:41:37 --> 02:41:39 [UNKNOWN]: Everything is up to be amended.
02:41:40 --> 02:41:45 [UNKNOWN]: Everything is up to be twisted and turned in ways that you just don't know.
02:41:45 --> 02:41:52 [UNKNOWN]: So yes, I can see that happening, where they don't tell her and they just for promises of something better.
02:41:56 --> 02:42:10 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, I think that there's reasons that Renee or Mike give them reasons to turn on her, like if she turns on the, you know, we know two of the dragon seeds are going to turn on her off and hue.
02:42:11 --> 02:42:13 [UNKNOWN]: Um, and then she turns on the rest.
02:42:13 --> 02:42:17 [UNKNOWN]: So that pisses people off, but also like this question of whether Thailand is dead.
02:42:17 --> 02:42:24 [UNKNOWN]: I think one of the worst thing she does is is when she shows up at King's Landing, that's where you find Thailand in the book.
02:42:24 --> 02:42:25 [UNKNOWN]: He's a renters.
02:42:26 --> 02:42:27 [UNKNOWN]: And then she has him.
02:42:27 --> 02:42:27 [UNKNOWN]: She will be tortured.
02:42:28 --> 02:42:35 [UNKNOWN]: like really badly towards you, but then he eventually becomes the hand for her son, A.G.
02:42:35 --> 02:42:36 [UNKNOWN]: Younger.
02:42:36 --> 02:42:40 [UNKNOWN]: So I'm like, I kind of hope Thailand isn't dead, I suppose.
02:42:41 --> 02:42:44 [UNKNOWN]: But then we know Coralus is going to wash up on the shore next time.
02:42:44 --> 02:42:46 [UNKNOWN]: We've already seen that in the trailer.
02:42:48 --> 02:42:49 [UNKNOWN]: Do they both wash up?
02:42:49 --> 02:42:50 [UNKNOWN]: I guess that can happen.
02:42:50 --> 02:42:51 [UNKNOWN]: We'll see.
02:42:52 --> 02:42:53 [UNKNOWN]: I guess that can happen.
02:42:53 --> 02:42:54 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:42:59 --> 02:43:10 [UNKNOWN]: Do you think, do you think Damon's going to die when there's this thing in the book where he and Amin fight and we know Amin dies because they find his body later, but Damon's body is missing.
02:43:12 --> 02:43:16 [UNKNOWN]: In my heart of hearts, I hope Damon flies off somewhere.
02:43:16 --> 02:43:17 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
02:43:17 --> 02:43:19 [UNKNOWN]: I thought you were going to say dies, horrible.
02:43:21 --> 02:43:23 [UNKNOWN]: I told you I'm trying to change it.
02:43:23 --> 02:43:24 [UNKNOWN]: Sorry.
02:43:24 --> 02:43:24 [UNKNOWN]: Sorry.
02:43:25 --> 02:43:29 [UNKNOWN]: I mean, I wondered they're setting up all this aisle of faces stuff already.
02:43:29 --> 02:43:37 [UNKNOWN]: We do know that at some point in this series, Adam of Hall is going to head to the aisle of faces and confer with the green men.
02:43:39 --> 02:43:43 [UNKNOWN]: There is questions about whether Damon ends up hiding out there or something like that.
02:43:46 --> 02:43:52 [UNKNOWN]: Um, yeah, yeah, still things left unanswered, still being unanswered.
02:43:52 --> 02:44:07 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, we know, I'm kind of weirdly looking forward to seeing what happens between Amin and Alice, they get together and like she is definitely going to feed into his mommy issues thing.
02:44:07 --> 02:44:11 [UNKNOWN]: I think they cast an actress that looks reasonably like Olivia Cook.
02:44:12 --> 02:44:35 [UNKNOWN]: and I think that's why they've been setting all this up to explain why he ends up falling for Alice presumably and they have, they have a baby together who some people think will become Brendan Rivers, the three-eyed crow, three-eyed Ravens, three-eyed Ravens, now, depending on
02:44:39 --> 02:44:42 [UNKNOWN]: So I'm very curious where all of that goes.
02:44:42 --> 02:44:46 [UNKNOWN]: Is there anything else you're especially looking for too?
02:44:47 --> 02:44:47 [UNKNOWN]: Seeing play out?
02:44:49 --> 02:44:55 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I'm looking forward to when Reinaura lands in King's Landing.
02:44:56 --> 02:44:58 [UNKNOWN]: OK. That's probably really soon.
02:44:59 --> 02:44:59 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, really soon.
02:45:00 --> 02:45:02 [UNKNOWN]: That's the moment that I'm looking for.
02:45:02 --> 02:45:04 [UNKNOWN]: Because it's going to be a shop contrast, I think,
02:45:09 --> 02:45:17 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of battles left with really consequential things coming out of them.
02:45:17 --> 02:45:22 [UNKNOWN]: So I wonder if the next one will see is the battle by the lake shore where we get some heavy winter wolf fatalities.
02:45:22 --> 02:45:24 [UNKNOWN]: I'm like, wow, they just arrived.
02:45:24 --> 02:45:29 [UNKNOWN]: But the uncoffing noise man, tell you, my girl.
02:45:30 --> 02:45:39 [UNKNOWN]: But it's really hard to say like, I was trying to predict where it is this end and some people are saying the battle of Tumbledon, which is when Hugh and Ulth turn.
02:45:40 --> 02:45:43 [UNKNOWN]: But I could even see that happening earlier in the season.
02:45:43 --> 02:45:46 [UNKNOWN]: Well, this season where this season ends, I think this is going to happen earlier.
02:45:46 --> 02:45:52 [UNKNOWN]: I think they are going to betray her much earlier than the ending of the season.
02:45:53 --> 02:46:03 [UNKNOWN]: I could even see, I don't know, them doing the, since they've setting up this whole God's I thing, I could see them doing that battle of God's I between Damon and Amend as a season finale.
02:46:04 --> 02:46:05 [UNKNOWN]: That is, yes.
02:46:06 --> 02:46:07 [UNKNOWN]: We'll see though.
02:46:07 --> 02:46:16 [UNKNOWN]: I was wrong last season, but then again, I was wrong on a technicality, because I do think this, well, we know this was going to be the season finale.
02:46:18 --> 02:46:20 [UNKNOWN]: I think that, that could very well be.
02:46:22 --> 02:46:25 [UNKNOWN]: That's fine about, yeah, let me not speculate, I don't want to speculate.
02:46:26 --> 02:46:37 [UNKNOWN]: No, all right, all right, all right, any final full spoiler thoughts before we end this long-ass but thorough introduction back into the world of houses.
02:46:37 --> 02:46:44 [UNKNOWN]: No, no, I've got nothing else, I get, um, yeah, the kids are not all right.
02:46:44 --> 02:46:48 [UNKNOWN]: That's, so that's all right, this, this, the spoiler is not as far a little bit as the
02:46:52 --> 02:46:56 [UNKNOWN]: All right, see you all next week to talk about more bad things happening to bad people.