The Lorehounds Play - E07 - Final Fantasy VII Rebirth

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[00:01:45] Welcome to The Lorehounds Play, where the lorehounds your guides to pixel-based adventures.

[00:01:49] I'm Jon.

[00:01:51] I'm Brandon.

[00:01:52] And this is our seventh The Lorehounds Play podcast, this time for Final Fantasy VII Rebirth.

[00:01:58] In this episode, we'll be breaking down the character's plot and gameplay of Square Enix's second entry

[00:02:03] into a trilogy of games retelling the story from just one game, Final Fantasy VII.

[00:02:11] Before we get started, quick reminder that you can send feedback to lhp at thelorehounds.com

[00:02:17] or leave us a voicemail at thelorehounds.com slash contact and we'll get those questions in the next episode.

[00:02:24] If you're enjoying our coverage of video games or any of the shows we're covering

[00:02:27] and you'd like to support us directly, head over to patreon.com slash thelorehounds

[00:02:31] or go to the Supercast link in the show notes and subscribe today for early and ad-free access

[00:02:36] to every episode as well as bonus content like second breakfast, Shireside Chats,

[00:02:41] and the new Elevenzies that we're starting.

[00:02:45] Now, Brandon, you are back.

[00:02:48] We are back.

[00:02:49] Let me repeat the refrain on this podcast.

[00:02:51] It's been a while.

[00:02:54] It certainly has.

[00:02:55] This seems to be like the podcast for when we can actually fit it into our life,

[00:03:00] which, you know, it makes a lot of sense because gaming as a grown ass adult is kind of that way, too.

[00:03:07] So I think it kind of fits the theme.

[00:03:11] Maybe this podcast should be renamed to Dad's Game.

[00:03:13] You know, just just when we can, when we can.

[00:03:17] I think I think there is no regular podcast schedule.

[00:03:21] Our lives are just chaos.

[00:03:23] I think an alternate name for a lorehounds run of a video game is also a tired dad's run.

[00:03:28] Yeah, that's right.

[00:03:30] Synonymous.

[00:03:31] That's right.

[00:03:32] I did play this entire game almost on easy, so I can relate.

[00:03:37] Oh, yeah, I can relate.

[00:03:39] All right.

[00:03:39] So we've been playing around with the format.

[00:03:42] I think we're going to be doing, you know, again, gaming news, you know, like gaming news.

[00:03:48] What we've been playing background on the game, some spoiler free rating one to three,

[00:03:53] which is now red light, yellow light, green light, and then a spoiler review.

[00:03:58] So we are still in spoiler free territory on rebirth.

[00:04:02] So don't worry.

[00:04:03] Why don't we head into quickly what we've been playing?

[00:04:05] Have you been playing anything besides Final Fantasy, Brandon?

[00:04:09] Nothing outside of the usual.

[00:04:11] I've been dabbling in my fortnight and I've been playing some of the

[00:04:16] bungee backed into a corner destiny, which has been fun.

[00:04:21] But other than rebirth, just dipping in every every time I get the chance to just chip away

[00:04:25] at that 100 percent.

[00:04:27] No, that's it.

[00:04:29] Nice for me.

[00:04:30] I've been vampire surviving, you know, I've just been they put it out a new DLC.

[00:04:37] They have new weapons.

[00:04:38] So and a few new levels.

[00:04:40] So I've been playing that.

[00:04:41] Other than that, I like barely started a new save of Ghost of Tsushima because I want to

[00:04:47] finally play it through and I streamed it for a few minutes the other night.

[00:04:51] You can follow us on Twitch, too, if you look this up.

[00:04:55] And then, yeah, I just I just fell off it because I'm a tired gamer dad.

[00:04:59] Yeah, huge shame of mine is that I got about two hours both into Ghost of Tsushima and a

[00:05:06] Red Dead two.

[00:05:08] And I was just so overwhelmed by the size of game that I was like, I'm just going to

[00:05:12] put this on the shelf and wait until I have time because with video games, for the most

[00:05:17] part, the longer you wait, the better off you are.

[00:05:19] I just wish I would have waited to pay later because I could have gotten them on sale instead

[00:05:24] of buying them brand new.

[00:05:26] Yeah, I think Ghost of Tsushima should definitely be on our list of upcoming games because it

[00:05:32] is really good.

[00:05:33] It's really, really good story.

[00:05:35] Yeah, it seemed like it seems like a pretty great story and just visually breathtaking.

[00:05:39] And that's just on PS5.

[00:05:41] I'm sure on PC it's going to look like, you know, chef's kiss.

[00:05:45] Yeah, for sure.

[00:05:47] Let's get into some gaming news.

[00:05:48] We had a sad month of gaming where we had a bunch of closures at Bethesda.

[00:05:54] Tango Games Gameworks was especially sad after they had this hit Hi-Fi Rush last year, which

[00:06:00] was a smaller experience, which is what a lot of us, especially us tired gaming dads

[00:06:05] want.

[00:06:05] Right?

[00:06:05] Like we want these bite sized experiences that are fun and nice.

[00:06:08] I don't know if you played Hi-Fi Rush.

[00:06:11] I didn't, but it's something that was definitely on the list.

[00:06:13] I mean, the concept of the game is cool and like visually it's like stunning.

[00:06:18] And I was I had a lot of fun watching people really dig that as it was stealth dropped

[00:06:23] into that Xbox showcase.

[00:06:25] Yeah, it seems like a pretty rad game.

[00:06:27] And it sounds like Microsoft wanted smaller rad games to add to their repertoire of games.

[00:06:33] And then they're like, well, I guess not.

[00:06:37] Not after this meeting anyway.

[00:06:38] Goodbye.

[00:06:39] It does seem that there's more scrutiny on the Xbox budget since the Activision purchase.

[00:06:47] Like it seems like Xbox leadership wanted small games and Microsoft leadership said

[00:06:53] go make another Starfield.

[00:06:55] Yeah.

[00:06:57] Yeah, it's pretty it's a pretty mixed bag.

[00:06:59] Microsoft seems to have infinite money since they're like, you know, they're part of

[00:07:06] they're part of the like infrastructure to like human life at this point.

[00:07:11] So they pretty much do have infinite money, but I am sure that they did not like that

[00:07:15] several billion dollar dent into their pocket from getting Activision Blizzard.

[00:07:20] So it does seem like it was 70 something billion.

[00:07:23] Yeah, so they're they're probably just like tightening up the purse strings for a while

[00:07:27] until everyone hates them and then they'll be bungee backed into a corner and maybe hopefully

[00:07:33] shower the money in games wherever they need them.

[00:07:36] But we'll see.

[00:07:38] I don't know what I'm pretty pessimistic about the industry as of right now, just because

[00:07:44] with all of the studio closures and and all that pretty shitty time to be making games

[00:07:50] right now seems like unless you're unless you're an executive because they are making bank.

[00:07:56] Right, right.

[00:07:57] Yeah, I guess that's that's the bummer is that the people who make the games are never

[00:08:00] really the ones who suffer layoffs.

[00:08:02] I was sorry are the ones who always suffer layoffs, whereas the executives who make the

[00:08:06] decision.

[00:08:07] Yeah, yeah.

[00:08:08] But that's that's the whole.

[00:08:10] Yeah, like you said, it's it's just the whole system.

[00:08:12] It's not just gaming.

[00:08:14] It's just that we are on a gaming podcast.

[00:08:16] That's what we're talking about.

[00:08:17] Those those those assholes on that pizza in the sky above us blocking out the sun, that

[00:08:24] rotten pizza.

[00:08:25] If I am going to make a Final Fantasy seven, I was very confused by what you were saying

[00:08:31] that.

[00:08:32] And rebirth or sorry, remake in the original.

[00:08:36] That's what they called the the the pizza on top of Midgar.

[00:08:41] Oh, we're all the higher ups of Shinra live anyway.

[00:08:45] OK, gotcha.

[00:08:46] You get that if you want to deep.

[00:08:48] No, I'm leaving it.

[00:08:49] Leave it in.

[00:08:50] All right, good.

[00:08:52] OK, so on a happier note, also on the Xbox side and PC side, Hellblade two got released.

[00:08:58] Have you have you tried that out at all?

[00:09:01] I have not, but I haven't played the first one, and I believe it's like a 20 hour all

[00:09:05] told experience if you wanted to play both.

[00:09:07] So that's something I'm wanting to do on like a vacation or something, just run through

[00:09:11] the whole last thing.

[00:09:12] And it's I think it's visual and cinematic enough that my wife would enjoy experiencing

[00:09:16] it with me.

[00:09:17] So you got to do headphones.

[00:09:19] Really?

[00:09:20] Got to do headphones.

[00:09:21] Yes.

[00:09:21] So a big part of the game is are these supernatural things really happening or is this psychosis?

[00:09:27] So there's a lot of like voices and whispering in your ears and it's another Final Fantasy

[00:09:31] seven tie.

[00:09:33] Yeah.

[00:09:34] OK, yeah, that that might be worth it.

[00:09:36] Then I'll just tell her to sit there and watch me slap some headphones on her.

[00:09:41] Yeah, that'll work.

[00:09:42] We'll double it up.

[00:09:43] I've actually watched my wife play this, but I have not played it.

[00:09:46] So I OK, I think I'm going to try to do both like you're suggesting.

[00:09:51] It seems like a great way to do it because I think it's a one like a congruous like you

[00:09:55] could just you can you can jet through the whole thing.

[00:09:58] But what does she said about it?

[00:10:00] Is she enjoyed it?

[00:10:01] Well, she hasn't played the second one yet.

[00:10:03] She she's the first one.

[00:10:04] Yeah, I think she's going to play the second one soon.

[00:10:06] I did.

[00:10:07] I installed it on the Xbox.

[00:10:09] I'm like the tech master in this house.

[00:10:11] Like if somebody needs to get done tech wise, it's just my job.

[00:10:14] Sure.

[00:10:14] So I installed everything.

[00:10:16] I charged up the headphones.

[00:10:18] I set it all up nicely.

[00:10:19] I think she's just been a little tired lately as we all are.

[00:10:23] Speaking of which, I booted up the Xbox today to put

[00:10:27] Cocomelon or some shit on the TV for my miss Rachel is what what my two year old almost

[00:10:32] two year old is into right now.

[00:10:34] Miss Rachel is great.

[00:10:35] She's wonderful.

[00:10:36] She's the best babysitter you could ask for.

[00:10:39] But the not to sell her short Hellblade two prompted whenever I started the Xbox up

[00:10:47] the living room Xbox, I started that up and it was like, hey,

[00:10:51] you want to download Hellblade two right now or you could buy it if you want.

[00:10:55] Or you could tell us to go away.

[00:10:57] So it's like the Xbox opened with a prompt for me to play.

[00:11:01] Helping us, which I thought was pretty interesting.

[00:11:03] Pretty all right.

[00:11:04] I'm cool with that kind of like, you know, in your face.

[00:11:07] For a big release.

[00:11:09] Yeah.

[00:11:09] Yeah.

[00:11:10] As long as it's not like every day I have a new pop up like I think for big releases,

[00:11:14] that's fine, especially with something that's free with your subscription.

[00:11:18] Absolutely.

[00:11:19] Yeah, it said first option was download with Game Pass.

[00:11:22] Second option, buy it if you want to throw these people money.

[00:11:25] So definitely I think it's a pretty cool way to do that.

[00:11:30] Cool.

[00:11:31] And then I just want to shout out to I guess the PS five pro is probably coming this fall

[00:11:35] and then the switch to early next year.

[00:11:38] Sounds like seems like early next year for the switch to I haven't seen too many people

[00:11:43] super jazzed for the PS five pro yet because I mean, it seems like, you know, we're barely

[00:11:49] getting, you know, we're scratching the surface of what the PlayStation five right now can do

[00:11:56] in a lot in a lot of games.

[00:11:57] But like and I'll say right now in Rebirth, we're actually like sort of bumping up against

[00:12:02] what it's capable of as a console right now.

[00:12:07] But it doesn't seem that way for most games.

[00:12:09] Rebirth is just a gigantic game.

[00:12:12] Yeah, I don't even know if that's the I don't know if that's the console or if that's the

[00:12:18] developers because I do think that there's an argument that it should not look that way

[00:12:24] in performance mode.

[00:12:25] Right.

[00:12:25] I mean, you look at and it's different because Senua's, you know, the Hellblade two is is

[00:12:32] a different kind of game and there's less gameplay involved so you can use a little

[00:12:36] bit more resources on the visuals.

[00:12:38] But man, there is a big difference.

[00:12:42] Yeah, I believe it.

[00:12:45] We'll get in we can get into some visual stuff with Rebirth later because there's some like

[00:12:49] specifics.

[00:12:50] But.

[00:12:52] But yeah, with the giant games with perhaps lots and lots of assets and like quickly loading

[00:12:59] giant areas of maps and stuff, that's where we're bumping into some issues with the consoles,

[00:13:06] which, you know, it's going to happen.

[00:13:08] So it's two can't come quick enough because I don't even like picking up my switch anymore

[00:13:11] because it's just garbage.

[00:13:14] Just so old and clunky.

[00:13:15] And like if I'm so spoiled that if I don't get it 60 FPS on, you know.

[00:13:23] On anything right now, I just can't I can't do it, man.

[00:13:26] I'm just like my eyes are spoiled.

[00:13:29] I'm a Steam Deck stand.

[00:13:30] I'll say that and that's often not 60 FPS, but I also don't play like modern AAA games

[00:13:36] on it.

[00:13:36] I'll do Indies.

[00:13:37] I'll do older games.

[00:13:39] So I just think it's not really for that, which is fine.

[00:13:42] You know, like this seems like Steam Deck bread and butter is those kinds of games.

[00:13:45] Yeah, like Vampire Survivors is amazing on that because I could just sit there and collect

[00:13:50] all my weapons.

[00:13:51] Are you a vampire survivors guy?

[00:13:53] No, but I've seen a lot of coverage for it.

[00:13:55] It seems like a game that would be perfect for the Steam Deck.

[00:13:59] It is.

[00:13:59] I'm definitely going to pick it up one day.

[00:14:01] Yeah, it's great for like one kid's napping and the other is watching a movie to stay

[00:14:05] quiet.

[00:14:06] And I just want to do something with my hands for a little bit.

[00:14:09] There are survivors on the Steam Deck.

[00:14:11] Heck yeah.

[00:14:12] Yep.

[00:14:14] All right.

[00:14:14] I was gonna say something about oh, 45 FPS seems to be like the way to go because a lot

[00:14:24] of people have been doing that like sort of halfway point and it something about the refresh

[00:14:29] rate.

[00:14:30] 45 FPS feels nice on your eyes.

[00:14:34] And honestly, Destiny 2 on PC, I was pretty much on my last machine.

[00:14:38] That's what I was playing it at because I still cranked everything up to max and I was getting

[00:14:42] pretty like a rock solid 45 like without it moving.

[00:14:47] And I had a great time with that.

[00:14:48] So that was on a PC.

[00:14:50] So like if you could like get that on the Steam Deck or something like that, or even

[00:14:54] switch to like give me 45 and I'm happy.

[00:14:56] I just can't do 30 anymore.

[00:14:58] Yeah, you can you can play around with the settings.

[00:15:00] That's the nice thing about it being a tiny PC is that you can play around.

[00:15:03] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:15:03] And do a lot of do a lot of nonsense with it.

[00:15:07] Tinkering.

[00:15:08] Indeed.

[00:15:09] So let's talk about Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth.

[00:15:13] No spoilers yet, but give me your overall impression, including your rating.

[00:15:19] Is this a red light?

[00:15:20] Do not play.

[00:15:21] Is this a yellow light would recommend if you like this kind of game or is it a green

[00:15:26] light?

[00:15:26] Everyone in gaming should play this forever.

[00:15:29] OK, so we're going to do red light is summon materia.

[00:15:33] Yellow light is going to be support materia and green light is magic materia.

[00:15:40] Got it.

[00:15:41] It's going to be a green light.

[00:15:43] It's I will say across the board, a green light.

[00:15:49] OK.

[00:15:50] If you have played the if you played Rebirth or Remake, just keep playing because, you

[00:15:55] know, this is more and better of that.

[00:16:00] If you haven't, it gives you like a little way to catch up and honestly, like going back

[00:16:08] now would maybe make remake feel a little bit like a tech demo for this game.

[00:16:15] Which is, you know, it's a more linear game.

[00:16:17] It's a different experience, but this is just such a grand.

[00:16:21] Thing and there is so much game here like.

[00:16:25] I've never played so many mini games in one game.

[00:16:29] There's so much to do.

[00:16:30] It is a visual spectacle.

[00:16:34] Yes, going to be green without getting into a lot more details.

[00:16:40] I love it.

[00:16:41] I absolutely love this game.

[00:16:43] Yeah.

[00:16:43] What about you?

[00:16:44] What's your rating?

[00:16:45] I'm agreeing to.

[00:16:47] It's funny because I think that at least for the first like at least 20 or 30 episodes

[00:16:53] of this podcast, it's almost always going to be a green because their games that we

[00:16:57] picked out because we like them so much.

[00:16:59] Yeah, it's true.

[00:17:01] But yeah, I mean, I was not agreeing.

[00:17:04] The only one that I could think of that I was not agreeing was the Star Wars game.

[00:17:08] I can't remember it with Calcestus.

[00:17:10] But yeah, you're right.

[00:17:12] You're right.

[00:17:13] I guess if it's if it's something that we've already played and we've chosen to cover it,

[00:17:17] it's probably going to be a green.

[00:17:19] If it's something that we agree to play coming up, like I think I think we should do

[00:17:22] Bioshock still because that's like a quick playthrough.

[00:17:25] For sure.

[00:17:25] I think that one, you know, you could have some variants.

[00:17:30] But yeah, this is I think the biggest critique I've heard of this game is the amount of many

[00:17:35] games that feel mandatory.

[00:17:37] I don't agree with that criticism.

[00:17:39] I never felt like I was forced to do many games.

[00:17:42] I did play a lot of them because I wanted to.

[00:17:45] And when I was forced to play a mini game, it really wasn't very long and that egregious.

[00:17:50] So I don't understand the criticism with that.

[00:17:53] My biggest criticism with the game is that the visuals in performance mode do not look great,

[00:17:58] but visuals in fidelity mode look great.

[00:18:01] And honestly, the gameplay and the story make up for it.

[00:18:05] The voice acting in this is absolutely amazing.

[00:18:08] The music is amazing.

[00:18:10] It's even more varied than the last one.

[00:18:12] The the story is captivating and heartbreaking and beautiful.

[00:18:17] And I just can't wait for the third one.

[00:18:19] Like I even started the original Final Fantasy after finishing this,

[00:18:23] and then I didn't get past getting my first Chocobo and getting annoyed about that.

[00:18:29] Yeah.

[00:18:31] Yeah, I definitely echo all those sentiments.

[00:18:34] The the music is just so killer in this one.

[00:18:37] And the way they implement it in the open world is really great, too.

[00:18:42] And there's two themes for everything.

[00:18:44] Like there's in the open world, there's the battle version,

[00:18:47] and then there's the just walking around version of music.

[00:18:50] And it all is so seamlessly done.

[00:18:54] I love it.

[00:18:56] I love it.

[00:18:57] And yeah, you're the voice acting.

[00:18:58] They absolutely crush it again.

[00:19:00] Like they did such a good job casting these people.

[00:19:03] And the expanded cast that we've gotten in this one is great, too.

[00:19:07] Yeah.

[00:19:09] It's going to be a lot of.

[00:19:12] A lot of praise coming out of me.

[00:19:13] I will have some criticisms once we get into the spoiler section.

[00:19:17] The minigames, I will say I did engage with a lot of minigame.

[00:19:24] And I don't think very many of them are mandatory.

[00:19:31] A lot of them are like story moments that you have to do something

[00:19:33] and you just have to get bare minimum.

[00:19:36] Right.

[00:19:36] You know, it's showing you that they exist.

[00:19:38] And then they're like, hey, did you like this minigame?

[00:19:40] Well, how would you like to ruin your life trying to get a perfect score?

[00:19:44] And I did.

[00:19:46] Queen's blood absolutely wrecked my life for a little while.

[00:19:50] I had to stop myself because I was getting so angry at it.

[00:19:55] I'm not a card game person at all.

[00:19:57] Like, I didn't even fall for like the beloved ones like your Gwent's and your,

[00:20:01] you know, triple triad.

[00:20:03] I didn't care for any of those.

[00:20:04] But if you put Queen's blood on my phone,

[00:20:07] I would play a bunch of Queen's blood.

[00:20:09] I think I think they really crushed it with that game.

[00:20:11] And then like you can follow like a chain of events for Queen's blood in the actual game.

[00:20:18] It's great, right?

[00:20:19] They did a really good job making the minigames feel like they mostly mattered.

[00:20:22] Yes, they rewarded you for going all the way, but you didn't have to do it,

[00:20:28] which I think is the perfect way to do a minigame.

[00:20:31] It's like, hey, here's a little here's this dolphin you ride on.

[00:20:33] You know, it's not really a spoiler.

[00:20:35] Here's this dolphin.

[00:20:36] If you want to really crush writing dolphins, you can keep doing that.

[00:20:39] But if not, let's go ahead.

[00:20:41] Let's go head on to June on.

[00:20:42] Right.

[00:20:44] Yeah, I think I think the minigames are implemented pretty well.

[00:20:47] And I can see if you do take the step to ruin your life trying to best all of the minigames,

[00:20:53] then the minigames would be too much.

[00:20:55] And by the way, absolutely.

[00:20:59] I will say that I have now beaten the game and have played.

[00:21:05] It's been a minute now since because, you know, it takes us.

[00:21:07] It takes us a lot of time to get to the recording studio here and get everything done.

[00:21:13] So my feelings on all of this have changed.

[00:21:16] And if you caught me 40 or so hours into the game, I probably had different thoughts.

[00:21:23] I was probably getting a little eager at that point to see the story play out.

[00:21:27] So I was probably more impatient.

[00:21:30] Yeah, I felt like that.

[00:21:33] But now that the now that I am unspoilable for the game and I'm definitely going to go back

[00:21:41] all the way, I'm just going to start fresh at some point and play it all over again.

[00:21:45] I don't think I'm going to have an issue with any of these minigames.

[00:21:48] There's going to be some that I skip and I'll go into maybe that later, which ones I super hated.

[00:21:54] But but yeah, I think.

[00:21:58] In retrospect, I don't have a single problem with all the minigames.

[00:22:01] Yep.

[00:22:02] Yep.

[00:22:04] All right.

[00:22:04] We're 20 minutes in.

[00:22:05] We've talked about our spoiler free thoughts.

[00:22:08] Go play the game if you haven't.

[00:22:09] It's really a masterpiece.

[00:22:10] I can't believe they made this game in three years.

[00:22:12] I'm sure that there were labor issues.

[00:22:14] Let's hope not.

[00:22:16] OK, well, before we get super into spoilers, the the people who made this game,

[00:22:24] um, they were able to retain something like 80 percent of the the the the devs.

[00:22:33] Oh, that's pretty good.

[00:22:33] Like they were they were able to just like as a team continue rolling straight into it.

[00:22:39] So like part of why it feels so like such a natural thing and why they were able to

[00:22:43] knock it out so fast with it being as big as it is, is they still had all the people

[00:22:48] who are familiar with these tools and these workflows and stuff.

[00:22:51] So like that is what made it go so smooth as they were able to hold on to their staff

[00:22:57] like that.

[00:22:58] I like it.

[00:22:59] I like that.

[00:23:00] Yeah, I think it's it's so important, especially in like the this day and age that they like

[00:23:06] valued with obviously like with squares like their their crown jewel.

[00:23:12] They valued the people making that enough that they're like, give them what they need.

[00:23:17] Give it to them.

[00:23:18] Um, and, you know, I'm super glad because like.

[00:23:23] Yeah, I think maybe we should get into spoilers because I want to just talk about some of

[00:23:26] that stuff.

[00:23:27] Square is like the weirdest or Squeenix, as people like to say they're like, never really.

[00:23:33] You've never heard this.

[00:23:35] No, I've never heard.

[00:23:36] I like that a lot.

[00:23:39] Squeenix is like the weirdest studio because their Japanese releases are are almost always

[00:23:45] well received and their American or Western releases are almost never well received.

[00:23:52] It's such a bizarre like Square Enix with Outriders and Avengers and things like that,

[00:23:59] like just not well received.

[00:24:02] And then their Japanese studios are just killing it game after game.

[00:24:06] Well, they're doing a lot of trend chasing like Outriders is just a it's a looter shooter

[00:24:11] without.

[00:24:12] Yeah, PVP.

[00:24:13] Without a soul.

[00:24:15] Exactly.

[00:24:15] And the same thing, honestly, with revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge,

[00:24:19] revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge,

[00:24:19] revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge, revenge,

[00:24:19] I mean, it was that same thing.

[00:24:21] They're just trying to sell microtransactions and stuff, which I've never I didn't.

[00:24:25] I never played that one.

[00:24:25] I did grab it before it was delisted, though.

[00:24:28] So I would like to play through this story because I actually heard like the 40 hour

[00:24:32] story or whatever is actually pretty righteous for it's fine.

[00:24:35] For that game.

[00:24:36] It's fine.

[00:24:37] Guardians of the Galaxy was better.

[00:24:39] Okay, cool.

[00:24:39] I still haven't played through that yet.

[00:24:42] I need to.

[00:24:44] Cool.

[00:24:45] Well, let's take a quick break when we get back.

[00:24:47] We'll go right into the spoiler section and we're back.

[00:25:05] All right, Brandon, it's time to talk full game spoilers.

[00:25:08] So so it is an open world.

[00:25:11] I want to talk about the gameplay first.

[00:25:12] The open world.

[00:25:13] I want to ask you your opinion on it's a lot of towers, a lot of side quests, a lot of

[00:25:20] checkboxes.

[00:25:21] This is something that when it comes from Ubisoft gets a lot of hate.

[00:25:27] This felt different to me, but I don't know about you.

[00:25:30] Yeah, I I didn't like touching towers very much.

[00:25:36] I do like that each one was like the mini of mini dungeons where there's usually like

[00:25:40] a monster and then you got to find out like what what to you know, like because all of

[00:25:46] the towers themselves are different to, you know, highlight different parts of the map.

[00:25:51] I think they're weak because sometimes like you'll hit the tower, you do the thing and

[00:25:55] then like one little like a materia spring will pop up like it doesn't seem like a very

[00:26:02] like, you know, robust thing that you unlock with the towers.

[00:26:08] And it's been said jokingly that Chadley's got more, you know, voice lines than anybody

[00:26:15] in the entire game put together.

[00:26:18] I had to turn off the feature of going through the controller because it was so annoying.

[00:26:24] It was just so annoying and for some reason it was much louder than my screen.

[00:26:29] And so I ended up so I was playing on this portable monitor I have in bed and my wife

[00:26:37] was trying to sleep next to me and she's like, oh, don't worry about turning it off.

[00:26:40] It's not very loud because she just likes some noise when she sleeps, you know?

[00:26:44] And I so I get a call from Chadley and it's like, and she's what the hell was that?

[00:26:53] That's when I changed it.

[00:26:55] That is when I actually was playing with headphones, so I kept kind of missing it.

[00:26:59] I'd see it pop up and I'd like I have to pull a headphone when you were on headphones.

[00:27:03] It still did that.

[00:27:04] Yeah, it still comes through the controller.

[00:27:06] That's stupid.

[00:27:07] But yeah, they had it to where you can just turn that off and have them come through your

[00:27:11] headphones.

[00:27:12] So I did that.

[00:27:13] But yeah, so I got this having it go through the screen.

[00:27:15] Yeah, but yeah, that was that was better.

[00:27:19] But interesting idea.

[00:27:21] I always like when they try and like gives the give something to the gimmick for the

[00:27:25] PlayStation, but like it usually ends up being more trouble than it's worth.

[00:27:29] I hate I hate the triggers, the haptic, the adaptive triggers.

[00:27:34] Yeah, I do not like them.

[00:27:35] I don't mind them.

[00:27:36] They don't bother me, but it doesn't like sell it for me.

[00:27:40] I like the haptic feedback.

[00:27:41] I don't really like the triggers very much.

[00:27:43] I mean, they're the same.

[00:27:44] That's a good way.

[00:27:45] Yeah, the triggers are the worst for me.

[00:27:46] I had to turn it off for Spider-Man.

[00:27:48] Like I will say when I first booted up Demon Souls on the PS5 and you feel the steps and

[00:27:53] they feel like real.

[00:27:54] That was cool with, you know, the haptic feedback.

[00:27:58] Right?

[00:27:59] Yeah, that makes sense.

[00:28:01] And I and I do appreciate in Ghost of Tsushima.

[00:28:03] They do a really interesting thing.

[00:28:04] You might remember from your two hours of it where you instead of having like a generic

[00:28:10] like here's the path to go, you have to swipe the middle pad and then the wind will blow

[00:28:16] in the direction you're supposed to go.

[00:28:18] Yeah, that was cool.

[00:28:19] And I also like swiping the pad for the you.

[00:28:22] That's how you put your sword away to or pull out your flute or whatever it is.

[00:28:27] In this in Final Fantasy or in Ghost of Tsushima?

[00:28:30] Ghost of Tsushima.

[00:28:31] Okay, I didn't I don't even remember that.

[00:28:32] I need to I need to get back into my ghost mode.

[00:28:36] Right?

[00:28:37] Yeah, the the middle pad in this one is pretty much just used is like the old if we're talking

[00:28:42] to old school because I can never remember the names on any of them.

[00:28:45] What the buttons are now it's the select button.

[00:28:48] Right?

[00:28:50] So I think you pull up your map and stuff.

[00:28:52] Yeah, because now this was the select button became the share button.

[00:28:56] Yes, which I do not care about.

[00:28:58] Yeah, and on the Xbox, it's burger and I can't remember window.

[00:29:03] I can't remember what people call it.

[00:29:06] I did buy a capture card so that I could stream for my PS5.

[00:29:08] That is something I did.

[00:29:10] But I have one of those as well.

[00:29:12] Which one did you get?

[00:29:13] By the way, I got a Elgato HD 60.

[00:29:16] I got one from TikTok shop.

[00:29:18] That was very cheap.

[00:29:20] Nice.

[00:29:21] I think it was $10 and it works like I did it the other night and it was good.

[00:29:25] Right on.

[00:29:26] Okay. Yeah.

[00:29:27] I'm gonna have to check check out some of your streams.

[00:29:29] You gotta I mean, they're not going to happen very often, but

[00:29:32] maybe we'll stream together in our one night every two months that we line up.

[00:29:36] I would love that.

[00:29:38] So we talked about the mini games.

[00:29:40] I don't want to belabor that point.

[00:29:42] The different biomes and chocobos.

[00:29:44] I heard this was different from the original.

[00:29:46] I heard in the original, you got to take whatever custom chocobos to different areas.

[00:29:52] Yeah, you kind of just had a chocobo and biomes only became accessible.

[00:29:57] They kind of did a little bit of that.

[00:29:58] Different biomes become accessible with different vehicles that you have.

[00:30:02] Like in this one, you needed the to cross like in the desert in.

[00:30:08] I can't remember names right now.

[00:30:10] Nouns.

[00:30:10] I'm always going to have trouble with nouns and corral.

[00:30:13] You needed the buggy to get across like the little river.

[00:30:17] It was kind of like that where it was different color chocobos that could do different things.

[00:30:21] And so they kind of did it like this.

[00:30:24] But now the chocobos more or less have.

[00:30:26] A bigger gimmick.

[00:30:30] Yeah, it's similar, except there were a couple of points where I was like,

[00:30:33] why does it take so goddamn long to get up this cliff?

[00:30:37] Yeah, yeah, that's that was in Gongaga, right?

[00:30:41] I thought it was Junon.

[00:30:43] Junon is where you're climbing.

[00:30:45] Oh, the Gongaga ones were the bouncy mushroom.

[00:30:47] Yeah, those were weird, too.

[00:30:49] Yeah, a lot of people have a lot of problems with Gongaga's navigation.

[00:30:54] A lot of people have a lot of problems with Gongaga's navigation in general,

[00:30:57] just because you got to bounce and there's like no clear path of where you're going.

[00:31:03] But yeah, if we're talking biomes like.

[00:31:07] I like how there's a little bit of everything.

[00:31:09] It's not a this is not a Star Wars planet.

[00:31:11] You're you got like jungle, you got desert, a lot of desert, but it makes sense with the

[00:31:17] plot of the game since, you know, we're pulling all of the planet's lifeblood out.

[00:31:23] Right, exactly.

[00:31:23] Livestream.

[00:31:25] So it makes sense that there's a lot of desert,

[00:31:27] but you get the sense that Cosmo Canyon was always a desert.

[00:31:32] Right, right.

[00:31:33] And but yeah, like and there's a lot of beauty in it still.

[00:31:37] I like this is not a thing that ever existed in any of the games,

[00:31:40] but like in the grasslands and stuff, how they just had like.

[00:31:45] Little wisps of livestream that would just be dancing around in the grass like a fairy.

[00:31:51] I thought that was really cool and like a like a touch that like I don't know why

[00:31:56] like I wouldn't think that the livestream would be ever present everywhere, but of course it

[00:32:00] would be. It's just magic, right? And I really liked seeing that as like a like a minor detail.

[00:32:06] Right. Cool.

[00:32:08] Yeah, I liked how they led you to the or was it the owls that led you to the shrines?

[00:32:14] That was cool too.

[00:32:15] Yeah, like they they're they just flag you down and they bring you to the the livestream

[00:32:20] right springs basically.

[00:32:23] The the shrines, the divine those hell stuff.

[00:32:27] Yeah, for the for your summons you'd get you'd find like these weird little

[00:32:32] it almost looked like Vex like like blocky things that almost like block like crystals.

[00:32:40] If crystals formed blocks instead of triangle shapes or whatever.

[00:32:45] And yeah, that I I do wish that the bosses like not the bosses, but the summons were like

[00:32:53] real fights instead of like. You know what they were, which is just Chad Lee challenges,

[00:33:00] but I do like that the summons were like a part of the world and that it did make

[00:33:04] like it made like a bit of sense geographically like in.

[00:33:09] And in the Nibelheim region, how like Odin, because, you know, it's sort of it.

[00:33:17] It fits the theme of the region.

[00:33:19] Right. I really liked the way that they did that.

[00:33:23] I thought that was neat, a neat way to implement those.

[00:33:26] Yeah, by the time I got to Nibelheim, I was done exploring.

[00:33:28] I was just like, OK, let's get to the end of the game and then it was the coolest.

[00:33:33] It was the coolest chocobo as well.

[00:33:34] And I did get the chocobo.

[00:33:37] I got the chocobo in every region.

[00:33:39] Right on. Yeah, you got to.

[00:33:41] I think literally you actually have to because if you don't.

[00:33:45] I don't know.

[00:33:45] I think Cosmo Canyon, you could actually get away with not for some reason.

[00:33:49] For the story.

[00:33:50] That's nice.

[00:33:51] Crazy. So because as soon as you get in on the off the plane,

[00:33:54] you land at where the chocobo thing is and you got to talk to.

[00:33:57] I'm not going to remember the girl's name, but it's a lady who runs it.

[00:34:01] And I think you would need that to get to anyway.

[00:34:04] Maybe I'll take your word for it right now.

[00:34:05] But I thought the chocobos were more important than they were in Cosmo Canyon,

[00:34:08] and I got really lost in like the whole obstacle course of flying.

[00:34:13] And I spent probably like two hours running around before I realized

[00:34:16] I could have just walked straight on the path and got into the town.

[00:34:19] Yeah, I will say I probably the most confusion

[00:34:25] I had in trying to navigate was in Cosmo Canyon, just because it's so stacked.

[00:34:30] Yeah, as far as really weird.

[00:34:32] Yeah, really weird.

[00:34:34] Really weird.

[00:34:36] Party configurations and synergy abilities.

[00:34:38] This was something new to this, because in remake,

[00:34:42] you had a set party for whatever part of the game you were in.

[00:34:46] Yes.

[00:34:46] And this also introduces synergy abilities,

[00:34:49] both the ones that are just on the quick menu and the super duper synergy abilities.

[00:34:55] What do you think about those?

[00:34:56] Was that a fun aspect they added?

[00:34:59] Absolutely.

[00:35:01] This is something that you missed not playing the Yuffie adventure in Intermission.

[00:35:06] Yuffie and Sonin had some of the synergy abilities.

[00:35:10] I don't believe they had the quick ones, the quick abilities,

[00:35:12] but they did have like the big synergy attacks.

[00:35:15] I think it's been a minute since I only played that once.

[00:35:19] But I thought that that worked really well.

[00:35:21] And I pretty much beat the game before I realized the utility of like the quick abilities.

[00:35:27] I seem to do them by accident a lot.

[00:35:32] But, you know, I like that it...

[00:35:35] Because like when you play a game like this,

[00:35:37] a lot of people would be tempted to just like stick with Cloud

[00:35:41] and just let the other characters do whatever they're going to do.

[00:35:44] Maybe cycle to someone if they want to do an ability or a heal or something,

[00:35:48] or if Cloud gets knocked out.

[00:35:50] But it really incentivizes you to switch

[00:35:53] and build the ATB charges using different things on each of your party members.

[00:35:57] So that way you can do those big synergy abilities because they're strong as hell.

[00:36:02] And even the quick ones are really, really strong

[00:36:06] and they don't take ATB.

[00:36:08] So it's really useful.

[00:36:09] Absolutely.

[00:36:10] So yeah, I would argue that those are actually...

[00:36:12] And I didn't realize this until way too late,

[00:36:14] but those are probably more useful because they don't use ATB and they hit so hard.

[00:36:20] I played on normal for most of the game.

[00:36:23] And as of where my characters are at now,

[00:36:27] and I didn't like, you know,

[00:36:28] I didn't power level or grind just to level or anything,

[00:36:32] but like nothing can survive like the magic swing that Cloud and Aerith do.

[00:36:39] Nouns are bad.

[00:36:40] Oh, I love that one.

[00:36:41] But yeah, I mean, like just nothing survives it.

[00:36:44] Isn't it like Spellblade or something like that?

[00:36:46] I think so.

[00:36:47] Yeah.

[00:36:47] Yeah.

[00:36:49] Yeah, like it hits so hard.

[00:36:51] And if I would have known that 50 hours before I found out

[00:36:55] and like how reliable it was,

[00:36:57] then the whole game probably would have been a lot more trivialized for me.

[00:37:02] But yeah, I did.

[00:37:05] I did figure it out like not that far in.

[00:37:07] I think maybe Cosmo Canyon is when I started using it heavily.

[00:37:11] I think my relying on what I learned from Rebirth or remake.

[00:37:16] God, that's going to it's going to kill me

[00:37:18] relying with what I had already known from playing remakes so many times.

[00:37:23] I didn't take the time to learn the new stuff

[00:37:26] and I just fell back on old stuff without like really paying too much attention.

[00:37:31] Right.

[00:37:32] That's where it got me.

[00:37:33] What do you think the third one is going to be?

[00:37:35] By the way, do you think reunion?

[00:37:37] They can't use a reunion because they use it

[00:37:41] to use reunion for the crisis core redo

[00:37:46] or whatever that they put on the current gen consoles.

[00:37:51] I believe that maybe it was Nomura

[00:37:56] who said that they were going to use reunion for this game

[00:38:00] because it made the most sense for this game.

[00:38:03] But so no, it is pretty much.

[00:38:06] And also there is a Twitter account

[00:38:10] that if you want to know the latest news and stuff coming from Japan,

[00:38:15] I'll I'll get it to you and maybe we should put it in the notes.

[00:38:18] But there is a someone who translates the Ultimania for the game.

[00:38:23] All right. So real quick, each one of these games has a book

[00:38:28] that is basically like director's notes and stuff for them.

[00:38:33] And it's called Ultimania.

[00:38:34] They get into like this is why we made these decisions.

[00:38:38] These are plot things that maybe we didn't lay out all the way in the game.

[00:38:41] But this is like definitive answers, blah, blah, blah.

[00:38:45] And they released the Ultimania couple, maybe a month or two ago.

[00:38:51] So like it filled out some of the like little details, that being one of them.

[00:38:56] And now that I say all this, I forget what I was talking about in the first place.

[00:39:00] But it is one of the details that that they they put out there in the Ultimania.

[00:39:05] OK, which is what what three might be called?

[00:39:10] Yes, that that well, that we know that it's not going to be.

[00:39:14] OK, not because they can't because they can't use it,

[00:39:18] which they should have used it for this game because it would have been perfect

[00:39:21] because that's literally what we're doing in the entire process of the game of the story.

[00:39:25] So, yeah, we're fair enough. We are igniting.

[00:39:28] Well, why don't we get more into the story?

[00:39:33] Somebody. Yeah, let's do that.

[00:39:34] I was I was trying to remember somebody had like a very good reword

[00:39:39] to put for the third game, but if I remember it, we'll get back to it.

[00:39:44] Remake, remake, redo, reduce, key, recycle.

[00:39:52] If you say so. All right.

[00:39:56] Cloud and the rest of Avalanche leave.

[00:39:59] You know what? I'm going to start over because I'm going to explain to you what I did.

[00:40:02] I broke this up into one, two, three, four, five sections.

[00:40:06] And we're going to talk about each plot section separately just to,

[00:40:09] you know, go over the biomes that we went to and whatnot

[00:40:11] and what we liked from those sections.

[00:40:14] Maybe give that overview for the podcast.

[00:40:16] Actually, I did like that's what I did right now.

[00:40:20] Oh, OK.

[00:40:23] I thought that was like a note.

[00:40:24] OK, carry on them.

[00:40:27] They know what you're doing.

[00:40:28] They know what we're doing.

[00:40:29] Leave it in.

[00:40:30] All right.

[00:40:31] Main plot synopsis.

[00:40:32] Cloud and the rest of Avalanche leave Midgar to find and defeat Sephiroth.

[00:40:38] Cloud recounts his Nibelheim mission with Sephiroth that led to the destruction of his hometown

[00:40:43] and the assumed death of Sephiroth.

[00:40:46] The party begins in calm, but must quickly flee to the grasslands after Shinra appears.

[00:40:52] Finding themselves in Junon, they infiltrate a military parade

[00:40:55] in honor of Rufus Shinra's rise to power.

[00:40:58] There, they're joined by Yuffie, who interrupts their almost pardon

[00:41:02] with an assassination attempt on the president.

[00:41:06] A lot of stuff in there.

[00:41:08] Um, how how at what point were you like fully hooked by this game?

[00:41:14] Like, how did you like the the storytelling that Cloud did in calm there?

[00:41:20] Oh, I loved it.

[00:41:21] I was right in.

[00:41:22] Yeah, it's I really, really love the way they handled it.

[00:41:26] Because, I mean, it is exactly like they did it in the original.

[00:41:30] What with like the pausing and Barrett asking silly questions or sometimes good questions

[00:41:35] or our Tifa and in they added Eryth as well being upset that Cloud is in.

[00:41:41] If you choose to do it, that Cloud is in her childhood room.

[00:41:46] The piano.

[00:41:47] It was a thing.

[00:41:50] I really love the way that they they did that cloud like.

[00:41:53] Cloud seeming like so much cooler here right at the beginning,

[00:41:59] like he's like a little bit more comfortable with this group of friends here

[00:42:03] and just like sort of, you know, it, you know, telling his story.

[00:42:09] And like little puppy cloud and his adventure with Sephiroth was rad as well.

[00:42:17] I love that.

[00:42:18] I love him being like, hey, Mr. Sephiroth, let's go off to town.

[00:42:23] Yeah, it was almost as good as Red using his real voice.

[00:42:27] Right.

[00:42:30] Yeah, I like that.

[00:42:31] I like how Nibelheim like you can tell there's just really horrible,

[00:42:34] messed up monsters everywhere that that Sephiroth does not give a shit about because he's so badass.

[00:42:41] I always love getting glimpses of hero Sephiroth because like he's such a Darth Vader character

[00:42:48] that like for for, you know, all of us think of him as that way.

[00:42:52] But it's hard to forget that he's like a straight up hero to everyone.

[00:42:57] And, you know, it's always cool to see him in that way before,

[00:43:02] you know, the horrifying, terrible things that he does after that.

[00:43:09] I really like the way that played out.

[00:43:11] You get the iconic Sephiroth destroying the town

[00:43:15] with him turning around and walking into the flames.

[00:43:20] But let me make sure that I have to press R2 and L2 repeatedly to get.

[00:43:24] Of course, I'm going to watch him.

[00:43:28] We got to watch him slowly murder people with guns.

[00:43:31] Why would they approach him with the guns whenever he has a sword that's like 14 feet long?

[00:43:38] The something that jumped out to me is like the first steps that you take in the

[00:43:44] like if you're coming from remake, you're like, oh man, this is going to be a pain in the ass

[00:43:49] to navigate. But the way you like are able to just more freely roam the world in this game

[00:43:55] feels great.

[00:43:56] Yes.

[00:43:56] Just jumping through rocks over rocks and stuff.

[00:43:58] When in the last game, you had to like find a ladder if you wanted to take a step up some

[00:44:03] steps in the first game.

[00:44:05] So it's just way improved, which I'm not going to talk too many like just straight up gameplay

[00:44:09] because we're talking story right now.

[00:44:10] But that's just I totally agree with you, though.

[00:44:12] It's you know, you open up the new game and you it's a breath of fresh air compared to remake.

[00:44:18] And that's saying something because remake felt good anyway.

[00:44:21] It did.

[00:44:21] And like the way that you head off up to the reactor and it plays the opening credits there

[00:44:29] as you're like running and, you know, Tifa is there and it is they got the coolest like

[00:44:34] country version of her.

[00:44:37] Her theme song is played on like a banjo and stuff and her little cowboy outfit.

[00:44:42] She's just so adorable and badass.

[00:44:46] Young Tifa is cool as hell.

[00:44:48] Zangon with his like sizing up cloud with his little tiny muscles trying to teach him

[00:44:53] how to fight.

[00:44:54] They just crushed it.

[00:44:57] And and yeah, you get those little those little barbs with Sephiroth where he literally says

[00:45:03] that cloud is such a puppy.

[00:45:07] Yeah, it's really great.

[00:45:08] Really great.

[00:45:08] But you also like seeing cloud sort of loses innocence there, where by the end he's really

[00:45:14] like trying to fight Sephiroth and trying to do the right thing.

[00:45:18] Whereas before, like he didn't just go, oh boy, if Sephiroth doing it, it must be right.

[00:45:23] I think part of that was watching his friend get hurt for sure.

[00:45:27] Yeah.

[00:45:29] There's a there's a lot of stuff that I know that you might not and that I don't want to

[00:45:36] really spoil here, but I think that the way that they handled just about every bit of

[00:45:41] the flashback, I don't think they could have done it any better.

[00:45:44] Yeah.

[00:45:46] And I'm sure that just culturally, even if you haven't played through the first game,

[00:45:50] you'll know parts of that.

[00:45:51] But I think I think they they really crushed it.

[00:45:54] And I have no qualms with calm.

[00:45:58] Junon joining the party back in like present times.

[00:46:04] Oh, and they did this whole weird thing where you you have to escape Shinra again and get

[00:46:09] into it.

[00:46:10] Yeah.

[00:46:11] And get into the getting through the grasslands and all that.

[00:46:16] Is this now I'm having a hard time.

[00:46:19] This is the point where the you have to get around the Midgard stormer, right?

[00:46:25] The big snake thing.

[00:46:28] Yes, I think so.

[00:46:30] This would be that where you're getting a lot of flashes of Sephiroth.

[00:46:33] You're getting.

[00:46:34] Yes, yes, yes.

[00:46:34] The the cloaked men, all those guys.

[00:46:38] And you're you're basically following the the cloaked men for this whole game.

[00:46:42] Yeah.

[00:46:44] But yeah, the all that and then you get the Junon.

[00:46:49] What did you think about the parade and stuff at Junon?

[00:46:52] How did you how did that make you feel?

[00:46:54] I had a fantastic time.

[00:46:55] I have to tell you, I found every single troop because I just wanted the full.

[00:47:01] I wanted the full regalia for cloud to perform with everybody.

[00:47:06] And it was great, and I and I did it well enough to get the achievement

[00:47:10] or the trophy, whatever it is.

[00:47:11] I'm I'm very happy with that one.

[00:47:14] I don't want to 100% the game, but I was like, I'm getting this trophy.

[00:47:18] If there's a trophy here, I'm getting it.

[00:47:20] Yeah, I think this is obviously this game's answer to the dance off

[00:47:25] from the first game sort of uses a similar mechanic

[00:47:29] where you're you know, you're following this ethereal thing that leads to the

[00:47:33] context sensitive button press that you have to do to make your your dudes do whatever.

[00:47:38] But yeah, it was very fun trying to fight like I really liked

[00:47:42] roaming around the city and trying to find all the guys.

[00:47:45] I like this is our first taste of our main crew in different costumes.

[00:47:51] Oh, yeah.

[00:47:52] Yeah, it's cool to see everybody in their little Shinra get ups.

[00:47:55] That was fun.

[00:47:56] I'm still obviously who they are like, and I think in the original game,

[00:48:01] they just they swapped out sprites or whatever they were using.

[00:48:06] But Cloud still was walking around with the Buster sword.

[00:48:08] So he is very clearly Cloud still.

[00:48:10] And yeah, he's a soldier.

[00:48:12] He's just he's a soldier.

[00:48:13] He was not ever a cadet or whatever it was.

[00:48:17] Yes.

[00:48:18] Yeah.

[00:48:19] So the yeah, I really enjoyed June on and all that there.

[00:48:26] The Yuffie was pretty fun at this point, too.

[00:48:31] And you know, the academy at this point.

[00:48:33] Absolutely.

[00:48:36] Which is the charm of Yuffie.

[00:48:38] I think you you get a little bit in intermission.

[00:48:41] You get kind of either you love her or you hate her at that point.

[00:48:46] I'm definitely used to the way that they are characterizing her now.

[00:48:49] So like I was I was I was pretty much only charmed.

[00:48:53] Um, but maybe it's because I had that bit of, uh, you know, in there.

[00:48:59] I was already in the tank for her a little bit.

[00:49:01] I really like the way that they are characterizing Rufus.

[00:49:06] Rufus Shinra is David Bowie looking ass.

[00:49:10] He is.

[00:49:10] Yes.

[00:49:12] He just seems so cool and collected.

[00:49:14] And I like that.

[00:49:15] They kind of treat him like a like a pop star.

[00:49:19] Yeah.

[00:49:19] And also he's he's different from his dad, right?

[00:49:21] He's like, listen, I don't care about your stupid bombings.

[00:49:25] It's all done.

[00:49:26] Can you just go handle Sephiroth for me?

[00:49:28] That was a cool moment that Yuffie completely botches.

[00:49:31] She just ruined it.

[00:49:32] Yeah.

[00:49:33] Yeah, I I like that, too.

[00:49:35] He's a he is a different face and direction for Shinra.

[00:49:40] It seems like.

[00:49:43] But then you have and I didn't really write this in the summary,

[00:49:45] but then you have this weird thing going on with Wu Tai

[00:49:48] and just wackiness going on with like what is going on between Shinra and Wu Tai at this point.

[00:49:56] Yeah, I don't think it's it's a spoiler to say that Wu Tai played a part in the other game

[00:50:04] or in the original game, but it seems like they're laying a lot more groundwork for Wu Tai

[00:50:08] to maybe in part three be like a way bigger thing.

[00:50:11] Because like you can kind of ignore Wu Tai, because honestly, Yuffie in the original game

[00:50:17] was an optional character.

[00:50:19] You didn't need her at all.

[00:50:21] Really?

[00:50:21] As you actually kind of had, you didn't have to take her into your party at all.

[00:50:25] No, you could actually like mess it up and not get her into your party

[00:50:29] because you use the wrong you answered her questions wrong, basically.

[00:50:33] Oh, wow.

[00:50:34] Then she just steals some of your stuff and you never see her again.

[00:50:37] And you can still finish the game like that.

[00:50:39] Yep.

[00:50:39] She's not in the she's not even in the end cut scenes of the game.

[00:50:43] Wow.

[00:50:44] You're not in there.

[00:50:45] That's just an optional character.

[00:50:46] Yeah, that you know, JRPGs used to roll different.

[00:50:51] They didn't give you everything if you didn't work for it.

[00:50:53] Yeah.

[00:50:55] Weird, weird.

[00:50:56] Yeah, she's definitely persona still has a lot of like miscible events like persona.

[00:51:01] If you don't, you know, get your social links up fast enough, you might not ever

[00:51:09] get the rewards from that relationship and things like that, you know, and you

[00:51:11] you could actually miss out on the entire postgame DLC and persona by not getting

[00:51:16] certain social links up in time.

[00:51:19] I kind of like that, but I think I'm too spoiled at this point.

[00:51:23] I mean, you just look up what social link to max out to get to the DLC.

[00:51:26] There's plenty of guys for that.

[00:51:28] For sure.

[00:51:29] But I mean, yeah, that and like, you know, if you miss it, play it again.

[00:51:33] That's what they want.

[00:51:34] Not no, no, no, not for 100 hours.

[00:51:36] Yeah, I'm sorry, but I am 80 hours into persona five and I'm not close to the end.

[00:51:41] And it's a problem.

[00:51:44] It's a problem.

[00:51:46] A fun problem sounds like.

[00:51:49] The.

[00:51:51] All right.

[00:51:52] All right.

[00:51:54] So let's go on to the party going on a cruise to Costa del Sol, a tropical resort where

[00:52:00] they meet their old enemy, Hojo Mojo Jojo.

[00:52:06] They narrowly escape capture and go to Corral Barrett's hometown, where he is a pariah.

[00:52:11] After a mini game fest at the Golden Saucer, the group and their new companion, Kate Sith,

[00:52:17] find Barrett's old friend Dine Barrett and Dine battle over their past mistakes,

[00:52:22] and the group moves on to Ganga Ganga Ganga Ganga.

[00:52:27] I can't say it.

[00:52:30] I don't believe you there.

[00:52:32] They go to an old reactor, learn more about Sephiroth's plan and watch cloud go a little

[00:52:36] off the rails.

[00:52:39] That's also a lot of stuff.

[00:52:40] You're actually doing a very good job of bite sizing this game.

[00:52:44] I'm trying.

[00:52:44] You know, I've been doing this for about two years now, summarizing stories.

[00:52:48] So I I better be able to do it by now.

[00:52:51] Oh, you know what?

[00:52:51] You're crushing it.

[00:52:53] Did how did did you expect a a tropical vacation at this point in the game?

[00:52:59] No, it felt very like a hard left turn.

[00:53:04] Yes, it definitely did of the original.

[00:53:06] And it was I think maybe I was more looking forward to the Gold Saucer, but Costa del Sol

[00:53:13] was a very close second and it did not for me anyway.

[00:53:16] It did not disappoint.

[00:53:19] Yeah, I liked both of those places.

[00:53:20] I really, really, really enjoyed.

[00:53:23] I mean, I guess I most enjoyed the whole dying thing and Barrett's.

[00:53:28] Definitely that.

[00:53:30] I mean, I always found Barrett a little exhausting.

[00:53:34] Did I say Barrett like Arath and Barrett?

[00:53:36] Anyway, Barrett a little exhausting, but this made me see his character in such a different

[00:53:42] light and made me like him a lot better.

[00:53:46] Yes, this is this is kind of Barrett's arc and it sort of plays out in its own like whole

[00:53:53] section of the game.

[00:53:55] And I think they handled it really well here.

[00:53:58] There's like a little bit of a mini mystery of like, you know, did Barrett murder these

[00:54:02] people in the Gold Saucer?

[00:54:07] And the way that that plays out is pretty.

[00:54:09] They do a weird thing where you're you're you're basically God killing heroes at this

[00:54:15] point get captured by a group of thugs.

[00:54:18] And the way that they play it is so funny because it seems like they can break out of the game

[00:54:23] like they can break out if they wanted to, but they're just like, just go cloud.

[00:54:28] Just do whatever they need you to do.

[00:54:30] We don't want to have to murder all these people.

[00:54:33] All these thugs.

[00:54:35] That's the like that's the like gravity that they seem to give this whole situation.

[00:54:42] Can I say the memes on TikTok and and on Reddit where they show cloud on the

[00:54:53] the Segway in Costa del Sol and they're like, we need to find Sephiroth cloud.

[00:55:00] Yeah, very.

[00:55:01] It is very good.

[00:55:02] I love the world is falling apart.

[00:55:04] Cloud, what's he doing?

[00:55:06] Red in his little Segway.

[00:55:08] I love the inclusion of that and like the the beach outfits that you got to put on, even

[00:55:13] though the dudes in the black cloaks can go on the beach without beach outfits just fine.

[00:55:18] Well, like they probably my head cannon is they ask them to stop, but they don't listen

[00:55:23] to anybody.

[00:55:23] So they just yeah, they're just they just walk.

[00:55:26] Nobody wanted to touch him.

[00:55:28] Yeah, that's that's probably the barrel dirty.

[00:55:30] Probably they smell like like work boots.

[00:55:35] Yeah, the yeah, I loved beach volleyball outfits for everybody.

[00:55:40] The you get your I think here you get your first little glimpse of Red 13 and his real

[00:55:46] voice because he does like a weird little gasp.

[00:55:50] He might have an eye for humans, it seems like because he gets a little bashful around

[00:55:55] seeing Earth and Tifa in their bikinis.

[00:55:59] But yeah, and then the weird just hojo fight on the beach.

[00:56:05] But yeah, moving on to the obviously like the Gold Saucer is a fun little like Disney

[00:56:12] slash Las Vegas area.

[00:56:14] And I think it is visually breathtaking.

[00:56:17] The introduction there where there's like a J-pop like dance number that when they show

[00:56:24] like Dio for the first time and you fee puts on like this weird little like outfit and

[00:56:30] they do a choreographed dance.

[00:56:33] I just my job was.

[00:56:35] Dio is straight out of one piece like he is just an anime character.

[00:56:40] It reminded me of Hercule from Dragon Ball Z.

[00:56:44] He does look like Hercule.

[00:56:45] Yeah, and I just he's just so ripped and like he just the most sort of macho man like energy

[00:56:54] coming off of him where he flexes and every like he punctuates all of his sentences with

[00:56:59] flexes and stuff.

[00:57:01] Very fun, great character.

[00:57:02] I like him a lot.

[00:57:04] And oh, and that whole thing culminates in like a like a VR boxing match that you got

[00:57:11] to do.

[00:57:12] And they they do a thing in this game where they use the old, you know, the very few

[00:57:18] polygon versions of the characters in a couple of different spots for many games in a very

[00:57:24] charming way.

[00:57:25] Yeah, I really liked the.

[00:57:27] I forgot what it was called, but where you're looking for like the secret pieces of something

[00:57:35] and you have to fight with the turn based kind of.

[00:57:39] Yeah, the Fort Condor thing.

[00:57:40] Yeah, yeah, Fort Condor.

[00:57:41] That's what I'm trying to say.

[00:57:44] The that whole like side quest line, I can't remember exactly what it's the proto relic

[00:57:50] quest line.

[00:57:50] That's what it is.

[00:57:52] Yeah, that is like I didn't realize how mandatory it was until I actually completed the game.

[00:57:59] But that's sort of what I'm chipping away at right now is doing the proto relic quest.

[00:58:03] But if you have not played this game yet, I don't know why you're listening to this.

[00:58:06] But if you have not done the proto relic thing, do it, go back and do that because it is

[00:58:13] very important and it's very fun.

[00:58:15] Interesting, because I didn't finish it.

[00:58:17] You should.

[00:58:18] OK, I'll look.

[00:58:20] Eyes to the camera.

[00:58:21] Go ahead and do the proto relic thing.

[00:58:22] You're going to need to.

[00:58:24] This is an audio only podcast, folks.

[00:58:28] The Dine stuff back to that to just finish off.

[00:58:32] I think in the original game, it was handled a little bit more subtly with Dine, but I

[00:58:41] think they did a great job here in translating it.

[00:58:44] The Dine fight as Barrett was pretty good, and I like how Dines gun arm just seems to

[00:58:50] have some wild nanomachine bullshit.

[00:58:54] It is just a very cool gun arm that I wish that I could have stolen for Barrett.

[00:58:59] But just just that it'll be fine.

[00:59:02] The emotional.

[00:59:03] Yeah, that's what we should do.

[00:59:04] I mean, he's not using it.

[00:59:06] The emotional weight of all of it for Barrett because they sort of drop everything for him.

[00:59:12] Everything for him here, and it sort of paints his character in such a different light.

[00:59:18] He lost everything.

[00:59:21] And when he I mean, it just shows like and the way they handle it with Marlene where

[00:59:27] because Dine thinks, you know, Marlene is obviously Dines daughter.

[00:59:31] Right.

[00:59:32] And he thought that she died.

[00:59:34] And when Barrett explains to him that no, Marlene's still here and he's got a picture

[00:59:39] of her and everything, you know, his his his hands are too bloody to even hold her at this point.

[00:59:47] So he just loses his shit.

[00:59:48] And like Barrett has to suffer.

[00:59:50] Barrett has to deal with his death again of his best friend.

[00:59:56] And I really think of it that way.

[00:59:57] It's like a second death for him.

[00:59:59] Yes.

[01:00:00] And it's just so brutal because I mean, he has to look into Dines eyes with with every

[01:00:04] time the person who's the most important person to him in the entire world.

[01:00:10] Just looks like his friend.

[01:00:11] So like it's it's a it's a hard thing that he has to deal with.

[01:00:14] And like, it makes sense why for one thing, it's when you adopt a kid, that's your kid.

[01:00:19] So like it kind of doesn't matter at this point, but it's just such an important.

[01:00:25] Painting on to his character, like why this matters so much.

[01:00:29] And they do it.

[01:00:30] It explains why he hates Shinra as much.

[01:00:35] And it's funny because like.

[01:00:38] He was like they wanted to do like coal.

[01:00:41] That's what they did in Coral.

[01:00:44] Corral is such a it's a funny thing to think about that coal is probably a way better option

[01:00:50] than stealing the lifeblood from the planet.

[01:00:54] And you know that that's what the bear really pulled hard to get that make a mock.

[01:01:00] I'm never going to remember that it's Mako Mako reactor.

[01:01:03] I got every noun wrong when I read this game, the original game.

[01:01:07] It was let's see Junin or Junion.

[01:01:13] Sorry is what I used to call it.

[01:01:15] Coral is what I called it.

[01:01:18] Mako is what I called it.

[01:01:19] Every single one I got wrong.

[01:01:23] Well, I'm grateful that I played remake first then probably probably good, at least for,

[01:01:27] you know, you know, not getting people mad that you pronounce things wrong.

[01:01:31] Yeah.

[01:01:32] Do you have anything else to add on dying?

[01:01:34] I really like the way they handled all of that.

[01:01:37] It's interesting.

[01:01:37] I did not get this far in the original before I got frustrated and put it down, but I've

[01:01:44] heard criticism of how they changed it.

[01:01:47] I've heard that people liked it better in the first one where he.

[01:01:52] He threatens to kill Marlene with him and that's what gets Barrett to finally turn on him.

[01:01:58] Yeah, I think there's like a couple of small differences, but I think that one is just

[01:02:05] it's going to be a roll of the dice whether or not you like it more or less.

[01:02:09] This is one of the areas where I'm like they might not have improved upon it on from the

[01:02:16] OG as much because a lot of the a lot of the things I'll say are kind of just straight

[01:02:21] upgrades in this game, but with one, I think glaring omission, but.

[01:02:28] This is one of the ones that's more like maybe the OG did it better, but I'm not upset

[01:02:34] with the way they handled it here.

[01:02:36] Okay, good.

[01:02:39] But yeah, so now they move on to going Gaga, which is how you say that.

[01:02:43] I.

[01:02:46] Gungaga felt like almost meaningless until until you get to the reactor like, but the

[01:02:51] town felt kind of meaningless other than we haven't really talked about Zach.

[01:02:55] I kind of left him out of most of the recap, but.

[01:02:57] I completely forgot to talk about it because he's like we can handle Zach now if you like.

[01:03:04] He's kind of been entirely a nothing burger for this whole game.

[01:03:09] I know he's it's fan service.

[01:03:12] The game actually starts with Zach.

[01:03:14] I forgot all about that.

[01:03:16] And he just pops up every few chapters.

[01:03:19] Yes, with bigs and bigs is alive.

[01:03:22] And you're in this alternate universe where everyone's dying.

[01:03:27] Yeah, at the I think at the end we can we can deal with the alternate universe of it all.

[01:03:32] But I mean, like, yeah, this gungaga exists.

[01:03:36] It existed in the original game, but they sort of stretch it out a little bit here

[01:03:42] with the reactor and just with like, it's all to like to show how and where Zach grew up.

[01:03:50] It seems like and to like, which is very strange for their characterization.

[01:03:53] It is.

[01:03:54] Can I ask you was Zach just dead as of the original Nibelheim trip with Sephiroth in the original?

[01:04:05] Was he was he gone for good?

[01:04:10] I'll say no.

[01:04:12] Okay, you don't have to say more.

[01:04:14] That's fine.

[01:04:15] I don't want to say too much more about what Zach was doing in the original game.

[01:04:21] I will say that.

[01:04:26] What do I want to say?

[01:04:27] This game does say that that Aerith and Zach had a relationship.

[01:04:36] So it is they do actually use this to sort of give Aerith a little bit more characterization

[01:04:43] because and they do it in an interesting way where Aerith talks to Tifa about Zach.

[01:04:49] But she doesn't give cloud very much about it because she's hot right cloud.

[01:04:53] So and her and Tifa are like just straight besties, which which is very nice.

[01:05:00] There's obviously like a love triangle with Tifa and cloud and Aerith.

[01:05:04] And I love that never for one second does an ounce of jealousy get between Aerith and Tifa's

[01:05:14] friendship.

[01:05:16] I think they do an excellent job with with making with showing how close they became so fast as well.

[01:05:24] Yeah, not a lot of competition by the end of the game anyway.

[01:05:27] No, I'd say not.

[01:05:29] That's kind of all that Gongaga does, except that they do whole they have an entire like

[01:05:35] wild bit of stuff with the weapons, weapons being planetary Godzilla kind of creatures.

[01:05:43] Um, and this is also the first point where cloud goes completely buck wild with his.

[01:05:52] With his.

[01:05:55] Like brainwashing, Genova brainwashing bullshit.

[01:05:58] Yeah, I still don't understand fully how it happens, but I think it's a part three spoiler.

[01:06:04] Um.

[01:06:06] I don't.

[01:06:07] Yeah, I guess so.

[01:06:08] I think there's more to be revealed that I don't know yet, and that's fine.

[01:06:12] Yeah, I think part of it is just that Sephiroth is an expert gas lighter.

[01:06:18] He's definitely great at that.

[01:06:20] It's one of his superpowers.

[01:06:23] But yeah, they do this thing where Tifa goes into the live stream itself, it seems like.

[01:06:29] Yes.

[01:06:33] Yeah, that was pretty interesting.

[01:06:36] The like weird sort of insights she gets into there and I was like for a second.

[01:06:40] I was like, are they about to kill Tifa?

[01:06:42] Like, is this about to die?

[01:06:46] Which would have been wild.

[01:06:50] But yeah, they didn't.

[01:06:51] And Tifa gets spit out by the weapon and clouds just kind of let off the hook and they just move

[01:06:56] right along to Cosmo Canyon.

[01:07:00] Yeah, did we get any that you can remember?

[01:07:03] It says to learn more about Sephiroth's plan.

[01:07:06] Did they get anything from here from from there about Sephiroth?

[01:07:11] I think that was where they figured out that the white

[01:07:14] whispers were helping Areth and the black whispers were helping Sephiroth.

[01:07:19] I see.

[01:07:20] OK, yes.

[01:07:21] Oh, and something about the whispers, they they are supposed to have died in the last game.

[01:07:26] That's kind of what the whole fight at the end of the last game did was you got rid of the whispers.

[01:07:31] And interestingly, now the whispers all have a like purple glowing eye on them.

[01:07:35] The black ones do, which is sort of a mark of Genova.

[01:07:41] Because Genova only has the one eye.

[01:07:45] The one purple eye.

[01:07:46] So it seems like that's probably what's going on there with them.

[01:07:51] Yeah, so Cosmo Canyon, Cosmo Canyon.

[01:07:55] We'll get there right after the break and we're back.

[01:08:12] Let's talk Cosmo Canyon.

[01:08:14] I mean, we get a lot here, quite a lot.

[01:08:19] And the first thing is we get a new voice for Red.

[01:08:23] And before I recap, I just want to say when Red first spoke that way,

[01:08:29] I thought there was a glitch in the audio where a different voice actor,

[01:08:34] like a placeholder or something was left in some scratch.

[01:08:37] I thought there was a mistake.

[01:08:39] And I was devastated when I found out that was how he was going to sound the rest of the game.

[01:08:44] Yeah, I hated it.

[01:08:47] Me too.

[01:08:49] I really didn't like that.

[01:08:51] You know, I like the idea, but I think the execution went a little too hard

[01:08:57] on making him sound like a widdle baby.

[01:09:01] Yeah, it's just it was a big adjustment is the same voice actor,

[01:09:05] which, you know, shows his range, which is nice, I guess.

[01:09:11] But yeah, I didn't I didn't care for that.

[01:09:16] Also, did we take the tiny Bronco to get here?

[01:09:18] I think we did.

[01:09:19] Yes, I believe so.

[01:09:21] So we would have been introduced at this point from Gungaga.

[01:09:24] That's right.

[01:09:25] We took the plane, the tiny Bronco.

[01:09:26] So we were introduced to Sid, who seems like a pretty cool guy and flies the plane.

[01:09:32] And he was so much older than I thought he would be because my introduction to Sid

[01:09:36] was Kingdom Hearts one, where he's the shop guy.

[01:09:41] Yeah, my introduction to a lot of like Cloud.

[01:09:43] My first introduction was when you have to fight him in like the Coliseum.

[01:09:49] Yep.

[01:09:49] In the Hercules Coliseum.

[01:09:53] Yeah, you would have been introduced to a lot of dudes.

[01:09:55] God, he wasn't Kingdom Hearts.

[01:09:57] I forgot Sid was in there.

[01:09:58] Yeah, he was.

[01:09:59] I thought you were.

[01:10:00] Yeah, damn.

[01:10:02] Yeah, he was.

[01:10:03] Yeah, damn.

[01:10:06] Yeah, he seemed a lot older in the original.

[01:10:08] And this one he seems which, you know, I'm a lot older.

[01:10:12] So it's always wild to think that Orin from Final Fantasy 10 is like 35.

[01:10:21] How does that make you feel?

[01:10:23] I'm sorry.

[01:10:24] Who is 10 in Final Fantasy 10?

[01:10:29] Orin is 35.

[01:10:31] Oh, I don't like that.

[01:10:34] I don't either.

[01:10:35] Because I'm 34 and Orin seemed like an old decrepit man.

[01:10:39] Yeah.

[01:10:40] Anyway, yeah, Sid, pretty cool guy, flew us on into Cosmo Canyon.

[01:10:45] And we got to learn Nanaki's real voice and name.

[01:10:50] Nanako.

[01:10:52] Nanaki is his...

[01:10:54] Is it?

[01:10:55] It is.

[01:10:56] What?

[01:10:57] I used to pronounce it Nanaki, but they pronounce it Nanaki.

[01:11:02] Okay.

[01:11:03] All right.

[01:11:05] Yeah, he's gonna leave the group to guard the canyon, huh?

[01:11:10] Yes.

[01:11:10] So this was kind of why he stuck with the group anyway is to get back to Cosmo Canyon.

[01:11:16] And we get introduced to his weird little hippie commune and his adoptive family, Boogenhagen.

[01:11:25] Boogenhagen.

[01:11:27] Why that name?

[01:11:28] You know, I don't know.

[01:11:30] I've never really looked into it.

[01:11:31] I also thought because of the way his like sprite from the old game.

[01:11:36] I don't know if they're technically sprites.

[01:11:38] I don't think they are.

[01:11:39] Whatever you call their little...

[01:11:42] The way they were animated in the original, I thought he was like a weird little

[01:11:47] tiger man or tiger wolf like Red was.

[01:11:50] But he's just an old man.

[01:11:53] I like the way that they sort of characterize him.

[01:11:59] But yeah, it's...

[01:12:01] He's kind of arrogant, right?

[01:12:03] He's arrogant at first.

[01:12:05] They're saying like, hey, the planet's dying.

[01:12:06] He's like, oh no, just go to your books.

[01:12:08] You'll see they're not actually...

[01:12:10] It's not actually dying.

[01:12:11] And then I think he's convinced by the end.

[01:12:14] Definitely.

[01:12:16] Also, planetology being like the study of the planet and all of the planets is interesting,

[01:12:23] especially when it takes like a much more like real grounded...

[01:12:27] Like this is where we kind of learn about like the Lifestream in general.

[01:12:33] And like I like their...

[01:12:38] Bugenhagen was a part of Shinra until he left because he didn't agree with the way

[01:12:44] they were advancing the tech.

[01:12:46] And up in Cosmo Canyon, they sort of have a much more harmonious relationship with technology.

[01:12:53] They're not using Lifestream.

[01:12:56] There's a lot of wind light generated power here,

[01:13:00] which is really cool that they're like synergizing with the planet there.

[01:13:08] Interesting way that they do all that there.

[01:13:12] And this is where we get the most sort of character development as well from

[01:13:18] Nanaki because he's got to go do his little trials to become the guardian of the canyon.

[01:13:24] And I like that they take...

[01:13:26] Bugenhagen sends Barret with him.

[01:13:29] They do a lot of this where they break up the characters a lot.

[01:13:32] And you're playing in this game a lot less with Cloud.

[01:13:37] He's going to be your main guy for most of the game,

[01:13:39] but they give sort of all of your characters a like sort of

[01:13:46] a moment to shine as the main character for a little bit, which I like.

[01:13:49] I do like that too, because also it forces you to sort of learn to play as the other

[01:13:53] characters were in the first one.

[01:13:54] It felt like you could just play as Cloud and never touch anybody else.

[01:13:58] Yeah, you kind of could.

[01:13:59] And I kind of did.

[01:14:00] And Yuffie is so fun to play with.

[01:14:03] She is.

[01:14:04] Obviously, they developed a whole spinoff for her.

[01:14:06] So like she's got like a very robust, you know, move set and stuff.

[01:14:13] But like Nanaki, even Red was was really enjoyable by the end of this segment.

[01:14:18] I when I did this segment, I was like, maybe I should play as Red more.

[01:14:22] Yeah, in the original game, funny enough, Red was always in my party

[01:14:29] just because I thought he was cool as hell.

[01:14:30] But I like I like him.

[01:14:33] I think the only weakness I would say from him is that to use your

[01:14:41] the majority of your good attacks, you have to do a lot of blocking,

[01:14:45] which is not what I want to do if I want to be constantly switching between characters.

[01:14:50] Right.

[01:14:51] And you kind of have to do that to get your vengeance gauge up with Red.

[01:14:56] So it's kind of a pain if you're not trying to main him,

[01:14:59] but especially whenever so many characters slot through and are able to get in and out.

[01:15:05] Real quick, who was your like main main three people?

[01:15:09] OK, Cloud, Yuffie and Aerith.

[01:15:12] OK, how about you?

[01:15:13] Solid choice.

[01:15:15] Cloud, Tifa and Aerith.

[01:15:17] OK, classic.

[01:15:19] Yep, I got to keep the Holy Trinity all the time.

[01:15:23] But I don't have really any complaints with any but one of the characters

[01:15:28] that you get to control.

[01:15:30] Oh, yeah.

[01:15:32] And yeah, and like his he's got a whole section later

[01:15:37] that sort of serves to teach you how to play as him.

[01:15:41] But the randomness of it all.

[01:15:43] And I don't like that you have to start the fight off of your mount every time.

[01:15:49] It really is just a pain in the ass.

[01:15:53] It would be like if you have to like use AP to get Cloud into

[01:16:00] not vengeance mode, but Punisher Punisher mode.

[01:16:03] It's just annoying.

[01:16:05] But yes, back to story.

[01:16:10] So this is where we get most of Red's character development with his father,

[01:16:14] which before this, I think they could have maybe gave

[01:16:17] Red a little bit more foreshadowing that he's got daddy issues

[01:16:20] because they presented them all and in full right here.

[01:16:23] And then they're just immediately resolved,

[01:16:25] which is kind of the way they did it in the original as well.

[01:16:28] But I still found it very moving.

[01:16:31] You're also introduced to like a whole new faction with the Gi.

[01:16:38] Yes, that fell out of nowhere.

[01:16:39] That one is the thing that I think most felt jarring.

[01:16:43] Yes.

[01:16:44] And they played.

[01:16:48] This isn't a spoiler.

[01:16:49] They played a very like a much smaller part in the original game.

[01:16:56] They have blown them up in such a strong degree, I think.

[01:17:02] So they.

[01:17:06] We'll get into that, I think, at the end.

[01:17:08] But yeah, they just take a much bigger role,

[01:17:12] which I think is a very interesting thing.

[01:17:15] The perpetual afterlife, so yeah,

[01:17:19] when you meet Gina talk, he which is a cool guy, I think he's a cool ass character.

[01:17:23] Well, he fights you, he fights you real bad and then he comes back.

[01:17:26] He's like, all right, come with me.

[01:17:27] I got to talk to you about this black material business.

[01:17:30] That fight in the original game, you could beat him in one move.

[01:17:33] And that was where you just feed him Phoenix down and he dies immediately because he's undead.

[01:17:39] Huh.

[01:17:39] That's funny.

[01:17:41] It's a very rough fight, but it's they did the old school RPG thing where if you heal him, he'll die.

[01:17:47] So but that doesn't.

[01:17:49] I tried it.

[01:17:50] One right.

[01:17:50] I tried it.

[01:17:51] It didn't work.

[01:17:52] Yeah.

[01:17:53] Yeah, they knew they knew what they were doing.

[01:17:56] But one of my favorite visuals is the party in Gina talks about as he's giving his little

[01:18:02] thing. I took a screenshot of that one and he's sort of telling you the plight of the G where

[01:18:09] they're not from their aliens and they can't die because they're not from.

[01:18:18] Oh, my God, what are we calling it?

[01:18:20] The play?

[01:18:20] It's got a name.

[01:18:21] Name it.

[01:18:22] It's got a name.

[01:18:23] I can't remember.

[01:18:24] I thought there was no one.

[01:18:25] I thought I had no name at all.

[01:18:27] It's Gaia.

[01:18:29] Oh, it is.

[01:18:30] It is.

[01:18:32] But because I don't think they ever told us that in either of these games.

[01:18:37] I don't think they have.

[01:18:38] Call it the planet.

[01:18:40] Yeah, you can't.

[01:18:41] They can't return to the planet because they're not from the planet.

[01:18:44] So they have to live as ghosts, basically.

[01:18:49] And they desire the death.

[01:18:54] So they made the black materia.

[01:18:57] But then it was I was a little unclear.

[01:19:00] So, like, the set took it from them and then hit it away.

[01:19:05] Yes, because it's basically a nuke.

[01:19:09] So they were at war with the set, which is sort of what diminished their powers in general.

[01:19:15] And it also painted a light that the set aren't angels either.

[01:19:20] They're not a perfect race of people.

[01:19:22] They were just straight up at war.

[01:19:24] And they stole that from they stole the black materia from the Geap.

[01:19:31] For, you know, obviously, they didn't want to be nuked, but they were at war with them

[01:19:35] at the time.

[01:19:36] And all of this was sort of masterminded by Genova.

[01:19:42] Right.

[01:19:43] So that they I think it's one of the best additions that they added to, like, the stakes

[01:19:50] and the overall lore of the game, because he didn't really play much of a part into it.

[01:19:58] And using like intertwining that with Red's background is done really well.

[01:20:07] And I like the resolution of Red's story where he learns that his father, who he super resented,

[01:20:14] sacrificed himself to save everything kind of.

[01:20:19] And they did this corny thing in the original where the frozen petrified Seto, which is

[01:20:27] the name of Nanaki's father, cries.

[01:20:31] And they did it again in this.

[01:20:33] And it was very moving.

[01:20:35] I was moved by a crying petrified dog wolf.

[01:20:40] So is he alive in there?

[01:20:43] I think I think this is terrifying.

[01:20:46] That's way worse than just being dead.

[01:20:49] I would say so, yes.

[01:20:52] Just kill me if I'm stuck in a statue form.

[01:20:55] Just kill me.

[01:20:55] Please.

[01:20:56] I will do that.

[01:20:56] I will do that for you.

[01:21:01] But yeah, that's kind of everything here.

[01:21:02] Did you have any thoughts here about what we're doing here?

[01:21:07] No, I think that that's a good summary.

[01:21:09] You know, we got the black materia.

[01:21:11] It felt like it kind of came out of nowhere.

[01:21:13] Honestly, they were like, OK, so your quest was to find Sephiroth this whole time.

[01:21:17] Now your quest is to get the black materia.

[01:21:19] Big.

[01:21:21] Well, I don't know how good of a job they did, but Sephiroth is also after the black materia.

[01:21:28] Oh, yeah.

[01:21:29] But here's the thing.

[01:21:30] I don't think that the group had the information that he was.

[01:21:34] I don't think so either.

[01:21:36] They're just like, he must be after it, too.

[01:21:37] Let's go.

[01:21:38] And honestly, by the end of the game, he's kind of not.

[01:21:41] It doesn't even seem like he is after the black materia anymore.

[01:21:45] Like, well, I think he was.

[01:21:46] I think I think it was speeding things up for him.

[01:21:49] And I think he used it to cause some havoc there.

[01:21:51] And then yeah, and he's but he's kind of doing something different,

[01:21:56] which I suppose we'll get into when we get there.

[01:21:58] Can I say I think that they should not have had this voice actor for Sephiroth.

[01:22:03] I think they should have had Pegasus from the original Yu-Gi-Oh!

[01:22:05] Anime.

[01:22:10] Cloud boy.

[01:22:11] That's fun.

[01:22:13] I actually super miss George Newbern, who was the voice from Advent Children.

[01:22:19] He did great.

[01:22:20] But yeah, that doesn't sound like a bad one.

[01:22:24] I am.

[01:22:24] Pegasus.

[01:22:26] Yu-Gi-Boy.

[01:22:29] I like it.

[01:22:30] Yeah, I liked it.

[01:22:31] I liked it.

[01:22:32] I never watched my trap card cloud.

[01:22:37] That's fun.

[01:22:40] Okay, so on to Nibelheim.

[01:22:43] Is where we're going to go from there.

[01:22:46] Nibelheim has rebuilt the village as a center for Mako poisoning treatment.

[01:22:50] They go to Shinra Manor and find Vincent Valentine, who joins the party in the weirdest way.

[01:22:56] They learn the location of the central temple and that the key was last seen at the Golden Saucer.

[01:23:01] There they obtained the key, but Kate Sith betrays the party and gives it to Shinra.

[01:23:08] Yeah, Nibelheim, a pretty cool area that I honestly didn't spend too much time in either.

[01:23:15] They did this different as well.

[01:23:18] So in this version, Shinra rebuilt the village as a center for Mako poisoning, as you said.

[01:23:27] In the original, I think they kind of did this a little cooler where Shinra just built a fake

[01:23:33] version of the same town and everyone is just paid actors and they're pretending that nothing

[01:23:39] happened.

[01:23:40] That's insane.

[01:23:41] I mean, I know they kind of.

[01:23:44] It's almost there, right?

[01:23:45] Like they did rebuild the town exactly how it looked.

[01:23:48] Yes, down to like, you know, obviously, like it's still the same assets.

[01:23:53] So everything is still there.

[01:23:54] Yeah.

[01:23:55] Like when you go into the bedrooms and stuff.

[01:23:58] But it's weird.

[01:24:00] It is weird.

[01:24:02] The Shinra Manor stuff.

[01:24:05] So Vincent, I think they really nailed his entire like oeuvre.

[01:24:11] I love I love the vibes coming off of Vincent.

[01:24:16] I love that they introduced him as a boss fight.

[01:24:20] He is also fun fact entirely avoidable in the original game, too.

[01:24:26] He is an optional character.

[01:24:31] So, yeah, you don't you don't even have to meet him in the original.

[01:24:34] Oh, really?

[01:24:35] Just walk.

[01:24:35] You just walk right past his coffin.

[01:24:38] Um.

[01:24:40] Now you got his own spin off, right?

[01:24:43] He did.

[01:24:44] His his game was called the Dirge of Cerberus, and they introduced some very

[01:24:49] questionable things in that game.

[01:24:53] If it was still around, I'd probably give it a go because it was like a

[01:24:57] third person shooter.

[01:25:00] They didn't really give you a good example of Vince, I guess part of it.

[01:25:05] Vincent's limit breaks were turned like to turn into different monsters.

[01:25:09] So you fought that monster in this, but he mostly fights with like a gun,

[01:25:14] like a pistol, like a hand cannon sort of destiny style.

[01:25:19] That is his first gun anyway.

[01:25:20] You get like a shotgun and a rifle, but he's like a former Turk turned.

[01:25:27] He's got a whole thing.

[01:25:28] We'll get an M later whenever the game does in the third game, probably

[01:25:32] for now.

[01:25:32] Like I love the way you said that he just joins the party in a weird ass way.

[01:25:36] Yeah, he just shows up like, hey, you should join the party.

[01:25:39] He's like, I don't know.

[01:25:40] And then he goes back to his weird coffin.

[01:25:43] Why is he a vampire?

[01:25:44] Why?

[01:25:44] Why is he a vampire?

[01:25:46] Oh, Joe.

[01:25:48] I mean, this is such a JRPG thing to just have random people with random abilities.

[01:25:53] Random vampires.

[01:25:54] Yeah.

[01:25:55] Um, there's just some experimenting on him.

[01:25:58] He's actually pretty intertwined with a pretty important character.

[01:26:03] I'll just say Sephiroth.

[01:26:05] He does mention that in this, he says basically like had to do with his creation, I think.

[01:26:11] Yeah.

[01:26:12] So yeah, he will we will learn a lot more about him, I think in game three.

[01:26:18] They just wanted they just they couldn't not put him in there.

[01:26:21] I don't think.

[01:26:22] And I mean, you you had to get in the manor.

[01:26:25] You went you had to, you know, so I think of there.

[01:26:28] I think it is justifiable to put him in this game.

[01:26:31] Kind of annoying that you don't get to play as him, but I had plenty, plenty of people

[01:26:35] you could play as.

[01:26:36] So yeah, I get it.

[01:26:37] I would much rather have played as him than Kate Sith.

[01:26:40] Yes.

[01:26:41] Speaking of Kate Sith, a lot of annoying shit with him.

[01:26:45] There's like a whole Kate Sith dungeon that you got to throw boxes.

[01:26:49] Didn't like that.

[01:26:50] Did you like that?

[01:26:52] It was OK.

[01:26:53] It wasn't I didn't hate it, but I didn't love it.

[01:26:55] It was again, this was at the point in the game where I'm like, I'm ready to do the whole

[01:27:00] temple and ending for sure.

[01:27:03] I'm ready to feel pain because I knew I will say I knew Aerith died at the end of this

[01:27:07] game.

[01:27:07] Like I was spoiled that way before I even played the first one.

[01:27:11] Yeah, because I've seen tick tocks of I showed this to you last time we did a Final Fantasy

[01:27:15] podcast.

[01:27:16] Like I saw a tick tock of this woman cosplaying Aerith at the bottom of an escalator and

[01:27:23] somebody playing Sephiroth going down the escalator with the sword very slowly while

[01:27:28] she's praying at the bottom.

[01:27:30] Brutal, brutal too soon.

[01:27:32] That's how I found out.

[01:27:33] So aren't you glad you didn't find out that way?

[01:27:37] I definitely am to to not rush because I was kind of with you.

[01:27:43] I was like ready to sort of get to it because I wanted to know if they were going to do

[01:27:46] it the same way.

[01:27:48] But this is where the date happens.

[01:27:50] Yes, yes, yes.

[01:27:51] I wanted to bring that up all throughout the game.

[01:27:55] The little like the missions and stuff you're doing, you're building rapport with your

[01:27:58] party and depending on who you have the strongest bond with, you get to go on a date at the

[01:28:05] gold saucer.

[01:28:07] Who'd you get to see?

[01:28:09] I got Aerith.

[01:28:10] Me too.

[01:28:12] Yeah, I shot.

[01:28:13] I've made absolutely sure to get Aerith because that's that's my that's my she's my main.

[01:28:21] I think.

[01:28:23] If I'm shipping, I read the stand.

[01:28:26] Yeah, yeah, for sure.

[01:28:28] I definitely am.

[01:28:29] But I think Tifa encourages.

[01:28:31] No, I'm going to pause and talk about those.

[01:28:33] Tifa encourages clouds worst impulses.

[01:28:37] She like she babies him and she doesn't talk to him with with real talk.

[01:28:42] She hides things from him when she thinks it's going to hurt his feelings.

[01:28:46] Aerith is, you know, Aerith portrays this like innocent look, but she's very wise and

[01:28:52] she's very like cut the shit, man.

[01:28:54] This is, you know, act better like she is very, very tough with him when he when she

[01:28:59] needs to be.

[01:29:01] I think that honestly they're both good for cloud in very different ways.

[01:29:05] No, you're wrong.

[01:29:07] Clouds.

[01:29:07] You're wrong.

[01:29:08] Clouds brain is just horribly messed up and Tifa is like sort of the perfect like caregiver.

[01:29:20] Cloud's mom even is like she says that she kind of a weird thing for her to say.

[01:29:26] She's like, maybe you need you need to just find a girl, maybe an older girl, one that

[01:29:30] can take care of you.

[01:29:31] She says something like that to him whenever he visits for the last time.

[01:29:36] Nibelheim.

[01:29:38] But Tifa is kind of that responsible caregiving person that I think would be very good for

[01:29:47] cloud.

[01:29:48] And I think in any other world, in a world where Aerith doesn't exist, I think Tifa is

[01:29:53] obviously the person who he should be with.

[01:29:55] But Aerith does exist.

[01:29:56] So that's where I sort of fall through there.

[01:30:00] Become.

[01:30:01] And, you know, it's hard to not with with knowing the future that we know by the end

[01:30:07] of this game, it's kind of hard to not want to go for like the biggest devastation and

[01:30:14] be a beast, be one that wants them to be together because you could tell they've got just such

[01:30:19] good chemistry.

[01:30:19] Cloud is such a shit head and Aerith does not give a shit like she doesn't.

[01:30:24] She sees right through it.

[01:30:26] Yeah, she likes him anyway.

[01:30:28] I like that a lot.

[01:30:29] I really like how she how she gets through him.

[01:30:32] And I don't think Tifa really does.

[01:30:36] Yeah, they have a they have an interesting history where like, you know, Tifa was kind

[01:30:43] of the cool girl in town and the cloud was just kind of like a weird little guy who didn't

[01:30:47] do the little, you know, he was and she kind of didn't really give him time a day until

[01:30:52] like right before he left.

[01:30:54] Like they had like a weird adventure and Tifa almost died.

[01:30:58] So Tifa's dad banned Tifa from ever hanging out with Cloud, which she was like, I mean,

[01:31:03] I never hung out with him really anyway.

[01:31:05] And but yeah, so like they didn't really bond at all until right as cloud was leaving to

[01:31:15] join soldier.

[01:31:17] And then she found him in the literally in the gutter in Midgar before the the start

[01:31:25] of the game, basically.

[01:31:27] And it's like your cloud, I haven't seen you in five years.

[01:31:30] What the hell have you been doing?

[01:31:32] Yeah.

[01:31:32] And it's so weird because there's a there's a time gap, right?

[01:31:35] There's a memory gap for cloud.

[01:31:37] There is a five year memory gap that does not make sense.

[01:31:41] No, no, it does not.

[01:31:43] And it should not.

[01:31:45] I'm so looking forward to finding out.

[01:31:47] I was hoping that we were going to find out by the end of this game, but I guess we got

[01:31:50] to wait.

[01:31:51] Yeah, wait a little bit longer.

[01:31:53] But the date, I think, was very sweet.

[01:31:55] I love the hotel in the gold saucer, the haunted hotel and the Spider-Man that you got to talk

[01:32:01] to the concert.

[01:32:03] I like the Tonberry, like all the little stuff in the in the hotel room that you're in.

[01:32:10] And just whenever you open that door and it's Tifa, not Tifa, but it's Eryth that's there

[01:32:15] and you guys go on your little date.

[01:32:17] That was fun just running around the gold saucer and seeing the show.

[01:32:21] What did you think about the show?

[01:32:24] I'm gutted.

[01:32:25] I mean, Jesse showing back up.

[01:32:28] Yeah, I really love the whole mini game with fighting Monster Barret and whatnot.

[01:32:35] Yeah, beautiful, beautifully done.

[01:32:37] A plus plus plus the date was fantastic.

[01:32:40] I'm curious, do you get a different date if you get a different character?

[01:32:44] So that when you beat the game, you can actually just play through that section on whichever

[01:32:48] you get to pick whoever you go on a date with.

[01:32:51] And I have seen since I've seen all of the dates.

[01:32:56] The date is kind of the same.

[01:32:59] The princess changes depending on who you go on the date with.

[01:33:05] Eryth will always sing the song.

[01:33:07] What happens if you get red?

[01:33:10] I don't actually don't remember what that is.

[01:33:12] I don't actually don't remember what they do for that.

[01:33:14] I think red and Barret's take the same place and then one of the girls will be the.

[01:33:18] But Yuffie or Tifa or Eryth can be the princess.

[01:33:22] OK, I like that.

[01:33:23] It's kind of like a fake Final Fantasy game that they're playing like they're doing a play of.

[01:33:30] I love all of that.

[01:33:32] Yeah, you know, Barret as a dragon knight with a still with a gun arm.

[01:33:36] Very cool.

[01:33:38] And Cloud's stilted performance is so good.

[01:33:42] And the voice actor does such a good job of being like,

[01:33:46] I'm a normal guy saying this dumb medieval bullshit.

[01:33:51] The way that it was handled was so good.

[01:33:53] It's so hard for an actor to act like they're bad at acting.

[01:33:58] It feels like.

[01:33:58] Yes.

[01:33:59] But guy crushed it so hard.

[01:34:01] I don't even know his name, but he's Cloud to me.

[01:34:04] So that's very good.

[01:34:06] Them seeing the portrait of Jesse as well

[01:34:09] before you know that you're going to see Jesse do a beautiful like dance was really, really good.

[01:34:17] And like you can see Tifa and Barret kind of have a moment where they can look at you can

[01:34:23] catch them looking at the picture of Jesse there and with how hard they characterize

[01:34:29] Jesse in the first game.

[01:34:30] Like I think they paid that off really well.

[01:34:32] And seeing Jesse like inner element doing the dance before

[01:34:36] Loveless starts was was really cool to see.

[01:34:39] She could have kept doing that, right?

[01:34:41] If she hadn't joined Avalanche, she would have still been on that stage.

[01:34:43] Probably.

[01:34:45] Probably.

[01:34:45] And it was just for like a dance in a video game.

[01:34:49] Like there were there all the way because it was like just a beautiful dance and stuff.

[01:34:55] So I really loved all that.

[01:34:58] And Cloud says at one point, oh, broke my heart.

[01:35:01] Still owe me that pizza.

[01:35:03] Yep.

[01:35:04] Broke my heart.

[01:35:05] Really rough.

[01:35:06] It was they did such a good job, man.

[01:35:09] I love the gold saucer like this is definitely like one of the parts of the game that I like

[01:35:15] the most.

[01:35:17] The dates go kind of different.

[01:35:18] I can kind of break those down real quick.

[01:35:21] You had Aerith.

[01:35:22] So what did you think about just the moment?

[01:35:25] The big thing between all the characters was the moment in the roller coaster, not a roller

[01:35:31] coaster.

[01:35:31] What is it called?

[01:35:32] Ferris wheel.

[01:35:33] Yeah, it's like a Ferris wheel.

[01:35:35] That's the biggest sort of difference is that you get a moment with whoever you go on the

[01:35:40] date with in the Ferris wheel.

[01:35:43] I liked a lot the cloud and Aerith date.

[01:35:46] It's tender.

[01:35:47] They don't they don't, you know, nothing happens.

[01:35:50] Doesn't seem like anyway.

[01:35:51] But, you know, it's just a nice bit of them bonding.

[01:35:56] And I think it was beautiful.

[01:35:58] And I got a lot of actually my background on my PC right now is of them sort of like

[01:36:03] of air thrusting on cloud.

[01:36:06] It's cute.

[01:36:07] Yeah.

[01:36:08] Anything to add on on their date?

[01:36:10] Not really.

[01:36:11] It was great.

[01:36:11] I think you're right.

[01:36:12] It was it was like on the border of platonic and romantic, right?

[01:36:16] And that was yeah, it felt right.

[01:36:17] And cloud actually finally takes a fucking he takes initiative and he holds her hand.

[01:36:22] And I think that's such a good.

[01:36:25] It just takes you back to being a teenager.

[01:36:27] And like, that's the biggest step you can make is to just grab that hand like and like

[01:36:31] she's actually like happy that he he's enough of a human to like to do anything.

[01:36:37] So like it was really nice.

[01:36:40] The Tifa the Tifa date and the Yuffie date are the ones that I want to remark on.

[01:36:46] Did you want to save that for yourself?

[01:36:48] No, I lost them.

[01:36:50] But if you want to say that for yourself, skip ahead like two minutes.

[01:36:54] Yeah, probably less because I'll handle it in about a minute.

[01:36:56] Tifa and Cloud's date there.

[01:36:59] She does a lot more.

[01:36:59] They just have a lot more of a little bit of a serious conversation.

[01:37:05] And but it ends with a kiss.

[01:37:09] So and yeah, so that one's a little saucy here.

[01:37:15] And then the Yuffie one.

[01:37:17] And so in a different game, I think in crisis in Crisis Core, you get to meet a young Yuffie

[01:37:23] who falls in love with Zach.

[01:37:27] And the date with Yuffie is completely platonic.

[01:37:30] And Cloud does a lot to like sort of booster up like, hey, maybe you'll find that guy you

[01:37:35] fell in love with again.

[01:37:38] And it's just very cute.

[01:37:41] Also, I can't remember what revelation that Red 13 does in that date, but he he gets like

[01:37:48] a big plot thing that I can't I can't remember at this point.

[01:37:52] Maybe I'll do an addendum later.

[01:37:53] But like, yeah, so like each one of the dates is worth watching.

[01:37:57] So if you beat the game, you can go back and watch all the dates because they're cool as

[01:38:00] hell.

[01:38:01] And we can move on from dating sim at this point.

[01:38:03] We're getting a little long.

[01:38:04] Sounds good.

[01:38:05] See, this is why I think you would like Persona, because there's like a whole dating mechanic

[01:38:09] in that too.

[01:38:10] Very good.

[01:38:10] I do like this kind of thing.

[01:38:11] You could really fun thing is you can date everybody and then on Valentine's Day, they'll

[01:38:18] all get together and beat you up.

[01:38:21] I love that.

[01:38:23] It's great.

[01:38:24] It's great.

[01:38:24] Then you get one after that.

[01:38:27] You get to keep one.

[01:38:30] So Sid takes the party to the Setra Temple and should as Shinra activates it.

[01:38:36] The group makes their way through the black through to the black materia.

[01:38:41] Sephiroth controls Cloud's mind and forces him to give him the black materia.

[01:38:46] Aerith and Cloud transport to an alternate timeline where the world is ending and they

[01:38:51] can be open about their feelings.

[01:38:53] Aerith assures him what is going to happen is not his fault.

[01:38:58] And pushes him back to the main reality.

[01:39:01] There, Sephiroth brings his sword down on Aerith as she prays.

[01:39:05] Cloud blocks the sword, but the scene glitches out and Sephiroth removes his sword from a

[01:39:09] dying Aerith.

[01:39:11] Cloud and the team, including Zack and Aerith, defeat Sephiroth and Jenova taking back the

[01:39:16] black materia.

[01:39:18] Only Cloud can see Aerith's spirit saying at the temple it's unclear whether he realizes

[01:39:23] she's gone.

[01:39:27] Okay.

[01:39:30] I will get us up to the.

[01:39:32] The the the Aerith dying bit.

[01:39:38] So getting into the temple and all that, the gameplay of the temple was kind of annoying,

[01:39:42] but it was cool to play as main character for a little bit.

[01:39:48] I like that she sort of takes initiative.

[01:39:50] This is also where Cloud takes a full fucking heel turn.

[01:39:55] He's he's such under control at this point that he's being a giant asshole to everyone,

[01:40:00] which is annoying and hard to see.

[01:40:02] But I mean, that's just that's what's happening.

[01:40:05] And each one of the characters at this point also has to go through like a little bit of

[01:40:08] a trial.

[01:40:10] And the biggest waterworks for me for some reason were in Aerith's trial where she has

[01:40:16] to relive the death of her mother.

[01:40:21] They get off of a train when Aerith is still a little girl and she has to her mother tells

[01:40:28] her to go find someone to help.

[01:40:30] And Aerith tries to go find someone to to help her mother and she can't and she has

[01:40:36] to return to her mom.

[01:40:38] And like she just said, I tried as hard as I could to find someone to help you.

[01:40:43] I just don't know what to do.

[01:40:44] And that's where Aerith's stepmom, Aerith's adoptive mother can't remember her name right

[01:40:52] now, but she comes up and she gets Aerith out of there before.

[01:40:58] Before Shinra forces come and steal her again.

[01:41:02] But man, it was just very rough to see like a little Aerith having to grapple with all

[01:41:07] that.

[01:41:07] It's always sad kids are always the thing that fucked me up the worst.

[01:41:11] Yeah, especially as parents, right?

[01:41:13] Yeah, it's just very hard to see.

[01:41:15] And that that whatever whoever that actress is just fucking crushed it because I really

[01:41:22] believed her in that moment.

[01:41:23] And everyone else, we kind of just dealt with stuff we'd seen.

[01:41:27] You know, their trials are just like it's the hardest part in their lives that we get

[01:41:31] to revisit because Sephiroth.

[01:41:36] So misery.

[01:41:37] Yeah, he's a mean guy and you activated his trap card.

[01:41:39] So what are you what is he what are you going to do?

[01:41:42] Yep.

[01:41:45] We can sort of beeline it here.

[01:41:46] I think there's a lot of stuff here at the end of the game, but the this is the juice.

[01:41:51] This is we get to.

[01:41:56] The Forgotten City and we find Aerith praying and then the bad shit happens.

[01:42:02] What were your thoughts here?

[01:42:04] You obviously knew Aerith was going to die, but walk me through the process of the end

[01:42:08] of this game.

[01:42:10] Oh my God, can I even it's bizarre.

[01:42:14] It's it's like three alternate universes.

[01:42:18] There's the main universe, there's the Aerith and cloud in the apocalyptic universe, and

[01:42:24] there's X universe.

[01:42:27] Where and then I think there are many universes, too, but those are the three we focus on.

[01:42:33] Yeah.

[01:42:34] And clouds blocks Sephiroth blow, but it gets corrected to where it.

[01:42:42] Hits.

[01:42:43] Yeah, so there's like a little visual motif that lets you know that there's a universal

[01:42:48] split happening where there's like rainbow like a light shaft with rainbows and that

[01:42:54] shoots out of the swords when they connect whenever cloud blocks Aerith from getting

[01:42:59] killed.

[01:43:00] So it seems like there's some world where cloud did save her right?

[01:43:06] So so she's alive in another world, right?

[01:43:08] That that is that why she can manifest or is it because she's.

[01:43:11] You know, set for a part of the life stream.

[01:43:14] So from my best guess.

[01:43:20] Aerith for a long time now has had knowledge in the first game.

[01:43:25] She had knowledge that she was going to die.

[01:43:27] She had knowledge that.

[01:43:31] Of different versions of herself in different timelines, it seems like.

[01:43:36] So there was a multiverse in the original Final Fantasy seven.

[01:43:40] Absolutely not.

[01:43:41] There was no universe there.

[01:43:43] There is no none of that, but.

[01:43:47] Our Aerith from remake.

[01:43:49] Oh, I got you.

[01:43:49] I get you might might know of the universe of the original game from start to finish

[01:43:55] because Aerith existed in the life stream and obviously in that from the original game.

[01:44:01] So.

[01:44:02] It's hard to say which version of Aerith that we are dealing with when we're having some

[01:44:07] of these conversations.

[01:44:11] But it stands to say that it is reasonable that in some universe cloud literally does

[01:44:21] save Aerith from Sephiroth here, but.

[01:44:25] To just cut to the chase, I think what we're seeing is that.

[01:44:29] To just cut to the chase, I think what we're dealing with at the end is that cloud did

[01:44:35] not save her.

[01:44:36] Obviously, to me, it seems very obvious that.

[01:44:40] That she is not saved because of the reaction of the rest of the crew.

[01:44:44] Right, right, because they're all devastated and cloud is like a fucking ghoul just sitting

[01:44:49] there like nothing happened.

[01:44:51] No, I don't mean in this universe, but I'm asking basically like, is she alive in a different

[01:44:57] universe in a different timeline, and that's why she's able to manifest the cloud?

[01:45:02] Maybe because cloud was in those other timelines with her.

[01:45:06] Yeah, I don't I don't know that we're looking into a different universe there or if we're

[01:45:12] looking at a spirit.

[01:45:14] Right, I guess that's that is the crux of my question.

[01:45:17] Yeah, I don't know that Aerith doesn't seem to be interacting with anyone but cloud.

[01:45:23] The one that we're seeing post post death.

[01:45:26] Right.

[01:45:28] And I'm just wondering if it's because cloud was the cause of the schism of her dying or

[01:45:34] not, and therefore she can still talk to him and she brought him to other universes with

[01:45:39] her, right?

[01:45:39] Like they transported themselves through a couple other universes before they got back

[01:45:44] to this one.

[01:45:46] So overall here we're looking at a multiverse that I'm not sure if I like it.

[01:45:56] I'll say that, that there's a multiverse at all.

[01:46:01] I will say that the death of Aerith in the original game was much more poignant and there

[01:46:09] was a lot more.

[01:46:11] It was a lot there was there was a finality there that we that was strongly felt.

[01:46:17] And in this one, they kind of rob it from you.

[01:46:19] Yeah, yeah, like you don't see even her getting buried or put in the life stream or whatnot.

[01:46:26] Yes, but I think that this is something that they're going to revisit honestly in the third

[01:46:33] game.

[01:46:34] So like I was very upset initially at the way that all of the ending of this was handled,

[01:46:41] but after a lot of thinking about it and a lot of like listening to other people's thoughts

[01:46:46] and like Ultimanias and all that, I am very open now to them resolving this in a way that is

[01:46:58] as good or maybe even better in the third game.

[01:47:03] So yeah, it's I'm waiting on it.

[01:47:05] I'm waiting on game number three until to make like the final judgment on it.

[01:47:09] And I do fully trust them.

[01:47:11] I just I'm a little burnt out on multiverses and I was kind of bummed that they did that

[01:47:17] with this story.

[01:47:19] But there's a lot of there's a lot of fertile ground here for them to take some stuff here

[01:47:23] and also like darkest timeline situation.

[01:47:27] Um, Earth is kind of weird after her death that the times that you talk to her.

[01:47:34] Yeah.

[01:47:36] And cloud is an unreliable narrator sometimes with his.

[01:47:40] Yeah.

[01:47:41] So there's some room for some wild shit to go down with Earth.

[01:47:46] There's literally a space alien demon who could be wearing Earth's face.

[01:47:53] Right, right, right.

[01:47:54] Named Genova, which is the darkest timeline of the version of the Earth we're talking

[01:48:00] to, especially since we see cloud do some wild shit with sneaking the black material

[01:48:05] into the Buster sword there in the last cut scene.

[01:48:08] I've seen a theory that Barrett has the real black materia that they don't trust him.

[01:48:15] I mean, I would trust cloud.

[01:48:17] I wouldn't either.

[01:48:18] And clouds like, hey, buddy or Barrett's like, hey, man, you good?

[01:48:22] And clouds like everything's fine.

[01:48:24] You see that giant crack in the sky?

[01:48:26] Don't look up.

[01:48:27] And Barrett looks up, of course, he's like now I got to look at, you know, mirroring

[01:48:31] what they did earlier.

[01:48:34] And he's like, I don't know.

[01:48:36] And, you know, Tifa is just like Tifa's devastated because her best friend just died.

[01:48:42] And like she's just she can't even talk to cloud at the end of this game just because

[01:48:47] like he's being so fucking weird.

[01:48:49] But yeah, I was very torn by the end and.

[01:48:56] I kind of I wanted I won.

[01:48:59] I was ready for the gut punch of Earth's death or the like supreme satisfaction that she

[01:49:04] got saved, which I kind of I don't I don't know if that if I wanted that, but I was ready

[01:49:09] for that.

[01:49:10] I was ready to be hurt, you know?

[01:49:12] Yeah.

[01:49:12] And I mostly I was ready to be hurt because I don't think you can take I don't think you

[01:49:17] can take the death of Earth away.

[01:49:19] It's the most iconic death in gaming, in my opinion.

[01:49:24] People are on escalators replicating it.

[01:49:26] Exactly.

[01:49:27] So I don't think it's something that you could have just taken away and they kind of

[01:49:30] just gave us something that is deliberately unsatisfying.

[01:49:35] Mm hmm.

[01:49:36] So I think it's something they have to pay off in game three.

[01:49:39] But I also think I think they're going to show more of the death of Earth.

[01:49:47] And aftermath in game three, I think so, you know, towards the beginning or or maybe cloud

[01:49:52] has some kind of revelation of like what actually happened.

[01:49:56] I think they have to do that because they can't rob this moment the way that they can't

[01:50:02] leave this moment the way it is.

[01:50:03] There's too much.

[01:50:04] We're still in Darth Cloud mode.

[01:50:06] I think so, too.

[01:50:07] Or perhaps, if you will, going back to you, we are in the Pharaoh cloud rather than the

[01:50:13] regular Yugi Moto cloud.

[01:50:16] Okay, I think I think I know what you're talking about.

[01:50:21] But yes, I really think they have a lot to resolve there with that.

[01:50:26] And the third game is going to be full of all kinds of wild shit.

[01:50:29] There's still like stuff from the original game.

[01:50:31] We got Wu Tai.

[01:50:33] We have unresolved conflict and issues and stuff from this one.

[01:50:38] So it's going to be a long couple of years while we wait.

[01:50:42] But yeah, boy, did I love this game?

[01:50:45] Do the pro quest.

[01:50:47] Yeah, do that quest line.

[01:50:50] What so what final thoughts on the death of Earth?

[01:50:56] How did you feel?

[01:50:56] You said you're devastated.

[01:50:58] I mean, I'm I'm I liked the way they did it only because I didn't have something to compare

[01:51:04] it to.

[01:51:05] But then I watched the original scene on YouTube and I went, oh, that's better.

[01:51:10] And that doesn't look as good.

[01:51:11] And it's better.

[01:51:12] So I'm just hoping that they sort of patch it up in the next one and that this was intentional

[01:51:17] in the way it was dissatisfying.

[01:51:19] I think it has to be that because they they are not going to fumble the bag on their biggest

[01:51:25] moment.

[01:51:26] Yeah, it is the most iconic moment in the game, and they can't fumble it without intentionally

[01:51:30] fumbling it.

[01:51:31] And I think they did.

[01:51:32] Right.

[01:51:34] All right, Brandon.

[01:51:36] It's been a great time talking about this whole world with you.

[01:51:39] I think we're about ready to get out of here.

[01:51:41] We're old, so we got to sleep.

[01:51:43] But and we could talk for several more hours about this game, and I think we will eventually.

[01:51:49] But yeah, send feedback if you're mad about opinions we have.

[01:51:53] Send it.

[01:51:53] We'll love to talk about it.

[01:51:55] Reminder, you can send that at LHP at lorehounds.com

[01:52:01] or the fancy new tools at the lorehounds.com.

[01:52:04] They're not that new anymore, but they were when I originally drafted this outline template.

[01:52:08] All right, everyone.

[01:52:10] Hope you all have a great night.

[01:52:11] See you in Midgar.

[01:52:14] Well, Brandon couldn't stay for the show notes, but you've still got me to talk about Patreon

[01:52:18] and Supercast, the best way to support us.

[01:52:20] If you want to go support us there and get early and add free access to our podcast,

[01:52:24] show guides and more, go to the link tree in the show notes, and it'll bring you there.

[01:52:28] You can also get to our Discord server there.

[01:52:30] Find our main feed, find our website, all the all the fancy stuff.

[01:52:35] All the fancy stuff.

[01:52:37] The other thing you can find there are our affiliates like Rings and Rituals, where

[01:52:41] Marilyn R. Percula and Dr. Sarah Brown of Signum University are breaking down the rings

[01:52:45] of power on a rewatch through the lens of ritual.

[01:52:48] They are up to episode seven coming soon.

[01:52:52] We also have Wolfshift Dust doing Beacon 23 season two episodes seven and eight.

[01:52:59] That's the finale, I think.

[01:53:01] And we have the Wolfshift Dust book club, which I believe is a Patreon thing, but at

[01:53:07] least it's Patreon.

[01:53:08] Don't don't expect that on the Lorehounds Patreon.

[01:53:11] The Silo Breakdown with with more silo books.

[01:53:17] Very exciting.

[01:53:18] I'm sure that if you are part of that, you know what she's doing.

[01:53:21] She's also very busy.

[01:53:23] She's doing a podcast on the Lorehounds feed with Planet of the Apes, and she's doing

[01:53:29] a Star Wars canon timeline podcast where we are watching her go through the entire saga

[01:53:36] era by era.

[01:53:37] She's currently in the High Republic doing the Young Jedi Adventure season one and a

[01:53:43] preview of the Acolyte.

[01:53:45] Very exciting stuff.

[01:53:46] And don't forget, I'm going to be covering the Acolyte with her over on her feed and

[01:53:50] this feed.

[01:53:52] We also have Properly Howard movie review with Felonies and Fugazis.

[01:53:57] This week they put out Rocky.

[01:53:59] That's how they're closing out the season.

[01:54:01] Very exciting season.

[01:54:03] It's always a great time to listen to Steve and Anthony talk.

[01:54:06] Super funny and Radioactive Ramblings is taking an off week, but they should be back

[01:54:11] soon.

[01:54:12] All right on the Lorehounds feed this week, we've got another Doctor Who episode.

[01:54:17] We've got the last couple episodes of House of the Dragons season one that we're going

[01:54:21] through.

[01:54:22] We've got this podcast, the Lorehounds play and Planet of the Apes, as I already mentioned.

[01:54:28] So plenty of content out here.

[01:54:30] And then we're also going to be recording Elevenzies, which is our new way we're covering

[01:54:34] movies instead of within Second Breakfast.

[01:54:37] That's going to be Patreon exclusive and that will be covering Eternal Sunshine of

[01:54:41] the Spotless Mind.

[01:54:41] So if you want to hear that, you'll have to get to the exclusive zone.

[01:54:46] All right, now is the time that I do all the thank yous.

[01:54:49] So thank you to our Discord server boosters, Narls, Aaron K, Tiller the Thriller, Dork of

[01:54:54] the Ninjas, Dove71, Captain Jinji56, and our Loremasters, Samartian, Michael G, Michelle

[01:55:03] E, David W, Brian P, Nick W, S C, Peter O H, Bettina W, Adam S, Nancy M, Dove71, Brian

[01:55:12] 8063, Frederick H, Sarah L, Gareth C, Eric F, Matthew M, Sarah M, DJ Miwa, Andra B, Kuang

[01:55:22] U, DeadeyeJediBob, Nathan T, Alex V, Aaron T, Subzero, Aaron K, Dally V, Mothership61,

[01:55:32] Narls, and Adrian.

[01:55:35] Thank you all.

[01:55:35] Always a pleasure to have you and it really helps us build more community and do more

[01:55:41] fun podcasts like Final Fantasy VII Rebirth.

[01:55:43] All right, we'll see you all on the next month of the Lorehounds play.

[01:55:47] The Lorehounds podcast is produced and published by the Lorehounds.

[01:55:51] You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at thelorehounds.com contact.

[01:55:58] Get early and ad-free access to all Lorehounds podcasts at patreon.com slash the Lorehounds.

[01:56:03] Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to

[01:56:07] any employers or other entities.

[01:56:09] Thanks for listening.

[01:56:10] A new Star Wars journey begins in the place all good journeys begin at well, the beginning.

[01:56:17] This Star Wars day, I'm excited to introduce the new Star Wars Canon Timeline podcast,

[01:56:22] where we will piece together the complete story of that galaxy far, far away in timeline

[01:56:27] order from the dawn of the Jedi through the great unknown following the sequel trilogy.

[01:56:33] This is a podcast for both Star Wars super fans and complete newbies.

[01:56:38] Listen to the short intro episode now to hear how it works and what to expect over the coming

[01:56:43] weeks as we set the stage for the new television series, The Acolyte, which we will be covering

[01:56:47] with weekly breakdowns.

[01:56:49] Subscribe to the Star Wars Canon Timeline podcast wherever you listen to take part in

[01:56:54] one of the most epic and expansive stories ever told following all the twists and turns

[01:56:59] from start to finish.

[01:57:01] May the fourth be with you all, all month and beyond.