Dune ep 1 – The creation of Dune (update + replay)
Wool-Shift-Dust does DuneJune 30, 2025
53
01:04:1158.77 MB

Dune ep 1 – The creation of Dune (update + replay)

After a brand new intro with updated information about the plans for the Dune adaptation series, revisit Elysia and Luke's 2022 episode looking at the life and career of Frank Herbert, and how that led him to create the world of Dune. The backdrop to set the stage for next week's introduction to the original novel's first 10 chapters and overall world-building.

(Note: After next week, episodes will follow every two weeks in the public feed. More often for Book Club members. Book Club members who joined since the final Silo episode will be shouted out in next week's episode.)


Coming up in this series...

Dune, the novel, in 4 parts

• Ranking the novel's most iconic scenes

• Jodorowsky's Dune

Dune 1984

• The Dune games

• Syfy's Dune

Villeneuve's Dune trilogy

Dune: Messiah


Get in touch

Email us: WoolShiftDustPodcast@gmail.com

Find us on Bluesky: @elysiacb & @lukemiddup

Or on the Lorehounds Discord: https://discord.gg/gM5VhTea2T


Find us also on the podcasts... 

The Lorehounds (Elysia)

The Star Wars Canon Timeline Podcast (Elysia)

It Could Be Said (Luke)


Produced by Elysia Brenner

Published by The Lorehounds

Explore the Lorehounds network for more book / film / TV / game / music podcasts


Intro & outro music: "Magnetic Universe" by Adrian Earnshaw & Benedict Roff-Marsh

Additional SFX from Freesound.org



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Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

00:00 --> 00:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Hello, and welcome to Woolshift Dust, or should I say worms, spice, dune?
00:06 --> 00:07 [SPEAKER_00]: True story.
00:07 --> 00:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I actually considered for ten seconds changing the name to that one.
00:10 --> 00:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I was first putting together the initial plan for this series, so I got a few things wrong with the whole first plan.
00:17 --> 00:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm glad I didn't go that direction, but also the fact that I thought I could cover the entire book in a single episode, including community rankings was adorable.
00:27 --> 00:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And just wrapping my head around the right format to strike the balance between depth and detail.
00:35 --> 00:38 [SPEAKER_00]: And also just making this a fun and accessible series.
00:38 --> 00:47 [SPEAKER_00]: It's one of the reasons why I took me along to finally kick this thing off that and you know, health and hearing loss and other losses and work and all the other obstacles that got in the way.
00:48 --> 01:04 [SPEAKER_00]: But there's no time like the present, and since it's been a while since this plan was hatched, I thought it would be a good idea to re-release this episode from twenty-twenty-two where Luke and I discussed Frank Herbert, the author of Doom, and the origin of the book and ideas it was based on.
01:04 --> 01:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure many of you haven't listened to it yet, and those of you who have have mostly forgotten it by now.
01:10 --> 01:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So if this seemed like a good place to start revisiting this, as far as how the series will go, so we'll get re-acquainted with the background info today.
01:20 --> 01:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you're listening, as this is released, then one week from now, you'll get the breakdown of part one A of the book, Dune.
01:28 --> 01:32 [SPEAKER_00]: The first ten chapters through the Hunter Seeker incident and the immediate aftermath.
01:33 --> 01:36 [SPEAKER_00]: After that, episodes will be released every two weeks.
01:36 --> 01:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And next up, we'll be Dune, the novel part one B, and that will be the rest of the first section of the book, which is conveniently
01:46 --> 01:50 [SPEAKER_00]: The book is divided into three parts which are confusingly called books.
01:51 --> 01:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And the first book within the book is confusingly called Dune.
01:55 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll be finishing that up after one A comes one B. And then we'll do the entire second book or section of the novel.
02:04 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_00]: That's called melodib.
02:05 --> 02:12 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be the episode after that followed by an episode dedicated to the third and final section or book of the original novel, The Profit.
02:13 --> 02:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We will wrap up the book talk finally with a separate episode ranking.
02:17 --> 02:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Everyone's most memorable scenes.
02:19 --> 02:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I've been collecting dozens of submissions so far, but I would love more.
02:24 --> 02:33 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you're interested, please send your top three scenes from the original Doom novel to woolshiftdustpodcast.gmail.com.
02:33 --> 02:36 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll hear me ask for that again in this episode that follows.
02:36 --> 02:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And you'll also find that email address linked in the show notes, of course.
02:40 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_00]: with the book thoroughly discussed after those five episodes.
02:44 --> 02:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And all the key characters and plot points in lore is laid out.
02:49 --> 02:55 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to turn our attention to the thankless task of trying to adapt this sci-fi magnum opus.
02:55 --> 03:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll have episodes dedicated to Hodorowski's infamous attempted adaptation, the Lynch movie that the director disowned from
03:05 --> 03:12 [SPEAKER_00]: the games from the nineties, the sci-fi series from the nauties, through to the Villeneuve movies and a look at the games today.
03:13 --> 03:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Once we've caught up on the twenty twenty four film, Dune Part II, we'll turn our attention to the second book in the original series, Dune Messiah, which will be the basis of the third and final movie in Villeneuve's trilogy.
03:27 --> 03:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And this coverage in the public feed that's starting today is not to be confused with the extra-dune book club episodes.
03:35 --> 03:42 [SPEAKER_00]: In the Dune book club on Supercast and Patreon, we are jumping all the way back to the beginning of the timeline, ten thousand years before the original book.
03:43 --> 03:53 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to start with dives into the stories of the Butlary and Gihad, aka the Machine Wars, the events that made the universe the unique place it is in Frank Herbert's novels.
03:54 --> 04:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And later today, book club members will get the first episode in that series, which is a look at the short story hunting Harkinins by Brian Herbert and Kevin J. Anderson, the earliest story in the Duneverse timeline.
04:10 --> 04:15 [SPEAKER_00]: And in that episode, I'll walk listeners through how the coverage will unfold for that series from there.
04:16 --> 04:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And after a few episodes have been released, I'll offer a season pass similar to the silo season passes, but this one, just for the ancient Dune book and story breakdowns, monthly subscribers, though, of course, will get access to all of these episodes, plus all the prior silo holiday episodes, et cetera, as always.
04:36 --> 04:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Not to mention the other series that we're beginning now, which is looking at each of you how is other stories.
04:43 --> 04:53 [SPEAKER_00]: In addition to the silo short stories, which we're already covered in the silo book club, we're going to be going through the rest of the machine learning collection of short stories one at a time.
04:53 --> 04:57 [SPEAKER_00]: And these are going to be shorter episodes first recapping the story and then discussing it.
04:57 --> 05:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And these will be released between the Dune episodes.
05:02 --> 05:07 [SPEAKER_00]: But again, more explanation for those of you who will be listening to that series in the Supercast and Patreon feeds.
05:08 --> 05:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Today, we're looking back into the past of our own real-world timeline, looking at the life and career of Frank Herbert's everything leading up to the publishing of the complete original novel in nineteen sixty five and how his life played out from there.
05:23 --> 05:26 [SPEAKER_00]: This episode you're about to hear is also a blast from this podcast past.
05:27 --> 05:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Because again, it was published in twenty twenty two.
05:29 --> 05:32 [SPEAKER_00]: So ignore the mention of anything dated.
05:32 --> 05:42 [SPEAKER_00]: We are of course now between silos seasons two and three rather than one and two, for example, but the information that we discuss about Frank Herbert is timeless.
05:43 --> 05:50 [SPEAKER_00]: And a small note, I've just now started reading Frank Herbert's biography, Dreamer of Dune by his son Brian Herbert.
05:50 --> 05:57 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'll bring up any interesting points I come across in that book to add to this discussion as we go through the series after this.
05:58 --> 06:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Just a few more corrections and caveats I want to lay out in advance before you listen to this.
06:04 --> 06:11 [SPEAKER_00]: This is, I've definitely refined my editing technique since I published this, so it is, it's edited a little fast, a little too tight.
06:12 --> 06:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, I make reference to one book episode.
06:17 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be in five parts as I just laid out before this.
06:21 --> 06:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Part one next week, and then, and then the next episode, every two weeks after that.
06:28 --> 06:36 [SPEAKER_00]: My prediction in this episode that Dune Part II wouldn't be delayed and the release did not age well, but thankfully it's long been out now.
06:37 --> 06:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And also, I mention a thing about top three questions.
06:40 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think there's going to be much time for that, although I want to hear your questions in general as we go through.
06:45 --> 06:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And as I said, your top three scenes as I lay out in this episode, your top three most memorable, most iconic scenes from the original book.
06:55 --> 07:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Another quick correction is that Luke and I are no longer on Twitter anymore.
07:00 --> 07:02 [SPEAKER_00]: We are now both on blue sky.
07:02 --> 07:05 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll find the links to our profiles there in the show notes.
07:06 --> 07:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And I have since this Red V for Fendetta and it's I found it a very good troubling in in the ways it was intended to be troubling very memorable book that I have thought about a lot since then.
07:22 --> 07:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Actually, you got a chance to discuss it and the movie adaptation with the Laura Hounds on a Laura Hound's Eleven Zs episode, which is a movie club that's in the Laura Hound subscriber feed.
07:32 --> 07:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, the references to Secret Invasion also maybe didn't age that well, we were being much kinder back then about it.
07:40 --> 07:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I think by the final episode, we just kind of fully gave up on that show.
07:45 --> 07:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I think that's it.
07:47 --> 07:52 [SPEAKER_00]: That brings us back up to twenty twenty five, but enjoy this dip into the past.
07:53 --> 07:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And book club members, I'll see you again later.
07:55 --> 08:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Everyone else, after this Luke and I will be back in a week with special guest David to talk about the first ten chapters of Dune, the original novel.
08:04 --> 08:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Just remember, a journalist will do absolutely anything to avoid finishing their assignments, even penning an epic novel that opens the global concept of science fiction.
08:15 --> 08:17 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're not yet sure what I'm talking about, be listening.
08:48 --> 08:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Hello, Walshift Dustyans.
08:49 --> 08:54 [SPEAKER_00]: We are back to keep your ears entertained and your minds engaged between silo seasons.
08:55 --> 09:02 [SPEAKER_00]: From sting to often butler and everything before between and beyond, Walshift Dust is doing doom for our season two.
09:03 --> 09:06 [SPEAKER_00]: There will be no spoilers of any kind during this intro episode.
09:07 --> 09:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And we'll get into exactly what the rest of the season is going to look like in just a moment.
09:12 --> 09:14 [SPEAKER_00]: But first, Luke, we're back already.
09:15 --> 09:17 [SPEAKER_00]: How have the London Archives been treating you?
09:18 --> 09:19 [SPEAKER_01]: They've been treating me well actually.
09:19 --> 09:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I've been doing a bit of mental outing down in London.
09:24 --> 09:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, we're not going to get into the book just yet.
09:27 --> 09:28 [SPEAKER_00]: That will be our next episode.
09:29 --> 09:31 [SPEAKER_00]: But I know that you've been rereading.
09:31 --> 09:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Last you updated me, you were at the part where the twenty twenty one film ended.
09:36 --> 09:38 [SPEAKER_00]: How's the rest of the reread going?
09:38 --> 09:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I actually finished it over the weekend.
09:41 --> 09:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, because I'm sure you've had the same experience when you start, do you?
09:45 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And you have to finish it.
09:46 --> 09:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
09:47 --> 09:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not a thing you can go and put down and come back to it.
09:50 --> 09:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Kinda has that quality.
09:52 --> 09:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The ones you start.
09:53 --> 09:54 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to finish.
09:54 --> 09:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And almost read itself.
09:55 --> 09:56 [SPEAKER_01]: It does.
09:56 --> 09:57 [SPEAKER_01]: It does.
09:58 --> 10:01 [SPEAKER_00]: And okay, so this read, who is your least favorite character?
10:01 --> 10:01 [SPEAKER_00]: No spoilers.
10:07 --> 10:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah.
10:08 --> 10:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, big, truly evil, mustache twirling guy.
10:12 --> 10:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah, like her, but goes out of his way to describe him in like physically grotesque terms.
10:18 --> 10:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, because that's one of the most interesting, like, differences they've been making in most of the adaptations is they have because he has these suspenders that help hold him up because of his massive weight.
10:32 --> 10:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, but then the adaptations have him like flying around like a maniac.
10:37 --> 10:38 [SPEAKER_00]: What if the worst one is like not?
10:39 --> 10:44 [SPEAKER_01]: The David Lynch one we're like, I was kind of like, oh, but acne thing going on.
10:44 --> 10:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, oh, yeah.
10:45 --> 10:48 [SPEAKER_01]: It's which isn't anywhere in the book.
10:49 --> 10:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, David Lynch was like, how could I make this weirder and grosser?
10:52 --> 10:53 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
10:54 --> 11:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, yeah, so yeah, I was on the one hand, I would want to say Baron Hawke honen, but he's also he's like so deliciously evil like
11:02 --> 11:09 [SPEAKER_00]: He's just one of the most loathable characters in all of literature that I almost want to say someone else.
11:09 --> 11:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And then, I don't know, it falls on the Reverend Mother, I guess, because she's just such a part in me, Kant, that I just, yeah, she just stands in everyone.
11:19 --> 11:19 [SPEAKER_00]: She's so annoying.
11:21 --> 11:44 [SPEAKER_01]: So you say I've been reading it I actually I kind of have and kind of have and I've been I have read a physical copy of Q and many years ago But yeah because of the nature of what I do for a job I really don't like I read a lot for work So I don't really I'm not really motivated to read outside of that so I listen to a lot of audio books
11:44 --> 11:49 [SPEAKER_00]: No, yeah, to be clear, when I say reading, I always include audiobooks in that definition.
11:49 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
11:50 --> 11:51 [SPEAKER_00]: You're consuming the book.
11:51 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Because I mean, think about, for instance, visually impaired readers and just people for whatever reason, dyslexia who knows, thousand different reasons you might want to read the audiobook.
12:04 --> 12:33 [SPEAKER_01]: The version I've got is somewhere between the book and a performance of it because the way the audio book is structured they have different voice actors, read from different characters point of view and they also like have a set of voice actors like the omnipresent narrator where it's no particular character it's not being read from a particular character's point of view and there is music and sound effects so it is the book it's the full text
12:34 --> 12:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's also a bit of an audio play performance and just a straight reading of it.
12:39 --> 12:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, I mean, I think that's that's awesome.
12:42 --> 12:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And I love how like the audio options have gotten so much better in recent years.
12:48 --> 12:58 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the DJ's ex gone from, you know, my friend was telling me that back in the day, a lot of the books weren't even the complete books, like it would be like, doon or bridged, which come on.
12:58 --> 13:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, who wants to listen to an abrenched version of anything?
13:01 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, exactly.
13:04 --> 13:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.
13:04 --> 13:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, I don't know who the better Jeserid are moving on.
13:11 --> 13:13 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, no, I'm so glad that that's gotten better.
13:13 --> 13:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's also, it's nice that you bring in that perspective of having had the audio experience where I do tend to cling to the word on paper or word on that.
13:25 --> 13:35 [SPEAKER_00]: In this case, for this, I'm rereading it digitally so that I can do like the searching and the highlighting and all that stuff to make time.
13:35 --> 13:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Because I'm not so right in my actual books.
13:38 --> 13:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that remind you reading the OC Bible then?
13:40 --> 13:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I think one of my favorite bits of the book is when they're describing the tiny like a holographic OC Bible.
13:50 --> 13:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, because this is, I was going to say this later, but I wasn't setting up.
13:54 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Do not keep eyes of very special niche in my sort of exposure to fantasy and sci-fi, because I have no visual imagination.
14:04 --> 14:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I have a very limited visual imagination.
14:07 --> 14:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So normally,
14:09 --> 14:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I will watch the movie or the TV series first if it's a book because if you're telling me it says massive futuristic city you know floating in the clouds of thirty thousand things I can't picture that I need somebody else to show it to me or I don't get the effect right doing is one of the very rare books where her but description is so evocative that I actually can picture it in my head
14:36 --> 14:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
14:36 --> 14:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's also one of the few bits of media I've read before I've seen any, any adaptation of it.
14:42 --> 14:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I've read it.
14:43 --> 14:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
14:43 --> 14:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I read it for the first time when I was fifteen, which I think is the ideal age to read.
14:50 --> 14:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I was about the same age, too.
14:52 --> 14:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
14:52 --> 14:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
14:54 --> 14:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so that's interesting because, okay, so which year describing is A Fantasia?
14:58 --> 15:15 [SPEAKER_00]: And if I know it's, for instance, another person who has it is one of my best friends here in Amsterdam, who is a, he's an animator, like his job is a visual job, but still, you tell him, picture yourself on a beach, he's like, I just can't, I can't complete the assignment, I'm sorry.
15:16 --> 15:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
15:16 --> 15:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And on the other hand, I'm on the opposite end of this spectrum.
15:20 --> 15:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I have hyper, I have hyper Fantasia, which means,
15:24 --> 15:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very vivid imagination and this doesn't just apply to visual things but also imagining other senses too.
15:33 --> 15:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
15:33 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah.
15:34 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So, no.
15:34 --> 15:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So, that's an interesting work.
15:35 --> 15:39 [SPEAKER_00]: So, we're going in with, you know, a couple different perspectives.
15:39 --> 15:42 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got the written versus audio.
15:42 --> 15:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So, I'm looking forward to hearing, you know, if you have anything to throw in as we're going through the book about how certain passages were interpreted by the readers that would be interesting.
15:54 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_00]: And also, yeah, we've got the hyper-fantasia versus the A-fantasia.
15:58 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah.
15:59 --> 16:05 [SPEAKER_00]: So on this reread, who's your favorite underrated character or most underrated character for you?
16:06 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Most underrated character.
16:10 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Like for me, it's shout out mapes always.
16:12 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I always think like she gets cut out of the interpret of the uh... Yeah, the role really gets minimized.
16:19 --> 16:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Still go.
16:21 --> 16:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
16:22 --> 16:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I think he goes on a really interesting journey from the beginning to the end of the book.
16:29 --> 16:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's really underplayed in all the adaptations that I've seen in even like in the text of Doom.
16:37 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It's more left up to your imagination to infer how still God got from point A to point B this that really sad passage close to the end where Paul talks about looking at him and seeing a follow-up rather than a friend.
16:53 --> 16:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
16:54 --> 16:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think that's a really interesting.
16:58 --> 17:08 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a really interesting, just a position, because it goes to the heart of one of Frank Herbert's themes, which is to be like a little bit critical of charismatic leadership.
17:08 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so for anyone who's wondering that the characters play by having her by them, the leader of the Fremon, obviously.
17:15 --> 17:16 [SPEAKER_00]: No spoilers.
17:16 --> 17:17 [SPEAKER_00]: What we'll get into that.
17:18 --> 17:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, that's fair.
17:19 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_00]: And a shout out mapes of whom I was speaking is also a Fremon, actually.
17:24 --> 17:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's interesting.
17:25 --> 17:34 [SPEAKER_00]: We both chose Fremon, but she is a housekeeper in the household of the main character and ends up playing an important role.
17:34 --> 17:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, I can't wait to talk about that.
17:37 --> 17:46 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, we're going to be getting into all that in our next episode in two weeks where we'll recap and analyze the entire first book this time with both of us having read it.
17:47 --> 17:52 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, so Dune, it was a book given to both of us by our parents when we were fairly young.
17:52 --> 17:55 [SPEAKER_00]: I got it for my mom and you got it from your dad, right?
17:55 --> 17:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I got it for I got it from both of my parents.
17:57 --> 17:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
17:58 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I will, we were, we were visiting my aunt.
18:02 --> 18:03 [SPEAKER_01]: in Australia.
18:03 --> 18:06 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's like a twenty four hour flight from the UK.
18:06 --> 18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So basically, I've got given this by my parents to say that they're sitting on the chase.
18:12 --> 18:16 [SPEAKER_01]: We're basically that this will keep you occupied for the like the plane journey.
18:16 --> 18:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And it did.
18:18 --> 18:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, it was just a really formative book because like so much of what is in doing bits and pieces of it feed through into other media.
18:31 --> 18:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And you know, June, June isn't for all the time.
18:35 --> 18:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been adapted.
18:36 --> 18:39 [SPEAKER_01]: It was first released in like, nineteen sixty five.
18:39 --> 18:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So what we think of as sci-fi trunks get their starting in doing and also just the I mean it was really interesting.
18:50 --> 18:55 [SPEAKER_01]: The first time I wrote it, the character I did identified most with was Paul of course.
18:55 --> 18:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Of course.
18:56 --> 19:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But you read it as you get older and the character are most I don't find now with this probably due to Leeta.
19:01 --> 19:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Hmm.
19:02 --> 19:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So I wonder whether that's just a function of age, or perspective, or what, but I just remember being completely blown away by it.
19:12 --> 19:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I've never read anything quite like it, because obviously there's the politics of it, which I think is one of my parents thought I'd like it, but there's the mysticism of it, and there's just the quality of it that sucks you into this world and these people, and just the vast
19:31 --> 19:46 [SPEAKER_01]: scale of it, you know, all of these, all of these people, all of these, all of this history, all of this, um, all of this philosophy, and just the precision of her, but it's writing.
19:46 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I said, even for somebody like me, with very little individual imagination, I can picture, do, because the writing of the description is so detailed and so evocative.
20:01 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And also it talks about things that I find easier to imagine.
20:04 --> 20:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of it sounds smell right touch.
20:08 --> 20:13 [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of it isn't a lot of what you being asked to imagine isn't necessarily visible, which I think helps.
20:14 --> 20:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:15 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_00]: And so the book was your first exposure then before like the Lynch movie or anything else.
20:21 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, okay.
20:22 --> 20:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I honestly, I don't remember when I first read it.
20:24 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I was definitely a teenager.
20:26 --> 20:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how many times I read it.
20:28 --> 20:33 [SPEAKER_00]: The follow up novels I've only read once all the way through twice for the second and third books.
20:33 --> 20:36 [SPEAKER_00]: And I haven't read the books by Frank Herbert's son at all.
20:36 --> 20:41 [SPEAKER_00]: The my mom has a plan on changing that after this, I think.
20:42 --> 20:43 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I don't know.
20:44 --> 21:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I also agree that it's changed where maybe the first time I read it I was more looking through Paul's eyes and now I'm more looking through Lady Jessica's eyes Yeah, I think I think it is something I think it is a book that you get more out of if you read it as a teenager for the first time because I think there is something It's the first piece of media riot that came across that really subverted the idea of the hero's journey
21:11 --> 21:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this journey the Paul is on, but he has no control over.
21:16 --> 21:18 [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't want to go on this particular journey.
21:18 --> 21:19 [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't want to be.
21:19 --> 21:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he embraces it.
21:21 --> 21:22 [SPEAKER_01]: He embraces it in the end.
21:23 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but yeah, it's a we won't get too much into how, but it diverts the heroes journey trope in ways.
21:32 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
21:33 --> 21:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
21:34 --> 21:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, yeah, and for anyone who doesn't know who Herbert is or doesn't know that Dune was a start of an entire series much less that it was continued by a son after his death.
21:43 --> 21:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't worry.
21:44 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be getting into all that in a moment.
21:46 --> 21:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, this episode, which should be shorter by will shift us standards anyway.
21:52 --> 22:01 [SPEAKER_00]: It's all about setting the stage for the whole doing story, where did it start and how did it become one of if not the most famous and influential science fiction stories ever told?
22:02 --> 22:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It's at least often cited as the best selling science fiction novel of all time.
22:07 --> 22:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And, yeah, as we talk through the timeline today, we'll touch on the topics we'll be covering in future episodes.
22:13 --> 22:19 [SPEAKER_00]: The Hodorowski adaptation that never was, but was supposed to give you the experience of a hallucinogenic.
22:20 --> 22:24 [SPEAKER_00]: The trippy, nineteen eighty four lynch adaptation that actually did happen.
22:24 --> 22:39 [SPEAKER_00]: and how that spurred the dune series to real fame and spawn some video games to and uh yeah the underrated sci-fi adaptation from two thousand the only one that includes some of the books most iconic scenes and i know Luke's especially excited i see him laughing already
22:41 --> 22:49 [SPEAKER_00]: And, of course, the Villeneuve adaptations past President Future, not to mention Dumasiah, the second book on which Villeneuve's third film will be based.
22:50 --> 22:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Luke, of all of these, which are you most excited to talk about and why is it the sci-fi one?
22:55 --> 23:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm just excited for the sci-fi one because I only watched that one, so I only watched that one and it came out.
23:02 --> 23:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I just have very odd memories of it.
23:05 --> 23:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to see if, like, my imagination is filled in gaps or it really was that it really was that strange.
23:12 --> 23:15 [SPEAKER_01]: The one I'm actually looking forward to most is talking about the A.T.
23:15 --> 23:17 [SPEAKER_01]: for Lynch adaptation.
23:17 --> 23:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, because my first exposure to Dune was the book, but my dad was moving and my dad loves that movie.
23:27 --> 23:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Like every time we've changed format, we've got the HS, we've got DVD, we've got the handwriting.
23:32 --> 23:41 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like every time I'm home, it will either be, do you want to put interstellar on, or do you want to put do you know it will be one of those two films?
23:42 --> 23:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Like that absolutely adores that film.
23:45 --> 23:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So I've seen that.
23:47 --> 23:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I've probably seen that in like three figures.
23:49 --> 23:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I can quote the other sections of that film.
23:52 --> 23:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, my mom's a big fan too.
23:53 --> 24:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe not as like, too, the detriment of all other typis that, but yeah, there's definitely with her entry way drug that got her on the books and everything else here.
24:03 --> 24:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, dad, it's either interstellar or dude.
24:08 --> 24:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm kind of excited to get into that adaptation so that we haven't that haven't gotten as much attention, but especially like juxtaposing them all together.
24:17 --> 24:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I think yeah, they're all wonderfully weird, but inversely different ways.
24:21 --> 24:33 [SPEAKER_00]: So each is like, each is undeniably adapting the same story, but from a different angle and like the visual creativity these books have inspired us is really fascinating how it goes on on all different directions.
24:33 --> 24:49 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm especially excited to take a closer look at the different choices each director has made in the adaptations, which ones worked, which one student and why and what can we learn from these that we can use to evaluate other adaptations of other stories?
24:51 --> 24:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we're definitely going to be relishing in all the delightful weirdness, too.
24:55 --> 25:03 [SPEAKER_00]: For each episode, I'm going to ask Luke and I and listeners at home to rank a top three as they read or watch each entry we're covering.
25:03 --> 25:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'll be gathering that feedback so we can analyze it together and figure out what we're responding to as a community.
25:10 --> 25:13 [SPEAKER_00]: So stay tuned until the end of the episode for the first top three question.
25:14 --> 25:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And
25:15 --> 25:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Quick housekeeping note, we have of course, heard the rumors that Warner Bros.
25:20 --> 25:28 [SPEAKER_00]: is considering moving the release date of any and all of their upcoming films, including Dune Part II, due to the ongoing writer and actor strikes.
25:28 --> 25:35 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to continue as planned for now, and if a date changes announced, we'll shift the later episodes of this series accordingly.
25:36 --> 25:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I personally think Dune is the film Warner Bros.
25:39 --> 25:47 [SPEAKER_00]: is least likely to move because they've already done so much promotion and it being Dune with that cast, it kind of promotes itself.
25:48 --> 25:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Most say I don't think they'll want to move it out of that prime awards window, sweet spot, as it's expected to be a powerful contender at the Oscars.
25:56 --> 26:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Between Dune and Barbie, the WB could have a very good year, even if they move the color purple on the rest of the slate.
26:02 --> 26:03 [SPEAKER_00]: So moving this film
26:04 --> 26:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I would also show bad faith that the studios aren't interested in negotiating.
26:09 --> 26:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Not that that's going to necessarily stop anyone.
26:11 --> 26:32 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, on that note, we just want to say that when we get into the new adaptations, we're here to promote the work of the creatives, the actors, the crew involved, based on the guidelines provided by the WGA and SAGA after a, and we believe it's important to highlight who it is that really makes our entertainment and demonstrate why they deserve to earn a fair wage for what they bring into the world.
26:32 --> 26:39 [SPEAKER_00]: and why their genius cannot be replicated or replaced by the next studio execs cost-cutting measure AI or otherwise.
26:40 --> 26:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Luke, is there anything you want to add to that?
26:42 --> 26:43 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I agree with all of that.
26:44 --> 26:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I did want to ask you one question in this in this introductory episode, Alicia, which is do you think any of the adaptations that have been released so far actually are actually live up to the book?
26:59 --> 27:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was actually discussing kind of discussing this with a friend earlier and I was saying, you know, I think this is one of those cases where collectively together, they get there.
27:10 --> 27:18 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, each one has different pieces that they need, you know, and but none of them on their own.
27:18 --> 27:18 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
27:19 --> 27:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I would agree with that, but I'd also say that I think the urge to adapt to as a movie, or as a mini series, is wrong.
27:30 --> 27:32 [SPEAKER_01]: It needs to be at least a day.
27:32 --> 27:37 [SPEAKER_01]: It needs to be HBO or Apple need to pick this up and do like a ten-episode.
27:38 --> 27:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, the last episode.
27:39 --> 27:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
27:40 --> 27:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I don't tell you universe to do it properly in my opinion.
27:45 --> 27:45 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I agree.
27:46 --> 27:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I agree.
27:46 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I know that was exactly my feeling with the villain of film.
27:50 --> 28:00 [SPEAKER_00]: And also, and I did find out like a lot of the things I was upset about them cutting apparently were originally in the plan and then they just cut for time because they
28:01 --> 28:18 [SPEAKER_00]: because a lot of the coolest things in the novel are those scenes with the subtle politics and you know learning about the world and yeah I mean a lot of filmmakers are sure how to translate that because the thing I always compare it to is beef and better okay I don't know if you've ever read the graphic novel for beef
28:19 --> 28:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I have not.
28:19 --> 28:24 [SPEAKER_01]: But there's a lot more stuff in there that built out the world.
28:24 --> 28:28 [SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot more stuff about chants on set, those background.
28:28 --> 28:31 [SPEAKER_01]: There's this whole thing about this artificial intelligence.
28:31 --> 28:33 [SPEAKER_01]: They've created despite on people.
28:34 --> 28:35 [SPEAKER_01]: None of that makes it into the movie.
28:36 --> 28:40 [SPEAKER_01]: But at its heart, the defender is actually quite a simple story.
28:40 --> 28:45 [SPEAKER_01]: You can actually prune all of that stuff and keep the bits of the story that really matter.
28:46 --> 28:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Where is dude?
28:47 --> 28:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I always feel if you take any part out of it.
28:50 --> 28:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
28:51 --> 28:52 [SPEAKER_01]: You're weakening the whole.
28:52 --> 28:53 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like playing just.
28:53 --> 28:55 [SPEAKER_00]: So intricately woven.
28:56 --> 28:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
28:56 --> 28:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Now it's true.
28:57 --> 28:58 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
28:58 --> 29:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we're going to get into what Dune is where it came from and who the fuck Frank Herbert is.
29:04 --> 29:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Right after this quick commercial break.
29:07 --> 29:10 [SPEAKER_02]: Receive the wisdom of Princess Eroland's writings.
29:12 --> 29:21 [SPEAKER_00]: At a Toyo note for anyone who doesn't know, Princess Eroland is the character who we played by Florence Pue in Dune part two.
29:22 --> 29:26 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll talk about her a bit later this episode and a whole lot more in the weeks to come.
29:27 --> 29:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, back to your regularly scheduled podcasting.
29:30 --> 29:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So Luke, how much do you know about Herbert and the Doom backstory?
29:35 --> 29:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I know a little bit about Frank Herbert.
29:37 --> 29:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I know he did a lot of things.
29:40 --> 29:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He was a journalist.
29:41 --> 29:44 [SPEAKER_01]: He was a speechwriter for a Republican senator.
29:44 --> 29:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
29:46 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_01]: He was a hydroographer, which makes a big difference to the story.
29:50 --> 29:57 [SPEAKER_01]: So this was a gun that went into the desert looking for water, particularly the desert of the Western United States.
29:58 --> 30:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he was as a journalist that he discovered that Oregonian dunes, he was sent to write a story about some approach in the earthy and crap grass.
30:07 --> 30:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
30:07 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
30:08 --> 30:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, so I didn't realize he'd done that as a journalist.
30:11 --> 30:19 [SPEAKER_01]: He allegedly enjoyed the occasional Dalyan swidd magic mushrooms, which I think probably pick up.
30:20 --> 30:21 [SPEAKER_01]: in the book.
30:22 --> 30:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, my research was a religious place.
30:26 --> 30:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And I know that the sort of inspiration for Dune is drawn from a lot of places.
30:32 --> 30:41 [SPEAKER_01]: But one of the, a couple of the key texts are histories of the Russian conquest of the Caucasus.
30:42 --> 30:44 [SPEAKER_01]: in the nineteenth century.
30:44 --> 30:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, oh, that's a new one for me.
30:46 --> 30:52 [SPEAKER_01]: He also, he also leans quite heavily on, like various sort of exploratory books.
30:52 --> 30:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we read from Wolfford Dessenges book, which is a travel log about walking through the Arabian desert.
30:59 --> 30:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
31:00 --> 31:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And as we did some research ahead of this podcast, hopefully you sleep.
31:04 --> 31:06 [SPEAKER_01]: There was a lot of Arabic influence.
31:07 --> 31:09 [SPEAKER_01]: in doing some Bedwin.
31:10 --> 31:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
31:10 --> 31:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
31:10 --> 31:18 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of Arabic language picked up, but there's also bits of Hebrew, bits of Turkish, a bit.
31:18 --> 31:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, bits of Burba.
31:20 --> 31:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he really drew from all over the place.
31:22 --> 31:26 [SPEAKER_00]: But of course, yeah, a lot of it is desert cultures because, yeah.
31:26 --> 31:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
31:27 --> 31:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, people always talk about it being the Arabian desert.
31:30 --> 31:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But I've always thought of it as the Sahil, which is like the southern realm of the Sahara desert.
31:37 --> 31:58 [SPEAKER_01]: basically because in like the Mahash's parts of the Arabian desert, people don't actually live there permanently, people pass through it, but there's not enough water to actually sustain life, whereas the Sahel always to me strikes as closer to what a racket is because actually there are settled communities.
31:59 --> 32:04 [SPEAKER_01]: You do have to be very careful about water and moisture, but there actually are permanent settled.
32:04 --> 32:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Communities in that death.
32:06 --> 32:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's not that the frame and don't move around.
32:08 --> 32:09 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, yeah.
32:09 --> 32:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But they're not on the map.
32:12 --> 32:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, despite the fact that it's based on the dunes from Oregon that Herbert was assigned to write a story about.
32:21 --> 32:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I haven't been there myself, but I've seen pictures.
32:24 --> 32:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I have to say that the depictions indeed and my head cannon had the Sam planet Iraqis looking a lot more like the Sahara for sure.
32:33 --> 32:41 [SPEAKER_00]: But the story of Dune or the Dune Chronicles, which started with the first book, simply called Dune, published in nineteen sixty five.
32:41 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_00]: As you said, Luke is a creation of Frank Herbert and he was born in nineteen twenty raised in rural Washington state and moved one state down to live with his aunt and uncle in Oregon at the age of seventeen.
32:54 --> 32:55 [SPEAKER_00]: He was known for a sharp mind.
32:55 --> 33:00 [SPEAKER_00]: having become an avid reader at a young age and he was an extrovert, making friends easily.
33:01 --> 33:15 [SPEAKER_00]: But I do have to wonder if this moving in with relatives and high school had any influence on the way politics, the main character of Dune seems to be more at ease with like uncle like figures like Duncan Idaho, than his own parents in the first half of the book.
33:16 --> 33:16 [SPEAKER_00]: What do you think?
33:17 --> 33:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, maybe I hadn't considered that.
33:20 --> 33:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Although actually I do think
33:22 --> 33:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I think he actually is quite a user with his mother and father given this sort of social system.
33:29 --> 33:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
33:30 --> 33:31 [SPEAKER_01]: The politics of it.
33:31 --> 33:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Given that they're aristocrats.
33:33 --> 33:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, given that they're a rich social structure.
33:35 --> 33:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
33:36 --> 33:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that has a lot to do with his mother's easing.
33:39 --> 33:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
33:40 --> 33:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
33:40 --> 33:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, get into that.
33:41 --> 33:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll be sitting next week.
33:42 --> 33:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah.
33:43 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, but Frank Herbert, he started his writing career at local newspapers, married in nineteen forty-one, had a daughter the next year, Penny, who passed away last year at the age of eighty, and he got divorced a year later, an in between, and forty-two, he served as a Navy photographer and came home with a head injury.
34:02 --> 34:11 [SPEAKER_00]: In Oregon, he went back to Newspaper work, studied fiction at the University of Washington, where in nineteen forty-six, he met in married fellow writer, Beverly and Stewart,
34:12 --> 34:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Mother of the younger Bruce, who sadly passed away, in the elder Brian, who continued his father's series after Frank's death at the age of sixty-five, and, yeah, Brian and his co-writer added more than a dozen books to the six millennia hopping opuses published it by Frank before his death.
34:30 --> 34:36 [SPEAKER_00]: at age of seventy-six Brian Herbert is still going strong and plans to release his next-do novel this fall.
34:36 --> 34:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Now have you read any of Brian's novels?
34:39 --> 34:40 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I haven't actually.
34:40 --> 34:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I've only read Dune, Dune, Messiah, and children of the year.
34:44 --> 34:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, okay.
34:45 --> 34:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, season two of the wool shift dust here on the public feed will cover the first two books, Dune, and eventually in November, Dune heretic, and all of the adaptations thereof.
34:56 --> 35:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Because, in fact, these are the only two books in the Dune series anyone has ever attempted to adapt, along with the third book Children of Dune, which is combined with Dune heretic for the Children of Dune sci-fi series.
35:07 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_00]: which will be the last thing we cover this season.
35:10 --> 35:27 [SPEAKER_00]: If your curious why no one has attempted to adapt beyond that point, just how wild this story gets in its telling a future humanity through thousands of years of intergalactic war and evolution and devolution and back again, there will be a book club to keep the story going.
35:27 --> 35:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's months away.
35:28 --> 35:30 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'll talk more about that then.
35:30 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_00]: For now, we're going to start with a book that started at all, the best known bit of this story.
35:35 --> 35:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Luke, you said your dad got into the movie first?
35:39 --> 35:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't think my dad has ever read the book.
35:42 --> 35:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
35:43 --> 35:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, what about you?
35:43 --> 35:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, he's a, he's an enormous fan of that.
35:47 --> 35:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And what about your mom and brother?
35:50 --> 35:55 [SPEAKER_01]: My mum is not into any kind of sci-fi and fantasy.
35:55 --> 36:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Nathan will watch it because when we were teenagers we basically had no choice but to watch it at least a couple of times.
36:05 --> 36:09 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I think he was more confused by it than anything else.
36:10 --> 36:13 [SPEAKER_01]: He hasn't, to my knowledge, he hasn't read the book.
36:13 --> 36:18 [SPEAKER_00]: So your parents gave it to you thinking, oh, this is up your alley, but they hadn't read it themselves.
36:19 --> 36:25 [SPEAKER_01]: No, they'd seen the film and they'd seen sort of the politics and the plotting of it.
36:25 --> 36:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And they knew I liked science fiction, so they thought this would be.
36:29 --> 36:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And also, I think, again, because I had a lot of time to kill the fact that it was a goal-stopper of a book, yeah, probably played some role in that choice.
36:39 --> 36:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, my mom definitely fell in love with the Lynch film first.
36:43 --> 36:49 [SPEAKER_00]: It got her to run out and read all the books and yeah, push the books on everyone she knew like like I did with silo.
36:50 --> 36:59 [SPEAKER_00]: So that included my dad and later when I was a teenager me and I don't remember whether I watched the Lynch film or read the book or play the computer game first.
37:00 --> 37:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I've spent so many hours playing that computer game.
37:03 --> 37:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, there's actually a few, but I think both of us are probably talking about the ninety two adventure strategy game.
37:08 --> 37:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
37:08 --> 37:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
37:09 --> 37:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So many hours.
37:10 --> 37:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I was in tall three very much in the nineties.
37:12 --> 37:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I don't remember which came first.
37:15 --> 37:16 [SPEAKER_00]: They were all interroven together.
37:18 --> 37:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think what I personally responded to in this book when I first read it is a world building.
37:22 --> 37:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is a world made by a man who knows many things in detail and can combine them in fantastical new ways to create a framework to think about human psychology, ecology, religion, politics, the meaning and structure of power.
37:36 --> 37:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Herbert, never graduated from university, but he was what we would call an auto-diadect, meaning he was like self-taught in all these areas, there is reading.
37:47 --> 38:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not a libertarian, like Herbert was, but we are both idealists, and the subversive way that he approached his science fiction world, like taking the native's perspective rather than the colonial perspective.
38:00 --> 38:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's one of the things that really set him apart from the classic science fiction authors before him, and it definitely heavily influenced the authors who came after him.
38:10 --> 38:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I'm sort of similar, but also, I like the idea of the inevitability of it or I think doing to something quite profound about how history is actually made in that.
38:25 --> 38:28 [SPEAKER_01]: human beings don't actually make history.
38:28 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_01]: They are trapped by the choices that came before them and they come from the wheel.
38:34 --> 38:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they will trap people who came after them.
38:37 --> 38:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think the, I think June gets that across beautifully because like June makes a clear that the, it's characters, all of its characters, even the, even the lead character, even the character with quasi superpowers.
38:55 --> 38:57 [SPEAKER_01]: only has very limited choices that you can make.
38:59 --> 39:04 [SPEAKER_01]: He's trapped by what came before him and what comes after him.
39:04 --> 39:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know whether it was just because as is somewhat do a teenager that kind of appealed to me this idea.
39:15 --> 39:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's sort of the line from battle struggle.
39:17 --> 39:19 [SPEAKER_01]: All of this has happened before and what happened again.
39:19 --> 39:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
39:20 --> 39:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And I just dreamt that we love time, by the way.
39:23 --> 39:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just thought that was really interesting.
39:26 --> 39:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And I love the way it's inverted.
39:28 --> 39:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Your expectations of water hero is supposed to be.
39:31 --> 39:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And the hero is like you said.
39:34 --> 39:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Herbert is a libertarian he has a very dim view of any kind of power structure right but also I think he has quite dim view of human nature in general in some ways it is quite a do a depressing book and that nobody really comes out of it that way yeah we're coming off the back of silo so you know whatever yeah um
39:57 --> 40:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, but for all that, it's also just a story about heartbreak and revenge and falling in love and leading a people and yeah, war.
40:06 --> 40:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
40:07 --> 40:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It's all in that stuff that really appeals to you when you fifteen.
40:10 --> 40:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, it's like the essence of humanity.
40:13 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And like when you read it, it's not all the person you find stuff in there that you miss.
40:16 --> 40:17 [SPEAKER_01]: This new layer.
40:17 --> 40:19 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, this new layer is.
40:19 --> 40:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
40:20 --> 40:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, Herbert started researching Dune, which was his third novel in nineteen fifty nine, uh, just in time for him to turn forty.
40:27 --> 40:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And he'd apparently been assigned to write an article about those Oregonian sand dunes, the articles never published.
40:34 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_00]: But that research became something much bigger with Herbert going down the Wikipedia rabbit hole researching desert cultures before there was even a Wikipedia.
40:42 --> 40:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, their mayor may not have been magic mushrooms involved.
40:45 --> 40:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
40:47 --> 40:53 [SPEAKER_00]: And after his wife returned to work and advertising the next year, she supported him as he devoted himself full time to the novel.
40:54 --> 41:02 [SPEAKER_00]: And in nineteen sixty three and nineteen sixty five, the novel was published in two parts, serialized into eight installments each.
41:02 --> 41:09 [SPEAKER_00]: in analog science fiction magazine and when he tried to get the entire novel published traditionally though.
41:10 --> 41:12 [SPEAKER_00]: It was rejected no fewer than twenty times.
41:13 --> 41:17 [SPEAKER_00]: For one thing, I was extremely long for a science fiction novel in the sixties.
41:18 --> 41:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And then, yeah, Wikipedia summarizes next in a single tidy paragraph quite nicely what happens after that.
41:25 --> 41:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So to quote the Frank Herbert article there, Sterling E. Lanier, an editor of a Kilton book company, no mainly for its auto repair manuals.
41:35 --> 41:44 [SPEAKER_00]: had read Dune Serios and offered a seven thousand five hundred dollar advanced plus future royalties for the rights to publish them as a hardcover book.
41:45 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Herbert rewrote much of his text.
41:47 --> 41:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Dune was soon a critical success.
41:50 --> 41:59 [SPEAKER_00]: It won the Nebula Award for Best Novel in nineteen sixty-five and share the Hugo Award in nineteen sixty-six with and call me Conrad by Rogers Ellesney.
42:00 --> 42:09 [SPEAKER_00]: for anyone who doesn't know the Hugo and Nebula, they're like the Oscars and Golden Globes of the science fiction writing world and Silesini is one of the greatest science fiction writers of all time.
42:09 --> 42:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah Luke, did any of that surprise you?
42:13 --> 42:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, no, I sort of done my own research into the podcast, so I think you picked up all of the stuff.
42:19 --> 42:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, okay.
42:21 --> 42:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, yeah, and then after publication, Dune was ever a spectacle size success, helping her bird at least get other work in journalism, education, photography, and even worked in Vietnam in Pakistan as a social and ecological consultant for a while.
42:36 --> 43:00 [SPEAKER_00]: uh... but by the end of seventy three his novel dune the nineteen sixty nine sequel to messiah and his other work had earned him enough to not only become a full-time author but also by second-home in who i and he did also write a bunch of non-dune science fiction books by the way uh... most of best sellers but i haven't read any of them yet i might have to change that what about you look no i've been read and things yeah
43:02 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, he's of course most famously associated with Dune and he published the third novel Children of Dune in nineteen seventy six.
43:11 --> 43:20 [SPEAKER_00]: During the seventies a cult filmmaker named Hodorowski tried to develop an adaptation to the first novel with art for Mobius and Geiger or Geiger
43:21 --> 43:25 [SPEAKER_00]: The latter of which would most iconically go on to be used in the alien films.
43:26 --> 43:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, this adaptation was going to be fourteen hours long and star his own son, plus Orson Wells, Salvador Dali, yes, he of the melting clock paintings, a young Mick Jagger, and so many more.
43:40 --> 43:46 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, the whole production was just going to be too big and what they had pink Floyd was supposed to do.
43:46 --> 43:48 [SPEAKER_00]: The soundtrack is
43:48 --> 43:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that this production kind of lost all touch with reality.
43:54 --> 43:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So no surprise, it got canceled.
43:57 --> 44:04 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, you can bet we're dedicating an entire episode to this one with the jaw dropping documentary that covers it all, all the crazy details.
44:04 --> 44:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Have you seen the doc yet, Luke?
44:06 --> 44:17 [SPEAKER_01]: No, but it's one of those, I'm really, it's one of the reasons I'm glad we're doing this podcast because it will finally give me the nerve journey to dig that documentary out because it's been on my to watch list forever.
44:18 --> 44:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Because yeah, the story of the hotter off ski adaptation just sounds so nuts, everything I've heard about it.
44:26 --> 44:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, I just can't, I can't wait to get into it.
44:29 --> 44:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, the doc is a good movie in and of itself in its own right.
44:32 --> 44:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm, I'm excited to revisit it, uh, because I definitely am forgetting some of the details and it's also Hodoroski, you know, he's, he's interviewed himself and he's such a character, Spanish guy, and Alex just, yeah.
44:43 --> 44:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a, it's a good film.
44:45 --> 44:46 [SPEAKER_00]: It's gonna be a fun, one to talk about.
44:47 --> 44:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And just to go back to, just to go back to hundreds of giga, apparently.
44:52 --> 45:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, because there's a really good alien talking entry on the making of alien that I watched a little while, but apparently Geeger actually showed their story boards that he'd written, they'd drawn for doom to really Scott.
45:04 --> 45:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, and that was part of, yeah, well, Ridley Scott was going to, uh, he was going to do his own adaptation and ended up doing, um, Blade Runner instead.
45:17 --> 45:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'd actually really like to see a pretty Scott adaptation of June.
45:21 --> 45:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he'd certainly get the visual material around.
45:26 --> 45:48 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, so then Herbert's fourth-do novel, God Emperor of Dune, aka the book where things really start to get wild, was released in nineteen eighty-one, heretics of Dune in eighty-four, the same year Lynch's movie came out, and also the year Herbert's wife passed away after a long illness, so it was one hell of a rollercoaster year for him.
45:48 --> 46:08 [SPEAKER_00]: The movie was a critical and commercial success in Europe and Asia, the less warmly received in the US at first, but obviously there were a lot of Americans who felt the way my mom and your dad did about it, because even before this podcast series, I'm going to bet that pretty much everyone listening has at least heard of this forty-year-old movie if not already seen it yourself.
46:09 --> 46:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's a pretty good mark of success.
46:12 --> 46:34 [SPEAKER_00]: if you haven't gone watch it because you'll enjoy it it may not be you may not enjoy it for the most high-brow of reasons but it's it's a fun it's a fun idea yeah well we'll be watching it together in a few weeks yeah and yet Frank Herbert's final doom book was chapter house doom published a year later in nineteen eighty five which is the same year he remarried to a former publisher
46:35 --> 46:45 [SPEAKER_00]: and he'd planned a seventh and final novel for the series but he passed away in nineteen eighty six before he could complete it from complications related to a surgery for pancreatic cancer.
46:46 --> 46:59 [SPEAKER_00]: More than a decade later his son Brian with the help of writer Kevin J Anderson would pick the series back up with amongst others to final books to complete the original series based on the his father's notes for that plan seventh novel.
47:00 --> 47:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Those were hundreds of Dune and San Marms of Doom published in two thousand six and two thousand seven, but Brian had several thousand pages of his father's notes to pull from.
47:11 --> 47:20 [SPEAKER_00]: So they've written a bunch more Dune books besides that during the original series just before it and ten thousand years earlier during the Butler in G-Hod.
47:21 --> 47:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Now these books are still being published to this day.
47:23 --> 47:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Does talking about Frank Herbert's life change anything about how you interpret the novel look?
47:30 --> 47:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I do think Herbert's politics are interesting because like in researching for this episode I came across like several articles arguing that doing is a problematic vote.
47:43 --> 47:56 [SPEAKER_01]: In that it you could say oriental like you can make an argument that orientalizes the fremon you know treats them as like exotic exotic others that are waiting for a savior from outside.
47:56 --> 48:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, but I disagree because you look through their eyes more than any other culture in the books.
48:01 --> 48:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just I don't so I think there's the
48:04 --> 48:14 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a couple of scenes that are deliberately written to make you think about how everybody's from outside doing is is complicit in what is going on.
48:15 --> 48:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the, I think the interesting thing is, doing is very open to interpretation and it's politics.
48:22 --> 48:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I think curb had a very clear sense of what he wanted to communicate, but I think a lot of other people, a picture of other themes that maybe Herbert wasn't keen on stressing or didn't
48:33 --> 48:51 [SPEAKER_01]: fully consciously realized we're in there or it's kind of death of the author type situation is one of those texts that's really dense and you can read a lot into it and I think it is one of those books that you you take out what you bring to it in a lot of ways in terms of your own prejudices
48:52 --> 48:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And your own worldview?
48:53 --> 48:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, I think that that can be said about a lot of things you can interpret it your own way.
48:58 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll definitely be talking about some of the more controversial aspects of the novel and also what Frank Herbert has stated or what we can infer based on what he has said was his
49:12 --> 49:15 [SPEAKER_00]: original intention with different aspects of it.
49:15 --> 49:25 [SPEAKER_00]: But is he's also one of those ones where you can tell he wrote the first book and then he had some thoughts about it and the second book kind of answers to the first book.
49:25 --> 49:39 [SPEAKER_00]: So I look forward to we're not going to get to that until after we cover the first one of actually the first two will move movies because the third movie is going to be based on that second book but it just it's interesting the more books he added the more layers he adds to you know
49:40 --> 49:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, I haven't read God Emperor of View because I've read like synopsies of it and I've just read the synopsies and thought no.
49:47 --> 49:48 [SPEAKER_01]: It's wild.
49:48 --> 49:51 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I am not ready to handle that.
49:51 --> 49:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, we won't be doing that one in the public podcast, but in a doon book club and it's going to be, it's going to be a fun one.
50:00 --> 50:01 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's a while away.
50:03 --> 50:09 [SPEAKER_00]: But even the first couple books, which are by far the most contained and accessible, they've been deemed quote unquote unfilmable.
50:10 --> 50:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Though, yeah, at least CGI is helping with the sandworms.
50:13 --> 50:17 [SPEAKER_00]: So just wait until you see with the sandworms looks like in the two-thousand adaptation.
50:19 --> 50:27 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, there is a huge cast of characters, a number of interconnected subplots, entire ecosystems and cultures being brought to life.
50:27 --> 50:30 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, hence all the different takes and the adaptations.
50:31 --> 50:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I would say varieties of spice of life, but in doom, the spice of malange is a spice of life and pre-cognition and space trap.
50:39 --> 50:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And also that there's one particular character that is very difficult to adapt.
50:45 --> 50:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And that is the Prince of Zero-long because she's not actually in the book, but she provides these little epigraphs to all the children.
50:54 --> 50:56 [SPEAKER_00]: That's going to be an interesting one to see how they're different.
50:57 --> 51:05 [SPEAKER_00]: It's interesting to see how they're different adaptations handle that, you know, for instance, in the film, of how they had instead a Chinese
51:05 --> 51:08 [SPEAKER_00]: do those opening, you know, analog sound.
51:09 --> 51:17 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll definitely talk because she does become much, she becomes an important character if we won't spoil anything, but she is important.
51:18 --> 51:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and yeah, a hodor ask his doom was by the way, actually, the second attempt to adapt the novel.
51:23 --> 51:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And after that, the baton passed Ridley Scott, as I said, who had been in the project for Blade Runner, at which point Dune landed in Lynch's lap for what might be the most memorable, and at least, and maybe least faithful of the adaptations that made it to the screen.
51:41 --> 51:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Aside from games, the sci-fi adaptation was the next one to tackle the series with Dune in two thousand and children of Dune in two thousand three.
51:49 --> 51:57 [SPEAKER_00]: They are the least known of the adaptations, but two of sci-fi's biggest releases from that heyday era that included Farscape and Battlestar Galactica.
51:58 --> 52:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Correctly, if I'm wrong, but children of Dune has baby James.
52:01 --> 52:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
52:01 --> 52:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it has baby James.
52:04 --> 52:05 [SPEAKER_00]: That's great.
52:06 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's not a bad thing.
52:07 --> 52:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the, you know, the costumes are funny.
52:10 --> 52:13 [SPEAKER_00]: These special effects are even funnier, but
52:15 --> 52:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and after that there was a failed attempt to for Paramount to adapt a movie between two thousand eight and two thousand eleven and yeah Brian Herbert and writing partner Kevin J Anderson were signed on as advisors and then finally the adaptation that frankly burings us here today they'll move three part take on the first two novels in Herbert series
52:39 --> 52:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Now later in the series we'll revisit the film from twenty twenty one which roughly covers the first half of the novel.
52:44 --> 52:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll film many doom fans including myself have ambivalent feelings about, but yeah, man does it personally for me at least nail the look of the universe.
52:55 --> 52:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'd say I'm unwilling about it.
52:58 --> 53:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to wait to pass judgment till I've seen the second film because it kind of feels unfair to judge it.
53:04 --> 53:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just know what I'm missing from the first half.
53:07 --> 53:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And then I hear that a lot of these scenes actually were planned and then we're taken out and I'm like, ah, but there's a lot of things that it did exceptionally well better than all the other adaptations.
53:18 --> 53:24 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I have to say one thing I do like about feeling those doing is the casting.
53:24 --> 53:32 [SPEAKER_01]: because like Oscar Isaac, as Jubilee taught a trade-ease and Josh Frollen particularly is going to be how it looks.
53:33 --> 53:34 [SPEAKER_01]: They just are those characters.
53:34 --> 53:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I think those two in particular are really good bits of casting.
53:39 --> 53:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think over, I think all of the casting has been good.
53:44 --> 53:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I, not all of the characterization landed from me, a hundred percent.
53:49 --> 53:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we'll get into it.
53:51 --> 53:52 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll get into it.
53:52 --> 54:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So I recently did an episode of Properly Howard, which is a podcast, one of the affiliates in the Laura Hounds network like us.
54:02 --> 54:05 [SPEAKER_00]: We did a, uh, do an episode on the twenty-twenty ones.
54:05 --> 54:12 [SPEAKER_00]: So I ended up watching the eighty-four and the twenty-twenty ones preparation for that and also just thinking prepping for this series that we're doing now.
54:13 --> 54:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was surprised that the eighty-four movie also cut some things that I had for some reason convince myself it hadn't.
54:23 --> 54:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Although I know that there is also a longer version.
54:25 --> 54:31 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm definitely going to be diving into and comparing the two versions when we get to that one.
54:32 --> 54:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah and I mean David Lynch was not happy with his famously not happy with the final cut right when you've been using his own name I mean David Lynch yeah David Lynch actually wanted his name taken off of him because he was so unhappy with the way it was cut and it's weird it's like you changed the whole trajectory of David Lynch's career because he's never done a big budget movie since never wanted to do a big
54:57 --> 54:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't blame him.
54:58 --> 55:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And since he's talked about this, you didn't like the amount of control with that kind of budget.
55:05 --> 55:08 [SPEAKER_01]: You didn't like the amount of control with the studio insisted on exercising.
55:10 --> 55:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So it completely changed the trajectory of this career.
55:12 --> 55:20 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to be going through all these adaptations leading up to the new film and a week before the currently scheduled release for part two.
55:20 --> 55:29 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to look at the trailers and recap what we can expect from the second film and we'll be back a week after the release to talk through that new film with you too.
55:30 --> 55:37 [SPEAKER_00]: And then finally we'll wrap up this season of Dune coverage with the second book, Dune Messiah and the children of Dune sci-fi adaptation.
55:38 --> 55:44 [SPEAKER_00]: to look ahead at what to expect from Villeneuve's Dune Part III, assuming it gets the green light.
55:44 --> 55:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you ready to become a Dune expert, Luke, or a Dune spurt?
55:48 --> 55:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Should we say?
55:50 --> 55:50 [SPEAKER_01]: A Dune spurt?
55:51 --> 55:53 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I can say I prefer to think of it as big a counter.
55:54 --> 55:58 [SPEAKER_01]: If a mentor, possibly in your case, if any Jesuit resistance, I mean.
55:58 --> 56:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I see no gender boundaries becoming a mentor, but no, I'd rather be a Ben and Jesuit.
56:02 --> 56:05 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like the for wheel of time fans, it's like the Isodai.
56:07 --> 56:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they get the cooler outfit.
56:09 --> 56:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And one of the things I'm most looking forward to talking about is, yeah, just how much everyone's gonna see do in everywhere after this.
56:18 --> 56:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Like Star Wars, Wheel of Time, Avatar, etc.
56:21 --> 56:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think everybody realizes how much stuff we love today has indirectly come from this book.
56:27 --> 56:28 [SPEAKER_01]: It's everywhere.
56:28 --> 56:35 [SPEAKER_01]: When you actually start to think about it, it's genuinely frightening how influential this book has been.
56:36 --> 56:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And some people get what June is about and takes stuff from that.
56:40 --> 56:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Some people, I think of wildly misinterpreted June and what it was really about.
56:47 --> 56:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking at you Star Wars, I'm looking at you.
56:51 --> 56:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, um, so yeah, it's just an incredibly influential book and what you say when you realize how influential it's been, you see it everywhere.
56:59 --> 57:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, I agree.
57:02 --> 57:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and for everyone at home who's following along, I definitely obviously recommend reading.
57:10 --> 57:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna be doing my reread this time rather quickly myself.
57:14 --> 57:17 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, it's the best ways to get the full picture and immerse yourself in that world.
57:18 --> 57:30 [SPEAKER_00]: But for those of you who don't have the time or desire, don't worry, will be breaking the whole book down, all the major characters, settings, themes, and plot points, so that you can understand the bones of the story and feel fully planted in this world.
57:30 --> 57:35 [SPEAKER_00]: and then we'll tackle the adaptations and look at how well they brought that world to and story to life.
57:36 --> 57:47 [SPEAKER_00]: For those of you who have read or reading along, my first top three question for you is, when you're reading the first book or thinking about the first book, what are your three favorite scenes from this book and why?
57:47 --> 57:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It can be the most memorable scenes, the scenes that moved you the most or surprised you the most, or just the three book scenes that stick out to you in whatever way.
57:57 --> 58:01 [SPEAKER_00]: all throw up a post on Twitter, yes, I'm still calling it Twitter or now in forever.
58:01 --> 58:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And you can also hop onto the Walshift Dust Channel, the Laura Hound's Discord to share your takes there, or you can also email them to us at Walshift DustPodcast at gmail.com.
58:13 --> 58:17 [SPEAKER_00]: And Luke and I will of course share our top three's live in the next episode.
58:18 --> 58:23 [SPEAKER_01]: If people are interested, by the way, there are, I know there are several audio versions of it.
58:23 --> 58:33 [SPEAKER_01]: The one I've been listening to is the one that is available on audible, and it is the one that has the list Simon Vance as the narrator.
58:33 --> 58:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously there's a full cast, but it's the one that lists Simon Vance as the main narrator.
58:38 --> 58:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, and then you hardly recommend it.
58:42 --> 58:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I do, it's a really good production.
58:43 --> 58:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and also looking ahead a few episodes, I'd love to hear from people who have played the Dune video games in the nineties and beyond.
58:51 --> 58:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, please tell me what you can remember.
58:54 --> 58:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I especially love some voice memos on this topic.
58:56 --> 58:57 [SPEAKER_00]: You can email them to me.
58:57 --> 59:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I will shift us podcasts at gmail.com again that email address in the notes.
59:03 --> 59:07 [SPEAKER_00]: And meanwhile, the silo book club is heating up on Patreon.
59:07 --> 59:13 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll find both part two of my Hugh Howie interview there as well as the full breakdown of the first book in the silo series of wool.
59:13 --> 59:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So, yes, we're giving away all the spoilers about what's going to happen next in the story with Sam of Silo TV fans fame this time to protect Luke's show only innocence.
59:24 --> 59:28 [SPEAKER_00]: You can find the book club at patreon.com slash woolshiftust.
59:29 --> 59:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And I want to personally thank the new Silasins who have joined the book club since we aired our Silo Awards episode.
59:36 --> 59:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Paul Kent, merciless fur, Stu, Samarshan, Dan G, Melee B, Cliff J, Tom S, Lisa Fanchor, aka Lady Walker fan, Matthew M, James N, Diane D, Laura E, Redhead Shannon,
59:54 --> 59:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Natalie L. Raleo.
59:57 --> 01:00:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Josh W. Faisal M. Salsa.
01:00:00 --> 01:00:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Kim Shang aka The Lone Token or that Chick-Coo plays bass.
01:00:04 --> 01:00:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Nano Nates Great.
01:00:06 --> 01:00:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Chris C. Rangabe.
01:00:08 --> 01:00:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Page C. Nancy M. Sam and I love having you all reading, listening and discussing with us, and there's still time to get in shift feedback before this weekend if you want in on that discussion too.
01:00:20 --> 01:00:26 [SPEAKER_00]: And this podcast was published by the Lower Hounds, a podcast community dedicated to deep dives and hot takes just like this.
01:00:27 --> 01:00:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm one of the co-hosts of the MCU universe series on the Lower Hounds feet, where we're just wrapping up our coverage of secret invasion.
01:00:34 --> 01:00:44 [SPEAKER_00]: The show isn't everything we hope to would be, but there's a lot to analyze from the interesting seeds for future storytelling to what exactly went wrong with the realization of it all.
01:00:45 --> 01:00:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say, as a listener, I think you guys have gone out of your way to be fair and balanced on that show because it would be, it would be so easy to rip it limb from a limb and you didn't.
01:00:58 --> 01:01:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, this show has its fans too.
01:01:00 --> 01:01:02 [SPEAKER_00]: There are people who genuinely enjoyed it.
01:01:02 --> 01:01:09 [SPEAKER_00]: So I mean, we tried to be fair and if we're going to, we talked about that there are things, it's not a complete homestrapire.
01:01:09 --> 01:01:11 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about the things that we liked about it.
01:01:11 --> 01:01:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And if we're going to criticize it, we try to be fair.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think you guys did a really good job of trying to highlight both the good and the bad in the show.
01:01:24 --> 01:01:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it would have been really easy to just point and laugh and go dumpster fire and yeah, in true lawhouse fashion you guys didn't do that.
01:01:35 --> 01:01:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, and we... It's a really good podcast, but do you say so myself?
01:01:39 --> 01:01:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
01:01:40 --> 01:01:46 [SPEAKER_00]: We try to pull out the easter eggs and things you'll still want to know whether or not you enjoyed the show yourself.
01:01:46 --> 01:01:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Because it's still part of, uh, it's still part of the MCU universe and I'm not someone who's going to cry MCU fatigue.
01:01:52 --> 01:01:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I love them, see you.
01:01:53 --> 01:01:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And also, if you haven't listened to a podcast he's done so far, John has just the best voice for radio.
01:02:00 --> 01:02:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:02:01 --> 01:02:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just just fantastic.
01:02:03 --> 01:02:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:02:04 --> 01:02:04 [SPEAKER_00]: deep and velvety.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I'll also be popping up with Jean and Jean who are two different people.
01:02:11 --> 01:02:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to one shot to talk about good homens, the second season of the Neil Gaiman adaptation.
01:02:18 --> 01:02:29 [SPEAKER_00]: And there will also be episodes coming out soon from the Laura Hounds without me, including a primer for a soak of season two, continuing their coverage of foundation, which is perfect for Dune fans.
01:02:30 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_00]: as well as one piece, the earth sea series of books, tokens, silver alien, and a bunch of other stuff.
01:02:36 --> 01:02:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And starting at September, I'll be guessing on the Wheel of Time coverage too.
01:02:40 --> 01:02:44 [SPEAKER_00]: And new to the lower hounds network is the podcast properly Howard.
01:02:44 --> 01:02:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I mentioned earlier, where Steven Anthony Tackle movies one a reverent take to time.
01:02:49 --> 01:03:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Their new season starting this month is all about remakes from white man can't jump to the worker man and Yeah, including that episode about the twenty twenty-one-one-dune film that I guess it on which will be coming out toward the end of this month if you want to preview and my thoughts on that film And look where can people find more view so they can find me I look at on Twitter.
01:03:11 --> 01:03:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it is Twitter.
01:03:13 --> 01:03:14 [SPEAKER_01]: It will always be Twitter
01:03:14 --> 01:03:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And I also do another podcast for the couple of friends from uni.
01:03:18 --> 01:03:20 [SPEAKER_01]: It could be said or one word.
01:03:20 --> 01:03:21 [SPEAKER_01]: We look at politics.
01:03:22 --> 01:03:24 [SPEAKER_01]: International relations and sports.
01:03:25 --> 01:03:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I'm also on Twitter and other social media as at Alicia C. B. And you can always find me on the L. R. Hound's Discord too.
01:03:33 --> 01:03:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Talk to you again in a couple weeks when we'll make sure you know your contacts from your spacing guild.
01:03:38 --> 01:03:45 [SPEAKER_00]: See the subtle difference between the quizzards, how to rack and the mod deep and understand why there's the bandages are it.
01:04:04 --> 01:04:05 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you.