Does that love song really remind them of you, or is it actually their previous partner? In this week’s episode, we revel in Toto’s 1982 masterpiece “Africa.” Nichole talks about how our memories play tricks on us, and how different people react to ambiguity. Meanwhile, Mark takes us on another investigation, this time trying to uncover how this song’s iconic riff fits in with the various keys of the song. We dare you to sing along (well) with this chorus!
Other music heard in this episode: Green Day - “Whatsername”, The Beach Boys - “In My Room”, Don Henley - “The Boys of Summer”, Sublime - “Wrong Way”, Toto - “Dune (Desert Theme)”, Steely Dan - “Black Friday”, Toto - “Hold the Line”, Toto - “I Won’t Hold You Back”, The Bee Gees - “More Than a Woman”, The Beatles - “Something”, The Cardigans - “Lovefool”
Send us your thoughts at NeverMusicPod@gmail.com
Nevermind the Music is part of The Lorehounds Network. Join the Nevermind the Music Discord channel by visiting thelorehounds.com
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00:00 --> 00:28 [SPEAKER_00]: the whole like crime scene sketch artist thing seems so baffling to me that someone's like still oh they look like this and like oh yeah oh it looks just like there's no way but in a way I could I've seen your face how many times if I describe your face to somebody a good artist there's it just wouldn't look like you would be different I forget everything about like your color eyes it'd be like I don't know I guess brown but that's just me rolling the dice and that's if I we asked you on a good day that's right what if we asked you after you just got punched and that's right you were supposed to be yeah that's right it's crazy
00:42 --> 00:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Hi, I'm Mark.
00:42 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Hey, I'm Nicole.
00:43 --> 00:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is Nevermind the Music.
00:45 --> 00:47 [SPEAKER_05]: What are we going to talk about today, Mark?
00:47 --> 00:49 [SPEAKER_00]: We are going to talk briefly.
00:49 --> 00:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I hope about karaoke.
00:52 --> 00:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh.
00:53 --> 00:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you do karaoke?
00:55 --> 00:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you like karaoke?
00:58 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_05]: I like the idea of karaoke.
01:00 --> 01:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And I want to be someone that does karaoke.
01:04 --> 01:09 [SPEAKER_05]: The only time I've ever done it is when I'm traveling for work in different cities and I use a different name
01:12 --> 01:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like you've even said that name on, I'm trying to remember Sally is the first to me.
01:17 --> 01:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I was like, yeah, okay, good, right.
01:19 --> 01:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I think you, yeah, have we, I don't, maybe we talked a little bit about karaoke in the sense that it's part of your drifting identity that you take.
01:26 --> 01:32 [SPEAKER_05]: And sometimes when I'm in the car singing, I imagine that I'm singing karaoke in front of people and they're like applauding wildly for me.
01:33 --> 01:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's funny, because you're a lapsed musician, not an active musician.
01:37 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_00]: But when I'm listening to a song, I imagine myself playing the song performing the song.
01:41 --> 01:46 [SPEAKER_00]: You're imagining karaoke in the song, not being on stage with a band or at a concert.
01:46 --> 01:47 [SPEAKER_00]: That's funny.
01:47 --> 01:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I imagine karaoke in the song at a company retreat from my university.
01:52 --> 01:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I'm imagining, I'm just weird.
01:54 --> 01:57 [SPEAKER_05]: I imagine singing the song in front of my co-worker.
01:57 --> 01:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Have you watched Jerry Doody Company retreat?
01:59 --> 01:59 [SPEAKER_05]: No, is it good?
02:00 --> 02:01 [SPEAKER_05]: And love during the love day.
02:01 --> 02:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the second, at the point that we recorded this, it's probably a couple months ago that came out.
02:08 --> 02:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, it's funny.
02:09 --> 02:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
02:09 --> 02:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll check it out.
02:10 --> 02:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody should check it out.
02:11 --> 02:14 [SPEAKER_00]: So I like the idea of karaoke.
02:14 --> 02:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Also, I have a weird kind of uncanny valley of karaoke.
02:19 --> 02:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Not that karaoke is the uncanny valley, but I represent an uncanny valley where I'm not like a really good singer.
02:26 --> 02:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Where people are like, please, to watch me.
02:30 --> 02:33 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm a good enough singer that it's not funny.
02:33 --> 02:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm just like, pretty good.
02:35 --> 02:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's pretty good.
02:36 --> 02:39 [SPEAKER_05]: I, I'll have to say I don't, you used the term uncanny valley a lot.
02:39 --> 02:40 [SPEAKER_05]: And I don't really know what that means.
02:40 --> 02:52 [SPEAKER_00]: The uncanny valley is a term, I think originally it's from robotics, but it's used a lot when people talk about like CG and stuff like that, where something is the uncanny valley is like a graph.
02:53 --> 02:57 [SPEAKER_00]: of affection and likability of a, of like a character, like a robot, right?
02:58 --> 03:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Where as it becomes more like a human, it becomes more something that you find affectionate and attractive to you.
03:06 --> 03:11 [SPEAKER_00]: But there's a point in which it becomes very close to being human and horrifying.
03:11 --> 03:15 [SPEAKER_00]: And so the graph shows a thing like a positive climb and then a dip.
03:15 --> 03:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And that dip is the, and then something becomes the movie AI or whatever or Westworld where it's indistinguishable from a human and then it starts going up again.
03:22 --> 03:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I say, so you're there, are you curious?
03:25 --> 03:33 [SPEAKER_00]: So in the robotics, think like, or think like a CG movie, where like, it looks almost real, but just not, and it kind of looks gross, even if it's supposed to look like a character you're rooting for.
03:34 --> 03:42 [SPEAKER_00]: So like, I'm good enough that I can hold my own, but I'm not a good enough singer that I actually, people are like, wow, let's hear that Mark guy again.
03:42 --> 03:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And so it's just like, it's me taking myself really seriously singing a song when they're like, let's move on to the next drunk guy who can't sing, right?
03:48 --> 03:50 [SPEAKER_05]: body because it's funnier.
03:50 --> 03:51 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not fun to watch me.
03:51 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just like trying my hardest to be a B-plus.
03:54 --> 03:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's all okay.
03:55 --> 04:02 [SPEAKER_00]: So, have you ever in your Sally mode chosen a song you think would be fine?
04:02 --> 04:03 [SPEAKER_00]: That was not.
04:04 --> 04:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, sometimes there are songs that you think are going to be great, but then they're not like wonderwall.
04:10 --> 04:13 [SPEAKER_05]: You think it's going to be great, but it's kind of hard to get there sometimes,
04:18 --> 04:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Every rose has its thorn.
04:20 --> 04:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow.
04:20 --> 04:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Like you think you know that song, but you don't really know the song.
04:23 --> 04:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I definitely don't really know it enough.
04:24 --> 04:26 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a good one line, you know?
04:26 --> 04:29 [SPEAKER_00]: But sometimes this is like a range thing, right?
04:29 --> 04:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Like you say, like, Wonderwall, Wonderwall might be too low for you or something, so you're actually at low or you're like singing at super high and it sort of doesn't work.
04:36 --> 04:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So I usually have a good sense of where my range is, right?
04:40 --> 04:51 [SPEAKER_00]: So if I hear something on the radio all sing along or whatever, so if I was choosing a karaoke song, it's usually not like the obvious trap of, oh my god, I accidentally chose a Freddie Mercury song I can't hit.
04:51 --> 04:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I already know I can't hit it, right?
04:54 --> 04:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not always like, oh that's a high thing.
04:56 --> 04:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I've got some hard songs that are in my rep.
04:59 --> 05:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't do karaoke much, but I could do possum kingdom.
05:02 --> 05:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, I don't know what that is.
05:04 --> 05:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you want to die?
05:05 --> 05:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Totally.
05:05 --> 05:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, do you know that?
05:06 --> 05:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I can do.
05:07 --> 05:08 [SPEAKER_00]: That's good for you.
05:08 --> 05:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Animal by neon trees, that's creamy.
05:10 --> 05:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I can do it.
05:12 --> 05:15 [SPEAKER_00]: But there are songs that are in my range that should fit my voice.
05:16 --> 05:18 [SPEAKER_00]: But I just can't, I just can't.
05:19 --> 05:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And maybe I've tried, maybe I've tried to sing it while I'm playing the guitar and I just know it would never work.
05:24 --> 05:30 [SPEAKER_00]: So, do you have five songs that Nicole should be able to sing but somehow totally can't?
05:31 --> 05:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Or should we just jump to my list of five songs that Mark should be able to sing but somehow totally can't?
05:36 --> 05:38 [SPEAKER_05]: I probably I can probably say artists.
05:39 --> 05:55 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think I can get into the granular of song give me a couple artists and then I'll give you my I should be able to sing Bonny rate, Melissa ethyrge, Justin Bieber, a lot of sports that like those are my range, but I should be able to sing colon lots of iconic really awesome vocalists
05:55 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, just I'm just talking about the rain like okay, you know, I'm not going to sing Sabrina Carverenter.
06:01 --> 06:02 [SPEAKER_05]: It's too high for me.
06:02 --> 06:04 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm not going to sing Taylor Swift.
06:04 --> 06:08 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not it's just not my range, but like Justin Bieber's perfectly in my range.
06:08 --> 06:08 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
06:09 --> 06:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just is.
06:09 --> 06:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
06:10 --> 06:12 [SPEAKER_05]: So that's what I would go to.
06:13 --> 06:14 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's something else about it.
06:14 --> 06:15 [SPEAKER_00]: That's too hard.
06:16 --> 06:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, there's something else about it.
06:17 --> 06:18 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's what I'm hitting.
06:18 --> 06:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And we're getting to number five, which is the title of the episode here, but the number one, no particular order.
06:26 --> 06:35 [SPEAKER_00]: The first song, completely within my vocal skill theoretically, but I just can't do, 2004, Green Day, what's her name?
06:52 --> 06:55 [SPEAKER_05]: The thing about that, dude, no one wants to hear that.
06:55 --> 06:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Carriol, that's your problem with Carriol.
06:56 --> 06:58 [SPEAKER_05]: You're picking songs that no one wants to hear.
06:58 --> 06:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not picking that.
06:59 --> 07:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I would never pick that.
07:00 --> 07:03 [SPEAKER_05]: If someone could have said, you'd be like, what is this shit, and I'm going to go the back.
07:03 --> 07:03 [SPEAKER_05]: You don't know.
07:03 --> 07:05 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't know Green Day because it's a popular album.
07:06 --> 07:07 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a kind of a besides song.
07:08 --> 07:10 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's the interval in the melody.
07:10 --> 07:12 [SPEAKER_00]: When they get to that Apajitura,
07:13 --> 07:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we'll talk about a budget to it as later.
07:14 --> 07:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, I can't do it.
07:17 --> 07:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Some reason I cannot sing in tune on that song.
07:19 --> 07:20 [SPEAKER_00]: How about this song?
07:20 --> 07:22 [SPEAKER_00]: It's high, but not too high.
07:22 --> 07:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I can sing pretty high.
07:24 --> 07:27 [SPEAKER_00]: 1963 in my room, Beach Boys.
07:28 --> 07:41 [SPEAKER_04]: There's no room where I can go and tell my secrets to in my room.
07:55 --> 07:59 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, Brian Wilson, I know it so you could say, oh, Mark, come on, here's the thing.
07:59 --> 08:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I've tried every single part.
08:01 --> 08:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I've sang the bass, the baritone, the all five part harmony on this because my ensemble at school did it.
08:06 --> 08:10 [SPEAKER_00]: And I tried to figure out which one I could do and I can't do any of them.
08:10 --> 08:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Any guess from listening why?
08:11 --> 08:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And I can sing the notes, but I sound like crap.
08:15 --> 08:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Why?
08:15 --> 08:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Because you're singing them by yourself, would you?
08:17 --> 08:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you're trying them with the group?
08:19 --> 08:21 [SPEAKER_00]: No, the note, the long notes.
08:21 --> 08:22 [SPEAKER_00]: You just can't do it.
08:22 --> 08:24 [SPEAKER_00]: The long notes, like you have to be so
08:25 --> 08:27 [SPEAKER_00]: from Huntington Beach, or wherever they're from.
08:27 --> 08:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe they're just in overbearing uncle yelling at you.
08:30 --> 08:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Father, well, I guess it would be.
08:31 --> 08:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Or uncle depending on which boy you are.
08:33 --> 08:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, maybe a uncle is like, love.
08:36 --> 08:39 [SPEAKER_05]: I really have to find my love in that van.
08:39 --> 08:40 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a bigger problem.
08:40 --> 08:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, I don't know, which one you want to be there.
08:42 --> 08:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, number three, 1984.
08:45 --> 08:48 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not just high, but it's the way it goes high.
08:49 --> 08:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Don Henley, boys of summer.
08:56 --> 09:12 [SPEAKER_04]: I saw it, it got you here, I couldn't do it I saw it, I saw it, I couldn't do it I can't do it, I love you, I love you, I love you I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you
09:14 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_00]: You know that right.
09:15 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_05]: I know that one.
09:15 --> 09:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Great song.
09:16 --> 09:29 [SPEAKER_05]: I would need like what's that like is it a pitch pipe the thing like Yeah, I wouldn't need that for that one around somewhere because like the notes that he's singing don't like fit with the rest of the song And you need to like be able to really hear it sing it right.
09:30 --> 09:31 [SPEAKER_05]: And in karaoke I think that's the hardest part.
09:31 --> 09:34 [SPEAKER_05]: You think you know where to start finding the notes.
09:34 --> 09:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, some of the notes are dissonant the first In the course.
09:39 --> 09:40 [SPEAKER_00]: That's in the court.
09:40 --> 09:41 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the third.
09:41 --> 09:43 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the last one's the major seven though
09:43 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_04]: The problem is it's the after the boys.
09:47 --> 09:50 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to have done that first part having to go back up again.
09:50 --> 09:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
09:51 --> 09:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just it's just too much.
09:53 --> 09:54 [SPEAKER_00]: It's good song though.
09:54 --> 09:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
09:55 --> 09:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Number four, 1996.
09:58 --> 09:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Not too high?
09:59 --> 09:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Not like that.
10:00 --> 10:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Wrong way.
10:01 --> 10:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Supply.
10:02 --> 10:04 [SPEAKER_02]: It's gone if I can, but I am only a man.
10:04 --> 10:07 [SPEAKER_02]: So I take good to the can, it's the wrong way.
10:07 --> 10:14 [SPEAKER_02]: The only family that she's ever had is her seven-honey brothers and a drunkass dad.
10:14 --> 10:17 [SPEAKER_02]: He needed money, so he put her other street.
10:17 --> 10:20 [SPEAKER_02]: Ever been what's going fine until that day she met me.
10:21 --> 10:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Happy I said, wanna shoot your dad, I'll do anything I can, the wrong way.
10:27 --> 10:29 [SPEAKER_05]: I would be a good song for me to sing karaoke.
10:30 --> 10:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Guess what?
10:30 --> 10:31 [SPEAKER_05]: What?
10:31 --> 10:32 [SPEAKER_00]: You can't.
10:32 --> 10:36 [SPEAKER_00]: It's impossible because you just heard three key changes.
10:36 --> 10:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Wait, three keys or three keys.
10:38 --> 10:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm trying to figure out every single section.
10:40 --> 10:42 [SPEAKER_00]: It keeps shifting around and I tried to play this song.
10:42 --> 10:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm never tried to karaoke.
10:43 --> 10:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know this would be.
10:44 --> 10:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I think you need to be drinking.
10:45 --> 10:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I think you have to be a better musician than I am.
10:48 --> 10:53 [SPEAKER_05]: It's really, you're saying that Bradley Noel from Sublime is a better musician.
10:53 --> 10:54 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know, man.
10:55 --> 10:57 [SPEAKER_00]: The song is the same two chords.
10:58 --> 11:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Sort of it just keeps going down a whole step, but it keeps shifting keys.
11:01 --> 11:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it's just really hard to find your note.
11:04 --> 11:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Put it that way.
11:05 --> 11:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
11:05 --> 11:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Somebody a bigger man than I or stronger woman than I could do the song.
11:10 --> 11:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know why.
11:11 --> 11:11 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
11:11 --> 11:12 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
11:12 --> 11:13 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
11:14 --> 11:15 [SPEAKER_00]: To good song, I'm gonna do the verses.
11:16 --> 11:19 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the repetition of one high note over and over again.
11:19 --> 11:21 [SPEAKER_00]: We're gonna get into fun things, talk about this song.
11:21 --> 11:25 [SPEAKER_00]: But Bobby Campbell's chorus in this song, 1982, Toto's Africa.
11:47 --> 11:53 [SPEAKER_04]: You're the things we never did.
11:53 --> 11:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I love this song.
11:54 --> 11:54 [SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
11:55 --> 11:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So, it's impossible to sing.
11:57 --> 11:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I was in a, have I ever told you about Delorean 88?
12:00 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_05]: No, but I'm so on the edge of my seat.
12:03 --> 12:04 [SPEAKER_05]: That was in Macapella?
12:04 --> 12:06 [SPEAKER_00]: No, but it was in 80's cover band.
12:06 --> 12:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I was in sort of new Haven Sin pop.
12:09 --> 12:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Honestly, Mark, probably one of the, in your top five band names you've ever come up with.
12:13 --> 12:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, maybe it was pretty good.
12:15 --> 12:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Did I come up with it?
12:16 --> 12:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
12:16 --> 12:18 [SPEAKER_00]: That was that one didn't take as long as something other ones.
12:18 --> 12:20 [SPEAKER_00]: 80s band names, not that hard.
12:21 --> 12:22 [SPEAKER_00]: This was right after college.
12:22 --> 12:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I was kind of the primary second vocalist.
12:25 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
12:26 --> 12:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So I would have been the meaning like, I wasn't the lead.
12:28 --> 12:29 [SPEAKER_00]: I was like a tar player.
12:29 --> 12:32 [SPEAKER_00]: We had to turn to our sex player Josh to get that.
12:32 --> 12:33 [SPEAKER_04]: Got to take a look.
12:33 --> 12:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just couldn't do it.
12:35 --> 12:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So here's what I want.
12:37 --> 12:50 [SPEAKER_00]: listeners, send in a audio of you seeing any of these five songs better than Mark could, especially the chorus, but also in the discord, what songs do you want Nicole to attempt and what songs impossible for you?
12:51 --> 12:51 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, anyways.
12:52 --> 12:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I have a rich alto voice.
12:53 --> 12:54 [SPEAKER_00]: You have a rich alto.
12:54 --> 12:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So you could probably sing that.
12:56 --> 12:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
12:57 --> 12:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
12:57 --> 13:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Can you sing the the wilddogs cry out in the night like versus or is that too low?
13:01 --> 13:02 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't even have to hear them.
13:02 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm not that familiar.
13:03 --> 13:07 [SPEAKER_00]: You can pronounce Kilimanjaro that way though, and not not Kilimanjaro.
13:07 --> 13:09 [SPEAKER_00]: So random lorehounds fun fact.
13:10 --> 13:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Total.
13:11 --> 13:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Uh-huh.
13:11 --> 13:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Composed most of the music to do.
13:14 --> 13:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Do you know that?
13:14 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_00]: David Lynch is 1984, dude.
13:16 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_00]: They love Dune.
13:17 --> 13:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Do they love the 1980s, Dune?
13:18 --> 13:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I love David does.
13:19 --> 13:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I think a lot of people don't, but this is the desert theme from Dune, which sounds just like Africa by Toto.
13:47 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm getting, I just made like this crazy connection to my everyday life.
13:51 --> 13:55 [SPEAKER_05]: So my husband went through this thing of watching Twin Peaks a lot.
13:55 --> 13:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Now he's been reading Dune and listening to Dune and I bet you because he's trying to watch Dune from 1980.
14:00 --> 14:01 [SPEAKER_05]: It's been a V4.
14:01 --> 14:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Whatever.
14:02 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_00]: He's in a day to lunch, man.
14:03 --> 14:05 [SPEAKER_00]: He's in a day of lunch mode.
14:05 --> 14:08 [SPEAKER_05]: But this song reminds me of my husband and I'd love to share a story.
14:09 --> 14:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Have I ever told you this story?
14:10 --> 14:12 [SPEAKER_00]: How dare you go off top of it?
14:12 --> 14:13 [SPEAKER_05]: This is an off topic.
14:13 --> 14:14 [SPEAKER_05]: This part of it.
14:14 --> 14:15 [SPEAKER_05]: This is part of it.
14:15 --> 14:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
14:15 --> 14:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
14:17 --> 14:29 [SPEAKER_05]: So when we first fell in love, my husband set the song as his ring tone for me because the specific time that you could like set ring tones, like as a song to attach to certain people.
14:29 --> 14:31 [SPEAKER_05]: So when I called him the song played.
14:31 --> 14:33 [SPEAKER_00]: The desert thing from Dune or Africa by total.
14:33 --> 14:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
14:34 --> 14:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Keep up Mark.
14:35 --> 14:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
14:35 --> 14:35 [SPEAKER_05]: So.
14:36 --> 14:37 [SPEAKER_05]: And he would always look at me.
14:37 --> 14:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, the song reminds me of you and it reminds me of us, okay?
14:41 --> 14:50 [SPEAKER_05]: And then now whenever he hears it on the radio, he looks at me and gets this like love struck looking his eye and like holds my hand and he's like, we did it.
14:50 --> 14:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Like you and me.
14:52 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I know I do.
14:53 --> 15:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Like why there's that, so she's that, and why it's important, or if there's like meaning in the song for our relationship that I just forgot about, now it's too late to ask.
15:03 --> 15:08 [SPEAKER_00]: You guys have been married long enough, and this is this could totally apply to me, and my wife, too.
15:09 --> 15:17 [SPEAKER_00]: there could be this emotional heart felt thing that happened with another person and his brain is just filled in the blanks that you are every person he's ever loved.
15:17 --> 15:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that that's what it is.
15:19 --> 15:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just like ambiguity of memory and that's remember that New Year's party and you're like you mean New Year's 1997 when you were still in high school and we'd never met before or something like that.
15:30 --> 15:31 [SPEAKER_05]: So but that idea
15:32 --> 15:39 [SPEAKER_05]: When I started thinking of the song, all I could think about was that ambiguity of memory, like I don't think that's a memory about me.
15:39 --> 15:42 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that's another memory that you're like inflating.
15:42 --> 15:47 [SPEAKER_05]: So that story actually is incredibly on topic, Mark, for what I plan to discuss in this song.
15:47 --> 15:48 [SPEAKER_00]: That's interesting.
15:48 --> 15:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you going to talk about the weirdness of this song?
15:51 --> 15:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yes.
15:52 --> 15:54 [SPEAKER_00]: This song is like inspired by
15:55 --> 16:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess the lyrics were David Page, written by the keyboardist, one of the keyboardist of total, David Page and the drummer, one of the drummers, Jeff Percaro, and he watched like a documentary about suffering in Africa, and it's like a fantasy of going there, and there's a woman he loves, but he misses her, but he also loves Africa like this song?
16:16 --> 16:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this okay?
16:17 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_05]: No, in the music video.
16:18 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Probably not.
16:18 --> 16:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Is so weird.
16:19 --> 16:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Did you watch the music video?
16:23 --> 16:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It's truly african- It's tropey-like africanism, kind of western- It feels yucky.
16:30 --> 16:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's weird.
16:31 --> 16:33 [SPEAKER_00]: So are we just going to, like, I want to talk about chords.
16:33 --> 16:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So are we just going to start by, like, this song is weird.
16:36 --> 16:40 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like the love and, and I feel like there isn't a lot of conversation about
16:41 --> 16:43 [SPEAKER_00]: whether it's okay or not.
16:43 --> 16:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's just ambiguous enough.
16:46 --> 16:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
16:46 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody knows what it's about that you can almost just forget that it's kind of weird.
16:52 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
16:53 --> 16:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Or forget that it's supposed to even be about something.
16:55 --> 16:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's like there was an Africa like 20 times.
16:57 --> 16:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's what I want to talk about.
16:58 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_00]: But so what kind of so.
17:00 --> 17:03 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's starting to ambiguous song and that.
17:04 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_05]: We can't really pin it down and I just keep thinking of this example from my life and the song about this ambiguous memory.
17:12 --> 17:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I love that.
17:12 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_00]: That is such a great thing that you just made up for the purpose of this conversation.
17:15 --> 17:17 [SPEAKER_05]: No, it's not.
17:17 --> 17:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I was really through.
17:19 --> 17:21 [SPEAKER_05]: But then you think, like, we happen together.
17:21 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm like, who else is out there?
17:23 --> 17:25 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, keep me away from you.
17:26 --> 17:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, well, all right, buddy, two, eight.
17:27 --> 17:30 [SPEAKER_05]: I already have you locked in, but.
17:30 --> 17:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're getting in there.
17:31 --> 17:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I'm definitely talking about ambiguity here.
17:34 --> 17:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
17:34 --> 17:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to talk about the ambiguity of this riff and what key it's in.
17:50 --> 17:52 [SPEAKER_00]: And you may say, oh, I know what kids in, I can hear it.
17:53 --> 17:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And my counter to that is it depends on what part of the song we're in.
17:56 --> 17:59 [SPEAKER_00]: There's that poor progression exists in multiple spots.
17:59 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So should we set up the song real quick?
18:01 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's the song.
18:01 --> 18:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we're already 15 minutes deep.
18:04 --> 18:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you go for a song around?
18:05 --> 18:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I live your best.
18:06 --> 18:10 [SPEAKER_00]: And then I want you to talk to me about what the hell this is all about.
18:10 --> 18:10 [SPEAKER_00]: OK.
18:11 --> 18:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I already mentioned 1982, the song is nine days older than me.
18:15 --> 18:16 [SPEAKER_00]: What?
18:16 --> 18:17 [SPEAKER_00]: What was the date it was released?
18:17 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you asking me to do that, Math?
18:19 --> 18:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Allegedly.
18:21 --> 18:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I would think that would be early October in 1982.
18:25 --> 18:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm older than you.
18:26 --> 18:26 [SPEAKER_00]: You are older than me.
18:27 --> 18:30 [SPEAKER_00]: There are the truth is, literally billions of people older than me.
18:30 --> 18:31 [SPEAKER_05]: What?
18:31 --> 18:32 [SPEAKER_00]: More people?
18:32 --> 18:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's interesting.
18:33 --> 18:36 [SPEAKER_00]: More people in the world are younger than me, probably.
18:36 --> 18:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Right?
18:36 --> 18:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Almost certainly.
18:37 --> 18:38 [SPEAKER_00]: That's bummer.
18:38 --> 18:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, well, no, it's great.
18:39 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_05]: You're probably right in the middle of your midlife.
18:41 --> 18:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm midlife, but I have a feeling there's certain parts of the world where the average age is pretty young.
18:46 --> 18:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Not here, though.
18:47 --> 18:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, anyways, Toto.
18:49 --> 18:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, his Toto 4.
18:50 --> 18:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Put it out.
18:52 --> 18:53 [SPEAKER_00]: This is from their record called Toto 4.
18:54 --> 18:57 [SPEAKER_00]: So this song I already mentioned written by David Page and Jeff Percaro.
18:58 --> 18:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you a fan of Toto in general?
18:59 --> 19:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, do you like Toto songs?
19:01 --> 19:03 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't dislike them.
19:04 --> 19:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I never really, deep dove into totals.
19:06 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Did you end up watching the Yacht Rock documentary from a year or two ago?
19:10 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
19:10 --> 19:20 [SPEAKER_00]: They figure into it a lot because not just because this song we could say is Yacht Rock, but they also were the session musicians in a lot of those songs.
19:21 --> 19:21 [SPEAKER_00]: So like,
19:22 --> 19:31 [SPEAKER_00]: They were guys that ended up forming a band, I think, essentially because they were seeing each other all the time playing other people's songs and just like, hey, let's start our own band.
19:32 --> 19:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So like, steely Dan, sunny and share, even.
19:36 --> 19:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But a lot of those, the Michael McDonald stuff, the stuff we associate with Yacht Rock, they were on a lot of those records.
19:42 --> 19:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's an example of them playing, not Yacht Rock, not yet at least, but this is Steely Dan, 1975.
19:49 --> 19:50 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is Jeff and David playing.
19:51 --> 19:55 [SPEAKER_00]: There's also other guys that are in the band, of course, but this just shows where these guys come from.
19:55 --> 20:03 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very like jazz-trained, sort of fancy musical background that then turned into pop songs.
20:03 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_00]: The song's called Black Friday.
20:25 --> 20:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Why is that song not used in every black Friday advertisement so good?
20:29 --> 20:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess we'd have to listen to the rest of the lyrics, but you like that?
20:31 --> 20:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:32 --> 20:34 [SPEAKER_00]: A part of me is like, almost think you're going to hate this guy.
20:34 --> 20:34 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I like it.
20:34 --> 20:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you like jazz rock?
20:36 --> 20:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I like jazz rock.
20:36 --> 20:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:37 --> 20:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like jam band.
20:38 --> 20:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, same thing.
20:39 --> 20:42 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just less folkie more jazz even though the jam bands.
20:42 --> 20:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:43 --> 20:47 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, they started their own band, one of those bands with a rotating cast.
20:48 --> 20:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So like Bobby Campbell's the guy, the high singing lead vocalist, they have a bunch of probably three or four of them sing.
20:53 --> 21:02 [SPEAKER_00]: But he got fired in 84 for drug stuff and then various guys, Joseph Williams settling in, you know, who John Williams is twin brother.
21:03 --> 21:04 [SPEAKER_00]: John Williams is son.
21:04 --> 21:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, really?
21:05 --> 21:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I was pretty close.
21:06 --> 21:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I think generationally John Williams would be kind of like
21:10 --> 21:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Why is this like the girl joining the band at that point?
21:14 --> 21:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe not that.
21:15 --> 21:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how old Johnny is.
21:16 --> 21:20 [SPEAKER_05]: They would want to get, though, John Williams, super talented.
21:20 --> 21:21 [SPEAKER_00]: To have him as your leads here.
21:21 --> 21:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Is he a good singer?
21:22 --> 21:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know John Williams.
21:23 --> 21:24 [SPEAKER_05]: He got to add value.
21:24 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's right.
21:25 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_00]: He definitely has value.
21:26 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, people, I assume most people have heard at least some total, but they started out much more arena rocky, just playing a couple tunes before we get to Nicole's crazy ideas about this song.
21:37 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And then they ended up more kind of R&B soft rock, y'all rock.
21:40 --> 21:43 [SPEAKER_00]: But this is the Irina Rocky phase, 1978.
21:44 --> 21:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably there, third biggest hit maybe, hold the line.
22:08 --> 22:09 [SPEAKER_05]: I love that song.
22:09 --> 22:10 [SPEAKER_05]: I didn't know that was total this whole time.
22:11 --> 22:12 [SPEAKER_00]: It's different vibe, right?
22:12 --> 22:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I think like I said kind of 70s arena rock, it's hard or like yeah, I think I only think of Africa when I think of total.
22:18 --> 22:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you don't understand it, right?
22:20 --> 22:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah.
22:21 --> 22:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's total.
22:22 --> 22:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's their second biggest.
22:23 --> 22:27 [SPEAKER_00]: So a re-like's Africa number one hit, Rosanna number two.
22:27 --> 22:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
22:28 --> 22:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Hold the line was a number five.
22:31 --> 22:31 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
22:31 --> 22:35 [SPEAKER_00]: The only other top 10 hit, I'll play a clip of it because I actually didn't know this song
22:37 --> 22:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I won't hold you back.
22:38 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_00]: This one, Steve Lukather on lead vocals, but interestingly, because he figures into Africa, Timothy B. Schmidt on backing vocals.
22:45 --> 22:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you know that name?
22:47 --> 22:47 [SPEAKER_05]: No.
22:47 --> 22:48 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the Eagles.
22:49 --> 22:54 [SPEAKER_00]: The second base player of the Eagles, which is so like the seventh Eagle, how does that thing?
22:54 --> 22:55 [SPEAKER_05]: So in the best dress.
23:17 --> 23:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Timothy plays on Africa.
23:18 --> 23:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm putting more like eagles than it's very Timothy B. Schmidt forward.
23:23 --> 23:26 [SPEAKER_00]: It sounds like I can tell you why or something like that, which is a good song.
23:26 --> 23:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But very Yacht Rockie right there are eagles.
23:29 --> 23:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Timothy B.
23:30 --> 23:31 [SPEAKER_05]: B. Schmitt was a good fan for.
23:32 --> 23:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I wonder if anybody could find out.
23:33 --> 23:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
23:33 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_05]: No, I don't know.
23:34 --> 23:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So and this is one of those family or deals, right?
23:37 --> 23:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Jeff Percaro and Drons who's legendary.
23:39 --> 23:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Rest in peace.
23:40 --> 23:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Mike Pocaro who joined after this album is base and also Steve, one of the other keyboardists and their dad plays Marimba on Africa.
23:49 --> 23:50 [SPEAKER_00]: You love Marimba.
23:50 --> 23:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I do love Marimba.
23:51 --> 23:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's funny that you say it like that's a bad thing.
23:53 --> 23:54 [SPEAKER_05]: No, I think it's great.
23:54 --> 23:55 [SPEAKER_05]: You never failed to mention Marimba.
23:55 --> 23:56 [SPEAKER_05]: I have to point it out.
23:56 --> 23:57 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not that often, right?
23:57 --> 24:02 [SPEAKER_00]: But before we just move on, this is background in public because I figured you probably didn't know that much about the band.
24:02 --> 24:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I certainly didn't.
24:03 --> 24:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I had to look into some of this stuff.
24:05 --> 24:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I only really know their hits.
24:06 --> 24:08 [SPEAKER_00]: These guys are songwriting powerhouses.
24:09 --> 24:14 [SPEAKER_00]: So like, not counting total songs, Steve Percaro, human nature.
24:15 --> 24:35 [SPEAKER_00]: by one Michael Jackson David Page got to be real by Cheryl Lynn remember from her our great friend Ross coverage in the Kendrick Lamar episode these guys kept playing on as session players so apparently they literally post-pone touring this album with number one hits to record thriller as the backing band
24:36 --> 24:42 [SPEAKER_00]: For a lot of it, like they were the band, except for the Van Halen solo, they're the band, it beat it, for example.
24:42 --> 24:43 [SPEAKER_00]: At least a lot of them are.
24:43 --> 24:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Wow.
24:44 --> 24:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Steve played on three songs, David on four, Jeff on four, and the other Steve, shoot, which Steve?
24:51 --> 24:53 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the Steve's is on six songs, the other ones on three.
24:54 --> 24:55 [SPEAKER_00]: So like they're all over that album.
24:55 --> 24:57 [SPEAKER_05]: I wonder if they made more money doing that.
24:59 --> 25:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I can't imagine.
25:00 --> 25:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, over time though, the question is just financially, are they getting, did they get paid cash or did they get like a kind of royalty?
25:08 --> 25:10 [SPEAKER_00]: If they're getting a residual, they may be a million.
25:10 --> 25:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Do certain musicians usually get residuals or do they usually get like a cut like a lump sum?
25:15 --> 25:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it really depends.
25:16 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I think usually just get money, right?
25:17 --> 25:22 [SPEAKER_05]: I think like the nature, I'm thinking of the person that does that job, they'd want just the money in their hand.
25:23 --> 25:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, if you're already total, maybe not, maybe not.
25:25 --> 25:26 [SPEAKER_00]: It depends.
25:26 --> 25:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Like if you get a session musician who's like a big name, they might just like, oh, yeah.
25:32 --> 25:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, don't even pay me.
25:33 --> 25:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll just take 10% of it.
25:34 --> 25:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I think just take 10% of thriller profits.
25:37 --> 25:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
25:37 --> 25:38 [SPEAKER_05]: It's possible.
25:38 --> 25:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I bet that wasn't that.
25:40 --> 25:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I bet.
25:40 --> 25:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe.
25:41 --> 25:46 [SPEAKER_00]: But they co-wrote some of the, I mean, like if two of the natures written by Steve Parkero, that would definitely do it.
26:01 --> 26:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, we're going to do like a, what is this chord investigation, what here we an investigation, but before we do that, all the people that fast forward to the 30 minute mark to be able to hear your thoughts on the troubling aspects and interesting ambiguity of these lyrics.
26:16 --> 26:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Go for it.
26:17 --> 26:22 [SPEAKER_05]: So troubling aspects and interesting ambiguity of these lyrics.
26:22 --> 26:28 [SPEAKER_05]: It's more focused on trying to figure out what the song is even about.
26:30 --> 26:34 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not really about Africa, the continent, like they talk about Africa a little bit.
26:35 --> 26:39 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not really about a love story, but there's like hints to love story.
26:39 --> 26:41 [SPEAKER_05]: It's about adventure, I think.
26:42 --> 26:51 [SPEAKER_05]: The music video has a real like haunted library vibe to it that I can't really wrap my head around, like really Salvador Dolly 10 outing situation.
26:53 --> 26:54 [SPEAKER_05]: It's weird.
26:54 --> 26:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I see what you mean.
26:55 --> 27:07 [SPEAKER_05]: So I was thinking of not often, are we allowing things to be open to more than one interpretation and this song is about whatever you want it to be about, which I think is kind of lovely.
27:08 --> 27:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Like for my personal history, this song is about me and my husband's relationship, I guess, for some reason.
27:14 --> 27:15 [SPEAKER_05]: At least for him it is.
27:16 --> 27:23 [SPEAKER_05]: For me, it's about the question of who was he before we met because the song is not about us, right?
27:24 --> 27:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Like so whenever I hear this, I think of like, what is he thinking about?
27:27 --> 27:29 [SPEAKER_05]: And he's thinking, it's just interesting.
27:29 --> 27:37 [SPEAKER_05]: And that got me thinking about this interpretation of the keys that we're gonna discuss later and how it depends on where you put them in the song, like what key it's in.
27:38 --> 27:42 [SPEAKER_05]: And in our memories, like where we store the information, what memory does it like evoke.
27:43 --> 28:02 [SPEAKER_05]: So I was thinking about that a lot and was thinking about our need for patterns seeking and how we like try to find like the right answer to things when the often isn't the right answer and how our brains develop this like mental schema around just the information that we have like we often just fill in the blanks to fill out a story based on information that we have pre-existing.
28:03 --> 28:06 [SPEAKER_05]: So I was thinking about that when I looked at the song and then I started doing
28:11 --> 28:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, for you, do you think that there's something's ambiguous and you don't know the answer?
28:16 --> 28:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Does it bother you?
28:18 --> 28:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Like do you have to find the answer?
28:20 --> 28:27 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's actually funny, because pretty recently, I was on a Lohound's podcast on a show that had mysteries.
28:27 --> 28:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And some of the other folks were like, what do we think is the meaning of this, did it?
28:31 --> 28:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm kind of like a little bit like, I don't know, let's see.
28:34 --> 28:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I kind of have grown to be okay, not knowing the answer.
28:38 --> 28:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And let the mystery be as the leftovers theme song says.
28:43 --> 28:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I like uncovering the truth and reality of the world, but also the older I get, the more I kind of enjoy a vague film ending.
28:52 --> 28:52 [SPEAKER_00]: That's cool.
28:52 --> 28:56 [SPEAKER_00]: A unresolved, is this person good or bad?
28:56 --> 28:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I feel like that's cool?
28:59 --> 29:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And musically, it's definitely cool.
29:01 --> 29:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm all about stuff being a little, what, what beat are we in, right?
29:04 --> 29:05 [SPEAKER_00]: What key are we in?
29:05 --> 29:07 [SPEAKER_05]: I thought that you were going to go the other way for sure.
29:07 --> 29:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Because of your, the high level of analysis you seem to be really passionate about, especially in regards to music, feel like investigation and figuring it out.
29:17 --> 29:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Like parsing it out.
29:18 --> 29:18 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the real answer.
29:19 --> 29:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so it's weird, but that's, it has led me in good faith to the answer that there is ambiguity in the ambiguity is good.
29:28 --> 29:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I, as a matter of like predisposition and drawn to, how can I label this?
29:34 --> 29:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this chord a tonic function in chord or a predominant function in chord?
29:38 --> 29:40 [SPEAKER_00]: What is the actual downbeat of this song?
29:41 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_00]: And in trying to over the course of decades come up with the answers, the songs that foil that have not led me to frustration.
29:50 --> 29:53 [SPEAKER_00]: They have led me to realizing that it's those moments that are great.
29:54 --> 29:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like there was an episode earlier this season where
29:58 --> 30:07 [SPEAKER_00]: What song was it there was maybe maybe you remember you were almost thinking I was saying oh, it was the killer song When I was talking about like oh we sing in all the wrong notes.
30:07 --> 30:12 [SPEAKER_00]: He's he's not in the court at all and and I kept saying that in a certain way And you were like yeah, but it sounds good.
30:12 --> 30:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I was like no, no, that's the whole point
30:14 --> 30:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the point I was making was you singing the wrong notes and it makes it unclear what we're on and that's why it's good.
30:21 --> 30:38 [SPEAKER_00]: And that actually might have been kind of a hard thought lesson where I mean I've made reference to this before where there were a few years there when I had learned so to speak music theory but hadn't learned to wield it for the forces of good that made it really hard to create music when I was writing songs or in bands like because I would
30:40 --> 30:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think my professor told me I had to do it, and that's why I wasn't a fan of my undergraduate music theory professors.
30:48 --> 31:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Is that interesting that we often do that when we're young, we think that we have to like stick to the script, and then you realize as you get older, like no actually deviating from the script is what makes it more interesting when you like go off character.
31:01 --> 31:21 [SPEAKER_05]: And psychology, I use the same expression on the time like, you know, we're teaching these skills of how to interpret human behavior and you have to pick like are you going to be a good witch or bad witch with these skills like how are you going to play it so well, can I can I just say on that yeah like I don't even think it's like, oh, when we're young we want to stick to the script, I think we maybe.
31:22 --> 31:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Some people, it's the opposite, and what it is is I think it's like when you're young, you feel like there's a purity of essence you have to aim at, whether it's I'm a script follower or I'm a rule breaker and it's it's like over time you see enough exceptions you realize like
31:37 --> 31:42 [SPEAKER_00]: The beauty is in the ambiguity the new on the differences that lay under the surface.
31:43 --> 31:48 [SPEAKER_05]: So some people have a high tolerance of ambiguity They perceive it as a challenge.
31:49 --> 32:03 [SPEAKER_05]: I think you probably have a high tolerance of ambiguity because you you want to figure it out You like the mystery the mysteries like the adventure of it for you and some people have a really low tolerance of ambiguity that if they don't know They get really really stressed out and picture it as a threat
32:04 --> 32:09 [SPEAKER_05]: I think of the two of us, I have a lower tolerance of ambiguity than you do.
32:09 --> 32:12 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that you're much more eager to uncover the mystery.
32:12 --> 32:15 [SPEAKER_05]: And I just want to know the answer, like I want to get to the answer of it.
32:16 --> 32:24 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's funny though, because there's also different ways that ambiguity, like ambiguity in my life, I have a lower tolerance for crap.
32:24 --> 32:26 [SPEAKER_00]: What day are we meeting for our next recording?
32:26 --> 32:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I can't plan my weekend.
32:27 --> 32:29 [SPEAKER_00]: So I know what day we're doing our next recording session.
32:29 --> 32:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Like that kind of ambiguity is more of a struggle.
32:32 --> 32:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I haven't learned as much the joy having kids is forced.
32:35 --> 32:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Some of that.
32:36 --> 32:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
32:36 --> 32:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess all this is fighting my predisposition.
32:39 --> 32:42 [SPEAKER_05]: I guess in that respect, I have a higher tolerance to them.
32:42 --> 32:43 [SPEAKER_00]: You're way more go to the go with the
32:43 --> 32:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm way more go with the flow.
32:45 --> 32:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, absolutely.
32:46 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_05]: But that's why we compliment each other because people like us need each other to get it done or else we just Or you're just I'm in the corner wound up crying.
32:53 --> 32:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah on the beach reading a novel.
32:55 --> 32:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, so you're it's like
32:58 --> 33:03 [SPEAKER_00]: You're sort of just saying like the joy of uncertainty.
33:03 --> 33:08 [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know, like, I'm trying to think how is that different from like instability?
33:08 --> 33:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Because the instability is for me more scary.
33:10 --> 33:14 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a reason why I was despite training to be a professional composer.
33:14 --> 33:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I was ultimately drawn to, yeah, but I want to 95 faculty.
33:18 --> 33:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Great.
33:18 --> 33:29 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not just for the stable income, it's for the like, constancy in my life, that being a freelance composer, even if I got really successful, would be kind of always constantly terrifying to me.
33:29 --> 33:32 [SPEAKER_05]: For you, you like to be grounded, but you also like to ponder stuff.
33:32 --> 33:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, you like the the security of a home and family and a job and stability, because that gives you that affords you the luxury of accepting ambiguity as like a challenge and not a threat.
33:45 --> 33:57 [SPEAKER_05]: If you had that stability, ambiguity would be hugely threatening to you, a thing that's important for us to remember of all this is happening in our own brains and we're like pattern-seeking, we're trying to find stability in a pattern.
33:58 --> 33:59 [SPEAKER_05]: And when we
34:01 --> 34:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Don't have all the information we need, we just fill in missing data points to create a big picture.
34:06 --> 34:11 [SPEAKER_05]: And I feel like when we start talking about the keys of the song, that's going to really come into play here.
34:11 --> 34:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And also, in relation to my story about my husband and the song, when we're trying to find a cognitive pattern around a memory.
34:21 --> 34:27 [SPEAKER_05]: the misinterpretation of that memory often falls in our own insecurities.
34:27 --> 34:34 [SPEAKER_05]: So when I'm thinking of my husband listening to the song, it's reminding me of him and how much he loves me, obviously.
34:35 --> 34:39 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm thinking of my own insecurities, like who was he with before me?
34:39 --> 34:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Who does he actually love?
34:40 --> 34:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Who does he actually love?
34:40 --> 34:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Because it can't be me, because I don't have the same memory, right?
34:43 --> 34:44 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's
34:44 --> 34:53 [SPEAKER_05]: When we interpret information with missing pieces, we have to recognize that we have biases and we're often going to skew negative.
34:53 --> 34:58 [SPEAKER_05]: We're often going to skew towards the worst possible outcome or the worst possible solution.
34:58 --> 35:00 [SPEAKER_05]: And we're often going to catastrophize.
35:00 --> 35:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Remember when we were talking to Sadie?
35:02 --> 35:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
35:02 --> 35:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I come on through so ago when she was on as a guest.
35:06 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_00]: talking about how, I think it was her that mentioned.
35:09 --> 35:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe you brought it up that folks with Alzheimer's or dementia like expressive therapists will recommend like play a playlist like a little unlock, I hope your husband never suffers dementia or memory loss, but you play that playlist and effort comes on and then you'll find out who it's really about.
35:29 --> 35:31 [SPEAKER_05]: We met when he was 20 years old.
35:31 --> 35:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not a long list, right?
35:33 --> 35:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think.
35:33 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think.
35:34 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
35:34 --> 35:37 [SPEAKER_00]: The hot library and from the high school library.
35:37 --> 35:40 [SPEAKER_05]: For that, like, just went on safari and came back or something.
35:40 --> 35:42 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think that was the experience, but.
35:42 --> 35:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Hat, okay.
35:43 --> 35:44 [SPEAKER_00]: So are we talking about?
35:44 --> 35:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Memories that we're talking about pattern formation, what, or, or, I think memories in pattern formation are, are connected.
35:50 --> 35:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Our, our memory is so untrustworthy, our memory cannot be counted on.
35:56 --> 36:02 [SPEAKER_05]: And we have to rely on schemas that we've developed to fill in the holes of the patterns that our memories create.
36:03 --> 36:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Our memories are not reliable, because we're imparting all of our current day bias on that previous experience.
36:10 --> 36:11 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
36:11 --> 36:12 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's freaking cool.
36:13 --> 36:15 [SPEAKER_05]: It's really cool, but like not as missible and court.
36:16 --> 36:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
36:16 --> 36:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's a problem because it is admissible in court.
36:19 --> 36:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's so much anymore.
36:20 --> 36:23 [SPEAKER_05]: I wouldn't as testimony is just starting to be ignored more.
36:23 --> 36:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Very, very broadly thought of it's like not worth it.
36:27 --> 36:31 [SPEAKER_00]: The whole like crime scene sketch artist thing seems so baffling to me.
36:31 --> 36:32 [SPEAKER_00]: That's someone's like,
36:32 --> 36:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, they look like this and like oh yeah.
36:35 --> 36:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it looks just like there's no way But in a way I could I've seen your face how many times if I describe your face to somebody a good artist There's it just wouldn't look like you would be different.
36:43 --> 36:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I forget everything about like your color eyes It'd be like I don't know I guess brown, but that's just me rolling the dice And that's if I we asked you on a good day.
36:50 --> 36:51 [SPEAKER_05]: That's right.
36:51 --> 36:56 [SPEAKER_05]: What if we asked you after you just got punched and that's right You're supposed to be yeah, that's right crazy
36:56 --> 37:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So, okay, so let's take this whole idea of the unreliable memories.
37:01 --> 37:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you don't fully remember, thing, your brain might fill in what's logical that happens.
37:06 --> 37:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, and Nicole was there.
37:08 --> 37:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Of course, I've seen the podcast, but not even what's logical, but what, depending on you, you as a human, what is the scariest thing for you?
37:17 --> 37:41 [SPEAKER_05]: So not the most comfortable, not the most, for some people the most comforting, if you're like an adaptive human, but if you're like, not your memory might fill in the blank with messages from previous trauma you've had or messages from like the worst possible outcome in your own mind's eye, you might catastrophize your own memory and screw your own memory based on like how you are personality wise.
37:42 --> 37:45 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's to serve some kind of a defense.
37:45 --> 37:49 [SPEAKER_05]: That's just so, yeah, so it's to protect you because you remember being bad.
37:49 --> 37:51 [SPEAKER_05]: So you're like, I'm not going to try that again because it was bad for the last time.
37:51 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_05]: We're unreliable narrators of our story.
37:54 --> 37:58 [SPEAKER_00]: But it doesn't go the other way, too, if it's a good memory where you're amplified the good.
37:59 --> 37:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely.
37:59 --> 38:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Try to comfort or like convince yourself that it was good, right?
38:02 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, absolutely.
38:04 --> 38:12 [SPEAKER_05]: And you can implant memories and people, you can skew other people's memories very, very, very easily, especially with children or trauma survivors.
38:12 --> 38:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's going to be another song where we can come back.
38:14 --> 38:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and I don't know which one, but 100%.
38:16 --> 38:17 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not this song though.
38:18 --> 38:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's talk about this.
38:20 --> 38:35 [SPEAKER_00]: we know from at least the little bit that I was able to find that this is sort of just inspired from afar, like maybe they eventually went to Africa, but they had not been to Africa yet, and this is this fantasy of what it would be like to go there while you miss through your love.
38:35 --> 38:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, how does that all fit in?
38:36 --> 38:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Actually, no, I know the answer to the inspiration of the story.
38:40 --> 38:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, and then connected to all this stuff about memory to.
38:43 --> 38:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, because it is about like their past experience, like there's a lot of
38:48 --> 38:52 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not necessarily a literal narrative from what the research I did.
38:52 --> 39:07 [SPEAKER_05]: It's more a metaphor of like the vast stardom that they have or their history in Catholic school because there's a lot of like veiled Catholic school references in the lyrics or a lot of this is what they said.
39:07 --> 39:14 [SPEAKER_05]: This is what Toto says or they are inspired by like late night documentaries that they watched about Africa.
39:14 --> 39:15 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I had heard.
39:15 --> 39:16 [SPEAKER_00]: So bring it all to the
39:18 --> 39:28 [SPEAKER_05]: memory and ambiguity and unreliable narration that they've just like picked little parts of all of those previous experiences and woven them together to create this expression.
39:28 --> 39:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
39:30 --> 39:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Africa.
39:30 --> 39:31 [SPEAKER_05]: It doesn't make sense.
39:32 --> 39:32 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, it makes sense.
39:33 --> 39:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Aren't like songs always like that, though?
39:35 --> 39:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Like kind of like disjointed.
39:37 --> 39:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I think writers even of novels and stuff.
39:40 --> 39:42 [SPEAKER_00]: There's also might be a scene randomly in your fiction that's
39:47 --> 39:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I think the best songs do in the best novels do stuff like that leave ambiguity because then we attach our own point of view to it.
39:54 --> 39:58 [SPEAKER_05]: We fill in the blanks with our lived experience and it connects us to the content more.
39:59 --> 40:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Gimbing you do's good because it allows us space to put our own stuff into it so we connect to it.
40:04 --> 40:09 [SPEAKER_05]: For me, the only reason I like this song is because it reminds me of my husband.
40:09 --> 40:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And when it shouldn't, but because of that ambiguity piece, I put myself into the song.
40:14 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_05]: And when I hear it on the radio, I never change the station.
40:16 --> 40:17 [SPEAKER_05]: I always listen to it.
40:18 --> 40:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Because I know he would listen to it because he's thinking of me.
40:21 --> 40:44 [SPEAKER_05]: hopefully or or at such a thing see this is this is the only reason you like the song yeah you don't like the song ever like do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do do the like the rest that I play right but you don't like the chorus you don't like the sometimes you're the song I imagine like acoustic guitar someone getting dragged behind horses for some reason
40:44 --> 40:46 [SPEAKER_00]: She's just dragged behind a horse.
40:46 --> 40:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, like I always think of that.
40:47 --> 40:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I murdered.
40:48 --> 40:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, yeah, no, but like, not it isn't like the horses can't like pull me away from you or something.
40:54 --> 40:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Isn't that one of the lyrics or my conflating two songs?
40:56 --> 40:58 [SPEAKER_00]: This is a different song.
40:58 --> 41:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe, but I see that image in my head.
41:01 --> 41:02 [SPEAKER_05]: You can't take me away from you.
41:02 --> 41:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Like I imagine like my husband trying to be ripped from me.
41:04 --> 41:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, God, I take a lot to drag me away from you.
41:06 --> 41:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so I always think of horses dragging him away from her.
41:09 --> 41:11 [SPEAKER_00]: There's nothing that a hundred men or more could ever do.
41:12 --> 41:12 [SPEAKER_05]: And more.
41:13 --> 41:15 [SPEAKER_05]: I always think that and more is a bunch of horses.
41:16 --> 41:18 [SPEAKER_00]: All the king's horses and all the king's horses.
41:18 --> 41:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think a hundred men or more.
41:19 --> 41:23 [SPEAKER_05]: I think of like, there's men, but there's horses and they're like attaching ropes to my husband trying to pull him from me.
41:23 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_05]: And he's like, no, I won't.
41:24 --> 41:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Cause I love her and or someone before her.
41:27 --> 41:34 [SPEAKER_00]: The thing that, all in the lyrics that kind of is always hard to wrap my brain around as we have that set of lines.
41:34 --> 41:37 [SPEAKER_00]: And then I blushed the reins down in Africa.
41:37 --> 41:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Gonna take some time to do the things we never had.
41:40 --> 41:41 [SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't.
41:41 --> 41:42 [SPEAKER_00]: What?
41:42 --> 41:43 [SPEAKER_00]: What are they talking about?
41:43 --> 41:44 [SPEAKER_00]: So, okay, is there much, do we?
41:45 --> 41:47 [SPEAKER_00]: where do we find this song?
41:48 --> 41:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Should we just leave it?
41:48 --> 41:56 [SPEAKER_00]: We are, are we not two people equipped to adjudicate whether this song is weirdly culturally insensitive?
41:57 --> 42:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Do we just kind of like leave it and let someone who isn't us adjudicate that?
42:00 --> 42:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like
42:02 --> 42:04 [SPEAKER_05]: where no, that's not what this podcast is about.
42:04 --> 42:10 [SPEAKER_05]: If we're going to do that, we have to go back and attend them a lot of our podcasts of like what was culturally insensitive or not.
42:10 --> 42:12 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just there's something about.
42:12 --> 42:14 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the video for me.
42:14 --> 42:15 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the music video.
42:15 --> 42:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Video doesn't help because I just don't think they're.
42:19 --> 42:27 [SPEAKER_00]: They're certainly not trying to do anything weird, but it's that innocent quote, innocent, not trying that makes that is also damning.
42:27 --> 42:31 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, what you absolutely just kind of like trivialized a whole continent, right?
42:31 --> 42:35 [SPEAKER_05]: If you're viewing it today as a microaggression, but in 1992,
42:37 --> 42:39 [SPEAKER_05]: We have to look at art in the time in place that was created.
42:39 --> 42:41 [SPEAKER_05]: We just have to, I stand by that.
42:41 --> 42:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Like we have to.
42:41 --> 42:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you and I aren't totally on the same page on that, but I think you have to look at it both from the time at which it was created and in your current time.
42:50 --> 42:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I think both of those lenses are valuable usually.
42:53 --> 42:55 [SPEAKER_05]: I bet you have total looked at the song in the video now.
42:55 --> 42:56 [SPEAKER_05]: They'd probably be like, oh,
42:56 --> 43:00 [SPEAKER_00]: If they were doing a remake, they probably wouldn't do it the same, you know?
43:00 --> 43:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's, I think that that's the moment like there's some artists that they would stand by and even present day having lived experience to inform that perspective.
43:09 --> 43:11 [SPEAKER_05]: And I think we need to give grace to those people, I do.
43:12 --> 43:20 [SPEAKER_00]: There is sort of an exoticization that was in Denmark in most of the 20th century, certainly, of these kind of like.
43:20 --> 43:21 [SPEAKER_05]: African countries.
43:21 --> 43:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, especially of African countries, but not just, I mean, I think just in that era, there's all the famine in Ethiopia.
43:27 --> 43:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And so we were always hearing of like, oh, you know, there's starving kids in Africa or in China or even.
43:36 --> 43:55 [SPEAKER_05]: like other countries that not like you say starving kids in Japan you're like Japan you mean the like highly developed megalopolis I mean people like the song so much because it like in their eyes at that moment made countries in Africa seem more romantic that is weird yeah last like family.
43:55 --> 44:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, now obviously they're talking about Kilimanjaro and Kilimanjaro is nowhere near like Ethiopia, right?
44:02 --> 44:04 [SPEAKER_05]: But are they referencing Ethiopia specifically?
44:04 --> 44:05 [SPEAKER_05]: No, I don't think so.
44:05 --> 44:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just mid-80s.
44:06 --> 44:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, think back to like- It goes pretty big.
44:08 --> 44:09 [SPEAKER_05]: The farming world.
44:09 --> 44:10 [SPEAKER_05]: As a continent.
44:10 --> 44:11 [SPEAKER_00]: It's top seven.
44:11 --> 44:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Definitely in the top seven.
44:14 --> 44:14 [SPEAKER_00]: So I don't know.
44:14 --> 44:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Any other stuff we should talk about this or should I get to the music piece?
44:17 --> 44:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I feel like we might get...
44:20 --> 44:28 [SPEAKER_00]: heart way through talking about the the chords and stuff and there might be some other click or we're like, yeah, oh yeah, a million percent.
44:28 --> 44:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's do it.
44:28 --> 44:36 [SPEAKER_00]: You took this angle from a very psychology of a human being offering a contextual lens on the song, which is interesting, right?
44:36 --> 44:37 [SPEAKER_05]: But I'm here for.
44:37 --> 44:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
44:37 --> 44:41 [SPEAKER_00]: No, as opposed to like this is an effect that applies to everybody with this song.
44:41 --> 44:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very much your and your husband's worry, which is interesting.
44:45 --> 44:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Psychology is the study view in your mind.
44:47 --> 44:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Sociology is the study of all of our minds together.
44:50 --> 44:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
44:50 --> 44:51 [SPEAKER_00]: And screw sociology.
44:52 --> 44:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Actually, sociology is pretty cool.
44:53 --> 44:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just more controversial to teach.
44:55 --> 44:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, really?
44:56 --> 44:56 [SPEAKER_05]: I think so.
44:57 --> 44:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
44:57 --> 44:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Because I'm for sure.
44:58 --> 44:59 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I was the police.
44:59 --> 45:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I made just so should have been the one that I would have been.
45:01 --> 45:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was.
45:02 --> 45:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Psychologies.
45:03 --> 45:08 [SPEAKER_05]: I like teaching it better because it is really just about the individual and their lived experience and sociology.
45:08 --> 45:20 [SPEAKER_05]: You have to talk about group bias and how we are all like, you know, we have to talk about current events and like a very, right, and can't ignore the call way and it gets really hard in a college classroom sometimes.
45:41 --> 45:46 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, so can we think back to the investigations in this podcast history?
45:46 --> 45:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Not only does Mark maybe enjoy some ambiguity, Mark likes inflicting ambiguity on other people and seeing if they can solve the ambiguity.
45:54 --> 45:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So we got baby, baby, baby, right?
45:56 --> 45:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Where?
45:56 --> 45:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Key is this in, oh, is this in B minor or A major?
45:59 --> 45:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Whatever it was.
46:00 --> 46:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Kiss from a rose.
46:02 --> 46:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this in major or minor?
46:04 --> 46:04 [SPEAKER_05]: It was minor, right?
46:04 --> 46:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Do you know what it would determine?
46:06 --> 46:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Sort of.
46:07 --> 46:08 [SPEAKER_05]: It was weed in the middle.
46:08 --> 46:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And do you know what it was when we said all that baby, baby, baby.
46:12 --> 46:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that was in the key of A, but it doesn't matter.
46:15 --> 46:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, it doesn't matter.
46:16 --> 46:17 [SPEAKER_00]: The journey is what matter.
46:17 --> 46:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's true.
46:18 --> 46:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So here we have a similar question of what key is this in.
46:22 --> 46:26 [SPEAKER_00]: But specifically, what key is this cool or riff in?
46:26 --> 46:28 [SPEAKER_00]: It's totally ambiguous.
46:29 --> 46:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And it really, I would say, aids in page and per carls songwriting.
46:33 --> 46:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it gives them this little hook that I'll play it again.
46:36 --> 46:37 [SPEAKER_00]: We already played it.
46:38 --> 46:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Gives us a reference point.
46:39 --> 46:43 [SPEAKER_00]: We constantly get even though the key of the song in general keeps shifting around.
46:44 --> 46:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So here's the cool riff once again.
46:58 --> 47:01 [SPEAKER_00]: And there's the marimba played by Joe, the parcaro brothers.
47:02 --> 47:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's how you are, air marimba.
47:03 --> 47:04 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a marimba.
47:04 --> 47:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, how could you not?
47:06 --> 47:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's pretty good.
47:07 --> 47:10 [SPEAKER_00]: But also, everybody loves this sinthrift.
47:10 --> 47:14 [SPEAKER_00]: David Page is kind of fake horns, brown, brown, brown, brown, brown, brown, brown, brown, brown, brown.
47:14 --> 47:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Sounds very cool.
47:15 --> 47:16 [SPEAKER_00]: But I do want to shout out the guitar.
47:17 --> 47:28 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Timothy B. Schmitt, the bass player of the Eagles, for some reason, playing what might be like a 12 string guitar or something like that in the background that I don't think it would be notices, but it's so cool.
47:28 --> 47:31 [SPEAKER_00]: 12 string guitars are the coolest.
47:31 --> 47:36 [UNKNOWN]: Can you play a 12 string?
47:43 --> 47:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Now well, that's hard, and it takes so long to tune.
47:49 --> 47:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Sometimes when you see a live band they bring out the 12th string and then you like get to watch the vocalist's vamp for like ten minutes Well, they're like tunes enough.
47:56 --> 47:57 [SPEAKER_00]: They're fun though.
47:57 --> 48:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I've only ever played in acoustic one meaning for I've never really played the electric's very long But they're cool.
48:02 --> 48:16 [SPEAKER_00]: So what the heck key is this in right we have this riff once again and then we're gonna explore a few options So we've got in a chord a G sharp minor chord and a C sharp minor chord in that order
48:22 --> 48:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So, maybe it's in A, which is the first chord, Bum, Bum, Bum, Bum.
48:27 --> 48:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's the riff again.
48:28 --> 48:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm playing this one, except we're imagining it's A. I'm gonna start by sort of establishing the key of A, and then play the riff.
48:44 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Sounds pretty good.
48:45 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_00]: That sounds right.
48:46 --> 48:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty good, but there's one chord wrong.
48:47 --> 48:51 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like feels not quite, or feels too like clean or something like that.
48:51 --> 48:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.
48:52 --> 48:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And keep in mind when I say wrong.
48:54 --> 48:55 [SPEAKER_05]: It's wrong.
48:55 --> 48:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's awesome.
48:56 --> 48:58 [SPEAKER_00]: But there's one chord that doesn't fit that key.
48:58 --> 49:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And plenty of songs have chords out of key, but that G sharp minor should be a G sharp diminished.
49:03 --> 49:03 [SPEAKER_00]: This is what?
49:03 --> 49:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Is that what I heard?
49:04 --> 49:06 [SPEAKER_00]: No, you heard G sharp minor.
49:06 --> 49:09 [SPEAKER_05]: No, but like in when I said it didn't sound clean, it didn't sound right.
49:09 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think this is what it would sound like, let's see.
49:12 --> 49:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
49:12 --> 49:17 [SPEAKER_00]: This is what it would sound like if I played it actually how it would be if you kept it to the key of A.
49:19 --> 49:20 [SPEAKER_00]: That's A major.
49:24 --> 49:24 [SPEAKER_05]: No.
49:24 --> 49:25 [SPEAKER_05]: No.
49:26 --> 49:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Didn't work.
49:26 --> 49:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Is that it?
49:27 --> 49:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Kind of weird, right?
49:28 --> 49:30 [SPEAKER_00]: That G sharp diminished is not sound good.
49:30 --> 49:31 [SPEAKER_05]: No, it's like it fell on its face.
49:31 --> 49:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So that means maybe it's the key of A, but maybe maybe that's not great.
49:35 --> 49:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, maybe it's the second chord.
49:36 --> 49:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe G sharp minor is the key.
49:39 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is what that would sound like in that key.
49:52 --> 49:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Hmm.
49:54 --> 49:55 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not right enough.
49:56 --> 49:57 [SPEAKER_00]: It sounds a little like it.
49:57 --> 50:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It sounds cool that A is a flat too.
50:00 --> 50:03 [SPEAKER_05]: It sounds like I'm at a funeral like I'm in charge of a funeral.
50:03 --> 50:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So if we kept to G sharp minor like earnestly and honestly, that first chord needs to be a sharp diminished.
50:10 --> 50:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think you're going to like it, spoiler.
50:22 --> 50:24 [SPEAKER_05]: Now it sounds like evil chair evil.
50:24 --> 50:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
50:25 --> 50:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So those keys could be correct.
50:28 --> 50:30 [SPEAKER_00]: But if they are, there's a chord that doesn't work.
50:31 --> 50:35 [SPEAKER_00]: That's been changed to make the riff we have, which is a better sounding riff, right?
50:35 --> 50:36 [SPEAKER_00]: A couple more options here.
50:37 --> 50:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe the third chord C sharp minor.
50:38 --> 50:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe that's our key.
50:40 --> 50:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's see what this sounds like.
50:52 --> 50:53 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the closest out of all of them.
50:53 --> 50:54 [SPEAKER_00]: It is.
50:54 --> 50:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's pretty close, isn't it?
50:56 --> 50:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe there's one core that kind of needs to be a little different.
51:00 --> 51:00 [SPEAKER_05]: A little different?
51:00 --> 51:02 [SPEAKER_05]: A little tweaked, like it needs to be a little sharper.
51:02 --> 51:04 [SPEAKER_00]: There's one note that should be a little sharper.
51:04 --> 51:07 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're in C sharp minor, you might see G sharp major more often.
51:07 --> 51:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
51:08 --> 51:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's see what that would sound like.
51:17 --> 51:18 [SPEAKER_05]: That's not it.
51:18 --> 51:18 [SPEAKER_05]: That's not it.
51:18 --> 51:19 [SPEAKER_00]: It's still the closest one.
51:20 --> 51:20 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
51:21 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it's, I don't know.
51:23 --> 51:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Do I even want to do one more?
51:24 --> 51:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, do one more.
51:25 --> 51:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I like this.
51:26 --> 51:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Because C-sharp minor is our closest.
51:29 --> 51:33 [SPEAKER_00]: But E major is the relative key of C-sharp, which means they have the same notes.
51:33 --> 51:38 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's just see for shits and giggles what it sounds like with E, which we haven't even heard in E chord.
51:49 --> 51:55 [SPEAKER_05]: It's pretty close and Mark, I'm not even joking when you first played the song and you're like, what key is it in?
51:55 --> 51:57 [SPEAKER_05]: In my head, I was like, it's an imageer.
51:57 --> 51:58 [SPEAKER_00]: It's an imageer, okay?
51:59 --> 52:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And I don't know where I like, I don't have skill set or knowledge for that way.
52:03 --> 52:08 [SPEAKER_00]: When you heard the clanging Timothy Spishmit guitar part, that was a lot of open strings on the guitar.
52:08 --> 52:09 [SPEAKER_00]: So maybe you heard it.
52:10 --> 52:11 [SPEAKER_00]: But I was like, that was an imageer.
52:11 --> 52:12 [SPEAKER_05]: I was like, this is an imageer.
52:12 --> 52:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So that one fits because all three of the chords are very common and totally fine, but we don't have any e-cords.
52:20 --> 52:21 [SPEAKER_00]: It's ambiguous, but here's the thing.
52:22 --> 52:29 [SPEAKER_00]: When I have, like, if my music theory class, for example, are doing an analysis, and they're looking at the page, oh, what's that chord mean?
52:30 --> 52:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Who knows, what's the context?
52:32 --> 52:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
52:33 --> 52:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So what we really need to do is here where this actually goes.
52:36 --> 52:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm going to play that riff.
52:37 --> 52:38 [SPEAKER_00]: This is how the song opens.
52:38 --> 52:42 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a few bars of the drums and other percussion.
52:42 --> 52:44 [SPEAKER_00]: And then we get the riff and then it goes into a verse.
52:44 --> 52:47 [SPEAKER_00]: So which of those keys do we land on?
52:47 --> 52:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Because that kind of answers it.
52:48 --> 52:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Because they're all like except for E is the closest, but E doesn't even exist as the chord.
52:54 --> 52:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's like does the verse then go to E. Does the verse go to E?
52:56 --> 52:57 [SPEAKER_00]: That kind of might answer.
52:57 --> 52:58 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's see.
53:04 --> 53:09 [SPEAKER_03]: I hear the gums that go into night and she has all new- Hmm.
53:09 --> 53:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Be major.
53:10 --> 53:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.
53:11 --> 53:12 [SPEAKER_00]: None of the ones that we talked about.
53:12 --> 53:13 [SPEAKER_05]: What?
53:13 --> 53:14 [SPEAKER_00]: None of the ones at all expressed.
53:15 --> 53:16 [SPEAKER_00]: But it sounded good, didn't it?
53:16 --> 53:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Listen again.
53:17 --> 53:17 [SPEAKER_05]: So good.
53:29 --> 53:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's so soothing for some reason and health and voice is just so chill.
53:33 --> 53:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Belly.
53:33 --> 53:36 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's not one of the keys we talked about at all.
53:36 --> 53:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Remember the idea of PivotCords when we talked about that.
53:39 --> 53:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Speak.
53:39 --> 53:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
53:41 --> 53:42 [SPEAKER_05]: So it learned that from you.
53:42 --> 53:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems like, awesome.
53:44 --> 53:46 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems like we might have a pivot cord here.
53:46 --> 53:55 [SPEAKER_00]: That C sharp minor, which maybe is in the key of C sharp, maybe in the key of A, maybe in the key of E. It certainly wasn't in the key of B at that time, at least didn't sound like it.
53:56 --> 53:58 [SPEAKER_00]: That cord is two in the key of B.
53:58 --> 54:04 [SPEAKER_00]: So we have a pivot cord, somehow making that transition sound kind of cool.
54:04 --> 54:11 [SPEAKER_00]: We have a riff, maybe it's in C sharp EA, something like that, but we end up in B by doing a pivot chord.
54:11 --> 54:12 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's fine.
54:12 --> 54:15 [SPEAKER_00]: We're not talking about pivot chords today, but it happened deal with it.
54:16 --> 54:20 [SPEAKER_00]: So then we get, we get a verse, we get a verse, we're in B major, let's go on.
54:33 --> 54:49 [SPEAKER_03]: She's coming in in 12 that it finds the moonlit wings Reflected the stars that guide between self-dation As long as so weird, I year listening to the notes and I'm listening to the lyrics.
54:49 --> 54:54 [SPEAKER_00]: We're just like fuzzy talking about the weird thing for the listeners that are listening to the chorus.
54:54 --> 54:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, they're paying attention.
54:57 --> 54:59 [SPEAKER_00]: No, you're paying attention, just two other things.
54:59 --> 55:00 [SPEAKER_05]: I'll do the things.
55:01 --> 55:03 [SPEAKER_00]: You're talking to your your passing notes in class, but it's fine.
55:03 --> 55:05 [SPEAKER_00]: You are engaging in the class.
55:05 --> 55:07 [SPEAKER_00]: He's just not in the trigonometry lecture.
55:07 --> 55:09 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a common theme for me.
55:09 --> 55:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're in B major.
55:11 --> 55:12 [SPEAKER_00]: What happens in the middle of this?
55:12 --> 55:13 [SPEAKER_00]: What happens 10 seconds into this first?
55:26 --> 55:31 [SPEAKER_00]: What just happened we pivoted we can bump bump bump bump bump bump but where are we now?
55:33 --> 55:34 [SPEAKER_00]: We're still in B, we haven't changed key.
55:35 --> 55:35 [SPEAKER_05]: It works.
55:36 --> 55:39 [SPEAKER_00]: That chord progression bump, bump, bump, bump, bump, bump.
55:39 --> 55:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Which was very much not in B major.
55:41 --> 55:42 [SPEAKER_00]: We changed to B major.
55:42 --> 55:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It happens again in B major.
55:45 --> 55:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Same chords, no changes.
55:46 --> 55:50 [SPEAKER_00]: That chord progression at riff now means something totally different harmonically.
55:50 --> 55:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
55:51 --> 55:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Now the A chord is flat seven in the key.
55:54 --> 55:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Flat seven six two.
55:56 --> 55:59 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just a different kind of chord progression.
55:59 --> 56:01 [SPEAKER_00]: But it is not a key change.
56:02 --> 56:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just completely re-contactualized within our new key.
56:06 --> 56:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And I love that you always say that cords don't just stand a lot like a cord has to live in a key.
56:14 --> 56:17 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's how you name the cord based on what key it's living in.
56:17 --> 56:19 [SPEAKER_05]: used as a good example of that.
56:19 --> 56:23 [SPEAKER_00]: You might be able to give it a name, but you can't understand what it's doing, what it's function.
56:23 --> 56:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Great.
56:24 --> 56:25 [SPEAKER_00]: What if I said the word red?
56:26 --> 56:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Without a sentence, you have no idea if I mean READ, I read, or the color red, or whatever, right?
56:33 --> 56:34 [SPEAKER_00]: You're talking with hominims.
56:35 --> 56:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Courts are hominims.
56:36 --> 56:37 [SPEAKER_00]: They can be, right?
56:37 --> 56:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
56:37 --> 56:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Is that a hominim or a homophone?
56:40 --> 56:40 [SPEAKER_05]: work.
56:40 --> 56:40 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
56:40 --> 56:41 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
56:41 --> 56:41 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
56:41 --> 56:43 [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's a homophobic style in the same fun.
56:43 --> 56:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's see.
56:44 --> 56:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to go back to the piano.
56:45 --> 56:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to play you the key of B major and then our riff again.
56:48 --> 56:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
57:01 --> 57:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And so that first chord is not in the key, you could tell that had kind of a different sound.
57:06 --> 57:08 [SPEAKER_00]: This is not the only time this happens in this song.
57:08 --> 57:10 [SPEAKER_00]: This riff, it does whatever you need it to be.
57:11 --> 57:13 [SPEAKER_00]: The beginning of the song is the one point when it is completely ambiguous.
57:14 --> 57:16 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know what key it's in because it is its own context.
57:16 --> 57:23 [SPEAKER_00]: It is me saying the word red, but in the verse, the riff makes sense in B major, even though it's sort of out of key.
57:23 --> 57:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But later in the song, we will hear it again and it will be whatever we need it to be in that moment.
57:29 --> 57:35 [SPEAKER_00]: but let's just listen real quick to the chords in the verse so you can kind of track how this is set up.
57:36 --> 57:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So let me just play through the chords in the verse and you're going to see that a chord which is sort of the darting point of our riff actually happens earlier in the phrase sort of setting this up making it feel natural.
57:50 --> 57:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Right here.
58:00 --> 58:07 [SPEAKER_00]: So, to the extent that this riff doesn't make sense in the key of B, the core progression in key kind of tells us that it's okay.
58:07 --> 58:11 [SPEAKER_00]: It tells us that the weird chord is just flat seven in the key, which isn't that weird.
58:12 --> 58:15 [SPEAKER_00]: But we've heard it already once before the riff comes back.
58:15 --> 58:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And so, we're very much grounded in this all making sense.
58:19 --> 58:19 [SPEAKER_00]: you with me.
58:19 --> 58:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's like we heard it before so now when we're trying to fill in any gaps that our ears are minder creating we can like pull it from our previous experience and plug it into what we're hearing now.
58:29 --> 58:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Totally.
58:30 --> 58:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, good.
58:31 --> 58:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Now we're going to lead to the chorus and this is a part of the song that is really fun to sing along.
58:35 --> 58:38 [SPEAKER_00]: So I would like you to sing along with it with me.
58:38 --> 58:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you want the high part or the low harmony?
58:40 --> 58:40 [SPEAKER_03]: The high part.
58:40 --> 58:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
58:57 --> 59:00 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's when my husband looks at me with tears in his eye.
59:00 --> 59:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
59:01 --> 59:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, and the horses are dragging him away from me.
59:04 --> 59:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
59:04 --> 59:06 [SPEAKER_05]: And like, what are you talking about?
59:06 --> 59:08 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's what I'm trying and failing to sing it.
59:09 --> 59:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm not, I'm not impressing anybody with my love when I'm on this.
59:13 --> 59:14 [SPEAKER_05]: No, they're like, huh.
59:14 --> 59:16 [SPEAKER_00]: But the hairy boy, it's waiting there for you.
59:16 --> 59:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Later, hairy boy, she's waiting there for you.
59:19 --> 59:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, that's me.
59:20 --> 59:21 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm her.
59:21 --> 59:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
59:22 --> 59:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Who's the boy?
59:23 --> 59:25 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're hudging it.
59:25 --> 59:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Singing it.
59:26 --> 59:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, hang on.
59:26 --> 59:28 [SPEAKER_05]: No, they're singing it to him.
59:29 --> 59:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes, they're there they oh, but that's the first is like he's narrating it right the wild dogs cry out in the night and then he said himself Harry boy She's waiting there for you.
59:40 --> 59:40 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
59:40 --> 59:48 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the old man turns to me as if to say that's right future him the old man that he walks by Who wow is it future him?
59:48 --> 59:52 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like looking back and they like she's the one No, I think there's literally a guy
59:58 --> 59:59 [SPEAKER_05]: and I really get what they're saying.
59:59 --> 01:00:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Timmy, why me?
01:00:00 --> 01:00:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, like, what is that from?
01:00:01 --> 01:00:03 [SPEAKER_05]: I know what that time is like.
01:00:03 --> 01:00:04 [SPEAKER_00]: It just means, yeah.
01:00:04 --> 01:00:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It just means like confusing timelines and stuff and this stuff.
01:00:06 --> 01:00:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Like just ignore it because it's cute for the plot.
01:00:10 --> 01:00:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I associate Timmy, why me, and I's with some things really complicated, actually.
01:00:14 --> 01:00:15 [SPEAKER_05]: And like we're just not going to explain it.
01:00:15 --> 01:00:17 [SPEAKER_00]: It's supposed to try to figure it out.
01:00:17 --> 01:00:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that may be the song.
01:00:18 --> 01:00:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe you told it by Africa.
01:00:19 --> 01:00:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Hypothesis is just so Timmy, why me?
01:00:21 --> 01:00:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So here's the thing though.
01:00:23 --> 01:00:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Where do we end up?
01:00:24 --> 01:00:25 [SPEAKER_00]: We sang over it.
01:00:25 --> 01:00:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Where do we end up?
01:00:28 --> 01:00:30 [SPEAKER_03]: Here's the rib.
01:00:30 --> 01:00:33 [SPEAKER_03]: Here's the rib.
01:00:34 --> 01:00:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:00:34 --> 01:00:35 [SPEAKER_00]: See you, Sharminer.
01:00:35 --> 01:00:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And... Gonna make the love the day they were in for you.
01:00:41 --> 01:00:41 [SPEAKER_00]: It goes up.
01:00:42 --> 01:00:42 [SPEAKER_00]: We're in the key of A.
01:00:43 --> 01:00:43 [SPEAKER_05]: What?
01:00:44 --> 01:00:44 [SPEAKER_00]: We were all the whole time.
01:00:45 --> 01:00:46 [SPEAKER_00]: A, well, we're a real time.
01:00:46 --> 01:00:48 [SPEAKER_00]: We were pretty much in B, right?
01:00:48 --> 01:00:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:00:48 --> 01:00:50 [SPEAKER_00]: A was one of the candidates the first time around.
01:00:50 --> 01:00:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:00:51 --> 01:01:00 [SPEAKER_00]: So we, when we get the hurry boy line, we have a pivot chord modulation, just like we talked about with no doubt, getting us back to the key of A, right?
01:01:00 --> 01:01:05 [SPEAKER_00]: So this part of the song weirdly like Sheds some of the yott rocking us.
01:01:05 --> 01:01:08 [SPEAKER_00]: and it's very much like a modern pop song progression.
01:01:09 --> 01:01:14 [SPEAKER_00]: 6415, like this is not complicated and jazzy, like a lot of other stuff total does.
01:01:39 --> 01:01:42 [SPEAKER_05]: They're vocal harmonies are awesome.
01:01:42 --> 01:01:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Rosanna's like that, hold the line.
01:01:44 --> 01:01:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Their hits all have really awesome vocals.
01:01:46 --> 01:01:50 [SPEAKER_00]: So where do we end when we end on that, that ooh, that Bobby does?
01:01:51 --> 01:01:51 [SPEAKER_00]: What's here, we end?
01:01:52 --> 01:01:57 [SPEAKER_00]: They really tell us this ends, not at all, and big U.S. in terms of the key.
01:02:11 --> 01:02:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Bum, Bum, that's A.
01:02:15 --> 01:02:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're like, hey, we're in A, but what's gonna happen?
01:02:19 --> 01:02:32 [SPEAKER_00]: A, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B
01:02:38 --> 01:02:40 [SPEAKER_00]: A for Africa, that's right.
01:02:40 --> 01:02:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, not ambiguous at all, we're idiots.
01:02:42 --> 01:02:44 [SPEAKER_00]: A for ambiguity.
01:02:45 --> 01:02:49 [SPEAKER_00]: The only metaphor when we talked about pivot chords that worked was the building with a passageway, right?
01:02:49 --> 01:02:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's kind of, this kind of works here too, because it's not that this is a pivot chord.
01:02:55 --> 01:02:58 [SPEAKER_00]: It's that this entire section can be in whichever key we want.
01:03:04 --> 01:03:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Hands us to the key of B like we did in the first first, but but the first time we heard the riff We weren't really sure maybe what keyword and now we work because we just had the whole chorus that really land Solively so Is it good or bad that we put these episodes sort of back to back?
01:03:20 --> 01:03:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's good.
01:03:21 --> 01:03:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know cuz like I'm like Love a key normally.
01:03:23 --> 01:03:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I try you what I like keys.
01:03:25 --> 01:03:26 [SPEAKER_00]: You like keys good.
01:03:26 --> 01:03:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I like boards and keys and how they all fit together The puzzle of it for me
01:03:31 --> 01:03:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Normally, I like go like melody episode.
01:03:33 --> 01:03:34 [SPEAKER_00]: We've been episodes.
01:03:34 --> 01:03:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:03:35 --> 01:03:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So, and I kind of.
01:03:36 --> 01:03:36 [SPEAKER_00]: modules.
01:03:37 --> 01:03:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Somehow we're in the unit.
01:03:39 --> 01:03:41 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got a unit test at the end of the week.
01:03:41 --> 01:03:41 [SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be awesome.
01:03:42 --> 01:03:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody's study.
01:03:43 --> 01:03:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So, all right.
01:03:44 --> 01:03:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So, almost wrapped up here.
01:03:50 --> 01:04:15 [SPEAKER_00]: So imagine this riff exists equally in the key of A and in the key of B, but we set up at the beginning when I played the different piano versions, it also sounds pretty good in the key of C sharp, key of E. They have chosen to have us go back to the B major section, but you could very easily imagine we go to a bridge in the key of E, or a bridge in the key of C sharp or something kind of anything works.
01:04:16 --> 01:04:17 [SPEAKER_00]: in retrospect, it all sounds normal.
01:04:17 --> 01:04:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And in the moment it would sound normal.
01:04:19 --> 01:04:21 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just they've chosen which ones.
01:04:21 --> 01:04:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And so this whole section is really that whole riff, the magic of it aside from the cool synth sound in the marimbas and the 12 string acoustic guitar, all those things sonically sound good.
01:04:33 --> 01:04:39 [SPEAKER_00]: But the genius of it as a kind of punctuation almost is that it can bring you anywhere you want.
01:04:39 --> 01:04:39 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
01:04:39 --> 01:04:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I may only go to two different spots.
01:04:41 --> 01:04:42 [SPEAKER_00]: So maybe they're not
01:04:43 --> 01:04:44 [SPEAKER_00]: They're not going far enough.
01:04:44 --> 01:04:46 [SPEAKER_00]: They wanted this to be a popular song probably.
01:04:46 --> 01:04:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, they don't want to fall into the uncanny valley.
01:04:49 --> 01:04:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, interesting.
01:04:50 --> 01:04:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Where it's Where it's to my fly.
01:04:52 --> 01:04:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it would be to do it.
01:04:54 --> 01:04:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
01:04:54 --> 01:04:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I think maybe this isn't like kiss from a rose or baby baby baby baby
01:05:00 --> 01:05:04 [SPEAKER_00]: where the key itself is in question, we always know what key we're in.
01:05:04 --> 01:05:10 [SPEAKER_00]: It's that the meaning of the chords and the fact that this chord progression can be redefined in any key.
01:05:11 --> 01:05:21 [SPEAKER_00]: In the same way that some of the words we were playing with earlier like, you know, is the word red, a verb or a noun, is it like it's whatever, the context will give that meaning.
01:05:21 --> 01:05:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's not true with most songs and not true with most chords or progressions.
01:05:25 --> 01:05:41 [SPEAKER_05]: And like many examples I always ponder like did they intend to do that or did it just happen because they have good years and it made sense Sonically I feel like for them there they seem like very smart songwriters and musicians that like it was done with intention
01:05:42 --> 01:05:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be, I mean, these are like, jazz and classically true.
01:05:45 --> 01:05:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's not that that gives them an authority, but it's like, they're already overthinking things.
01:05:50 --> 01:05:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, they like understand this more than you do.
01:05:52 --> 01:05:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Correct.
01:05:53 --> 01:05:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
01:05:53 --> 01:05:56 [SPEAKER_05]: And then the baby, baby, baby, you might understand it.
01:05:56 --> 01:05:57 [SPEAKER_05]: It's honestly more than.
01:05:58 --> 01:06:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Do we remember, yeah, it was baby face like baby I don't know I didn't I'm pretty sure we asserted that baby face probably understands music theory better.
01:06:06 --> 01:06:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, okay, that's true.
01:06:07 --> 01:06:14 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll have to get him on like, so these aren't like, oh, when we did blondie and I'm like, oh, it's monophane during that we're like, they're not like thinking about it.
01:06:14 --> 01:06:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably that way.
01:06:16 --> 01:06:19 [SPEAKER_00]: These guys are probably baby face probably was too.
01:06:19 --> 01:06:21 [SPEAKER_00]: The baby face wasn't the artist, right?
01:06:21 --> 01:06:24 [SPEAKER_00]: He was the professional songwriter they were working with.
01:06:24 --> 01:06:24 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
01:06:24 --> 01:06:24 [SPEAKER_00]: You know,
01:06:25 --> 01:06:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, that's all I got on total, but this happens in some other songs, so let's hear it.
01:06:30 --> 01:06:33 [SPEAKER_00]: A few other songs where, what am I looking for?
01:06:33 --> 01:06:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not talking about pivot chord modulations or anything.
01:06:35 --> 01:06:44 [SPEAKER_00]: What we're talking about is a chord or a passage that is ambiguous in what it means and then gets reinterpreted elsewhere in the song.
01:06:44 --> 01:06:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is a song.
01:06:46 --> 01:06:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I've played randomly just as an example of a BG song.
01:06:49 --> 01:06:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I like
01:06:55 --> 01:06:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to bring your attention to this beautiful C major 7 chord we have at the beginning.
01:06:59 --> 01:07:01 [SPEAKER_00]: But it ends up going to E major.
01:07:01 --> 01:07:06 [SPEAKER_00]: So this C is like a flat 6 chord is what it means in the key.
01:07:06 --> 01:07:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Take a listen.
01:07:08 --> 01:07:09 [SPEAKER_00]: This chord.
01:07:26 --> 01:07:29 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that would be a great karaoke song for you.
01:07:29 --> 01:07:30 [SPEAKER_00]: The high fall set, though.
01:07:30 --> 01:07:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because I think you're taking yourself to, you're trying to prove something at karaoke, and you just need to surrender that.
01:07:35 --> 01:07:41 [SPEAKER_05]: And just, just, just, just like being in, and just like be silly, and just let your natural talent shine through the silliest.
01:07:42 --> 01:07:43 [SPEAKER_05]: So, you're trying too hard.
01:07:43 --> 01:07:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that chord, that's the problem.
01:07:45 --> 01:07:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Hold that chord in your head because we're going to get it again.
01:07:47 --> 01:07:50 [SPEAKER_00]: The pre-chorus of the song is in D major.
01:07:50 --> 01:08:00 [SPEAKER_00]: but it ends with that C major seven again, which is a different total meaning in this key, which is the flat seven chord.
01:08:00 --> 01:08:04 [SPEAKER_04]: Ready for a new mission now, I think of a guy right here.
01:08:26 --> 01:08:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And it actually ended up in G. So that C major seven was flat six of E goes to the key of D where it's flat seven, which then leads to the key of G, where it's four.
01:08:35 --> 01:08:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So it ends on kind of the simplest analysis, but yeah, that song would be fun.
01:08:40 --> 01:08:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't sound good, and that's freeing, right?
01:08:42 --> 01:08:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's what it is.
01:08:43 --> 01:08:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I think you're like so concerned about me wicked.
01:08:46 --> 01:08:48 [SPEAKER_05]: It's great, and it would be like entertaining.
01:08:48 --> 01:08:52 [SPEAKER_05]: It's hard to watch people sing karaoke when they're like trying to prove something.
01:08:52 --> 01:08:53 [SPEAKER_05]: You don't need to prove anything.
01:08:53 --> 01:08:54 [SPEAKER_05]: You just want to have fun.
01:08:54 --> 01:08:57 [SPEAKER_05]: And like this song would allow you to like get out of your head and have fun.
01:08:57 --> 01:09:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And just be a little more see-minus than I normally allow.
01:09:00 --> 01:09:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Right, because it's karaoke.
01:09:02 --> 01:09:02 [SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
01:09:03 --> 01:09:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:09:03 --> 01:09:24 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, so the point of it, this is one of my favorite Beatles songs, maybe it's come up before something 1969, the riff we hear is in the key of C, the chords go F E flat G, landing on C, and so it's this weird riff that has one weird chord iconic little moment and for this to be the beginning of the song is kind of odd.
01:09:37 --> 01:09:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But then later in the song, we get it again, but this time it goes to a completely different place.
01:09:42 --> 01:09:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It goes to an A major chord.
01:09:44 --> 01:09:47 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's like flat six, flat five.
01:09:47 --> 01:09:48 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like weird harmonies.
01:09:49 --> 01:09:52 [SPEAKER_00]: In any case, the same riff leads us to a very different place.
01:10:13 --> 01:10:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's like such a good song.
01:10:14 --> 01:10:15 [SPEAKER_05]: This is such a good song.
01:10:15 --> 01:10:22 [SPEAKER_05]: And I always like wondered it felt so like off and off culture at the beginning, and this is why I love that about the song and it's one of my favorite things.
01:10:22 --> 01:10:24 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like it comes at you from a weird angle.
01:10:24 --> 01:10:31 [SPEAKER_05]: And then you just like land in this like cozy pocket of like really great lyrics and really great songwriting, and I think it's just why.
01:10:31 --> 01:10:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I love George Harrison's songs.
01:10:33 --> 01:10:35 [SPEAKER_05]: So, George Harrison's songs are the best ones.
01:10:35 --> 01:10:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably.
01:10:35 --> 01:10:37 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just not as many of them.
01:10:37 --> 01:10:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's maybe that's why they're so good too, because you know, it's like the diamond in the rut, like the needle and the head.
01:10:42 --> 01:10:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And then he drops a literal triple album after they break up.
01:10:45 --> 01:10:46 [SPEAKER_00]: So, all right, well, more example.
01:10:47 --> 01:10:50 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is a song I actually kind of just want to do an episode about.
01:10:50 --> 01:10:55 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't know what what to do and maybe I'm spoiling by using this example.
01:10:55 --> 01:11:00 [SPEAKER_00]: But the cardigans do you remember the cardigans love, love, love fool.
01:11:00 --> 01:11:01 [SPEAKER_00]: 1996.
01:11:01 --> 01:11:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So we start with this A minor chord, but we're very much in C. So it's going like A minor D G C. So like six, two, five, one.
01:11:11 --> 01:11:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Kind of almost like a jazz tune would do take a listen.
01:11:41 --> 01:11:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so we ended in the key of X.
01:11:42 --> 01:11:44 [SPEAKER_00]: So they did a key change, right?
01:11:45 --> 01:11:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Through other means.
01:11:46 --> 01:11:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Other means.
01:11:48 --> 01:11:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's not a pivot chord.
01:11:49 --> 01:11:50 [SPEAKER_00]: It's sort of a direct mod.
01:11:50 --> 01:11:51 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a sequence.
01:11:51 --> 01:11:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they built up a bottom.
01:11:53 --> 01:11:54 [SPEAKER_00]: They just kind of go there, right?
01:11:54 --> 01:11:59 [SPEAKER_00]: So A minor was this middle of the progression kind of six chord before.
01:11:59 --> 01:12:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And now we're in A major.
01:12:00 --> 01:12:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And what do they do at the end of the chorus?
01:12:02 --> 01:12:05 [SPEAKER_00]: They just turn that A major, flip it into A minor.
01:12:05 --> 01:12:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And it becomes a minor one.
01:12:07 --> 01:12:13 [SPEAKER_00]: which we heard is the same chord before, but now it has a new meaning because it means one, and then we just go right into the verse.
01:12:13 --> 01:12:16 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a very odd, chromatic alteration.
01:12:16 --> 01:12:18 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's why the song is so memorable because it doesn't...
01:12:18 --> 01:12:20 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of reasons why it's memorable.
01:12:20 --> 01:12:21 [SPEAKER_00]: It's also Swedish.
01:12:21 --> 01:12:28 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to redact my previous statement and say that this should be your karaoke song, hilarious.
01:12:28 --> 01:12:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.
01:12:28 --> 01:12:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's listen to the chorus and the change back to the original key through the chromatic and play.
01:12:32 --> 01:12:36 [SPEAKER_05]: And while we do that, I want you to picture yourself seeing this in karaoke in front of your colleagues.
01:13:04 --> 01:13:05 [SPEAKER_00]: and we're back and see major.
01:13:06 --> 01:13:08 [SPEAKER_00]: So you're picturing karaoke when you listen.
01:13:09 --> 01:13:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I just picture myself playing bass.
01:13:11 --> 01:13:14 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm picturing you karaoke to your co-workers.
01:13:15 --> 01:13:17 [SPEAKER_05]: What karaoke songs would you prescribe to me?
01:13:17 --> 01:13:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Just saying.
01:13:18 --> 01:13:20 [SPEAKER_00]: What do I want to hear you do?
01:13:20 --> 01:13:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, well, could I sing it karaoke?
01:13:23 --> 01:13:28 [SPEAKER_05]: That would be like, you need a song that's a crowd, please, or that people can like not and sing along to.
01:13:28 --> 01:13:32 [SPEAKER_05]: You don't want to be side or deep cut, because people don't...
01:13:32 --> 01:13:33 [SPEAKER_05]: They're usually not.
01:13:33 --> 01:13:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Be side to deep cut.
01:13:34 --> 01:13:34 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
01:13:34 --> 01:13:35 [SPEAKER_00]: As the list of options.
01:13:35 --> 01:13:44 [SPEAKER_05]: No, you need something that people are going to sing along to a little bit, but also shows off your some ability, but isn't hard to do when you're drunk.
01:13:44 --> 01:13:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it would be kind of low hanging fruit to say like oh yeah I want to see you do you ought to know.
01:13:51 --> 01:14:00 [SPEAKER_00]: But but I do think it is like a 90s rocker kind of like some PJ Harvey or something like that.
01:14:00 --> 01:14:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm trying to think what I would want to hear.
01:14:03 --> 01:14:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, like, jewel, can you do like who will save your soul or something like that?
01:14:06 --> 01:14:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think you'd do that, Yoda.
01:14:08 --> 01:14:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It has like that high.
01:14:09 --> 01:14:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, zombie by the cranberry to do that.
01:14:12 --> 01:14:16 [SPEAKER_05]: I could do zombie or like a blondie song maybe.
01:14:16 --> 01:14:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
01:14:16 --> 01:14:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:14:17 --> 01:14:20 [SPEAKER_05]: I think the pair more songs are good for me too.
01:14:20 --> 01:14:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
01:14:20 --> 01:14:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:14:21 --> 01:14:22 [SPEAKER_00]: She's got pipes too, though.
01:14:22 --> 01:14:24 [SPEAKER_00]: All those singers are really good.
01:14:24 --> 01:14:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I don't think I'm a bad singer.
01:14:26 --> 01:14:27 [SPEAKER_05]: I've just never been tested.
01:14:27 --> 01:14:29 [SPEAKER_05]: I have too much ambition.
01:14:29 --> 01:14:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Not enough inhibitions.
01:14:30 --> 01:14:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Not enough inhibitions.
01:14:31 --> 01:14:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Too much inhibitions.
01:14:32 --> 01:14:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
01:14:33 --> 01:14:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Too much inhibitions.
01:14:35 --> 01:14:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Abitid.
01:14:35 --> 01:14:36 [SPEAKER_05]: And too inhibited.
01:14:36 --> 01:14:38 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the profitable.
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01:15:08 --> 01:15:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for listening.