Elysia, John, and Mark explore the the influence of Pennywise over Derry. They give their thoughts on the New, New Losers Club, the Pattycakes, and the passive adults of the town. Then, they speculate on how being an outsider can interact with Pennywise's influence.
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00:00 --> 00:27 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you very much.
00:37 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Welcome to the horrorhounds podcast where the lorehounds your guides to small town terrors I'm John I'm Alicia and this is our coverage of it welcome to dairy on HBO Max season one episode two the thing in the dark if you want to get into contact with us you can send an email to horror at thelorhounds.com or head to our discord server from the link tree in the show notes
01:00 --> 01:16 [SPEAKER_05]: and if you like what you've heard and want to support us or get ad free and bonus content, check the same link tree for our Patreon and Supercast subscription options.
01:16 --> 01:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, I was struggling to come up with an it themed joke about the fact that I didn't commit that I would come back, but here I am.
01:23 --> 01:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to try to come back as much as I can and maybe even maybe even every episode if I can make the schedule work.
01:28 --> 01:35 [SPEAKER_01]: By the way, John, that's some mighty fine theme music that this podcast opens with every week.
01:35 --> 01:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm also props.
01:38 --> 01:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Congrats.
01:38 --> 01:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
01:39 --> 01:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
01:39 --> 01:42 [SPEAKER_03]: I tried all 30 minutes of that.
01:42 --> 01:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.
01:44 --> 01:47 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it's it's I wanted something spooky.
01:47 --> 01:48 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, we're in spooky season.
01:49 --> 01:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Although we were in a spooky season.
01:51 --> 01:53 [SPEAKER_05]: It's always spooky season.
01:54 --> 02:01 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, in Victorian times, or before pre-Victory in times, especially Christmas time, a spooky season.
02:01 --> 02:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Because it's dark.
02:02 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Can you tell cozy ghost stories?
02:04 --> 02:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, the Victorian era ruined plenty for us, but it can't ruin this show.
02:09 --> 02:11 [SPEAKER_03]: So let's get right into it.
02:12 --> 02:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Spoilery hot takes.
02:13 --> 02:15 [SPEAKER_03]: I just want to give a spoiler warning.
02:15 --> 02:19 [SPEAKER_03]: We did do a spoiler free part of episode one, because it's a leverage.
02:20 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_03]: But for this and for every episode beyond, we're going to be talking spoilers for the entire it franchise and maybe some light spoilers for other Stephen King works.
02:28 --> 02:33 [SPEAKER_03]: But the entire it franchise, the movies, the book, whatever.
02:33 --> 02:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Alicia, what's your hot take on the episode?
02:36 --> 02:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think it's still early in the season, but it's already hitting its stride.
02:40 --> 02:46 [SPEAKER_05]: I was really impressed, especially, with the writing in this episode.
02:46 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, it was a very stressful watch, but clearly intended to be.
02:51 --> 03:01 [SPEAKER_05]: I especially, the part of the story that especially spoke to me is with Ronnie and Lily,
03:02 --> 03:07 [SPEAKER_05]: are just trying to protect themselves and their family, and they're being pitted against each other.
03:07 --> 03:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And oh my god, poor Lily, she is, as she said, tricked into kind of implicating Ronnie's dad.
03:14 --> 03:17 [SPEAKER_05]: But then she ends up in the asylum anyway.
03:17 --> 03:23 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's just all so horrifying and infuriating and the handlings are the only good adults.
03:24 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_05]: And their son must be protected at all costs.
03:27 --> 03:30 [SPEAKER_05]: He is probably my favorite warmhearted character.
03:30 --> 03:33 [SPEAKER_03]: And hold on, hold on, just as for the grogins.
03:34 --> 03:37 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that they are our fine adults too.
03:37 --> 03:38 [SPEAKER_05]: true.
03:38 --> 03:41 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, they're not as problematic as Lily's mom sucks.
03:41 --> 03:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Lily's mom is the world.
03:42 --> 03:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Lily's mom sucks.
03:44 --> 03:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
03:45 --> 03:49 [SPEAKER_05]: But I do hope that there are more moments of respite.
03:49 --> 03:55 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, we always talk about that in this podcast that we need those warm cozy moments of the kids just being friends together.
03:55 --> 03:57 [SPEAKER_05]: And I'm sure that's coming.
03:57 --> 03:59 [SPEAKER_05]: They're clearly building it up.
03:59 --> 04:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I think we have the the new band kid who showed up this episode, clearly they're setting up to
04:07 --> 04:09 [SPEAKER_05]: and I can't wait to see that part.
04:10 --> 04:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we're going to have a new, new loser's club.
04:12 --> 04:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, we're worried that the mean girl called them the square central or something.
04:18 --> 04:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, petancakes.
04:19 --> 04:20 [SPEAKER_05]: You call them square central, I think?
04:21 --> 04:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought that was a really weird square is not the term you'd use for like, really to them, Lily's like a weird kid, right?
04:29 --> 04:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Square, the square, maybe, like, I don't know,
04:35 --> 05:00 [SPEAKER_05]: murderer and town does that make her a square it's just a it was a weird yeah i don't think any of us in school in the sixties so um i don't know i thought a square make you're boring and straight-laced in kind of a tight right like yeah i don't know this this could be a devastating blow to somebody in the sixties or we didn't know if anyone was in middle school in the sixties and has an opinion on this i'm curious because i just a good point that is a good point
05:01 --> 05:08 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's like calling the kid that's always like the hoodlum kid, a goody goody, you're kind of like, wait, what, wrong and so wrong kid, you know?
05:08 --> 05:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Right, right.
05:09 --> 05:14 [SPEAKER_05]: I just, I just want Lily and what is it?
05:15 --> 05:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Not my kind.
05:17 --> 05:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, Marge of course, but with my kennel and dad, the kid, the henlum kid.
05:21 --> 05:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, well, well, thank you.
05:23 --> 05:31 [SPEAKER_05]: And his new band buddy, and yeah, I just want them to all sit together at lunch.
05:32 --> 05:33 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's right.
05:33 --> 05:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I think the new Losers Club is going to be fantastic.
05:37 --> 05:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.
05:37 --> 05:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
05:38 --> 05:57 [SPEAKER_03]: I actually think that the chemistry between the kids, even though they have an all-med up together, so far the chemistry between these kids is stronger than the chemistry between the kids in episode one, and maybe that's on purpose, but also I just, I felt like the kids in episode one were just rehashing the movies.
05:58 --> 06:05 [SPEAKER_03]: losers club, like the same tropes, and this feels different, you know, the feels like new kids, feels like we're going into different themes.
06:05 --> 06:09 [SPEAKER_03]: And I guess I'm kind of transitioning into my hot takes unless you had something else, Alicia.
06:09 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_05]: No, just to piggyback on what you're saying is that because of the, it's a TV show, they have more room to set up, more realistic, more complicated, more nuanced relationships between the kids.
06:21 --> 06:24 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, it's not just hey, yeah, we've all known each other since the second grade.
06:24 --> 06:26 [SPEAKER_03]: So we're all besties right now.
06:27 --> 06:28 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think that's right.
06:28 --> 06:42 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's nice to see them come together more than just, you know, the new kid on the block, he has his songs and he has a poster and Bev Marsh is going to be, you know, joining the group, but no, we've got we've got the whole crew here.
06:43 --> 06:46 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that all the kid actors are doing an amazing job.
06:46 --> 06:58 [SPEAKER_03]: I think, you know, they are really putting on the performances of their lives so far, you know, I guess it's not much much else to compete with, and it beats that, you know, that toothpaste commercial they did when they were four year old.
06:58 --> 06:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
07:00 --> 07:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
07:00 --> 07:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Not, I guess not too hard.
07:01 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe one of them did an Oscar Meyer song, you know what I mean?
07:04 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_03]: If you do the Oscar Meyer song, people will remember you forever, because I've never gotten that out of my head, you know what I'm saying?
07:15 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
07:15 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_01]: B-O-L-O-G-N-A.
07:16 --> 07:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
07:16 --> 07:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, whatever happened to the kid who's saying the Oscar Meyer saw.
07:21 --> 07:21 [SPEAKER_03]: about the baloney.
07:22 --> 07:24 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, am I speaking into the void here?
07:24 --> 07:28 [SPEAKER_03]: Are people in our listenership completely unaware of the baloney song?
07:28 --> 07:30 [SPEAKER_05]: I just said it, come on.
07:30 --> 07:33 [SPEAKER_03]: That's true, you did, you did.
07:33 --> 07:36 [SPEAKER_05]: I assume everyone my age has it firmly implanted.
07:37 --> 07:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, okay, there's my baloney has a first name, one.
07:41 --> 07:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But there's also I wish I were an Oscar minor, weiner, right?
07:44 --> 07:45 [SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
07:45 --> 07:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to, we're talking about Oscar minor, which genre of processed meats are we talking about?
07:50 --> 08:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh boy, all right, anyway, I just think that the plot is heating up, I'm really interested about this broken amygdala, that's a really interesting twist.
08:02 --> 08:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
08:02 --> 08:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, the interest.
08:03 --> 08:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Sam without coloring.
08:04 --> 08:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
08:05 --> 08:10 [SPEAKER_03]: We were, we were curious last episode is Dick Haller and going to be heavily involved or is this going to be?
08:10 --> 08:10 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he's inside character.
08:11 --> 08:12 [SPEAKER_03]: He's heavily involved, right?
08:12 --> 08:12 [SPEAKER_03]: There's this thing.
08:12 --> 08:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
08:12 --> 08:13 [SPEAKER_03]: He's definitely, yeah.
08:13 --> 08:16 [SPEAKER_03]: They didn't cast him just to put him in the background here.
08:16 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
08:18 --> 08:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, they all, I'm going to bite my tongue on making Daredevil references, but the man without fear thing is super intriguing with the Pennywise of it all.
08:28 --> 08:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I just can't wait to see, is Pennywise even gonna try to scare him and how he reacts?
08:34 --> 08:39 [SPEAKER_03]: And I also, I think that I would question whether he actually has no fear.
08:40 --> 08:46 [SPEAKER_03]: And I'll come back to that when we talk about their home life, but let me pass it over to Mark for now.
08:46 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, yeah, on that note, before my hot take, like, is that a thing?
08:50 --> 08:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, this is a Nicole question.
08:53 --> 08:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, oh, you have a damaged amygdala.
08:55 --> 08:57 [SPEAKER_01]: You have no fear, super power unlocked.
08:57 --> 09:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if that's a thing.
09:00 --> 09:02 [SPEAKER_05]: It's simplified, but I'm fine with it.
09:02 --> 09:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Why don't you send her text right now by the end of the episode we'll have an answer that I actually probably can I can do that let me give me a second here um life podcasting everybody um okay so my hot take actually really like this episode um I
09:20 --> 09:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I think part of it was I got to watch it with my dad and he's like the Stephen King guy and my parents are in town and it was Halloween night.
09:26 --> 09:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I got to watch Stephen King stuff with my dad, which was kind of a cool experience.
09:32 --> 09:40 [SPEAKER_01]: But I thought a lot of the, you know, I mentioned last week I liked the last episode, but I had a few issues.
09:40 --> 10:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like the horror worked a lot better in this episode, there was a lot less of it which felt very Stephen Kingy, like most of this was character development, but yet there were a couple scenes and they were CG heavy, but they were also practical effects, heavy, and they just felt horrific and they fit in in the same way that like in the books like terrible punctuate the human drama
10:07 --> 10:09 [SPEAKER_01]: There were, I guess, really two set pieces, right?
10:09 --> 10:13 [SPEAKER_01]: The pickle thing and the mother, Ronnie's mother, right?
10:14 --> 10:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And they were both great.
10:16 --> 10:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So at least, especially in comparison to a few of the problems I had last time.
10:22 --> 10:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I really like how we're getting our new square central, our new losers club.
10:30 --> 10:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But similarly to, in the books, it's kind of a mix of new relationships and preexisting relationships.
10:40 --> 10:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, it's not completely high who are you.
10:43 --> 10:47 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's not also completely, oh, these kids have been friends since second grade.
10:47 --> 10:52 [SPEAKER_01]: There's kind of like, oh, there's this kid that I've seen across the, the hall for the last couple of years.
10:52 --> 10:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And we can actually have a conversation now.
10:55 --> 11:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's true, you know, is it then and then and Mike in the books join in with the other four.
11:04 --> 11:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I think is as a pre-existing quartet.
11:07 --> 11:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I think something like that.
11:10 --> 11:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And we had that in the first episode too, but those kids are dead, at least a lot of them.
11:16 --> 11:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's kind of happening again, and I think that's cool.
11:21 --> 11:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Is the new kid rich or something did I see that will in the oh, oh, I see what you're saying the the kid Across the hall from well who who warns about this stink bomb.
11:31 --> 11:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I swear And I never watched the the like after episode things, but I I did and I swear They said his name was rich.
11:38 --> 11:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I put it in the outline because I checked the last thing That's just interesting because
11:44 --> 11:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, they don't feel the sort of new group of kids doesn't feel as directly analogous to the movies and the book group as the ones in the first episode, right?
11:55 --> 11:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Which one of you said, and I totally agree.
11:58 --> 11:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Except that one of them is named Richie.
12:00 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's actually kind of a very realistic thing.
12:03 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:03 --> 12:09 [SPEAKER_01]: People have the same name, like you know how many Liam's and Owens are in my son's class right now and on his default team.
12:09 --> 12:10 [SPEAKER_05]: That's how he's doing.
12:10 --> 12:11 [SPEAKER_01]: That's how he's doing.
12:11 --> 12:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, Marcus, Marcus, we're a couple years early from Mark.
12:16 --> 12:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
12:16 --> 12:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And like from like 1965 to I'm the last Mark that was born.
12:21 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_03]: I think I said on a podcast once I have a I have a three year old cousin named Marcus.
12:27 --> 12:28 [SPEAKER_01]: But that's the thing.
12:28 --> 12:29 [SPEAKER_01]: You can be Marcus.
12:29 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_01]: You can be Marcel.
12:31 --> 12:35 [SPEAKER_01]: You can be anything but Mark with a K Mark with a K was retired when I was born.
12:35 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.
12:36 --> 12:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So, so yeah, that's my hot take.
12:40 --> 12:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I like it.
12:40 --> 12:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Haloran is definitely a thing and sorry.
12:43 --> 12:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I cast a thing.
12:46 --> 12:49 [SPEAKER_05]: I was with someone for four years named Mark with a K who was born after.
12:50 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_01]: okay all right the different continent different continent he's not 20 years younger than me though right no no no yeah so he's still like my generational cohort is the one that killed that name right um and I think I'm late like most marks I've met are five to ten years older than me right but uh except for your mark uh from another continent I'm just gonna go with Antarctica um but let me can I just say like they
13:17 --> 13:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Because this is, you know, run related kind of to everything else.
13:20 --> 13:22 [SPEAKER_01]: There's this question of which continuity, right?
13:22 --> 13:25 [SPEAKER_01]: We're following the movie continuity, not the book continuity.
13:26 --> 13:31 [SPEAKER_01]: The shining, that is a very real question, right?
13:31 --> 13:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Because the movie that everybody knows is so much more different than the book then,
13:37 --> 13:45 [SPEAKER_01]: the TV version that was written by Stephen King, et cetera, like, and Stephen King famously has sort of disavowed the shining film, the Kubrick film.
13:46 --> 13:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But I feel like they really cast somebody that looks like quite a lot, like, Skettman Crothers, to be Haloran.
13:54 --> 14:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's this weird, like, wait, are we actually sharing continuity with the Kubrick shining also from 1980?
14:01 --> 14:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's a weird, it's not possible to really go that far, but yeah.
14:04 --> 14:18 [SPEAKER_01]: There is a weird kind of, there's something about that actor that looks more like him back then than I would think sort of statistical likelihood would have it be, but anyways, probably means nothing.
14:18 --> 14:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Did you watch Dr. Sleep?
14:22 --> 14:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I saw that when it like around when it came out,
14:27 --> 14:51 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's a really weird like we can't decide what's everything's canon in that right am I correct about that Yeah, I mean that one's closer to the book and I know Stephen King was happier with it for that reason But it also includes a Dick Halorin where they just clearly have a physical archetype That they're yeah, it was played by Carl Lumbly in Dr sleep So they've just got a mood board somewhere.
14:51 --> 14:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Dick Halorin.
14:51 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_05]: She'll always look such
14:53 --> 15:00 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's probably just, you know, as much as Stephen King is, you know, disavowing the shining movie.
15:00 --> 15:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
15:01 --> 15:08 [SPEAKER_03]: He knows that that is the cultural and the producers know that that is the cultural understanding of that character.
15:08 --> 15:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
15:09 --> 15:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Like if you were in an ass, somebody, oh, what does Dick Haller look like?
15:12 --> 15:14 [SPEAKER_03]: They point to that character in that movie.
15:15 --> 15:20 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think they kind of just accept like that's just the zeitgeist of what Dick Haller looks like.
15:21 --> 15:51 [SPEAKER_03]: it's Kubrick story now kind of like that version is so iconic uh... yeah and it's not at all a criticism it's just a funny like kind of yeah nod cool well i'm in for it alright well let's get right into the episode well it's hot i didn't i didn't write an outline for it but do you want to talk about the main title sequence that was
15:51 --> 16:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, the thing I love about the main title sequence is that it is, like, you know, we were talking last time about what the archetypal Pennywise scare is.
16:02 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And it always starts in this sort of friendly, accessible, familiar way.
16:08 --> 16:09 [SPEAKER_05]: And then,
16:09 --> 16:39 [SPEAKER_05]: warps into like slowly things are more and more wrong until it's it's a nightmare and that's what the opening title sequence communicates so effectively and it's just I've now watched it like I don't know five times because there's all these little details you can pick out of it so I highly recommend anyone who's enjoying the show see which you can get out of the main title sequence lots of references to the book to the movies to what might be coming this season
16:39 --> 16:41 [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't know if you guys had any thoughts about it.
16:41 --> 16:49 [SPEAKER_01]: For me, I think that that's the question is what is Vibe versus what is predictive?
16:50 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and also what is recap, like obviously like the kid looking in the sewer, that is probably more than anything just sort of a nod to, oh, like the first kill in the film.
17:01 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly.
17:01 --> 17:14 [SPEAKER_05]: George, you're probably a kid's, but I mean, it was a little girl looking in the sewer in this version, but probably other kids have Pennywise has gotten them through the sewers because he lives down there where they all float.
17:15 --> 17:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, there's only so many disruptions you can come up with.
17:19 --> 17:20 [SPEAKER_03]: I haven't done this one in a while.
17:20 --> 17:21 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, people that's right.
17:21 --> 17:22 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
17:22 --> 17:29 [SPEAKER_01]: But like, okay, we see a kid getting apparently lobotomized in Juniper Hill.
17:29 --> 17:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So is that just a vibe thing or look what's going on in Juniper Hill or is that telling us that will happen in the season, right?
17:35 --> 17:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And we don't know.
17:36 --> 17:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And because some of the stuff for sure, I don't want to call out which, which things, but like,
17:45 --> 17:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of those shots are things that happen in the history of dairy, right?
17:50 --> 17:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And, but they're like, um, what's it called?
17:54 --> 17:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Inbellish through sort of over the top.
18:00 --> 18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
18:00 --> 18:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I gosh, do I want to see it's like it's it's also tough for me to remember which things are mentioned as backstory in the films.
18:08 --> 18:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Like this is kind of like a house of the dragon thing.
18:10 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like wait did this actually get spoiled already in the original series?
18:13 --> 18:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm trying to remember but like some of these are sort of hyper
18:18 --> 18:27 [SPEAKER_01]: like exaggerated versions of things that did happen, whether we see them in this season, like one thing that I looked it up happens in 1908.
18:28 --> 18:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And so one of the things that's depicted, and so didn't one of you say 1908 is a year we're going to?
18:33 --> 18:33 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes it is.
18:34 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's one that I'm like, all right, that seems like a season two or a season three thing, but they're telling us right now what happens.
18:42 --> 18:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's like hyper kind of impossible, like some of those things can't happen in the same moment, right?
18:48 --> 18:53 [SPEAKER_05]: But it's, I mean, the stuff that happened in 1908, it's still, it's still in the past.
18:53 --> 18:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, for instance, in part, I think it was the first new it movie, the one from 2017.
18:59 --> 19:18 [SPEAKER_05]: I think they actually did show a glimpse of my color and in the library, looking through figuring out these past events and kind of name-dropping things that happened in the past.
19:18 --> 19:19 [SPEAKER_05]: future seasons as well.
19:19 --> 19:20 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was actually Ben.
19:21 --> 19:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Wasn't I?
19:21 --> 19:22 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so yeah.
19:22 --> 19:23 [SPEAKER_03]: I know Mike's the eventual library.
19:23 --> 19:27 [SPEAKER_03]: Ben's the one who's like, um, the Duke, you know, the, like, I have no friends.
19:27 --> 19:28 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to go to the library.
19:28 --> 19:29 [SPEAKER_03]: That's right.
19:29 --> 19:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Ben's cool.
19:30 --> 19:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It would have been all I
19:34 --> 19:45 [SPEAKER_01]: What if they did this as like a framing device for like every episode is like Ben is a kid or Mike has an adult opening a book and let's see what happened next or whatever But I guess the point is this stuff I've got forgotten.
19:46 --> 19:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, so that's his or their 20s now.
19:48 --> 19:49 [SPEAKER_03]: So that's right.
19:49 --> 19:49 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
19:49 --> 19:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah The Donnie Darko bunny thing was weird.
19:55 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, did you notice the bunny mask one like that's
19:59 --> 20:18 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the one that I'm really like thrown for a loop about the and the only thing that I can think of that it that is Stephen King related directly is really bizarre, which is not a person in a mask at all that like animal headed people, which are a thing and some of the books, but But to he and I just don't think we should go there.
20:18 --> 20:19 [SPEAKER_01]: There's no way that's what that is.
20:19 --> 20:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know it's just a weird
20:21 --> 20:34 [SPEAKER_05]: I do wonder if they're going to bring in other stuff from the books like Minor Trailer Reference, they they show a mist rolling over the town and like they're not going to go there Are they wow?
20:35 --> 20:38 [SPEAKER_01]: which is also super related to the dark tower.
20:39 --> 20:41 [SPEAKER_01]: That would be just so, yeah.
20:41 --> 20:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, but the thing is dairy is a place that is kind of a nexus of all of this, right?
20:47 --> 20:52 [SPEAKER_01]: The main is a really rough spot to live in the Stephen King.
20:52 --> 20:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Like if you're not in, if you're in Maine or Colorado, or,
20:56 --> 21:08 [SPEAKER_01]: What's the town like there's another town kind of in the south or the southern Midwest or something where stuff happens other than that you're pretty you're pretty safe If you're in one of those spots like there's just a lot of bad stuff happening.
21:09 --> 21:16 [SPEAKER_03]: I would still take cost me was areas than Florida in the real world But I mean that's nice Yikes okay shots fire.
21:16 --> 21:17 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just kidding.
21:17 --> 21:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just kidding Floridians a little bit I think there might be one said in Florida too.
21:22 --> 21:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Let me think
21:24 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean Florida definitely, well, yeah, Florida is where the nexus of all realities is in Marvel a garden.
21:32 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I guess here's the thing is Florida men could take down any one of these villains.
21:36 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Like Pennywise would not stand a chance fighting Florida men.
21:41 --> 21:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I mean, actually I would like to like to see that in Florida, man, would be like, I'm sorry.
21:47 --> 21:50 [SPEAKER_05]: This is just Tuesday, you know, sorry for that.
21:50 --> 21:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Do McKee is.
21:51 --> 21:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I have friends from Florida and they make these jokes.
21:54 --> 22:03 [SPEAKER_03]: So they do a single episode where a Florida and Travis, you know, tourists comes to dairy and just like, it's like, no, I'll be back in 27 years.
22:03 --> 22:06 [SPEAKER_03]: I can't do this.
22:06 --> 22:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyways, um, are you are the two of you big fans of patients and
22:11 --> 22:12 [SPEAKER_01]: of what?
22:12 --> 22:12 [SPEAKER_05]: What?
22:12 --> 22:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Patience and prudence.
22:15 --> 22:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Patience and prudence.
22:15 --> 22:17 [SPEAKER_05]: That's very nice.
22:17 --> 22:17 [SPEAKER_01]: The song.
22:18 --> 22:19 [SPEAKER_01]: The song.
22:19 --> 22:20 [SPEAKER_01]: In the main title.
22:21 --> 22:23 [SPEAKER_01]: is a track by patience and prudence.
22:23 --> 22:25 [SPEAKER_01]: These two sisters from the fifties.
22:26 --> 22:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is not something I just knew.
22:28 --> 22:29 [SPEAKER_01]: This is something I looked up.
22:30 --> 22:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like a bubble gum pop group from the fifties that was like two twin girls that were sisters.
22:36 --> 22:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And they had a few hits.
22:38 --> 22:39 [SPEAKER_01]: This was a hit.
22:40 --> 22:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what.
22:41 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I probably kind of a one hit one or kind of thing, but
22:45 --> 22:51 [SPEAKER_01]: It was at least a single that did get on the Billboard charts called a smile and a ribbon, right?
22:52 --> 22:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And it does seem there, it's there for some kind of period placement, but also the irony of it all, right?
22:59 --> 23:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I thought it was a bigger.
23:01 --> 23:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought it was, it was very good.
23:03 --> 23:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we were going to have to redo the awesome theme music.
23:06 --> 23:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Just to make it over.
23:08 --> 23:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Creepy version of that.
23:09 --> 23:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, we can do our own thing, we're forging our own way and dairy.
23:12 --> 23:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Also, the theme music I'm assuming is going to change every season because they're going back 20 seconds.
23:17 --> 23:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
23:17 --> 23:19 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm someone else.
23:19 --> 23:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Wow.
23:21 --> 23:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:21 --> 23:23 [SPEAKER_01]: No, that's 1908, huh?
23:23 --> 23:28 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to get like, Bob Ville, kind of a sound.
23:28 --> 23:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's the pop music of the era.
23:30 --> 23:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyways, yeah, looking forward to it.
23:31 --> 23:36 [SPEAKER_03]: To say the clarinet predated the saxophone as the lead instrument, come on.
23:38 --> 23:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, where are we talking about?
23:40 --> 23:40 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, dude.
23:40 --> 23:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, not a thing, Mr. Music Professor.
23:42 --> 23:44 [SPEAKER_03]: What the heck?
23:44 --> 23:47 [SPEAKER_03]: We know the clarinet was the king of like instrumental bands.
23:48 --> 23:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, 1908, it's like before jazz.
23:52 --> 24:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there was still the clarinet was definitely in its heyday up until I'd say the 30s in terms of like early jazz and stuff.
24:01 --> 24:03 [SPEAKER_01]: But pre-jet, like you're talking on a ragtime dance.
24:03 --> 24:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think you'd have a lot of cornet, which is not an instrument that gets a lot of play these days, but I think there was some clarinet.
24:11 --> 24:13 [SPEAKER_03]: This is, you get to hammer on, it's fun.
24:13 --> 24:13 [SPEAKER_03]: It's fun.
24:14 --> 24:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Look it up.
24:15 --> 24:19 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, well, I don't think we need to go too deep into that right now.
24:19 --> 24:24 [SPEAKER_03]: We can head right into the Hamlin's home life, Alicia, you want to read that for us?
24:26 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_05]: The Henlands home life.
24:28 --> 24:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Lee Roy Henlands wife Charlotte and son will arrive in Derry to see their new home.
24:33 --> 24:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Lee Roy struggles to bond with his nerdy son, but the family is happy to reunite.
24:37 --> 24:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Charlotte does errands in town with a mixed reception until she sees a boy getting viciously attacked by a group of bullies and no one's stopping it.
24:46 --> 24:50 [SPEAKER_05]: She stops the boys resulting in odd looks from all the boys and bystanders.
24:50 --> 24:56 [SPEAKER_05]: When she tells the story a dinner, Lee Roy suggests that his wife not get involved.
24:56 --> 25:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Ooh and see this is a Charlotte's already my favorite character because I'm the person who cannot help but try to stop and stop a fight and it can really annoying people around me.
25:09 --> 25:18 [SPEAKER_05]: So I feel Charlotte with this and the big difference obviously is that I am a visibly white woman in you know,
25:19 --> 25:25 [SPEAKER_05]: A time growing up, I never really had to fear that the police would do anything to me.
25:25 --> 25:33 [SPEAKER_05]: And Charlotte is so much braver, because she already apparently knows the consequences.
25:33 --> 25:41 [SPEAKER_05]: They've already had bricks through their cars and had to leave town, but she still just can't not speak up when she sees injustice being done.
25:42 --> 26:08 [SPEAKER_03]: This is also a pre civil rights act like this is like, you know, even worse to be a black person in America at this time, and yeah, I think incredibly brave, you know, this whole scene is what makes me or this set of scenes that, you know, I'm combining things with all these outlines, but this is what makes me go, does Lee Roy actually not have fear, because I think he does have at least some kind of anxiety here, right?
26:08 --> 26:18 [SPEAKER_03]: And how do you define fear some things right exactly and and maybe that's what Pennywise is going to play with right is like Okay, he doesn't fear the dark.
26:18 --> 26:19 [SPEAKER_03]: He doesn't fear monsters.
26:19 --> 26:28 [SPEAKER_03]: He doesn't fear violence But what does he fear and I think he still has You know, you know fear fear has a logical component, right?
26:28 --> 26:29 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not all irrational.
26:30 --> 26:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe he doesn't feel irrational fear But do you fear something happening to his family?
26:35 --> 26:36 [SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm.
26:36 --> 26:38 [SPEAKER_03]: I think absolutely
26:38 --> 26:44 [SPEAKER_03]: So I question this whole amygdala thing, if Mark can get a sentence or from Nicole about up.
26:44 --> 26:50 [SPEAKER_03]: But even, you know, putting real world science behind, I think that this is going to be a question of what is fear.
26:51 --> 26:54 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that is a brilliant question to ask in in it series.
26:54 --> 27:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Like that is a great way to expand the itverse is to start asking questions of what is fear?
27:01 --> 27:02 [SPEAKER_03]: How do you define it?
27:02 --> 27:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Mark, do you have any thoughts on this set of scenes?
27:07 --> 27:31 [SPEAKER_01]: are professors, feedback on the amygdala, um, what do we think about Schrieveport, not like the town, but they made reference to like ever since Schrieveport, like they did they have to leave because of something she did or did they just was they're like public shaming associated with something that Charlotte had done.
27:31 --> 27:34 [SPEAKER_05]: They said that they got bricks through their car windows.
27:35 --> 27:42 [SPEAKER_05]: And basically it sounds like they were chased out of town because she was, and he said something about like sitting where you're not supposed to sit, that's sort of thing.
27:42 --> 27:45 [SPEAKER_05]: So she was active in the civil rights movement.
27:46 --> 27:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Or at least sitting at a cutting herself.
27:48 --> 27:49 [SPEAKER_05]: That's why it's only, that's sort of thing.
27:52 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_01]: At the very least, putting herself in business that people didn't like.
27:59 --> 28:29 [SPEAKER_03]: yeah i mean i'm just i just wanted to look up uh... brown v board of ed which is the four hole in the whole well it had to do with public schools i can't recall if there was another case that was the uh... you know for for more general um... segregation issues brown v board of ed was nineteen fifty four so this would have actually had to be eight years before if it was pre brown uh... with racial segregation at at like a you know lunch
28:29 --> 28:43 [SPEAKER_03]: But, of course, we all know that, you know, just because the law said something does not mean that the people in a small town are going to abide by that, you know, there's, there's microaggressions, there's macroaggressions at that time.
28:44 --> 28:49 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's, you know, a big part of why the civil rights movement of the 1960s became so big.
28:50 --> 28:54 [SPEAKER_03]: And so it sounds like she was sort of an early actor in the civil rights movement.
28:56 --> 29:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So in terms of the in general of this plot, like what it tells us about dairy, right, is that the evil of dairy in part of the sort of spell of it is to make otherwise good people do nothing and turn a blind eye, right?
29:12 --> 29:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And so she is still, and to some certain extent, this entire family is still an outsider, right?
29:17 --> 29:19 [SPEAKER_01]: They're coming in,
29:19 --> 29:41 [SPEAKER_01]: not a part of the sort of agreed upon subconsciously norms of dairy, whether that's will, as a kid, the dad, Leroy, who's maybe kind of going against the grain in some ways on the base, but she hasn't yet got the memo psychically or whatever, that you're supposed to turn a blind eye to the bully stuff.
29:41 --> 29:44 [SPEAKER_05]: So if we see that there, that's going to be heartbreaking.
29:45 --> 29:47 [SPEAKER_01]: But it kind of has to, right?
29:47 --> 29:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Like there is no
29:49 --> 29:56 [SPEAKER_01]: the poll of even the loser's club as adults coming back, it's like, there's even they forget, right?
29:57 --> 30:00 [SPEAKER_01]: And they were literally fighting the monster in the sewers when they were kids, right?
30:01 --> 30:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And so turning a blind eye is sort of just programmed to you.
30:04 --> 30:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And so this sort of era of turning a blind eye to adjust this, especially when you think of it as a northern context,
30:18 --> 30:33 [SPEAKER_01]: in Maine and Boston in New York and california these other sort of northern aligned cities to be like well we didn't have slavery at least not not since the 1700s and we you know we're not racist here when like blatantly
30:33 --> 31:02 [SPEAKER_01]: you were it was an excuse to turn a blind eye and that's basically what's happening with dairy it's there's always a self preservation element or boys will be boys element that that's the story really of of what happens to the adults because of the influence of Pennywise but but like is it all because of Pennywise or as Pennywise also fueled by people's
31:03 --> 31:11 [SPEAKER_05]: No, I mean because my thing is like does every town have a penny-wise because you sure see this all over I know I know well, let me let me ask you though.
31:11 --> 31:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh
31:13 --> 31:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I was wondering why they were bringing in a racial plot line, a racial discrimination plot line.
31:18 --> 31:21 [SPEAKER_03]: And one is, it's the 60s, it's kind of everywhere.
31:21 --> 31:23 [SPEAKER_03]: It's, you can't really avoid that question.
31:24 --> 31:26 [SPEAKER_03]: It's almost dishonest to avoid that question.
31:27 --> 31:42 [SPEAKER_03]: But the other thing is, I wonder if the fact that she has been treated as an outsider, and clearly there is a racial component to that here, dancing around things with the butcher,
31:43 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_03]: was a little weird to her at first.
31:47 --> 31:49 [SPEAKER_03]: The one who sold the her husband, the telescope.
31:50 --> 31:59 [SPEAKER_03]: I wonder if the fact that they're being treated more as outsiders will delay, at least, the assimilation into Pennywise's magic, right?
31:59 --> 32:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Because they're not part of theory.
32:01 --> 32:02 [SPEAKER_03]: They are still passer.
32:03 --> 32:07 [SPEAKER_03]: They are still contributed as passer passing through.
32:07 --> 32:19 [SPEAKER_05]: But I mean, this is like we see, for example, the beginning of the book, the beginning of the second movie, Adrian, the gay man, he is an outsider.
32:19 --> 32:28 [SPEAKER_05]: He's not even, he's not from Dairy, and he is killed in that kind of kicks off that part of, sorry, spoiler from the beginning of those things.
32:28 --> 32:35 [SPEAKER_05]: But that kicks off, you know, this adult round of investigation into Pennywise that you get from the original material.
32:36 --> 32:44 [SPEAKER_05]: So I think Pennywise also seems to, because it's a lot, like the overall story, I think is a lot about bigotry.
32:45 --> 32:55 [SPEAKER_05]: And we see all different types of bigotry, and Pennywise uses that as one of his tools, I think, to push the buttons where he sees them pop up.
32:57 --> 33:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mentioned, I mentioned this last week that there is some ambiguity in the universe between whether Pennywise is causing human to human mass atrocities at the moments that he rises or if in some ways, those human to human mass atrocities and terrible things are what wake him up.
33:18 --> 33:20 [SPEAKER_01]: So, like,
33:20 --> 33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Adrian being murdered at the beginning of the 80s era in the novel and the 2010s era in the film is sort of because of Pennywise but also kind of the thing that finally seals the deal that he's awake now right so like I think we could look at these kind of situations as possibly a cause like the bullies beating up the kid is
33:46 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_01]: partially because of Pennywise and also partially the a cause of Pennywise that some of these horrific events it's unclear which is cause which is a result and and I would just say like the title of this is welcome to dairy and I wonder if there's going to be an outsider figure that we look at every single season and we know it it had to be I mean that there's aspects with
34:10 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_01]: without like getting into where this is going.
34:13 --> 34:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I know where this is going because there is reference to black soldiers in the coming to the base nearby town as a part of the backstory that my canlon researchers.
34:26 --> 34:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So that was in the novel, canonically like about something that happened when people who were out of town move there.
34:34 --> 34:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And what are we gonna get when it's 1908?
34:36 --> 34:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Like is it?
34:38 --> 34:44 [SPEAKER_01]: you know, European immigrants moving in, um, if we keep going back, uh, leash already spoiled this, like this goes back hundreds of years.
34:45 --> 34:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it going to be colonists, like, is this series always about?
34:49 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And outside are coming in, who's the only person who can really see things are not right here, right?
34:55 --> 34:59 [SPEAKER_01]: This is not the way humans should behave in a society because everybody else.
35:00 --> 35:05 [SPEAKER_01]: The adults, at least, are not able to perceive that.
35:05 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's only the outside of adults that even can be a perspective holder.
35:09 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, it's hard for us to be in the perspective of one of Lily's mom or whatever, because she's under the spell already.
35:16 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Right?
35:17 --> 35:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Wendy, you want a McDillah talk from Nicole.
35:19 --> 35:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Should we wait till we talk about the soldiers?
35:22 --> 35:23 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, why don't we wait till that?
35:24 --> 35:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I've got it.
35:24 --> 35:25 [SPEAKER_03]: I've got it.
35:25 --> 35:26 [SPEAKER_04]: I've got it.
35:27 --> 35:29 [SPEAKER_03]: And until then, we're going to take a quick break.
35:47 --> 35:50 [SPEAKER_03]: We're back and ready to talk about some school drama.
35:51 --> 35:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Marge tries to fit in with the plastics, I mean the pati cakes, by matching their mean girl energy.
35:57 --> 36:02 [SPEAKER_03]: She invites Lily back into their group, but she declines and we're choosing to remain alone.
36:03 --> 36:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Will has his first day at school and is already being bullied by students and teachers alike.
36:09 --> 36:14 [SPEAKER_03]: He makes connections with Rich, while running from a Stinkbomb and Ronnie well in detention for it.
36:15 --> 36:21 [SPEAKER_03]: This is kind of a catch-all for everything happening at the school that wasn't directly related to somebody's plot line, but...
36:21 --> 36:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
36:21 --> 36:22 [SPEAKER_03]: March sucks.
36:22 --> 36:33 [SPEAKER_03]: I just want to say that, but I feel badly for her because she, you know, clearly wants to fit in, but she's choosing the wrong way to fit in, right?
36:33 --> 36:34 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a good idea.
36:34 --> 36:35 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's really interesting.
36:36 --> 36:40 [SPEAKER_03]: I thought it was a great writing how she kind of takes it too far both times, right?
36:40 --> 36:45 [SPEAKER_03]: And that actually, like her desperation to fit in,
36:45 --> 36:50 [SPEAKER_03]: is what Ketra from fitting in very true to life.
36:50 --> 36:51 [SPEAKER_05]: I called on the discord.
36:51 --> 36:54 [SPEAKER_05]: I said Marge is the real villain of the story.
36:55 --> 37:06 [SPEAKER_05]: But I do actually think she's going to be the one who has the most satisfying arc over the story because I think this is going to be a story about her learning to
37:07 --> 37:12 [SPEAKER_05]: have be more confident in who she is and obviously she'll end up with the square square or whatever.
37:14 --> 37:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I have a lot of empathy for Marge actually like I don't I it sucks but I I actually feel like it's really realistic kind of the way that she's behaving because she when she says like I'm trying to be your friend but that's the first episode but you're making it hard like
37:35 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_01]: the attention between who I was hanging out with and who other people thought I was hanging out with like it's just like when the social reality explodes for you in adolescence it's so hard to just be comfortable with who your friends are and just not even question it and not aspire to ladder climb like I yeah she clearly making the wrong answers but or excuse me making the wrong decisions but it's also like her best friend is
38:04 --> 38:07 [SPEAKER_01]: someone who's been in and out of a mental institution in the 1960s.
38:08 --> 38:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And that is a stigma back then.
38:10 --> 38:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And you do have this little in with the cool kids.
38:14 --> 38:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I don't know that it would be
38:18 --> 38:37 [SPEAKER_01]: easy to expect somebody to stand up for her and and it is interesting that she takes it to 100% at that age if she was 15 then actually yeah grow up a little bit like like stick up for your friends and stick up for yourself but the idea of her taking it too far I almost wonder
38:37 --> 38:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember the girl who's cutting her down all the time, the like leader, the tallest one, what's her name?
38:48 --> 38:49 [SPEAKER_01]: What did we know her name?
38:51 --> 38:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Just turn me in girl name.
38:51 --> 38:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I don't know.
38:52 --> 38:54 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll call her queen, that's fine.
38:54 --> 39:03 [SPEAKER_01]: The second time when she cuts her down, like, that's enough for whatever she says, I almost felt like it wasn't that she actually had taken it too far.
39:03 --> 39:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It was that girl was trying to protect her own power dynamics because the girls were laughing at marriage.
39:08 --> 39:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
39:08 --> 39:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, laughing with Marge, and she needed to make sure Marge stayed a subservient force within that dynamic.
39:12 --> 39:17 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,
39:18 --> 39:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, she's taking it too far.
39:19 --> 39:24 [SPEAKER_01]: She's trying too hard, but I feel like that one girl is making sure everybody knows that, right?
39:24 --> 39:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
39:24 --> 39:28 [SPEAKER_01]: That she's actually, this is like her exerting a bunch of effort.
39:29 --> 39:30 [SPEAKER_03]: But I think that's right.
39:30 --> 39:34 [SPEAKER_03]: And defensive March, she does invite Lily to sit with them, right?
39:34 --> 39:35 [SPEAKER_03]: She's not excluding Lily.
39:35 --> 39:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Lily is actually saying side or self, but I think that that is.
39:41 --> 39:47 [SPEAKER_03]: And like you're saying, Mark, it's, I have a lot of empathy's
39:48 --> 39:54 [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, she's, she, if she were more mature, she might be like, I have to meet my friend where she is, right?
39:54 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I'll just go sit with her today and let her vent and or just sit with her in silence if that's what she needs.
40:00 --> 40:04 [SPEAKER_03]: But instead, she's like, let's just force our way back into normal, say.
40:04 --> 40:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
40:04 --> 40:08 [SPEAKER_05]: By the way, of course, the, the name of the mean girl is Patty.
40:09 --> 40:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so Patty takes like that's the, there.
40:12 --> 40:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because she's Patty, yeah.
40:15 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I think even just the,
40:17 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_01]: the more mature thing is as simple as girls come on Lily she's had a tough her dad that lets let's leave her like you could even just advocate for her you could totally try to join that group all that and the more mature thing would just be that have them lay off Lily a little bit right come on she's actually pretty cool let's just let her in whatever she's she's weird but she's cool you'll see like
40:41 --> 40:44 [SPEAKER_01]: She's a few years away from even being able to really do that.
40:45 --> 40:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Her only solution is to pretend that there isn't anything wrong with the situation or anything that anybody should be concerned about.
40:55 --> 40:56 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
40:56 --> 41:10 [SPEAKER_03]: And I will say that is something that I've admired about Gen Z and older Gen Alpha is that they are much more, I would say, accepting of mental health struggles.
41:12 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_03]: especially like even when I was in middle and high school, you know, and I'm on the younger side of millennials, it still was not that healthy, you know, and I see Genzi and older Jell now for being healthier with that.
41:24 --> 41:36 [SPEAKER_05]: And when people are suppressing, like, you know, making fun of this other person who has, she obviously had a public outburst of some sort after her father died, um,
41:36 --> 41:56 [SPEAKER_05]: and so that makes it easy to point fingers at her but then by making fun of her it's like the people who closet themselves for who are gay or something like that um you're just making it harder on yourself because you're suppressing that part of you instead of being like okay this is part of being human and how do we handle this instead of just pretending it doesn't exist
41:57 --> 41:57 [SPEAKER_01]: right.
41:58 --> 42:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And my oldest is a couple of months in the middle school now.
42:02 --> 42:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'll have to let you know what is the new stuff that's digitized?
42:06 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Because sure, if if
42:08 --> 42:09 [SPEAKER_01]: They want to talk about mental health.
42:10 --> 42:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Gen Alpha is not going to stigmatize.
42:12 --> 42:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you go to therapy or you're on meds or whatever, they're not going to stigmatize it like they would have when these kids were growing up.
42:16 --> 42:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But there's probably something new.
42:18 --> 42:29 [SPEAKER_01]: They do stigmatize because it's, I'm sure Nicole would say it's kind of developmentally appropriate for there to be in groups and out groups and mean girl behavior is just gonna happen.
42:29 --> 42:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And I just don't know yet what it is for the new kids.
42:31 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's probably stuff about social media and all that.
42:35 --> 42:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I'll let you know.
42:39 --> 42:55 [SPEAKER_03]: six six or seven days you mean when we're next on like or six seven all the kids are doing now how do i i don't get no about six seven no it's seven mark you're gonna know better than me with with your middle schooler
42:55 --> 43:07 [SPEAKER_01]: The hilarious thing is, I can't tell you what it actually means, though, and I've had full on conversations with my kid, where it's like the question of what does it mean is almost unanswerable.
43:07 --> 43:08 [SPEAKER_01]: It is the dead lights.
43:08 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It is an inn, perceivable, undescribable.
43:11 --> 43:13 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a meme basically, Alicia.
43:13 --> 43:16 [SPEAKER_01]: It is a meme that started because of
43:16 --> 43:24 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's the number, it's, it started in an NBA game with somebody's number, but then there's a little dance that someone did as a TikTok meme, and it basically is a non-secretor.
43:24 --> 43:26 [SPEAKER_01]: You say it to mean anything.
43:26 --> 43:28 [SPEAKER_01]: It means anything and nothing.
43:29 --> 43:32 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not even, it has even less meaning than skip it, it means.
43:32 --> 43:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's just sort of a thing they say, and, you know, if you go on Reddit, you'll find innumerable post of, like, teachers,
43:43 --> 43:48 [SPEAKER_01]: using it in class to try to like make it uncool.
43:48 --> 44:06 [SPEAKER_01]: So kids stop saying it like we have the commercials and we need it to be but it's it's the main of any gen alpha parents existence because it's just like this term that keeps being said and nobody knows what it means and when you ask the kids they're like they don't even know it's just gen alpha humor is
44:07 --> 44:20 [SPEAKER_01]: If you thought like, our generation was the family guy generation where there was a lot of like non-secreters and absurdist tumor, and that was, it's like every gen Alpha joke is a one of those.
44:20 --> 44:23 [SPEAKER_01]: G-I-J-O-P-S-A's from the U-Lift 2000s.
44:23 --> 44:26 [SPEAKER_01]: That's just random stuff that means nothing.
44:26 --> 44:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And I can't explain it, but six, seven, now you know, which you know literally as well as you ever will.
44:33 --> 44:35 [SPEAKER_03]: What I mean, and you probably very confused.
44:35 --> 44:35 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's right.
44:36 --> 44:39 [SPEAKER_03]: I will tell you, South Park did a whole episode on it.
44:39 --> 44:41 [SPEAKER_03]: The first episode of this current season.
44:41 --> 44:42 [SPEAKER_05]: OK, so I will catch up.
44:42 --> 44:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm a couple episodes behind on South Park, so.
44:45 --> 44:51 [SPEAKER_03]: It's, it does actually seem it's going to be a season long joke about this stupid meme.
44:51 --> 44:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, and is this why they randomly switch season numbers?
44:54 --> 44:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, people think this is why they re-numbered the season in the middle of the season.
45:00 --> 45:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
45:00 --> 45:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Wait, is it season number six, seven?
45:03 --> 45:14 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it was, it was, it was, they changed from season 27 to 28, and I think it's because they want the six, seven joke to be a two-parter between episode six and seven, but it was a whole thing.
45:14 --> 45:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Got it.
45:15 --> 45:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Got it.
45:16 --> 45:17 [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
45:17 --> 45:18 [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
45:18 --> 45:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, this is in a South Park podcast.
45:20 --> 45:22 [SPEAKER_03]: We're going to talk more about our school friends.
45:23 --> 45:28 [SPEAKER_03]: I, you know, I have empathy for Mark is saying, I have, I have,
45:28 --> 45:30 [SPEAKER_03]: empathy for all of these people.
45:30 --> 45:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I it's hard to have it for Patty, but I'm sure I'm sure that comes from a deep level of insecurity too of I don't sure.
45:36 --> 45:38 [SPEAKER_03]: All I have is this power structure, right?
45:39 --> 45:50 [SPEAKER_03]: I did want to say their patty cake rhythmic stuff being like the intensely, you know, the tension track, yeah, I thought that was fantastic.
45:50 --> 45:51 [SPEAKER_03]: That was really, really great.
45:52 --> 45:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I agree.
45:54 --> 45:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Are you great?
45:55 --> 45:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Are you great?
45:55 --> 45:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, they're really good.
45:57 --> 46:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Speaking of soundtrack, is this the only time we're gonna talk about Rich, the new kid?
46:03 --> 46:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I probably.
46:04 --> 46:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, just calling out the musical cue there when he's staring at the girls and son of everything slows down and we hear this song.
46:13 --> 46:18 [SPEAKER_01]: This is another consequence of my boomer dad watching, he's like,
46:18 --> 46:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's you'll never walk alone.
46:20 --> 46:38 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the Liverpool football club like he a lot of his good friends are British guys And they go to games and stuff when he've got he's been to England and seen Manchester games and stuff and Liverpool That's that's a song so Rogers and Hammerstein from carousel But has become like an anthem of
46:39 --> 46:47 [SPEAKER_01]: of various soccer teams, like it's kind of like in Boston, we have sweet caroline by Neil Diamond played plays at every Boston Red sauce game.
46:47 --> 46:56 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like an anthem, but also became like a anthem for essential workers during COVID.
46:56 --> 47:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot of like loaded modern context to this song and it's this old.
47:03 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_01]: musical theater tune from gosh, is it the forties?
47:07 --> 47:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know, like I just put all that out there.
47:11 --> 47:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why it's like a comforting kind of encouragement song, but he's like in love with one or all of these girls and it's playing the song.
47:21 --> 47:22 [SPEAKER_01]: It was it with March.
47:22 --> 47:23 [SPEAKER_01]: See, I couldn't really tell.
47:23 --> 47:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but it's just weird because the song has a lot.
47:26 --> 47:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not as the the first one we heard.
47:30 --> 47:35 [SPEAKER_01]: The main title music is kind of I would say mostly divorced from modern context, right?
47:35 --> 47:39 [SPEAKER_01]: It's this is a bit more like if you.
47:40 --> 47:43 [SPEAKER_01]: piped in, like, running up that hill by King Bush.
47:43 --> 47:46 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, wait, is that a stranger thing's reference or is that a 80's reference?
47:46 --> 47:56 [SPEAKER_01]: This is like, wait, is that a Rogers and Hammerstein reference or is this some kind of like a soccer game or COVID-19, it like probably not, but it's just an interesting choice.
47:57 --> 48:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So thanks to the boomer, who knows a lot about British football.
48:01 --> 48:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, do you think that Richie might save March from herself, his crush?
48:09 --> 48:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
48:09 --> 48:13 [SPEAKER_05]: I didn't give her the confidence to stop kissing up to the patty cakes.
48:14 --> 48:14 [SPEAKER_01]: It could be.
48:15 --> 48:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not so confident that that's going to all go in the direction we want it to go in terms of March.
48:20 --> 48:22 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I think more kids are going to end up dead.
48:22 --> 48:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I think this is going to be way more brutal in that regard than the movie.
48:25 --> 48:31 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, I see I see a girl, a school is girl in thick glasses and shorter hair.
48:32 --> 48:35 [SPEAKER_03]: And what stranger things, I don't think they have a good track record.
48:36 --> 48:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, people have been comparing her to stay away from a pool.
48:42 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
48:45 --> 48:46 [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
48:46 --> 48:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, let's get into Ronnie's vision mark.
48:48 --> 48:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Would you like to ask that for us?
48:51 --> 48:52 [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, well, I did Ronnie's first.
48:53 --> 48:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh.
48:56 --> 49:01 [SPEAKER_01]: So we've got, we're not talking pickles, we're talking about Ronnie's vision.
49:02 --> 49:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
49:03 --> 49:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Ronnie listens to her dad and grandmother argue about his inevitable arrest from under the covers of her bed.
49:08 --> 49:13 [SPEAKER_01]: The covers come alive and begin to grow veins and fill with fluid.
49:13 --> 49:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Ronnie fights her way out, eventually pushing through her mother's uterus as her mother demands Ronnie answer why she tore her apart.
49:22 --> 49:26 [SPEAKER_01]: The zombie mother continues to go to Ronnie as she drags her toward her with the umbilical cord.
49:27 --> 49:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Ronnie breaks free in screens as the mother saunteres towards her and is saved by her dad's comfort.
49:34 --> 49:38 [SPEAKER_05]: This was deeply horrifying, really well done and I hope we are done with the bird horror.
49:40 --> 49:41 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think we're done.
49:41 --> 49:43 [SPEAKER_03]: I think this is going to be a major theme of
49:43 --> 49:54 [SPEAKER_01]: So I thought this was a pretty cool scene, I thought it was a blend of like real people there and effects.
49:55 --> 49:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It was creepy.
49:55 --> 50:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the antibiotic frug out there in like mock amniotic fluid and that's fun.
50:04 --> 50:05 [SPEAKER_03]: It's pretty gross.
50:05 --> 50:08 [SPEAKER_05]: They give me an extra, but they have to be bad all over like that.
50:09 --> 50:10 [SPEAKER_01]: So are you making that up?
50:10 --> 50:12 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm not making that up.
50:12 --> 50:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's funny.
50:12 --> 50:13 [SPEAKER_01]: That's funny.
50:13 --> 50:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
50:15 --> 50:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I think aside from the main title, this is our first sighting of yellow eyes.
50:22 --> 50:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And we see another sighting later in the, I think, with the pickles, this is
50:30 --> 50:44 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, we're supposed to think Pennywise, I just want to kind of remind people of the idea from the films of the Deadlights, which I mentioned, which is these orange light that if you like truly see into it, you see the Deadlights.
50:44 --> 50:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And it may be that the Deadlights are it's it's all very vague, but maybe the power behind it, maybe the true essence of it.
50:54 --> 51:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's just interesting we associate orange color glowing lights with that and it you know that sort of
51:02 --> 51:08 [SPEAKER_01]: What's the lovecraftian kind of horror almost of this creature, right?
51:08 --> 51:10 [SPEAKER_01]: But she didn't die, so it's not the actual death.
51:10 --> 51:12 [SPEAKER_01]: If you see the dead lights, you normally die, I think.
51:12 --> 51:17 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not actually that, but I feel like it's just sort of homage to that.
51:17 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to probably get that color as a kind of vibe for seeing into this creature.
51:23 --> 51:27 [SPEAKER_05]: But didn't they, they've saved kids who've seen the dead lights and brought them back.
51:27 --> 51:28 [SPEAKER_05]: You don't have to die.
51:28 --> 51:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think sometimes you end up combatose floating in the sewer right and then like brought Beverly back with a kiss.
51:35 --> 51:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think they're my, I'm not saying the first season to do so.
51:41 --> 51:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm not saying it's like the kind of thing.
51:44 --> 52:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, she saw through a mirror or whatever, but there might there might have been some reason why she didn't now I don't it could have been their their bonds of friendship or whatever, but but I think sometimes you guys Like of terror or of dread.
52:01 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, but Yeah, it's just calling it out watch for orange lights everybody
52:09 --> 52:24 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm in in the arms lights all right um... yeah i mean i i feel like there's not a ton to say about the scene it's mostly about the scare i mean obviously running is traumatized by this and and i think it it of course
52:25 --> 52:28 [SPEAKER_03]: ties back to the fact that she feels now that she's losing her father, right?
52:28 --> 52:34 [SPEAKER_03]: She's already lost her mother and now she's going to lose her father and I think in bold situations, she feels responsible, right?
52:35 --> 52:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm.
52:35 --> 52:44 [SPEAKER_03]: And obviously, if someone, if a woman dies in childbirth is not the baby's fault, I mean, you can make that clear, but yeah, tie with Lannister.
52:44 --> 52:45 [SPEAKER_03]: Come on.
52:45 --> 52:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
52:47 --> 52:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, Tyrion eventually claims that one.
52:49 --> 52:50 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, oh, I killed my mother on the way out.
52:50 --> 52:56 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, he's really- Yeah, but he claims it because it's sort of like, oh, this thing you say about me the whole time.
52:57 --> 52:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Fine, I'll wear it as a badge of honor.
52:58 --> 52:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
52:59 --> 53:00 [SPEAKER_03]: He's reappropriating.
53:00 --> 53:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
53:00 --> 53:03 [SPEAKER_03]: He's really, you know, you know, you know.
53:03 --> 53:08 [SPEAKER_03]: But now she feels responsible because she let the kids into the theater and then he died, right?
53:08 --> 53:10 [SPEAKER_01]: So do we think?
53:11 --> 53:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Pennywise was trying to kill her and was saved by her dad, or do we think it was basically messing with her?
53:23 --> 53:25 [SPEAKER_03]: I think messing with her, I think he's playing with his food.
53:26 --> 53:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, trying because I think they're seasoning.
53:29 --> 53:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, seasoning the meat, salting the meat.
53:31 --> 53:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Because it seems like you could just turn into a monster that tears her apart, right?
53:36 --> 53:39 [SPEAKER_01]: There's something about this specific thing.
53:39 --> 53:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I just wonder if she had been pulled all the way into that thing's jaws.
53:43 --> 53:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Is she dead then?
53:43 --> 53:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Or is this a long game, you know?
53:47 --> 53:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes it seems like it's just sort of,
53:50 --> 53:51 [SPEAKER_01]: playing around.
53:52 --> 53:56 [SPEAKER_05]: It's how hungry Pennywise is that day, you know, it's a cat playing with their prey.
53:58 --> 54:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah.
54:01 --> 54:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, it's it's sad.
54:03 --> 54:04 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel for the whole grogan family.
54:04 --> 54:10 [SPEAKER_03]: That's why I was like just as for the grogans before when you said there was only one good set of parents.
54:10 --> 54:11 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
54:12 --> 54:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, her parents have done nothing wrong, but yeah, and they've been in town for a while.
54:18 --> 54:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, right, true, and they seem to have at least some awareness of what's going on, and and that's why I wonder if, you know, the racial aspect is to show that like when these people are not quite accepted into the town, are they a little bit broken off from Pennywise's spell?
54:40 --> 54:45 [SPEAKER_01]: But, but also like not at all saying this isn't like
54:46 --> 54:53 [SPEAKER_01]: that blaming them or anything, but that's their like seeming alert and seeing really
54:54 --> 55:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Cognizant of the situation at hand in a way that the rest of the town isn't has everything to do with self preservation.
55:00 --> 55:00 [SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
55:00 --> 55:02 [SPEAKER_01]: They are not going out.
55:02 --> 55:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Her dad.
55:02 --> 55:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not saying he wouldn't, but her dad is not going out to help someone else.
55:06 --> 55:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Her dad and her grandma are very much concerned with how do we get out of this?
55:10 --> 55:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And so if they do are there friends, even there are other friends in the black community, like if we view them as outsiders or whatever, are they concerned or they going, keep your head down, pour up, runny's dad's going to get.
55:24 --> 55:29 [SPEAKER_01]: going to get taken like we don't know what he would do if he saw the kids getting beat up on the side of the road.
55:30 --> 55:31 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to push back two ways.
55:32 --> 55:36 [SPEAKER_03]: One, we saw all the neighbors watching and looking directly at what was happening.
55:36 --> 55:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Whereas in the white community, we saw the butcher just ignoring.
55:42 --> 55:45 [SPEAKER_03]: And the pastor by shock that charlotte.
55:45 --> 55:46 [SPEAKER_03]: interfered, you know.
55:47 --> 55:54 [SPEAKER_03]: And two is, we saw Hank, I think his name, Hank Grogan, letting Maddie off the hook in episode one, right?
55:54 --> 56:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, right, like, you know how his home life is, come on, let's give this kid a break, let's not chase him for, you know, feel on a movie.
56:01 --> 56:06 [SPEAKER_03]: And I, and I do think that that is kinder and less penny-wisey, right?
56:06 --> 56:10 [SPEAKER_03]: This is something he has more empathy than Pennywise generally allows.
56:10 --> 56:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I watch a new film, a 2025 film called New Group from Japan, so it's on the festival circuit now, but it plays exactly into what we're talking about right here, where it is basically about, it's like a form of zombie film, but it's about the in group and the out group and how it becomes harder and harder to hold on to independent thinking, to being part of the
56:36 --> 56:57 [SPEAKER_05]: hey this person died let's not pretend that didn't happen um so yeah it's and it's I do wonder if that is what's at play what Pennywise is playing on what we see happening with March where there's just this desperate desire to fit in and that's what's really driving the apathy.
56:58 --> 57:04 [SPEAKER_05]: and the people who can resist that desire to fit in are the ones who can see things clearer.
57:05 --> 57:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, resist or are forced out of fitting in, right?
57:08 --> 57:11 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's where I'm getting out with the racial component.
57:12 --> 57:21 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I think that there are still lots of members of the black community in that town who, as, you know, I think Marky was saying, who are just like, keep your head down and.
57:21 --> 57:22 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm sure that's true.
57:22 --> 57:27 [SPEAKER_03]: It's it's just I do think that there's a reason that we're talking about race here.
57:27 --> 57:28 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
57:28 --> 57:30 [SPEAKER_03]: I Yeah, but it's and I think it's related.
57:30 --> 57:33 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think it's just social commentary on the 60s.
57:33 --> 57:34 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it's related to it.
57:35 --> 57:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, no, I think it's like I.
57:36 --> 57:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Like I've been saying, I think that it's a core component of its story, is it's always, you know, whether it's the gay bashing from part two or whether it's a wondering if next season, there's been talk of this Chinese restaurant on next season, be about Chinese immigration and how they retreated.
57:56 --> 58:00 [SPEAKER_05]: But I think that that is a core component of the its story.
58:00 --> 58:07 [SPEAKER_01]: So interesting last episode, and I have no idea if this family is going to appear anymore, but the Uris family, right?
58:07 --> 58:13 [SPEAKER_01]: So that was those were obviously relatively recent Jewish immigrants from Europe, right?
58:13 --> 58:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So sometime after World War II, so probably they'd been there a decade or maybe a little more.
58:18 --> 58:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And there was a very much a
58:23 --> 58:23 [SPEAKER_01]: What are you doing?
58:23 --> 58:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Why are you bringing this up?
58:25 --> 58:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But that could kind of be unrelated to it, right?
58:27 --> 58:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It could have just been self-preservation because of the Holocaust and him feeling like his son didn't understand any of this.
58:34 --> 58:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It's set around the real context.
58:36 --> 58:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So like, we're...
58:38 --> 58:40 [SPEAKER_01]: was that persecuted minority group?
58:41 --> 58:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Also an outsider with regards to Pennywise, or is it sort of irrelevant?
58:45 --> 59:01 [SPEAKER_01]: In the same way that like, Marge, we could say Marge's influences, oh, Pennywise makes you think this in that out group, or she's just a pre-team, and engaging, and I think to a certain extent the kids are immune and some levels to some of this apathy, but,
59:01 --> 59:29 [SPEAKER_01]: like how far does this go in terms of like when does an outsider get kind of brought in to the spell and and a lot I mean we don't know much in the books about the base right so that's a group of people that most of them probably are kind of outsiders right if you think of like the way it is transitory for for military families to come and go like
59:29 --> 59:34 [SPEAKER_01]: The people presumably doing research on that are maybe a lot of them of our new to dairy and maybe don't even live in dairy.
59:34 --> 59:35 [SPEAKER_01]: They maybe live in the base, right?
59:36 --> 59:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So it is kind of a strange like, you know, if this does become the thesis in some ways, how far does it, how far do we take it, right?
59:48 --> 59:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
59:48 --> 59:57 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, obviously, the people of the base are being affected by whatever these artifacts are that they, that they, you know, they were talking about digging them.
59:57 --> 59:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Anyway, sorry, we'll say that for a while.
59:59 --> 59:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, say it, say it.
01:00:00 --> 01:00:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, at least you can you tell us about the arrest.
01:00:03 --> 01:00:19 [SPEAKER_05]: In the aftermath of the capital theater massacre, Hank Grogan draws the suspicion of everyone in town, though he had an alibi and witness said, and witnesses said he wasn't there, town officials pressure police chief chief Clint Bowers to make an arrest.
01:00:19 --> 01:00:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Ronnie pleads with Lily to tell the full story to the police, but Lily fears being returned to Juniper Hill, asylum.
01:00:26 --> 01:00:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Under pressure from chief Bowers, Lily implicates Hank, leading to his arrest and Ronnie's rage.
01:00:32 --> 01:00:33 [SPEAKER_03]: I shouldn't say presents.
01:00:33 --> 01:00:37 [SPEAKER_03]: I've not felt in some time.
01:00:37 --> 01:00:38 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, okay.
01:00:39 --> 01:00:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Can I use a bookspot?
01:00:40 --> 01:00:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, no.
01:00:41 --> 01:00:44 [SPEAKER_05]: I was to say there's a book spoiler about Ronnie, but I guess we shouldn't say.
01:00:46 --> 01:00:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I don't book spoiler about Ronnie.
01:00:48 --> 01:00:49 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, we're in Ronnie.
01:00:50 --> 01:00:51 [SPEAKER_05]: General full name.
01:00:52 --> 01:00:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Veronica.
01:00:53 --> 01:00:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.
01:00:54 --> 01:00:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Veronica.
01:00:55 --> 01:00:57 [SPEAKER_01]: She's not Veronica.
01:00:57 --> 01:00:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay.
01:00:58 --> 01:00:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:00:58 --> 01:01:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not, I mean, we're not, we're cannon to the
01:01:03 --> 01:01:05 [SPEAKER_01]: We're assuming people have seen the films, right?
01:01:05 --> 01:01:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:01:07 --> 01:01:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we can talk about the Bauer's family.
01:01:09 --> 01:01:12 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just happened in the second.
01:01:12 --> 01:01:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
01:01:13 --> 01:01:13 [SPEAKER_03]: It's just referencing.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:15 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Why don't we save that for later?
01:01:17 --> 01:01:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
01:01:18 --> 01:01:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
01:01:18 --> 01:01:19 [SPEAKER_03]: But Bauer's, yeah.
01:01:19 --> 01:01:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Can we call out who that is?
01:01:21 --> 01:01:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:01:21 --> 01:01:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Go ahead.
01:01:22 --> 01:01:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:01:22 --> 01:01:23 [SPEAKER_01]: So.
01:01:24 --> 01:01:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm assuming grandfather of Henry Bowers, who's the bully in the first timeline.
01:01:32 --> 01:01:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, the kid timeline in it, but then grows up to be sort of the familiar almost of Pennywise.
01:01:42 --> 01:01:49 [SPEAKER_01]: who is in June of Brazil and, you know, is bad news essentially always for the loser's club.
01:01:49 --> 01:02:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And presumably this guy's, like, he has a really, he hasn't really abused a father who's maybe this guy's son, who he kills at one point.
01:02:01 --> 01:02:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Henry Bower says a teenager kills him under the influence of it.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we can see like his,
01:02:08 --> 01:02:26 [SPEAKER_01]: his dad or grandpa or whatever, the chief is sort of like an upstanding member of the citizenry who is very much perfect exhibit a of the apathy, you know, cover your ass kind of way they do things in dairy by what happens in this episode, but like
01:02:26 --> 01:02:52 [SPEAKER_01]: it feels like that's a that'll fall really far from the tree in terms of status in the town like Henry the Bauer's family in it are a sort of dead beats as I recall so and like he's got this drunk abusive son and so I guess what I'm curious to see is does that happen in the course of what we're going to see now is there a fall from grace of the chief that leads his family
01:02:52 --> 01:03:20 [SPEAKER_01]: you know white lotus season three style like like kind of to end up like uh oh at the end of this their status is gone or is that just all happening in a decade later when his kid is in his twenties before he has Henry right so um something to watch just related to the connective tissue between this story and the next generation story yeah how does Henry
01:03:20 --> 01:03:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, I mean, basically, yeah, which is a thing in a lot of like the novel, the outsider has figures just like that, too.
01:03:28 --> 01:03:30 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a more recent Stephen King novel.
01:03:31 --> 01:03:35 [SPEAKER_01]: People that become kind of under the spell and sourcehold sort of.
01:03:37 --> 01:03:41 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we basically talked about the arrest, the grogins, all that already.
01:03:42 --> 01:03:48 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that what we needed to talk about was the police chief.
01:03:48 --> 01:03:54 [SPEAKER_03]: There's not much more, but it's interesting to see the town officials come and say, you know, you're going to be out of a job.
01:03:55 --> 01:03:58 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, how many of these are basically blackmail, right?
01:03:58 --> 01:04:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Like low grade, blackmail, you know,
01:04:03 --> 01:04:30 [SPEAKER_03]: town officials are saying you're going to lose your job, then he goes and down the black mail chain to Lily and goes, well you're going to go to Jennifer Hill if you don't cooperate and yeah I mean where does the it start and end right all right I don't not much more to say about this if everybody else is good let's talk about Lily let's talk about Lily but first we're going to take a break
01:04:46 --> 01:04:49 [SPEAKER_03]: We're back to talk about Lily's vision.
01:04:50 --> 01:04:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Lily goes grocery shopping for her mom, but things get weird.
01:04:55 --> 01:04:59 [SPEAKER_03]: She feels she is being followed and taunted by about her mental health.
01:05:00 --> 01:05:05 [SPEAKER_03]: The Isles closing around her until she sees Pennywise cereal boxes and the faces of her dead friends.
01:05:06 --> 01:05:10 [SPEAKER_03]: The pictures begin to decay when a jar of pickles begins talking to her.
01:05:10 --> 01:05:16 [SPEAKER_03]: She recognizes her dad's face and responds to his request for a kiss by smashing the
01:05:17 --> 01:05:22 [SPEAKER_03]: The other jar is shatter and the pieces of Lily's father form a monstrous creature who approaches Ford's kiss.
01:05:23 --> 01:05:29 [SPEAKER_03]: The grocery store owner finds Lily and sends her to her mother, who brings her back to Juniper Hill asylum.
01:05:33 --> 01:05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Cool scene.
01:05:34 --> 01:05:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:05:35 --> 01:05:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Creepy.
01:05:36 --> 01:05:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But cool.
01:05:37 --> 01:05:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Why did one of the kids on the box not decay?
01:05:40 --> 01:05:55 [SPEAKER_05]: one of the kids who was killed in the first episode, and there is a thing also that people noticed in the first episode where maybe it was a continuity error or maybe it's something more that one of the kids, I think it was Teddy Euras.
01:05:55 --> 01:05:57 [SPEAKER_05]: I think it was him.
01:05:57 --> 01:05:58 [SPEAKER_05]: It seemed to be killed twice.
01:06:00 --> 01:06:14 [SPEAKER_05]: So maybe it was just a continuity error, but I also noticed in this scene, as she's walking around, I was paying attention to what's in her grocery cart, and the contents of her grocery cart kept changing suddenly, like something would disappear or reappear.
01:06:14 --> 01:06:17 [SPEAKER_05]: And I don't think all of that was continuity errors.
01:06:17 --> 01:06:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that was intentionally about, you know, the disjointedness and messing with you subconsciously.
01:06:26 --> 01:06:27 [SPEAKER_03]: That would make sense.
01:06:27 --> 01:06:30 [SPEAKER_05]: So I wonder if they're saying something about the one kid not decaying.
01:06:31 --> 01:06:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Hmm.
01:06:34 --> 01:06:38 [SPEAKER_01]: It's totally possible that based on what we see in...
01:06:39 --> 01:06:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I guess it's a chapter one with the kids in the sewers all floating kind of to be eaten later.
01:06:46 --> 01:06:53 [SPEAKER_01]: It's quite possible that a couple of those kids were devoured and killed in that one of those kids was not was brought down into the sewers, right?
01:06:53 --> 01:07:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So he could be one of them could not be dead yet, right?
01:07:00 --> 01:07:01 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
01:07:01 --> 01:07:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Everybody likes it to go box, right?
01:07:02 --> 01:07:03 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and anyway.
01:07:03 --> 01:07:03 [SPEAKER_03]: That's right.
01:07:04 --> 01:07:05 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, he's got to save some for later.
01:07:08 --> 01:07:14 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I don't know, something to watch, but it's interesting like what's a mistake versus what's deliberate.
01:07:15 --> 01:07:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Clearly they're messing with her perception of reality in that scene when she's walking.
01:07:20 --> 01:07:20 [SPEAKER_01]: So.
01:07:20 --> 01:07:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:07:22 --> 01:07:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Can I also bring in, we had a JFK reference this episode.
01:07:25 --> 01:07:33 [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think that that was accidental because the Kennedy's famous for their presidents, but also famous for their luck.
01:07:33 --> 01:07:36 [SPEAKER_03]: And for their lobotomization of one
01:07:37 --> 01:07:40 [SPEAKER_03]: the the siblings of JFK Rosemary.
01:07:40 --> 01:07:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it Rosemary Rosemary Kennedy was lobotomized by her father, you know, and father Joseph was was obviously like a tyrannical patriarch of the Kennedy family, and sent Rosemary to be lobotomized, and that is like an infamous detail about the Kennedy family.
01:07:59 --> 01:08:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Is this the scene in which Kennedy's mentioned?
01:08:01 --> 01:08:03 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it's earlier.
01:08:03 --> 01:08:08 [SPEAKER_03]: It's with, um, hand, I think Lee Roy handling says to his wife, Charlotte, when she's like, are we welcome hearings?
01:08:08 --> 01:08:11 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, oh, they could take it up at JFK if we're not.
01:08:11 --> 01:08:11 [SPEAKER_03]: That's right.
01:08:11 --> 01:08:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, but I, but I do think that that is like a subtle nod.
01:08:16 --> 01:08:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I'm just, you know, connecting dots.
01:08:18 --> 01:08:24 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I'm Charlie Day, you know, I'm trying to pin up everything on the wall.
01:08:24 --> 01:08:46 [SPEAKER_03]: just reminded me you know this I feel like anytime you see in asylum you get a lobotomy reference you in the sixties especially you got to think about the Kennedy's right that's probably the most famous lobotomy that ever happened and it is a new England family right and the truth new England true and right now as we speak Jake
01:08:47 --> 01:08:54 [SPEAKER_01]: has time traveled from the 2000s and is back in 1960s trying to prevent that assassination.
01:08:54 --> 01:09:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So in the Stephen King universe, JFK is very much an important figure because of the novel 12, 12, 11, 22, 63.
01:09:05 --> 01:09:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So and that is canonical to other Stephen King works.
01:09:08 --> 01:09:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, doesn't mean it's going to matter, but
01:09:11 --> 01:09:17 [SPEAKER_01]: if you go to Fort Worth right now, there's a dude camping out in an apartment trying to learn everything he can about Lee Harvey Oswald.
01:09:17 --> 01:09:23 [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, yeah, I think JFK is Stephen King's Roman Empire.
01:09:24 --> 01:09:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, he's thinking about it all the time.
01:09:26 --> 01:09:28 [SPEAKER_01]: He's just obsessed for some reason.
01:09:28 --> 01:09:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very, you know, it is a criticism that some people have that like his
01:09:35 --> 01:09:41 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very pre the last 15 years conception of what it means to be a good upstanding liberal.
01:09:41 --> 01:09:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of these books are a little, wouldn't it just be so much better if JFK didn't die?
01:09:47 --> 01:09:57 [SPEAKER_01]: In the sense of like, some people have criticized his view as a little overly simplistic, but I think that's, I think everybody's a product of their time, right?
01:09:57 --> 01:09:58 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's hard to judge him harshly for that.
01:09:59 --> 01:10:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But, and the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,
01:10:01 --> 01:10:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the thing is the novel 11, 22, 23, 22, 63, which I really liked.
01:10:09 --> 01:10:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It did feel a little late.
01:10:11 --> 01:10:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I think for people for that kind of sentiment, because it got the ideas, I think, like 20 years earlier, and it took him so long to write that novel, which this is not a podcast about.
01:10:23 --> 01:10:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Society had changed enough that the notion that the world's problems would be solved of JFK wasn't assassinated, was a little quaint and a little rose tinted, rose married JFK tinted glasses.
01:10:38 --> 01:10:42 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I haven't read the novel, but the mini series was excellent, so.
01:10:42 --> 01:10:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'm going to go on the record and just say if I could stop one Kennedy assassination, I'd probably stop RFKs before I stop JFKs, but the original RFK, by the way, I just want to be clear.
01:10:56 --> 01:10:57 [SPEAKER_01]: RFK senior.
01:10:57 --> 01:10:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:10:57 --> 01:10:59 [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
01:11:00 --> 01:11:10 [SPEAKER_01]: If you find a time travel, like convenience store, I think it was that you walk in the back room and it brings you back 50 years.
01:11:11 --> 01:11:13 [SPEAKER_01]: You can do a different 60 years.
01:11:13 --> 01:11:16 [SPEAKER_01]: You can have a different mission than Jake from that novel.
01:11:17 --> 01:11:18 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, all right, that's fair.
01:11:18 --> 01:11:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Let's fair.
01:11:19 --> 01:11:21 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't have to live by Jake's rules.
01:11:23 --> 01:11:49 [SPEAKER_03]: yeah i mean it's it's this whole thing is terrifying and obviously lily is really traumatized by this and loss in the fear of loss of of your parents i think uh is definitely a theme here right is it's definitely a theme of this season uh between Ronnie and lily and it's interesting how they both have that in common right this this fear that they killed their parent
01:11:51 --> 01:11:56 [SPEAKER_03]: But they feel so far apart right there because of the conflicting interest, right?
01:11:56 --> 01:11:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
01:11:56 --> 01:11:59 [SPEAKER_01]: So her dad went in to help.
01:12:00 --> 01:12:02 [SPEAKER_01]: No, went in because she had forgotten.
01:12:02 --> 01:12:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Like something like that.
01:12:03 --> 01:12:04 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what it was, yeah.
01:12:04 --> 01:12:05 [SPEAKER_01]: She had forgotten something.
01:12:05 --> 01:12:07 [SPEAKER_01]: But then he went to help stop the machine, right?
01:12:07 --> 01:12:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And he was torn apart or something.
01:12:09 --> 01:12:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
01:12:09 --> 01:12:11 [SPEAKER_05]: So again, not her fault, obviously.
01:12:11 --> 01:12:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:12:11 --> 01:12:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:12:12 --> 01:12:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
01:12:12 --> 01:12:26 [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, and that's why it's so heartbreaking and frustrating to see what are obviously two natural allies who like each other as people and would quickly be friends, but they're being pitted against each other.
01:12:26 --> 01:12:30 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's so real and so frustrating.
01:12:31 --> 01:12:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
01:12:32 --> 01:12:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really hard to
01:12:36 --> 01:12:53 [SPEAKER_01]: like the on board with what Lily did when she threw her dad under the bus, but it's also really hard to belaymer in that context with the asylum, I mean that and asylum in the sixties is just a prison under a different name and a prison with fewer rights in some cases.
01:12:54 --> 01:12:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, no due process and on that note, like I was
01:12:57 --> 01:13:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Speaking of the lack of due process, if they were going to arrest, is it Hank?
01:13:04 --> 01:13:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Hank Rogan, they were going to arrest him based on
01:13:07 --> 01:13:12 [SPEAKER_01]: The testimony of an 11-year-old girl saying, I can't prove he wasn't there.
01:13:13 --> 01:13:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's so thin.
01:13:14 --> 01:13:16 [SPEAKER_01]: My question is, why didn't they just arrest him with nothing?
01:13:16 --> 01:13:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, why were they waiting for her?
01:13:18 --> 01:13:19 [SPEAKER_01]: She didn't finger him.
01:13:19 --> 01:13:21 [SPEAKER_01]: She didn't point and say he did it.
01:13:21 --> 01:13:23 [SPEAKER_01]: That testimony might as well be no testimony.
01:13:23 --> 01:13:24 [SPEAKER_01]: They should have just arrested him anyways.
01:13:25 --> 01:13:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, what?
01:13:25 --> 01:13:30 [SPEAKER_05]: But if you want to believe something, you only need the barist quote-unquote proof.
01:13:30 --> 01:13:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Even when it's been very clearly planted, it's just...
01:13:34 --> 01:13:35 [SPEAKER_01]: But it is weird, he didn't need that.
01:13:35 --> 01:13:37 [SPEAKER_01]: his brain didn't need that.
01:13:37 --> 01:13:42 [SPEAKER_05]: He taught me not his brain, but the legal process requires at least some witness testimony.
01:13:43 --> 01:13:50 [SPEAKER_05]: But I mean, and now she's obviously probably going to try to retract everything and then going to be like, well, but you're going to learn Juniper Hill.
01:13:50 --> 01:13:52 [SPEAKER_05]: So we can't trust you.
01:13:52 --> 01:13:54 [SPEAKER_03]: But how can you rely on the first one?
01:13:54 --> 01:13:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly, exactly.
01:13:55 --> 01:13:58 [SPEAKER_05]: It's they are just choosing what they want to be true.
01:13:59 --> 01:14:02 [SPEAKER_05]: And I don't think that any of the cops even believe that that is true.
01:14:02 --> 01:14:09 [SPEAKER_05]: It's just makes it easier to wrap up the case if they just blame it on the black projector, a projectionist.
01:14:10 --> 01:14:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:14:11 --> 01:14:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I love though that like what's contained within that logic.
01:14:17 --> 01:14:21 [SPEAKER_01]: is that there's a triple murderer still at large in your town.
01:14:22 --> 01:14:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
01:14:22 --> 01:14:30 [SPEAKER_01]: And the idea that it's easier to just blame it on somebody else, and I'll just hope that this doesn't happen again.
01:14:30 --> 01:14:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Apple is a hell of a drug.
01:14:32 --> 01:14:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Crazy.
01:14:33 --> 01:14:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:14:35 --> 01:14:37 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, let's get into the military base.
01:14:37 --> 01:14:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Mark, you want to close out this episode on the military base.
01:14:40 --> 01:14:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Leroy's told that masters was one of the culprits of his attack.
01:14:44 --> 01:14:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Leroy tests this theory by seeing if masters could successfully load the complicated Russian pistol as quickly as the assailant.
01:14:52 --> 01:14:55 [SPEAKER_01]: When Master's fails, Liroi calmly confronts General Shaw.
01:14:56 --> 01:15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: The general confesses to it being a test of Liroi's damaged amygdala and his supposed lack of fear.
01:15:02 --> 01:15:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Having passed this test, Hanlan is allowed to see what Dick Haloran has been searching for.
01:15:07 --> 01:15:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Haloran, in between his special privileges, has been searching for Beacon's, leading to the fear-based weapon buried in Dairy, as an effort to win the Cold War before Cuba becomes a Soviet missile base.
01:15:19 --> 01:15:23 [SPEAKER_01]: At the end of the episode, the soldiers find a vehicle filled with corpses.
01:15:23 --> 01:15:25 [SPEAKER_01]: The first beacon to it.
01:15:26 --> 01:15:31 [SPEAKER_03]: Can I ask you both, do we trust general budget Harrison Ford?
01:15:31 --> 01:15:31 [SPEAKER_05]: No.
01:15:33 --> 01:15:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Hard no.
01:15:34 --> 01:15:36 [SPEAKER_05]: And I think he gave us a good reason why not to.
01:15:36 --> 01:15:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Where he, he admits like, oh, we were just testing your fear.
01:15:40 --> 01:15:44 [SPEAKER_05]: But first of all, why didn't he just upfront say this?
01:15:44 --> 01:15:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Why did he make himself get caught in the line to do that?
01:15:47 --> 01:15:54 [SPEAKER_05]: And second of all, yeah, why, what reason do we have to think he's not continuing to lie about various things?
01:15:56 --> 01:16:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think he got caught and he's like, okay, here's my secondary life.
01:16:03 --> 01:16:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we know when this takes place exactly in terms of month of 1962?
01:16:09 --> 01:16:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh boy, no, I... Did it take any signals?
01:16:14 --> 01:16:19 [SPEAKER_01]: The Cuban missile crisis happens in October.
01:16:20 --> 01:16:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, Lord, my birthday, 1962, lovely, and so it feels like that hasn't happened yet, right?
01:16:28 --> 01:16:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Because they're talking, oh, and the nukes might come to, they're talking about this.
01:16:33 --> 01:16:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So speaking of Kennedy, that's the other kind of context of all of this, right?
01:16:38 --> 01:16:46 [SPEAKER_01]: That that presumably in this timeline is about to happen, and maybe is related to what's going on here, which is interesting.
01:16:47 --> 01:16:48 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's right.
01:16:48 --> 01:16:52 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that this is not happening yet.
01:16:52 --> 01:16:57 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to see it might be in the show and we just missed it and it's not in like an easy summary online.
01:16:58 --> 01:17:04 [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, we know four months passed and it started in it started in a cold time, right, because wasn't it really cold out.
01:17:05 --> 01:17:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Probably started in the early in the year and then we're we're like, we were where either is late school year or early school year of the next.
01:17:13 --> 01:17:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
01:17:14 --> 01:17:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:17:15 --> 01:17:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So, June or September or something.
01:17:18 --> 01:17:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there hasn't had any.
01:17:19 --> 01:17:21 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's not summer vacation, yeah.
01:17:21 --> 01:17:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:17:21 --> 01:17:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:17:24 --> 01:17:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So, do we want to hear about the amygdala yet?
01:17:30 --> 01:17:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we're ready.
01:17:31 --> 01:17:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:17:31 --> 01:17:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you can.
01:17:32 --> 01:17:33 [SPEAKER_01]: You make doletalk.
01:17:33 --> 01:17:36 [SPEAKER_01]: So Nicole from the Nevermind the music podcast.
01:17:38 --> 01:17:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Never mind the music.gov.
01:17:40 --> 01:17:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Those won't know, please don't look there.
01:17:42 --> 01:17:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
01:17:42 --> 01:17:44 [SPEAKER_01]: That might be a website, I don't know.
01:17:46 --> 01:17:50 [SPEAKER_01]: She says, to my question, is it possible you wouldn't feel fear?
01:17:50 --> 01:17:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Short answer no, but it would have to be removed.
01:17:55 --> 01:17:57 [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know exactly what she meant.
01:17:57 --> 01:17:59 [SPEAKER_01]: So I asked for more clarification, and I got it.
01:18:00 --> 01:18:07 [SPEAKER_01]: She says, in theory, anything that's possible, there has been some really cool research about serial killers and the size of their enigdola.
01:18:07 --> 01:18:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to get you an easy link in a second.
01:18:10 --> 01:18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have a link, but I have more text.
01:18:12 --> 01:18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So here we go.
01:18:13 --> 01:18:21 [SPEAKER_01]: She says, the amygdala, a part of the brain responsible for processing the motions like fear and empathy, shows differences in serial killers compared to the general population.
01:18:22 --> 01:18:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Studies show that serial killers often have a smaller or less active amygdala and reduced connectivity between the amygdala and the prefrontal cortex.
01:18:31 --> 01:18:37 [SPEAKER_01]: leading to a diminished capacity for feelings like guilt and fear and an increased propensity for aggression.
01:18:37 --> 01:18:45 [SPEAKER_01]: However, these brain differences are not the sole cause and are influenced by a combination of genetics and environmental factors like childhood trauma.
01:18:45 --> 01:18:55 [SPEAKER_01]: If you damaged or removed your amygdala, you would feel less fear emotionally, but your body would probably still have a nervous system or physiological reaction to danger.
01:18:55 --> 01:19:23 [SPEAKER_01]: essentially a removed or damaged amygdala would result in you not giving a shit about much including fear or danger okay so like you still feel it but you wouldn't act on it maybe but i think it still comes down to yeah what is fear right like if fear is a solier brain
01:19:24 --> 01:19:25 [SPEAKER_01]: there might be more to it.
01:19:26 --> 01:19:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:19:28 --> 01:19:29 [SPEAKER_01]: So interesting.
01:19:30 --> 01:19:34 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I know from the inside out movies that fear and anxiety are two different emotions.
01:19:35 --> 01:19:40 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think I think this all tracks, you know, all tracks with my Disney lore.
01:19:41 --> 01:19:43 [SPEAKER_03]: So Dick Howard.
01:19:44 --> 01:19:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm pretty science professor.
01:19:50 --> 01:19:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:19:55 --> 01:20:06 [SPEAKER_01]: This, you know, truck, which is or this car, right, this car's cab, which is full with dead bodies, which maybe we're going to see what that is.
01:20:07 --> 01:20:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Interesting like in the second it movie.
01:20:10 --> 01:20:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, I forget what they called them in this, but he said they said in this episode, basically, that they They were in order to pinpoint what they're actually looking for.
01:20:20 --> 01:20:25 [SPEAKER_05]: There are these, and did they use the word totems or am I just substitute that in?
01:20:25 --> 01:20:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Beacons.
01:20:26 --> 01:20:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Beacons.
01:20:26 --> 01:20:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
01:20:27 --> 01:20:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, well, that's also an interesting word obviously in Stephen Kinglor.
01:20:32 --> 01:20:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I so
01:20:35 --> 01:20:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that truck full of bodies?
01:20:37 --> 01:20:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Are we going to see what that is 30 years before in the next season?
01:20:41 --> 01:20:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Are we going to learn about that?
01:20:44 --> 01:20:44 [SPEAKER_05]: So I think.
01:20:45 --> 01:20:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Is that what they said?
01:20:47 --> 01:20:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Wasn't just looking at the car and isn't it based on the story about these mobsters from the 20s?
01:20:58 --> 01:20:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I think.
01:21:00 --> 01:21:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we know the dates of any of that in?
01:21:02 --> 01:21:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm just can't know.
01:21:03 --> 01:21:05 [SPEAKER_05]: Just saying from looking at the car.
01:21:07 --> 01:21:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
01:21:08 --> 01:21:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
01:21:08 --> 01:21:09 [SPEAKER_01]: But it could be a 20.
01:21:09 --> 01:21:11 [SPEAKER_02]: You can tell the ear of the car looking at a, the good job.
01:21:11 --> 01:21:15 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, you know, you're about to be a witness for, for Vinnie Gambi.
01:21:15 --> 01:21:20 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, not even good at cars, but I just looked distinctively different in it.
01:21:20 --> 01:21:25 [SPEAKER_03]: But the 1964 view, it didn't exist in a mint green, and it's never going to make me.
01:21:25 --> 01:21:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, but like it could be a car from the 20s being driven in the 30s right.
01:21:30 --> 01:21:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, you're right.
01:21:32 --> 01:21:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:21:32 --> 01:21:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So there is stuff you even see in the opening scene.
01:21:37 --> 01:21:41 [SPEAKER_01]: There is what looks like a mob shoot out happening in Pennywise when I say that.
01:21:41 --> 01:21:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean the the main title sequence.
01:21:43 --> 01:21:48 [SPEAKER_01]: So this could be related to that whether we see that in in a later season or not.
01:21:50 --> 01:21:51 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just.
01:21:52 --> 01:22:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that the shining in the shining, that ability or in Dr. Sleep is like, we've heard it being used as like a detective tool for psychically imprinted object.
01:22:06 --> 01:22:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It's an interesting thing.
01:22:07 --> 01:22:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Like is he looking for and feeling objects like this or is he detecting it?
01:22:12 --> 01:22:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Is he detecting the dead lights?
01:22:14 --> 01:22:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's self, the energy behind the malevolence there, right?
01:22:18 --> 01:22:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, this part.
01:22:22 --> 01:22:25 [SPEAKER_01]: could go in a direction that I feel like is a little lame.
01:22:25 --> 01:22:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we're looking for a weapon that is fear itself.
01:22:29 --> 01:22:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Like that's a little too off universe to me.
01:22:32 --> 01:22:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I don't know that I want that to be completely ultimately where this goes.
01:22:38 --> 01:22:46 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a whole thing of people getting that there was like a sound wave supposedly that was making people sick a couple years ago.
01:22:46 --> 01:22:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.
01:22:47 --> 01:22:47 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
01:22:47 --> 01:22:49 [SPEAKER_05]: It was growing up for a long time around.
01:22:49 --> 01:22:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, I'm kind of like I anything's possible at this point No, it's more just the vibe being the vibe of the it story, right?
01:22:57 --> 01:23:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's not it's not it's not What's the what's the corporation?
01:23:03 --> 01:23:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Well in Utahny for Alien we're going we're looking for a weapon to that's a little more Hawkins lab stranger things like capitalism can be a villain wherever it's present.
01:23:13 --> 01:23:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes
01:23:15 --> 01:23:20 [SPEAKER_03]: The American military industrial problem, what does he say is mark to a prove it's building?
01:23:21 --> 01:23:23 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, but like what is the theme of this, right?
01:23:23 --> 01:23:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And theme of this is different if it's inside our outside or stuff, welcome to Dairy that we've been talking about, or if the true villain is the military industrial.
01:23:33 --> 01:23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: That's just a different story, right?
01:23:35 --> 01:23:43 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's what you're saying is worrying me a little bit because some of the more negative reviews said this feels like two shows, mush into one.
01:23:43 --> 01:23:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Hmm.
01:23:45 --> 01:23:48 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't, I mean, I don't mind that having different plotlines.
01:23:48 --> 01:23:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Obviously, they cross over with, you know, the handland ad and everything.
01:23:51 --> 01:23:57 [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, I'm very excited to have the declarant of it all and explore.
01:23:57 --> 01:24:11 [SPEAKER_05]: And we also, one thing we didn't mention is that we got a sighting of, in the movie, they talk about Mike went to the local tribe, a Native American tribe, and they had,
01:24:11 --> 01:24:16 [SPEAKER_05]: ways of containing Pennywise, and so they taught them this ritual of the original, I think it's gone.
01:24:17 --> 01:24:26 [SPEAKER_05]: And so we saw a group of young guys who seemed to be from the tribe who were watching the excavations that were going on.
01:24:26 --> 01:24:28 [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm excited about that story.
01:24:28 --> 01:24:35 [SPEAKER_05]: And particularly the guy up front, he was in another Stephen King adaptation this year, one of my favorite films of the year, the Long Walk.
01:24:35 --> 01:24:37 [SPEAKER_05]: He had a very memorable role in that.
01:24:37 --> 01:24:38 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, it's his name.
01:24:38 --> 01:24:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, Jacob, or Joseph, something starts with an O, sorry.
01:24:42 --> 01:24:44 [SPEAKER_05]: We did not write down on the cast member names.
01:24:45 --> 01:24:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Still haven't seen that.
01:24:46 --> 01:24:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I really want to, though.
01:24:47 --> 01:24:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I had not read that, though.
01:24:48 --> 01:24:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Joshua Ajay.
01:24:50 --> 01:24:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, what's satian?
01:24:52 --> 01:24:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Joshua Ajay is the name of the actor.
01:24:55 --> 01:25:20 [SPEAKER_01]: and hopefully they come back right we get more of that there's that they don't want to show that one frame for or that one shot for no reason just so you know there's other long as long walk a Bachman book or a king book Bachman being the alter ego right good like it might be that era good question well it doesn't matter but I know I can look it up as easily zoo but i was just curious um if you'd read it um yeah it's it i just saw them what's
01:25:21 --> 01:25:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, what's interesting here about this two shows in one is, based on what I know of the back stories of dairy, I already think I know where the soldier black soldiers in particular thing is going, and that thing is not stranger things Hawkins lab, military industrial complex.
01:25:41 --> 01:25:48 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's like they really are, if this is a thing that this could all just be a nothing burger, but if it is leads to something,
01:25:48 --> 01:26:16 [SPEAKER_01]: It's very much going to be a both-hand, I think, that it's hard for me to imagine them not doing the thing that I think they're doing with the soldiers, but they would then do that plus this Cuban missile crisis, we're going to harness the power of fear itself, weird kind of
01:26:16 --> 01:26:20 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm looking forward to seeing where this is going, should we get into listener feedback?
01:26:21 --> 01:26:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
01:26:21 --> 01:26:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Do it.
01:26:23 --> 01:26:23 [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
01:26:23 --> 01:26:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Eric M writes in and says, hello.
01:26:25 --> 01:26:33 [SPEAKER_03]: I was listening to your coverage of Welcome to Dairy and wanted to point out that the Turtle mascot at the school was not the school mascot as discussed on the podcast.
01:26:34 --> 01:26:40 [SPEAKER_03]: But Bert the Turtle was the mascot of the U.S. civil defense administration beginning in the 1950s.
01:26:40 --> 01:26:46 [SPEAKER_03]: This was the teach kids to duck and cover in case of an attack by the Soviets during the Cold War.
01:26:47 --> 01:26:58 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, the show is so far taking place in the winter and spring of 1962, the Cuban missile crisis, which is considered the height of the Cold War takes place in October 1962.
01:26:59 --> 01:27:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Curious of the wider paranoia of the Cold War will impact the characters.
01:27:03 --> 01:27:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, we know Eric wrote this before episode two, so I think, you know, yes, definitely.
01:27:09 --> 01:27:28 [SPEAKER_01]: uh... air continues also could the u.s. air base behind a tami knocker in its secret hangar oh boy mm-hmm was a tami knocker uh... uh... not very good book and tv film tami knocker i i i don't know i i i read it as a kid but tami knockers is a
01:27:29 --> 01:27:39 [SPEAKER_01]: a Stephen King novel, and basically there's a UFO that crashes in near a small town, and I don't think it's dairy.
01:27:40 --> 01:27:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And somebody starts kind of obsessively digging it up like they feel pulled to it.
01:27:45 --> 01:27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And
01:27:46 --> 01:27:47 [SPEAKER_01]: It's aliens, I think.
01:27:47 --> 01:27:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't remember what it really is.
01:27:48 --> 01:27:49 [SPEAKER_01]: It's been a long time.
01:27:50 --> 01:27:52 [SPEAKER_01]: This is definitely a cocaine-addled novel.
01:27:53 --> 01:27:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Satellite, I think.
01:27:55 --> 01:27:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Stephen King said so also about it.
01:27:57 --> 01:27:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't.
01:27:59 --> 01:28:05 [SPEAKER_01]: That's one that I really have no idea how it fits in with the larger canon.
01:28:05 --> 01:28:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It feels different kind of from a lot of the cosmology.
01:28:11 --> 01:28:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It's possible.
01:28:12 --> 01:28:12 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what it is.
01:28:13 --> 01:28:14 [SPEAKER_01]: That would be a weird one.
01:28:14 --> 01:28:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like that book is not one of his most beloved ones to say the least.
01:28:19 --> 01:28:26 [SPEAKER_01]: So it feels like a little bit of a weird choice to say we're going to intersect with the Tommy knockers.
01:28:26 --> 01:28:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But all right.
01:28:27 --> 01:28:28 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to shut it down.
01:28:28 --> 01:28:29 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to shut it down.
01:28:29 --> 01:28:31 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, we'll revisit if we have more evidence.
01:28:33 --> 01:28:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Eric finishes Pennywise made a brief
01:28:40 --> 01:28:42 [SPEAKER_03]: it and is set between the two timelines.
01:28:43 --> 01:28:50 [SPEAKER_03]: So I think I sorry, it was written a little weirdly, but Eric, I think is saying that Pennywise makes a brief cameo in that book about the Alien.
01:28:52 --> 01:29:02 [SPEAKER_05]: So I mean, I could see them being related cosmologically and it does seem like this is going to go into the backstory of Pennywise in this show.
01:29:03 --> 01:29:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
01:29:04 --> 01:29:07 [SPEAKER_03]: And Bert, of course, shares the turtle film, which is fun.
01:29:09 --> 01:29:10 [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
01:29:10 --> 01:29:10 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, thanks.
01:29:10 --> 01:29:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Thanks, Eric.
01:29:12 --> 01:29:13 [SPEAKER_03]: And I appreciate you writing in.
01:29:13 --> 01:29:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Please keep writing in.
01:29:15 --> 01:29:18 [SPEAKER_03]: We are going to have plenty of discussions coming up.
01:29:18 --> 01:29:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Alicia, do you have open Brian's email?
01:29:20 --> 01:29:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, I do.
01:29:21 --> 01:29:23 [SPEAKER_05]: He says, hello, everyone.
01:29:23 --> 01:29:25 [SPEAKER_05]: You're US historian and residents here.
01:29:26 --> 01:29:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Great start.
01:29:26 --> 01:29:28 [SPEAKER_05]: And this is from Usul, by the way.
01:29:28 --> 01:29:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Brian, it is 63.
01:29:30 --> 01:29:30 [SPEAKER_05]: You're
01:29:30 --> 01:29:32 [SPEAKER_05]: For a great start to the podcast, it's been so helpful.
01:29:32 --> 01:29:37 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm a fan of King's Early Works, Carrie Salem's Lot, The Night Shift, and The Shining.
01:29:37 --> 01:29:45 [SPEAKER_05]: The material in the 1980s onward is hit or miss for me, but I enjoyed Coojo, The Stand, The Green Mile, Pet Cemetery, and Gerald's Game.
01:29:46 --> 01:29:49 [SPEAKER_05]: I tried the Dark Tower books, and I read the first three.
01:29:49 --> 01:29:56 [SPEAKER_05]: I still have not given up though, I will try again, and I'll say to just interrupting Alicia here.
01:29:56 --> 01:30:12 [SPEAKER_05]: the fourth book is most people's favorite, I think, and it's when it really starts to, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, it is like particularly a book in one setting, but it's really, I think as a series goes on, it stitches together.
01:30:12 --> 01:30:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Like the first books all feel so different from each other, I think.
01:30:17 --> 01:30:23 [SPEAKER_05]: And the first, the fourth book is where it really starts to become what it is.
01:30:23 --> 01:30:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I'll take care.
01:30:25 --> 01:30:29 [SPEAKER_01]: The first glimmer of Roland as a kind of compelling character.
01:30:29 --> 01:30:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Also, because it's a backstory, right?
01:30:32 --> 01:30:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
01:30:33 --> 01:30:37 [SPEAKER_01]: That first one by the way, folks, the first book is pretty, is kind of hard to get through.
01:30:37 --> 01:30:40 [SPEAKER_03]: It's short, but that's good to know, because I got through that.
01:30:40 --> 01:30:42 [SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, I don't think I want to get out of it.
01:30:42 --> 01:30:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's short, but it's short at least.
01:30:44 --> 01:30:47 [SPEAKER_01]: It's definitely the weakest of the, okay.
01:30:47 --> 01:30:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And it doesn't have much to do with a lot of the rest of it.
01:30:51 --> 01:30:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, all right.
01:30:53 --> 01:31:02 [SPEAKER_05]: I think that was before he really had the story fleshed out and I said, he's like, yeah, I just had this character and, you know, well, yeah, so much so that the version that I read, I've never read the original version.
01:31:02 --> 01:31:11 [SPEAKER_01]: There was a reprint he did after releasing a few of the other books that fixes some of the, because there, there became continuity mistakes.
01:31:11 --> 01:31:33 [SPEAKER_01]: his original vision, his original work did not work with the vision he settled on and so he edited it which he's done in other books to he added some things but also just fixed some things that were contradictory I think about you know once he decided that the villain in that book was also the villain in some other books that I won't spoil he changed some things in the gunslinger so
01:31:34 --> 01:31:35 [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
01:31:36 --> 01:31:40 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so anyway, so Brian says I just started it, but I have never read it before.
01:31:41 --> 01:31:43 [SPEAKER_05]: I saw the two movies and the older mini series.
01:31:43 --> 01:31:45 [SPEAKER_05]: So Brian, you and I are in the same boat.
01:31:45 --> 01:31:47 [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm now on like an entrepreneur five, I think.
01:31:48 --> 01:31:51 [SPEAKER_05]: In the show, I like the Cold War stuff from the Air Force Base.
01:31:51 --> 01:32:00 [SPEAKER_05]: So I want to give everyone a quick overview of the key events about the Cold War in 1961 and 1962, the time of the series.
01:32:00 --> 01:32:09 [SPEAKER_05]: This is a heightening period of relations between the U.S. and the Soviets, leader of South Communism as a mortal threat and a real possibility of nuclear war.
01:32:09 --> 01:32:12 [SPEAKER_05]: April 1961, the Bay of Pigs, the invasion of Cuba.
01:32:13 --> 01:32:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Jerry's successful?
01:32:15 --> 01:32:15 [UNKNOWN]: No.
01:32:15 --> 01:32:23 [SPEAKER_05]: June 1961, JFK meets Nikita Kuchev in Vienna, which is seen as a disaster for the new president.
01:32:23 --> 01:32:27 [SPEAKER_05]: August 1961, East Germany starts to build the Berlin Wall.
01:32:28 --> 01:32:34 [SPEAKER_05]: January 1962, the Geneva convention on nuclear disarmament fails to reach any agreement.
01:32:34 --> 01:32:38 [SPEAKER_05]: February 1962, the US ends trade with Cuba.
01:32:39 --> 01:32:40 [SPEAKER_05]: So, yeah, this would be right after that.
01:32:41 --> 01:32:56 [SPEAKER_05]: And then, yeah, Brian says, we're only months away from the New York Times bestselling books, seven days in May by Fletcher, Kneville, and Charles Bailey the second about a political coup in the US, which is triggered by the President signing a nuclear disarmament treaty with the Soviets.
01:32:56 --> 01:32:58 [SPEAKER_05]: the movie came out in 1964.
01:32:59 --> 01:33:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And of course, we have October 1962 with the Cuban missile crisis.
01:33:04 --> 01:33:05 [SPEAKER_05]: So tensions were high.
01:33:05 --> 01:33:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Thanks, everyone, Brian age 63.
01:33:07 --> 01:33:10 [SPEAKER_03]: That's really good context.
01:33:10 --> 01:33:12 [SPEAKER_03]: So thank you, Brian, for sharing all that.
01:33:12 --> 01:33:14 [SPEAKER_03]: I know Eric also wrote in about some Cold War details.
01:33:15 --> 01:33:18 [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, that's definitely part of this backdrop.
01:33:18 --> 01:33:24 [SPEAKER_05]: You can't ignore it.
01:33:25 --> 01:33:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Stills, I guess, the art stills in the main title sequence.
01:33:30 --> 01:33:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, we see people duck and covering wild and actual.
01:33:35 --> 01:33:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Mushroom Cloud is above them, so they're like,
01:33:39 --> 01:33:53 [SPEAKER_01]: you know, what does that mean is that that's the vibe and you know, height highlighting the sort of ludicrous aspect of the duck and cover propaganda kind of videos and stuff of like, is that really going to help you from a mushroom cloud from a nuke?
01:33:53 --> 01:33:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, right.
01:33:55 --> 01:33:58 [SPEAKER_01]: But that's not something that obviously literally happens or will happen in dairy.
01:33:58 --> 01:34:03 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't think this series is going to take that that turn where there'll be a nuclear explosion.
01:34:04 --> 01:34:05 [SPEAKER_01]: But interesting.
01:34:06 --> 01:34:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, this has been an exciting episode, everyone.
01:34:09 --> 01:34:11 [SPEAKER_03]: I think I'm going to end up doing the outro by myself.
01:34:11 --> 01:34:16 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm going to send off our other two lovely co-hosts.
01:34:16 --> 01:34:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Any final thoughts on the show for this episode?
01:34:19 --> 01:34:20 [SPEAKER_05]: I can't wait to see where it goes.
01:34:21 --> 01:34:27 [SPEAKER_05]: I hope that there are warm spots amidst all the misery, but the writing in my book is impeccable.
01:34:29 --> 01:34:53 [SPEAKER_03]: yeah it's been great looking forward to it yeah really really i think huge improvement over episode one so i'm i'm looking forward to next episode alright everybody we will see you after episode three alright bye i just want to do a quick outro today because i'm traveling and i'm dealing with some family stuff but i want to remind everyone to check out our affiliates never mind the music doing weekly coverage of music and psychology
01:34:54 --> 01:34:59 [SPEAKER_03]: I want to direct people towards probably Howard for their bacon rap season if you want to want some silly movies with them.
01:35:00 --> 01:35:06 [SPEAKER_03]: And radioactive ramblings is about to do fallout and just wrapped up Gen V, the boy's been off.
01:35:07 --> 01:35:19 [SPEAKER_03]: You can also check out Alicia's other feeds, wool shift dust and the Star Wars kind of timeline podcast, Alicia's doing some spooky season stuff with Frankenstein on the wool shift dust feed and I'm sure she'll have some Star Wars content up soon.
01:35:20 --> 01:35:29 [SPEAKER_03]: On the main feed, we have a David doing coverage of Pluribus, the new Vince Gilligan series alongside Nevermind the Music Snackole.
01:35:29 --> 01:35:33 [SPEAKER_03]: So definitely stay on the main feed or go to the main feed if you're on the horror feed right now.
01:35:34 --> 01:35:35 [SPEAKER_03]: And you can check that out.
01:35:35 --> 01:35:38 [SPEAKER_03]: You can find everything in the link tree in the show notes.
01:35:39 --> 01:35:41 [SPEAKER_03]: And we will see you next week for more.
01:35:41 --> 01:35:45 [SPEAKER_03]: Welcome to Dairy and I think we'll have a telemask episode out too.
01:35:45 --> 01:36:02 [SPEAKER_03]: For now, let me just thank our Discord server boosters, Aaron K. Tillow the Thriller, Duke 71, Athena A. Lestu, Nancy M. Ghost of Partition, radioactive Richard and Adrienne, and our lore masters, Samarshan, Michael G. Michelle E. S. C. Peter O'H.
01:36:03 --> 01:36:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Nancy M. Duke 71, Brian 863, Frederick H. Sarah L. Garth C.
01:36:09 --> 01:36:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Andre B. Quang Yu, Nathan T. Sub-Zero, Aaron K. Delevi, Mothership 61, Niles, Kathy W. Lestu, Jeffrey B. Alicia Yu, Ben B. Scott F. Steven N. Julia F. Collias, Elmariel, Paul K. Rackizim, Jessica H. Redzipi,
01:36:35 --> 01:36:37 [SPEAKER_03]: And sorry, don't believe that we missed you for a month.
01:36:37 --> 01:36:41 [SPEAKER_03]: We appreciate the reminder of anybody else notices that they're missing.
01:36:41 --> 01:36:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Definitely send us an email.
01:36:43 --> 01:36:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Catch it.
01:36:44 --> 01:37:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And Andrea, thanks everyone, and we will see you very soon with more it.