Should Mark let his students drop no-no words in their concerts? This week, the hosts remember the iconic 1999 counter-diss track “Forgot About Dre” by Dr. Dre and Eminem. Mark highlights some awesome use of a cool rhyme trick that makes the song really stand out. Things then go a bit off the rails into a conversation about the use of problematic language in songs, as well as how we should interface with that language in our teaching. Write in with your input on this topic!
Other music heard in this episode: "Astronomy (8th Light) (feat. Weldon Irvine)”, Dr. Dre - “Still D.R.E. (feat. Snoop Dogg)”, “The Next Episode (feat. Snoop Dogg)”, “Bang Bang (feat. Hittman and Knoc-turn’al)”, “The Message (feat. Mary J. Blige and Rell)”, No Doubt - “The Climb”, “Nuthin' but a "G" Thang (feat. Snoop Dogg)”, Rhiannon Giddens - “At the Purchaser’s Option”, Kendrick Lamar - “The Recipe (feat. Dr. Dre)”, Madvillain - “Figaro”, Mark Ronson - “Uptown Funk (feat. Bruno Mars)”, Barenaked Ladies - “One Week”
Send us your thoughts at NeverMusicPod@gmail.com
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00:00 --> 00:12 [SPEAKER_00]: listeners, normally I play a goofy thing at the beginning of the episode, a snippet of a comedic moment later, we are explaining, well, I guess we're not doing an explicit language warning, are we, Nicole?
00:12 --> 00:16 [SPEAKER_03]: No, I'd rather just cut the explicit language out of this episode.
00:16 --> 00:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I'd rather just do that and I know that that's a cup out.
00:18 --> 00:26 [SPEAKER_03]: And I know that we should recognize all vernacular is an all in the academy, you know, all language is academic language.
00:26 --> 00:37 [SPEAKER_03]: And I feel like if you look at these lyrics as poetry, there is value added to adding certain vernacular to that poetry.
00:38 --> 00:40 [SPEAKER_03]: But I just don't like it.
00:41 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so this is playing at the beginning of the episode.
00:43 --> 00:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So long story short folks, this episode has a big conversation about harsh language and how we intersect with it with music and stuff.
00:53 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_00]: So you're going to hear us listening to the unedited version, the non-radio single version of this song.
01:00 --> 01:05 [SPEAKER_00]: But the music you will hear is the clean version as per Nicole's request.
01:05 --> 01:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Thanks, guys.
01:17 --> 01:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, I'm Mark, and I'm Nicole, and this is Nevermind the Music.
01:20 --> 01:21 [SPEAKER_00]: It sure is.
01:21 --> 01:23 [SPEAKER_03]: What are we talking about today, Mark?
01:23 --> 01:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Today, I would like to talk about Dr. Dre, and I guess to some extent, Eminem, forgot about Dre from 1999.
01:33 --> 01:38 [SPEAKER_04]: So I'm confused because you keep saying we're talking about Dr. Dre, but this isn't an Dr. Dre song, this is an M&M song, right?
01:56 --> 01:58 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Dr. Drey Song featuring Eminem.
01:58 --> 02:00 [SPEAKER_03]: B-turing Eminem.
02:00 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, we're getting as far as listening to the song a single time and seeing on your Spotify playlist that it was credited with the story.
02:05 --> 02:11 [SPEAKER_03]: I like you know it, but when I hear the song, like, yeah, I listen to it, obviously.
02:11 --> 02:18 [SPEAKER_03]: And I know that it's a Dr. Drey song, but it seems like code this in my mind, it's code as an Eminem song.
02:18 --> 02:19 [SPEAKER_00]: The hook is Eminem.
02:19 --> 02:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's why.
02:21 --> 02:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Two of the verses are Jray.
02:22 --> 02:25 [SPEAKER_00]: All of the choruses are M&M, one of the verses is M&M.
02:26 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So, I mean, we're fast forwarding a little bit, but M&M wrote this.
02:29 --> 02:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So, okay, Dr. Dre, what's Dr. Dre's deal?
02:32 --> 02:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, what is, if you had to assign one role in the music industry, two Dr. Dre, what would it be?
02:38 --> 02:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And I know that part of it is that that's not accurate, but if you had to assign one role, what would it be?
02:43 --> 02:45 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he's not a medical doctor.
02:45 --> 02:46 [SPEAKER_03]: I think we need to clarify that.
02:46 --> 02:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, specifically in the movie, he's a chemistry, his size.
02:49 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_00]: He may be being an actual doctor.
02:50 --> 02:51 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like a mastermind.
02:51 --> 02:52 [SPEAKER_03]: He's a producer.
02:52 --> 02:53 [SPEAKER_00]: He's a producer, right?
02:53 --> 02:58 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you look at so many of his hits,
02:59 --> 03:01 [SPEAKER_00]: virtually all of them have a feature.
03:02 --> 03:08 [SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes that feature is kind of like 50, 50 in this case, or whatever, or like nothing but a G thing.
03:08 --> 03:10 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very like Snoop Dogg and him.
03:11 --> 03:20 [SPEAKER_00]: But sometimes the featured artist is more prominent than even Dr. Dre is, because Dr. Dre is a rapper, but Dr. Dre's are rapper kind of like secondarily.
03:20 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Like if you think like the first thing you or I probably ever heard that Dr. Dre had his hands on would have been like NWA.
03:29 --> 03:37 [SPEAKER_00]: The honorable Dr. Dre presiding like he talks in the middle of the verses between the EZE and the ice cube verses and MC renverses, right?
03:38 --> 03:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he's the producer who sometimes would rap, right?
03:41 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And so even his solo albums are like covered in, he's almost like the hip hop Jacob Collier or Jacob Collier is the Doctor Dre of jazzy pop music, kind of, on some level.
03:54 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So
04:00 --> 04:05 [SPEAKER_00]: working with Dr. Dre with the intention that Snoop Dogg would be the main role on it.
04:05 --> 04:08 [SPEAKER_03]: But then like, but then things changed.
04:09 --> 04:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Dr. Dre heard the scratch track that M&M recorded and just decided he liked it more and kept that.
04:15 --> 04:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's weird like can you imagine
04:19 --> 04:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Snoop Dogg singing this kind of like the rapid fire it feels so M&F.
04:23 --> 04:26 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yeah, and also we like know it to be M&F.
04:26 --> 04:28 [SPEAKER_03]: It's hard to rewrite that memory.
04:28 --> 04:31 [SPEAKER_00]: There's like a laziness to Snoop Dogg style.
04:31 --> 04:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that is just so not like the sort of bouncing off the walls of like the early M&F party.
04:38 --> 04:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah
04:41 --> 04:52 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked a little bit in our Lauren Hill episode about my own journey that it was sort of like late high school before I started actually paying attention to hip-hop that wasn't, you know, another bad creation as a little kid kind of a situation.
04:53 --> 04:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is a part of that, right?
04:55 --> 04:56 [SPEAKER_00]: That same generation, the song is 1999.
04:56 --> 04:58 [SPEAKER_00]: This comes from Draze, 1999 album called,
05:02 --> 05:02 [SPEAKER_00]: 2001.
05:02 --> 05:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's right.
05:04 --> 05:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Using which is not that long after M&M broke out.
05:07 --> 05:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So he had probably at that point, maybe only had his first record.
05:11 --> 05:17 [SPEAKER_00]: This record was supposed to be called the chronic 2001, but then Shug Knight stole the title.
05:18 --> 05:23 [SPEAKER_03]: Because I know that title, see, I don't really like know a lot about early on hip hop.
05:24 --> 05:24 [SPEAKER_00]: So I don't think.
05:25 --> 05:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Or even late 90s hip hop.
05:26 --> 05:29 [SPEAKER_00]: So like, should I, you know, famously head of death row?
05:30 --> 05:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
05:31 --> 05:32 [SPEAKER_03]: A life day.
05:32 --> 05:37 [SPEAKER_00]: What did he like run his car into the middle of the set of straight all out of content or something like that?
05:37 --> 05:40 [SPEAKER_00]: But there's a death row comp from that same year that.
05:41 --> 05:47 [SPEAKER_00]: when they heard Dre was going to use the title of the chronic 2001 because the chronic, of course, is the early 90s album.
05:47 --> 05:54 [SPEAKER_00]: They just literally just used it because Dre had left death or records really like shortly before.
05:54 --> 05:57 [SPEAKER_00]: And there's tons of like Dre distracts on that record.
05:57 --> 06:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Like so this is sort of a counter to that.
06:00 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a lot of drama.
06:02 --> 06:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Lots of drama with those boys.
06:04 --> 06:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody want to talk like they got enough to say but none comes out like they've run Betrayed like this is all just sort of defense I guess against that and I don't really remember the songs Even I looked on it the trackless.
06:14 --> 06:24 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't remember really many the songs on that comp that death row comp I was like deep in my Damian rice phase when this was all coming out and this was all happening so late high school I can't get more different
06:27 --> 06:32 [SPEAKER_00]: My Drake consumption at that time was fully just pop culture as Moses.
06:32 --> 06:35 [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't until later that I ever listened to any of the records.
06:35 --> 06:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And to be clear, there's only three, and I've listened to two of them.
06:41 --> 06:42 [SPEAKER_00]: So I know the chronic and I know this album.
06:43 --> 06:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I have not heard Compton, which is the one that came out in the mid 2010s or something like that.
06:49 --> 06:50 [SPEAKER_00]: But it seems like you weren't a fan.
06:51 --> 06:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a fan.
06:51 --> 06:52 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's fine.
06:52 --> 06:53 [SPEAKER_03]: I like it.
06:53 --> 06:55 [SPEAKER_03]: I just, I mean, it's like a black spot.
06:55 --> 06:58 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a black spot in my music listening.
06:59 --> 07:01 [SPEAKER_03]: I want to be someone that knows Dr. Dre.
07:01 --> 07:05 [SPEAKER_03]: I want to be someone that like knows all this lore, but I just, I just don't.
07:06 --> 07:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you know?
07:07 --> 07:08 [SPEAKER_00]: No, biggie.
07:09 --> 07:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, and that's what I was talking with, Puffy, Puff Daddy.
07:12 --> 07:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you know who's in?
07:15 --> 07:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, okay.
07:16 --> 07:18 [SPEAKER_03]: And like, tribe called Quest, and here is one.
07:18 --> 07:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I think Keras wants to know those artists, but as a teenager, hmm.
07:23 --> 07:26 [SPEAKER_00]: The only reason I know K-R-S-1 is because Sublime mentions them.
07:26 --> 07:28 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, and that's got me listening to them.
07:28 --> 07:30 [SPEAKER_00]: So what are we observing here?
07:30 --> 07:35 [SPEAKER_00]: We are observing suburban San Diego versus suburban Boston.
07:35 --> 07:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
07:36 --> 07:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I knew.
07:36 --> 07:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Dre.
07:37 --> 07:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Tupac.
07:40 --> 07:55 [SPEAKER_00]: going back for an MC Hammer, like the West Coast hip-hop, whereas I mean, some people were listening to like Biggie and Wu Tang and stuff like that, or not, or whatever, but the East Coast West Coast battle was like waged.
07:55 --> 07:58 [SPEAKER_00]: L.A. was one of the central pieces of that, right?
07:58 --> 07:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Compton and all that.
07:59 --> 08:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So, I heard way more.
08:01 --> 08:04 [SPEAKER_03]: G-pop representative of East Coast West Coast
08:07 --> 08:08 [SPEAKER_03]: are knowledge of me.
08:08 --> 08:16 [SPEAKER_00]: We shouldn't have smithelaged white people, called professors, or I wouldn't say representative, but we are representative of the pop culture knock on effects of that.
08:17 --> 08:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
08:17 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I was just saying.
08:18 --> 08:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Hip-hop wasn't my main jam in high school.
08:20 --> 08:25 [SPEAKER_03]: But I love job call quest or like most deaf and black star to live quality.
08:25 --> 08:26 [SPEAKER_03]: Like all those people.
08:27 --> 08:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I came of age at the time when West Coast finally started like edging in and using its elbows to rudely shove everybody out, right?
08:39 --> 08:41 [SPEAKER_00]: If you think of like the TV station reports about
08:42 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_00]: gangster rap and like it's taking over and that was sort of like as we were 10 years old and stuff like that scare tactics.
08:50 --> 08:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh yeah, yeah, like me is more panics.
08:52 --> 08:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we should talk about moral panics one of those things That you should pipe in some black star right now because it's so good.
08:59 --> 09:01 [SPEAKER_03]: I can't mention it and not listen to it.
09:01 --> 09:01 [SPEAKER_03]: It's so good.
09:01 --> 09:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, okay
09:03 --> 09:20 [SPEAKER_00]: like this first song and there's like one album so it's like the first song and that album so this is the first time in history of the podcast we will ever pipe in music for no real reason except for one of our songs it's never happened before i'm just sure right now like i can't focus on anything until we listen to fair enough Blackstar
09:44 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_07]: Like the sooner love the date Like the profit love the date
09:51 --> 10:00 [SPEAKER_00]: For me, it was in my 20s when I was like, okay, I'm gonna like actually dig into this stuff, but Still the West Coast bias was strong for me.
10:01 --> 10:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I've heard a lot more of the G-Funk or the Drey Even later stuff.
10:06 --> 10:15 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not really G-Funk anymore, and Snoop Dogg, then I heard ever Natura's BG or any of that and you know, I know yeah, I
10:16 --> 10:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And of course there's Midwesterners in there too.
10:18 --> 10:19 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got what?
10:19 --> 10:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Eminem.
10:20 --> 10:22 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, but they like a dot.
10:23 --> 10:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, he became like a creature of the expanded universe of Dr. Drake.
10:28 --> 10:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so on this particular record, though, the collaborations, again, are key, right?
10:32 --> 10:41 [SPEAKER_00]: So we've got M&M, we've got Snoop Dogg, but also we've got 6-2 exhibit, Nate Dogg, making a triumphant return from earlier in the G-Funk era, of course, Hitman, and more folks.
10:42 --> 10:45 [SPEAKER_00]: This song, though, only hit number 25.
10:45 --> 10:48 [SPEAKER_00]: This felt like a huge hit, but
10:49 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
10:49 --> 10:58 [SPEAKER_00]: It's still Dr. Dre, like I guess it's still just gangster rap and enough that there's a ceiling, maybe at that point that it could have reached.
10:59 --> 11:04 [SPEAKER_00]: None of the songs on this album went past 20, but keep their head ringing, had to attend.
11:05 --> 11:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing but a g-thing all the way to number two.
11:07 --> 11:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So, in retrospect, some of those songs were huge, even in the early
11:17 --> 11:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Dr. Dr. Dave, of course, guests on a lot of songs too, which one of which I think will come back to.
11:21 --> 11:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And you're going to say, I thought this was a Dr. Dr. Dreyson, and it's like, no, it's not one's not credit for Dr. Dreyson.
11:27 --> 11:35 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know much about the genre, and I'm trying to understand all the players involved in this world when we talk about like East Coast West Coast rivalry.
11:35 --> 11:39 [SPEAKER_03]: I genuinely don't know who sits where.
11:39 --> 11:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I really don't.
11:41 --> 11:45 [SPEAKER_00]: The Alfa and Omega of the East West Coast Rivalese is going to be too pop and a big small.
11:46 --> 11:47 [SPEAKER_00]: They're both killed for it.
11:48 --> 11:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
11:49 --> 11:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think there's game of thrones be trails happening.
11:53 --> 11:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think there are West Coast wrappers that were on the side of the East Coast wrappers.
11:57 --> 12:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there might have been in the margins, but the major figures on the West Coast were unified in that kind of
12:05 --> 12:06 [SPEAKER_00]: side of it, right?
12:07 --> 12:28 [SPEAKER_00]: And then the major players on the East Coast would have been as well, basically New York, but then like, up comes Atlanta and so they're, you know, and of course, you've got like the Miami base sound like that, but it still has like a cultural affinity, more with East Coast sound, whereas you've got Northern and Southern California that kind of represent the West Coast.
12:28 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And then in the middle, like I don't know, like,
12:32 --> 12:34 [SPEAKER_00]: bone thugs from two seasons ago.
12:34 --> 12:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Like where are they?
12:34 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Where is Cleveland fit in with this?
12:36 --> 12:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And the truth is maybe not necessarily anywhere except that bone thugs and signs with easy ease label.
12:43 --> 12:46 [SPEAKER_00]: So then maybe come allied with the West Coast side.
12:46 --> 12:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
12:46 --> 12:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Obviously.
12:47 --> 12:47 [SPEAKER_03]: It's all very
12:48 --> 13:04 [SPEAKER_03]: complicated in and I do feel like in the game of throne type of way, even though I don't really know too much about all of those incidents and that's either, but I do feel like there's a lot of history and feuding that's interesting to dig into and maybe now is not the moment to do that.
13:04 --> 13:14 [SPEAKER_00]: What I will say is Dr. Dre, I mean, people can watch straight out of the conflict and all that, but like Dr. Dre's a part of that, but to my understanding, like not a part of that,
13:14 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_03]: He seems like he, like, floats above all of it.
13:16 --> 13:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I don't remember.
13:17 --> 13:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, that's just that vibe.
13:18 --> 13:19 [SPEAKER_00]: That vibe, right?
13:20 --> 13:21 [SPEAKER_00]: He wasn't in need deep in this.
13:22 --> 13:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think to the extent that some of these other guys were.
13:25 --> 13:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I do think if we want to talk about, I want to say, even if we're going to sidestep the conversations about gangster rap and general and East Coast West Coast rivalries to some extent,
13:34 --> 13:40 [SPEAKER_00]: We have to obviously point out that there are serious scars in the Dr. Dre legacy.
13:40 --> 13:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And he's apologized for some of this, but like in particular violence against women.
13:45 --> 13:50 [SPEAKER_00]: So the reporter D Barnes basically, he just like beat her up years ago.
13:50 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_00]: This is years ago.
13:51 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Like.
13:52 --> 13:59 [SPEAKER_00]: mid 90s or early 90s, she wrote something that he thought was inflammatory in an article and he just found her and assault her.
13:59 --> 14:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And like kind of got away with it and he's sensed to apologize for it, you know, that notably was not in the straight in a Compton film, even though, you know, it's a pretty important moment in someone's story.
14:12 --> 14:15 [SPEAKER_00]: There's also domestic violence allegations there.
14:16 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like with gangster rap, we do get some practice sweating a little bit the separation of art and artist thing.
14:24 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
14:25 --> 14:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how much we want to get into it.
14:27 --> 14:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Beyond that, it sounds like you're not super well-versed in it, so maybe we kind of just leave it there.
14:31 --> 14:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't think that I don't want to say anything that misrepresent anybody in a way that's derogatory, just because of my own ignorance to it.
14:40 --> 14:43 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'd rather just not talk about it until I'm more well informed.
14:44 --> 14:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you like this song?
14:45 --> 14:45 [SPEAKER_03]: I do.
14:45 --> 14:46 [SPEAKER_03]: I like Eminem.
14:46 --> 14:47 [SPEAKER_03]: I like Eminem.
14:47 --> 14:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Eminem.
14:48 --> 14:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like we might talk about Eminem for real one day.
14:51 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Eminem can be a side character in this conversation.
14:53 --> 14:58 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that we need to like you go that deep on him as a dude right now either.
14:58 --> 15:00 [SPEAKER_03]: No, I just like I like him as a lyric.
15:00 --> 15:05 [SPEAKER_03]: I think he's very smart and he's very nimble and that adds a lot to the song for me.
15:06 --> 15:07 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a draw for the song.
15:10 --> 15:12 [SPEAKER_00]: It's already argue with the hook.
15:13 --> 15:13 [SPEAKER_00]: OK.
15:13 --> 15:14 [SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
15:14 --> 15:14 [SPEAKER_00]: It's pretty awesome.
15:15 --> 15:21 [SPEAKER_00]: And before we proceed, though, OK. Can I shout out one of the great annoying synth sounds in all of pop music?
15:21 --> 15:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'll allow it.
15:23 --> 15:24 [SPEAKER_00]: This does come from this song.
15:24 --> 15:28 [SPEAKER_00]: I want you to recognize the plucky pluck kind of guitar slash harp.
15:29 --> 15:37 [SPEAKER_00]: But almost sounds like a coto, you know, Japanese, string instrument or the Chinese instruments, maybe the Luching or the Peepa.
15:37 --> 15:40 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's some cheap sort of synth sound.
15:48 --> 15:48 [SPEAKER_03]: You love a harp.
15:49 --> 15:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Anytime you can talk a lot.
15:50 --> 15:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I like a good harp.
15:51 --> 15:53 [SPEAKER_00]: And yet we have not done Florence and the Machine.
15:54 --> 15:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they have an actual harpist in the band.
15:57 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.
15:58 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Apparently Dre was kind of into this sound in his era, because if the G Funk style, like the more classic G Funk from the early 1990s, the chronic, et cetera, to me that was much more about
16:09 --> 16:21 [SPEAKER_00]: cheesy synth sounds like think like a pee funk bassline interpolation with a lazy preset from a cheap synthesizer like a Yamaha keyboard or something here's let me ride from 92.
16:22 --> 16:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Listen to the sort of whistle lead tone that is very much to me just baked into that early 1990s G funk sound this of course is an interpolation of mothership connection by parliament.
16:47 --> 16:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Just a few, yeah, just a few.
16:49 --> 17:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Now interestingly, that I'm going to talk about sonic evolution between, you know, the whistley synths and the funk bass lines with two plucky pluckers in on this 2001 album, but what doesn't change is the low brow skits.
17:05 --> 17:29 [SPEAKER_00]: There are still raunchy skits between songs all four of these records and I don't know Listeners write in if you've listened to the 2015 album is he still doing skits like he's 20 year old in 1992 or whatever So you know what I'll add okay is on Justin Bieber's one of the more recent albums He has those like skits in between his songs and you didn't like those
17:30 --> 17:34 [SPEAKER_00]: The Justin Bieber's calling saying I'm basically black skin.
17:34 --> 17:35 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I did not like that skin.
17:35 --> 17:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I was pretty stupid.
17:36 --> 17:37 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I was pretty stupid.
17:37 --> 17:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe that was like a callback in his artistry to to the boasting of a King to rapper.
17:45 --> 17:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it was like
17:46 --> 17:49 [SPEAKER_03]: I'll part of it, like it was more meta than we were thinking at the time.
17:49 --> 17:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe Justin Bieber should do really ronchi skits with.
17:53 --> 17:54 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't even want to describe it.
17:54 --> 17:57 [SPEAKER_03]: You have me at Justin Bieber ronchi skit.
17:57 --> 17:58 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't even need any more context.
17:58 --> 17:59 [SPEAKER_03]: There I'm here.
17:59 --> 18:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So, lucky sense on this record.
18:03 --> 18:04 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Still Dre.
18:16 --> 18:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's got to bring bring bring car and the The next episode maybe same is the sound that is used in it feels very similar
18:39 --> 18:46 [SPEAKER_03]: That sound is so iconic to Snoop Dogg and like time and place of this music for sure.
18:46 --> 18:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Like you can't, I can't separate them in my head.
18:48 --> 18:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like Dr. Drey's that is the best when Snoop Dogg is in his corner.
18:51 --> 18:52 [SPEAKER_03]: I think so too.
18:52 --> 18:53 [SPEAKER_00]: That song is really good.
18:53 --> 18:56 [SPEAKER_03]: And when they're all together, like it's pretty awesome.
18:56 --> 18:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Like they all do Super Bowl.
18:57 --> 18:58 [SPEAKER_00]: That song is gonna be on a dog on it.
18:58 --> 18:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Like great.
18:59 --> 19:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Smoke weed every day.
19:01 --> 19:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's our yesterday.
19:02 --> 19:03 [SPEAKER_03]: He's making millions off that.
19:04 --> 19:13 [SPEAKER_00]: In my quest to include only the clean version of these songs, I stumbled upon what Nate Dogg's line at the end of this song sounds like in the edit.
19:13 --> 19:14 [SPEAKER_02]: I never heard that before.
19:29 --> 19:30 [SPEAKER_00]: album track, it's not one of the hits.
19:31 --> 19:34 [SPEAKER_00]: The message, this one almost sounds like a real instrument, not a
19:58 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_03]: I like that quite a bit.
20:00 --> 20:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It's good.
20:00 --> 20:01 [SPEAKER_03]: I like that.
20:01 --> 20:06 [SPEAKER_03]: It's more mellow, even though the lyrics don't indicate mellow, but...
20:06 --> 20:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's mellow.
20:07 --> 20:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:07 --> 20:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, relatively.
20:08 --> 20:10 [SPEAKER_03]: It's relatively, and that's what I knew.
20:10 --> 20:11 [SPEAKER_03]: I knew like a palette cleanser.
20:11 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
20:12 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_00]: So.
20:13 --> 20:13 [SPEAKER_03]: So.
20:14 --> 20:16 [SPEAKER_00]: We are going to talk about, for God about Dre.
20:17 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to talk about rhyming, specifically internal rhyming, which doesn't happen as much in the chorus of this song that happens all throughout the rest of it, and it's pretty cool trick.
20:27 --> 20:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Where do you want to take this conversation?
20:28 --> 20:40 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like it's going to be some mental gymnastics, but I'm going to try to make some connections between this internal rhyming that you're discussing, and methods of memorizing
20:43 --> 20:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, specifically called the method of Loki or the memory palace or the mind palace sometimes people call it.
20:51 --> 20:52 [SPEAKER_00]: How do you spell Loki?
20:53 --> 20:54 [SPEAKER_03]: L-O-C-I.
20:55 --> 20:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Like locus, but loci, but low key.
20:58 --> 21:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, all right, or the memory palace.
21:01 --> 21:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like low, like the latin route seems like location.
21:04 --> 21:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, place, place, yeah.
21:07 --> 21:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, it's like a mental mapping.
21:09 --> 21:20 [SPEAKER_03]: So my hope is that your talk about rhyming schemes involves some sort of like mapping convention that I can layer on my ideas on top of.
21:20 --> 21:21 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think I can do it.
21:21 --> 21:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So what I'm not talking about is rhyme scheme.
21:24 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
21:25 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
21:25 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Internal rhyming.
21:27 --> 21:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Internal rhyming.
21:28 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_00]: And then do you want me to talk?
21:29 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
21:29 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Then you can learn what I'm talking about.
21:31 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
21:31 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
21:32 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_03]: I need to learn.
21:32 --> 21:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So before we talk about the rhyme, just listen to the beat here.
21:37 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_04]: So this allegedly, I say this very knowingly, has a sample of season 2 alumni no doubt.
22:06 --> 22:22 [SPEAKER_00]: sourced on a website that is now defunct that lists this as a sample like I don't know who's actually truly asserting that this is a sample or an interpolation because Mike Elisando was credited to actually playing bass on this track but this is the no doubt song.
22:31 --> 22:32 [SPEAKER_00]: compared to
22:46 --> 22:51 [SPEAKER_03]: not melodically, so the key feels the same, the chord progression feels the same.
22:51 --> 22:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I do do some of the same things.
22:53 --> 22:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like it's moving the same way.
22:55 --> 23:04 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's played by a different person, like it's re-recorded, it's probably in interpolation, but like I don't know if, I don't know, it's weird, it's weird to have that listed as a sample.
23:04 --> 23:09 [SPEAKER_03]: And the songwriting credit does not indicate that we're never able to connect it that on my own.
23:09 --> 23:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
23:09 --> 23:13 [SPEAKER_03]: But if I'm primed that way, I can like make the connection between the two.
23:13 --> 23:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
23:14 --> 23:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe maybe, okay, all right.
23:36 --> 23:41 [SPEAKER_00]: So what I want to talk about is a rhyming trick that makes a simple song in this case really hit in my opinion.
23:42 --> 23:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's first walk through just kind of how rhymes normally work.
23:45 --> 23:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think we've really ever talked about.
23:47 --> 23:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I've only brought up lyrics a few times in this podcast at all.
23:50 --> 23:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But here is more of a traditional approach to rhyme.
23:56 --> 23:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's listen to nothing but a G thing.
23:58 --> 24:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Snoop Dogg's verse is first verse, 1992.
24:20 --> 24:23 [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, perspective, contraceptive, trouble, bubble, crazy pays me.
24:23 --> 24:25 [SPEAKER_06]: Yes, hand understand.
24:25 --> 24:25 [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
24:25 --> 24:29 [SPEAKER_06]: And those and those rhymes tend to fall in this first at the end of each of the lines.
24:29 --> 24:29 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
24:43 --> 24:51 [SPEAKER_00]: So we call that end rhyme, and that would be what I would think of as kind of normal rhyming convention, right?
24:52 --> 24:59 [SPEAKER_00]: You basically say a line and then choose a rhyme or a half rhyme or something like a rhyme at the end of the next line.
25:00 --> 25:04 [SPEAKER_00]: And you could create a pattern of them, a series of, let's say, like
25:05 --> 25:08 [SPEAKER_00]: bubble and then trouble and then crazy then pays me.
25:08 --> 25:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that was the order it went in.
25:09 --> 25:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So that would you could label bubble and trouble.
25:12 --> 25:14 [SPEAKER_00]: That's one sound you could label it as A, right?
25:14 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_00]: And then crazy and pays me you could label that rhyme as B.
25:18 --> 25:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And so the rhyme scheme might go A, A, B, B.
25:21 --> 25:22 [SPEAKER_00]: But like
25:23 --> 25:34 [SPEAKER_00]: different kinds of poems or different kinds of songs or raps could have a rhyme scheme that's you know like A-A-A-B-B-A, where the fifth line rhymes are like you go A-B-A-B, there's all sorts of ways.
25:34 --> 25:35 [SPEAKER_03]: It's just like poetry.
25:35 --> 25:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
25:36 --> 25:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I think song lyrics are just mediocre poems that have a melody to make them better in a lot of cases, right?
25:41 --> 25:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So that is called rhyme scheme.
25:43 --> 25:49 [SPEAKER_00]: And there are some songs with really awesome rhyme schemes, including a lot of hip-hop, and I look forward to
25:52 --> 26:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Today is not that day because the song okay so forgot about Drey has some interesting rhyme scheme elements but a lot of the end rhymes frankly in forgot about Drey are the same word over and over again.
26:04 --> 26:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Right?
26:05 --> 26:05 [SPEAKER_00]: So
26:06 --> 26:08 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to hear this first and first.
26:09 --> 26:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And the end rhymes, you're going to hear low key, no G's, no skis, groceries.
26:13 --> 26:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And the rhyme scheme is like AA, AA, AA, like it's just constantly the same word.
26:19 --> 26:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So the rhyme scheme isn't necessarily that interesting.
26:22 --> 26:28 [SPEAKER_00]: The end rhyme in this song, overall, is not the focus.
26:28 --> 26:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's say that.
26:29 --> 26:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So listen to the beginning of the first verse back to forgot about your A.
26:31 --> 26:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Y'all know me, still the same old G But I've been low-key Heading on by most these With no cheese, no deals and new Gs No wheels and no keys No rules, no snow, snow, no bills and no skis Made of me, cause I can finally afford to provide my family with post-reads
26:46 --> 26:50 [SPEAKER_00]: low key no G's no skis you're hearing a lot of and rhyme that is repetitive.
26:51 --> 27:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It is a cool and rhyme though I'll say he's not just rhyming key he's rhyming low key no skis groceries like he's got two sounds of multiple words and a lot of cases which is pretty cool.
27:01 --> 27:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, cool.
27:02 --> 27:07 [SPEAKER_00]: But listen again and what I want you to focus on is what happens in the middle of the lines.
27:08 --> 27:09 [SPEAKER_00]: in between the end rhymes.
27:09 --> 27:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Focus on the each line, in some cases as it's own entity and see if things rhyme within the lines.
27:32 --> 27:34 [SPEAKER_00]: know me OG, know cheese, know cheese.
27:35 --> 27:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Those rhymes all happen in rapid succession.
27:37 --> 27:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll play just that line again and you're gonna hear a lot of those rhymes are happening not at the end of the line Right, those rhymes know me OG, et cetera, all happening in the middle of the line.
27:46 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_02]: And so we call this internal rhyme or sometimes called middle rhyme
28:02 --> 28:06 [SPEAKER_00]: But if you listen in, he's also throwing in other internal rhymes as well.
28:06 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got no deals, no wheels, snowmobiles.
28:08 --> 28:11 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'm picking up on snowmobiles.
28:11 --> 28:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Like it's kind of like no mobiles.
28:14 --> 28:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Low keys, no G's, snowmobiles, but then they, but then the deals rhymes with no deals, like it's a very cool way he does it.
28:24 --> 28:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But then he goes back to mad at me in family, which rhymes with the earlier set of rhymes, right?
28:29 --> 28:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, do you think that they just like spit it out and it works because they're like quick thinkers and good at words or do you think they like sit and ponder with like a pen and paper to like make these to great question and in this case I have no idea I think every rapper is different I think there's a lot of improvisation that goes on so too because I think it can help me that I can't all be that
28:50 --> 29:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and you think of like M&M wrote this to be performed by at least certain sections of the song to be performed by Snoop Dogg, so there's some amount of like, this isn't just a jam at the mic, there's some amount of like, I'm going to kind of write this.
29:04 --> 29:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to like, scope figure this out, but some of it's got to be improvisation.
29:09 --> 29:10 [SPEAKER_03]: There's a real hard history to it.
29:11 --> 29:16 [SPEAKER_00]: 100% so listen again, and let's try to create like whoa, is there a pattern to all this internal rhyme?
29:16 --> 29:19 [SPEAKER_02]: So if we focus just on the end rhyme, we have a a a a a
29:36 --> 29:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But if we incorporate the middle rhyme, the first line is A, A, A, the second line is A, B, A.
29:43 --> 29:46 [SPEAKER_00]: The third line is B, A, C, C, B, A.
29:46 --> 29:48 [SPEAKER_00]: So many rhymes in that third line, and I'll play you just that line.
29:49 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_00]: And then we end D, D, A.
29:51 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So they're all ending on A, but they have these patterns in the inside.
29:54 --> 29:57 [SPEAKER_00]: And here's that crazy third line that has so many of them.
30:01 --> 30:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm labeling that as B-A-C-Z-B-A.
30:04 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Folks, I will not be like giving the labeling of every line in the song, don't worry.
30:08 --> 30:09 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't need to follow her in any case.
30:09 --> 30:12 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, yes, even like correcting multiple choice exams.
30:12 --> 30:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my gosh.
30:12 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah, midterm time, basically.
30:15 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_00]: So...
30:16 --> 30:24 [SPEAKER_00]: This kind of thing, you already mentioned poetry, so internal rhymes, a big thing in poetry, of course, forget about music, just written poems.
30:24 --> 30:30 [SPEAKER_00]: People who can actually write words, well, this is TS Eliot's The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock.
30:30 --> 30:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Nice.
30:31 --> 30:31 [SPEAKER_00]: 1915.
30:33 --> 30:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Time for you and time for me and time yet for a hundred indiscisions and for a hundred visions and revisions before the taking of toast and tea.
30:42 --> 30:48 [SPEAKER_00]: So we've got a literation there too, which is cool toast and tea, but indiscisions and then visions and revisions like it's internal, right?
30:48 --> 30:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not just he doesn't do as many as Drake does in that one line, but it's a thing in poetry, right?
30:55 --> 30:56 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, for sure.
30:56 --> 31:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So moving on later in this verse, things actually get a little simpler, right?
31:01 --> 31:07 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're going to get a new set of internal rhymes on a different sound, so like tracks, right?
31:07 --> 31:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Wall full of plaques back.
31:09 --> 31:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We get a lot of internal rhymes on a different sound, but then we do go back to that A sound, the no-g's, right, trophies, and it kind of continues with that.
31:17 --> 31:20 [SPEAKER_00]: There is no line that has a bunch of them like in the first half.
31:20 --> 31:24 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean there's some problematic lyrics here, but I'm gonna avoid that and think of it as poetry
31:42 --> 31:43 [SPEAKER_00]: It is, right?
31:43 --> 31:43 [SPEAKER_00]: It is.
31:44 --> 31:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It is.
31:44 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's culturally expressive use of time.
31:46 --> 31:46 [SPEAKER_03]: And I love that.
31:46 --> 31:50 [SPEAKER_03]: And I love expressive use of language.
31:50 --> 31:55 [SPEAKER_00]: So you tell me what's going on in this next bit.
31:55 --> 31:58 [SPEAKER_00]: This is the end of the verse or gosh, no, we still got a couple more sections.
31:58 --> 32:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me play just a snippet here.
32:00 --> 32:01 [SPEAKER_00]: What's going on rhyme wise here?
32:11 --> 32:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so yeah, what do you got?
32:12 --> 32:17 [SPEAKER_02]: We're getting a lot of e-sounds, e-s-e-d-o-c-s-w-g-s-drop-the-beats-a, right, and then that's back-to-a, right, yeah, yeah, and then we go to some ood-sounds
32:33 --> 32:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't say I was weren't doing a good thing.
32:34 --> 32:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Good.
32:34 --> 32:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Through the hood.
32:35 --> 32:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
32:36 --> 32:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
32:36 --> 32:40 [SPEAKER_03]: So we have a little bee convention bee skiing or maybe it's.
32:40 --> 32:42 [SPEAKER_03]: I wasn't tracking when we did that one before but.
32:43 --> 32:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's a new and new sound like hearing it.
32:46 --> 32:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, now it's new to us.
32:48 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not novel, but then we're going back to the A, C, what, who?
32:53 --> 33:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Doctor, they told you to go C. C, elbow, better listen up closely, and that's the end of the the clip that you played.
33:00 --> 33:05 [SPEAKER_03]: So we're alternating between two like really conventional conventional rhymes.
33:05 --> 33:07 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not seeing a ton of internal rhymes in this group.
33:08 --> 33:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe they're there.
33:08 --> 33:10 [SPEAKER_03]: I need further analysis.
33:10 --> 33:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no, that's there's death.
33:11 --> 33:12 [SPEAKER_00]: That's internal for sure.
33:15 --> 33:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's four in one line right right.
33:19 --> 33:23 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's internal just means it's like not at the end It's not at the end of the line right.
33:23 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I would say this section of the song each line is two bars Mm-hmm.
33:27 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay
33:28 --> 33:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, so what if it rhymes in the middle and at the end with the same the Snoop DO double G's or yes, so a lot of these are The end rhyme separately from the internal rhyme, but a lot of times the internal rhyme is the same sound is the end rhyme not always would you still call that line like having an internal rhyme skill.
33:49 --> 33:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, okay because that line if I just play that beginning again
33:59 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I think the police is the end of the line.
34:02 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_00]: So we've got like five of them before that.
34:04 --> 34:07 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, do you feel that there's an ending point?
34:07 --> 34:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
34:07 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll count that as an end rhyme.
34:09 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_00]: In the verses of the song, I think the phrase structure is like two bars long, which is what I just played.
34:14 --> 34:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I think in the chorus it actually speeds up to be one bar, and part of that is just M&M's lightning fast delivery.
34:20 --> 34:27 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's arguable, but when you feel the end of a line, that's your end of the line, and you can follow that rhyme as the end rhyme.
34:27 --> 34:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But in that case we had, what was that?
34:29 --> 34:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Five of them before we reached, but do you have a lyrics open?
34:32 --> 34:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
34:32 --> 34:36 [SPEAKER_00]: How many E sounds before we hear Motherfuck the police?
34:36 --> 34:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, easy ease, DOC's.
34:39 --> 34:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Snoop, DOG's, so that's three.
34:41 --> 34:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
34:42 --> 34:43 [SPEAKER_03]: F the pulleys.
34:44 --> 34:47 [SPEAKER_03]: That's shit just for and then a tape full of dope beats.
34:47 --> 34:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's after that's after but that's the second line.
34:50 --> 34:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm saying just that first line has four rhymes on the same sound.
34:53 --> 34:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
34:53 --> 34:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
34:54 --> 34:56 [SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, hood and good.
34:56 --> 34:57 [SPEAKER_00]: That's within one line.
34:57 --> 34:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm pretty sure.
34:57 --> 34:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
34:58 --> 34:58 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
34:58 --> 35:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So he ends this verse starting.
35:01 --> 35:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to actually play the last bit we just heard because he said closely and then we're going to take that line and move on to the end.
35:08 --> 35:11 [SPEAKER_02]: You're gonna have to put an explicit warning on this episode.
35:34 --> 35:35 [SPEAKER_00]: You are okay.
35:35 --> 35:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about this thing.
35:37 --> 35:38 [SPEAKER_00]: You grew up in this era.
35:38 --> 35:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
35:39 --> 35:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And you are made uncomfortable listening to gangster rap.
35:43 --> 35:46 [SPEAKER_00]: That's just kind of been in pop culture for 30 years.
35:46 --> 35:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Kind of 25.
35:48 --> 35:49 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm having like a reaction.
35:49 --> 35:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Talk to me about that.
35:49 --> 35:50 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's just the end word.
35:51 --> 35:51 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't like.
35:51 --> 35:53 [SPEAKER_00]: But that did that line even haven't downward?
35:53 --> 35:55 [SPEAKER_03]: They have so many ends.
35:55 --> 35:56 [SPEAKER_00]: No that line that I just played.
35:57 --> 35:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
35:58 --> 36:00 [SPEAKER_03]: All you end words said that I turned pop or the firm flow.
36:00 --> 36:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
36:01 --> 36:02 [SPEAKER_00]: See, I've long since.
36:02 --> 36:04 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's a lot of the misogyny stuff gets me too.
36:04 --> 36:06 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's why I don't really love this type of music.
36:07 --> 36:08 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think that that's it.
36:08 --> 36:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I feel uncomfortable with like, it's so crass to me.
36:13 --> 36:16 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's so wild because I'm a pretty crass person generally.
36:16 --> 36:18 [SPEAKER_00]: It's interesting to me because like,
36:18 --> 36:32 [SPEAKER_00]: So I actually was just earlier this semester talking to one of my colleagues who for the first time in their particular ensemble was going to program a song that had some rough language.
36:47 --> 36:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, first of all, this is a college, right?
36:50 --> 36:51 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're all adults.
36:51 --> 36:54 [SPEAKER_00]: You could kind of do whatever you want, right?
36:54 --> 37:02 [SPEAKER_00]: But for me, as a middle-aged, employed, cisgendered heterosexual white male,
37:03 --> 37:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
37:04 --> 37:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I am never going to be telling the students what they can and can't say.
37:07 --> 37:18 [SPEAKER_00]: So what I do in the ensemble, I lead, which is, and I know this isn't what you're talking about specifically, it is up to the expression, the intent and comfort level of the student.
37:18 --> 37:19 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all in the music.
37:19 --> 37:27 [SPEAKER_00]: So there are tiny amounts of limits I do to that, but basically like F bombs a lot of other work terms.
37:27 --> 37:28 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like student.
37:28 --> 37:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you comfortable with this or not?
37:29 --> 37:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And I will, depending on the level, I will give a notification before the song or at the beginning of the concert.
37:34 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, my kids go to our concerts sometimes, and it's like, okay, this is about to happen if somebody wants to step out.
37:39 --> 37:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, in a lot of ways, this also relates to the positionality of that student.
37:44 --> 37:50 [SPEAKER_00]: So, for example, if something is truly misogynistic, racist, homophobic, really strong, I just want him to bother putting the song in.
37:50 --> 37:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
37:51 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_00]: But if it's an iconic song that uses unsavory language, like, okay.
37:55 --> 37:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Like this.
37:55 --> 37:57 [SPEAKER_00]: let's not even go this far.
37:58 --> 38:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Money for nothing by direstrates uses the worse f-bomb uses the gaysler f-bomb, right?
38:05 --> 38:20 [SPEAKER_00]: In 1982 or whatever that song is, if I were to program that song, which I haven't, but if I were to program that song for the ensemble, if I had a student performing it, identified as somewhere in the LGBTQ world, I would say it is up to you what you want to do with that word.
38:21 --> 38:24 [SPEAKER_00]: You can take ownership of it and perform it, you can change it, whatever you want.
38:24 --> 38:33 [SPEAKER_00]: if it was a cis hetero-dude singing it like dire straits was that I would say I highly recommend you not sing that word.
38:34 --> 38:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I would ultimately leave it up to them.
38:36 --> 38:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I highly caution, I highly caution students.
38:40 --> 38:50 [SPEAKER_00]: The N word in particular, I highly tell people like, you have to understand, we have faculty at this college, for example, that we're literally like beaten up by cops as civil rights activists in the 60s and 70s.
38:51 --> 38:52 [SPEAKER_00]: So like, tread very lightly.
38:53 --> 38:58 [SPEAKER_00]: But if you are an African-American student, specifically not just black, but like all of the African-American sort of line.
38:59 --> 39:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, you can take this word and it is your choice what you will do.
39:02 --> 39:07 [SPEAKER_00]: If it's a white student doing a rap verse that doesn't end word, I'm highly cautioning them.
39:07 --> 39:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I highly recommend you not do it.
39:10 --> 39:15 [SPEAKER_00]: But I have taken it to be like really truly fundamentally not my place to be judging at all with.
39:16 --> 39:21 [SPEAKER_00]: people that aren't me's use of language in music, and that includes the N word.
39:21 --> 39:30 [SPEAKER_03]: I get that man, but also the reality is that you are in a power position, given your role, which is why I surrender that power.
39:30 --> 39:32 [SPEAKER_03]: But do you think that that's genuine though?
39:32 --> 39:34 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, yeah, you surrender your power.
39:34 --> 39:36 [SPEAKER_03]: You state that's the student's choice.
39:36 --> 39:39 [SPEAKER_03]: But if the student says, oh, I want to do right by my professor.
39:39 --> 39:40 [SPEAKER_03]: I want a in this class.
39:40 --> 39:42 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to do what he thinks I should be doing.
39:43 --> 39:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is what do you think I think it should be doing?
39:45 --> 39:47 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, that's what the students debating.
39:47 --> 39:48 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not whether they should use the word or not.
39:48 --> 39:51 [SPEAKER_03]: It's whether they think Professor wants me to use the word or not.
39:51 --> 39:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So then it's better to just not empower them at all.
39:54 --> 39:56 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's better to not even program a song like this.
39:56 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Not program any hip-hop that uses the inward.
39:59 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
40:00 --> 40:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Not program any hip-hop that says the word bitch.
40:03 --> 40:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
40:04 --> 40:05 [SPEAKER_03]: I think.
40:05 --> 40:07 [SPEAKER_03]: So our schools are very different.
40:07 --> 40:08 [SPEAKER_03]: I know in my school.
40:10 --> 40:38 [SPEAKER_00]: that would be the path is to not program it and to have a discussion about why we're not programming it and why we're taking a different path to not give power to those words anymore and your population is different it just is and I think it's tough for me at a majority minority institution that I teach at to be like I'm a scared I'm going to eliminate massive proportions of certain styles of music that are extremely popular that you all know and listen to and
40:40 --> 40:42 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not from being scared, it's just about respect.
40:42 --> 40:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I'm not going to program it because I feel like it could be disrespectful to put students in position to have to make the choice.
40:49 --> 40:52 [SPEAKER_03]: If they were around their friends singing the song, it's different.
40:52 --> 40:59 [SPEAKER_03]: But now they have to decide if they're going to perform this in front of the entire student population, or whoever comes up.
40:59 --> 41:00 [SPEAKER_00]: What am I doing in this class?
41:00 --> 41:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I am training musicians to make those decisions.
41:03 --> 41:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I have to equip my students when you're fricking hired to be in the wedding band, and someone's like, I want you to do cop killer by iced tea or whatever.
41:14 --> 41:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Am I wedding?
41:14 --> 41:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Because shit like that happens.
41:15 --> 41:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
41:15 --> 41:17 [SPEAKER_00]: They have to go, well, what do I actually do?
41:17 --> 41:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Because grandma's gonna be there.
41:19 --> 41:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And so is- Then you ask your client for it.
41:21 --> 41:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, you know what I mean?
41:22 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And what do I want to do?
41:24 --> 41:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I have to, like, I don't have to do anything.
41:26 --> 41:31 [SPEAKER_00]: But like, the idea that I should not allow the student's look.
41:31 --> 41:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So I had a situation.
41:31 --> 41:34 [SPEAKER_00]: You're talking about like harmful language.
41:35 --> 41:58 [SPEAKER_00]: There is a very beautiful song by Rian and Giddens that I programmed once because I programmed the music for I even know who was in the group right and then once I see who's auditioned the group all I'll say okay well you should try this song there was a woman who sang this one song by her so beautifully but it was from the perspective of a slave like it was a historical kind of song gorgeous song
42:01 --> 42:12 [SPEAKER_00]: slave woman who was going to be salt and so like the sense of instability of like what are they going to take my baby, but the theme of this concert was telling stories that were unheard, right?
42:26 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You can take my body, you can take my bone, you can take my blood, but not my soul, you can take."
42:34 --> 42:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And this woman's voice fit the song so freaking well, and we rehearsed it a few times.
42:40 --> 42:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And she told the class, I don't feel comfortable singing this song.
42:43 --> 42:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It's beautiful.
42:44 --> 42:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't think I'm the right person to share this.
42:47 --> 42:49 [SPEAKER_00]: And we had vocalists in the band that were black.
42:50 --> 42:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And none of them wanted to sing it because they were like, but she sounds so good on it.
42:54 --> 42:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's just not do this song.
42:56 --> 43:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And so the band made that decision, we talked about it, and we had a great conversation.
43:00 --> 43:05 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a good learning experience for some of the people in the class because some of them just did not get it.
43:06 --> 43:09 [SPEAKER_00]: There was one guy in particular who was like harping on it.
43:09 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_00]: What are you talking about?
43:10 --> 43:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Do it.
43:11 --> 43:15 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, you don't know what it's like, man, it's easy for you to play base or whatever in the background of this.
43:16 --> 43:17 [SPEAKER_00]: and not have to think about it.
43:17 --> 43:36 [SPEAKER_00]: And like, I don't know how many other students would have made the same decision she did, but it was interesting that she didn't want to do it, and none of the black women in the group wanted to sing it because out of almost like, difference to her, because they were like, well, I'm not gonna sound as good as you, because your voice sounds exactly like random getins, but you don't feel comfortable, let's just retire, and I'm like great.
43:37 --> 43:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And the truth is, that's only time that's ever happened, then when the content of a song was challenging enough, and that song doesn't have a single swear word in it.
43:45 --> 43:59 [SPEAKER_00]: The song doesn't have just the content and and I got to say like I'm never programming concert that's like the N words used as a like it is colloquial African American vernacular use of the N word.
44:00 --> 44:21 [SPEAKER_00]: If the song is talking about misogynistic crap, I don't program it, but when the word hose exists in the song as a sort of random, like a spray and prey of a machine gun fire of random kind of not a random word, but you don't even like, it's not like there's f-bombs that are different levels too, right?
44:21 --> 44:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And I will just not program something if it's like racist.
44:24 --> 44:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
44:25 --> 44:29 [SPEAKER_00]: black vernacular use of the n-word as a synonym for like other people.
44:30 --> 44:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I just put it and I just say like leave it and this is really interesting.
44:33 --> 44:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I did not think we'd be talking about that.
44:35 --> 44:47 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that all I know and I respect your mission to educate your students and to have these hard conversations and I think that that's really noble and lovely that you decent yourself and put your give your students the power.
44:48 --> 44:52 [SPEAKER_03]: but all I know is that every institution's different.
44:52 --> 44:57 [SPEAKER_03]: And if this was my institution, it would be not okay.
44:57 --> 45:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Like write ups in the school newspaper, parents calling Board of Trustees upset.
45:01 --> 45:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Like it would be a big deal.
45:02 --> 45:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Your institution has a very different mission statement than mine's
45:05 --> 45:16 [SPEAKER_03]: know and you know what the funny thing is they really don't and that's the unfortunate thing is we're all about inclusivity and diversity and like advocating for at-risk populations like that is part of my institution's mission.
45:16 --> 45:19 [SPEAKER_03]: This is just kind of untouchable first school like mine.
45:19 --> 45:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:19 --> 45:23 [SPEAKER_03]: And for yours it doesn't seem to be and I think that that's
45:24 --> 45:40 [SPEAKER_03]: powerful and also like really challenging as an educator because even though you're unsentering yourself and you're putting students in the decision making position, there's so much that's going into that decision that is subtext and happening in like the background of that.
45:40 --> 45:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's interesting because what you're prescribing is, and I hear you, I really do.
45:45 --> 45:49 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't think I've agonized over this for, I'm sure you have over a decade.
45:49 --> 45:49 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I'm sure you have.
45:50 --> 45:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I had literal meetings with faculty in the behavioral sciences and social departments to be like, what do you think is the best way?
45:56 --> 45:59 [SPEAKER_00]: We're doing a concert with immigration as it's theme.
45:59 --> 45:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
45:59 --> 46:00 [SPEAKER_00]: How do I handle this?
46:00 --> 46:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I have to talk about it with a way that's not going to like cause people to be upset.
46:04 --> 46:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
46:05 --> 46:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems like what you're suggesting by saying don't program it is I'm using max power.
46:10 --> 46:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Whereas you would say, well, I'm presenting the illusion of power, which I disagree with, but like, oh, well, how much choice do they really have?
46:17 --> 46:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Whereas just if I just cut it, well, then that's me describing them of ever having that opportunity to make that decision.
46:24 --> 46:28 [SPEAKER_00]: And I am exercising max power by saying, well, this song is literally homophobic.
46:28 --> 46:29 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm never programming it.
46:29 --> 46:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Fine, but like these marginal cases, like this song probably wouldn't do too much.
46:34 --> 46:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think because I don't feel like this is a marginal case and it's not just the end word for me.
46:38 --> 46:40 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a lot of hip-hop is the massage in the piece.
46:40 --> 46:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Like it just really makes me so uncomfortable.
46:44 --> 46:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we talk to Dre is controversial because he has a trouble in history with women.
46:50 --> 47:00 [SPEAKER_03]: And like said now we're, you know, and you can see it in the lyrics and we're like talking through these lyrics and analyzing them like poetry.
47:00 --> 47:06 [SPEAKER_03]: And I get all that, but it's just hard for me to like not have that running in the background.
47:06 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
47:07 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_03]: It's hard.
47:07 --> 47:09 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm getting distracted by it.
47:09 --> 47:11 [SPEAKER_03]: And I feel like that's taking away from the artistry of it.
47:11 --> 47:13 [SPEAKER_03]: It is like that piece for me.
47:14 --> 47:15 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's okay.
47:15 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Because that's why music's cool because you can have your own interpretation.
47:19 --> 47:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think this is an interesting thing that like this song, what did I say, it was a 25 top 25 single.
47:25 --> 47:26 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not for us though.
47:27 --> 47:29 [SPEAKER_03]: No, I'm like, I wouldn't let my kid listen to this.
47:30 --> 47:31 [SPEAKER_03]: And I let my kid listen to a lot.
47:31 --> 47:34 [SPEAKER_03]: I let my kid watch a lot, but I, it's the language.
47:34 --> 47:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Your kid is 12 years old.
47:36 --> 47:36 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
47:37 --> 47:40 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, and the kid is too young, probably to listen to.
47:40 --> 47:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, how old were you when the song came out?
47:42 --> 47:42 [SPEAKER_03]: 18, 16 maybe?
47:46 --> 47:46 [SPEAKER_00]: 17.
47:47 --> 47:48 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not the same as 12 years old.
47:48 --> 47:49 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it's not, but it's still pretty formative.
47:50 --> 47:52 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not the same as it's not the same.
47:52 --> 47:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I would say it's not even cool.
47:54 --> 47:59 [SPEAKER_00]: When I was like 13, I was still like sitting in the front seat in my dad's car and playing a song and a swear word goes and I go.
48:00 --> 48:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh-oh, and he's like, it's fine.
48:01 --> 48:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, oh, okay.
48:03 --> 48:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I just learned something.
48:04 --> 48:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I can play some, but I wasn't playing this with my friends, but this didn't exist when I was 12, right?
48:09 --> 48:10 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
48:11 --> 48:15 [SPEAKER_00]: But, but, but NWA existed when we were, uh, the chronic existed.
48:16 --> 48:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing but a G thing like actual high peak gangster rap was a thing when we were 10 or 11 years old, and you and I weren't buying those records.
48:23 --> 48:26 [SPEAKER_00]: But people we knew were, someone was for sure.
48:26 --> 48:27 [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't know.
48:27 --> 48:30 [SPEAKER_03]: It's just a lot, we're getting sidetracked, and I'm into it.
48:31 --> 48:31 [SPEAKER_03]: But,
48:32 --> 48:37 [SPEAKER_03]: I just am, I keep having like a reaction to something like this, I have a question for you.
48:37 --> 48:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there's still, we could table some, like, meaning like, I don't have to go through the whole song.
48:41 --> 48:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I've got, I've got the M&M verse and stuff like that.
48:43 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_00]: There's some cool more examples of this.
48:45 --> 48:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I've got other examples from other music.
48:47 --> 48:50 [SPEAKER_00]: We could do whatever you wanted to talk about, or you could say, screw it.
48:50 --> 48:52 [SPEAKER_00]: We just had the gun, the Nicole out of this conversation.
48:52 --> 48:54 [SPEAKER_06]: I feel like that's fine.
48:54 --> 48:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And do you want me?
48:56 --> 49:02 [SPEAKER_00]: to redo the audio samples and play the clean version on the actual podcast that goes out.
49:03 --> 49:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't have a problem with that.
49:04 --> 49:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to caveat that because I think that's a choice, but I'm willing to go with your choice on this.
49:10 --> 49:13 [SPEAKER_00]: If you and I, sorry, you and I collaborated on a concert, my ensemble did.
49:13 --> 49:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:14 --> 49:21 [SPEAKER_00]: If you had been like my classes involved with this and you have a song that's then we would have had that conversation and maybe not played that song, right?
49:21 --> 49:22 [SPEAKER_00]: That would have been an idea.
49:22 --> 49:23 [SPEAKER_03]: I kind of want you to.
49:24 --> 49:24 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's
49:26 --> 49:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Only because like, yeah, my, I know that kids aren't listening to this music, but maybe kids are listening to our podcast or may, you know, parents like the podcast is also marked as explicit.
49:38 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, but even though funny enough, it comes more from you.
49:42 --> 49:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, no, I know.
49:44 --> 49:45 [SPEAKER_03]: That's why this is really ironic.
49:45 --> 49:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so if you're just the N word, I'm like, very not okay with it.
49:49 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_00]: It's funny, because this song has so much less of a drag than a lot of hip-hop.
49:53 --> 49:58 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I know this song has, you stop me on the, if you all kind of stuff, right?
49:58 --> 50:02 [SPEAKER_00]: This song has like harsh, it's like a retaliatory distract, right?
50:02 --> 50:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's a lot of harsh language in it, but it's less and word and more and even less misogyny and more just like aggressive kind of negative vibe, right?
50:12 --> 50:15 [SPEAKER_00]: So interestingly, none of the internal rhyme or end rhymes are on any of these words.
50:16 --> 50:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Which is why it doesn't like add value or not.
50:18 --> 50:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that's why I'm offering that.
50:21 --> 50:24 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not undermining the premise.
50:24 --> 50:24 [SPEAKER_00]: The premise.
50:25 --> 50:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
50:25 --> 50:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I wouldn't chose if those words were the loaded words in the song that mattered to my thesis, I wouldn't have chosen this song.
50:35 --> 50:41 [SPEAKER_00]: But the funny thing is like, I made this comment, maybe with you, but maybe it was with another friend.
50:41 --> 50:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, part of me can't wait for my children to scandalize me with music.
50:46 --> 51:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, that sounds like noise or that is so runchy because I feel like coming of age in the 1990s, we heard everything there was to hear in terms of car sounding music, like death metal or whatever, and really harsh lyrics like gangster rap.
51:01 --> 51:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's interesting to me,
51:03 --> 51:14 [SPEAKER_00]: You're still scandalized, whereas to me, it's like in one ear at the other, I don't even really, like I'm not playing WOP for my kids, but like this just the use of language, it just kind of just goes through, I don't even notice it anymore.
51:14 --> 51:30 [SPEAKER_03]: See for me, I'm kind of thankful to be scandalized by the use of the end word in music because it is a reminder about the history attached to that and about how damaging that word can be and I don't ever want to be just sensitized to it.
51:33 --> 51:39 [SPEAKER_03]: when I hear that word because I should be unsettled when I hear that word because in my world, that is a evil word.
51:39 --> 51:43 [SPEAKER_00]: This is where I say this song isn't these lyrics more written for us.
51:43 --> 51:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, no, it's not my job to say Dr.
51:45 --> 51:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Duration, using the word.
51:46 --> 51:53 [SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, a middle-aged black man could maybe make that accusation a scholar of music, but like, I'm not, not my place to make that.
51:53 --> 51:54 [SPEAKER_03]: No, not at all.
51:54 --> 51:57 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that in this context.
51:58 --> 52:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, it is not prescribed the same way in might be throughout history, right?
52:03 --> 52:05 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's okay.
52:06 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's okay.
52:07 --> 52:14 [SPEAKER_03]: But I'm glad that every time it's like a white middle-aged woman, I hear that word, I get uncomfortable.
52:14 --> 52:16 [SPEAKER_03]: I should feel uncomfortable when I hear that word.
52:17 --> 52:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I want to.
52:18 --> 52:22 [SPEAKER_03]: It reminds me to like have empathy.
52:22 --> 52:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I think discomfort isn't the same
52:27 --> 52:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I am any time my students say even an f-bomber or shit or something in the song, I am uncomfortable.
52:33 --> 52:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I am their professor.
52:34 --> 52:37 [SPEAKER_00]: My dean is watching the provost of the college is sometimes letting.
52:37 --> 52:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I am uncomfortable.
52:39 --> 52:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Fine.
52:39 --> 52:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I can be uncomfortable.
52:40 --> 52:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It's okay for me to be uncomfortable if that's student is choosing to say that.
52:44 --> 52:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel secure with academic freedom that nobody's going to challenge my choice to allow that student.
52:50 --> 52:52 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the opposite if I re-dewarden.
52:53 --> 52:56 [SPEAKER_00]: allow the student or I forced the student or these things.
52:57 --> 53:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Me being uncomfortable, now no student is ever chosen to do the end word.
53:00 --> 53:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll say no student.
53:01 --> 53:03 [SPEAKER_00]: You're saying they feel pressured.
53:03 --> 53:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody thinks the white liberal professor is trying to get them to say the end word.
53:07 --> 53:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm giving them the option.
53:09 --> 53:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm if it's not a black student, I am just like, please, please, please, please, please, please don't.
53:14 --> 53:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Please don't.
53:15 --> 53:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Imagine having tenure.
53:17 --> 53:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, imagine.
53:18 --> 53:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, I'm sorry.
53:19 --> 53:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry.
53:19 --> 53:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Look at like trust academic freedom.
53:21 --> 53:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I've got a expression.
53:22 --> 53:28 [SPEAKER_00]: You are protected by academic freedom just the same as I am, but they could just not renew my contract right next year.
53:28 --> 53:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, but if you, I think I'm astrused on if there were if you could make a case and this is really hard to prove that it was because of what you I'm not and people always say that like or you could like bring it to court.
53:39 --> 53:41 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, I'm not going to bring it to court.
53:41 --> 53:42 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't have time for that.
53:42 --> 53:43 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just going to get a job.
53:50 --> 53:51 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you.
54:03 --> 54:05 [SPEAKER_03]: It's like I'm not gonna lit a gate.
54:05 --> 54:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna listen to that section one more time because this is what you set you off So there is an end word in that line
54:25 --> 54:33 [SPEAKER_00]: There is no massaging in that line, so you were saying you were getting set off by that, but this song doesn't really mean it was the blow me in a really good sense of tone.
54:33 --> 54:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I think blow me could be construed as homophobic.
54:36 --> 54:59 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if you're a woman and you have a giant guy screwing blow me at you like well he's screaming at it shug night though and let but like I'm listening to it right yeah you are so that's how that was my reaction yeah I mean it was just interesting to me that that was the line that said you off because there was there were actually mentions of some things that was like doubling for a while to me that's it didn't just say set me off I think that's like a
55:01 --> 55:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Can we get to the really pleasant and non-controversial M&M?
55:14 --> 55:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Not really internal rhyme there, right?
55:16 --> 55:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Nowadays, some of the Nesay kinda and lips gibberish, yes, but for the most part, it's more just straightforward rhymes.
55:24 --> 55:30 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got the say rhymes and the gibberish lines, A's and B's, and then forgot about Jray and it's back on.
55:31 --> 55:38 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, nowadays, nowadays, something to say, and that's kind of, but, but it's, but it's less intense.
55:38 --> 55:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
55:38 --> 55:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
55:39 --> 55:43 [SPEAKER_00]: And there's an F bomb, but I mean, Eminem's not dropping in words in this song.
55:43 --> 55:43 [SPEAKER_03]: No.
55:43 --> 55:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Eminem probably does another song.
55:45 --> 55:46 [SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know.
55:46 --> 55:48 [SPEAKER_03]: I, I'd, I'd wonder.
55:49 --> 55:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, but M&M is there's a lot of not good stuff.
55:52 --> 55:53 [SPEAKER_03]: No, I don't know what that chromosome stuff is.
55:54 --> 55:55 [SPEAKER_03]: I think he knows that there's a line there.
55:55 --> 55:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I don't know, actually.
55:56 --> 56:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, M&M's, uh, well enough to know if he's and, and wording, probably not though.
56:01 --> 56:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Probably not.
56:02 --> 56:07 [SPEAKER_03]: No, he's probably got his butt kicked a bunch of times and Detroit for and wording is my guess.
56:07 --> 56:08 [SPEAKER_00]: So, here's his verse.
56:09 --> 56:11 [SPEAKER_00]: This is interesting because we have a lot of fast rhymes.
56:11 --> 56:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So like we could kind of almost.
56:14 --> 56:17 [SPEAKER_00]: compress the the phrase to like one bar each, but I don't know.
56:17 --> 56:20 [SPEAKER_00]: It's sort of maybe an accelerated phrase structure.
56:20 --> 56:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe doesn't matter.
56:21 --> 56:25 [SPEAKER_00]: But in any case, there still is some internal rhyme.
56:25 --> 56:28 [SPEAKER_00]: We got somebody you hate, chill with your way, bloody your way and W.A.
56:29 --> 56:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Nice reference there.
56:38 --> 56:44 [SPEAKER_04]: One day I was walking by with a walk in a one When I called a guy give me a no but I The mom in the parking lot But it's broken up I don't give a girl If it's broken up I'm haunted in me Trying to walk a dot Any comments?
56:44 --> 56:44 [SPEAKER_04]: Thoughts?
56:44 --> 56:46 [SPEAKER_04]: No, I'm here what you're saying Anything disturbing in this one?
56:46 --> 57:00 [SPEAKER_03]: No We're gonna derail now I'm sure, okay Except the Walkman The Walkman by with a Walkman on Nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice,
57:01 --> 57:04 [SPEAKER_00]: The accelerated pace to the rap, it's almost like kind of like an answer.
57:04 --> 57:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so you've got all this internal rhyme in the first verse.
57:06 --> 57:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to just do you double and just speed everything up.
57:09 --> 57:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not right.
57:10 --> 57:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to skip a few lines where there isn't as much of it.
57:12 --> 57:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So just highlighting the parts that do.
57:14 --> 57:19 [SPEAKER_00]: This part is cool because we have some actual, it's not just an accelerated pace, but some real internal rhyme.
57:20 --> 57:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Canful gas, handful of matches, windows up, temp goes up, some cool stuff here.
57:24 --> 57:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Groups of words as our rhyme, just like with Draise verse instead of just a single sound.
57:31 --> 57:56 [SPEAKER_04]: Next to a breakdown house, but it can't for the gas and a head for the mat Let's do one for now now, right here So I'm here all now, it's the chronic Zoom Storn the day, it's the malls and new I don't still welcome enough, it's trying to do that, but it's dropped in tune I think I think it's the same Sadie Hot of the instead of twin babies And I'm a Sadie spends with the windows on When the temp goes up to the mid 80s Call it mid 80s, sorry doc, but I've been crazy It's the way you two can save me It's okay, go with him, Sadie
57:58 --> 58:03 [SPEAKER_03]: It's so Eminem, the colon response he does with himself and I love that.
58:03 --> 58:05 [SPEAKER_03]: I just think it's iconic.
58:05 --> 58:07 [SPEAKER_00]: He's his own height man sometimes.
58:07 --> 58:08 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think it's great.
58:08 --> 58:10 [SPEAKER_03]: It adds so much texture.
58:10 --> 58:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
58:11 --> 58:14 [SPEAKER_03]: And just he's Dr. Dre's a good lyricist.
58:14 --> 58:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Eminem's a great lyricist.
58:16 --> 58:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Like it's wild.
58:17 --> 58:18 [SPEAKER_03]: The stuff he comes up with.
58:19 --> 58:20 [SPEAKER_00]: He's just extremely clever.
58:21 --> 58:24 [SPEAKER_00]: He's got like a wittiness to his style also.
58:24 --> 58:25 [SPEAKER_03]: He's so great.
58:26 --> 58:28 [SPEAKER_00]: We can look at the third verse, but I think we're not.
58:29 --> 58:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it's moving on.
58:29 --> 58:30 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't need to look.
58:30 --> 58:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's more the same.
58:31 --> 58:33 [SPEAKER_00]: The coolest line at the end though.
58:33 --> 58:36 [SPEAKER_00]: The coolest internal rhyme is the fuck rap you're gonna have it back.
58:36 --> 58:37 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a good internal one.
58:37 --> 58:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna have to say.
58:38 --> 58:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Little harsh.
58:39 --> 58:40 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a good internal run.
58:40 --> 58:44 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the one that stuck out when I heard the song went, maybe we should talk about internal runs.
58:44 --> 58:47 [SPEAKER_00]: And then I went back and went, holy crap, it's all over the place in this song.
58:47 --> 58:47 [SPEAKER_00]: But we'll move on.
58:47 --> 58:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like you've had a lot of Dr. Dre trying to keep your blood pressure low.
58:51 --> 58:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Honestly, it's just, I get, it's not even like I get amped up or like it's just, I kind of shut down.
58:59 --> 59:00 [SPEAKER_03]: It's too much for me.
59:00 --> 59:02 [SPEAKER_03]: I just like turn off because it's
59:03 --> 59:03 [SPEAKER_03]: I get it.
59:03 --> 59:12 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's just not my favorite sound music even though I can appreciate the artistry of it and I absolutely do and I appreciate the cultural relevance of it for sure.
59:13 --> 59:22 [SPEAKER_03]: And the misogyny and language in the type of music is it doesn't draw me to it like I'm not going to listen to that piece.
59:22 --> 59:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think you'd made that point yet.
59:24 --> 59:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think we knew that you didn't like the misogyny.
59:26 --> 59:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just kidding.
59:27 --> 59:28 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't.
59:28 --> 59:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
59:28 --> 59:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I'm just going to realize.
59:30 --> 59:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I get it.
59:31 --> 59:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And I've been in bands throughout the years.
59:35 --> 59:39 [SPEAKER_00]: written all sorts of, I don't think I've written a single lyric with a swear word in it.
59:39 --> 59:43 [SPEAKER_00]: A swear word to say nothing of misogyny and whom it's like nothing.
59:43 --> 59:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I just make that choice myself to go, well, I'm not going to...
59:48 --> 01:00:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, because it's not part of your, for an act, you know what it is, yeah, I swear sometimes not all the time, but it's not like I just don't when I write songs, you know, swear in the classroom, like in lecture, I will, this is controversial actually people to agree, I will feel like get really upset about that question, I will like for comedic emphasis sometimes me too.
01:00:11 --> 01:00:16 [SPEAKER_00]: late in the semester usually, or if it's a group of students I know earlier, I really don't.
01:00:16 --> 01:00:22 [SPEAKER_00]: If I'm ever frustrated with the students, which I try to not be anymore because it's like, I, that's just the pet.
01:00:22 --> 01:00:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Why are you so late?
01:00:23 --> 01:00:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't ever had an angry.
01:00:24 --> 01:00:28 [SPEAKER_00]: If I ever do, it's like, I'm trying to think of an example, but
01:00:29 --> 01:00:31 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe it and it's usually a lighter one.
01:00:31 --> 01:00:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's usually not an F bomb.
01:00:32 --> 01:00:36 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I'll never say F. It's a shit or an ass or something like that.
01:00:37 --> 01:00:49 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's kind of it like not I do if I'm in the middle of a lecture and everyone's even though I'm dynamic in the classroom don't get mixed up if people are like sleeping or something over like
01:00:50 --> 01:00:54 [SPEAKER_03]: If I teach it to a clock in the afternoon class and like everyone's had lunch, they're fading.
01:00:54 --> 01:00:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:00:54 --> 01:01:00 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's a two hour long lecture about like PSJA or something, not super super interesting.
01:01:00 --> 01:01:04 [SPEAKER_03]: I'll throw in a little bit off-color language to wake up.
01:01:05 --> 01:01:09 [SPEAKER_03]: or tell them like a story that's like a really gossipy story about P.U.J.
01:01:10 --> 01:01:17 [SPEAKER_03]: or like make-in off-color comment about how he looks so junky with his little monocle on the picture and like he's so cute, you know?
01:01:17 --> 01:01:22 [SPEAKER_03]: I like I'll do stuff like that just to keep them listening but teachers get like
01:01:23 --> 01:01:26 [SPEAKER_03]: Like some people like no, I'll never how dare you.
01:01:26 --> 01:01:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's worth what's weird about it as I think that I've been surprised in the colleagues and even bosses I've had, how frequent it is that somebody has their opinion on that, but also just cannot understand why anybody wouldn't have their opinion.
01:01:41 --> 01:01:57 [SPEAKER_00]: like I've had like folks that are like I can't believe anybody would swear and then there's people like what's wrong with you that's how the students talk you should swear to like there's a lot of people who don't have nuance to it where as I'm kind of like whatever like I'm I'm not going to be a curtain about it, but it's I'm not
01:01:58 --> 01:02:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I've heard of people like swearing at their students, like that's not good.
01:02:02 --> 01:02:05 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it's what you said, like you're trying not to do it out of anger.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:08 [SPEAKER_03]: It's like, what circumstance would you get so angry?
01:02:08 --> 01:02:10 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you, I don't get angry at students.
01:02:10 --> 01:02:11 [SPEAKER_03]: They come in late.
01:02:11 --> 01:02:11 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't care.
01:02:12 --> 01:02:14 [SPEAKER_03]: They don't do it on ensemble.
01:02:14 --> 01:02:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I am a guest not, yeah.
01:02:16 --> 01:02:20 [SPEAKER_00]: When I say anger, it's like anger is relative to me.
01:02:20 --> 01:02:22 [SPEAKER_00]: We know that like my, I have a capacity for anger.
01:02:22 --> 01:02:22 [SPEAKER_00]: No, it's like,
01:02:23 --> 01:02:30 [SPEAKER_00]: You can't show up after we're done spending 30 minutes setting up the equipment every single day and expect to do this concert.
01:02:30 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're not here on time for that next day, you will not perform in this concert because you can't disrespect this on.
01:02:35 --> 01:02:36 [SPEAKER_00]: That's always the ensemble.
01:02:36 --> 01:02:41 [SPEAKER_00]: But, and so there's a version of reality in which I could swear in that in exchange.
01:02:41 --> 01:02:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not yelling at the student, but I'm like, I'm pretty frustrated with them.
01:02:44 --> 01:02:51 [SPEAKER_00]: You cannot show up 30 minutes late and leave 50 minutes early just conveniently for all the setup and breakdown times and expect everything to go well.
01:02:53 --> 01:03:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And so there's a version of a person that would use colorful language in that, and I would not, right?
01:03:00 --> 01:03:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, for shock value.
01:03:02 --> 01:03:10 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a comedic shock value for me like shock value, or like to live in up the room, or like if people are sleeping, or you know, I need to like dial the back in.
01:03:11 --> 01:03:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I give a few examples of internal line in different degrees?
01:03:14 --> 01:03:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's do it.
01:03:14 --> 01:03:17 [SPEAKER_00]: This is, and maybe I have to find the clean version here.
01:03:17 --> 01:03:19 [SPEAKER_00]: We're starting with Dre, some hip-hop.
01:03:19 --> 01:03:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing but a G thing.
01:03:20 --> 01:03:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Once again, but this time, Dre's verse.
01:03:23 --> 01:03:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Not as much as in in this song, but we definitely have some internal line.
01:03:38 --> 01:03:53 [SPEAKER_02]: you see, got you never been on a ride like this for fun put it with me so who can wrap it in trouble, the mice broke at the same time with the dope rhyme that I kick, you know and I know I'm full so I won't walk in here, to have to my collection, to selection, to molasses, don't take a
01:03:58 --> 01:04:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so we've got sit back relax and strap at the same time with the dope rhyme You know when I know I flow Don't take a talk, but don't choke Elections election.
01:04:09 --> 01:04:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, I missed that one.
01:04:10 --> 01:04:21 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, a lot of it in that section Snoop Dogg's not as much his verse and that song totally does This is never mind the musical alumnus Kendrick Lamar the recipe
01:04:21 --> 01:04:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Did not just play Kendrick Lamar when we did any way you want it, I think I played these walls, right?
01:04:25 --> 01:04:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this is the recipe from 2012, which happens to also have Dr. Dre, though we won't hear that part.
01:04:31 --> 01:04:32 [SPEAKER_00]: This has a lot of it.
01:04:57 --> 01:05:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I like the Jason Voorhees boy he's and other stuff in the middle you didn't want to hear.
01:05:01 --> 01:05:01 [SPEAKER_03]: No.
01:05:01 --> 01:05:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I could just edit out that part but then they don't get to hear the Jason Voorhees boy he's Yikes.
01:05:06 --> 01:05:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:05:07 --> 01:05:09 [SPEAKER_00]: One more hip hop and then I've got a couple pop stuff.
01:05:10 --> 01:05:15 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is Figaro by Mad villain, which is a collaboration between MF Doom and Madlip.
01:05:15 --> 01:05:15 [SPEAKER_00]: This is 20.
01:05:17 --> 01:05:27 [SPEAKER_11]: Not enough tracks, not enough black ones, too hot to handle You got blue sandals, who shot you, who got you No spots to vandal, do not stay still, both shows
01:05:36 --> 01:05:42 [SPEAKER_00]: That's like every eighth note basically as a different internal rhyme kind of nuts I'm pretty shameric and rapper.
01:05:42 --> 01:05:43 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm F Doom and F Doom.
01:05:44 --> 01:05:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he is a lot of costuming involved in his vibe Yeah, mask mask stuff very good.
01:05:48 --> 01:05:49 [SPEAKER_03]: I like him.
01:05:49 --> 01:05:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I listen to good.
01:05:50 --> 01:05:58 [SPEAKER_03]: I like because it's like a little bit More like more alternative and like a low-fi kind of like yeah, you know, I just think that sounds right.
01:05:58 --> 01:05:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah
01:06:00 --> 01:06:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, uptown funk, Mark Ronson with Bruno Mars, 2014.
01:06:22 --> 01:06:30 [SPEAKER_03]: So that's great because each line has like an internal rhyme scheme, but also their end rhyme is the same for each line.
01:06:30 --> 01:06:31 [SPEAKER_00]: But different from the internal.
01:06:31 --> 01:06:32 [SPEAKER_03]: But different from the end.
01:06:32 --> 01:06:33 [SPEAKER_03]: That's very cool.
01:06:33 --> 01:06:33 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
01:06:33 --> 01:06:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So we've got like silent while in, living up in the city, and then Chuck's on St. Laurent.
01:06:38 --> 01:06:38 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm so excited.
01:06:38 --> 01:06:39 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm so excited.
01:06:39 --> 01:06:39 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm so excited.
01:06:41 --> 01:06:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It was cool that the internal rhymes matches little pairs, but they don't relate to the end right.
01:06:45 --> 01:06:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I like that.
01:06:47 --> 01:06:47 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
01:06:47 --> 01:06:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Last example, this is one week by Bare naked ladies, 1998, which is actually crazy.
01:06:54 --> 01:06:58 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think again, the, I think again, the end rhymes are separate from the internal rhymes.
01:06:59 --> 01:07:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I hope you didn't want much of a hood wink Since I make you stop think You think you're looking at acumen I summon fish to the dish although I like the shell issues I like the sushi cousins I'm addicted to frying pan I like the soapy when I bust rhymes Beglaidly and rhymes Because I'm all about value Birding campers got the man hits You try to match with You try to hold me by the bus through You're gonna make a break and take a think I like a sink and they can check out like vanilla It's the finest of the flavors You're gonna see the showcase and you'll know the further go It's gonna go because it's a dangerous You're life's not a waiver
01:07:24 --> 01:07:32 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's wild, too, because for the same reason Bruno Mars, because there's so much internal rhyming in the lines, but then it's like the end of every other line rhymes, too.
01:07:33 --> 01:07:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:07:33 --> 01:07:34 [SPEAKER_03]: Very complex.
01:07:35 --> 01:07:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
01:07:35 --> 01:07:39 [SPEAKER_00]: That has a rhyme scheme to the end rhymes, and then also separate.
01:07:39 --> 01:07:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:07:40 --> 01:07:42 [SPEAKER_03]: No use to the end word, though, disappointing.
01:07:42 --> 01:07:45 [SPEAKER_00]: No, you don't think a Canadian alternative rock band would thrive.
01:07:46 --> 01:07:46 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
01:07:47 --> 01:07:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't think that's the effing point.
01:07:50 --> 01:07:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's their point.
01:07:51 --> 01:07:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:07:52 --> 01:07:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So point of all of this.
01:07:54 --> 01:07:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I didn't even talk about the memory palace or the method of Loki.
01:08:00 --> 01:08:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we've gone, and I think it's fine.
01:08:02 --> 01:08:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we've gone 80 minutes on this episode.
01:08:04 --> 01:08:08 [SPEAKER_03]: That's a lot where I think we need to move on, but I'll, they know what the great news is.
01:08:08 --> 01:08:10 [SPEAKER_03]: I can just save that for something else.
01:08:10 --> 01:08:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Any song that's about memory or maybe even more so than this?
01:08:14 --> 01:08:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think also, because this was internal, it wasn't rhyme scheme anyways.
01:08:19 --> 01:08:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So if that's about patterns that help you remember, I feel like there's going to be a, well, I mean, I have a way to connect it.
01:08:27 --> 01:08:29 [SPEAKER_00]: This is definitely an episode that I think folks should write in.
01:08:30 --> 01:08:30 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
01:08:30 --> 01:08:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Let us know what you think.
01:08:31 --> 01:08:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Try not to use words in your email.
01:08:34 --> 01:08:38 [SPEAKER_00]: That will make us have to read them out loud or whatever.
01:08:38 --> 01:08:39 [SPEAKER_00]: But like, well, we have free will.
01:08:39 --> 01:08:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So we just wouldn't.
01:08:40 --> 01:08:40 [SPEAKER_00]: We could just not.
01:08:40 --> 01:08:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But like, tell us what you think.
01:08:42 --> 01:08:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Because I think we do we do see this differently.
01:08:45 --> 01:08:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's been in it really interesting conversation.
01:08:48 --> 01:08:52 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think like it's important in port as Mark says it's important.
01:08:53 --> 01:09:14 [SPEAKER_03]: to have a set of important important important important yes it's really relevant to have these conversations and to talk about it and not center ourselves and so it's impossible with the two of us not to center ourselves because we're the only one talking so let us know what you think if you have a more nuanced perspective but from where I sit
01:09:15 --> 01:09:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Certain things are kind of off limits and yeah, this is one of them Certain things are off limits for me too.
01:09:21 --> 01:09:22 [SPEAKER_00]: It's that have a very different line.
01:09:23 --> 01:09:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, maybe Never mind the music is hosted by Nicole Baxter and hosted and produced by Mark Poppinney You can email us at never music audit email.com and give us a follow on social media
01:09:47 --> 01:09:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Never mind the music is also part of the Laura Hound's network.
01:09:50 --> 01:09:52 [SPEAKER_03]: Please join the conversation on their Discord server.
01:09:54 --> 01:09:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Thanks for listening.