Silo: S2-e6 – "Barricades" between us

[00:00:26] Hello team Wool-Shift-Dust, Alicia here. And is it getting hot in here or is it just Juliet's arm infection fever?

[00:00:34] But really I think season two action is really heating up this episode. What do you think Luke?

[00:00:39] Yeah, definitely. This felt very much like a mid-season episode, like it's setting everything up for the finale.

[00:00:46] A lot of pieces are being moved into place.

[00:00:50] Yeah.

[00:00:51] Yeah, but in an exciting way I think, right?

[00:00:54] Yes, yes.

[00:00:55] Like moving into place.

[00:00:57] And if anything happens to Shroxy, I'm going to write a strongly worded review on Rotten Tomatoes.

[00:01:04] I just want one couple to make it through this show.

[00:01:08] Oh, we're definitely going to get into that and I'm going to ask you to kill your darlings on that front too.

[00:01:13] Okay.

[00:01:14] Well, Luke and I are going to make sure that you at home didn't miss anything important in all the action of Barricades,

[00:01:21] the sixth episode of Silo Season 2 on Apple TV+.

[00:01:24] Luke, before we get into our thoughts on the episode, can you remind everyone of our spoiler policy?

[00:01:30] So Alicia has read all the books that go to comprise the series Silo.

[00:01:35] I haven't read any of them.

[00:01:37] So we will not be discussing anything in the books that happens after Season 2, Episode 6.

[00:01:43] We will be talking about things that happen in the book, either in Season 1 or in the first six episodes of Season 2.

[00:01:52] Right. So obviously spoilers for this episode and every episode that's aired before it.

[00:01:57] No spoilers ahead.

[00:01:58] We have not watched ahead of the episode that we're talking about now.

[00:02:02] And Luke, again, is representing the non-readers so that we make sure that we respect your policy on that.

[00:02:08] So Luke, I actually I got a comment today that I wanted to bring up with you.

[00:02:12] Might as well do it on air.

[00:02:14] I was asked if we could not bring up trailer spoilers during the main episode.

[00:02:21] Fine by me.

[00:02:22] Yeah. Yeah, it's okay.

[00:02:23] I think if we have any trailer spoilers, we can save it to the end.

[00:02:27] Yeah.

[00:02:28] Although I don't see any of this episode per se, but yeah.

[00:02:31] No, I don't think so.

[00:02:33] But yeah, they're they're changing a lot in the show.

[00:02:36] As always, they're adding new characters and new plot lines and things like that.

[00:02:42] So I'm often just as clueless as non-readers.

[00:02:46] But for those of you who do want to know what book spoilery stuff I am holding back,

[00:02:50] I save that for the book club spoiler casts.

[00:02:53] This week's topic is going to be the wool rebellion.

[00:02:56] So this is something even show only fans can see the situations getting explosive in silo 18.

[00:03:03] I'm Abby and I and the book club spoiler cast are going to compare what we see happening on the screen with what happened in the books and combining what we know from both versions.

[00:03:12] We're going to try to lay out what we expect to happen from here.

[00:03:16] And who's likely not to make it out alive, including the wise and how as all that happens.

[00:03:21] So stick around at the end for more on the book club and how you can join if you're not a member.

[00:03:27] But no future book spoilers for now as we break down season two, episode six, barricades.

[00:03:33] Your regularly scheduled breakdown will begin in three, two, one.

[00:03:42] So barricades is the title.

[00:03:44] I guess, you know, that's literal.

[00:03:46] We see a barricade go up.

[00:03:49] I guess metaphorical too?

[00:03:51] I guess metaphorical, but mostly literal.

[00:03:55] Yeah.

[00:03:55] Yeah.

[00:03:55] Well, I always think that like, you know, we had to sense the other week.

[00:03:59] I think that they do intentionally choose these words that are metaphorical and literal at the same time.

[00:04:05] That's my interpretation.

[00:04:07] Episode six aired Thursday or Friday, December 19th or 20th, depending on where you live in the world, 2024.

[00:04:13] And the writer was Jeffrey Wang.

[00:04:16] And he was a staff writer in season one.

[00:04:19] And he was credited in season one for episode eight, Hannah, which is the one where Luke and I got all personal over Martha's agoraphobia.

[00:04:26] Um, and he was also, he was bumped up to an, an executive story editor this season.

[00:04:31] So he's deep in this show and its story.

[00:04:36] And the director this week was again, Michael dinner, who has been the director for most of the episodes this season.

[00:04:41] What were your overall thoughts on the episode?

[00:04:43] Luke.

[00:04:44] I really liked it.

[00:04:45] It was, it was a very dynamic episode.

[00:04:48] There was a lot happening.

[00:04:51] Um, it was, like I say, it felt like it was an episode that was setting up a lot of storylines to come in the remaining four and then in the remaining five episodes.

[00:05:04] Um, I, yeah, for, uh, well, yeah, for episodes, 10.

[00:05:10] Um, I really liked the, um, storyline with Shirley and Knox or Shroxy as I'm taking the calling them.

[00:05:19] And there was one absolute WTF moment in the episode that had my jaw on the floor, but we'll, we'll, we'll get to it.

[00:05:29] Well, what's that?

[00:05:30] We've, we're passing spoiler point.

[00:05:32] It was Luke.

[00:05:32] It was Lucas being made, Lucas being made shadow.

[00:05:36] I did not.

[00:05:36] I did not see that coming.

[00:05:40] Doing a victory lap as a book reader.

[00:05:42] Yeah.

[00:05:42] I take it from your reaction that that is in the book.

[00:05:46] Yeah.

[00:05:46] So, okay.

[00:05:47] So here's my reactions to the episode.

[00:05:49] I'm just going to read out the texts that I sent to Luke as I was watching this episode.

[00:05:54] I said, okay, Kathleen is with winning me over smiley face.

[00:05:59] I should have been filming a reaction video of me watching Bernard's conversation with Camille.

[00:06:05] They mentioned Danny again, but where is he?

[00:06:08] Hey, crying emoji.

[00:06:10] I knew there were Sherlock's vibes, kiss, kiss.

[00:06:14] And then I sends a screenshot of Bernard saying, Lucas Kyle, I'm electing you to be my shadow.

[00:06:21] And I wrote fucking finally.

[00:06:24] I'm so sick of book readers crying about this.

[00:06:27] LOL.

[00:06:28] Were you surprised?

[00:06:28] You said, yeah, really did not see that coming.

[00:06:31] I said, yay.

[00:06:32] And I, yeah.

[00:06:33] And I said the episode made me tear up a few times, like with Martha and Pete.

[00:06:37] And you said, Bernard and Mary got you.

[00:06:40] Yeah.

[00:06:40] You had to remind yourself he actually killed her.

[00:06:42] It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's an episode with a lot of emotional weight behind it.

[00:06:46] But yeah, as a non book reader, I did not see Lucas becoming Bernard.

[00:06:51] Like if you'd given me a hundred guesses for a plot twist, that would not have been, that would not have been one of the guesses.

[00:06:58] Mm hmm.

[00:07:00] Yeah.

[00:07:00] They've definitely buried it more this time.

[00:07:02] Um, yeah.

[00:07:04] And I also like in the book version, he's a family friend.

[00:07:07] So there's like that connection also, but it does come down to the same thing where it's like a desperate moment.

[00:07:12] It's like, you know, you're smart and good with computers, but I kind of like how this time in this version, I think it was a good thing where they made it like, Bernard's like, you can fix this thing for me.

[00:07:24] You know, your brain works like Meadows says your brain works real good.

[00:07:27] And I see what you're doing with, you know, this more and more advanced programming.

[00:07:32] And he realized he was only holding him back by not giving him access to all the information.

[00:07:36] And also I do like when Sims bursts into Bernard's office.

[00:07:40] Oh yeah.

[00:07:41] What are you, what are you doing here?

[00:07:43] Oh no.

[00:07:43] You're supposed to be in the mines.

[00:07:45] Wait till he finds out.

[00:07:48] Yeah.

[00:07:49] Yeah.

[00:07:50] Okay.

[00:07:50] Well, we're going to talk through the episode one arc at a time.

[00:07:53] Uh, we're going to mostly be talking about everything going on in 18.

[00:07:57] It's kind of mostly all part of one story this week, but there will be parts that we talk about out of the order of in which the scenes aired.

[00:08:04] So just follow along.

[00:08:06] Uh, we're just trying to keep story arcs together.

[00:08:09] All right.

[00:08:11] So we begin with a hunger for justice.

[00:08:13] We open on down deepers gathering at the barricade on one 30 constructed in the last episode now restored and well guarded.

[00:08:20] They chance to let them through, let them through at the Raiders who are holding back all of their deliveries from the rest of the silo, including food.

[00:08:29] Meanwhile, surely Remy Milner tends to the injury on Knox's Shane McRae's back where he was whipped from the descender cable.

[00:08:36] After Amundson cut it last episode, they bicker flirtily in Martha's Harriet Walters workshop.

[00:08:43] While she tries to concentrate on her work, she's upset that Carla was arrested last episode.

[00:08:48] Knox says they'll get her back, but her status as head of supply should protect her.

[00:08:54] Martha says the only status they've assigned to them all now is enemy.

[00:08:58] She points out that Sheriff Billings is down there allegedly looking for them, but Martha's staying put in her workshop and he can find her there as far as she's concerned.

[00:09:08] So, yeah, I totally called it with the chemistry between them.

[00:09:12] Yeah, you did.

[00:09:13] Yeah, you did.

[00:09:14] There's, yeah, they were, it's fire between them.

[00:09:17] And like Martha knows, Martha knows what's going on.

[00:09:19] Martha knows the score and she's just not at all interested.

[00:09:23] She's just not at all interested.

[00:09:26] It struck me as like a parent, like who's, cause she kind of was a parent to them and she knew them since they were young.

[00:09:33] So she's like, oh, the teenagers are flirting and doing their thing and bickering and play fighting.

[00:09:40] But also like this episode, it struck me, this episode would have been a really fun episode to be an extra on.

[00:09:47] Mm hmm.

[00:09:48] You know, all the chanting and the running and the, yeah, it'd be a really good episode to have been an extra on.

[00:09:55] Yeah, that's true.

[00:09:57] Um, so by the way, from the book perspective, I just have to point out that I think that this means this, this, uh, what did you call them?

[00:10:06] Shoxi. Shoxi, yeah. Shoxi.

[00:10:08] Shoxi.

[00:10:08] Um, Shoxi confirms what I suspected is that there, there's a book character, Mark with a CK, who is Shirley's husband in the book, who isn't in the show.

[00:10:18] So now I think they might be blending those two characters together, which is something I suspected might be the case.

[00:10:24] Abby and I will talk through in the spoiler cast about what that might mean for Knox's character arc.

[00:10:30] So Knox and Shirley visit the metal fabrication workshop run by Mark without a C, played by George Robinson.

[00:10:37] And in episode two, we saw Knox ask Mark for weapons for only them and no one else.

[00:10:43] And now there's a table full of glorified pipes and primitive firearms waiting for them.

[00:10:47] Um, I did find it interesting that Shirley doesn't already know Mark.

[00:10:51] So I guess when Mark said in the last time we saw him that he got out of somewhere, I guess that wasn't mechanical.

[00:10:58] No, no, I'm thinking, I'm thinking possibly the mines.

[00:11:03] Yeah, maybe.

[00:11:04] I'm thinking that maybe his wheelchair use might be as a result of some kind of injury sustained.

[00:11:10] Could be.

[00:11:11] In the mines, possibly.

[00:11:12] Could be, yeah.

[00:11:14] Yeah, and we'll find out what Knox's second secret request from Mark was later in this episode.

[00:11:20] Well, now, hang on.

[00:11:22] Don't we have them both?

[00:11:23] It's not to make weapons for anybody else.

[00:11:25] Uh-huh.

[00:11:26] It's to make weapons for him.

[00:11:27] Right.

[00:11:28] But then the second request was that cement saw.

[00:11:31] Oh, okay.

[00:11:32] Okay.

[00:11:34] I think so.

[00:11:35] Okay.

[00:11:35] Or maybe, yeah.

[00:11:36] Hmm.

[00:11:38] Anyway, he gets a cement saw later too.

[00:11:40] We'll get back to that.

[00:11:41] Yeah, we'll get back to that.

[00:11:42] So, meanwhile, Teddy Olatun J. Ofe, whose eye is healing nicely after the police brutality surrounding his arrest for graffiti, he rushes into the workshop to tell them that his, about the deliveries being blocked and there's something else.

[00:11:59] The food they already have has been covered with rat poison.

[00:12:03] And first of all, how did Teddy know to find them in the workshop? Like, Teddy's like fricking everywhere this season.

[00:12:10] Yeah, it's true.

[00:12:12] I don't know, presumably.

[00:12:14] Is he a spy?

[00:12:15] Is he the one who poisoned the food?

[00:12:17] No, can't be.

[00:12:18] No, I don't think so.

[00:12:20] Um, I think it's the, if you're asking me who it is, I think it's the doctor.

[00:12:27] Who went up, yeah.

[00:12:28] Yeah, the doctor that made it very convenient escape.

[00:12:31] Up to the mids, yeah.

[00:12:33] Up to the mids, yeah.

[00:12:34] Um, I'm assuming Teddy just went by Knox's flat, went by Shirley's flat, found out they weren't there and asked somebody where they were.

[00:12:44] Right.

[00:12:45] But how does anyone, anyway, it doesn't really matter.

[00:12:48] It would, I mean, Teddy does seem to be very like on the ball.

[00:12:52] Like he's very eager.

[00:12:53] He's an eager beaver.

[00:12:55] Um, so yeah, so they, the plan of Bernard and co is to starve them out.

[00:13:01] Uh, do you, are you worried that this is going to turn into a siege situation or?

[00:13:06] Well, I mean, by the end of the episode.

[00:13:08] Things changed.

[00:13:09] The things have shifted.

[00:13:11] So I'm not, I'm not too concerned by that, but it's a pretty ruthless, um, strategy from Bernard because, you know, that's going to affect everybody in the down deep.

[00:13:22] That, you know, you know, people who are involved in this rebellion and not involved in this, in this rebellion.

[00:13:29] And like, you can't wipe out everybody in the down deep because who's going to, who's going to pass on the knowledge of how the silo works?

[00:13:37] Right.

[00:13:38] Of how, you know, the, the, the generator and everything works.

[00:13:41] So Diego's aunt.

[00:13:43] Yeah.

[00:13:44] Yeah.

[00:13:44] It goes on one 35.

[00:13:45] So yeah, it's a very aggressive strategy on Bernard's part.

[00:13:52] And the one thing about the rat poison, the rat poison is, it does mean there is the possibility of the Raiders.

[00:14:00] We already know that there are listeners that the Raiders have a sort of intelligence network in the down deep, but this might mean that there is one of those listeners who's prepared to, you know, go a bit further than just passively spying on people.

[00:14:14] Mm hmm.

[00:14:15] Yeah.

[00:14:17] Yeah.

[00:14:17] I do wonder that's got to become a plot point at some point who the traitor is down there.

[00:14:22] Yeah.

[00:14:23] Um, I had to laugh though at Knox's reaction when he realizes like, cause he takes it, he's

[00:14:27] like, what's on that lettuce?

[00:14:28] And he's like rubbing his fingers on it and she's like rat poison.

[00:14:30] He's like, yeah.

[00:14:32] It's like wiping his hand on his trousers.

[00:14:35] Yeah.

[00:14:35] Don't do that.

[00:14:36] Wash your hands, wash your clothes.

[00:14:38] Yeah.

[00:14:39] Spreading it.

[00:14:41] Um, but yeah, meanwhile, up in the janitor.

[00:14:44] In the office closet surveillance room, head of judicial security, new head of judicial security, Amundsen, Christian Ochoa stands with Bernard,

[00:14:54] Tin Robbins overseeing the watchers looking for Knox and Shirley.

[00:14:58] Bernard, uh, reiterates his goal of using order to prevent chaos.

[00:15:03] As he watches the hungry people of the down deep protest, the people withholding their food.

[00:15:10] Patient Patrick.

[00:15:12] Meanwhile, Sheriff Billings, Chinaza Uche and down deep deputy Hank, Billy Postlethwight have managed to secure the down deep doctors.

[00:15:20] Young shadow Felix.

[00:15:21] Felix.

[00:15:22] Zheng.

[00:15:22] Zheng.

[00:15:23] Zheng.

[00:15:23] Zheng.

[00:15:50] The worst one.

[00:15:51] And it's so, it sounds like this kid probably hasn't had the best training.

[00:15:54] Yeah.

[00:15:54] And like I say, I think it is convenient timing that the down deep doctor has suddenly decided to go and visit family in the meds.

[00:16:02] Oh yeah.

[00:16:03] And that he was allowed to.

[00:16:05] And that he was allowed to.

[00:16:06] Yeah.

[00:16:07] Doc fell on.

[00:16:08] He's our enemy.

[00:16:09] I do love Patrick's like, are you forgetting something?

[00:16:13] You've got to give me drugs.

[00:16:15] Lots of drugs.

[00:16:17] Um, yeah.

[00:16:20] So yeah, I wouldn't, I wouldn't trust Felix to get a bullet out.

[00:16:24] I wouldn't trust Felix to get a bullet out my shoulder.

[00:16:26] No, he'd had like the wrong forceps to it.

[00:16:29] It was, it looked like bad news.

[00:16:31] Uh, Patrick was right in that, but I do.

[00:16:33] This is the second time they've mentioned this doc fell on or fell on or however it's pronounced.

[00:16:38] So I do have Patrick stops him by saying, hold on a rat fucking second.

[00:16:46] You started shaving.

[00:16:48] Yeah.

[00:16:50] Yeah.

[00:16:50] I just think rats are mentioned a lot in the books also.

[00:16:53] So I liked that they've been incorporating them into the slang in the show as well.

[00:16:59] All right.

[00:17:00] So we cut to Hank and Paul back in the down deep deputy station.

[00:17:03] Billings is sending a message to his wife, Kathleen, Caitlin saws asking her to get a doctor to bring down in an unofficial capacity.

[00:17:12] He tells her to stay behind because it's not safe for her and the baby.

[00:17:15] Hank asks him if he really plans to arrest Knox, Shirley and Walker.

[00:17:20] Paul doesn't seem too interested in the idea.

[00:17:22] He gives some lip service to the pact, but he knows Hank doesn't think they're guilty.

[00:17:26] He says if there's such great people, they'll turn themselves in.

[00:17:30] I love that.

[00:17:31] I love that.

[00:17:32] When Paul messages his wife, he says need a doctor and then immediately not for me because of course that's going to be her first worry.

[00:17:39] Yeah.

[00:17:40] They are such a cute couple.

[00:17:41] They really are.

[00:17:42] Mm hmm.

[00:17:42] And yeah.

[00:17:44] And we'll, we'll come back to the state of Paul Billings is health later on because there's some interesting developments.

[00:17:51] Yeah.

[00:17:51] On that front.

[00:17:53] And, um, I have to say, Stu, do 71 said earlier in the season that, um, that Hank was becoming a bit of a company man.

[00:18:03] And he did sound a bit of a company man here.

[00:18:06] He's says at one point to Billings, doesn't matter what I think.

[00:18:09] I swore an oath.

[00:18:10] Like, oh, I don't know about that.

[00:18:14] I'm not sure that he meant that.

[00:18:16] I think he was trying to reassure Billings.

[00:18:18] Yeah.

[00:18:19] Like it's like Billings, you know, I swore an oath to like Billings says at the end, you know, I'm, I'm protecting the law.

[00:18:26] I'm not protecting any particular person, but yeah, they really have to look very hard away to not know where Knox and Shirley are because they are currently standing on a table in the down deep cafeteria.

[00:18:38] Giving speeches and talking to the crowd.

[00:18:41] This is the thing.

[00:18:42] If they were desperate to arrest Knox and Shirley, they would have done it.

[00:18:46] They would have done it.

[00:18:47] If they cared the least little bit.

[00:18:49] Yes.

[00:18:49] First of all, where's the first place you would look?

[00:18:52] Martha's place.

[00:18:53] Yeah.

[00:18:54] Where's the second place you would look?

[00:18:55] The cafeteria.

[00:18:56] Well, yeah.

[00:18:57] If they're like giving yelling in the middle of the cafeteria, that's hard to miss.

[00:19:01] You really have to try.

[00:19:02] Yeah.

[00:19:03] Um, but yeah, they, they're telling the crowd that they've been framed.

[00:19:08] They did not kill judge Meadows.

[00:19:10] They blame Bernard Holland and Robert Sims common.

[00:19:13] There's discontent in the crowd though, because the blockade ends.

[00:19:17] If Knox and Shirley are turned in, but Martha stands up and says, Bernard and Sims have already won because they're turning mechanical against their own.

[00:19:25] She reminds them that this is life or death.

[00:19:27] Her speech rouses a portion of the crowd, but a louder portion is yelling about not wanting to starve.

[00:19:33] Just then Teddy rolls in a trolley full of food with compliments from their farmer friends on level one 22 delivered via the recycling shoots.

[00:19:43] So it says, the note says to our friends in mechanical.

[00:19:46] Thank you for always keeping the power on.

[00:19:48] And they signed it.

[00:19:49] Juliet lives.

[00:19:50] I mean, this is another reason why I think the whole idea of the order of turning the rest of the silo against mechanical.

[00:19:59] Doesn't really make sense because people know that mechanical keep the lights on that they keep the water flowing that they keep that they, you know, probably manage the waste disposal.

[00:20:11] You know, all of these things is very immediate that if you turn on these people, they're not that none of that is going to happen.

[00:20:20] Right.

[00:20:21] And so we've talked about this in previous episodes.

[00:20:24] I just don't think what the leaving aside the morality of what the order says, I just don't think it's practical.

[00:20:32] I think, yeah, there is also the show emphasizes a lot the how people at the top can become disconnected.

[00:20:40] Like we heard Bernard say, what was that last episode or the episode before?

[00:20:44] He's making coffee in the Sims apartment.

[00:20:46] He's like, you know, I loved, I used to admire how John's made her own coffee.

[00:20:50] I'm like, she made her own coffee to stay close to the people.

[00:20:55] I love your posh accent there.

[00:20:59] Yeah, but we definitely have had like a full arc going on with Knox and Shirley because we started the season with him standing on the table alone.

[00:21:10] Yelling at her on the floor.

[00:21:12] And now they're standing there together yelling at everybody else.

[00:21:15] The two of them.

[00:21:16] It was a very, it was a, it was a very against the world.

[00:21:19] It was a very I Spartacus.

[00:21:22] He kind of episode.

[00:21:23] There was a lot of, there's all of the shouting and yelling and you know, hands in the air.

[00:21:28] Kind of.

[00:21:29] But they were, yeah, but they were all against them at this.

[00:21:32] Yeah, it's true.

[00:21:33] Yeah.

[00:21:33] But it's interesting.

[00:21:34] Nobody wants to turn on Martha.

[00:21:36] No one wants to turn Martha in.

[00:21:38] They're like, no, not you.

[00:21:39] Just the two of them.

[00:21:40] I'm going to say, well, she's like, she's like the grum.

[00:21:42] She's the down.

[00:21:43] She's the grandma of the entire down deep.

[00:21:45] As far as I can tell.

[00:21:47] It's also like very clear.

[00:21:49] Like there's something weird about like Martha's like, okay, so Carla was arrested.

[00:21:53] They're after these two.

[00:22:07] And she's like, okay, well, I'm here if anyone does want to arrest me.

[00:22:12] Yeah.

[00:22:13] I hadn't really thought about that, but it's a good point.

[00:22:16] Like Bernard in particular, like you say, puts no emphasis on Martha and I wonder why.

[00:22:21] That's a really good point.

[00:22:23] I feel like there's some, I don't know, protective vibe, but then again, he ordered a hit on Johns

[00:22:28] and I think he felt the same way.

[00:22:30] And while he killed.

[00:22:31] Well, did he?

[00:22:32] I mean, we don't know that.

[00:22:34] We don't know the details.

[00:22:35] We don't know the details.

[00:22:36] It could have been Sims without him, but I think we can assume.

[00:22:41] No, I'm not sure.

[00:22:42] I mean, he was willing to kill.

[00:22:44] He was willing to kill his own love to kill Mary.

[00:22:47] So.

[00:22:48] Yeah.

[00:22:48] But just cause, just cause you're willing to, just cause you're willing to commit one cold blooded

[00:22:53] murder doesn't mean you're willing to.

[00:22:54] To.

[00:22:55] I mean, I think he's committed a number of them, but yeah, I think he's probably safe to say

[00:22:59] he's committed a number at this point.

[00:23:02] All right.

[00:23:03] Well, so Amundsen says no more trash stash.

[00:23:06] He reports to Bernard about people sending foods mechanical down the trash suits shoots.

[00:23:11] And Bernard was apparently expecting this, but he says it's ahead of schedule accelerating

[00:23:17] the timeline of planned events.

[00:23:19] And he tells Amundsen to post raiders at every shoot access points.

[00:23:22] The plan to starve them is still on.

[00:23:25] So if he wants to starve them out, why do you think the help from the allies is like

[00:23:30] a phase is that help from the allies phases?

[00:23:34] The plan.

[00:23:34] Why wouldn't you just like block the shoots to begin with?

[00:23:38] And also why wouldn't you deliver food using the shoots normally?

[00:23:42] That seems way more efficient than, than like having a whole, whole bunch of port because

[00:23:49] also like you wouldn't be able to get like, um, the stairs aren't wide enough for you to

[00:23:54] get wagons down them.

[00:23:56] So like how many porters do you need to deliver food back and forth on a daily basis to the

[00:24:02] down deep or indeed anywhere that's not a farm?

[00:24:05] Like surely using the shoots would just be a more efficient way of distributing food to

[00:24:10] begin with.

[00:24:11] Yeah.

[00:24:11] But we saw what's his name?

[00:24:13] What was his name?

[00:24:14] Like Calvin or something who, who the supply guy, um, he's, you know, it's, he laid out

[00:24:20] and this is very much a thing from the books.

[00:24:21] The porters are very territorial about their work.

[00:24:24] They want to be, keep employed, you know?

[00:24:27] Yeah.

[00:24:28] But I mean, there must be like, there's a population of 10,000.

[00:24:31] And in the silo, like there must be hundreds of porters.

[00:24:36] If, if you just think about like the amount of people it would take to carry food, let alone

[00:24:41] anything else, like they may be, they may be the single largest department within the

[00:24:46] silo if that's the way it's going to work.

[00:24:49] I mean, yeah, there, there are definitely a lot of porters.

[00:24:52] Yeah.

[00:24:54] Um, by the way, just, I just want to note that Diego obvious, uh, Aki Kotabe, he's eyeballing,

[00:25:01] the conversation again between Amundsen and Bernard from his watcher post.

[00:25:06] So I'm wondering if we should rename him to Diego looky Lou this season.

[00:25:10] He's not doing any exposition anymore.

[00:25:13] Well, no, his full name is Diego.

[00:25:15] Lucky Lou obvious.

[00:25:16] Like, well, I think the obvious moniker I'm going to give to someone else later.

[00:25:21] Okay.

[00:25:23] All right.

[00:25:23] So we get to the part where Kathleen wins me over.

[00:25:27] She supports her man, period.

[00:25:29] Kathleen has been asked by her husband to procure a doctor and send them to the down deep, uh,

[00:25:36] to, to the down deep deputy station, but in an unofficial capacity, which could be a daunting

[00:25:41] challenge.

[00:25:42] But Kathleen has a can do attitude and a connection she made with an excellent doctor just last

[00:25:47] week.

[00:25:48] Dr.

[00:25:48] Dr.

[00:25:48] Daddy, Peter Nichols played by Ian Glenn.

[00:25:51] Uh, Dr.

[00:25:51] Nichols is living in his rebel era.

[00:25:53] So he's happy to go along with some questionable, but assuredly morally upright doctoring.

[00:25:58] So he goes with Kathleen who's decided to ignore her husband's instructions to stay behind.

[00:26:04] Um, by the way, I just had to laugh.

[00:26:06] I, uh, I Claire, baby Claire.

[00:26:09] I'm like, I recall her being bigger than that lump that Kathleen's always hugging to her

[00:26:13] chest.

[00:26:13] And it's always, I love how like quiet and long that baby sleeps.

[00:26:18] She's very quiet baby.

[00:26:20] Yeah.

[00:26:20] And it's like, it's, it's, there's one shot where it's obvious that there's nothing in

[00:26:24] that purpose.

[00:26:25] It's just the way they folded it.

[00:26:28] There is clearly nothing.

[00:26:29] I think there's a baby doll in there.

[00:26:30] Yeah.

[00:26:31] There might be a doll.

[00:26:32] Yeah.

[00:26:32] But there certainly isn't a child.

[00:26:34] No, but I, but I, uh, Caitlin's, she sells it with like her constant bouncing and rocking

[00:26:41] of the bundle and stuff.

[00:26:42] Yeah, she does.

[00:26:43] She does her job.

[00:26:45] Uh, when they get to the barrier on one 30 though, uh, Dr. Nichols flashes his badge

[00:26:50] and says he was called down for medical emergency, but the judicial guard dogs aren't having

[00:26:55] it.

[00:26:56] So Kathleen steps up and throws out a, my husband is the sheriff and starts describing C

[00:27:01] sections, which is probably the only thing men want to hear about less than periods.

[00:27:07] And so they let the two of them and the baby through warning them.

[00:27:11] They may might not be able to get back.

[00:27:13] I love it.

[00:27:14] Kathleen.

[00:27:15] She's she cites section 12 of subsection six of the pact.

[00:27:20] But unlike her husband, I'm pretty sure she was just bullshitting that.

[00:27:23] Yeah.

[00:27:23] I was wondering that is, is she making that up in that moment?

[00:27:28] It looks like she was.

[00:27:29] Did it, did it just take her a moment to remember like what it was?

[00:27:33] Cause like the thing she cites, like denying a citizen life serving medical treatment.

[00:27:38] And that sounds like the kind of thing that ought to be in the pact.

[00:27:42] I'm sure it is somewhere, but I don't think she has it memorized the way her husband does.

[00:27:46] Yeah.

[00:27:47] Yeah.

[00:27:48] And I also find it interesting, you know, I'm, when we were saying who could be the

[00:27:52] doctor for Patrick, um, I brought up Dr. Nichols and I said, you know, he might want

[00:27:57] to help the man who helped his daughter, but he doesn't even know that even by the end

[00:28:01] of this.

[00:28:03] He's just doing this because he's a good guy.

[00:28:06] Yeah.

[00:28:07] Yeah.

[00:28:07] Just trying to restore a bit of professional pride.

[00:28:09] True.

[00:28:10] Yeah.

[00:28:10] He's redeeming himself.

[00:28:11] Yeah.

[00:28:13] So Billings is surprised to see his wife show up with Dr. Nichols in the down deep, but she's

[00:28:18] here to nurse if he would kindly hold the baby.

[00:28:21] Dr. Nichols removes the bullets with the help of some proper painkillers and so is Patrick

[00:28:25] back up.

[00:28:26] And now Paul wants Patrick to hold up his end of the deal and tell him what he knows about

[00:28:31] what's going on in the silo.

[00:28:32] Patrick decides to play coy though, and Billings does not find it cute.

[00:28:37] He eventually hands the baby back to his wife and sends everyone else out of the room so

[00:28:42] he can do a little closer questioning.

[00:28:44] He threatens to tell Sims where Kennedy is and Kennedy stops playing.

[00:28:49] Um, and Kennedy stops playing his game saying Billings isn't going to be happy to learn what

[00:28:54] he has to say.

[00:28:55] Uh, yeah.

[00:28:57] So we get the Kennedy attitude.

[00:28:58] Oopsie.

[00:28:59] Looks like I made daddy mad.

[00:29:00] And Billings is like, not really.

[00:29:02] I just didn't expect much from you.

[00:29:04] And he slams that chair down.

[00:29:07] Yeah.

[00:29:08] Like you're doing your best Paul, but Billings is just not a very intimidating character.

[00:29:14] He's not got the Sims.

[00:29:16] I don't know.

[00:29:16] I think he flipped a switch there.

[00:29:18] Yeah.

[00:29:19] I think he, well, I mean, not Sims.

[00:29:21] I don't.

[00:29:21] Yeah.

[00:29:21] He shouldn't be Sims, but I think he flipped a switch there where it was because remember,

[00:29:26] this is also the guy who told us the story about how another teenager said that, um, oh,

[00:29:32] look, we both have the syndrome.

[00:29:33] And he's like, no, I don't.

[00:29:34] And beat the kid up.

[00:29:36] Um, also whoops.

[00:29:38] I make daddy mad is pretty good, but nothing's going to be Holston Jr.

[00:29:42] from, um, season one.

[00:29:46] But he does.

[00:29:47] Yeah.

[00:29:47] He says a very memorable line here where he says, you're not going to be happy to hear

[00:29:50] what I have to say.

[00:29:52] It'll ruin your fucking life.

[00:29:54] And it's like, you know what?

[00:29:56] It's true.

[00:29:56] It is going to ruin his life, but it's life's about to be ruined.

[00:29:59] Regardless.

[00:29:59] Everyone's lives are.

[00:30:02] Well, it's just a situation of a silo.

[00:30:06] So Patrick tells whole hotels Holston Patrick tells Billings about the green video.

[00:30:12] Juliet flashed about being gagged and bagged.

[00:30:15] He says the green video was like the page from the guide that billing showed him the picture

[00:30:20] of the mountains, but a million times more beautiful, indescribable.

[00:30:25] He tells billing Sims came to him to make a deal 22 years of forgetting for a fire bombing.

[00:30:31] And then he asks Billings if some small part of him wouldn't rather not know all of that.

[00:30:38] Patrick admits that he didn't think the forget drugs were real, but he had a hood over his

[00:30:44] head and not a whole lot of options.

[00:30:45] And I'm like, you know what?

[00:30:46] I accept that explanation.

[00:30:48] Yeah, that's fair enough.

[00:30:50] Yeah.

[00:30:51] Although like, what if he had gone down there like, yeah, I'll do your fire bomb thing.

[00:30:54] And he hid out down there instead.

[00:30:57] Or maybe he was just afraid to like bring the heat on his knees.

[00:31:01] Yeah, I think he's probably afraid to bring the heat on his knees.

[00:31:03] And also like if he'd hid out, if he tried to hide out and it had gone wrong, given the

[00:31:10] fire bombing and given the atmosphere, there's a decent chance he would have been ripped limb

[00:31:14] from limb by the damn deepest.

[00:31:16] So probably not a good idea.

[00:31:19] Well, they wouldn't.

[00:31:20] They would have had no reason to rip him limb by limb if he didn't do the fire bomb.

[00:31:24] That's true.

[00:31:25] But yeah, like I said, hiding in the silo is really difficult because you can hide, but

[00:31:35] you can't run like there's nowhere for you to go.

[00:31:38] Ultimately, you will be ultimately if the raid is a determined enough, they will find you

[00:31:44] because there are only so many places to hide.

[00:31:47] Yeah, yeah.

[00:31:50] And yes, we find out that when Juliet flashed the green on the computers, they told everyone

[00:31:56] the computers went dark because of a system reboot.

[00:31:58] But it's still unclear if anyone outside the janitor's closet actually saw that flash of

[00:32:03] green or not.

[00:32:04] But it did come up like for a split second and it was a split second on the screens in the

[00:32:11] cafeteria.

[00:32:11] We saw that in...

[00:32:13] Did we?

[00:32:13] I think so.

[00:32:14] We saw that.

[00:32:15] That was in the first season, wasn't it?

[00:32:17] Yeah, it was.

[00:32:18] Yeah.

[00:32:18] But I mean, when Juliet showed it at the end of the season rather than there was a flash

[00:32:23] earlier in the season.

[00:32:25] I think...

[00:32:26] I think I'd have to go back and rewatch it, but I think...

[00:32:29] No, yeah, because I was toward the beginning of the season when that happened.

[00:32:32] Okay.

[00:32:33] Yeah.

[00:32:35] Yeah.

[00:32:36] Which, yeah, still cause problems because why...

[00:32:38] How would that happen?

[00:32:39] How would it flash in the cafeteria unless...

[00:32:41] Yeah.

[00:32:41] I don't know.

[00:32:41] They should have done it when Juliet did it, but anyway, I guess they were just trying

[00:32:45] to like create a mystery.

[00:32:48] But yeah, this is...

[00:32:49] So Patrick mentions my friend Danny again.

[00:32:52] So Danny's getting mentioned every fricking episode, but where is he?

[00:32:58] Danny!

[00:32:59] He says, who knows what they did to him?

[00:33:01] I don't know.

[00:33:02] Who knows what the hell they did to him?

[00:33:04] He's sitting in a room somewhere with a bag over his head going...

[00:33:09] Or maybe he's already in the mines or I don't know.

[00:33:11] Yeah, maybe he's already in the mines.

[00:33:14] If they're doing all of this just to tell me he's dead in the finale or something, I'm

[00:33:19] going to be pissed.

[00:33:21] Why?

[00:33:22] Where are you holding Danny?

[00:33:23] Let Danny go!

[00:33:25] Let Danny go!

[00:33:25] Look, you've already got Lucas.

[00:33:27] You can't ask for Danny as well.

[00:33:30] Well, they invented Danny.

[00:33:31] Now they have to keep him in play.

[00:33:34] Okay.

[00:33:35] Lucas is...

[00:33:35] I always knew Lucas was going to come step into the role he stepped here.

[00:33:39] It just took a while.

[00:33:41] No.

[00:33:42] I also love...

[00:33:43] Patrick calls the down deep grease town.

[00:33:46] So maybe we should...

[00:33:46] I'm confused about whether it's mechanical or engineering or whatever.

[00:33:50] It's just grease town.

[00:33:52] I'm going to say to Patrick, like, you are just the guy...

[00:33:56] You're the odd job man, so maybe don't look down your nose at mechanical.

[00:34:01] Mm-hmm.

[00:34:02] Yeah.

[00:34:03] Yeah.

[00:34:04] I guess everybody looks for someone to look down on.

[00:34:06] Yeah.

[00:34:08] So, Bernard is keeping himself busy.

[00:34:11] Lucas Kyle, played by Avinash, who apparently hasn't been given clean clothing or access to a shower,

[00:34:17] fills Bernard in on his efforts to crack the code in the love letter from former rebellion head of IT,

[00:34:23] Salvador Quinn, to his wife.

[00:34:25] The letter Meadows first told Bernard about, which was one of the only things Lucas could recover from the hard drive that Bernard smashed.

[00:34:33] So, Lucas has been building increasingly complex programs to run increasingly complex codes, shifting letters around to see if any of these mutations reveal legible words.

[00:34:47] Bernard tells him he's been reinventing something called a Caesar shift and more beyond that.

[00:34:53] And then he lets him get back to it.

[00:34:56] So, I guess we're going to find out next week how Bernard knows all this stuff.

[00:35:00] Yeah.

[00:35:01] I mean, I think that's one of the most interesting things they're setting up this season is just how much does the head of IT know?

[00:35:08] Mm-hmm.

[00:35:08] Because Bernard seems to have like a wide...

[00:35:10] Not only a very wide span of knowledge, but quite a deep span of knowledge.

[00:35:15] Certainly much deeper than anybody else in the silo we've come across.

[00:35:20] And that applies...

[00:35:21] We'll see it at the end, but that applies to Solo as well.

[00:35:25] Mm-hmm.

[00:35:25] You know, as a former shadow of IT, he's a...

[00:35:29] You know, he was talking about like celestial positioning earlier in the season.

[00:35:34] He's able to...

[00:35:36] But is Solo a former shadow of IT?

[00:35:38] Because it turns out he was impersonating.

[00:35:40] Yeah, that's the interesting question.

[00:35:43] But he certainly seems to have like...

[00:35:44] Right.

[00:35:45] The kind of knowledge...

[00:35:46] He has access to that bunker.

[00:35:46] He's in that bunker.

[00:35:47] Yeah.

[00:35:47] Yeah.

[00:35:48] He seems to have access to the kind of knowledge that only the head of IT seems to have.

[00:35:53] Right.

[00:35:54] Yeah.

[00:35:55] Well, while Lucas works, Bernard stops by Camille's, Alexandria Riley's desk out in the IT open office area and loudly in front of her colleagues, he asks her menacingly about her actions last episode.

[00:36:09] Rescuing Knox and Shirley from the mob, after which they disappeared.

[00:36:13] She says she was just answering the call for former raiders to step up and help out with the unrest in the silo and following the pact by preventing vigilante justice.

[00:36:23] And that she notified judicial of where she stashed the pair for them to come pick them up.

[00:36:28] She says she waited on the stairs for an extraction team to come, but one never arrived.

[00:36:33] Well, first of all, I don't think she did wait on the stairs, but I think she knew one was not coming.

[00:36:38] Yeah.

[00:36:39] She didn't.

[00:36:39] She certainly didn't ask for one.

[00:36:42] Well, I mean, maybe off screen, who knows, but, but yeah, Camille said she was told unofficially that justice needed to come from the citizens of the silo.

[00:36:51] And that's against the pact though.

[00:36:53] Apparently it's not against the order, but Camille of course doesn't even know the order exists.

[00:36:58] So Bernard gives her his iciest smile and asks how her husband, who was the one who sent the mob after Knox and Shirley reacted when she told him what she'd done.

[00:37:09] She said he understood being the judge now.

[00:37:11] And Bernard obviously completely believed this story.

[00:37:17] Yeah.

[00:37:18] Like Bernard, Bernard's not having any of it.

[00:37:20] And that smile Tim Robbins gives her, that is the evilest grin I think I've ever seen.

[00:37:26] What's the expression?

[00:37:27] It's like the, it's like the sun shining off the brass plate of a coffin.

[00:37:31] It's just, yeah, it's just the most evil smile.

[00:37:36] And like, this is the thing.

[00:37:38] I think Bernard knows exactly who Camille is, even if he doesn't know everything she's done.

[00:37:46] Um, but, but he also knows that if he tries to, if you also, he also knows that if he tries to get rid of her, if he tries to move her, if he tries to do anything to her, that he's going to make a bomb.

[00:38:03] He's going to make a bomb.

[00:38:04] He's going to make a bomb.

[00:38:07] And then he's going to make a bomb.

[00:38:08] And then he's going to make a bomb, I mean, that's the most evil.

[00:38:09] But I feel like this gives him a tool to play the Sims is against each other because I mean, first of all, there's no way that Robert doesn't find out about all this, right?

[00:38:18] Like, how do you think Sims is going to react when he finds out the stuff his wife's been up to behind his back?

[00:38:24] I don't know.

[00:38:25] I think it'd be very hard to split the Sims is they seem a very committed couple to each other.

[00:38:31] And I mean, that, that's almost from Robert's point of view, that's almost his redeeming feature is that he loves his wife and he loves his child.

[00:38:39] Um, so I don't get me wrong.

[00:38:43] I don't think Robert Sims will be happy when he find out, when he finds out what Camille Sims has been doing, but I don't think it's going to change how they behaved towards church.

[00:38:52] Okay, yeah, I hope not.

[00:38:55] But we get a glimpse of Robert a few scenes later, sitting at his desk and playing with his pen and he's looking really bored at his job.

[00:39:06] Back to the new game that I brought up the other week, buddy cop, conspirator, murder.

[00:39:11] So who's, who's your buddy cop partner?

[00:39:13] Who are you conspiring with?

[00:39:16] And who do you murder?

[00:39:17] Okay.

[00:39:17] Mr. Sims, Mrs. Sims, Bernard.

[00:39:24] I am, I am murdering Bernard.

[00:39:29] Okay.

[00:39:30] Cause he killed Mary Meadows and I want justice, damn it.

[00:39:34] Yeah.

[00:39:34] I am not conspiring, I'm conspiring with Robert cause I'm fairly certain I'd be the smarter of the two conspirators.

[00:39:43] Like I'm not, I'm not conspiring with Camille.

[00:39:45] She's smarter than I am.

[00:39:47] She'd be able to play me.

[00:39:49] So, and I guess I'd buddy up with Camille in that case.

[00:39:53] All right.

[00:39:56] Um, I'm conspiring with, oh, I don't know if I'm going to play with Camille.

[00:40:00] I want to buddy up with Camille or conspire with, I guess I want to conspire with her because I do think she's the smartest of three.

[00:40:05] And at least in like, you know, that kind of way.

[00:40:08] Um,

[00:40:08] She'd throw you under the bus in half a second.

[00:40:11] Yeah.

[00:40:12] But so would Bernard.

[00:40:13] So I'm offing him.

[00:40:14] Oh, but I don't.

[00:40:15] Yeah.

[00:40:15] I guess we talked about it before with Roberts.

[00:40:19] Like he would at least be good muscle for our buddy cop duo.

[00:40:22] Yeah.

[00:40:22] We would have complimentary talents.

[00:40:25] So that's true.

[00:40:25] And also he's got the big leather trench coat just goes along with being a cop.

[00:40:30] Sure.

[00:40:31] So if we get caught out in the rain, oh wait.

[00:40:34] Yeah.

[00:40:36] All right.

[00:40:37] So Bernard goes to see judge Meadows body laid out in the morgue and Bernard laments that there's been 140 years of stability since the last rebellion.

[00:40:47] And now it's all going south under his watch.

[00:40:50] He says he's made the calculations.

[00:40:52] He's planned for everything, but then events forced him to do something.

[00:40:58] He really didn't want to do to kill.

[00:41:00] Maybe his only real friend.

[00:41:02] Now he cries over her corpse about how sorry he is.

[00:41:07] So yeah.

[00:41:08] So yeah.

[00:41:08] Business school one-on-one plan for unexpected events, Bernard, but yeah, events quote unquote forced me.

[00:41:14] Okay.

[00:41:14] How this is an emotionally affecting scene.

[00:41:18] Um, I feel like Robbins is prepping his Emmy reel, but, uh, how sorry are you feeling for Bernard?

[00:41:25] I'm not, I mean, this is the thing I'm sort of sitting there going, Oh, poor Bernard.

[00:41:30] Yeah.

[00:41:31] No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[00:41:32] Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[00:41:33] You're the one that killed her.

[00:41:35] Yeah.

[00:41:36] You're the one that killed her.

[00:41:38] Yep.

[00:41:41] Bernard asked, um, she, he asked her body if their roles were switched, would she have done the same?

[00:41:46] What do you think?

[00:41:48] No, I don't think so either.

[00:41:49] No, never.

[00:41:52] No.

[00:41:52] Also, I am always really impressed by actors playing corpses.

[00:41:57] Mm-hmm.

[00:41:57] That must be so hard.

[00:41:59] I don't know.

[00:42:00] Maybe it's a cast.

[00:42:01] To lie perfectly still.

[00:42:02] Maybe they, maybe it was a, I don't know if they would do a full body cast for that,

[00:42:06] but I don't know.

[00:42:07] No, it seems like too short a scene for that, but if it is, if it is.

[00:42:12] Let's just say her body, cause he picks up her hand and like buries his face in it.

[00:42:16] She didn't seem to have rigor mortis.

[00:42:18] No.

[00:42:19] No.

[00:42:20] So, yeah, it's a really effective scene.

[00:42:23] And you say plan for, you know, business school 101, plan for unexpected events.

[00:42:29] But there is only so far you can, there is only so far you can go with that.

[00:42:33] And this is the problem with Bernard.

[00:42:35] Bernard is intelligent.

[00:42:39] Um, but to quote, um, spot from wrath of Khan.

[00:42:43] He tends to think in two dimensions.

[00:42:45] Like he's bounded in by what is in the order.

[00:42:48] Yeah.

[00:42:49] And he can't think outside of that.

[00:42:51] And that's going to be, that's going to be his downfall.

[00:42:55] I suspect.

[00:42:57] Yeah.

[00:42:58] No, I think you're right.

[00:42:59] I think you're right.

[00:43:01] I think you're right.

[00:43:25] All right.

[00:43:35] So now we've got Diego versus the down deep.

[00:43:48] Nox, Shirley and Teddy confer about the situation with their food supply being cut off again.

[00:43:54] But at least for the moment, the people around them in the cafeteria are eating happily.

[00:43:59] Shirley proposes that they find a way to push the barricade up 10 levels to 120, which would put it above the lower farms, giving them their own food supply.

[00:44:09] And yeah, that's obviously easier said than done, but we'll get to that.

[00:44:13] Um, but as this is going on, Walker is in her workshop thinking about Carla remembering their last kiss when Hank and Billings bang on the door.

[00:44:21] Martha asks if they're going to arrest her, but they just want to ask her about what happened with Nox and Shirley.

[00:44:28] But Walker says she won't talk to them until they find out what happened to Carla.

[00:44:33] So yeah, poor Martha.

[00:44:35] This is where I'm going to ask you to kill your darlings.

[00:44:39] If you could save both members of one and only one couple in the silo this season, which couple would you choose?

[00:44:47] I'm glad you said this season because if you'd said overall, it would have been a really easy answer.

[00:44:52] It would have been Holston and Allison and none of this would have started.

[00:44:59] So I'm going to go with Shirley and Knox for the simple reason that I'm really interested to see where this relationship goes.

[00:45:09] Hmm.

[00:45:09] Um, like Martha and Carla, I think, you know, they've had, you know, I think they've had quite a, I think their relationship kind of ran its distance.

[00:45:19] We still don't know kind of how or why that happened.

[00:45:22] Mm hmm.

[00:45:23] And they were sort of moving, maybe moving back towards getting back together again.

[00:45:27] But I'll just be honest.

[00:45:29] I love the idea of Shirley and Knox as a couple.

[00:45:32] Yeah.

[00:45:32] It just works.

[00:45:34] They're cute.

[00:45:34] They're cute together.

[00:45:35] Yeah.

[00:45:36] Um, but I think I, I would not have said this before this episode, but now I'm going to say the Billings is.

[00:45:44] Good.

[00:45:44] Good call.

[00:45:46] Good call.

[00:45:47] Yeah.

[00:45:48] They won me over and made me glad that she went down there with whatever it's going to kick off that she's at least on the same team as him.

[00:45:55] Um, which is different from the books, by the way.

[00:45:59] So speaking of teams, Knox leads a team in makeshift armor with makeshift weapons to the barricade and the Raiders call up to Amundsen to ask for guns to keep them at bay.

[00:46:10] Amundsen is too busy quietly freaking out to pay attention to Diego looky Lou, who's just gotten a message from his aunt on level one 35.

[00:46:19] She's warning them that Knox and his gang are just a distraction because there's another team headed somewhere else down there with a special saw they can cut through concrete with this machine.

[00:46:30] They can cut their way up through the floor.

[00:46:34] I've got to say, you know, ignoring Diego, it's not a good move, but I can see why he did it.

[00:46:40] The first time in his life, the guy has got something useful to say and no one's going to listen.

[00:46:45] See, he's not Diego obvious anymore.

[00:46:48] Yeah.

[00:46:49] I've got to say, I don't go ambitious.

[00:46:51] Yeah.

[00:46:52] I don't think Amundsen's audition to be head of judicial, head of the judicial Raiders is going particularly well.

[00:46:58] I mean, bless him.

[00:47:00] The guy is just not that bright.

[00:47:03] He thinks you can plug a stapler into a computer.

[00:47:06] I'm exaggerating, but not pretty much.

[00:47:10] I mean, it's just like, yeah.

[00:47:12] Um, it's just like, wait, they've got a, they've got a, they've got a, they've got a,

[00:47:15] they've got a device that can cut through concrete.

[00:47:18] Hmm.

[00:47:18] I wonder how they're going to use it.

[00:47:21] Hmm.

[00:47:22] Maybe cut through some concrete.

[00:47:23] Maybe cut through some concrete.

[00:47:26] It's like when he turns up at the barricade, I know what drilling sounds like.

[00:47:29] Well, why don't you go and try and investigate where they're drilling to?

[00:47:32] Why are you just standing there?

[00:47:34] Yeah, they're just a barricade.

[00:47:34] What can they do?

[00:47:35] Why are you just standing there?

[00:47:37] Yeah.

[00:47:39] So the ant on 135, I don't think she poisoned the food, but I think it's interesting that

[00:47:44] we see like different ways that people can be quote unquote, traitors to the down deep.

[00:47:50] You know?

[00:47:51] I think she's probably just a woman who's scared and you know, telling her nephew, like things

[00:47:57] are getting bad down here.

[00:47:59] Yeah, exactly.

[00:48:01] Hmm.

[00:48:02] We were reminded again that the cameras below 120 are out.

[00:48:06] So they're relying on listeners down there, but it sounds like his aunt is not actually an official listener.

[00:48:12] Just no, she just seems to be.

[00:48:14] Yeah.

[00:48:14] Like you said, she just seems to be telling him what's going on.

[00:48:18] Right.

[00:48:18] Yeah.

[00:48:21] And Diego looky Lou decides he'll take matters into his own hands since he can't get Amundsen

[00:48:26] to listen.

[00:48:27] He asks Sims to meet him and tells him about the message from his aunt.

[00:48:31] And then Amundsen is ignoring him and Bernard is nowhere to be found.

[00:48:34] So Sims goes looking for Bernard in his very unpleasantly surprise to find Lucas in his office

[00:48:39] instead and not in the minds where sin Sims reminds him he's supposed to be.

[00:48:44] Lucas stammers out that mayor Holland needed his help with programming stuff, but he doesn't

[00:48:49] know where he is.

[00:48:50] And Sims storms off.

[00:48:51] Yeah.

[00:48:52] I feel like this again emphasizes how Sims never really had a shot at the shadow job

[00:48:57] because he wouldn't know the first thing about coding for one.

[00:49:00] And I'm not saying that's a requirement, but that's what makes Bernard respect you.

[00:49:04] Exactly.

[00:49:05] And also like Bernard, you know, was not going to take him into his confidence that he was

[00:49:11] using Lucas Kyle as a, you know, as a, as a, as a source of information as well.

[00:49:17] Right.

[00:49:18] Right.

[00:49:19] But I do, I do just love the way common plays this really just bursts through the door.

[00:49:25] What the hell are you, what the hell are you doing here?

[00:49:29] He's already upset.

[00:49:30] And then he's like, what is this unexpected twist?

[00:49:33] Yeah.

[00:49:33] What?

[00:49:35] That we got rid of you.

[00:49:37] I haven't got time for this nonsense and I'm stalking off.

[00:49:41] Also common can stalk like nobody's business.

[00:49:45] Yeah.

[00:49:46] Like that guy, he's got like the full sort of shoulder hood head forward.

[00:49:52] I'm a man on a mission kind of thing.

[00:49:55] So as he stalks out, he sees his wife, you know, working in the bullpen and he shoots

[00:50:00] her a look and she's a, and gets up and goes to follow him to talk to him.

[00:50:04] Do you think she thought for a minute that he'd figured out what she had done or Bernard had told

[00:50:08] him about her going behind his back with stuff?

[00:50:12] It hadn't occurred to me, but yeah, maybe.

[00:50:16] But apparently not.

[00:50:17] He just wants to talk to her about what he's learned from Diego because Sims is apparently

[00:50:21] the more honest partner of the two.

[00:50:25] Camille, of course, sees this as an opportunity to manipulate her husband's way back into power.

[00:50:30] She says there's nothing wrong with letting people suffer their own mistakes.

[00:50:34] And Sims corrects as long as the mistakes don't endanger everyone else.

[00:50:39] So do you think Sims cares about the greater good in the same way that Bernard does?

[00:50:44] Well, no, because Sims then adds including Elsa.

[00:50:47] Good point.

[00:50:50] So no, I think he cares primarily about the family.

[00:50:54] Yeah, I think you're right.

[00:50:55] I think you're right.

[00:50:57] And yeah, I feel like she's playing a game when she says to him, you can't do anything.

[00:51:00] You're a judge now.

[00:51:02] And he's but then he plays it right back at her this time.

[00:51:04] He says, I know besides I was never a raider.

[00:51:08] It's the next time we see her she's in raider gear.

[00:51:10] Yeah, like the Sims marriage is an interesting one.

[00:51:15] But I don't think they'd ever turn on each other.

[00:51:18] Yeah.

[00:51:19] I agree.

[00:51:21] Right.

[00:51:22] So meanwhile, Knox gets ready for the big push.

[00:51:25] He continues to distract the raiders at the barricade while Shirley and co are indeed cutting chunks out of the floors and back rooms to make their way up the silo past the barricade.

[00:51:35] And another group anchors a spool of cable into the steps and then runs that cable up to the barricade.

[00:51:41] Shirley's group sneaks out of a supply room on a floor above one thirty.

[00:51:45] Just as they're making their move, Camille runs down in raider gear to on her husband's behest, Warren Amundsen about the ambush that's coming.

[00:51:54] But the ambush is already here.

[00:51:55] And really, they're Shirley's group is just distracting Amundsen's team so that the group on the stairs can hook that cable onto the barricade and pull it down.

[00:52:05] With Shirley's group across the stairs on his level and the other group coming up through the now defunct barricade, Amundsen realizes they're hugely outnumbered and he orders his team to fall back further up the stairs.

[00:52:16] Shirley and Knox and company chase the raiders up to level one twenty.

[00:52:20] And then there's a standoff.

[00:52:22] Knox and Amundsen parlay and come to a truce.

[00:52:25] They throw up a new barricade there.

[00:52:27] They manage to avoid violence, but now the down deepers have gained ten levels, including a farm.

[00:52:33] They can't starve them out anymore.

[00:52:35] So were you surprised by any of these maneuvers?

[00:52:38] No, I mean, I could, I could, I don't know about you, but I could see this coming a mile off.

[00:52:45] Okay.

[00:52:45] And it's like, it was, I was getting annoyed with Amundsen actually.

[00:52:48] It's like, they're drilling, like, they're clearly trying to get past you.

[00:52:53] Do something, don't just stand there, man.

[00:52:57] Um, uh, yeah, I know what drilling sounds like, Derek, who's by the way, Fahad Shaft.

[00:53:03] So I feel like we have a new Derek obvious in the Mac in the making.

[00:53:07] We're going to see more of Derek.

[00:53:09] Yes.

[00:53:09] But Amundsen, you know what drilling sounds like.

[00:53:11] And then you just proceeded to do nothing about that fact.

[00:53:14] You do nothing with that information.

[00:53:16] Also, I think the Shirley Knox's plan and it is mostly Shirley's plan.

[00:53:22] Actually, it's quite interesting because they're just, they're just reacting to what Bernard's doing.

[00:53:29] I mean, they're not trying to take over the silo.

[00:53:32] They're not trying to, they're not trying to pop the lid in the same way that the people in silo 17 were.

[00:53:39] They just want a better, it seems to me that their plan is just to get a better negotiating hand.

[00:53:45] Hmm.

[00:53:46] Um, for talking to Bernard and the people in the up top.

[00:53:49] I don't think they're looking to like take over the silo or like depose Bernard.

[00:53:55] They just want to, they just want a decent position to negotiate from.

[00:54:01] Yeah.

[00:54:02] Yeah.

[00:54:03] Well, I wouldn't just to, you know, be blocked from them using that, uh, starving tactic.

[00:54:08] Yeah.

[00:54:09] Yeah.

[00:54:10] It was very nice of Amundsen though, to stop exactly on one 20 Shirley's target level.

[00:54:15] Yeah, exactly.

[00:54:16] One 20, but also like how fun must this scene have been to film and Remy Miller, um, Shirley

[00:54:23] in particular, looks like she's having the time of her life.

[00:54:26] Yeah.

[00:54:27] Um, filming this scene.

[00:54:29] I noticed, uh, there was that interview that I shared with you recently between Bernard

[00:54:33] and come, uh, but we're sorry with Tim Robbins and common being interviewed.

[00:54:38] I think it was for collider or something.

[00:54:41] And, um, and they asked Tim Robbins who he really admired in the cast.

[00:54:46] And he said, Remy Milner.

[00:54:47] I was like, Oh really?

[00:54:47] I didn't expect that because they don't really do many scenes together.

[00:54:50] No, I don't think they've done any scenes together.

[00:54:52] Yeah.

[00:54:53] Well yet.

[00:54:55] Maybe we'll see.

[00:54:56] Yeah.

[00:54:57] Maybe they will later.

[00:54:58] I mean, uh, yeah, they, at the, um, judicial, of course.

[00:55:02] Yes.

[00:55:02] When the frame.

[00:55:03] Oh yes.

[00:55:04] Yeah.

[00:55:05] Yeah.

[00:55:05] Yeah.

[00:55:07] So yeah.

[00:55:08] Bernard is obviously not very happy with Amundsen about this development and he chews

[00:55:13] him out in front of all of the watchers with Diego looky Lou piping up next to him to

[00:55:18] help him make his points.

[00:55:19] Do we think it is a Diego ambitious?

[00:55:22] Is he angling for better position?

[00:55:24] I'm sorry, but Diego obvious head of the judicial Raiders.

[00:55:28] I'm sorry.

[00:55:28] That would be the point at which the show jumped the shark.

[00:55:31] I'm afraid.

[00:55:32] No, come on.

[00:55:32] He's better.

[00:55:33] I think he's better suited for the job than Amundsen.

[00:55:36] I mean, I'm sorry.

[00:55:37] Amundsen is just thick as mint.

[00:55:40] It's just.

[00:55:42] And also I like camp and I going, what's on, what's on one 22.

[00:55:46] Come on.

[00:55:47] Somebody without looking at a map.

[00:55:48] What's on one 22.

[00:55:51] The farm.

[00:55:52] He goes really head teacher all of a sudden.

[00:55:55] And Diego's like, Oh, there's a farm.

[00:55:57] Ooh.

[00:55:57] I know this one.

[00:55:58] I know me.

[00:56:00] I know.

[00:56:00] Pick me.

[00:56:03] Hmm.

[00:56:03] So now we are getting deep into the disillusionment of Billings.

[00:56:10] Billings shows up at Martha's again saying he missed the battle because he was finding out what happened to Carla.

[00:56:15] Hanks checked with every deputy station and no Carla to be found.

[00:56:20] Billings thinks she might be in judicial seclusion.

[00:56:23] Martha is worried that with Carla's health issues, this will kill her.

[00:56:27] Billings says he'll try to clear her name, but he needs to know what happened with Judge Meadows.

[00:56:33] Yeah.

[00:56:34] Okay.

[00:56:34] Judicial seclusion.

[00:56:35] That means she's been gagged and bagged, or at least that's the working theory at the moment.

[00:56:40] I'm going to reapply my clown makeup and ask, do we think we'll see Carla and Danny team up to break out of gag and bag land?

[00:56:49] Maybe, but like, um, like Walker was pointing out, Carla's not exactly, you know, not exactly in the best of health.

[00:56:57] And also I imagine that they're not being held together.

[00:57:01] I imagine that when you're in judicial seclusion, you're on your own.

[00:57:05] But what are they doing with Danny?

[00:57:07] Maybe he'll help Carla.

[00:57:10] All right.

[00:57:13] So Shirley and Knox flirt some more by talking to each other over some homemade booze in the control room, which leads to a lot of making out until Paul barges in.

[00:57:24] And Martha's told their side of the story about them being framed for murder.

[00:57:28] And Billings asks if they'll swear to that on the pact, which of course they will.

[00:57:32] So Billings radios Bernard and tells him he has the fugitives, but he won't tell him where they are until he can open a full investigation into Meadows death.

[00:57:42] Bernard tells the watchers to shut off radio communication and then says to himself, fuck me, I just lost a sheriff.

[00:57:50] Knox and Shirley are grateful to Billings whose disillusionment is now complete.

[00:57:54] He says he stands with none of them up top or down deep.

[00:57:58] He stands with the law and he strides out like a self-anointed saint.

[00:58:03] Are you, are you surprised, first of all, to see Billings on the side of the barriers, things heat up, you know, Mr. Follow the rules?

[00:58:11] What do you think the turning point for him was?

[00:58:13] I kind of did a little fist bump during this scene because this is who I thought Billings was, you know, a genuinely just man.

[00:58:25] Mm hmm.

[00:58:26] Um, and that's, that's an interesting character, but it's also somebody to fear.

[00:58:32] I get like, I get like Stannis Baratheon vibes a little bit now from Billings.

[00:58:38] You know, he's, um, he's iron.

[00:58:41] He'll break, he'll break before he'll bend.

[00:58:44] Mm hmm.

[00:58:44] Um, and this is the thing.

[00:58:47] Genuinely just people are in some ways good and in some ways necessary, but you also need to be balanced by that.

[00:58:55] That kind of pragmatism, you know, what's good for the silo?

[00:58:59] What's going to help.

[00:59:00] Right.

[00:59:01] 10,000 people survive.

[00:59:03] I like, I think Billings is so boxed into his vision of justice.

[00:59:09] I worry that it's going to get in the way of actually doing the right thing as opposed to the just thing.

[00:59:17] Mm hmm.

[00:59:18] Yeah.

[00:59:20] What do you think the turning point was for him to get to the point where he is now?

[00:59:24] I don't think there was a turning point particularly.

[00:59:27] I think it's just more as he's learned more about how the silo actually works.

[00:59:32] His commitment to the pack has been there from day one.

[00:59:37] It's just, he's found out that other people are less committed to it than he is.

[00:59:42] Oh yeah.

[00:59:43] I guess that's true.

[00:59:44] So what do you think that knocks and surely think of him right now?

[00:59:49] The exchange of looks after he leaves.

[00:59:51] What do you think?

[00:59:52] It's like, yeah, well, for the moment he let us go, but if it turns out the packs to the packed, um, in the end tells him to send us outside to clean, he's going to do that as well.

[01:00:04] So, and also he did kind of walk in on us making out.

[01:00:08] So, I mean, he's just like, whatever.

[01:00:12] He doesn't know that it's even new for them.

[01:00:17] But I do love how the three of them, like the two of them and Martha never for a second seemed worried that Billings was actually going to arrest them.

[01:00:26] Like all of them, like he just walks in.

[01:00:28] They're all like, you're going to arrest me.

[01:00:29] He's like, nah.

[01:00:30] Well, I mean, surely a Knox's point of view.

[01:00:33] I'm pretty sure that they could take Billings if he tried to arrest them.

[01:00:37] Yeah.

[01:00:38] Yeah.

[01:00:39] I don't know if they want to escalate, you know, attacking the sheriff, but yeah.

[01:00:43] Um, I do think it's very cute.

[01:00:45] The billing thinks that everybody else holds the pack as sacredly as he does.

[01:00:49] This is the thing.

[01:00:50] He doesn't now used to know.

[01:00:54] He does hold the pack sacredly.

[01:00:55] It's, it's the leadership that he.

[01:00:57] Yeah, exactly.

[01:00:59] Because even in this scene, he's like, do you swear that this is true?

[01:01:03] Will you swear it on the pact?

[01:01:04] And you know, a lot of people, it's a lot of people will be like, yeah, sure.

[01:01:07] I'll swear.

[01:01:08] Yeah.

[01:01:09] Bundle of papers.

[01:01:11] Um, I am very glad though, that Kathleen and Dr.

[01:01:14] Nichols are down there because I don't know what's going to happen up top.

[01:01:18] Well, they could certainly do with a good doctor.

[01:01:20] Mm hmm.

[01:01:22] For sure.

[01:01:22] Especially since the other one was his name.

[01:01:26] I think it's a good thing.

[01:01:26] I think it's a good thing.

[01:01:27] Is it felon?

[01:01:29] But with a pH?

[01:01:31] Yeah, I think so.

[01:01:32] I think it's felon.

[01:01:33] As in felon, as in, you know.

[01:01:34] Yeah.

[01:01:35] Yeah.

[01:01:36] Mm hmm.

[01:01:37] But with a pH.

[01:01:38] Hmm.

[01:01:38] Anyway.

[01:01:39] Yeah.

[01:01:40] So over dinner in the cafeteria, Kathleen tells Paul he did a very brave thing today.

[01:01:45] Stupid, he counters, worried he'll lose his job.

[01:01:48] He's not as sure as Kathleen that it was actually the right thing to do.

[01:01:52] As he ponders in silence, Kathleen asks him when he last took the herbs he uses to manage his

[01:01:57] syndrome symptoms.

[01:01:58] And he admits it's been days and she points out how steady his hands are.

[01:02:03] Seems the syndrome might have been psychosomatic after all.

[01:02:07] Yeah.

[01:02:08] So, yeah.

[01:02:08] What are your thoughts?

[01:02:09] Yeah.

[01:02:10] It looks like the syndrome is at least in part psychosomatic.

[01:02:16] And also, they're eating a very nice salad and what looks very appetizing corn on the cob as well.

[01:02:23] But yeah.

[01:02:23] You've got those 122 farms now.

[01:02:25] Yeah.

[01:02:26] But yeah.

[01:02:27] So is the syndrome even a thing?

[01:02:30] You know, is it, is there any sort of physical reality to it?

[01:02:35] I think that's an interesting question.

[01:02:37] Yeah.

[01:02:38] Yeah.

[01:02:39] I wonder what made it stop.

[01:02:40] Did he stop being exposed to something in particular?

[01:02:43] Because he's been down there for days or did, or is it just like an emotional state?

[01:02:49] Because now he's kind of decided who he is better.

[01:02:53] Like he's feeling more sure of himself.

[01:02:56] Or is it, or it could just possibly be that it's in remission.

[01:03:00] Mm-hmm.

[01:03:01] Um, we, we don't know enough about what the syndrome is or how it works.

[01:03:05] We do not.

[01:03:07] This is an excellent point.

[01:03:09] All right.

[01:03:11] This is an excellent place to take our second pause.

[01:03:14] And when we come back, we're going to talk about some of the biggest events that wrap up the end of the episode.

[01:03:19] Just a second.

[01:03:26] So we're, we're to that moment, that moment of shadowing, that foreshadowed moment.

[01:03:32] Ah, Hey, so Bernard checks back in with Lucas who updates him on the increasingly complicated program.

[01:03:41] He's building to decode the Salvador Quinn letter.

[01:03:44] And he's getting glimpses of words now, but he hasn't gone far enough.

[01:03:49] Bernard realizes that Lucas could work faster if he had access to the same knowledge that Bernard has.

[01:03:55] But the only other person who would be allowed to have access to that information is Bernard shadow.

[01:04:00] So Bernard tells Lucas, he has to see the legacy and he swears him in on the spot.

[01:04:06] So, uh, you said you didn't see it coming.

[01:04:10] No, like not only did I not see it coming, but like you say, if you give me a hundred guesses, I wouldn't have guessed that.

[01:04:15] But how do you feel about it?

[01:04:17] I mean, this is the thing when it happened.

[01:04:19] It's like, yeah, that makes sense.

[01:04:21] So it was good twist.

[01:04:23] It wasn't like, it wasn't like it didn't make sense or it threw me out of the episode.

[01:04:30] It did make sense.

[01:04:31] Um, I mean, Lucas isn't really given time to consider whether he wants to be Bernard shadow or whether he wants that kind of knowledge.

[01:04:40] And also like Lucas is defining character trait is curiosity.

[01:04:45] And like, if he, if the, if being Bernard shadow means he gets to know a load of stuff, I think that's a pretty good bargain from his point of view.

[01:04:54] Oh yeah.

[01:04:55] I mean, to him, the, it doesn't seem like a downside.

[01:04:58] I'm sure because the alternative is what the mind.

[01:05:01] Yeah.

[01:05:02] But like, you're going to be, you're going to be a keeper of secrets and not all of them are going to, not all of them are going to be pleasant, but he doesn't necessarily know that part.

[01:05:12] Yeah.

[01:05:13] It reminds me, it reminded me of that bit from, uh, revenge of the Sith where Anakin and Palpatine are at the opera.

[01:05:21] Yeah.

[01:05:22] Being a shadow is a pathway to many abilities.

[01:05:24] So we are considered to be unnatural.

[01:05:27] Unnatural.

[01:05:30] Yeah.

[01:05:31] I thought it was interesting to contrast the conversations that Bernard was having with Lucas here with the ones Lucas was having with Meadows.

[01:05:38] Cause it was funny in the one with Meadows, like, uh, Lucas was looking at Meadows.

[01:05:43] Who's giving him this information, like with his puppy dog ish look on his face of excitement.

[01:05:48] And he's like, is there other worlds out there?

[01:05:50] And she's like, shut it down.

[01:05:51] Um, but in this case, like Lucas is just explaining to Bernard who he's obviously a bit afraid of because, you know, he holds his life in his hands basically.

[01:06:00] And he's explaining, but Bernard, the way he's looking back at Lucas, like you can see him starting to get like that excitement.

[01:06:06] Like, uh, you know, with Meadows, it's a conversation about the nature of the universe with Bernard.

[01:06:13] It's going to be about coding and that's what gets him to really respect someone's brain.

[01:06:17] Yeah.

[01:06:18] He looks like almost giddy as he's talking to Lucas in this scene.

[01:06:21] Yeah.

[01:06:21] Cause I mean, this is the thing from Bernard's point of view.

[01:06:25] It's so rare to come across somebody in the silo with that level of curiosity.

[01:06:30] And with that level of, with that level of being able to think outside the box for want of a better term.

[01:06:38] Yeah.

[01:06:39] It is interesting that, um, there are certain similarities between Lucas and Meadows in that way.

[01:06:44] And Bernard was, well, we know he was drawn to Meadows and it seems now that he's, you know, uh, yeah, he's drawn to Lucas in some way.

[01:06:53] And it makes me wonder if this is a case of him admiring something that he doesn't have, you know, that extra thinking outside the boxness, but then also wanting to control it.

[01:07:06] And that's, you know, gonna always go awry.

[01:07:08] Right.

[01:07:09] Yeah.

[01:07:10] Um, and what do we think?

[01:07:12] Well, I don't, if you can't answer this question, I understand.

[01:07:16] But what do we think the legacy is?

[01:07:18] What do you think the legacy is?

[01:07:20] They've teased it twice now.

[01:07:22] And the last time they teased it to remind people was, uh, Bernard asked Meadows when he pulled out the VR headset, he asked her if she had ever used it when she quote unquote sat with the legacy.

[01:07:34] I'm wondering, is it, is it that, is it that screen thing that Bernard was looking at the, the camera footage from Juliet's helmet, that kind of whirly swirly screen thing in the, in the bunker?

[01:07:49] Is it some kind of advanced computer technology from the before times?

[01:07:54] Um, okay.

[01:07:56] That's a thing to wonder.

[01:07:58] Yeah.

[01:07:58] Okay.

[01:07:58] I can't say.

[01:08:00] Yeah.

[01:08:00] Um, I have talked about this in, this was a topic of, uh, the spoiler cast in the first, uh, spoiler cast episode this season.

[01:08:10] So.

[01:08:10] Okay.

[01:08:11] We talk about the legacy in depth there.

[01:08:14] Yeah.

[01:08:15] And actually all the time.

[01:08:17] Uh, but do you think this means we'll get a tour of the secrets of the bunker next week?

[01:08:23] I hope so.

[01:08:24] I really, I hope so.

[01:08:25] I really hope so.

[01:08:26] And also like, I'd like to see Lucas have a moment of doubt or at least like reflection about what he's just done.

[01:08:35] Cause like Bernard did it so quickly.

[01:08:37] And like, I can say Lucas is so afraid of Bernard that he didn't really have a chance to think through what he was doing.

[01:08:43] I mean, he looks confused, you know, also maybe relieved.

[01:08:46] He's like, Oh yeah, that sounds like better than the alternative.

[01:08:49] And maybe I hope he gets a bed now in a shower.

[01:08:53] Cause he looks real tired.

[01:08:54] Yeah.

[01:08:54] He looks really tired and he looks like you say, he looks like you desperate need of a shower and a change of clothes.

[01:09:01] Hmm.

[01:09:02] So then we get, um, this emotional scene that this was the one that really moved me was a co-parenting moments.

[01:09:12] Uh, since he's in the down deep, Dr. Nichols swings by to see Martha, the woman who basically raised his daughter.

[01:09:17] And Pete's heard about the tape swap that led to Juliet's big walk and wants to thank her for that as well.

[01:09:23] Martha says she doesn't think that Juliet's still alive.

[01:09:26] How could she be from their perspective, but she knew Juliet didn't want people she loved to see her die.

[01:09:32] So yeah, very nice to see these two together.

[01:09:36] Yeah.

[01:09:37] Yeah, it was.

[01:09:39] All right.

[01:09:39] I've got a new game.

[01:09:41] New game is parent teacher enemy.

[01:09:44] So which of these three characters I'm about to name would you want as a parent?

[01:09:49] Which would you want as your teacher and which would be your enemy?

[01:09:52] And it's Martha, Carla and Pete.

[01:09:57] See, the thing is I'm not all mechanical.

[01:10:00] Mm hmm.

[01:10:00] So I think having Martha as a teacher would be wasted on me.

[01:10:04] Mm hmm.

[01:10:05] Um, so I'm, I'm not an, I, and I, I'm not really like, I didn't do very well at biology in school.

[01:10:13] So probably having daddy, Dr. Nichols as a teacher would be wasted on me.

[01:10:18] So by process of elimination, I'm going to go with Carla as a teacher.

[01:10:22] Mm hmm.

[01:10:22] I'm going to go with Martha as a parent.

[01:10:26] Okay.

[01:10:26] And then by default, I'm going to go with Dr. Nichols.

[01:10:28] I knew you wanted to kill him.

[01:10:31] I don't want to kill him.

[01:10:32] Like, I know.

[01:10:35] Well, well, this is the thing.

[01:10:37] I think having Dr. Nichols as an enemy, you're fairly safe.

[01:10:40] He's not going to do anything.

[01:10:41] He's a, he's a, he's a decent guy.

[01:10:44] Hmm.

[01:10:45] Yeah.

[01:10:46] Although he is a doctor, so he could poison me.

[01:10:48] Yeah.

[01:10:49] Um, well, yeah, so I actually wanted Martha or Pete as my teacher for the opposite reason

[01:10:55] that they could teach me things I don't already know.

[01:10:58] So I guess the question is, um, I guess in the silo situation, I'm going to go for,

[01:11:05] Oh, I don't know.

[01:11:05] Medicine and mechanical are both extremely useful skills.

[01:11:09] Um, you know, I'm, I'm soft.

[01:11:13] I'm going to go for Pete.

[01:11:15] He's upstairs.

[01:11:16] Uh, as my parent.

[01:11:22] Yeah.

[01:11:22] I'm going to go with Martha as a parent because we've got the tough love, but she really cares.

[01:11:27] And she, you know, she really will come through with, for you in a pinch, even if

[01:11:31] it involves suddenly miraculously carrying herself of agoraphobia.

[01:11:35] Um, so sorry, Carla, we're enemies now.

[01:11:39] But I mean, she's head of supply.

[01:11:41] She could.

[01:11:42] Yeah.

[01:11:43] Um, she could, she could, she could do some nasty stuff.

[01:11:46] She could do some nasty stuff too.

[01:11:49] I'd have Martha speak on my behalf.

[01:11:51] Okay.

[01:11:52] That's not fair.

[01:11:56] I'm like the stepchild.

[01:11:59] All right.

[01:12:00] So we, we only got one scene, one short scene in silo 17 this week, but honestly,

[01:12:07] I was fine with that because there was so much going on the rest of the time.

[01:12:10] Did that bother you?

[01:12:12] Yeah.

[01:12:12] No, not at all.

[01:12:13] I'm sure there's going to be people upset about not seeing enough Juliet.

[01:12:17] And actually this scene throws up a whole variety of really interesting questions.

[01:12:21] Yeah.

[01:12:22] Yeah.

[01:12:22] Yeah.

[01:12:22] Now it's a doozy of a scene.

[01:12:24] So we end the episode with just a moment in silo 17 where Juliet wakes up in a bedroom

[01:12:30] as solo is cooking another soup for her.

[01:12:32] He tells her he's given her antibiotics for her arm and they seem to be working though.

[01:12:37] She still looks rough.

[01:12:39] However, he's hidden the suit she's making to go outside until she helps him fix the pump

[01:12:44] seven levels underwater to prevent the water from rising any further in his silo.

[01:12:49] Though she basically calls him selfish saying he's putting the 10,000 people of her own silo at risk.

[01:12:56] Um, first of all, he made the antibiotics himself in that kitchen.

[01:13:00] I have to ask.

[01:13:02] Yes.

[01:13:02] Make them.

[01:13:03] Yeah.

[01:13:03] And like, how does he have the knowledge to do that?

[01:13:07] That is not, that is not an easy thing.

[01:13:10] That's not an easy thing to do.

[01:13:12] Yeah.

[01:13:13] Um, he's a lot of random knowledge.

[01:13:15] He has a lot of random knowledge.

[01:13:16] And like, even if he isn't solo, even if he isn't who he claims to be with that level

[01:13:25] of knowledge, the head of it.

[01:13:26] Yeah.

[01:13:27] Yeah.

[01:13:29] Either he actually was the shadow of it or, or he has access to the legacy in silo 17.

[01:13:40] Hmm.

[01:13:41] And this sort of reinforces my idea that the legacy might be some kind of supercomputer from

[01:13:48] the before times.

[01:13:49] Cause maybe you can just like look up how to make, how to make antibiotics.

[01:13:56] Mm hmm.

[01:13:56] You know?

[01:13:57] So what do you think's in the drawers in the bunker?

[01:14:01] I don't know.

[01:14:03] Is it, is that a clue that I should be paying more attention to the drawers?

[01:14:09] I'm just asking, what do you think is in the drawers?

[01:14:11] What else do you think is in the bunker?

[01:14:13] I don't know.

[01:14:14] I think you're trying to feed me clues.

[01:14:16] No, no, no, no.

[01:14:17] Um, this show has given you more clues than I could ever give you.

[01:14:21] I don't know.

[01:14:22] I will pay.

[01:14:22] You don't know.

[01:14:23] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[01:14:23] I have to say this show is, is mixing it up versus the book.

[01:14:27] It's not, the legacy is definitely a thing in the book, but, um, the nature of the legacy,

[01:14:32] I think is going to prove to be slightly different in the show.

[01:14:36] Okay.

[01:14:38] I think, cause I, at the moment I think the legacy is like the silo.

[01:14:41] You ever read Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy?

[01:14:44] Yes.

[01:14:45] I think the, um, I think the legacy is like the silos version of deep thought.

[01:14:50] Hmm.

[01:14:51] Like the, the supercomputer that they build to work out the meaning of life, the universe

[01:14:57] and everything.

[01:14:58] Okay.

[01:14:58] Okay.

[01:15:00] All right.

[01:15:01] Well, checking in, where is Solo on the Sims Nard scale now?

[01:15:05] Cause this is the thing.

[01:15:09] Juliet calls him selfish, but like, if she doesn't help, he is going to drown in 10 months,

[01:15:16] 13 months.

[01:15:19] I'm going to go with a five.

[01:15:21] Okay.

[01:15:23] What do you think?

[01:15:24] Um, so he's drifted more toward the middle for you again.

[01:15:27] Yeah.

[01:15:27] He's drifted more towards the middle.

[01:15:29] Yeah.

[01:15:30] He is like, um, a bit more aggressive in this way than in the books, but I guess this is

[01:15:36] all probably part of having to speed up the plot of a lot of things, you know?

[01:15:41] So they have to give him a more aggressive personality to move the plot forward faster,

[01:15:45] I suppose.

[01:15:46] Yeah.

[01:15:47] Although it feels like breakneck speed in the books too.

[01:15:50] And I mean, also from his point of view, he's running out of time.

[01:15:52] Like if Juliet leaves, he's, if Juliet leaves, he's going to be dead in 10 months.

[01:15:57] Yeah.

[01:15:58] Cause the, the, uh, like I said before, the flooding in the books is not nearly up that high

[01:16:02] either.

[01:16:03] Yeah.

[01:16:03] It's much further down.

[01:16:04] Yeah.

[01:16:05] Oh, it's not.

[01:16:05] So maybe it's not a question of giving him a more aggressive personality.

[01:16:09] It's just a question of a worse.

[01:16:11] More desperation.

[01:16:12] Yeah.

[01:16:13] Yeah.

[01:16:15] Yeah.

[01:16:15] Yeah.

[01:16:16] All right.

[01:16:17] Any final thoughts on the episode?

[01:16:19] Well, like I say, if they kill Shroxy, either one of Shirley or Knox, there's going to

[01:16:27] be, there's going to be such a review on Rotten Tomatoes.

[01:16:31] I know not what it will be, but it will be the terror of the review boards.

[01:16:36] Hmm.

[01:16:37] Okay.

[01:16:38] Okay.

[01:16:39] Um, just want one couple to get out alive.

[01:16:43] God damn it.

[01:16:44] Maybe it'll be the Billings is.

[01:16:46] Yeah.

[01:16:47] But we'll get out where, where are they going?

[01:16:50] Okay.

[01:16:51] Just out of the season.

[01:16:51] You mean?

[01:16:52] Yeah.

[01:16:52] To survive the season.

[01:16:54] Let's put it that way.

[01:16:55] Okay.

[01:16:55] Okay.

[01:16:58] Other than one couple surviving, what do you hope happens in the next episode?

[01:17:03] I want to see the legacy.

[01:17:05] I don't want this like hanging till, till episode 10.

[01:17:09] Yeah.

[01:17:09] Um, I want Lucas to have like a moment.

[01:17:13] I like to have like a bit of an existential crisis of what have I done?

[01:17:16] I've signed up to be Bernard.

[01:17:18] Well, he has to first learn more about what he's done.

[01:17:20] Yeah.

[01:17:21] Because he has no idea what all Bernard knows.

[01:17:23] And I want, and I want, um, I want the family Sims to sit down and have a family meeting and work out what page they're on.

[01:17:32] Cause yeah, I think that, I think they're overdue for, you know, a frank and a free and frank exchange of views at this point.

[01:17:40] Mm hmm.

[01:17:42] How about you?

[01:17:43] What do you want to see?

[01:17:44] Um, I, yeah, I hope that the episode just like straight up opens with like, okay, Lucas, you're my shadow.

[01:17:50] Now let's go in the bunker and let me show you everything and talk and tell you all the things.

[01:17:54] I hope it's just like, like we got at the beginning of episode three, when Solo gave Juliet the information dump.

[01:18:00] Now it's Lucas's turn to get dumped upon again.

[01:18:03] Like he was last season, but Juliet, I guess.

[01:18:06] Um, I want, I want Carla and Danny to team up and have an escape caper or I just want Danny to, I just stopped teasing me with the Danny thing.

[01:18:17] Where is he?

[01:18:18] Why are you hiding him?

[01:18:19] It's something like the actor sick.

[01:18:21] What's where is it?

[01:18:22] Why do you keep bringing him up and then not showing him?

[01:18:25] Um, well, you've already got Lucas this season.

[01:18:28] Don't get greedy.

[01:18:30] I know.

[01:18:30] Come on.

[01:18:31] All the characters.

[01:18:32] You can't just dangle a character and then not deliver them.

[01:18:37] Uh, I mean, I guess, yeah, it's hard for me to say because I have a feeling.

[01:18:43] I know what, um, the next big moves are going to be.

[01:18:48] So I can't really say.

[01:18:49] Okay.

[01:18:50] Okay.

[01:18:50] Okay.

[01:18:52] All right.

[01:18:53] Any final thoughts?

[01:18:55] Nope.

[01:18:55] You've already had my phone.

[01:18:57] I've got no more thoughts left to give.

[01:18:59] No more thoughts in the head.

[01:19:01] You have squeezed this lemon dry.

[01:19:03] Well, we'll let you reduce.

[01:19:05] And we'll be back here every Friday through January 17th, breaking down each episode with

[01:19:11] more mailbags in between.

[01:19:12] I think look out for the next mailbag after the holidays, covering feedback on episodes

[01:19:18] six through eight.

[01:19:20] We'll also, we also definitely want to hear your thoughts about the show and your theories

[01:19:25] and we'll discuss and pose those to the rest of the community in these extra mailbag episodes.

[01:19:31] Please send them to wool shift dust podcast at gmail.com.

[01:19:36] You'll find that link in the show notes.

[01:19:37] Also do join the conversation on discord.

[01:19:40] We've got a dedicated forum with separate chats per episode and a book spoiler discussion as well.

[01:19:45] Book spoilers are also welcome in the feedback, but then, uh, just please send that feedback to me.

[01:19:51] Don't tag Luke or anything.

[01:19:53] And, uh, that feedback will be discussed in the spoiler cast episodes.

[01:19:57] And again, this week's spoiler cast discussion is the wool rebellion, AKA the cruel plot twists.

[01:20:03] The books tell us are coming at the end of the season and how the show changes are likely to play into that.

[01:20:09] Supercast and Patreon subscribers have access to all of these spoiler casts, plus breakdowns of the silo books and short stories and season one spoilery rewatch and extra interviews with Hugh Howey with full book spoilers.

[01:20:22] And I want to welcome new siloes in Craig B., Brady P., Thunder and Chris B.

[01:20:29] Thank you so, so much.

[01:20:31] And I hope you also help make this public podcast possible.

[01:20:34] See you on the next spoiler cast.

[01:20:35] But if you're not interested in, there are new season pass options that allow you to just get those things that I described, the silo specific things for a one time fee.

[01:20:48] Um, you have a few different options there, but subscribers who do a monthly or annual subscription on Supercast or Patreon get all access to all that plus additional episodes that include extra seasonal episodes.

[01:21:01] Like the Christmas Carol novella deep dive with extra short story audio drama that Luke and I just released.

[01:21:09] And not to mention additional Hugh Howey book and short story breakdowns and doom book breakdowns coming up after silo.

[01:21:17] Plus there'll be more, um, Abby and I are going to do more Hugh Howey short stories from the machine learning book as well there.

[01:21:25] So anyway, if you're interested in any of that, you can explore the links in the show notes for more information.

[01:21:31] Um, if you're not interested in any of that, then we just really want to thank you for listening.

[01:21:35] And if you feel like you got something out of it, then please do pass it on to anyone else who might be interested, leave a positive review, all these things.

[01:21:43] Again, I always say this, they really, really do help.

[01:21:47] And also do check out the lore hounds feed where David is leading weekly breakdowns of dune prophecy with me joining him.

[01:21:55] Lots of other stuff happening over there, like wicked one shot, some comics versus content.

[01:22:00] We've got a Joker versus madcap episode.

[01:22:04] And of course the Christmas content there, there's a Netflix Christmas goodness.

[01:22:11] We, we talked about hot frosty and we talked about, um, our little secret.

[01:22:17] Are you, do you watch any of the Netflix Christmas stuff, Luke?

[01:22:20] No, no, I've been watching so much Christmas Carol themed stuff for our, uh,

[01:22:27] but in general, a holiday special that I'm, uh, no, I'm not a big, I'm not,

[01:22:32] I don't actually watch much Netflix content full stop.

[01:22:36] Okay. Fair, fair. All right.

[01:22:39] Um, do also check out the other podcasts on the platform, the Star Wars Canon timeline podcast,

[01:22:43] Properly Howard, which is currently doing a few good films season with film starring leads from a few good men.

[01:22:49] Uh, radioactive ramblings is covering red rising arcane and Ghibli movies.

[01:22:56] Uh, nevermind the music is combining music and psychology to give you fresh insights into your favorite songs or even songs that you might not be so into.

[01:23:06] You still learn things from it.

[01:23:07] And it could be said, you said you, you guys are planning an end of year episode.

[01:23:11] Yeah, we did. And actually we recorded, there was so much going on in the world that we did actually find time to record a episode.

[01:23:18] So our latest episode looks at the general election in the Irish Republic.

[01:23:22] It looks at, uh, some of Trump's cabinet picks.

[01:23:26] It looks at the very strange resignation of British transport secretary Louise Hay and inspired by our, um, Christmas Carol coverage.

[01:23:36] We each pick one historical event that we'd like to see depicted on film by Muppets.

[01:23:44] So, so I selected Watergate.

[01:23:48] Um, that's perfect.

[01:23:49] Yeah.

[01:23:50] Will select my, uh, cohost will calling, um, selected the divorce of Prince Charles and Princess Diana.

[01:23:57] Um, and my host Simon LV, um, like how Simon LV selected the perfumer affair with Muppets, which.

[01:24:05] Would have been interesting seeing as that is a sex scandal involving British politicians.

[01:24:13] That's like, reminds me of was there's a puppet sex movie.

[01:24:16] Was it, uh, something team America.

[01:24:19] Yeah.

[01:24:20] Yeah.

[01:24:22] Yeah.

[01:24:23] Yeah.

[01:24:23] World police team America.

[01:24:24] Yes.

[01:24:25] Yeah.

[01:24:27] All right.

[01:24:28] Great.

[01:24:30] Any final thoughts?

[01:24:31] No words of wisdom or love for the listeners.

[01:24:35] Yeah.

[01:24:36] Well, um, thanks for all the feedback on discord and thank you to the many people, um, that

[01:24:44] have followed me on blue sky.

[01:24:46] Um, and are as a result of the show.

[01:24:49] Um, so just a reminder that for anybody out there that wants to my blue sky handle is Luke F.

[01:24:55] Middip or one word.

[01:24:57] And yeah, you'll find links to both of our blue skies in the show notes as well.

[01:25:01] So you can find us there.

[01:25:03] All right.

[01:25:04] We'll see you next Friday for episode seven.

[01:25:07] And of course this week's extra spoilery spoiler cast.

[01:25:11] Until then, hope you're brushing up in your coding skills because Bernard's watching.

[01:25:37] We'll see you next time.

[01:25:44] Bye.

[01:25:46] Bye.

[01:25:48] Bye.

[01:26:00] Bye.

[01:26:00] Bye.

[01:26:01] Bye.