Steve and Anthony cruise with Nighthawks.
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00:19 --> 00:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Properly Hower, a podcast that reviews classic films and other post-fiction.
00:25 --> 00:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Today we take a look at the 1981 Gritty Crime Drama Nighthawks.
00:31 --> 00:38 [SPEAKER_01]: starring Sylvester Stallone as Dek to Silva, who is assigned to stop a German terrorist played by Rudger Hauer named Wolfgar.
00:38 --> 00:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Wolfgar is hell bent on sewn chaos, and to Silva wants to save New York and a maxi skirt.
00:44 --> 00:49 [SPEAKER_01]: with me to discuss this film as always is Dr. Anthony Ladda.
00:50 --> 00:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Steve, I'm going to begin by playing you the trailer for Nighthawks.
00:56 --> 00:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Ooh, exciting.
00:57 --> 00:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Is this trip business a pleasure?
01:00 --> 01:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Pleasure.
01:01 --> 01:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Hi, how are you?
01:03 --> 01:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to United States.
01:05 --> 01:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, my ride hard.
01:06 --> 01:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes called Wolf's car.
01:09 --> 01:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Born Frankfurt, Germany, 1946.
01:12 --> 01:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Educated Paris and Patrice Lamonby University, Moscow, currently self-employed, occupation, international terrorist.
01:29 --> 01:33 [SPEAKER_00]: You are to be indoctrinated in counter terrorist techniques.
01:33 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Dig the silver, age 35, born and raised New York City.
01:42 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Honorable Miss George, U.S. Army, 1972, 52 registered kills, occupation, cop.
02:05 --> 02:11 [SPEAKER_00]: One man can bring the world to its knees,
02:22 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Universal Pictures presents Sylvester Stallone in the night hox.
02:28 --> 02:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Coming in.
02:29 --> 02:29 [SPEAKER_03]: Is Wolf.
02:30 --> 02:43 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you think Wolfgar is a smarter terrorist, or do you think that, I think, D.C. is a smarter counter-terrorist?
02:43 --> 02:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's a newly formed anti-terrorist group, right?
02:47 --> 02:49 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, they cannot do the basics.
02:50 --> 02:58 [SPEAKER_01]: What I never really understood for sure was were they being like punished by being sent to the anti-terrorist squad.
02:58 --> 02:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, all right.
02:59 --> 03:06 [SPEAKER_03]: So according to the, according to this trailer, one man can bring the world to its knees.
03:07 --> 03:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh yeah.
03:08 --> 03:10 [SPEAKER_03]: And one man can stop him, all right?
03:10 --> 03:13 [SPEAKER_03]: What is it that Professor Solona's brain of the table?
03:14 --> 03:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Why can he, his ability to go full-tutzy?
03:20 --> 03:33 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's very artsy, you know, not only he has a very specific preferred way to toward crime.
03:34 --> 03:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he wigs in pantyhoes.
03:38 --> 03:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
03:38 --> 03:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Wonderful.
03:39 --> 03:45 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, just just, he could have been a police sketch artist and a former life.
03:46 --> 04:00 [SPEAKER_01]: If he hadn't been dishonorably discharged from the military for 52 confirmed kills, I love that Stallone looks like Serpico, but behaves like cruising.
04:05 --> 04:06 [SPEAKER_01]: First off, this movie is a treat.
04:08 --> 04:09 [SPEAKER_03]: I had no idea.
04:10 --> 04:15 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I was expecting a movie that would be unintentionally funny.
04:15 --> 04:16 [SPEAKER_03]: It was unintentionally funny.
04:17 --> 04:23 [SPEAKER_01]: The entire time, even the music makes you think like it's a different movie.
04:23 --> 04:31 [SPEAKER_03]: When I first heard the music, I was like, oh, if we ever have to switch up cocoons of horror music, maybe this would be a good option.
04:31 --> 04:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's pretty, I was, I kept thinking about you during the music.
04:35 --> 04:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I also was thinking,
04:36 --> 04:58 [SPEAKER_01]: that whatever movie this music is for it also seems interesting because it's not this movie eight it shifts quite a bit the tone the tone suggests different things like so that and maybe it's just what i'd accustomed to uh... maybe in eighty one we're still figuring out how soundtracks work but
04:58 --> 05:06 [SPEAKER_01]: There's like, I remember how I like in jaws when they get on the boat and it's like all kind of like they're going to go to the shark, but it sounded like almost like like a pop-i cartoon.
05:07 --> 05:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right, yeah, and I was, this kind of brought me back to that because there's like scenes where it's like, the drama is such that it's supposed to be like kind of harrowing and instead it gives this sort of like TV show action montage music.
05:22 --> 05:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I like when the helicopter's going up to like the tram, which is supposed to be like this kind of major
05:28 --> 05:38 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, seeing basically to show, you know, the, the, the, the length of that wolf guard will go through, go to, to, to assert his dominance.
05:38 --> 05:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
05:39 --> 05:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's just like, That's just doesn't match at all.
05:44 --> 05:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
05:45 --> 05:48 [SPEAKER_03]: That, we're, I, I need to jump right into that scene.
05:49 --> 05:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
05:50 --> 05:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
05:52 --> 05:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So, and by the way, I'm going to say wolf guard a bunch during this podcast.
05:57 --> 05:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Wolfgarb may be the best villain's name ever.
06:00 --> 06:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's, yeah, good luck finding it.
06:02 --> 06:05 [SPEAKER_01]: The best part is his full name is Hamar Reinhardt.
06:07 --> 06:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And, but it's Hamar Wolfgar Reinhardt, all right.
06:10 --> 06:15 [SPEAKER_03]: So, terrorist event on a tram, genius, genius.
06:16 --> 06:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Secondly, you gotta get someone in a helicopter at some point.
06:19 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know why.
06:21 --> 06:22 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, what was the idea?
06:23 --> 06:25 [SPEAKER_03]: You're, yeah, exactly.
06:25 --> 06:26 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's the stalemate, right?
06:26 --> 06:31 [SPEAKER_03]: You're going to send a, like, you need, this, this movie is a lot about just the stare down.
06:32 --> 06:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, totally.
06:34 --> 06:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And helicopter, helicopters are perfect for stare down, right?
06:37 --> 06:40 [SPEAKER_03]: You got to get some, almost, that's why they get to loan it, I level.
06:40 --> 06:42 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, the, the lifts on his shoes aren't enough.
06:44 --> 06:47 [SPEAKER_03]: You have to get him up to I level with Wolfgarh.
06:48 --> 06:51 [SPEAKER_03]: And one of them's in a, over a city tram.
06:51 --> 06:59 [SPEAKER_03]: And one of us in a helicopter and they're just staring at each other at no point.
06:59 --> 07:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Helicopters only invented for stare downs like I mean, you figure from the military perspective.
07:03 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not stealthy.
07:04 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_01]: It's loud as hell.
07:06 --> 07:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Not them, you know, it's it's just sort of inconvenient all the way around because you can't even speak to each other.
07:11 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's only if you want to go to the military.
07:15 --> 07:31 [SPEAKER_03]: headquarters just to give them a just a steely glare helicopters are really about the vibes you could do the same scene with the hot air balloon and they just wouldn't have the cashier you just imagine the slow rise
07:33 --> 07:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the thing of, and I love when movies have helicopters that surprise, and I'm like, dude, how is helicopter showing up by surprise?
07:40 --> 07:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I remember I can leave the web and helicopter just pops up and they're like, whoa, and I'm like, dude, I can hear in helicopter, like, two states away.
07:46 --> 07:53 [SPEAKER_03]: These are men who have a lot of explosives in their past.
07:55 --> 08:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I guess it's a, which explains why all of them in this film have to yell at each other.
08:01 --> 08:06 [SPEAKER_01]: This is all movie just about the, uh, the perils of living with tenitis.
08:06 --> 08:25 [SPEAKER_03]: so he goes up in the chopper I don't know what the plan is I got it is he does a mean to like jump from helicopter to tram at one point he's the guy flying the helicopter so I'm not sure what the idea there is but
08:26 --> 08:29 [SPEAKER_03]: He gets up there, they do the stair down.
08:29 --> 08:35 [SPEAKER_03]: And then he's got to go land, he's got to go land, land the bird.
08:35 --> 08:36 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, all right.
08:37 --> 08:40 [SPEAKER_03]: And then he connect to a cable.
08:40 --> 08:40 [SPEAKER_03]: He's going to a cable.
08:41 --> 08:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I just get hoisted up, hoisted up, slow.
08:45 --> 08:46 [SPEAKER_01]: By all means, movie, take your time.
08:48 --> 08:52 [SPEAKER_03]: And when they're doing the little, you know, the face off,
08:52 --> 08:57 [SPEAKER_03]: and Stallone is holding the child and Wolfgarth calls to Shaka.
08:57 --> 09:00 [SPEAKER_03]: He says, you know, you can't even imagine here.
09:00 --> 09:04 [SPEAKER_01]: The names, Deek, Shaka, Wolfgarh, and then you've got Matt.
09:04 --> 09:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Just poor Matt, we're going to talk about Matt in a bit here.
09:07 --> 09:08 [SPEAKER_03]: They care as much.
09:09 --> 09:11 [SPEAKER_03]: They care much about that characters they do about naming the character.
09:13 --> 09:20 [SPEAKER_03]: So when he starts to send him.
09:20 --> 09:22 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I laughed really hard.
09:22 --> 09:25 [SPEAKER_03]: I really, really wound that a bunch.
09:25 --> 09:39 [SPEAKER_03]: There's nothing more castrating than just like trying to exchange barbs with the terrorists and then just get set down a slowly, slowly, send down the, um,
09:40 --> 09:54 [SPEAKER_01]: in the newly wed game you know how things are connected I mean this you know we got we have a cable we have a helicopter a little bit of dark man yeah that's true yeah that's right well and you you did call it cruising
09:55 --> 09:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
09:55 --> 09:56 [SPEAKER_03]: And Serpico.
09:56 --> 09:59 [SPEAKER_03]: And I, you know, this is about that time.
10:00 --> 10:09 [SPEAKER_03]: And it feels like the director is kind of going for that gritty 70s New York cop, New R. And it opens.
10:12 --> 10:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Who is the lone like mission and possible drag.
10:15 --> 10:19 [SPEAKER_01]: That mask that he's wearing would freak me out.
10:20 --> 10:25 [SPEAKER_03]: totally like he's about to get no way I'm robbing that woman.
10:28 --> 10:34 [SPEAKER_03]: These streettops in New York City they are not deterred by the freakiest mask ever made.
10:34 --> 10:40 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really important that we have you dress up as a woman, but heaven for bid we ask you to shave that beard.
10:40 --> 10:44 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll have to come up with just some sort of creepy mask.
10:44 --> 10:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh man when he pulls off the mask.
10:46 --> 10:47 [SPEAKER_02]: How cut you man?
10:48 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_02]: You guys
10:50 --> 11:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop
11:17 --> 11:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sitting down going, first off, I mean, the music is fun.
11:21 --> 11:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, it doesn't match this movie, but the music is fun.
11:24 --> 11:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And some of the shots of the city are like, kind of gorgeous.
11:28 --> 11:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, yep, they do some amazing framing going on that sort of give you the, just sort of the, the large view of the city and also there's a,
11:43 --> 11:49 [SPEAKER_01]: But I'd also give you moments of claustrophobia because of just how everything is big.
11:49 --> 11:52 [SPEAKER_01]: But if you're in it, you kind of feel surrounded and trapped.
11:52 --> 11:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's a lot of elements visually that are actually really good.
11:57 --> 12:02 [SPEAKER_01]: This movie has moments that, like, it has the confidence of a better movie.
12:02 --> 12:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I mean, it certainly has confidence.
12:09 --> 12:12 [SPEAKER_03]: That's not the bad about that.
12:13 --> 12:28 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's funny here because I think if Puccino was in this role at about this time, it would have been unintentionally funny in a different way.
12:29 --> 12:29 [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.
12:30 --> 12:33 [SPEAKER_03]: Stallone is just, he's just got that one track.
12:34 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_03]: Should we talk about Stallone?
12:37 --> 12:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Let's talk about Stallone.
12:39 --> 13:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Did anyone have a higher early career apex that never lived up to it's I mean he's got a pretty I mean okay so here's it so still on like you didn't say that because still on this is still very active in things like he's he's he's in there actually probably a very active in cosmetic surgery
13:05 --> 13:06 [SPEAKER_01]: true.
13:07 --> 13:19 [SPEAKER_01]: He's also like, I don't know where his movies rank like in the Razzies, but like it's pretty sensational how you're saying how he's going to many bad movies.
13:19 --> 13:24 [SPEAKER_03]: He's now you're saying that he's got a fantastic batting average for bad movies?
13:26 --> 13:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I mean he he gets to the plague a lot.
13:31 --> 13:44 [SPEAKER_03]: And yet doesn't really know, like, you know, there's there were a couple comedy movies he was in a couple self-aware movies that he was in, but for the most part like he does it while that he's in a cage, right?
13:44 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_01]: But that's the thing is like, I feel like studios knows that he's the studios know if they put Stallone in it, they're going to make a ton of money.
13:52 --> 13:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I feel as as a society, not even an American society, because I think globally these movies tend to do pretty well.
13:58 --> 14:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I think as a human race,
14:01 --> 14:07 [SPEAKER_01]: We do not know what our relationship with Savasrasd alone truly is, right?
14:07 --> 14:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Because he sort of mastered the iconic character, right?
14:13 --> 14:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Like coming out is Rocky.
14:15 --> 14:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Rocky is Rocky has a statue, a fictional character has a statue in real life.
14:21 --> 14:23 [SPEAKER_03]: We're very confused.
14:23 --> 14:25 [SPEAKER_03]: We're very as a society.
14:25 --> 14:43 [SPEAKER_01]: We are very confused about so at that moment I think we just said we have we have sold our solders of us just alone and then and then and then so and then like so thing is as Rocky's great First Rocky's fantastic First blood actually very good and he's lucky wins the Oscar.
14:44 --> 14:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, has there is another sports movie that's done this
14:47 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_03]: it's almost like held up as sort of the pinnacle of sports movies because of the Oscar.
14:53 --> 14:56 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a great movie.
14:56 --> 14:57 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a great movie.
14:58 --> 15:02 [SPEAKER_03]: It's super, super funny at the same time.
15:02 --> 15:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
15:03 --> 15:11 [SPEAKER_03]: And then, you know, we've covered other rocky films on this podcast, the parlay from Rocky to Rambo, it's impressive.
15:12 --> 15:22 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, in terms of his career, right, I don't know if maybe I'm about to say something untrue, but I was going to say that the 80s were almost like the pinnacle of action movies.
15:23 --> 15:26 [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, I think you're going to have, you're going to have three or four.
15:26 --> 15:28 [SPEAKER_03]: They were all going to come out in the summer.
15:28 --> 15:30 [SPEAKER_03]: They were going to get, man, they were
15:32 --> 15:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It was going to be, and it's sort of laid out the blueprint going forward, right?
15:35 --> 15:43 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and I kind of feel like actually like stilones rise with the rise of the action flick.
15:43 --> 15:47 [SPEAKER_03]: And then does he get market corrected by source and eggher?
15:47 --> 15:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Is that what happens?
15:49 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, trying to think timing wise because source and eggher, what is he's on the scene with Conan, right?
15:59 --> 16:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I think so.
16:01 --> 16:03 [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't think he explodes until Terminator.
16:03 --> 16:07 [SPEAKER_03]: I think there might have been one other thing before Conan, but yeah, you're right.
16:08 --> 16:10 [SPEAKER_03]: So Terminator sort of his big coming out party.
16:11 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_03]: But he's the baddie, right?
16:14 --> 16:15 [SPEAKER_03]: He's the villain.
16:15 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think Slies ever played the villain.
16:19 --> 16:22 [SPEAKER_03]: There might be something, but I can't think of any time.
16:22 --> 16:31 [SPEAKER_03]: He hasn't been like lead superhero kind of guy.
16:31 --> 16:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like slides almost an afterthought, like Schwarzenegger's just taking over that slot.
16:38 --> 16:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, there's, the, the thing that's interesting is they're sort of side by side, right?
16:41 --> 16:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Like there, they were kind of,
16:43 --> 17:03 [SPEAKER_03]: they were kind of the genera pocino of action stars uh... both and similar a relationship to them are both similar i feel like at one point source today or kind of achieve self-awareness and quicker for sure right and he realizes that like he they keep there's something about him that's really funny
17:04 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_03]: And I almost felt like Stallone because it was early success, never, maybe it was the Oscar.
17:12 --> 17:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe that was that.
17:12 --> 17:17 [SPEAKER_03]: It was like, no, I'm the Oscar winning film, our tour.
17:18 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm not going to take myself less seriously than that.
17:24 --> 17:29 [SPEAKER_03]: Whereas maybe Swartz Nager comes on the scene in a different way.
17:30 --> 17:36 [SPEAKER_03]: And he never really has that, I don't know that, that's snobbery attached to him.
17:39 --> 17:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's, so that is very, very interesting, right?
17:42 --> 17:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So, because I think it is important the origins.
17:48 --> 17:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, for one, I mean,
17:49 --> 17:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Stallone's American, right?
17:51 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Or at least he's that's where he Kind of delf you know, let's just You sure but like like Stallone like in his first like films Like what had to be dubbed because his acts or it's fortunate you had to be dubbed because his accent was either so thick or he's English wasn't very good and he was primarily known for size, right, because
18:14 --> 18:16 [SPEAKER_01]: still on comes out on the scene.
18:16 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_01]: He isn't cut and ripped until rocky three.
18:21 --> 18:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, in terms of like, write it up, you know, he's, yeah, but like, I mean, he was certainly physically and like, you could like, when he was shirtless and rocky, he's kind of doughy, you know, he looks all, he looks old a bit the part.
18:36 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_01]: But by the time he's shredded in rocky three,
18:41 --> 18:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's different, right?
18:42 --> 18:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So that changes the character too, because that's when things become incongruous.
18:47 --> 18:54 [SPEAKER_01]: That's when Rocky becomes more of a superhero than he does every man Icon, right?
18:55 --> 19:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, but yeah, to your point, he starts off with a lot of different films, but they are based on a certain level of realism to some degree, right?
19:11 --> 19:16 [SPEAKER_01]: He's kind of, he's still in every man with opportunity, right?
19:16 --> 19:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And then first blood is, you know, it's a commentary on, I mean, there's definitely action for sure, but it is a little bit more rich of a story in terms of the commentary on the, uh, the abandoned Vietnam that, right, both Rocky and Rambo are trying to say something.
19:35 --> 19:58 [SPEAKER_03]: they're not well rambot yeah first blood for sure says something rambot doesn't okay all right that i i stand corrected on that but you're right so both first blood and rocky they're they have some kind of commentary there's there's a deeper theme there's a statement to the movie they're both coming out of that kind of nineteen seventies culture
19:58 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_03]: But it's almost like once the 80s decides to go full 80s, Stallone kind of rides that wave, but still thinks he's important.
20:13 --> 20:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
20:13 --> 20:15 [SPEAKER_03]: No, that makes sense.
20:15 --> 20:20 [SPEAKER_03]: The choice is that he makes suggests that he's going for the cash.
20:20 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_03]: And yet he always thinks that he's sort of, he's always like wondering, like, well, why isn't this winning an Oscar?
20:27 --> 20:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so like he's in movies like lords of flat bush with Henry Winkler and like the 70's right so like in the 70's he's got roles he's doing some things right in the, but then he really comes out on the scene with Rocky obviously and
20:54 --> 20:57 [SPEAKER_01]: There's an intention, Ali, like I said, there's a purpose.
20:58 --> 21:02 [SPEAKER_01]: If Nighthawks comes out right after Rocky II, right?
21:02 --> 21:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's bonified at this point.
21:06 --> 21:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he's well established as Rocky at this point.
21:11 --> 21:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Because the 76 Rocky comes out, he makes fist, he makes Paradise Ali, he makes Rocky II and 79.
21:16 --> 21:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Next film was Nighthawks, and he's also in victory the same year.
21:23 --> 21:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I think at this point, he's like, yeah, I'm, I mean, he's, he's, he's a star.
21:27 --> 21:30 [SPEAKER_01]: He's a, he's a, but that night, hugs comes around.
21:30 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_03]: He's, he's, he's a household name, yeah, and I mean, he, he certainly the main character in this film.
21:37 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's almost like, ability is, is his sidekick.
21:41 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
21:41 --> 21:49 [SPEAKER_03]: And yet, and so, you know, he's selling the movie, and I think that the film does want to be a serious film.
21:49 --> 21:56 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's it really wants to like this film is taking this up very seriously.
21:57 --> 22:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, but it could kind of wild it like like first blood comes out like the next year.
22:03 --> 22:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So he's kind of on a track right like night hoax is an interesting moment because if you look at his where he's at it's like,
22:12 --> 22:14 [SPEAKER_01]: there's there could be a perception again.
22:14 --> 22:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
22:15 --> 22:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I was pretty young.
22:16 --> 22:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I wasn't really paying attention, but like there's probably a perception that this guy, is this guy like, like, brando?
22:24 --> 22:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I think he thinks he is.
22:26 --> 22:27 [SPEAKER_03]: I think he thinks he's brando.
22:27 --> 22:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Or he's being told that or he thinks it or the studios think and then he's one of the Oscar for best film for rocky Yeah, like why wouldn't he think that yeah, you know, so so why wouldn't I think all right?
22:39 --> 22:47 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm gonna make a commentary on on uh, you know Crime in New York City, you know, I want to show the world
22:48 --> 22:49 [SPEAKER_03]: how bad the world really is.
22:49 --> 23:01 [SPEAKER_03]: But in this film, he's like, you know, he's like morally troubled, like maybe he's like, he feels guilt over the amount of people he killed in the war.
23:01 --> 23:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Like one is like, that was worse.
23:04 --> 23:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
23:05 --> 23:19 [SPEAKER_03]: And then, but, you know, he can't take the shot because, you know, they're trying to indoctrinate him so he can be as ruthless as a terrorist, but he's like, how are we better than them if we're just going to be as ruthless as them?
23:19 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_03]: So this movie is absolutely trying to show the conflicted heart inside of a man, you know, right.
23:27 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: This film, this film thinks it's saying something.
23:35 --> 23:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we don't know what he is.
23:37 --> 23:42 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know why we don't know that he was even trying to stop any crimes either time.
23:42 --> 23:46 [SPEAKER_03]: We don't know why Lindsey Wagner broke up with him.
23:48 --> 23:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I got an idea.
23:49 --> 23:50 [SPEAKER_01]: He's stretching out her pantyhose.
23:54 --> 23:57 [SPEAKER_03]: So he thinks he's everything.
23:57 --> 24:03 [SPEAKER_03]: I think audiences still think that he's, you know, he's sort of a big star.
24:04 --> 24:07 [SPEAKER_03]: This movie feels like let's go for the Oscar, you know, let's put it.
24:07 --> 24:10 [SPEAKER_03]: It's put all of our marbles into this.
24:10 --> 24:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Let's make this the next big thing.
24:13 --> 24:17 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, they've done enough to entertain us, you know?
24:17 --> 24:22 [SPEAKER_03]: There's, I don't know if we're the demographic, they really were hoping for.
24:23 --> 24:23 [SPEAKER_03]: True.
24:28 --> 24:30 [SPEAKER_01]: His career trajectory is kind of fascinating, all right?
24:30 --> 24:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So you see this, you go rocky too, you go night hogs, and he's in victory, then he's in first blood, and it's like, he's, here he is.
24:37 --> 24:39 [SPEAKER_01]: He's establishing himself, right?
24:40 --> 24:46 [SPEAKER_01]: but then Rocky 3, then he directs Stain alive, then he's in Rindstone.
24:47 --> 24:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Now he's Rambo.
24:48 --> 24:49 [SPEAKER_01]: When is over the top?
24:51 --> 24:54 [SPEAKER_01]: It's after Rocky 4 and Cobra.
24:56 --> 25:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Cobra's another one of those were, see again, and again, I think this is important to this juxtaposition.
25:03 --> 25:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Now he does Rindstone, which is off-type, right?
25:06 --> 25:07 [SPEAKER_01]: He's
25:08 --> 25:11 [SPEAKER_01]: but he immediately goes to Rocky 4 cobra over the top.
25:11 --> 25:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Rambo 3 lockup and then he gets to tango and cash.
25:14 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And so like now he's starting to hit a little bit more of his comedic phase, right?
25:17 --> 25:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Cause then he gets to Oscar after Rocky 5 and stop from my mom will shoot and then he starts adding a little bit more.
25:26 --> 25:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Like Castango and Cash, I think like starts add a little bit more comedy to his actions stuff, because Cobras is like deadly serious.
25:33 --> 25:37 [SPEAKER_01]: But Schwarzenegger just as a juxtaposition, right?
25:37 --> 25:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he doesn't like Conan comes out in 82.
25:40 --> 25:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Conan comes out like so right when like, so first blood and Conan, the barbarian are going against each other, right?
25:47 --> 25:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And Schwarzenegger's main function is to be big.
25:50 --> 25:55 [SPEAKER_01]: He looks like a monstrous muscle man, right?
25:56 --> 26:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Conan the barbarian then 84 Conan the destroyer very much typecast at this point, right?
26:01 --> 26:04 [SPEAKER_01]: But it also an 84 Terminator.
26:04 --> 26:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a sort of flips the script.
26:06 --> 26:11 [SPEAKER_01]: 85 Redstone becomes out so sort of offshoot of the Conan series.
26:11 --> 26:13 [SPEAKER_01]: But I think Terminator did so much.
26:13 --> 26:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Now 85 Commandow.
26:16 --> 26:19 [SPEAKER_01]: So this puts him now he's not the bad guy.
26:19 --> 26:22 [SPEAKER_01]: So Rambo comes out the same year that Commandow comes out.
26:23 --> 26:26 [SPEAKER_01]: So now we're basically putting them head to head.
26:26 --> 26:29 [SPEAKER_01]: So first blood, now we have the sequel, it's Rambo.
26:29 --> 26:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So now, and so Stallone has taken the trouble to Vietnam vet and turned him into a killing machine.
26:39 --> 26:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And so Camando goes up, so you could probably make the argument that Camando feels like a poor man's Rambo at that point, because Schwarzenegger is, we know who he is, he's a big deal, but he hasn't really,
26:51 --> 26:55 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, outside of the Conan movies hasn't started as the main guy.
26:55 --> 26:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
26:56 --> 27:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Interestingly, Rod deal comes out the next year, which is sort of a forgettable tale, but then it's predator and running man's same year.
27:08 --> 27:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's kind of off to the races at that point.
27:10 --> 27:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Now it's
27:17 --> 27:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, because Stallone's done rhinestone, but he hasn't done tango and cash, but like Schwarzenegger is now leaning into the one liners and red heat and then twins and then total recall kindergarten cop terminator two and it's kind of okay so here's here's what I'm going to say about that I think that early on Schwarzenegger is sort of like almost in the shadow of Stallone.
27:43 --> 27:50 [SPEAKER_03]: But what Schwarzenegger has that Solone never figured out was that he's got comedic timing.
27:51 --> 27:56 [SPEAKER_03]: He figured out that I can be a bigger star if I can be action slash comedy.
27:56 --> 27:56 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
27:57 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_03]: And so you, you look at twins.
27:59 --> 28:00 [SPEAKER_03]: You look at kindergarten cop.
28:01 --> 28:06 [SPEAKER_03]: These are just much funnier movies than anything.
28:06 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Still, I never did.
28:08 --> 28:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
28:09 --> 28:17 [SPEAKER_03]: And so because, because the source in there had that other gear, I just think that Stallone just kept on taking himself too seriously.
28:17 --> 28:20 [SPEAKER_03]: And maybe he just didn't wasn't as talented as a community actor.
28:21 --> 28:30 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, an action film started going to action slash comedy and you almost had to have equal parts of both that just left Stallone in the dust.
28:31 --> 28:31 [SPEAKER_03]: He couldn't do it.
28:32 --> 28:34 [SPEAKER_03]: He can be unintentionally funny for sure.
28:35 --> 28:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, in his movies, they're very like famous, right?
28:38 --> 28:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I mean, even like, demolition man, which is, I mean, demolition man, cliffhanger.
28:44 --> 28:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, judge dread.
28:47 --> 28:49 [SPEAKER_01]: These movies make money.
28:50 --> 28:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're very memorable people know what they are, but they're not good.
28:56 --> 28:57 [SPEAKER_01]: They're not good.
28:57 --> 28:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And no, but they're not good.
28:59 --> 29:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, when some time, like, okay, let's look at,
29:05 --> 29:06 [SPEAKER_01]: like running man, right?
29:07 --> 29:13 [SPEAKER_01]: You could argue that running man's not very good, but it's, but there's an entertaining quality to it that over the top does not have.
29:14 --> 29:18 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a, like, almost, like, it feels more self-aware, right?
29:18 --> 29:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I think that's kind of what we're talking about.
29:22 --> 29:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, demolition man feels like maybe a moment of self-awareness where his cliffhanger is real, real bad.
29:28 --> 29:29 [SPEAKER_01]: but it never feels like it knows it.
29:30 --> 29:31 [SPEAKER_03]: No, that's right, not self-aware.
29:32 --> 29:39 [SPEAKER_03]: I will say this because we're, you know, I don't want to submerge the legacy of Stallone Too Bad.
29:39 --> 29:44 [SPEAKER_03]: 97 is you'll be all right, 97 is Copland.
29:45 --> 29:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Copland is a good movie.
29:46 --> 29:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I like Copland.
29:48 --> 30:00 [SPEAKER_03]: He's the lead character in this movie that features Kaitel and De Niro and Ray Leota Janine Grafalo.
30:00 --> 30:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you remember that season this movie?
30:02 --> 30:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, that's right.
30:03 --> 30:04 [SPEAKER_03]: You'll end up
30:04 --> 30:21 [SPEAKER_03]: it's a legit movie it's it's sort of it has the it has a problem because it's a Danero liota movie that's not nearly as good as good fellas or some of these uh you know even in kaitel you know it just it's just in the shadow of a lot of other very
30:22 --> 30:38 [SPEAKER_03]: very well made movies, but it's a it's a decent movie and and he plays a serious part it's him in 97 almost returning to almost returning to greatness.
30:38 --> 30:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if it's a great movie, but it's a good movie and then it also is very it's it's a big deal because he's in the foreground of a movie that has
30:50 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_01]: those heavy weights, those dramatic heavy weights behind them.
30:54 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
30:55 --> 30:59 [SPEAKER_03]: And so he gets to pretend like he's Mr. Oscar again, and he doesn't do bad.
30:59 --> 31:12 [SPEAKER_03]: And then it would also say that, you know, as much as we like to crap on rocky sequels, some of these later rocky movies are actually pretty decent, like he's actually pretty decent in Rocky, Boboa.
31:13 --> 31:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I agree.
31:14 --> 31:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Rocky, Bobo is actually.
31:15 --> 31:16 [SPEAKER_03]: It's actually a pretty decent movie.
31:17 --> 31:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And then he probably the second best.
31:19 --> 31:21 [SPEAKER_01]: of the series.
31:21 --> 31:24 [SPEAKER_03]: So, he's still got that in him.
31:24 --> 31:26 [SPEAKER_03]: It's just that he doesn't have the range.
31:26 --> 31:28 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, he's pretty limited.
31:29 --> 31:37 [SPEAKER_03]: But if you can get him in the right movie with the right tone, with the, with the, with good writing.
31:37 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, do you can actually impress this movie that we're covering today?
31:46 --> 31:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I've been doing everything we could do to talk about this particular movie.
31:49 --> 31:50 [SPEAKER_03]: This movie that we're covering today.
31:50 --> 31:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh my gosh, isn't that bad writing.
31:54 --> 31:57 [SPEAKER_03]: But it's so, it's so wonderfully bad.
31:57 --> 31:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's totally worth the watch.
32:00 --> 32:05 [SPEAKER_01]: This is a, for listeners out there who haven't watched it, give it a watch.
32:07 --> 32:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh my gosh.
32:08 --> 32:09 [SPEAKER_01]: An hour, 40 year, your time.
32:09 --> 32:11 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, I need to, I need to talk about Wolfgar here.
32:12 --> 32:26 [SPEAKER_03]: So the premise of this movie is that you've got this international terrorist who's a bomber, but he's a little bit too indelicate for the other terrorists.
32:28 --> 32:42 [SPEAKER_03]: So the other terrorists have him on the outs, poor wolf
32:43 --> 32:45 [SPEAKER_03]: So he wants to make a name for himself.
32:46 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_03]: And what he does is he gets himself to New York City so that he can show the world.
32:54 --> 32:57 [SPEAKER_03]: But he's the most terrifying terrorist in the entire world.
32:58 --> 33:01 [SPEAKER_03]: And of course, you need the biggest world stage to do that.
33:01 --> 33:03 [SPEAKER_03]: You're going to do it in New York City.
33:04 --> 33:05 [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
33:05 --> 33:07 [SPEAKER_03]: But he needs to do this in Cognito.
33:08 --> 33:11 [SPEAKER_03]: So he goes for a cosmetic surgery.
33:13 --> 33:14 [SPEAKER_03]: to unread his hair.
33:19 --> 33:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Can we talk about this cosmetic surgery?
33:24 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_03]: Does he get, I mean, what happened?
33:27 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't do.
33:27 --> 33:29 [SPEAKER_03]: He shaved his beard.
33:29 --> 33:31 [SPEAKER_03]: That's, that's what ends up happening.
33:31 --> 33:34 [SPEAKER_01]: This will be doesn't know what disguise is off.
33:36 --> 33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: He, where are the good nighthawks, what are the call of nighthawks?
33:46 --> 33:48 [SPEAKER_03]: We got to go back to this plastic surgeon.
33:53 --> 33:55 [SPEAKER_03]: He says, are they going to close?
33:55 --> 33:56 [SPEAKER_03]: Here's what we're going to do.
33:56 --> 33:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Here's what we're going to do.
33:58 --> 34:03 [SPEAKER_03]: I've got two photos to show you, and I think that these are both work.
34:03 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_03]: What do you want?
34:04 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_03]: One or the other?
34:04 --> 34:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you want A or B?
34:06 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Because A is going to make your nostrils bigger.
34:14 --> 34:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Now Wolfguar is not the kindest man in the world, but I kind of understand his problem.
34:20 --> 34:24 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, your plastic surgeon, you're giving me two options.
34:25 --> 34:26 [SPEAKER_03]: Two options?
34:27 --> 34:33 [SPEAKER_03]: like could I see a menu please because I feel like what you're showing me here is pretty limited.
34:33 --> 34:45 [SPEAKER_03]: Now, the way he communicates his dissatisfaction is to, uh, he like hooks a needle through his sweater and then pokes it in his cheek or something and he says, make me beautiful.
34:47 --> 34:47 [SPEAKER_03]: That's right.
34:48 --> 34:56 [SPEAKER_03]: And apparently what they've settled on is that he gets his beard shaved and
34:57 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, it's just, you know, you'd be surprised at what a little, a little bit.
35:03 --> 35:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, there are some people that we went to school with that had plastic surgery.
35:05 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And I didn't initially recognize them on Facebook.
35:10 --> 35:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they had a little more done than shave their beard and expand their nostrils.
35:14 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: But like, you know, I mean, it a little bit goes a long way.
35:16 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Interesting.
35:16 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
35:17 --> 35:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, this is a major plot point in the movie.
35:20 --> 35:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
35:21 --> 35:47 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a major plot point because even though they're sending a Nigel Davenport, Hartman, to the United States to indoctrinate New York City cops on techniques in counterterrorism, they acknowledged that he went to a plastic surgeon and killed him, and he may not look anything like the photograph that they're seeing on on the screen.
35:47 --> 36:02 [SPEAKER_03]: In order to thwart him, a sliced alone is not listening to the lecture, he's sitting there sketching, and he's able to imagine what someone would look like was slightly larger nostrils.
36:04 --> 36:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, midnasties.
36:09 --> 36:15 [SPEAKER_03]: And this allows him to pick him out in this disco club where they have a stair down.
36:16 --> 36:39 [SPEAKER_03]: It's such an intense stair down that Wolfguard just decides he's going to pull out his gun in the middle of the disco, which kind of announces his presence, you know, like it's a little bit of like kind of undercuts all the effort to make him look different.
36:41 --> 36:45 [SPEAKER_03]: But as soon as someone looks at you too long, you pull out your gun and shoot at them.
36:46 --> 36:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Like if you're trying to stay in cognito, maybe that's not a smart move.
36:55 --> 36:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, it's not like his back was against a wall at this point either.
36:59 --> 37:01 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, hey, I might be being recognized right now.
37:02 --> 37:04 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like if you would have just said, what are you looking at?
37:05 --> 37:08 [SPEAKER_03]: I know I'm not yeah or maybe just walk away say no sir.
37:08 --> 37:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not an international terrorist.
37:12 --> 37:14 [SPEAKER_01]: You must have me mistaken with someone else.
37:14 --> 37:19 [SPEAKER_01]: You might want to consult your sketchbook.
37:19 --> 37:22 [SPEAKER_03]: So back to the back to the premise of this movie.
37:23 --> 37:29 [SPEAKER_03]: According to the trailer, there is one man that can take the world to his knees and one man that can take him down.
37:30 --> 37:38 [SPEAKER_03]: The reason why he can take him down is that he is just very intuitive about the size of people's nostrils.
37:42 --> 37:45 [SPEAKER_03]: That's not that's not insignificant.
37:45 --> 37:46 [SPEAKER_03]: That's the plot of this movie.
37:52 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_01]: That's that's why he's the right man for the job.
37:57 --> 37:59 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to kill anybody.
37:59 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_02]: wouldn't mind, you know, maybe paint them a little bit.
38:12 --> 38:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I, I stand by that he's, he's very comfortable doing the drag thing.
38:16 --> 38:21 [SPEAKER_01]: This is, this is, I think,
38:22 --> 38:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Shaming drag or any of that.
38:24 --> 38:28 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, whatever, man, that's not that's not the point of what I'm about.
38:28 --> 38:30 [SPEAKER_01]: No, this is Sly and drag.
38:30 --> 38:39 [SPEAKER_01]: This is 1981, so Vester Stallone at not one, but two moments in the film.
38:39 --> 38:43 [SPEAKER_01]: In fact, book ended with him dressed as a woman in a wig.
38:43 --> 38:51 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's like, that's his thing.
38:53 --> 39:19 [SPEAKER_03]: He says he was down at a particular part of the city and she asks she says what were you doing down there cruising This is his things like yeah, and I don't think he's picking up anyone because that mask is not anyone's canke that's a thing right like there's so many other ways To do anything This is the choice like the movie starts with kind of just a like
39:20 --> 39:31 [SPEAKER_01]: a mugging, but like he's undercover as a woman like they could have had a female police officer for example, and they could have been nearby.
39:31 --> 39:50 [SPEAKER_01]: But the best plan was to take your most bearded police officer and put him in a horrifying mask and just have him wander around until he gets mugged
39:54 --> 39:56 [SPEAKER_01]: This movie is amazing.
39:56 --> 39:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's how it starts.
39:59 --> 40:09 [SPEAKER_01]: So when we get to the end, and I don't know how you felt, but like, how quickly did you know that was Stallone in drag?
40:09 --> 40:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And at the end.
40:10 --> 40:12 [SPEAKER_03]: It was completely, it completely fooled me.
40:13 --> 40:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Really?
40:14 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I got Wolfguard.
40:16 --> 40:17 [SPEAKER_01]: The movie tells on itself.
40:17 --> 40:20 [SPEAKER_01]: The movie completely lched.
40:21 --> 40:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It makes kind of a fatal,
40:24 --> 40:44 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a it's a premise that's going on for a long time to the point where like I know where the punch line isn't a better be this punch line It was not my final what is not one of my final moments because we need when he calls and nobody answers and the leaves There's no sequence when Wolfgar is making his way into the violent woman's apartment
40:45 --> 40:50 [SPEAKER_01]: where we cut to anything of like him racing to get there right like that's the kind let's what you'd expect.
40:51 --> 40:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's sense the movie doesn't do that.
40:53 --> 41:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like well we just completely of left Dique his subplot altogether and so as he starts making his way to the house and getting through and I hear the shower I'm like oh oh Diques and drag Diques and drag again and as soon as we
41:14 --> 41:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, and now I'm getting mad, I'm like, if it isn't that, this movie, this movie is completely, you know, a waste of time, because I'm like, now I'm just rooting for it and I can't wait for it.
41:27 --> 41:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And not only does it do it, but I don't know why he feels the need to take the wig off to show it to him, because he doesn't have the mask on.
41:36 --> 41:38 [SPEAKER_01]: He's just deep to silver.
41:38 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_01]: with a blonde woman's wig on, and he slowly takes it off as if to say, like, ah, well, he is wearing a woman's robe.
41:46 --> 41:49 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, but he's bearded and still on.
41:50 --> 41:52 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, what it goes to show is that.
41:54 --> 41:57 [SPEAKER_03]: He already has the natural ability to thwart the terrorist.
41:58 --> 42:01 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's just sort of what he's been doing in his life.
42:02 --> 42:14 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, because he has been cruising, because he has spent a lot of time in drag, he already knows how to create the kind of incognito needed.
42:14 --> 42:18 [SPEAKER_03]: To thwart this, he doesn't need to go to a plastic surgeon.
42:18 --> 42:21 [SPEAKER_03]: He is already superior.
42:22 --> 42:23 [SPEAKER_03]: at the costume.
42:23 --> 42:25 [SPEAKER_03]: He's already to disappear at the disguise.
42:26 --> 42:31 [SPEAKER_03]: And everything that he learned from Hartman is is worthless.
42:32 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_03]: And you know what he doesn't need to be a ruthless.
42:34 --> 42:36 [SPEAKER_03]: He doesn't need to shoot first.
42:38 --> 42:42 [SPEAKER_03]: He doesn't even need to learn the history of recent terrorism in the world.
42:43 --> 42:51 [SPEAKER_03]: All he needs to do is put on some nylons.
42:57 --> 43:02 [SPEAKER_03]: uh, uh, love every moment with Billy D. Williams.
43:03 --> 43:07 [SPEAKER_03]: I, uh, I laughed really, really hard when he gets cut in the face.
43:08 --> 43:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, my gosh.
43:09 --> 43:11 [SPEAKER_01]: That whole, I watched that scene probably four times.
43:11 --> 43:26 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, because I was sure what, like, I was like, wait, did they want me to think that he got cut in the neck because the way that still own response.
43:27 --> 43:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's almost like he didn't know what the script was and like he's he's actually okay.
43:32 --> 43:38 [SPEAKER_03]: He can't stand the idea that Billy D Williams money maker might have a scar on that's bear.
43:39 --> 43:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's like he's he's us in that moment.
43:43 --> 43:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's like someone just someone just took a piss on the Mona Lisa and we're going to cut up Billy D Williams face.
43:52 --> 43:53 [SPEAKER_03]: When does the Empire come out?
43:54 --> 43:55 [SPEAKER_01]: She's that's a great question.
43:57 --> 43:58 [SPEAKER_01]: My strike spec comes out in 80.
43:58 --> 44:01 [SPEAKER_01]: So this is post, postlandle reality here.
44:02 --> 44:15 [SPEAKER_03]: It's one thing to make it pretty clear that your white actor is the main character, and the other guy is the sidekick.
44:15 --> 44:20 [SPEAKER_03]: All right, so you're basically black eye playing second fiddle to white eye, all right.
44:20 --> 44:22 [SPEAKER_03]: So that's, there's that.
44:22 --> 44:30 [SPEAKER_03]: But to, at one point, have one of them called the lone ranger and the other one, taunto, right?
44:30 --> 44:31 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, fair, yeah.
44:31 --> 44:33 [SPEAKER_03]: It's like, you didn't need to say that.
44:34 --> 44:36 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, we understand what's happening here.
44:37 --> 44:39 [SPEAKER_03]: You need to, you need to actually call the guy taunto.
44:39 --> 44:41 [SPEAKER_03]: You need to, you need to, you need to actually call the guy taunto.
44:45 --> 44:46 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a little much.
44:46 --> 44:47 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a little much.
44:48 --> 44:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Everything about Billy Dee Williams, he just such a pinnacle of my childhood.
44:54 --> 45:00 [SPEAKER_03]: For the amount of things that actually saw him in, he's just heroic in my memory.
45:01 --> 45:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Now you actually met Billy Dee Williams.
45:05 --> 45:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I did not have a picture with him, yes.
45:07 --> 45:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Tell me about that experience.
45:09 --> 45:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So I was doing a comedy festival in
45:16 --> 45:19 [SPEAKER_01]: had a day to kill and I was just looking to see what was up.
45:20 --> 45:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, and I saw that the Star Wars experience, like they didn't call it a convention or whatever, was going on over at Ananaheim.
45:27 --> 45:31 [SPEAKER_01]: So I took the journey, not knowing what I was getting myself into.
45:31 --> 45:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was so funny, like there's all these different things you can go to.
45:37 --> 45:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Good, all these different symposiums and lectures and cool things to look at.
45:42 --> 45:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was just stuck on the
45:45 --> 46:15 [SPEAKER_01]: like the showroom floor where everybody's in costume and like buying stuff I was there for I walked around for five straight hours because that was just the best for me and then I saw that oh yeah there's pictures you could get pictures and it was like the biggest deal was that Mark Hamill and Carrie Fisher were at the same thing for like I think like the first time like maybe like ever and it was it was huge you could your picture taken with both of them you know
46:15 --> 46:21 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, in McDermand was, you know, Palpatine and different folks, right?
46:22 --> 46:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm looking around and I saw that there was Billy D. Williams, and I'm like, well, I better run, because I'm sure that line's going to be massive.
46:29 --> 46:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And nothing like the other lines.
46:32 --> 46:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I was still lengthy, but man was I stoked.
46:35 --> 46:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And man, I was just, the, the, the, the people I was in line with, I mean,
46:46 --> 46:46 [SPEAKER_01]: prior to that.
46:48 --> 46:49 [SPEAKER_01]: But I have a pretty good idea.
46:49 --> 46:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And I kind of realized where I was.
46:53 --> 47:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's just like he's just sitting there and with his pink slacks, good lord, wearing pink slacks.
47:03 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_01]: And I've just looking at him going, man, this is.
47:08 --> 47:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Is this just this fun for you at all?
47:10 --> 47:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I mean, he's just hours of just sitting in a chair and then they bring somebody by
47:15 --> 47:17 [SPEAKER_01]: and then they stand next to him.
47:17 --> 47:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And then they bring somebody by and they stand next to him.
47:19 --> 47:26 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not really like, like, particularly interested in chat chats and you sleep.
47:26 --> 47:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know if he was waxed at first.
47:31 --> 47:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
47:45 --> 47:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And he starts chuckle in and the picture gets taken so we get a good good picture of me all happy and he's in like full mid chuckle.
47:52 --> 47:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man, I was so happy.
47:56 --> 47:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's the best.
47:57 --> 47:58 [SPEAKER_03]: That's wonderful.
47:58 --> 48:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Back to have that right now.
48:00 --> 48:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking out of the frame picture of it.
48:02 --> 48:08 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, you guys are both living the dream at the same time on much different sides of the spectrum, I guess.
48:09 --> 48:10 [SPEAKER_03]: True, true.
48:12 --> 48:15 [SPEAKER_03]: Is there a tweak that you'd make to this movie to improve it?
48:16 --> 48:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, flip the roles.
48:20 --> 48:21 [SPEAKER_01]: If Billy D Williams is your lead.
48:22 --> 48:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, there you go.
48:23 --> 48:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that makes a big difference because he's, and he can think about that.
48:27 --> 48:28 [SPEAKER_01]: He's your charismatic.
48:28 --> 48:29 [SPEAKER_01]: He's your artistic.
48:30 --> 48:30 [SPEAKER_04]: Mm-hmm.
48:30 --> 48:31 [SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't necessarily have to.
48:31 --> 48:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, necessarily have to have him in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in
48:43 --> 48:48 [SPEAKER_01]: He's the more, maybe the more, the more gritty and like he needs a little more nuance.
48:48 --> 49:06 [SPEAKER_01]: That character, like, you know, to thwart this terrorist and maybe he's the lone just wants to go out there and just, well, we just take Wolfgar out, but like the Billy D. Williams Matthew Fox is a little more slie like a fox, not slie like Stallone and he knows, you know, there's, there's more to Wolfgar than meets the eye.
49:06 --> 49:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Because that's the thing Stallone is like, like, I know this guy.
49:09 --> 49:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I know how he thinks.
49:10 --> 49:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Why?
49:10 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Why would you?
49:13 --> 49:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know if you know how you think.
49:17 --> 49:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I like that, I like that a lot.
49:19 --> 49:26 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if there's a tweak, but the writing in this movie is just horrific.
49:28 --> 49:30 [SPEAKER_01]: It'd rewrite it, that's a tweak.
49:31 --> 49:34 [SPEAKER_03]: Just one more editorial glance, that would be my tweak.
49:36 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Is there a tropically shared device that you liked in this movie?
49:44 --> 49:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I was really into, I mean, maybe entering from what's a trope.
49:49 --> 49:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I guess it's just an era, but like I did kind of fall in love with early 80s New York.
49:58 --> 50:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the squaller of early 80s New York City is almost, well, it is a trope, you know, it's been in so many movies.
50:07 --> 50:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And I also, and another trope, I like, and I don't, I'm wondering,
50:13 --> 50:18 [SPEAKER_01]: We see it so much now, but I wonder how a prevalent it was in 81.
50:18 --> 50:22 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the crowded nightclub search.
50:23 --> 50:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that was in a lot of movies.
50:25 --> 50:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it is now, but I wonder how much of it was then, too, right, and my trope.
50:30 --> 50:41 [SPEAKER_03]: So in Wolfgar has to meet Shaka for the first time, they, uh, they meet in a Catholic church confessional, uh, every time love it, every time.
50:41 --> 50:44 [SPEAKER_03]: And I always think like, is that the only thing that they use those things for?
50:46 --> 50:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, right.
50:46 --> 50:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Like who's who's actually confessing?
50:48 --> 50:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Like I think that those little booths are they're just for terrorists to have conversations.
50:58 --> 51:00 [SPEAKER_03]: See, if is this movie better?
51:00 --> 51:02 [SPEAKER_03]: We're so on par with their Ron Howard movie.
51:02 --> 51:04 [SPEAKER_03]: It's about a Ron Howard minus five.
51:05 --> 51:06 [SPEAKER_03]: It's pretty close.
51:06 --> 51:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I quite enjoy this movie.
51:09 --> 51:13 [SPEAKER_01]: right, but not because of how well presented it was.
51:14 --> 51:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Like you said, cinematography was pretty decent at times.
51:19 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_03]: The music is all over the place, but I really enjoyed it.
51:23 --> 51:29 [SPEAKER_03]: It was just kind of fun to be in almost 1970s New York.
51:30 --> 51:32 [SPEAKER_03]: I like Stallone's leather jacket.
51:32 --> 51:37 [SPEAKER_03]: Like he's got that
51:37 --> 51:44 [SPEAKER_03]: He's almost got like a nut-brown leather jacket, but it's in the shape of like a sport jacket.
51:46 --> 51:52 [SPEAKER_03]: And so he's wearing the sweater vest and the collar underneath, which I prefer that look.
51:52 --> 51:56 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I'm just wondering, do I need a letter?
51:56 --> 51:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, would it be weird if I wore a leather jacket like that?
52:01 --> 52:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I think you need to fold the full on some.
52:06 --> 52:08 [SPEAKER_03]: I also need to wear the boots with lifts as well.
52:10 --> 52:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and you know, I have a wig and a dress on them.
52:14 --> 52:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, that goes without saying that I'm also going to have that to put on over whatever I'm wearing.
52:21 --> 52:47 [SPEAKER_03]: How'd you like the Superman sweater that that billy deal with her love it love it fantastic right fantastic what what a great touch What a great touch so yeah, I'm going to say run Howard minus four on this one Is there a half the battle one to go on move moment in this movie Um If you're going to shave your legs, maybe shave your beard
52:51 --> 52:52 [SPEAKER_03]: I do like slay with the beard though.
52:54 --> 52:55 [SPEAKER_03]: That's my favorite still on.
52:57 --> 52:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, beard is still on.
52:58 --> 52:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty good.
53:00 --> 53:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, look, I mean, that was good beard.
53:01 --> 53:02 [SPEAKER_01]: This is very, very good beard.
53:03 --> 53:05 [SPEAKER_03]: That's why he doesn't want to shave it.
53:05 --> 53:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Just give me a mask that covers the up the beard.
53:09 --> 53:20 [SPEAKER_01]: The only more impressive beard, first alone in this movie, was Lindsay Wagner.
53:26 --> 53:28 [UNKNOWN]: Thank you.
54:27 --> 54:30 [SPEAKER_01]: But she might spend the day I can't walk again.
54:30 --> 54:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm home.
54:34 --> 54:35 [SPEAKER_02]: In a cocoon of horror.