Why can’t Mark keep the Batman films straight in his mind? This week, the light hits the gloom on Seal’s 1994 baroque pop gem “Kiss From a Rose.” Mark is fascinated by the clashes between major and minor in this song, and Nichole likens that to Jung’s shadow self that lurks in all of us.
Other music heard in this episode: Seal - “I Put a Spell on You”, Seal - “Crazy”, Seal - “Prayer for the Dying”, Push - “Lay it on the Line”, Tomás Luis de Victoria - “O Magnum Mysterium”, John Dowland - “Flow My Tears”, Alice in Chains - “Down in a Hole”, Gnarles Barkley - “Crazy”, TLC - “Waterfalls”, Sublime - “Same in the End”, Weezer - “Holiday”, Taylor Swift - “Betty”
Send us your thoughts at NeverMusicPod@gmail.com
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00:00 --> 00:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Can be seen major and then Baby by the way shout out to my friend Brendan who I used to live with in college.
00:10 --> 00:11 [SPEAKER_05]: He got so mad.
00:12 --> 00:15 [SPEAKER_05]: We were doing laundry and I just walked in the room and I was just like baby.
00:16 --> 00:17 [SPEAKER_05]: And he was like don't do that at me.
00:18 --> 00:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I love you Brendan.
00:19 --> 00:20 [SPEAKER_05]: That's your vocal stim.
00:20 --> 00:21 [SPEAKER_05]: That's right.
00:21 --> 00:23 [SPEAKER_05]: I was dimming back in the two albums.
00:23 --> 00:23 [SPEAKER_05]: I
00:35 --> 00:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, I'm Nicole.
00:36 --> 00:36 [SPEAKER_05]: And I'm Mark.
00:37 --> 00:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is never mind the music.
00:39 --> 00:40 [SPEAKER_01]: What are we going to talk about tonight, Mark?
00:41 --> 00:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Did you see the seal commercial in Super Bowl, fifty nine, twenty twenty five?
00:45 --> 00:48 [SPEAKER_01]: No, seal the art, the singer.
00:49 --> 00:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, it's seal the singer and seal the creature.
00:52 --> 00:57 [SPEAKER_02]: There is so much as he can tell you, so much he can say.
01:05 --> 01:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, this is the weirdest thing I've ever seen.
01:07 --> 01:09 [SPEAKER_05]: What is happening?
01:09 --> 01:10 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a Mountain Dew commercial.
01:11 --> 01:12 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's really uncanny valley.
01:12 --> 01:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Weird.
01:13 --> 01:17 [SPEAKER_05]: I felt exactly like the influencer there at the end.
01:18 --> 01:23 [SPEAKER_05]: It's seal singing, but he's like a seal, CG seal for creature.
01:24 --> 01:24 [SPEAKER_01]: OK.
01:24 --> 01:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Very weird.
01:25 --> 01:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
01:27 --> 01:28 [SPEAKER_05]: We are talking about the real song today.
01:28 --> 01:32 [SPEAKER_05]: We are talking about actual kiss from arose by seal.
01:36 --> 01:38 [SPEAKER_02]: It sounds different.
01:56 --> 01:58 [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's all read done, but yeah, it's weird.
01:58 --> 02:01 [SPEAKER_05]: His voice is a little different, a little husk, here he's a little older now.
02:01 --> 02:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't seem to be hired to me.
02:02 --> 02:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Any change to lyrics to be about Mountain Dew?
02:04 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
02:06 --> 02:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And the weird.
02:06 --> 02:07 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
02:07 --> 02:12 [SPEAKER_05]: I think it was a little bit of a swing in a miss, but I'm not exactly the expert on advertising.
02:12 --> 02:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I haven't been divorced, hit him hard.
02:14 --> 02:17 [SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, we go in there later.
02:18 --> 02:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Right now.
02:19 --> 02:22 [SPEAKER_01]: But Heidi Klum, she's a kind of a wild card.
02:23 --> 02:24 [SPEAKER_01]: She likes fashion.
02:24 --> 02:26 [SPEAKER_05]: She likes fashion.
02:26 --> 02:26 [SPEAKER_05]: She likes fashion.
02:26 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_05]: She hosts the fashion show where you still host the fashion.
02:28 --> 02:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And she has like crazy Halloween parties and gets weird about Halloween costumes, like a really into it, like dressing like ET and stuff.
02:36 --> 02:43 [SPEAKER_05]: So this song, Kiss From A Rose, is from nineteen ninety fours album by seal.
02:43 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_05]: His second album called
02:46 --> 02:46 [SPEAKER_05]: seal.
02:47 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_05]: And can we talk about this for a second?
02:50 --> 02:51 [SPEAKER_01]: The second album is called seal.
02:52 --> 02:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, okay.
02:53 --> 02:54 [SPEAKER_05]: So let's talk about this.
02:54 --> 02:56 [SPEAKER_05]: So this is a bit of a Rambo situation.
02:57 --> 02:58 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, the movie Rambo.
02:58 --> 03:02 [SPEAKER_05]: I know of the movie Rambo, but Rambo is actually the sequel.
03:03 --> 03:04 [SPEAKER_05]: to a movie called First Blood.
03:04 --> 03:05 [SPEAKER_03]: What?
03:05 --> 03:05 [SPEAKER_05]: You don't know about this.
03:05 --> 03:18 [SPEAKER_05]: So first blood's like a serious movie, a commentary on Vietnam, you know, he's a Vietnam vet who kind of loses his capacity to exist in society and he ends up kind of going rogue in Central Park or something like that.
03:18 --> 03:19 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm trying to remember exactly.
03:20 --> 03:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And then Rambo,
03:22 --> 03:25 [SPEAKER_05]: is him as an action hero and it's first blood part two, right?
03:25 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_05]: His name is John Rambo.
03:27 --> 03:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
03:27 --> 03:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.
03:28 --> 03:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm completing Rambo with the other with the one where he's a boxer.
03:34 --> 03:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Rocky.
03:35 --> 03:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Rocky.
03:36 --> 03:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Rocky.
03:37 --> 03:43 [SPEAKER_05]: They're different, but they coexist in the same era, which means maybe they share cinematic universe.
03:43 --> 03:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like it's the same character, just with the different outfit.
03:46 --> 03:47 [SPEAKER_05]: But the point.
03:47 --> 03:48 [SPEAKER_01]: The point.
03:49 --> 03:49 [SPEAKER_05]: First blood.
03:50 --> 03:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh-huh.
03:51 --> 03:53 [SPEAKER_05]: First blood part two is called Rambo.
03:53 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Cool.
03:54 --> 04:03 [SPEAKER_05]: But then there's a movie called Rambo three, which is really first blood three, but maybe she'd be called Rambo two, but it's not called that.
04:04 --> 04:05 [SPEAKER_05]: So here we go.
04:05 --> 04:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Seal.
04:06 --> 04:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Sealed first album is called Seal.
04:10 --> 04:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It's first album.
04:11 --> 04:12 [SPEAKER_05]: His first album is called Seal.
04:13 --> 04:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I need a PowerPoint for this.
04:14 --> 04:19 [SPEAKER_05]: And then he has a second album, which we've mentioned is called Seal, also.
04:19 --> 04:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
04:20 --> 04:26 [SPEAKER_05]: And then his third album is called Human Being, which maybe we can think in our heads is called Seal Three.
04:26 --> 04:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
04:27 --> 04:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Because this fourth album is called seal four with this time with Roman numeral.
04:31 --> 04:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
04:32 --> 04:39 [SPEAKER_05]: This fifth album is called system, which we could probably logically call seal five, right?
04:39 --> 04:44 [SPEAKER_05]: And then the next album is called soul, which I guess we could call seal six, but then he has seal six.
04:45 --> 04:45 [SPEAKER_01]: What?
04:46 --> 04:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Seals six.
04:46 --> 04:47 [SPEAKER_01]: What?
04:47 --> 04:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Seals six coming in.
04:50 --> 04:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Which means soul is not seal six.
04:53 --> 04:55 [SPEAKER_05]: And because then he has an album called Soul Two.
04:56 --> 05:01 [SPEAKER_05]: So clearly soul is like a spin-off series because what these are, the soul series are cover albums.
05:02 --> 05:09 [SPEAKER_05]: And then he has an album called seven, not seal seven, but presumably it kind of is seal seven.
05:09 --> 05:10 [SPEAKER_05]: And then he has an album called standards.
05:11 --> 05:19 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's his last album as I understand it, which maybe we can call seal eight, except that it's a never album of him doing standards, pop standards.
05:20 --> 05:24 [SPEAKER_05]: So maybe it's kind of its own side series.
05:24 --> 05:27 [SPEAKER_05]: So more complicated than Rambo, I think.
05:29 --> 05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: arguably, but also I'm just impressed by like how many albums seal has.
05:33 --> 05:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he's he's been around, you know, and he's kept me.
05:37 --> 05:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're like, and most of our original music, not like there's two covers, like a standard cover.
05:42 --> 05:47 [SPEAKER_05]: And three two soul cover albums and one sort of pop standards, you know, I think it's like kind of.
05:47 --> 05:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Here's some of like what can songs to see cover.
05:50 --> 05:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Like R&B stuff.
05:52 --> 05:52 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
05:52 --> 05:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Should we, should we spur the moment get one up?
05:54 --> 05:55 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
05:55 --> 05:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm, I'm interested.
05:56 --> 05:58 [SPEAKER_05]: I didn't, I didn't listen.
05:58 --> 05:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Let's figure it out.
05:59 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, we're just a track list.
06:01 --> 06:02 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to tell you a track list.
06:02 --> 06:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And if there's something we're desperate to hear live podcasting everybody streams directly to you.
06:08 --> 06:09 [SPEAKER_01]: This is where the magic happened.
06:09 --> 06:09 [SPEAKER_05]: My basement.
06:10 --> 06:11 [SPEAKER_05]: to you.
06:11 --> 06:13 [SPEAKER_01]: We're actually in a state of the art recording studio, guys.
06:13 --> 06:14 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
06:14 --> 06:17 [SPEAKER_01]: People ask me, oh, just your podcast have like a YouTube that we can watch.
06:17 --> 06:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you don't want to see.
06:18 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they don't want to see us.
06:20 --> 06:21 [SPEAKER_01]: What happens?
06:21 --> 06:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
06:22 --> 06:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
06:23 --> 06:26 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's so handsome, right?
06:26 --> 06:27 [SPEAKER_05]: He's he's quite handsome.
06:28 --> 06:29 [SPEAKER_05]: He did marry a super model.
06:29 --> 06:30 [SPEAKER_05]: He did.
06:30 --> 06:31 [SPEAKER_00]: He pulled it off.
06:31 --> 06:33 [SPEAKER_05]: So a change is going to come.
06:33 --> 06:34 [SPEAKER_05]: I can't stand the rain.
06:34 --> 06:35 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a man's man's world.
06:36 --> 06:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Here I am.
06:36 --> 06:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Come and take me.
06:38 --> 06:39 [SPEAKER_05]: I've been loving you too long.
06:39 --> 06:40 [SPEAKER_05]: It's all right.
06:40 --> 06:41 [SPEAKER_05]: who Curtis Mayfield.
06:42 --> 06:44 [SPEAKER_05]: If you don't know me by now, knock on wood.
06:44 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm still in love with you free.
06:45 --> 06:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Stand by me.
06:46 --> 06:47 [SPEAKER_05]: People get ready.
06:47 --> 06:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, soul to track listings.
06:48 --> 06:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Sounds like he's really trying to work for something with those tracks, wishing on a star.
06:53 --> 06:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Love TKO, who baby, baby, let's stay together.
06:56 --> 06:57 [SPEAKER_05]: What's going on?
06:58 --> 06:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Love don't live here anymore.
06:59 --> 07:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Backstabbers.
07:01 --> 07:01 [SPEAKER_05]: I'll be around.
07:02 --> 07:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Love won't let me wait.
07:03 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Lean on me.
07:04 --> 07:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh girl.
07:05 --> 07:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And then fast forward to twenty seventeen standards.
07:08 --> 07:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Luck be a lady.
07:10 --> 07:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Autumn leaves.
07:10 --> 07:11 [SPEAKER_05]: I put a spell on you.
07:12 --> 07:13 [SPEAKER_05]: They can't take that away from me.
07:13 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Anyone who knows what love is.
07:15 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Love for sale.
07:16 --> 07:16 [SPEAKER_05]: My funny Valentine.
07:17 --> 07:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I've got you under my skin.
07:18 --> 07:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Smile.
07:19 --> 07:20 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm beginning to see the light.
07:20 --> 07:21 [SPEAKER_05]: It was a very good year.
07:21 --> 07:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Can we listen to a put a spell on you?
07:24 --> 07:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I put a spell on you.
07:25 --> 07:25 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
07:28 --> 07:34 [SPEAKER_02]: That's great, yes, like a raspiness.
07:55 --> 08:00 [SPEAKER_05]: He has a little bit when you hear the high notes and kiss from a rose, a little raspiness, but I feel like it's more now.
08:00 --> 08:02 [SPEAKER_01]: He's older, he's been through it.
08:02 --> 08:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he's got a little gravel in there.
08:05 --> 08:06 [SPEAKER_01]: This doesn't bet me on returns anymore.
08:07 --> 08:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, so you're bringing us to first of all, wrong.
08:11 --> 08:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well, we'll come back to that.
08:13 --> 08:24 [SPEAKER_05]: We all know, people love a certain age, a certain generation, know to associate this song, kiss from a rose, with one of the most iconic film soundtracks of the nineteen nineties.
08:25 --> 08:26 [SPEAKER_05]: the never ending story three.
08:27 --> 08:28 [SPEAKER_05]: From that to ninety four.
08:28 --> 08:30 [SPEAKER_01]: They made a third one.
08:30 --> 08:31 [SPEAKER_05]: They made a third one.
08:31 --> 08:35 [SPEAKER_05]: And this movie came out the same year as seal two and included.
08:36 --> 08:37 [SPEAKER_05]: This is the film.
08:38 --> 08:40 [SPEAKER_05]: I know that's not what you thought I was going to say.
08:40 --> 08:43 [SPEAKER_05]: This includes kiss from a rose.
08:43 --> 08:44 [SPEAKER_05]: I did not know this.
08:45 --> 08:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Did you see you didn't see.
08:46 --> 08:48 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I didn't even know they made a second one.
08:48 --> 08:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's learn a second one.
08:49 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_05]: The second one was in theaters.
08:51 --> 08:52 [SPEAKER_05]: The second one was weird.
08:53 --> 08:55 [SPEAKER_05]: The main kid was a different kid.
08:55 --> 09:00 [SPEAKER_05]: It was the really, really pretty guy who was in like Lady Bird's, what's Lady Bird's?
09:01 --> 09:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It was Jonathan Brandis.
09:03 --> 09:03 [SPEAKER_01]: What's his name?
09:04 --> 09:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that what it is?
09:04 --> 09:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
09:04 --> 09:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It was in Lady Bugs.
09:06 --> 09:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Lady Bird's.
09:07 --> 09:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you with the guy with the curly hair from city slickers.
09:11 --> 09:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh no, Roddy Dangerfield.
09:12 --> 09:12 [SPEAKER_05]: With Roddy?
09:13 --> 09:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, God.
09:13 --> 09:14 [SPEAKER_05]: I can't believe I couldn't think of Roddy.
09:14 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
09:15 --> 09:17 [SPEAKER_05]: So that guy was Bastion or whatever.
09:17 --> 09:19 [SPEAKER_05]: And it was like they go back and it was just weird.
09:19 --> 09:23 [SPEAKER_05]: I showed the never ending story to my kids recently and I don't think.
09:24 --> 09:28 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know that they, if they certainly didn't appreciate it as much as I wanted to.
09:28 --> 09:38 [SPEAKER_05]: I wanted them too, but also, you know, at the point we watch show, I still, one of my kids in particular was still kind of young, and we were like, guys, I'm just warning you, there's a really sad.
09:38 --> 09:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, my kid was scared of it.
09:40 --> 09:41 [SPEAKER_05]: And they were like, they're much.
09:41 --> 09:41 [SPEAKER_05]: What's the big deal?
09:41 --> 09:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
09:42 --> 09:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, they apparent my kid's hate horses, I guess, are good.
09:46 --> 09:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Rest in peace our tax.
09:49 --> 09:54 [SPEAKER_05]: So because it didn't affect them emotionally like it did when I was whatever years old.
09:54 --> 09:57 [SPEAKER_05]: So yes, they did make a never ending story part three, which I never saw.
09:57 --> 09:58 [SPEAKER_05]: But this
10:01 --> 10:02 [SPEAKER_05]: This soundtrack.
10:03 --> 10:05 [SPEAKER_05]: What is the name of the his mom?
10:05 --> 10:06 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the thing.
10:06 --> 10:08 [SPEAKER_05]: He shouts her name out.
10:08 --> 10:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you know what?
10:08 --> 10:12 [SPEAKER_01]: If you watch it with the subtitles on, she says it.
10:12 --> 10:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you want me to tell you?
10:13 --> 10:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it going to ruin the mystique?
10:15 --> 10:16 [SPEAKER_05]: And tell me.
10:16 --> 10:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Moonchild.
10:17 --> 10:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Moonchild.
10:18 --> 10:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Is that improvised or something?
10:19 --> 10:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Or is it from the book or something?
10:20 --> 10:21 [SPEAKER_01]: It's from the book.
10:21 --> 10:24 [SPEAKER_01]: But like when you, I watch things with subtitles because I read it.
10:24 --> 10:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, sure.
10:24 --> 10:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
10:26 --> 10:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, it says moonchild.
10:28 --> 10:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, there it is.
10:29 --> 10:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just written right there.
10:31 --> 10:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Almost like one of the zapah kids.
10:33 --> 10:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Almost.
10:33 --> 10:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Moon unit.
10:34 --> 10:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
10:34 --> 10:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Moon unit.
10:36 --> 10:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
10:36 --> 10:36 [SPEAKER_05]: So.
10:36 --> 10:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Can't be a real name.
10:38 --> 10:38 [SPEAKER_05]: This soundtrack though.
10:38 --> 10:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Again, one of the greatest soundtracks of the nineties, apparently.
10:41 --> 10:42 [SPEAKER_05]: It also had Rockset.
10:43 --> 10:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Dave Stewart from the rivmix.
10:45 --> 10:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Alia is on this soundtrack.
10:47 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_05]: All right, P. Yeah, RIP.
10:49 --> 10:50 [SPEAKER_05]: And then yellow.
10:50 --> 10:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Remember, oh, yeah, yellow.
10:52 --> 10:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think it's that song.
10:53 --> 10:55 [SPEAKER_01]: No, but you don't remember.
10:55 --> 10:56 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a bow, bow.
10:56 --> 10:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.
10:58 --> 10:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That's out from my first music.
11:00 --> 11:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't really match the vibe of your ending story.
11:03 --> 11:05 [SPEAKER_05]: So to be clear though, we haven't seen it.
11:05 --> 11:07 [SPEAKER_05]: It might actually perfectly match the vibe.
11:08 --> 11:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I'll have to watch it, I guess.
11:09 --> 11:15 [SPEAKER_05]: So we might remember it more from another movie was featured in, which is not.
11:16 --> 11:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Not bad memory turns, but it was a Batman.
11:18 --> 11:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Batman forever.
11:19 --> 11:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, was that a little bit the cat lady?
11:22 --> 11:23 [SPEAKER_05]: The childless cat lady.
11:23 --> 11:24 [SPEAKER_05]: The childless cat lady.
11:25 --> 11:26 [SPEAKER_05]: The childless cat lady.
11:26 --> 11:27 [SPEAKER_01]: What was we shall fight for?
11:28 --> 11:28 [SPEAKER_05]: The fight.
11:29 --> 11:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
11:29 --> 11:31 [SPEAKER_05]: The fight was cat woman.
11:31 --> 11:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Cat woman.
11:32 --> 11:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Cat woman.
11:33 --> 11:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Cat woman.
11:33 --> 11:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Cat woman.
11:35 --> 11:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Cat woman.
11:37 --> 11:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Though this soundtrack kind of felt like a big deal and the song was, but this song, did you see Batman forever?
11:45 --> 11:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I must have.
11:47 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I remember the music video for the song.
11:50 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Totally.
11:50 --> 11:52 [SPEAKER_05]: And we can talk about that.
11:52 --> 11:54 [SPEAKER_05]: This song was only in the credits though, right?
11:54 --> 12:00 [SPEAKER_05]: So this isn't there is music in that movie, but obviously it's totally kind of weird to have this be.
12:02 --> 12:05 [SPEAKER_05]: like a love song like this, a Baroque pop song that we could describe it as.
12:06 --> 12:08 [SPEAKER_05]: But it's in the end credits, but did you have this soundtrack?
12:08 --> 12:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
12:09 --> 12:10 [SPEAKER_05]: So do you remember what's on it?
12:11 --> 12:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember this song.
12:12 --> 12:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I remember dancing to a lot of awkward boy girl dances and middle schoolish to this song.
12:20 --> 12:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So, remind me.
12:21 --> 12:23 [SPEAKER_05]: So, it has the media mist you too song ever.
12:24 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Hold me through me, kiss me, kill me.
12:26 --> 12:28 [SPEAKER_01]: They're all, however, I'm not a YouTube fan.
12:28 --> 12:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, you don't like even good.
12:30 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_05]: You don't like great YouTube?
12:32 --> 12:34 [SPEAKER_01]: What name won great you too song?
12:35 --> 12:37 [SPEAKER_05]: name one great with or without you.
12:37 --> 12:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
12:38 --> 12:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I guess that one's pretty good.
12:39 --> 12:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:39 --> 12:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
12:40 --> 12:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
12:40 --> 12:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I just don't like how they took over my eye.
12:42 --> 12:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I phone that time.
12:44 --> 12:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Sunday, bloody set.
12:44 --> 12:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
12:45 --> 12:49 [SPEAKER_05]: The iPhone hijacking the force sale or whatever for free or whatever.
12:49 --> 12:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:49 --> 12:52 [SPEAKER_05]: It was a better but hold me through me kiss me kill me's on this.
12:52 --> 12:54 [SPEAKER_05]: There's PJ Harvey.
12:54 --> 12:55 [SPEAKER_05]: There's Brandy.
12:55 --> 12:56 [SPEAKER_05]: There's Mass of Attack.
12:56 --> 12:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Nazzy star.
12:58 --> 12:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Awesome.
12:58 --> 12:59 [SPEAKER_05]: I love Offspring.
12:59 --> 13:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Nick Cave.
13:00 --> 13:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Method man.
13:02 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Sunny day real estate.
13:04 --> 13:06 [SPEAKER_05]: and the flaming lips as well as a couple of the flaming lips.
13:06 --> 13:07 [SPEAKER_05]: The flaming lips, do you?
13:07 --> 13:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe you didn't have this because I didn't have it.
13:09 --> 13:12 [SPEAKER_05]: But like it's something that was just in the air.
13:12 --> 13:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
13:12 --> 13:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Really only five of them are actually in the movie.
13:15 --> 13:18 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's like one of those where it's like a fancy compound.
13:18 --> 13:27 [SPEAKER_05]: They were trying to do that nineties soundtrack thing in the pre Napster and pre streaming days where hey, let's sell a compilation to the teenagers.
13:27 --> 13:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
13:28 --> 13:30 [SPEAKER_01]: To have the offspring and the flaming lips in the same album.
13:30 --> 13:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's iconic.
13:31 --> 13:32 [SPEAKER_05]: The offspring.
13:32 --> 13:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I said that.
13:33 --> 13:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Sorry.
13:34 --> 13:35 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't remember what I know.
13:36 --> 13:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Totally the offspring yet to or Mazzy star and sunny day real estate.
13:40 --> 13:46 [SPEAKER_05]: I guess those are both kind of like dauer and anyways, but I don't know.
13:46 --> 13:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Is that too?
13:47 --> 13:48 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I think that's a war.
13:48 --> 13:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, do you have thoughts on the baton the nineties Batman series in general?
13:53 --> 13:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah, I mean, do I have thoughts on the nineties Batman series?
13:58 --> 13:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, by the way, I'm crazy.
13:59 --> 14:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Lawrence, don't write in.
14:00 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Batman Forever is not the one with Catwoman.
14:03 --> 14:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Catwoman is Batman Returns.
14:05 --> 14:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I was right.
14:06 --> 14:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Michelle Fiverr is in the second Batman movie, which the first Batman movie and the second one are both Tim Burton movies.
14:12 --> 14:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
14:13 --> 14:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And then, what's the penguin?
14:14 --> 14:17 [SPEAKER_05]: The first one has, you know, a Prince soundtrack, right?
14:17 --> 14:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Prince Led soundtrack.
14:18 --> 14:20 [SPEAKER_05]: The penguin is in the second one, Joker's in the first.
14:21 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_05]: This is the one where they turned Lorraine's over.
14:24 --> 14:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Is this Joel Schumacher?
14:26 --> 14:27 [SPEAKER_01]: This is where things start getting weird.
14:28 --> 14:30 [SPEAKER_05]: This isn't the one with the nipples on the bat suit.
14:30 --> 14:31 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the fourth one.
14:31 --> 14:32 [SPEAKER_01]: That's where they lost me.
14:33 --> 14:34 [SPEAKER_05]: They lost you on the nipples.
14:34 --> 14:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't like Ben F. Black involved in some.
14:36 --> 14:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, Ben F. Black's way later.
14:37 --> 14:39 [SPEAKER_05]: That's this one's Joe Schumacher.
14:39 --> 14:40 [SPEAKER_05]: It's so his Batman or Robin.
14:40 --> 14:42 [SPEAKER_05]: This is the one with
14:44 --> 14:47 [SPEAKER_05]: with Val Kilmer as Batman.
14:47 --> 14:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
14:48 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_05]: And Chris O'Donnell as Robin and Uma Thurman as Poison Ivy.
14:53 --> 14:55 [SPEAKER_05]: And no, I'm wrong.
14:56 --> 14:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god.
14:56 --> 14:57 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to get it together.
14:58 --> 15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: One of the fact that you haven't had any of this information in your head.
15:02 --> 15:03 [SPEAKER_05]: No, it's Nicole Kidman is the love interest.
15:04 --> 15:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It's Chris Pine.
15:05 --> 15:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Right?
15:06 --> 15:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Chris Pine was like a kid.
15:08 --> 15:09 [SPEAKER_05]: No, okay, this is, let me start over.
15:09 --> 15:10 [SPEAKER_05]: This is the one.
15:11 --> 15:16 [SPEAKER_05]: This is the one Valcomer is Batman, Chris O'Donnell's Robin, Jim Carrey as the Riddler.
15:17 --> 15:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
15:17 --> 15:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And Tommy Lee Jones as two-face.
15:20 --> 15:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And then Nicole Kimman.
15:21 --> 15:25 [SPEAKER_05]: So this is not the one with Uma Thurman as Poison Ivy.
15:25 --> 15:29 [SPEAKER_05]: And Jill Out, Schwarzenegger is Mr. Prisoner.
15:29 --> 15:31 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the later one that happened to this one.
15:31 --> 15:31 [SPEAKER_01]: That's it.
15:31 --> 15:32 [SPEAKER_05]: I didn't see that one.
15:32 --> 15:33 [SPEAKER_01]: I stopped at this one.
15:33 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_01]: He stopped at this one.
15:34 --> 15:36 [SPEAKER_05]: But you heard kiss from a rose.
15:36 --> 15:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, those killmers just like, you know, it's so good.
15:41 --> 15:45 [SPEAKER_01]: especially like if you think of the door's movie where he played Jim Morrison.
15:45 --> 15:47 [SPEAKER_05]: So that's what I was gonna actually say.
15:47 --> 15:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
15:48 --> 15:55 [SPEAKER_05]: I saw that not in the theaters but close to when it came out and probably was too young maybe to see it.
15:57 --> 16:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And it kind of, it's such an unappeal in my opinion, an unappealing look at Jim Morrison as a person.
16:03 --> 16:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, he was kind of unappealing.
16:05 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_05]: That it made me like kind of not like Val Kilmer at the time.
16:08 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, how funny.
16:10 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I had like the inverse reaction, like I was so enthralled by Jim Morrison as like as a broken person that I could probably fix.
16:19 --> 16:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And he was so cute that every time I think of the doors, I think of Val Kilmar, like as short.
16:27 --> 16:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And like I can't separate.
16:28 --> 16:31 [SPEAKER_05]: I think there's something about somebody who's just a profoundly bad bandmate.
16:34 --> 16:41 [SPEAKER_05]: like a bad band made and that that kind of bummed me out back then and it bums me out now and there's some artists I want to talk about later in the season that that's true for.
16:43 --> 16:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's why I like him because he's like a bad boy.
16:45 --> 16:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, well, clearly, that's what part of his greatness.
16:48 --> 16:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
16:49 --> 16:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Batman returns.
16:50 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about Batman forever.
16:52 --> 16:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Batman returns as the one with Michelle Fifer and Danny Divido as the Joker.
16:56 --> 16:57 [SPEAKER_05]: She's Catwoman.
16:57 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That might be my favorite one.
16:59 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_05]: It's pretty cool.
16:59 --> 17:00 [SPEAKER_05]: It's weird.
17:00 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a Tim Burton.
17:01 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Tim Burton.
17:02 --> 17:02 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like Beetlejuice.
17:03 --> 17:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Which I'm in too.
17:04 --> 17:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I like to get that aesthetic for sure.
17:06 --> 17:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
17:06 --> 17:07 [SPEAKER_01]: This hits different.
17:08 --> 17:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It seems much more commercial and eager to like check off some box office boxes.
17:14 --> 17:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Sure.
17:14 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_05]: More villains.
17:15 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
17:15 --> 17:16 [SPEAKER_05]: More merchandise to sale.
17:16 --> 17:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It's our Batman generally as a franchise.
17:19 --> 17:22 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not my favorite, but I think he's like a great gay icon.
17:23 --> 17:27 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that's part of the part of what makes the Schumacher movies tick.
17:27 --> 17:35 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that's the camp of that aspect, which pissed a lot of people off because Batman in the nineties was kind of
17:36 --> 17:41 [SPEAKER_05]: had been remade to be sort of the gum and serious.
17:42 --> 17:52 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, like, if you think of the eighties and nineties, kind of the comic direction, which I didn't read comic books, but I've read some graphic novels and stuff of like the Dark Knight Returns.
17:52 --> 17:57 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like the brooding old man Batman, which is just totally different from the nipples on the bat suit and all that.
17:57 --> 17:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want that.
17:59 --> 18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: George Clooney.
18:00 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, give me a break.
18:02 --> 18:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, I will give you break.
18:03 --> 18:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Let's talk about Batman, except that we can say one more thing allegedly.
18:08 --> 18:17 [SPEAKER_05]: And this, I don't know how you verify this because it's not a real person, but February and I teeth everybody, seals birthday, is allegedly Bruce Wayne's birthday.
18:18 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_01]: What?
18:19 --> 18:22 [SPEAKER_05]: So, where seal as Bruce Wayne slash Batman?
18:22 --> 18:24 [SPEAKER_01]: That, I wouldn't see.
18:24 --> 18:24 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
18:25 --> 18:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Never had a black Batman.
18:27 --> 18:29 [SPEAKER_05]: I didn't any of the movies, yeah, I think.
18:30 --> 18:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, you're right.
18:31 --> 18:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, totally.
18:31 --> 18:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's time.
18:32 --> 18:36 [SPEAKER_05]: I wonder if that in the comic books, you know, there was like one character becomes another character.
18:37 --> 18:39 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if it may as have may have happened.
18:39 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Lorounds, you don't need to write in.
18:41 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_05]: We don't need to know.
18:42 --> 18:42 [SPEAKER_05]: We won't.
18:42 --> 18:45 [SPEAKER_05]: We will come to you next time you have a Batman episode and listen.
18:45 --> 18:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because we need help.
18:46 --> 18:48 [SPEAKER_01]: We need some support here.
18:48 --> 18:49 [SPEAKER_01]: We're all over the place.
18:49 --> 18:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about seal kiss from a rose.
18:51 --> 18:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Baroque pop.
18:52 --> 18:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so how do you see both videos of this?
18:55 --> 18:56 [SPEAKER_05]: I think on Batman, I guess.
18:56 --> 18:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Both videos.
18:58 --> 18:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no, I haven't seen both.
18:59 --> 19:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I've just seen like the Batman, like Batman video.
19:02 --> 19:03 [SPEAKER_05]: There's a Batman one, which.
19:03 --> 19:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like on the rooftop.
19:06 --> 19:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and it cuts to Batman, it cuts to Nicole Kidman, and it's still singing in front of the bat, like the bats in the bat.
19:12 --> 19:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's what I'm familiar with.
19:14 --> 19:18 [SPEAKER_05]: If you watch that had a context, like you didn't know this was in a movie, you feel like the hell.
19:18 --> 19:21 [SPEAKER_05]: It's one of the great non-secreters of all time.
19:21 --> 19:25 [SPEAKER_05]: If you just watched that movie, not knowing that this was in the end credits of a Batman film.
19:26 --> 19:32 [SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, there's an original one, because this movie came out a year later than the single, like this single popped off.
19:33 --> 19:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Ninety ninety five when the movie came out not Ninety ninety four when the album came out he's both he's equally booty in the handsome in both videos the first one It's you know him cutting between him and you know a woman a beautiful woman that he's probably pining after or whatever and putting a rose on the grave of or whatever So yeah this song we ready yeah so produced by Trevor horn do you know that is
19:57 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_01]: No, but I love the name Trevor.
19:59 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah.
20:00 --> 20:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I just think it's cool.
20:00 --> 20:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Trevor's a cool.
20:02 --> 20:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Ninety skater name.
20:03 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I love it.
20:04 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Trevor.
20:04 --> 20:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
20:05 --> 20:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Shout out to the Trevor's was last time you went to a skate park, right?
20:08 --> 20:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I actually know a Trevor.
20:09 --> 20:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
20:10 --> 20:10 [SPEAKER_01]: In real life.
20:10 --> 20:10 [SPEAKER_05]: He's a skater.
20:11 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like a nine year old boy.
20:12 --> 20:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, well, it's so wild.
20:14 --> 20:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think so.
20:15 --> 20:16 [SPEAKER_05]: It's okay.
20:16 --> 20:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's okay.
20:17 --> 20:18 [SPEAKER_05]: When's Mark coming back?
20:18 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_05]: I haven't met a mark under the age of maybe thirty five ever.
20:22 --> 20:22 [SPEAKER_01]: You know what?
20:22 --> 20:23 [SPEAKER_01]: That's so funny.
20:23 --> 20:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe a Marcus or something like that.
20:25 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Marcus the most.
20:27 --> 20:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Gen X and I'm the last Mark basically.
20:29 --> 20:30 [SPEAKER_01]: You're the last.
20:30 --> 20:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm the last Mark.
20:31 --> 20:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I feel like they ran out of juice.
20:33 --> 20:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So the plot of never ending story four.
20:35 --> 20:36 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
20:36 --> 20:37 [SPEAKER_01]: They found you last Mark.
20:37 --> 20:41 [SPEAKER_05]: So Trevor Horn is the guy from the Buggles video killed the radio itself.
20:41 --> 20:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
20:41 --> 20:43 [SPEAKER_05]: And he produced this record.
20:43 --> 20:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Weird.
20:44 --> 20:45 [SPEAKER_05]: And so kiss from a rose itself.
20:59 --> 21:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, the lyrics are kind of weird.
21:10 --> 21:13 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't really understand where he's going.
21:13 --> 21:19 [SPEAKER_05]: And apparently, seals refused all these years to explain that line in particular.
21:19 --> 21:20 [SPEAKER_01]: The rose is in bloom.
21:21 --> 21:24 [SPEAKER_05]: The light hits the, the light hits the gloom on the grave.
21:24 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_05]: What is the light?
21:25 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
21:25 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_01]: The moon on the grave.
21:26 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
21:26 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Either way, like it's, it's very strange.
21:29 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_01]: It's very strange.
21:29 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_01]: The moon, I'm kind of, it's beautiful.
21:32 --> 21:33 [SPEAKER_05]: It's, it sounds beautiful.
21:33 --> 21:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
21:34 --> 21:37 [SPEAKER_05]: But I don't, I can't say that I understand really where he's going with it.
21:38 --> 21:39 [SPEAKER_01]: He probably doesn't know either.
21:40 --> 21:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, maybe he just he used an AI early early mid nineties AI.
21:45 --> 21:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Um, this is clearly feels biggest hit.
21:48 --> 21:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
21:48 --> 21:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Number one in the USA from seal we already mentioned is this the first seal you heard.
21:54 --> 21:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
21:55 --> 21:57 [SPEAKER_05]: So you didn't hear crazy when it came out.
21:58 --> 21:59 [SPEAKER_05]: So crazy was nineteen ninety one.
21:59 --> 22:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, I have
22:06 --> 22:07 [SPEAKER_02]: This is a great song, too.
22:11 --> 22:12 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a great song.
22:12 --> 22:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, crazy is great.
22:13 --> 22:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I, even better.
22:15 --> 22:21 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know that I knew, well, it's a little more, it makes a little more sense on pop radio, frankly.
22:21 --> 22:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Because from a rose is very, you know, like I said, Baroque pop, this term of like, you know, think Paul McCartney on Sergeant Pepper's or the left banker, some moody blues where it's like classical.
22:32 --> 22:37 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, this, the song has an oboe in it, which, you know, haven't heard a lot of oboe since
22:38 --> 22:40 [SPEAKER_05]: I got you, babe, right, though.
22:40 --> 22:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Are we talking about Baroque?
22:41 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a reference to like Baroque painting or the Baroque style.
22:45 --> 22:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Baroque music, right?
22:46 --> 22:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Like Bach, right?
22:47 --> 22:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think a Baroque painting, which is like really, sure.
22:50 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Realistic stylized, a lot of like jazz, hero, like hyper contrasting like contrasting.
22:56 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
22:56 --> 23:00 [SPEAKER_05]: And Baroque music is also about a strong contrast between sections and stuff.
23:00 --> 23:02 [SPEAKER_05]: But but I think the term is
23:03 --> 23:06 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, I've even heard people say baroque and roll, Baroque and roll.
23:07 --> 23:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
23:08 --> 23:10 [SPEAKER_05]: I think Baroque is just sort of arbitrarily chosen.
23:10 --> 23:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Like it's not literally Baroque music.
23:12 --> 23:14 [SPEAKER_05]: It's just sort of means classically.
23:14 --> 23:24 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like if you take prog rock or art rock, Baroque pop is going to be kind of a little gentler, a little more pretty and classical without as much
23:25 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_05]: weird experimental stuff like.
23:27 --> 23:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And it has like some drama to it.
23:29 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like when you say Baroque pop, I think of like high highs, low lows, like dramatic.
23:35 --> 23:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think that's right.
23:36 --> 23:42 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's not you're not gonna have rush rush is progressive rock, but not Baroque pop, right?
23:42 --> 23:48 [SPEAKER_05]: But when you've got like an orchestra behind the moody blues, you could say maybe that's some of those songs are Baroque pop.
23:48 --> 23:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:48 --> 23:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the moody blues is a good connection to make when I think of kiss from a rose, like it hits like the moody blues for me a little bit.
23:55 --> 23:58 [SPEAKER_05]: orchestra in there and all that kind of fun time changes and stuff.
23:58 --> 24:06 [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't think I knew crazy was I didn't know who seal was, but I heard crazy on the radio a bunch when I was little.
24:06 --> 24:14 [SPEAKER_05]: But that one only hit number seven though higher in the UK and kiss from a rose only hit four and so seals British by the way.
24:14 --> 24:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Sure.
24:16 --> 24:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Kiss from a rose weirdly hit way more in the US than it did in the UK, but then the opposite with crazy.
24:24 --> 24:25 [SPEAKER_05]: And is it Batman?
24:26 --> 24:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it?
24:26 --> 24:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's the most.
24:27 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_05]: It's gotta be.
24:28 --> 24:30 [SPEAKER_05]: But it's just like when you think of the cross section.
24:30 --> 24:39 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I loved Batman as a kid and I loved this song, but it feels like a weird cross section of people that would be into this kind.
24:39 --> 24:40 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a very adult song.
24:41 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not why did this hit me when I was twelve or whatever.
24:44 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
24:45 --> 24:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I think for me it was like, it felt really romantic to me.
24:48 --> 24:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It felt like an opportunity to like, look at your crush from across the room and like, swim for them when you heard the song.
24:55 --> 24:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that was appealing to me.
24:57 --> 24:59 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that was the goal and I think that it worked.
24:59 --> 25:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Once again, talked about it before, why I didn't go to middle school dances.
25:05 --> 25:09 [SPEAKER_05]: So okay, he had another single from this album that I didn't know I'll just play it just for fun.
25:09 --> 25:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Call prayer for the dying.
25:11 --> 25:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh.
25:22 --> 25:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I know that song.
25:24 --> 25:24 [SPEAKER_05]: You do.
25:24 --> 25:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I do.
25:25 --> 25:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I could sing it.
25:25 --> 25:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I, when you were playing it, I was like, I know the lyrics.
25:28 --> 25:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I know the melody.
25:29 --> 25:30 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not for sure.
25:30 --> 25:31 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a cool song.
25:31 --> 25:31 [SPEAKER_05]: I like it a lot.
25:32 --> 25:35 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't remember it though, which is while I never have this record or anything like that.
25:36 --> 25:41 [SPEAKER_05]: And the only kind of the last thing that I feel like was you could say in the US was a hit.
25:42 --> 25:59 [SPEAKER_05]: was fly like an eagle right his cover that was sealed to yeah he will it's a cover right of right of steve Miller but um space-traum soundtrack another oh man another nineties gem there i think i need to watch space jam we end up talking about a lot yeah it's come up a few times on this podcast
26:00 --> 26:01 [SPEAKER_01]: in weird context.
26:01 --> 26:05 [SPEAKER_05]: So last random thing before we jump in, did you know that seal started out?
26:05 --> 26:06 [SPEAKER_05]: A singer in a funk band?
26:07 --> 26:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I believe it.
26:07 --> 26:08 [SPEAKER_05]: A British funk band?
26:08 --> 26:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
26:09 --> 26:10 [SPEAKER_05]: He sounds cool.
26:10 --> 26:11 [SPEAKER_05]: This song's called Lay It On The Line.
26:11 --> 26:12 [SPEAKER_05]: They're called Push.
26:18 --> 26:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Sounds very generic why kind of never British funk band lower production values right a little more indie
26:54 --> 26:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Cool, so this song, we mentioned it's Baroque pop.
26:57 --> 26:59 [SPEAKER_05]: There's a lot of fancy to it.
26:59 --> 27:00 [SPEAKER_05]: There's a lot we could talk about here.
27:01 --> 27:04 [SPEAKER_05]: The verses, the first two verses, or the song is in six eight.
27:05 --> 27:05 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
27:06 --> 27:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Comparing one.
27:07 --> 27:13 [SPEAKER_05]: One and a two and if my students count it, one, two, three, four, five, six, I get really mad at them.
27:13 --> 27:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, really?
27:14 --> 27:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's a one.
27:16 --> 27:44 [SPEAKER_05]: a chipplet based kind of like triplets based it that's called compound meter and the verses go to nine eight what's that the Latin here's what's crazy the last first doesn't it's days six eight and so the last first has this weird kind of hiccup where things seemed rush and that's not what we're talking about today but it's another thing I'm threatening you listeners here's what you could have had compound meter breaks my students minds you too could be broken by me but instead we're talking about something else
27:46 --> 27:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Remember when we did baby baby baby.
27:48 --> 27:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
27:48 --> 27:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Bye.
27:49 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_05]: TLC.
27:50 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
27:51 --> 27:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I made you figure out what key it was in.
27:54 --> 27:55 [SPEAKER_05]: And I did.
27:55 --> 27:56 [SPEAKER_05]: And we got it.
27:56 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_05]: And I agreed with your final thing.
27:58 --> 28:01 [SPEAKER_05]: But as I recall, the sheet music was wrong in your opinion.
28:02 --> 28:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And in yours.
28:03 --> 28:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
28:03 --> 28:05 [SPEAKER_05]: The sheet music was something we disagreed with.
28:06 --> 28:06 [SPEAKER_05]: We've had a lot of that.
28:06 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_05]: We had that on the Green Day episode.
28:08 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
28:08 --> 28:09 [SPEAKER_05]: In correct.
28:09 --> 28:13 [SPEAKER_05]: That's just they had the college freshman intern do it.
28:13 --> 28:14 [SPEAKER_05]: The Green Day ones inexcusable.
28:15 --> 28:16 [SPEAKER_05]: So this time we're going to do that again.
28:16 --> 28:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
28:16 --> 28:17 [SPEAKER_05]: A quest in adventure.
28:18 --> 28:19 [SPEAKER_05]: But this time simpler.
28:20 --> 28:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Is this song in major or is this song in minor?
28:24 --> 28:25 [SPEAKER_05]: That's what we're doing.
28:26 --> 28:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I already have an opinion.
28:27 --> 28:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Already have an opinion.
28:27 --> 28:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Let's hear your.
28:28 --> 28:30 [SPEAKER_05]: So this is this is how science.
28:30 --> 28:32 [SPEAKER_05]: This is what happens when you go to grad school or whatever.
28:32 --> 28:35 [SPEAKER_05]: We're going to decide before we've seen the fact tell me what's your opinion.
28:35 --> 28:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's in minor.
28:36 --> 28:36 [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's in minor.
28:37 --> 28:37 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
28:38 --> 28:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Am I right?
28:39 --> 28:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe.
28:40 --> 28:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, that's all.
28:41 --> 28:48 [SPEAKER_05]: What we're going to, what we're going to see, see, I'm making fun of our lack of scientific method, but no, that is what you call a hypothesis, right?
28:48 --> 28:54 [SPEAKER_05]: So actually our investigation, it's okay if you start with a little, a little assumption as long as you're not.
28:54 --> 28:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Because you have to prove or just prove the hypothesis.
28:56 --> 28:57 [SPEAKER_05]: So we're going to prove or just prove that hypothesis.
28:58 --> 29:04 [SPEAKER_05]: So listeners, put in the comments what you, oh, wait, no, this isn't a YouTube video.
29:04 --> 29:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Just listen, we'll see if it's major, a minor, we'll see if Nicole's right.
29:08 --> 29:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Let's listen to the chorus.
29:09 --> 29:11 [SPEAKER_05]: I say one more time, but probably we'll come back to it again.
29:11 --> 29:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's the harmonies.
29:35 --> 29:37 [SPEAKER_05]: The chords or the vocal harmonies.
29:37 --> 29:38 [SPEAKER_05]: The vocal harmonies sound minor.
29:39 --> 29:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, to me.
29:40 --> 29:51 [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm going to put out the other that it sounds a little bit of both going on to it sounds also there's there's something about it that feels a little major and something about it that feels a little minor.
29:51 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_05]: The song is in G. There's a G major scale.
30:02 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And if we say a song is in G major, that means it's more or less using the notes from that scale.
30:09 --> 30:13 [SPEAKER_05]: But if we say a song is in G minor, it means we're mostly using the notes from this scale.
30:23 --> 30:28 [SPEAKER_05]: And when we listen to the song though, there's elements of both of them, which is a little weird.
30:28 --> 30:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Now, but you're saying that overall vibe feels minor.
30:31 --> 30:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It feels like
30:33 --> 30:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Minor wins, right?
30:34 --> 30:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
30:35 --> 30:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Like it just has like a heaviness to it and doesn't have a lift that I would associate with like a major key.
30:41 --> 30:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Sure.
30:41 --> 30:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Notable.
30:42 --> 30:42 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's good.
30:43 --> 30:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Got reaction, right?
30:45 --> 30:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Just like the lift, the sense of it, the feel of it.
30:48 --> 30:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
30:48 --> 30:49 [SPEAKER_01]: The vibe.
30:49 --> 30:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a minor vibe.
30:50 --> 30:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's on the rooftop.
30:51 --> 30:51 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a grave.
30:51 --> 30:52 [SPEAKER_05]: There's a grave.
30:52 --> 30:52 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a grave.
30:52 --> 30:53 [SPEAKER_01]: There's some reason.
30:53 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_01]: There's some reason the moon's hitting it.
30:54 --> 30:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And the rose is blooming.
30:56 --> 30:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It seems like a weird sexual innuendo, but it's probably not.
30:59 --> 31:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Also the bat signal, the bat signal that feels minor.
31:02 --> 31:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Feel like the bass in this.
31:04 --> 31:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Like looming.
31:04 --> 31:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
31:05 --> 31:07 [SPEAKER_05]: So listen to the very beginning of the song.
31:07 --> 31:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Here's our famous Obo solo.
31:09 --> 31:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Does this also sound minor?
31:23 --> 31:25 [SPEAKER_01]: No, that sounds super major to me.
31:25 --> 31:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Super major.
31:26 --> 31:27 [SPEAKER_05]: It's weird.
31:27 --> 31:29 [SPEAKER_05]: So what's happening is we have three chords.
31:30 --> 31:33 [SPEAKER_05]: The first two are minor, they're not minor chords, but they're from minor.
31:34 --> 31:38 [SPEAKER_05]: E flat major and F major, which they're major chords, but they exist in G minor.
31:39 --> 31:41 [SPEAKER_05]: But then it ends on the G major chord.
31:41 --> 31:46 [SPEAKER_05]: So we go like, we're in minor, we're in minor, Tata, we're in G major, listen again.
31:46 --> 31:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Listen to the, when he goes, but a, da, da, da, da, da.
31:51 --> 31:54 [SPEAKER_05]: When he hits that, it's this bright, beautiful major G chord.
31:54 --> 31:56 [SPEAKER_05]: When the rest of it is super minor sounding.
32:08 --> 32:08 [SPEAKER_01]: wild.
32:09 --> 32:11 [SPEAKER_01]: All I'm thinking about for some reason is Robin Hood men and tights.
32:11 --> 32:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know why.
32:12 --> 32:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Robin Hood men and tights.
32:15 --> 32:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Is that an iconic ninety sound track, too?
32:17 --> 32:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think so.
32:18 --> 32:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Just a little like true.
32:20 --> 32:23 [SPEAKER_05]: There's a mandaland or something.
32:24 --> 32:34 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that's a mandaland, but it's being played almost like an allude from a country.
32:35 --> 32:38 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not reminding you of something that's a period piece.
32:38 --> 32:42 [SPEAKER_05]: It's reminding you of a parody of a period piece, which is an interesting difference.
32:42 --> 32:48 [SPEAKER_05]: So let's, in terms of just getting to the bottom of what I mean when I'm saying is this major or minor.
32:48 --> 32:54 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to give you three simplified versions of just me on the piano playing this bit.
32:55 --> 33:01 [SPEAKER_05]: First, the way it is with the first two chords being from minor and then the third one bringing in the majorness.
33:08 --> 33:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
33:09 --> 33:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Now here is it if I just keep everything minor.
33:12 --> 33:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
33:19 --> 33:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's how I like hear this song in my heart.
33:23 --> 33:26 [SPEAKER_05]: But that last chord sounds totally different than what I really like.
33:26 --> 33:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it like is it.
33:28 --> 33:29 [SPEAKER_05]: So I have a feeling I'm predicting.
33:30 --> 33:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Here's my hypothesis.
33:31 --> 33:34 [SPEAKER_05]: You're not kind of like the version when I make the whole thing major.
33:34 --> 33:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Probably not.
33:37 --> 33:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So numb.
33:41 --> 33:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Sounds like a wiggles version of the song.
33:44 --> 33:45 [SPEAKER_05]: It does sound really terrible.
33:45 --> 33:53 [SPEAKER_05]: And that lens us too, or starting assumption that this is in minor with some bleed of major maybe works.
33:53 --> 33:58 [SPEAKER_05]: It is more likely to be correct because that sounds like a different song.
33:58 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like a stupid song.
34:01 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_05]: It sounds like a top ten single to me, but.
34:04 --> 34:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's a form.
34:05 --> 34:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like easy.
34:06 --> 34:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's too easy.
34:07 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a little bit bigger.
34:09 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And you even said,
34:11 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, Batman was brooding handsome.
34:14 --> 34:16 [SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't sound brooding your handsome.
34:16 --> 34:17 [SPEAKER_05]: That's on now.
34:17 --> 34:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Also, she mentions the Wiggles, the Wiggles are the top selling Australian artists of all time.
34:21 --> 34:22 [SPEAKER_05]: So if that wasn't Wiggles version.
34:23 --> 34:24 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe it would be a huge hit.
34:25 --> 34:26 [SPEAKER_05]: However, not in the Batman forever.
34:26 --> 34:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Soundtrack.
34:27 --> 34:27 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
34:27 --> 34:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe like after Locky divorced Emma.
34:30 --> 34:31 [SPEAKER_05]: We're going there again.
34:31 --> 34:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
34:31 --> 34:32 [SPEAKER_05]: That takes us way back.
34:32 --> 34:34 [SPEAKER_05]: That's like third eye blind episode.
34:34 --> 34:36 [SPEAKER_05]: We talked about the little shit's bump.
34:36 --> 34:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my gosh.
34:37 --> 34:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, well, we've moved on from that early until any of us have kids.
34:40 --> 34:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Now there's like funny wiggles.
34:42 --> 34:44 [SPEAKER_01]: There's not just a thought for anymore.
34:44 --> 34:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I think there's different chapters in the country.
34:46 --> 34:48 [SPEAKER_01]: No, there's like eight wiggles now.
34:48 --> 34:49 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a collective.
34:49 --> 34:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a collective.
34:50 --> 34:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, like Chamba Womba or like Wu Tang, like where there's no, no.
34:54 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, but there's so many.
34:55 --> 34:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
34:56 --> 34:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And some of them are pretty handsome.
34:58 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Why do you still follow them, even though your daughter's like holding up that she's teaching music.
35:03 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Fascinating.
35:04 --> 35:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just fascinating.
35:05 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Like the whole, in Anthony still there is like the longest standing wiggle.
35:10 --> 35:10 [SPEAKER_05]: He's the elder statesman.
35:11 --> 35:11 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
35:11 --> 35:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes it takes a shirt off.
35:12 --> 35:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, that's so bad.
35:13 --> 35:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
35:14 --> 35:14 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
35:14 --> 35:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, everybody.
35:15 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: He's burning in handsome.
35:17 --> 35:18 [SPEAKER_05]: This is what keeps me cool.
35:18 --> 35:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Come and back to the podcast.
35:20 --> 35:20 [SPEAKER_01]: You three happen tonight.
35:20 --> 35:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Wiggles talk.
35:21 --> 35:25 [SPEAKER_05]: So the difference between major and minor.
35:26 --> 35:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Keys, I played you the scale, but the difference just between the chord major and minor, like a G major and a G minor, is really just one note.
35:35 --> 35:41 [SPEAKER_05]: So if we play the first three notes of the scale, we get to this third note, which is different.
35:41 --> 35:47 [SPEAKER_05]: So here, you're gonna hear GAB, which is, you know, do-ray me if we were gonna do it with soul-fed syllables.
35:50 --> 35:53 [SPEAKER_05]: And in minor, all we do is change that third note down from me to me.
35:54 --> 35:55 [SPEAKER_05]: It's lower by a half step.
35:57 --> 35:59 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's the dada dada dada dada.
35:59 --> 36:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
36:01 --> 36:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
36:01 --> 36:05 [SPEAKER_05]: So what's going on in his intro is when he starts that dada dada.
36:05 --> 36:06 [SPEAKER_05]: We're getting in the May.
36:07 --> 36:11 [SPEAKER_05]: But then when we reached the last chord, the third chord, he changed it to me.
36:11 --> 36:13 [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm going to play the intro again.
36:13 --> 36:16 [SPEAKER_05]: But this time I'm playing the piano, the B flat.
36:16 --> 36:18 [SPEAKER_05]: The May turns into being after all me.
36:18 --> 36:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
36:19 --> 36:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And not you me.
36:21 --> 36:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Listen.
36:33 --> 36:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Your face is so pleased to hear so.
36:35 --> 36:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Play with myself also.
36:36 --> 36:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm doing it.
36:37 --> 36:42 [SPEAKER_05]: The piano didn't occur in the first phrase and I'm like, oh crap, did I play the wrong file and I was like, oh, there it is.
36:43 --> 36:46 [SPEAKER_05]: But you hear how they, it was flat and then it perked up for that.
36:46 --> 36:47 [SPEAKER_05]: And so we get this moment of major.
36:48 --> 36:49 [SPEAKER_05]: And so this is a thing.
36:51 --> 37:04 [SPEAKER_05]: And it makes sense in a broke pop song like this ending a phrase or a song that's in a minor key, but with a major chord goes way back like hundreds of years back to Robinhood men and tights time.
37:05 --> 37:10 [SPEAKER_05]: The name is comedies of speaking of Rodney Dangerfield.
37:10 --> 37:10 [SPEAKER_05]: He's in that too.
37:10 --> 37:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think he's in it.
37:12 --> 37:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Mark during the edit, he's not.
37:14 --> 37:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Isn't he the fryer talk or something?
37:16 --> 37:18 [SPEAKER_05]: No, I think I'm confusing.
37:18 --> 37:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Yep, that was Mel Brooks.
37:19 --> 37:20 [SPEAKER_05]: It's been a long time.
37:20 --> 37:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I think he's the fryer.
37:22 --> 37:24 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he's a sneeze.
37:24 --> 37:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, he's a sneeze.
37:27 --> 37:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.
37:28 --> 37:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, it's been a long time, everybody.
37:30 --> 37:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
37:30 --> 37:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, Blinken.
37:31 --> 37:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I said, hey, Blinken.
37:32 --> 37:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my gosh.
37:35 --> 37:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Wait, it's funny.
37:36 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Blinken, these are, these are characters, right?
37:39 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
37:39 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, gosh, I barely remember.
37:40 --> 37:42 [SPEAKER_03]: But clear that, dude.
37:42 --> 37:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, so you're ending a minor moment on major like this.
38:03 --> 38:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Can I drop a term?
38:04 --> 38:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Sure.
38:05 --> 38:07 [SPEAKER_05]: This is called a Pickardy third.
38:07 --> 38:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, that could be like John Luke Picard with a Y. Don't get me started.
38:11 --> 38:12 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, you started.
38:12 --> 38:13 [SPEAKER_05]: I we've talked about Star Trek before.
38:14 --> 38:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Only next generation was where it begins and ends for me.
38:16 --> 38:17 [SPEAKER_05]: It's all about Picard, right?
38:17 --> 38:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So.
38:18 --> 38:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Riker more, but.
38:20 --> 38:21 [SPEAKER_05]: The riker lean, you know, about the riker.
38:21 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, okay.
38:22 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Anyway.
38:22 --> 38:23 [SPEAKER_01]: So, so good.
38:23 --> 38:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure it's influenced a lot of your development.
38:25 --> 38:26 [SPEAKER_05]: So, okay.
38:27 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_05]: A Pickardy third is where a song or a section of music that's in minor key ends on a major chord.
38:34 --> 38:40 [SPEAKER_05]: A major in this case, we would call it the tonic chord, the one chord in G minor, you end on G major.
38:40 --> 38:51 [SPEAKER_05]: So if that's what's happening here, then we could say this is a song in minor, but ends on a Pickardy major chord, a Pickardy third.
38:51 --> 38:53 [SPEAKER_05]: And what's to deal with that name, by the way, it's
38:54 --> 38:56 [SPEAKER_05]: unclear because it goes back too long.
38:56 --> 39:05 [SPEAKER_05]: It's either named after the Picardy region of France, maybe, or from an aversion of a word in old French, which is like Picard, which means pointy.
39:06 --> 39:09 [SPEAKER_05]: But it doesn't mean sharp like a note.
39:09 --> 39:10 [SPEAKER_05]: It means pointy.
39:10 --> 39:11 [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't know.
39:11 --> 39:13 [SPEAKER_05]: It's very lost in translation.
39:13 --> 39:16 [SPEAKER_05]: I think don't trust anybody that sure what the name means.
39:16 --> 39:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
39:16 --> 39:17 [SPEAKER_05]: But Picardy.
39:18 --> 39:21 [SPEAKER_05]: So here's some examples of going way back.
39:22 --> 39:29 [SPEAKER_05]: This is Omanu Mysterium by Tomas Luis Dividoria, a Spanish composer from the sixteenth century.
39:29 --> 39:36 [SPEAKER_05]: This is a motet which means like a polyphonic meaning like all the voices singing kind of around each other.
39:36 --> 39:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Vocal piece from fifteen seventy two performed by Vosez or Votesz eight.
39:41 --> 39:43 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know how they pronounce it.
39:43 --> 39:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Take a listen.
39:44 --> 39:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Notice the minorness ending major.
39:57 --> 40:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Pretty minor, right?
40:14 --> 40:15 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really beautiful.
40:16 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Hallelujah.
40:17 --> 40:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
40:17 --> 40:18 [SPEAKER_05]: It's the light way to end that word.
40:19 --> 40:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And like I'm so dumb because I was like, but year, do you say fifteen something?
40:24 --> 40:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Fifteen seventy two.
40:25 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, wow, what a great recording quality.
40:28 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:28 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:28 --> 40:29 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:29 --> 40:29 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:29 --> 40:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:30 --> 40:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:30 --> 40:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:31 --> 40:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:31 --> 40:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It's cool.
40:32 --> 40:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It's cool.
40:32 --> 40:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It's cool.
40:32 --> 40:33 [SPEAKER_05]: It's cool.
40:33 --> 40:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:34 --> 40:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:34 --> 40:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:35 --> 40:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
40:37 --> 40:39 [SPEAKER_05]: It sounds old, though, doesn't it?
40:39 --> 40:40 [SPEAKER_05]: It's on the vocal side.
40:40 --> 40:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Here's another super duper old one, John Dowling.
40:43 --> 40:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Flow my tears.
40:44 --> 40:46 [SPEAKER_05]: He's an English composer from the sixteenth century.
40:47 --> 40:49 [SPEAKER_05]: This tune is fifteen, ninety six.
40:49 --> 40:53 [SPEAKER_05]: This was originally just a loot piece, but it was made into a song later.
40:53 --> 40:56 [SPEAKER_05]: This is Angela Hicks and Sam Brown performing.
40:57 --> 40:59 [SPEAKER_05]: You're going to hear minor music ending major.
41:20 --> 41:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Let me ask you this.
41:22 --> 41:27 [SPEAKER_01]: If someone said to you, hey, Mark, I have tickets to see this music being performed.
41:28 --> 41:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Would you be excited to go?
41:30 --> 41:47 [SPEAKER_05]: actually totally yeah really I love early music so so I don't go and see it that often but if you ask me to like rank if you think of like Western art music kind of classical music or whatever with a lower case see you ask me to rank like what my favorite to experience is
41:48 --> 42:06 [SPEAKER_05]: actual classical music is kind of the lowest of the era's like I would probably go modern like contemporary stuff yeah followed by early stuff so like Renaissance music and stuff like this like stuff like this and then probably romantic broke and then classical like Mozart at the bottom I love
42:06 --> 42:13 [SPEAKER_05]: the sort of primordial ooze of really old music that's so passed down from people to people.
42:14 --> 42:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, but it's not oral tradition, right?
42:15 --> 42:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, this is the birth of notation instead.
42:17 --> 42:20 [SPEAKER_05]: So this is written by a professional composer and notated.
42:20 --> 42:22 [SPEAKER_05]: It's just, it's so old, it sounds new.
42:23 --> 42:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, it actually has, I hear it as having more in common in a lot of ways with
42:29 --> 42:33 [SPEAKER_05]: contemporary music and contemporary pop music and contemporary classical music.
42:34 --> 42:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Sonically, there's just something about it that's almost more relatable to a modern year than handle would be or hide in or whoever.
42:42 --> 42:43 [SPEAKER_01]: That's really interesting.
42:43 --> 42:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I think like in the right environment, I would really enjoy watching a performance of this.
42:48 --> 42:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And like an old stone church or something, or like with like some mead, I'd want a cup of mead probably.
42:57 --> 43:00 [SPEAKER_05]: always got to have me when you're in a church, right?
43:01 --> 43:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think I think that's what I would need.
43:03 --> 43:08 [SPEAKER_05]: I think you should listen to the album of a bunch of downwind, John Downland made by sting.
43:09 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Like he has a version of this song.
43:11 --> 43:12 [SPEAKER_01]: That would be cool.
43:12 --> 43:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe the nineties or something like that.
43:13 --> 43:19 [SPEAKER_05]: And he does a pretty I thought this was a little more maybe representative of the the song is it originally intended because it's sting, right?
43:19 --> 43:21 [SPEAKER_05]: You're a little distracted by sting when you hear sting.
43:22 --> 43:23 [SPEAKER_05]: But he does a good job.
43:23 --> 43:23 [SPEAKER_05]: He sings it well.
43:24 --> 43:26 [SPEAKER_05]: He has a whole album of of loot music.
43:26 --> 43:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I would love that.
43:27 --> 43:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe some Theorba, which is sort of like the loot base kind of.
43:30 --> 43:32 [SPEAKER_05]: So this, yes, this is a broke pops on guests.
43:33 --> 43:38 [SPEAKER_05]: It's old in its kind of influences, but also this pickerty third thing comes up in newer stuff, too.
43:39 --> 43:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Can I give you some examples here?
43:40 --> 43:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Have we played Allison Chains?
43:42 --> 43:42 [SPEAKER_01]: We have.
43:42 --> 43:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm really.
43:43 --> 43:46 [SPEAKER_05]: That was maybe my favorite ban when I was like a freshman in high school.
43:46 --> 43:48 [SPEAKER_05]: I believe that this is down in the hole.
43:49 --> 43:50 [SPEAKER_05]: It's nineteen ninety two.
43:50 --> 43:55 [SPEAKER_05]: The song technically is in Dorian, which means it's sort of sort of minor, but listen to the ending.
44:10 --> 44:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And then major.
44:11 --> 44:13 [SPEAKER_05]: And on a major chord.
44:14 --> 44:24 [SPEAKER_05]: Now, the Pickety third, the Pickety major chord generally speaking happens at the end of something, but we get a similar idea popping up in the middle of song sometimes and I'll give you a few examples of that.
44:25 --> 44:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Like we have it.
44:26 --> 44:27 [SPEAKER_05]: It's done.
44:27 --> 44:29 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the four seconds into the song.
44:29 --> 44:29 [SPEAKER_05]: That's not the ending.
44:29 --> 44:31 [SPEAKER_05]: It's just the ending of that line.
44:31 --> 44:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
44:32 --> 44:35 [SPEAKER_05]: And there are times when a minor chord shifts to major that does something differently.
44:35 --> 44:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Call it a secondary dominant.
44:36 --> 44:38 [SPEAKER_05]: That's not what I'm talking about.
44:38 --> 44:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe we'll come back to that in another time.
44:40 --> 44:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Here's just a mid song shift to the major chord.
44:43 --> 44:45 [SPEAKER_05]: The major version of the main chord.
44:46 --> 44:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Naurals Barclay.
44:47 --> 44:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Remember Naurals Barclay?
44:48 --> 44:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Two thousand six.
44:50 --> 44:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Crazy.
44:59 --> 45:16 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's just that bright measure.
45:16 --> 45:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, good.
45:17 --> 45:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that silo?
45:18 --> 45:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Silo.
45:18 --> 45:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:19 --> 45:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Silo plus dead mouse.
45:22 --> 45:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's, I feel like- See a little plus danger mouse?
45:25 --> 45:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's see low and danger mouse.
45:27 --> 45:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's cool.
45:28 --> 45:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it is cool.
45:29 --> 45:30 [SPEAKER_05]: I haven't really heard them since that era.
45:30 --> 45:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
45:31 --> 45:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
45:31 --> 45:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't need to revisit that.
45:33 --> 45:35 [SPEAKER_01]: See what was the fascinating guy.
45:35 --> 45:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Came up already from our, as a back of vocalist in waterfalls.
45:40 --> 45:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, we didn't talk about.
45:41 --> 45:43 [SPEAKER_05]: We didn't talk about that.
45:43 --> 45:45 [SPEAKER_05]: We didn't talk about that.
45:45 --> 45:46 [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't talk about that.
45:46 --> 45:56 [SPEAKER_05]: We came up when we did TLC, but it did not come out on podcast, probably he's when you listen to the the harmonies he's in in TLC's waterfalls.
45:56 --> 45:57 [SPEAKER_05]: He's one of them.
45:57 --> 45:57 [SPEAKER_05]: You can hear his voice.
46:07 --> 46:09 [SPEAKER_05]: That's cool.
46:09 --> 46:16 [SPEAKER_01]: We talked about him when we talked about Feral and happy because he originally passed on the song.
46:16 --> 46:18 [SPEAKER_05]: When did we talk about happy by Feral?
46:19 --> 46:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember.
46:20 --> 46:21 [SPEAKER_05]: We didn't do that song.
46:21 --> 46:22 [SPEAKER_01]: We didn't do that song.
46:22 --> 46:24 [SPEAKER_01]: We talked about it like in another.
46:24 --> 46:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I think like in the, when we talked about like censorship, who even knows what we've been doing here.
46:30 --> 46:32 [SPEAKER_05]: We've got, it's been wide-ranging everybody.
46:32 --> 46:33 [SPEAKER_05]: One more example of Hengelot.
46:34 --> 46:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Same in the end.
46:35 --> 46:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Sublime.
46:36 --> 46:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Nineteen ninety-six self-titled posthumous for Bradley Noel.
46:40 --> 46:46 [SPEAKER_05]: This progression once again, very minor, D minor, but with a random major D-cords coming in.
46:47 --> 46:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Take a listen.
46:55 --> 46:55 [SPEAKER_05]: That's a minor.
47:09 --> 47:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the blame is so flipping good.
47:11 --> 47:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
47:12 --> 47:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
47:13 --> 47:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Yep.
47:13 --> 47:14 [SPEAKER_05]: One of my favorites for sure.
47:14 --> 47:15 [SPEAKER_01]: For sure.
47:15 --> 47:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's a leave it at that right now.
47:17 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe we'll get to deep dive.
47:19 --> 47:22 [SPEAKER_05]: No, it's just like I have so much I would want to say that like what am I going to do?
47:22 --> 47:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And every time I hear them like, all right, it's so good.
47:26 --> 47:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
47:27 --> 47:28 [SPEAKER_05]: So what's to deal with this?
47:28 --> 47:40 [SPEAKER_05]: By the way, I will just say like, I think there's something about the warmth of major that is a little stronger that even in a minor piece, people feel like it could be more satisfying.
47:41 --> 47:42 [SPEAKER_05]: to end there, right?
47:42 --> 47:54 [SPEAKER_05]: It's lightning and ending and also shout out to our episode on Green Day, waiting the overtones of a major chord are more stable than that of a minor chord.
47:55 --> 47:56 [SPEAKER_05]: And so it may jump
47:56 --> 48:02 [SPEAKER_05]: be from a physics sort of resonance standpoint, more finished sounding when you end on major.
48:02 --> 48:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Now that's not happening in these songs because this is in the middle of it, but when you listen to like down in a hole or flow my tears, that ending on a major chord is by definition the waves are more stable than a minor chord.
48:14 --> 48:16 [SPEAKER_05]: So that could be why this grew as a tradition over the years.
48:17 --> 48:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It could be, but I have another possible theory of why we like it when things end on a major chord.
48:44 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, get there.
48:45 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Go let's go.
48:45 --> 48:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
48:46 --> 48:49 [SPEAKER_05]: So, which by the way, we don't know that the seal song does yet.
48:49 --> 48:50 [SPEAKER_05]: We gotta come back to that.
48:50 --> 48:50 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know.
48:50 --> 48:52 [SPEAKER_05]: We just know that the first phrase does.
48:52 --> 48:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But like we have a tendency to lean towards the thought that good things are better than bad things.
49:00 --> 49:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Would you say, I would emphatically state that good things are better than bad things.
49:05 --> 49:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, my bank.
49:07 --> 49:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
49:08 --> 49:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you ever hear of the term toxic positivity?
49:10 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_05]: No, help me out.
49:11 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_05]: What?
49:11 --> 49:13 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's something bad's happening in your life.
49:14 --> 49:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And people like don't worry.
49:15 --> 49:16 [SPEAKER_01]: It's also fine.
49:17 --> 49:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And like think, look on the bright side, right?
49:19 --> 49:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
49:19 --> 49:21 [SPEAKER_01]: That's actually like pretty toxic.
49:21 --> 49:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Because if you always looked on the bright side, you really undermine a lot of like the more traditionally what we code as negative emotions in your life and like you need to like feel those.
49:31 --> 49:33 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like the inside out theory.
49:33 --> 49:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah.
49:34 --> 49:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think from the movie inside out.
49:36 --> 49:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
49:36 --> 49:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Sure.
49:36 --> 49:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
49:36 --> 49:38 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the psychological feeling.
49:39 --> 49:40 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, you can't you can't hide the
49:41 --> 49:44 [SPEAKER_05]: What's the, what's the one that's really annoying?
49:44 --> 49:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Anyways, I don't understand this.
49:46 --> 49:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, you can't hide the sadness, the blue one, right?
49:48 --> 49:48 [SPEAKER_05]: The blue one.
49:48 --> 49:50 [SPEAKER_05]: You have to embrace the blue one.
49:50 --> 49:54 [SPEAKER_05]: So, and I think, you know, there's something about the toxic positivity.
49:54 --> 50:00 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that comes from a selfishness and the sense that like saying it's okay makes it easy for me the person saying that.
50:00 --> 50:26 [SPEAKER_05]: feel okay to feel okay and to not get brought down by your sadness or whatever like it's it's for me not for you if I'm gonna say oh it's gonna now there are sometimes like if your kid is hurt and they've never experienced something like this you're like this is okay you're gonna be okay I think there's comfort in that but also dismissing somebody's negative emotions to make yourself feel better feels like that's a part of why that happens in our society I mean but you even said when you're talking about who's the bad one
50:27 --> 50:29 [SPEAKER_01]: When you talk to what inside out, you're like, who's the bad one?
50:29 --> 50:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sad, and this is the bad one.
50:31 --> 50:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I said the only one, right?
50:33 --> 50:35 [SPEAKER_05]: I think there's the one to suppress, right?
50:36 --> 50:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I get I think there's a lot for it ain't going on with those statements, right?
50:39 --> 50:46 [SPEAKER_05]: The idea that like you need to select where I think the starting principle of that movie is, which is that we have to suppress some of them.
50:48 --> 50:51 [SPEAKER_05]: and only go for the happy one, but then you end up, that's a problem.
50:51 --> 50:54 [SPEAKER_05]: That's not the thesis, the movie, that's the starting assumption in the movie.
50:54 --> 50:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And then as it goes on, you learn that you can't have joy without sadness, you can't have one without the other, right?
50:59 --> 51:01 [SPEAKER_05]: You can't have puberty without on-week.
51:02 --> 51:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Without on-week, or anxiety.
51:04 --> 51:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
51:05 --> 51:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of two wasn't as good, that was good.
51:07 --> 51:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But the idea that like we all have this like dark side or this shadow, self.
51:13 --> 51:16 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, Carl Young is we talked about.
51:16 --> 51:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So Young means psychology has this principle that we all have this like several different archetypes that live inside of us.
51:22 --> 51:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Those are like areas of our personality.
51:24 --> 51:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we all have the same different characters that live inside our own head.
51:27 --> 51:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Very much like inside out.
51:29 --> 51:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't really mean to make all these connections to inside out, but they're there.
51:33 --> 51:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And he said that one of those was the shadow south, which in Freudian psychology, we would call like maybe the id.
51:39 --> 51:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
51:40 --> 51:43 [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll talk about id ego super ego here a little bit.
51:43 --> 51:45 [SPEAKER_05]: A little bit a long time ago.
51:45 --> 51:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
51:46 --> 51:48 [SPEAKER_05]: So maybe maybe episode two or something.
51:48 --> 51:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you remember what the Freudian id represents?
51:52 --> 51:55 [SPEAKER_05]: that it is like your impulses, right?
51:55 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like your basic instincts, you're kind of like the dark side of you, not to steal seals line, but it is your darkness, you're like impulse.
52:08 --> 52:09 [SPEAKER_05]: It's necessarily bad.
52:10 --> 52:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like the devil on your shoulder telling you to make bad choices.
52:14 --> 52:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And young said that we all have his interpolation of the it was this idea of the shadow self that we all have this like kind of bizarre version of our psyche that like is naturally darker than our outward presentation.
52:26 --> 52:27 [SPEAKER_01]: We're trying to suppress it.
52:28 --> 52:33 [SPEAKER_01]: But we often like try to present the positive aspects of ourselves to others.
52:33 --> 52:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So when you're talking about this integration of major and minor for me, I am thinking about
52:40 --> 53:01 [SPEAKER_01]: This young he and symbolic journey of self-integration, like young set a lot that what we have to do is try to integrate the shadow self into our everyday life and integrate our psyche to get to this place of like on meostasis, to get to this balance, which is what you're kind of talking about too, that you need like the major and the minor to work together to find like the balance in the song.
53:01 --> 53:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Right?
53:02 --> 53:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Or else it sounds like the core progressions I played were the major ones sounded terrible in the minor ones.
53:06 --> 53:08 [SPEAKER_05]: It was okay but kind of weird.
53:08 --> 53:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And you can see people when you meet people that are like too positive and too major.
53:13 --> 53:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
53:14 --> 53:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So okay.
53:15 --> 53:16 [SPEAKER_05]: So back to the toxic positivity.
53:17 --> 53:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
53:17 --> 53:23 [SPEAKER_05]: You brought that up like is it because it feels fake or because it doesn't validate other people like where's the toxicity there?
53:23 --> 53:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I think because it feels fake and it doesn't allow for like the full range of a human experience.
53:28 --> 53:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we, a negative stuff happens to all of us, right?
53:32 --> 53:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And to say like, oh, it's all going to be okay.
53:34 --> 53:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you don't know that.
53:36 --> 53:37 [SPEAKER_01]: They don't know what's going to be okay.
53:37 --> 53:40 [SPEAKER_05]: I think everything's going to be okay is a risky thing.
53:40 --> 53:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And it devalues.
53:42 --> 53:46 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're going through a really tough time and I'm your friend and I say like, oh, don't worry, it's all going to be okay.
53:47 --> 53:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Things will turn around.
53:48 --> 53:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, but what if they don't?
53:51 --> 53:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, what if they don't turn around?
53:52 --> 53:54 [SPEAKER_01]: What if it doesn't get better, right?
53:54 --> 53:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, we have to kind of honor that experience, too.
53:57 --> 53:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It's part of life.
53:58 --> 54:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Can I bring us back to another early episode of our podcast when you talked about grief?
54:03 --> 54:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
54:04 --> 54:06 [SPEAKER_05]: And the beauty of grief, this is our, well, two-part episode.
54:07 --> 54:10 [SPEAKER_05]: It's our episode on phone thugs and harmony, but also we did a sidetrack about it.
54:10 --> 54:14 [SPEAKER_05]: One of the things that made you love grief was that everybody experiences it.
54:14 --> 54:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
54:16 --> 54:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm finding a little bit of a not confusion here, but how do we unpack the idea that I think like a loved one dying is like one of the worst things that could possibly happen.
54:26 --> 54:35 [SPEAKER_05]: But you know, taking some of what what you said in those episodes, the whole idea of like everybody goes through this, you will be on this raft.
54:35 --> 54:40 [SPEAKER_05]: I remember the raft analogy and you will weather this wave and it will get easier over time.
54:40 --> 54:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Everything will be okay because everybody goes through this.
54:44 --> 54:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Like everything will be okay in the sense that this is where all meat puppets and like we are these bags of sacks with neurons firing and neurotransmitters going and good and bad things happen and that's actually the way it should be.
54:59 --> 55:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, maybe when you think of like everything will be okay for me, I don't think of okay as positive or negative.
55:07 --> 55:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I think is, I think of okay as stasis.
55:10 --> 55:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Like everything will be okay that everything will eventually the storm will clear and you're gonna be left with whatever's left.
55:18 --> 55:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Whatever's left.
55:19 --> 55:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And that might be good.
55:20 --> 55:20 [SPEAKER_01]: It might be bad.
55:20 --> 55:21 [SPEAKER_05]: The house or it could be rumble.
55:21 --> 55:23 [SPEAKER_01]: But it, you will still be.
55:24 --> 55:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, or you won't.
55:26 --> 55:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Or you won't.
55:27 --> 55:28 [SPEAKER_05]: If you have an illness or something.
55:28 --> 55:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
55:28 --> 55:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
55:29 --> 55:30 [SPEAKER_01]: That's, that is okay.
55:30 --> 55:31 [SPEAKER_01]: There'll be a resolution.
55:31 --> 55:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
55:33 --> 55:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Whether or not it's a positive resolution or a negative resolution still it will resolve itself.
55:38 --> 55:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And the thing about grief, like you never resolved, if you just learn to move forward with it, right?
55:44 --> 55:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You find home your status within those feelings.
55:46 --> 55:47 [SPEAKER_01]: They didn't go away.
55:47 --> 55:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You still carry it with you, but you just like find a piece with it.
55:51 --> 55:55 [SPEAKER_05]: So there's like a neutral, like, you know, George Harrison, all things must pass element.
55:55 --> 55:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, that doesn't mean it's good or bad.
55:57 --> 55:59 [SPEAKER_05]: It just means it will happen.
55:59 --> 56:00 [SPEAKER_01]: It will happen.
56:00 --> 56:01 [SPEAKER_01]: It will play out.
56:01 --> 56:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Time ticks no matter what for us, at least for humans it does.
56:04 --> 56:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And to say, like, oh, it'll all get better.
56:06 --> 56:09 [SPEAKER_01]: That's loaded because you don't know what's all going to get better.
56:09 --> 56:11 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's all probably going to change.
56:12 --> 56:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And you can learn how to adapt to that change.
56:15 --> 56:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think when we listen to this and bring it back to the seal song, it is like, there's ambiguity.
56:20 --> 56:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it major?
56:20 --> 56:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it minor?
56:21 --> 56:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it good?
56:22 --> 56:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Or is it bad?
56:22 --> 56:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't have to be either.
56:24 --> 56:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It can be both at the same time.
56:26 --> 56:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll find states that we'll find tonality and consonants in the music.
56:34 --> 56:35 [SPEAKER_05]: This is actually interesting.
56:36 --> 56:37 [SPEAKER_05]: You mentioned consonants.
56:38 --> 56:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Everything we've heard so far is consonant.
56:39 --> 56:43 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm not expressing much dissonance or I'm not showing you much, much dissonance.
56:44 --> 56:48 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm more showing clashing between keys, but the chords themselves are consonant.
56:48 --> 56:59 [SPEAKER_05]: We have major and minor chords, but I think we've talked about this, or I think I've maybe mentioned this before, but the idea of harmony, harmoniousness is being thought of as a good thing.
57:00 --> 57:08 [SPEAKER_05]: when harmony, the driving force behind harmony is the interaction of consonants with dissonance.
57:08 --> 57:09 [SPEAKER_05]: This is actually, oh my god, it's just balance.
57:09 --> 57:13 [SPEAKER_05]: The first time, hey, Laura Hounds, everybody, we're part of the Laura Hounds network.
57:14 --> 57:19 [SPEAKER_05]: My first interaction ever with the Laura Hounds before we started this podcast was riding in.
57:21 --> 57:29 [SPEAKER_05]: on an episode they had about not the Lord of the Rings, not a TV show, but the Silma Rillian, which is the book, the backstory to the Lord of the Rings.
57:29 --> 57:30 [SPEAKER_05]: It gives like a textbook.
57:31 --> 57:35 [SPEAKER_05]: And I wrote in because the whole thing, this is not what I thought we'd be talking about.
57:36 --> 57:45 [SPEAKER_05]: The whole thing about the creation of the world, according to Tolkien for the Lord of the Rings universe, was the sort of angels get together and they play music.
57:45 --> 57:47 [SPEAKER_05]: But there's one bad one.
57:47 --> 57:52 [SPEAKER_05]: They're sort of their looser fur, melcore, who's playing distant music.
57:52 --> 57:53 [SPEAKER_05]: And he's kind of ruining everything.
57:53 --> 57:55 [SPEAKER_05]: And my whole thing was like, hold up.
57:56 --> 57:59 [SPEAKER_05]: All the music you like is only good because of the moments of dissonance.
58:00 --> 58:04 [SPEAKER_05]: If you only had consonants, things would be so boring.
58:04 --> 58:06 [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, the rest is here.
58:06 --> 58:07 [SPEAKER_05]: They didn't know who I was at that point.
58:07 --> 58:08 [SPEAKER_03]: I just wrote it in your life.
58:09 --> 58:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, J. R. R. Tolkien, in nineteen thirties when you wrote this or whatever, you don't understand what actually that we need.
58:17 --> 58:19 [SPEAKER_05]: You say consonants, we need the dissonance too.
58:19 --> 58:24 [SPEAKER_05]: And whether it's minor or major like things clashing even more than that or what make things work.
58:24 --> 58:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the inside out paradox, right?
58:27 --> 58:30 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't have joy without sadness.
58:31 --> 58:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
58:31 --> 58:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Did we do it?
58:33 --> 58:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Do we do it?
58:33 --> 58:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Do we win?
58:34 --> 58:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we win?
58:35 --> 58:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we like make some some connections?
58:37 --> 58:41 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to bring it back to what I was bringing to the table here.
58:42 --> 58:47 [SPEAKER_05]: The weird thing is you're almost, I would say more than almost undermining the question, right?
58:47 --> 58:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Like why?
58:48 --> 58:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Why is it matter?
58:49 --> 58:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Why am I, I mean, ultimately the thesis is when we discover whether it's in major or minor, ultimately what makes a good is that it's in both?
58:57 --> 58:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
58:57 --> 59:03 [SPEAKER_05]: But even trying to figure out which one wins undermines the point, which is that it's they're both being used here.
59:03 --> 59:06 [SPEAKER_05]: And there is actually just looking at music history.
59:06 --> 59:17 [SPEAKER_05]: There is this period, you know, when you're looking at a string quartet, you know, I think it's the joke or whatever by hiding its string quartet in E flat major.
59:18 --> 59:24 [SPEAKER_05]: And they're writing things, you know, Beethoven's fifth symphony is called symphony in C minor, right?
59:24 --> 59:24 [SPEAKER_05]: The
59:25 --> 59:26 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so intentional.
59:26 --> 59:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Title has to end and that doesn't mean there's a section in the middle that's not major.
59:30 --> 59:34 [SPEAKER_05]: There's it goes to major for parts, but it's gonna start and end in C minor.
59:34 --> 59:47 [SPEAKER_05]: By the time we get to nineteen hundred or whatever, you see something like shrink or to it in G symphony in C. And they're going out of the way to not say major a minor and it's almost like how dare you try to put me down.
59:47 --> 59:51 [SPEAKER_05]: The point is these are shared modes in one tonic.
59:52 --> 59:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like just like Gus humans, we all have
59:55 --> 59:59 [SPEAKER_01]: new ones, and you can't just label someone as like, you're a happy person.
59:59 --> 01:00:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, it's so effing boring.
01:00:01 --> 01:00:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
01:00:02 --> 01:00:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
01:00:04 --> 01:00:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I think nobody's really just happy, right?
01:00:06 --> 01:00:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I think you can pretend.
01:00:07 --> 01:00:12 [SPEAKER_05]: I think I'm a content person, but you have to have a little bit of moments of not.
01:00:13 --> 01:00:20 [SPEAKER_05]: There's another possible, there's another possible explanation for what's happening here and it's not that it's minor with a major ending.
01:00:21 --> 01:00:30 [SPEAKER_05]: It's that it's major with chords being ripped from minor to spice and things to spice and to spice things up.
01:00:30 --> 01:00:32 [SPEAKER_05]: I think spice is its own past tense verb.
01:00:32 --> 01:00:34 [SPEAKER_05]: So take a listen.
01:00:34 --> 01:00:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Let's just jump forward to another piece just for some varieties sake.
01:00:37 --> 01:00:38 [SPEAKER_05]: This is the verse section.
01:00:39 --> 01:00:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Starts on G, ends on G, but with some stuff in the middle.
01:00:46 --> 01:00:49 [SPEAKER_02]: I will alone on the sea.
01:00:49 --> 01:00:56 [SPEAKER_02]: You became the light on the dark side of me.
01:00:57 --> 01:01:00 [SPEAKER_02]: Love remains a draw last high.
01:01:03 --> 01:01:08 [SPEAKER_05]: So similar kinds of chords, but there's just so much G major, and there's so much the note.
01:01:08 --> 01:01:19 [SPEAKER_05]: The money note of G major here is the B. When he goes, that's the B, and then that's another B. He just keeps hitting B, B, B, not B flat, B natural, B natural, B natural.
01:01:19 --> 01:01:23 [SPEAKER_05]: And so maybe it's the G that's right, and the middle chords that are wrong.
01:01:24 --> 01:01:30 [SPEAKER_05]: And so maybe instead of a Pickety third and minor, what we're having is something we call borrowed chords.
01:01:30 --> 01:01:38 [SPEAKER_05]: Where you're playing in major and you're stealing chords from minor for dramatic and oftentimes emotional effect.
01:01:39 --> 01:01:40 [SPEAKER_05]: We sometimes call this mode mixture.
01:01:41 --> 01:01:42 [SPEAKER_05]: If a mode is a name of a scale,
01:01:43 --> 01:01:46 [SPEAKER_05]: It's mixing major and minor modes together.
01:01:46 --> 01:01:52 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm not going to play as many examples of this because I'm made choose to just do an episode on this topic later.
01:01:53 --> 01:01:53 [SPEAKER_05]: But here's a couple.
01:01:54 --> 01:01:55 [SPEAKER_05]: So see if you know this.
01:01:55 --> 01:01:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah.
01:01:56 --> 01:02:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah.
01:02:07 --> 01:02:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah.
01:02:07 --> 01:02:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah.
01:02:10 --> 01:02:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Wezer, ninety four holiday.
01:02:12 --> 01:02:13 [SPEAKER_01]: The wezer.
01:02:13 --> 01:02:13 [SPEAKER_05]: The wezer.
01:02:14 --> 01:02:14 [SPEAKER_05]: The wezer.
01:02:14 --> 01:02:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Is that what the wezers are they that wezers?
01:02:18 --> 01:02:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Rivers and the wezers.
01:02:19 --> 01:02:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Um, yeah.
01:02:19 --> 01:02:26 [SPEAKER_05]: So we have a barrel that when he says heart beat, we shifts to a chord from the minor key, right?
01:02:26 --> 01:02:28 [SPEAKER_05]: But it's a major song.
01:02:28 --> 01:02:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Here's another example.
01:02:29 --> 01:02:33 [SPEAKER_05]: One more from an artist that we swore we never talk about again.
01:02:40 --> 01:02:41 [SPEAKER_01]: That's fun.
01:02:41 --> 01:02:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Listen here.
01:02:56 --> 01:02:58 [SPEAKER_05]: It's such a sad moment when it's just.
01:02:58 --> 01:02:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, good.
01:02:58 --> 01:02:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so good.
01:02:59 --> 01:03:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's good.
01:03:00 --> 01:03:02 [SPEAKER_05]: You tell us with also from folklore, which we just talked about.
01:03:02 --> 01:03:05 [SPEAKER_01]: But you have to listen to the documentary.
01:03:06 --> 01:03:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Have you watched it yet?
01:03:07 --> 01:03:08 [SPEAKER_05]: I have not watched it yet.
01:03:08 --> 01:03:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:03:08 --> 01:03:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you have to watch it.
01:03:09 --> 01:03:11 [SPEAKER_05]: The listeners have had a few weeks to watch it.
01:03:11 --> 01:03:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Those things we talked about yesterday.
01:03:13 --> 01:03:21 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to watch it because in that moment, the face that Aaron Dresner makes when he plays that shift is just like so magical.
01:03:21 --> 01:03:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Is it like the face I made when we just listen to?
01:03:23 --> 01:03:24 [SPEAKER_01]: You were like, it's happening.
01:03:24 --> 01:03:25 [SPEAKER_01]: He was like, it's happening.
01:03:25 --> 01:03:26 [SPEAKER_01]: We're doing it.
01:03:26 --> 01:03:27 [SPEAKER_01]: We're making music together.
01:03:27 --> 01:03:28 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like so lovely.
01:03:29 --> 01:03:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So, it's a great song.
01:03:30 --> 01:03:39 [SPEAKER_05]: We can leave it at those examples, but these are moments where you have a song that's very clearly in major, more so than kiss from a rose, but rip something from mine or for color.
01:03:40 --> 01:03:41 [SPEAKER_05]: And so we have these two options.
01:03:41 --> 01:03:53 [SPEAKER_05]: The song is either in minor, but using the Pickety third, or it's in major, but borrowing from minor, or it's sort of both in neither, which is maybe what our psychological journey is telling us.
01:03:53 --> 01:03:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that that's what my takeaway is.
01:03:56 --> 01:03:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:03:57 --> 01:03:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that like you, you need to be a little bit of both.
01:03:59 --> 01:04:02 [SPEAKER_05]: We're already prematurely solving the puzzle.
01:04:02 --> 01:04:03 [SPEAKER_05]: It's both.
01:04:03 --> 01:04:04 [SPEAKER_01]: It's both.
01:04:04 --> 01:04:06 [SPEAKER_05]: You started with minor, but maybe it's both.
01:04:06 --> 01:04:07 [SPEAKER_05]: So let's see what happens.
01:04:08 --> 01:04:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Does that still stay true?
01:04:09 --> 01:04:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Here's the pre-chorus.
01:04:11 --> 01:04:13 [SPEAKER_05]: This one's probably the weirdest.
01:04:13 --> 01:04:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Instead of putting all the middle cords, it just goes G major and then right to G minor immediately.
01:04:18 --> 01:04:19 [SPEAKER_02]: There.
01:04:37 --> 01:04:39 [SPEAKER_01]: The lyrics really do not make any sense, though, huh?
01:04:40 --> 01:04:42 [SPEAKER_05]: They sure sound meaningful, though, don't they?
01:04:42 --> 01:04:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like his expressions like, oh, these are so profound.
01:04:45 --> 01:04:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But if you just read it, you'd be like, well, what does this guy talking about?
01:04:48 --> 01:04:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I really don't know.
01:04:49 --> 01:04:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Listen, right in if you know, seal.
01:04:52 --> 01:04:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:04:52 --> 01:04:55 [SPEAKER_05]: If you're willing to finally break the story, we'd love to have you as a guest.
01:04:55 --> 01:04:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, I'm not talking about it.
01:04:56 --> 01:04:57 [SPEAKER_05]: All these years.
01:04:57 --> 01:04:57 [SPEAKER_05]: So,
01:04:59 --> 01:05:01 [SPEAKER_05]: This is going to be maybe a little annoying.
01:05:01 --> 01:05:07 [SPEAKER_05]: I want to really hit how ambiguous this is because that last bar includes multiple.
01:05:08 --> 01:05:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Can be seen, major, and then, baby.
01:05:12 --> 01:05:13 [SPEAKER_05]: I did it.
01:05:13 --> 01:05:15 [SPEAKER_05]: The high, the high baby.
01:05:15 --> 01:05:18 [SPEAKER_05]: By the way, shout out to my friend, Brendan, who I used to live with in college.
01:05:18 --> 01:05:19 [SPEAKER_05]: He got so mad.
01:05:20 --> 01:05:23 [SPEAKER_05]: We were doing laundry, and I just walked in the room, and I was just like, baby.
01:05:24 --> 01:05:25 [SPEAKER_05]: And he was like, don't do that at me.
01:05:26 --> 01:05:26 [SPEAKER_05]: I love you, Brendan.
01:05:27 --> 01:05:28 [SPEAKER_05]: That's your vocal stim.
01:05:28 --> 01:05:29 [SPEAKER_05]: That's right.
01:05:29 --> 01:05:36 [SPEAKER_05]: I was stimming back in the two albums I. You know, Brendan turned me on to a lot of really weird music, but apparently getting sung at,
01:05:42 --> 01:05:48 [SPEAKER_05]: But point being that first note I sang is B may or B natural, but then the high note is a B flat.
01:05:48 --> 01:05:51 [SPEAKER_05]: So within a beat and a half of each other, he's giving us both.
01:05:51 --> 01:05:55 [SPEAKER_05]: So I really want you to check this out on Infinite Loop.
01:05:56 --> 01:05:56 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
01:06:04 --> 01:06:04 [SPEAKER_01]: This one's for Brandon.
01:06:05 --> 01:06:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, how ones for Brandon?
01:06:06 --> 01:06:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Hey, Brandon.
01:06:07 --> 01:06:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, Brandon.
01:06:08 --> 01:06:09 [SPEAKER_05]: You're not listening at all.
01:06:09 --> 01:06:10 [SPEAKER_01]: First the laundry going.
01:06:10 --> 01:06:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he's done.
01:06:11 --> 01:06:11 [SPEAKER_05]: He's done.
01:06:12 --> 01:06:14 [SPEAKER_05]: So we heard this chorus.
01:06:14 --> 01:06:16 [SPEAKER_05]: He heard it a few times.
01:06:18 --> 01:06:19 [SPEAKER_05]: It's pretty clearly both, right?
01:06:20 --> 01:06:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Is it still sound like that to us?
01:06:29 --> 01:06:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Major.
01:06:31 --> 01:06:32 [SPEAKER_05]: From Minor.
01:06:33 --> 01:06:34 [SPEAKER_05]: back to major.
01:06:44 --> 01:06:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:06:45 --> 01:06:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:06:46 --> 01:06:47 [SPEAKER_01]: It really is beautiful.
01:06:48 --> 01:06:48 [SPEAKER_05]: It's great.
01:06:49 --> 01:06:51 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's great because of the ambiguity.
01:06:51 --> 01:06:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:06:51 --> 01:06:55 [SPEAKER_05]: The only other section that really gives us new data to answer our question.
01:06:56 --> 01:06:57 [SPEAKER_05]: is the bridge.
01:06:57 --> 01:06:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Colby's got to have a bridge with contrast.
01:06:59 --> 01:07:03 [SPEAKER_05]: This one also uses chords from these keys, but it's different.
01:07:03 --> 01:07:05 [SPEAKER_05]: So from G minor, we got FMB flat.
01:07:05 --> 01:07:11 [SPEAKER_05]: From G major, we have C, but never is there a G chord in here at all.
01:07:11 --> 01:07:12 [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't know that it really helps.
01:07:24 --> 01:07:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, it's, it's giving Robmonton men in taste to me.
01:07:29 --> 01:07:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
01:07:29 --> 01:07:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, this is just an F major.
01:07:31 --> 01:07:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a different piece.
01:07:32 --> 01:07:33 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's totally not helpful.
01:07:35 --> 01:07:40 [SPEAKER_05]: If we're worried about, or if we're thinking about Pickety Thirds, we got to listen to the ending.
01:07:40 --> 01:07:41 [SPEAKER_05]: What is the ending do?
01:07:41 --> 01:07:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Minor chord major chord.
01:07:43 --> 01:07:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's get it.
01:08:04 --> 01:08:04 [SPEAKER_01]: There it is.
01:08:06 --> 01:08:06 [SPEAKER_05]: What's that chord?
01:08:07 --> 01:08:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't name it but it offers resolution.
01:08:10 --> 01:08:10 [SPEAKER_05]: It's neither.
01:08:11 --> 01:08:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Neither.
01:08:12 --> 01:08:14 [SPEAKER_05]: It's just a G in the D. It's just a fifth.
01:08:14 --> 01:08:17 [SPEAKER_05]: It's neither, except it is totally ambiguous.
01:08:17 --> 01:08:18 [SPEAKER_05]: It's just a bare fifth.
01:08:18 --> 01:08:19 [SPEAKER_05]: They're missing one note.
01:08:20 --> 01:08:25 [SPEAKER_05]: But when he says grave, there's this really quiet vocal harmony singing the major one above and listen.
01:08:29 --> 01:08:31 [SPEAKER_05]: So I guess it's major.
01:08:31 --> 01:08:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Pickety third.
01:08:33 --> 01:08:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
01:08:33 --> 01:08:34 [SPEAKER_05]: It's ambiguous.
01:08:34 --> 01:08:35 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like seal.
01:08:35 --> 01:08:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Just like seal.
01:08:36 --> 01:08:37 [SPEAKER_05]: It's sealing ambiguous.
01:08:37 --> 01:08:37 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
01:08:37 --> 01:08:38 [SPEAKER_05]: Seals pretty good.
01:08:39 --> 01:08:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He's ambiguous.
01:08:40 --> 01:08:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I think.
01:08:41 --> 01:08:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Like what's going on with seal?
01:08:43 --> 01:08:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Where is he right now?
01:08:45 --> 01:08:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
01:08:47 --> 01:08:52 [SPEAKER_05]: You convinced us through your talk of you and all that that it's not man or or major.
01:08:52 --> 01:08:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Our assumption was wrong.
01:08:54 --> 01:08:55 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not just minor.
01:08:55 --> 01:08:56 [SPEAKER_05]: It's more than that.
01:08:56 --> 01:08:56 [SPEAKER_05]: It's ambiguous.
01:08:58 --> 01:08:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Just like us.
01:08:58 --> 01:09:02 [SPEAKER_05]: That's right, in my major minor is there more that you will.
01:09:02 --> 01:09:03 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all I got really.
01:09:03 --> 01:09:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Is there something fun we can end on?
01:09:05 --> 01:09:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Is there a sound track you want to shout out?
01:09:08 --> 01:09:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I actually have two soundtracks that I listen to as albums.
01:09:13 --> 01:09:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, one is original music, which is Daisy Jones and the six soundtracks to the show.
01:09:20 --> 01:09:26 [SPEAKER_01]: They're such a good band that they almost went on tour as the fictional band from the show.
01:09:26 --> 01:09:30 [SPEAKER_01]: They had dates, books, and everything that thank COVID happen, so they had to cancel the tour.
01:09:30 --> 01:09:32 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's kind of like this is spinal tap.
01:09:32 --> 01:09:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, the final tap became an actual band playing, you know, hair metal shows.
01:09:37 --> 01:09:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like DJ Jones in the sixth, like their songs were original songs for the TV show is based on a book, but they were really good.
01:09:44 --> 01:09:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And people loved them, so like, we'll tour it.
01:09:47 --> 01:09:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But they ended up not.
01:09:48 --> 01:09:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So I listened to that because it's just good kind of classic rock, Fleetwood Mackie type of music.
01:09:52 --> 01:09:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And I just like that.
01:09:55 --> 01:10:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Recently, I've gotten back into, it's one of my favorite movies of all time, almost famous.
01:10:00 --> 01:10:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I started a couple days ago, Randy.
01:10:03 --> 01:10:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I haven't seen it in, it is probably since the two thousands.
01:10:06 --> 01:10:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Iconic.
01:10:07 --> 01:10:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so good.
01:10:08 --> 01:10:11 [SPEAKER_01]: When I watch that as a teenager, I was like, this is what I want to be when I grow up.
01:10:11 --> 01:10:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I want to be these people.
01:10:13 --> 01:10:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And the soundtrack is awesome.
01:10:16 --> 01:10:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just such a good compilation of really great songs.
01:10:19 --> 01:10:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And I like late sixties, early seventies.
01:10:20 --> 01:10:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:10:21 --> 01:10:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:10:21 --> 01:10:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And still water is the name of the band from that.
01:10:24 --> 01:10:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And they have a couple of their originals.
01:10:27 --> 01:10:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Are they good?
01:10:27 --> 01:10:28 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't remember.
01:10:28 --> 01:10:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember.
01:10:29 --> 01:10:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's good.
01:10:30 --> 01:10:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's good.
01:10:30 --> 01:10:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not you all everybody stuff.
01:10:32 --> 01:10:33 [SPEAKER_01]: No, you all everybody.
01:10:33 --> 01:10:35 [SPEAKER_01]: No, or like that thing you do remember that.
01:10:36 --> 01:10:37 [SPEAKER_05]: The thing you do is a fun song.
01:10:37 --> 01:10:39 [SPEAKER_01]: That was like a fun nineties movie.
01:10:39 --> 01:10:41 [SPEAKER_05]: You all have everybody from loss is not a great solo.
01:10:42 --> 01:10:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I don't know that we have a really hear it.
01:10:43 --> 01:10:45 [SPEAKER_05]: We just sort of hear people singing it anyways.
01:10:45 --> 01:10:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my, oh, we used everyone.
01:10:47 --> 01:10:47 [SPEAKER_05]: I'll shout out.
01:10:47 --> 01:10:48 [SPEAKER_05]: And I'm not saying these are the best of whatever.
01:10:48 --> 01:10:49 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm shouting out.
01:10:50 --> 01:10:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I'll do one that's original music one and then I'll do one that's
01:10:54 --> 01:10:55 [SPEAKER_05]: just a comp, just like you.
01:10:56 --> 01:10:59 [SPEAKER_05]: So this is two thousands, not nineties, but a mighty wind.
01:11:00 --> 01:11:04 [SPEAKER_05]: So I mentioned, I mentioned this is spinal tap.
01:11:04 --> 01:11:08 [SPEAKER_05]: So that's reiner directing, but it's the same guys, right?
01:11:08 --> 01:11:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Christopher guests, who's one of the guys in spinal tap, then directs a bunch of mockumentaries like this is spinal tap.
01:11:15 --> 01:11:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Have you seen a mighty wind?
01:11:16 --> 01:11:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
01:11:16 --> 01:11:17 [SPEAKER_05]: It's totally your scene, right?
01:11:17 --> 01:11:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Cause it's a bunch of like, sixties, folk bands get coming back together for ringing.
01:11:23 --> 01:11:27 [SPEAKER_05]: And the songs, some of the songs are like, actually really good, including the ones that they're making fun of.
01:11:27 --> 01:11:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, they're, oh, we don't like that band.
01:11:29 --> 01:11:30 [SPEAKER_05]: They're too poppy.
01:11:30 --> 01:11:31 [SPEAKER_05]: And I'm like, I don't know, they sound pretty awesome.
01:11:31 --> 01:11:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, like the Nuff Ted or whatever, just, it's just cool music.
01:11:35 --> 01:11:36 [SPEAKER_05]: And I love those guys.
01:11:36 --> 01:11:37 [SPEAKER_05]: It's hilarious movie.
01:11:37 --> 01:11:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
01:11:38 --> 01:11:40 [SPEAKER_05]: And then I'll shout out the wedding singer sound.
01:11:40 --> 01:11:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
01:11:40 --> 01:11:45 [SPEAKER_05]: So, and I'm shouting that out because I mentioned that I mentioned in a previous podcast.
01:11:45 --> 01:11:49 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure that I sort of like hated eighties pop when I was in high school.
01:11:49 --> 01:11:50 [SPEAKER_01]: But now you love it.
01:11:50 --> 01:11:51 [SPEAKER_05]: And then I love it.
01:11:51 --> 01:11:57 [SPEAKER_05]: And that was one of the transition moments where I was forced to go like, all right, fine.
01:11:57 --> 01:11:58 [SPEAKER_05]: This stuff's great.
01:11:58 --> 01:11:59 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't even remember what songs are on it.
01:11:59 --> 01:12:03 [SPEAKER_05]: But I used to listen to it with friends and stuff like that back then.
01:12:04 --> 01:12:06 [SPEAKER_05]: It sort of woke my ass up.
01:12:06 --> 01:12:15 [SPEAKER_05]: So to speak on that, it was the first cracks in my, oh, synthesizers are lame that, you know, obviously.
01:12:15 --> 01:12:16 [SPEAKER_01]: You never saw the wedding singer.
01:12:17 --> 01:12:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah, it was fun.
01:12:18 --> 01:12:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I played guitar in the pit for a high school production of the wedding singer, the musical.
01:12:25 --> 01:12:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Wow.
01:12:26 --> 01:12:27 [SPEAKER_05]: I was not a high school student.
01:12:27 --> 01:12:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I was a winner from one of my friends was the director of the group and he's like, and she's like, I need it.
01:12:33 --> 01:12:47 [SPEAKER_05]: That was most of my, uh, high school musical experience was the G. B. Band was not a. I was in some, I was in some favors to a friend high school productions while I was a college or grad student for some reason.
01:12:48 --> 01:12:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Anyways, we could probably cut that.
01:12:49 --> 01:12:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
01:12:56 --> 01:12:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Never mind the music is hosted by Nicole Batcher and me, Mark Poppinny.
01:12:59 --> 01:13:00 [SPEAKER_05]: I also produce.
01:13:01 --> 01:13:04 [SPEAKER_05]: Please leave us a rating and a review and don't forget to follow.
01:13:05 --> 01:13:11 [SPEAKER_05]: We're never music pot on social media, and you can also send us an email at nevermusicpot at gmail.com.
01:13:13 --> 01:13:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Never mind the music is part of the Laura Hounds network.
01:13:15 --> 01:13:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Join the conversation by going to thelawhounds.com and hop on our Discord server.
01:13:21 --> 01:13:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Thanks for listening.