Invincible - S03E01-3 - "You're Not Laughing Now," "A Deal With the Devil," "You Want a Real Costume, Right?"

[00:00:05] Hey everyone, David here. Severance is back. The Lorehounds are partnering with Properly Howard to bring you in-depth weekly coverage of Season 2. Join me, John, Anthony, and Steve as we unpack every twist, theory, and revelation. We've created a dedicated feed just for our Severance coverage. Simply search for Severance Lorehounds in your podcast app or find the direct link to Severance Lorehounds.

[00:00:35] in our link tree. Our weekly episodes dig deep into the show's mysteries, themes, and bigger questions about identity and consciousness that make Severance so compelling. Season Pass and regular community subscribers get ad-free access to our weekly episodes, plus exclusive content like our Supply Closet bonus series featuring fascinating conversations with experts like the team from Nevermind the Music. We've explored the neuroscience of memories and the

[00:01:05] memory and personality decoded the hidden meanings in the show's musical themes. And there's much more to come. You'll also get Steve and Anthony's complete Season 1 rewatch series. We believe in total transparency with our listeners. And unlike Mammalians Nurturable, we're happy to share all of our secrets.

[00:01:28] Find the link for Severance Lorehounds.com. Find the link for Severance Lorehounds.com. Find the link for the Severance feed in the show notes below, or search Severance Lorehounds wherever you get your podcasts. Come theorize with us about what's really happening at Lumen.

[00:01:40] Back to the Radioactive Ramblings podcast. The show where three buddies get together and ramble about our favorite shows. Sorry. Sorry. Fuck.

[00:02:40] Why are you such a hater, Chase? Come on. Can we keep that in? Can we keep that in? The podcast where three buddies get together to ramble about our favorite shows, movies, and struggle to stay on topic. I'm one of your hosts, Aaron. And I am another one of the hosts, Chase. And last and certainly least, I'm Richard, the other host. Listen, today's an American holiday, Super Bowl Sunday. Don't sell yourself short. Shut the fuck up.

[00:03:07] Whoa, no, no, no, no, no, no. It's not an American holiday because of that. It's an American holiday because the Chiefs got put down. They deserved it. You sound like an Eagles fan right now. I'm not even an Eagles fan. You know I'm just a diehard Bills fan, and the Chiefs are like our mortal enemies. In some ways. But before we get into the topic of today's episode, I'm going to share a little bit about our Patreon.

[00:03:32] We're going to be releasing early and ad-free content to all of our Patreon subscribers. We've already been doing that with most of our episodes. We've been doing that with Red Rising. They've been coming out a few days early. So if you would like to have some early access, just scoot on over to the Patreon, and we've got something for you. There's a few tiers. We really want to make it worth your while, so we're going to have some extra bonus episodes coming out pretty soon. So stay tuned. All right.

[00:04:01] And for today's episode, the topic will be Invincible Season 3, Episodes 1 through 3. Wait, I thought we were covering Studio Ghibli's film. Shut the fuck up. You stupid idiot. You stupid idiot. Dude, I just watched the movie. I haven't watched Invincible yet. Dude, I just watched the movie. Dude. Dude, I didn't watch Invincible.

[00:04:28] Sorry, I'm talking about that movie that Aaron hates because he's full of hatred and deceit. Meanwhile, me and Chase, we're filled with joy and whimsy. Okay, whimsy. Get on to your next... Yeah, I'm getting on my spiel. Talking time. Okay, okay. I'm going on my spiel about contacting us. I'm sorry. We have a slew of ways to contact us, and the first of which is our email, radioactive at thelorehounds.com.

[00:04:54] Of course, we have a channel set up for radioactive ramblings in the Lorehounds Discord server. You can send us a message, chat about the show, tell Aaron to stop hating on Princess Mononoke. We have a contact form, and you can leave us a voicemail or just a message on that, and that's at thelorehounds.com. And consider giving us a follow on Blue Sky. I mean, we really just post when a new episode is up. And we like to chat around in the Lorehounds community on that, and that's Radioactive 141.

[00:05:22] And we'd appreciate a rating on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Audible, or wherever else you listen to us. It helps other listeners like you find us. Oh, and also, there's a way to subscribe to us for free on Patreon, which also will help you keep up to date with our posts, by the way. Very true. Thank you, Chase. Chase, I see that you've put together a wonderful little recap of all of these episodes. Do you want to get into that? Are we splitting this up, or are you just going kind of crazy on this one?

[00:05:51] I was thinking I could go ham, but if you want to split it up per paragraph, because each paragraph is one episode. Listen, as a wise man once said, this is your rodeo. Chase, what do you want us to do? All you, big man. I mean, I would like you to, like, wire me $500 each, but I don't know if that's happening. Oh, okay. Well, I would like to not have to do that. I'm just a little bit pissed because the two of you still owe me for all of the cuts that I've been making.

[00:06:19] It's $80 per marker that I have to put into these podcasts, and no one has paid up yet. Okay, to be fair, that's more me than it is Chase. So, like, leave him alone. You owe me $8,000. I think I owe you way more than that. Yeah, honestly, I would say upward more than $100 at least. I mean, I think every time I go on a completely different tangent about the Stormlight Archive, Aaron just- Well, like, right now we're cutting everything. Yeah.

[00:06:45] Well, as soon as I say the words the Stormlight Archive, Aaron just markers that shit instantly. It's like Pavlovian dog. Yeah. Nothing Brandon Sanderson related makes it into the final cut of the podcast. We'll get into the recap of the episodes. The season starts off three months after Mark's confrontation with Ingstrom Levy, where Mark

[00:07:09] starts training under Cecil from the GDA, where he increases his physical performance greatly. He partners with Rexplode to then stop the theft of the Declaration of Independence by Dropkick and Fightmaster with their awesome little scooter. Right.

[00:07:32] During this, Multipol pulls up and almost kills Rex because he thinks it's Rex's fault that Kate died, but then it's revealed to not us, because we actually already knew this from last season, but the characters of the show that Kate is actually still alive. She stops Multipol's rampage, or I guess she kind of halts everything because Invincible was

[00:08:00] about to kill him. Go ham? Yeah. But yeah, we get that. And then after that, we get the dock seismic battle because he's escaped from confinement and kidnaps all of the superheroes in America besides Eve and Mark using his underground friends. And Mark and Eve try to save them, but get their butts kicked.

[00:08:26] So Cecil is forced into using his newly reformed friends, Darkwing and the Rhiannamen. And what was that scientist's name again? It was... Doc Sinclair, I think. Yeah, Sinclair. I knew Sinclair. D.A. Sinclair. D.A. Sinclair's Rhiannamen to defeat Seismic. And because of this, Mark has an issue with Cecil for obvious reasons.

[00:08:53] The use of Darkwing and Sinclair, who were like crazy supervillains at one point. Or like, Darkwing wasn't a supervillain, but... But he killed a lot of people. Yeah, he killed a lot, a lot of people. Yeah. All right. And then in the next episode, Cecil... Oh, I thought we were... It's my rodeo. Oh, it is your rodeo. Okay, sorry. Hello? I'm sorry. Do you have anything to say about this insolence?

[00:09:23] I kind of already said that it was your rodeo, and I feel like this blatant disrespect is just... It's everything that's wrong with America today. Yeah, you're gonna have to... Oh, okay. You're gonna have to make up for this. Ten years and lines. Wow. No, send him out to clean. All right.

[00:09:46] The next episode, Cecil reflects on his journey to becoming the GDA's director, where we get his backstory, almost. Which draws parallels between his past decisions and Mark's current moral dilemmas over the use of DA Sinclair in Darkwing. Obviously, tensions escalate when Mark discovers the GDA's use of Rihanna Men and confronts Cecil.

[00:10:10] In response, Cecil uses a device he implanted in Mark's head to emit a sound wave that causes him extremely intense pain and throws off his balance. Yeah, and I think he, like, can't fly because of it, too. Yeah. Which leads to Mark basically cutting ties with Cecil in the GDA and causes also a huge split between the Guardians of the Globe because Mark seeks out their help.

[00:10:39] And I would say a little more than half of them decide to side with Mark and cut ties with the GDA. And during this episode, Mark and Eve grow closer and decide to be in a relationship. And then in our final episode we will be talking about today, Eve moves back in with her parents where she sets some boundaries about her powers with them. And kind of mends her relationship with her father a little bit.

[00:11:06] Then Debbie begins a relationship with Paul, one of her colleagues, and kind of gives up her family's identity to him. Which causes Mark to have, I would say, like a minor disagreement with her that gets mended later on. Then Oliver, Mark's younger brother, get new costumes. And even though Mark tells Oliver not to use the name Kid Omni-Man due to their father's history, Oliver still chooses that.

[00:11:34] Together, Mark and Oliver stop a prison break. Even though Mark didn't want Oliver to act, he did. And later, Mark goes to stop the Mahler twins from launching a missile. But Oliver pulls up and kills the Mahler twins. Which causes a huge argument with Mark.

[00:11:58] And kind of shows that there's still a lot of things in Oliver's upbringing that needs to be ironed out. And the three episodes concludes with Mark noticing one of Engstrom Levy's surveillance drones watching them. But yeah, that's our recap. That is our recap. Can I say something kind of crazy? Sure. What do you got? I think Cecil is completely justified in everything that he does.

[00:12:26] Okay, I was gonna say this later in the episode, but let's fucking get it out now. Oh yeah. I think that Cecil was right to have suspicion against Mark, right? And obviously also right to want to have a failsafe considering... I mean like, obviously we've seen Mark put his life on the line again and again. He's fought two overwhelming forces that he knows he was not strong enough to take, but did it anyways, right?

[00:12:54] Against obviously his dad in season one and then in season two against Anissa. Where they literally told him, they're like, Mark, there's like an 80% chance you fucking get clapped up and die instant, right? Yeah. And he still did it. And he couldn't even lie and say that he wouldn't protect the earth. Which is like, I understand the needing for Cecil to prepare to fight against any possibility, right? But I think the way he presented it was wrong.

[00:13:23] When Mark pulled up to the GDA to speak to Cecil, instead of Cecil like immediately bringing him into the white room and threatening Mark and being like, hey, this is how it's gonna be. I think if he had like a real talk to Mark about it and a talk about rehabilitation instead of just being like, nah, they're fine now. What I say goes. I think it would have been different. Yeah, I'm with you.

[00:13:45] Especially because Cecil, I mean, we see this in the flashbacks that Cecil came from kind of a similar place that Mark was in where he had no respect for these people who were going through rehabilitation. He didn't see the value in rehabilitating anyone. He was very much same mindset that we see Mark in now. And he doesn't even attempt to explain it to Mark.

[00:14:09] It's really, it's really odd to me that he doesn't put in a little bit more effort to draw Mark into his point of view because he has experience as the person on the other end of that conversation. Yeah, I mean, I just think that we've, this is kind of part of Cecil's character is like he just expects people to obey him. Right. That's very true.

[00:14:30] Yeah, it reminds me a lot of the, I know in like some of the Batman's, most of the Batman's storylines, he's got like contingencies for the Justice League in case they go rogue. Cecil reminds me of that for sure, but I don't know. I feel like Cecil does do some shadier shit when it comes to that. I will say that the only thing Cecil was doing that I was a little conflicted on, D.A. Sinclair.

[00:14:54] It's a little tough to get past everything that we know he did because it goes beyond murder. He was fully torturing people and like replacing their body parts. It feels like a step further than murder in my mind. So I don't know. It was a, it was a tough one for me to reckon with for sure. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. I think like Darkwing definitely can be rehabilitated.

[00:15:20] I mean like he just went, like the story is he literally just went crazy from fighting so much crime on basically his own. But like Sinclair was, I feel like that is like another story, like he just needs to be in prison. Yeah. Also, he's still creating monstrosities. Like did you see the Rhiannon? Those are not. Yeah, no, yeah. No, those aren't creatures, dude.

[00:15:44] Uh, speaking of the Rhiannon and that whole D.A. Sinclair storyline, I thought it was a little bit fucked up that Mark told Rick, right? That's his name, Rick? Yeah, Rick. I thought it was a little fucked up that Mark told Rick that. It felt a little self-centered on Mark's part. I don't think that Rick needed to know that D.A. Sinclair is like free. That, I feel like that just causes more problems than it solves. Yeah, I don't know where I stand on that, honestly.

[00:16:12] I'm a little bit more, honestly, this is like one of the few decisions that Mark made that I'm a little more on his side because I will say like, I guess Rick does deserve to know what's actually going on with the guy that fucked him up. But maybe Mark could have delivered the news better. I guess if I had to think about it, think about someone who's been like attacked by someone, right? Wouldn't you want to know the truth if they're like out there or not? Yeah, I guess that's a good point.

[00:16:42] Think about how he would feel if Mark never told him and then randomly he just found out that Sinclair is still on the loose. And then like it turned out that Mark knew the whole time. Yeah, he would feel super betrayed and it would probably cause like a huge rift between like him and William or Mark and William, I mean. Yeah. All right. I retract my statement. I was wrong.

[00:17:04] Because like I understand your point of view too, where it's like in the way that it's presented in the show, it like feels like the whole Sinclair thing is like obviously under wraps. Sinclair is free, but not free because he's probably like stuck in the lab, right? Or not the lab, but wherever Cecil has him. Right. But the offshoot chance that he's not in the lab at all times and actually is able to just roam free under Cecil's surveillance. I feel like he has the right to know about that. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:17:32] I guess when you put it like that, I can definitely see your point of view. I think you've swayed me. You've gotten me. Yeah. They say I have a way with words. A wordsmith. Right. What are some other like hot-ish takes we want to talk about? You guys have anything? I don't know. Some of Mark's hypocrisy this season. I know Aaron was texting me about it. I don't even know if this really is a hot take.

[00:18:01] I haven't been like active in the Invincible community, I guess. But I think that a lot of like Mark, the way he's handling Oliver, where he's telling him to stay back all the time. I get the idea behind it. But he was I mean, he was the exact same when he got his powers in season one. And I get that he learned through experience. But I feel like he's being a lot more rough before the Mahler thing. Yeah.

[00:18:31] But Mark was also a 17 year old. I feel like the difference between a 17 year old and Oliver, who's genuinely like four months old. But let's let's not even go there. Let's let's pretend that he's like actually human age. Like, what is he like? Eight? Ten? I think he's like 10 or 12. I would say he's like 10 or 11. Yeah. 10 or 12. Like still somewhere in that range. That's kind of crazy. Different. Like, yeah, no, I'm with you for sure. But he is still very hard on him. And I understand the reasoning.

[00:19:01] It's just that Mark was very much like he wanted to get right up into it until he made his mistakes. And sometimes that's the best thing that you can do is let them make their mistakes. Obviously, like if he's in danger, save his ass. But I mean, we've seen Oliver make his mistake and it doesn't seem like he's very remorseful for it. Yeah. He just lacks that emotional maturity that that Mark had at the age that he got his powers. It's just that is true.

[00:19:30] I do want to talk about that. And Aaron, I'm sorry that you don't. You're not going to get the the parallel I'm drawing here. But going from Hunter Hunter, in my opinion, is very similar. It's a very similar trope where it's like a kid who's being for, you know, he's he's from the viewpoint of a kid and very like black and white, good and evil, all that. And getting into more like complex moral situations. Like, yes, the Maulers are bad.

[00:20:00] But you don't have to just fucking murder them, especially that brutally. And on top of that, like killing the first one was an accident, I guess. I'm willing to accept that it was an accident. The second one, however, was begging for his life. Yeah. And Oliver fucking uppercut his head off. That was too far. I mean, they were both too far, but that was clearly not an accident.

[00:20:30] I guess the apple doesn't fall from the tree. Oh, my God. No, I like Oliver a lot as a character. I think that it's going to be interesting to see how they try to raise him in this really strange and fucked up situation where he's like four months old, but has the intelligence of a 12 year old and the body of a 12 year old, but still has. I think he's older than four months.

[00:21:00] Really? It's been like three months since Mark came back to Earth, hasn't it been? Well, yeah, but since his confrontation with things from Levi. Okay. Okay. Well, it took like two months to get back from Thraxa, I thought was the thing, right? I thought it was just a few weeks. On the high end, he's like six months old, right? I think he's like somewhere between six and eight. I thought that. But I could be wrong, but I thought that's around how old he was.

[00:21:29] Either way, it doesn't really matter that much. True. The emotional intelligence of a less than a year old person, despite having the intelligence and the strength of a Viltrumite, that's kind of insane. You can't really expect that kid to know what to do with his powers, but at the same time, how do you control someone like that? And he's clearly a lot stronger than Mark was when he got his powers. I think he's stronger than Mark is now. No, he's not. I mean, you saw him.

[00:21:59] He was like almost faster. No, Mark holds back too much. And Mark doesn't, from what I can gauge, it seems like Mark is a lot stronger when he lets his emotions kind of loose. Yeah. And I think he does a fantastic job putting a stopper on that to kind of limit himself. But he needs to stop doing that. And I feel like that's what this season is going to be about for him.

[00:22:28] Is it going to be about him learning more how to utilize his powers, especially with the comeback of Angstrom Levy? I feel like I know some things, and I know you know some things, Chase, that are going to happen. Yeah, I know probably like 90% of what's going to happen this season, since they are doing some things a little different from the comics. Yeah. Should be interesting, though, to see. I'm excited.

[00:22:56] I really liked the resolution between Mark and Debbie when they had their little fight about her telling Paul pretty much everything. Yeah. It was a very mature moment. Yeah, exactly. I thought that it was a great moment for the two of them. And they're essentially raising this kid together, so they're kind of like the parents in the household. So seeing them come to that understanding, it was a nice moment.

[00:23:24] I always have loved Debbie and Mark's relationship. I think that it's a really great mother-son dynamic. So all Debbie love on this podcast. Oh, for sure. Debbie, I mean, I feel like we were all about Debbie love when we were talking about the finale of last season. Because, I mean, she went through it in that last episode. The ghost Debbie. Dude, she comes back every time.

[00:23:52] Her whole thing, they very much framed it in last season with the scene where it's like Omni-Man's floating around in space. And she's kind of walking through the city. They very much framed it when she was standing over the bridge like she wanted to fucking jump off. And taking a step away from that and persevering. Debbie is the invincible. That's all I wanted to highlight before we continue.

[00:24:20] She's such a genuinely good person. Taking in her abusive... Emotionally abusive. Until the very end. But yeah, abusive ex-husband's child. She really is just a good-hearted person. Bro thinks he misses his wife. I... He did say that. I have a tough time having any sympathy for Omni-Man. I don't have really sympathy, but I like where his arc is headed.

[00:24:51] Him and Alan have had a kind of fun dynamic in the prison. Chase, since we're on the topic of Alan and Omni-Man, do you want to tell us a little bit about what you thought about that? I think Alan is an interesting vessel into deliver us Omni-Man's humanization, you know?

[00:25:11] Like the overly friendly alien Alan getting under Omni-Man's skin and getting him to try and shift him towards the cause of justice and fighting against the Viltrumite takeover. Yeah. And then of course there's the part where they have him strapped to the giant-ass laser and it doesn't do shit to him. Because Alan's the fucking goat, bro. Well, it's like Zenkai logic, right? From Dragon Ball? For Alan, yes. Yeah.

[00:25:43] Basically, if he can survive a fight, he will become stronger after. Yeah. Alan's pretty cool. I mean, we had a little bit of a hint to that too, right? When Nolan tells him that he thinks he got stronger. Not even a hint at all. We saw like last season Thaddeus or... Thaddeus? Yeah, Thaddeus. Thaddeus was like, Alan, like, I'm sorry I gambled with your life, but this is the only way that we can like combat the Viltrumites.

[00:26:13] And then Alan got punched like full force in the face and just like ate it like it was nothing. Yeah, he... And those are the same Viltrumites that jumped him and almost killed him. Torned shreds, basically. I think it's like the closer he gets to death too, the more like power he gets out of it, right? Yeah. Or at least that's what it seems to be.

[00:26:36] Yeah, it's like the more damage inflicted on him is like the greater strength he gets after. Damn. I bet he's in for some crazy strength training, even though he seems like he's up there, I'm sure with... He's already like, as Nolan slash Omni-Man has told us, like he's already most definitely strong enough to take out a Viltrumite. Yeah.

[00:27:03] I'm wondering if he can get even stronger, though, and start taking out squads of them at a time. Because obviously he's strong, but they're definitely more skilled fighters just based on how long they live and their society. I feel like it's... There's so much more bred for combat. Well, you know who's bred for combat? Kid Omni-Man. Yeah? How's that, Aaron? How is he bred for combat? What did he do?

[00:27:29] He's like eight months old and he's running through the maulers like they don't even exist. Those two were just meat sacks in that kid's way. He can't... No one can stand against that kid. He's bred for war. It was a shock. My jaw was on the ground. And as soon as that happened, I texted you and I was like, dude, you need to get on Invincible season three. And then, of course, the other night you texted me while I was at work.

[00:27:55] Like, oh my god, Oliver just ran through the one mauler twin. Dude, I'm not gonna lie. My greedy butt watched all three episodes at 3 a.m. on February 6th when they aired. God damn. I watched three or I watched two of them when I woke up that day. Because, you know, I was hoping it was a midnight release. So, like, I got home from work. I showered. I made food. And then I checked Amazon.

[00:28:25] And I was heartbroken to find out it was a 3 a.m. release. So I just woke up. And then you had to sit there watching the 182nd episode of The Walking Dead. What? No. I watched an episode of Dexter because I'm on that Dexter grind. Of course you are. Real talk, what are we gonna cover the Walking Dead spinoffs on this? We're not, dude. You don't want to talk about the Daryl Dixie show? No. No, I don't want to talk about Fualiandu.

[00:28:55] Wow. What even is, like, what is the state of The Walking Dead right now? I'm so confused. It would take me about an hour to explain the state of The Walking Dead to you. Oh, my God. It's honestly the most ridiculous shit ever. And I can't stop watching. He's explained it to me and it feels like I'm, like, in a fever dream every time he tells it to me. They've got some kid now who's, like... Jesus, right? Like, Jesus.

[00:29:23] Yeah, they've got a French kid who's, like, Jesus. Okay, anyways, we're getting off topic. I kind of wanted to talk about Mark and Eve a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. I've got some thoughts on this. I feel like, as someone who read the comics after season one of Invincible, I feel like even in season one we saw this relationship coming.

[00:29:51] Yeah, it was definitely, like, the stars were aligned and then Amber was there. No offense to Amber. I liked her as a character. I know a lot of people didn't like her. But, you know. I mean, in fairness to Mark and Amber, too, I mean, Eve was with Rex before Mark was with Amber, you know? Yeah. Oh, yeah, true. Things just didn't work out on both sides for the two of them. And now they are. Yeah.

[00:30:20] I do want to circle back to Rex after this. Yeah, and they're... I don't know. We excited to see what the future holds for the new power couple? I felt like Mark telling Eve about the future Eve was so dumb. I was like, why? He fumbled that so much. Top ten cringe moments. I feel like if, you know, that's the kind of bomb that you drop on someone after, like, you've built some...

[00:30:48] That's, like, two years into the relationship or something like that. Like, you don't pop that on, like, asking her out. Because then she's like, well, now you're only asking me out because, like, you think in your head I'm, like, a sure shot. Like, you think it's, like, you think I'm in love with you. Yeah. Yeah. I... Top ten cringe moments for sure. Mark, dumbass. And, like, I get where he's coming from, where he's trying to be, like, honest with her.

[00:31:14] Because there were times where he wasn't honest with Amber and that caused, obviously, a lot of issues for them. Yeah. But at the same time, it's, like, kind of what William said. There's honest and too honest. And it's, like, it's not even, like, you're being dishonest not telling her that. Like, because that's not really your motivation for asking her, right? Like, it's, like, obviously that, like, helped you push you in the right direction. But, like, the reason you're asking her out is because you genuinely like her and you shouldn't...

[00:31:43] Knowing someone likes you back be the reason that, like, you're asking her out. You make a move. Yeah. Yeah. I do like the way that he saved it. I think it was a great moment for him and a great moment of, like, emotional maturity when he said, like, as he was getting... You know, he thought he was gonna die to the Rihannaman. And he, all he could think about is not being able to, like, talk to her or see her one last time. And I think that that obviously... No, he's just a smooth criminal. He was capping.

[00:32:13] He was not capping. Shut up. Mark would never... He clutched up with that one for real, though. Yeah, I thought it was a little corny. I'm not gonna lie, but... I... We'll let it slide. I feel like, like, lovey-dovey shit is always a bit corny. But, like, the thing is, it's not like he's saying that to someone who's... His long-term committed girlfriend. He said that to his, like, obviously close friend who, like, they clearly have feelings for each other. I just thought it was a little crazy to be like, it's not you, my mom or Oliver I saw.

[00:32:43] It was you. Like, I thought that was a little much. That's what I thought was crazy is that he didn't bring up his mom or Oliver. I was like, what? That's what I'm saying is, like, if he said that to Eve and they'd been dating for, like, six months or something, I would have been like, oh, that's sweet, I guess. They hadn't even been dating. This is, like... Yeah, this is post-failed asking her out. I felt like it was a little, like, bro chill. Calm down. Can we circle back to Rex for a moment?

[00:33:11] Rex, you mean character development-splode? Dude, he's so goaded now. I love redemption arcs. Obviously, I know I yap about every redemption character ever. Like, I wouldn't shut up about A-Train. I probably won't shut up about the Omni-Man redemption if we get it. I probably... I know I won't shut up about Cassius for Red Rising. Like, those are all definites. And Rex's redemption is truly amazing. Yeah.

[00:33:40] Can't argue with the facts and logic. I know, right? I have been enjoying his character a lot this season, which I never thought... When I first started watching the show, I never thought it was a possibility for me to enjoy that character. Yeah, they do such a great job making him an annoying little shit. Like, the first two seasons. And now he's, like... Like, he's still... Obviously, like, the old hymn still slips in here and there.

[00:34:06] But it's, like, comedic relief hymn, not, like, oh, I'm, like, a piece of shit that doesn't give a fuck about my girlfriend hymn. When the joke goes a little too far, he even, like, apologizes and says he's trying to do better. And I feel like we're seeing that for sure. I mean, I loved in episode one when he was trying to wingman for Mark and Eve. Or not wingman, but, like, trying to, like, push Mark in that direction. He's like, dude, I know what's going on between you two. Just make it happen.

[00:34:35] I liked, too, when the last season, when he was, like, talking Mark through fixing things with Amber. And we had, like, the split scene of it being Eve and Amber. Oh, and last season when Rex was, like, helping Eve, too. When she was, like, going through some shit with her family. Yeah. And Rex was there for her. No, everything after his, like, near-death experience. I mean, obviously that changes the person. Yeah, he's been a chiller. Yeah. He just needed a little lobotomy.

[00:35:06] I swear to God, if anything happens to Rexplode, I'm burning down Amazon. Dude, I almost burnt down Amazon when I had to fucking sit through five ads per episode, okay? Five unskippable ads per episode is blaspheming activity right there, dude. What the heck was that? Can we talk about that for a little bit? Like, dude. I don't know. I feel like it was coming.

[00:35:31] I wrote a rage-filled message in the Discord being, like, love the episodes, but sitting through the ads genuinely made me so mad. Yeah. Because the ads weren't long. It's the problem is that they're, like, every, like, ten minutes throughout the episode. Yeah. If they just made me sit through two minutes of ads in the beginning, I would be, like, whatever. Yeah. I like those because I can go, like, get a drink, get a snack, like, get situated.

[00:35:58] Or, like, look at my phone for a minute or something. I don't know. Like, not have to be, like, I'm in the middle of watching this, like, peak content and then, like, there's 15 seconds of Charmin Ultrasoft on my screen or something. Yeah. Like, I'm about to watch one of the Mahler twins get turned into a donut and then add. And then it's, like, do you have, like, mesothelioma lymphoma or something? And it's, like, no, I don't. And I want to see the Mahler twin lose his head. Yeah.

[00:36:27] And then as soon as it pops back, Oliver's coming out the other side. One character who has genuinely been taking me off this season is Duplicate Rex. Oh, totally. Duplicate arguing with Shrink Ray and Rex about their near-death experience, like, hers is anything in comparison, pissed me the hell off. She has her copy that was safe. It is totally valid to be, like, yes, I've technically experienced death, like, this many times. Like, I hold that memory.

[00:36:56] At the same time, it's, like, experiencing death for you is not the same because it's not the end. Yeah. And it's not you, necessarily. When she came back, you see the one on her chest because she's still not there. It's not the last one. Well, she's never actually experienced death. Yes, exactly. She's never experienced death or the fear of truly dying, at least in what we've seen of her. So it pisses me off so much when she tries to condescend to people. And it's like... They only have one life.

[00:37:26] Like, shut up. You almost died. I haven't seen how many times I've actually died. And it's like, dude, can we... Are you done? Also, fuck the immortal. How much of a bum do you have to be to be thousands of years old and you can't win a fight ever? Oh my god. Sorry. Dude, I keep seeing posts of people being like, I swear the immortal gets weaker every episode or something. Or like, immortal in bed telling Mark off.

[00:37:56] Like... And the immortal told Mark to fuck off in his bed at night. Like... Oh. No, but Duplicate was on my nerves every second she was on screen. Bro, I'm not gonna lie. Mark versus like the multipalls and then the Rihanna man horde. Oh my god. And I love the parallels between like... Obviously, we gotta talk about the parallel in the Guardians of the Globe.

[00:38:23] Yeah, the way he killed the Rihanna man was the same way that Omni-Man killed the Guardians of the Globe. Yeah, except there were more of them. And it was just so... So brutal. Like, oh my god. I didn't notice that. Yeah. The only one that's not the same might be the fish guy. Whatever the fuck his name was. I don't remember one. I just remember, I saw like the one where he ripped the dude in half and then the one where he like squished the dude's head.

[00:38:53] And I was like, isn't that how he killed the Rihanna? Wait, yeah. No, it is all the same actually. Now that I'm... Yeah. Holy fuck. I didn't realize it was like the exact same methods used. But that's actually really cool. I just meant like the aftermath looked the same. In terms of like the blood splatter. But cool detail. In the second episode, I think it was. I loved the Cecil backstory that we got.

[00:39:18] The whole story of him going to the prison and essentially becoming the leader of this whole group of rehabilitated superheroes and supervillains and whatnot. I thought that that was so cool. And it gave a lot of insight into how that character got where he is now. So, yeah. I liked, while we're talking about stuff like that, I really liked the start of episode three with the two criminals and then they try to make ends meet the normal way.

[00:39:48] Oh my god. It was really nice. That shit was so goaded, bro. I loved that. It was like a beautiful sequence and I like the symbolism of the flower growing. I was convinced that my headphones were broken for the first two minutes of the episode. Yeah, me too. Me too. Well, I turned my speakers up to like full and then as soon as the sound kicked back in, like I didn't even remember to turn them back down. So, I just got blasted for a second.

[00:40:16] It was just like Mark when Cecil used that little neck bomb. But no, that was such a good sequence and I enjoyed it a lot. Yeah, me too. I actually really liked it. Do we have... Oh, the new suit. Thoughts. I don't like it. I mean, really? I like it. Get out. The new suit is fire. It's a little too malicious looking. It reminds me of Mr. Incredible. Really? It reminds me... I feel like it's like his black suit. Like his Venom suit.

[00:40:45] Feels like he's trying to be Batman right now. It reminds me of like the OG Mr. Incredible suit, which is like one of my favorite superhero suits ever. Oh, okay. I thought... I was confused because when you said Mr. Incredible, I think of like the red. But yeah. No, I was talking about like when he was in his prime. Yeah, I like to think that that's a homage in that case. Like, come on. It's got to be something like that. Maybe.

[00:41:14] To one of the goaded childhood superhero movies. But yeah. I like the new suit. I think it's definitely fitting for what choices he's making. When do we think Mark is going to get with the program and kind of come back to the Guardians? I don't think he's going through this season. Part of the Guardians. The GDA. Yeah. We'll go with. Yeah, he was working. I don't think Mark is coming back to the GDA. I think they're going to split off and it's going to be the group.

[00:41:42] Like, you know, in the old teen team base, it's going to be them. And then it's going to be the Guardians. I'd assume like when the Viltrum Empire sends crazier shit, obviously there's going to have to be some unification. Even if Mark doesn't like it and Cecil doesn't like it, they're going to have to join forces to deal with some of the crazy shit. I know some of the crazy shit. I'm excited for the crazy shit, but I don't know like how the Earth side deals with it.

[00:42:10] I just know that it happens. So far, I've been greatly enjoying the episodes. In all honesty, I do have some gripes about the quality of the art considering how long it takes them to get these episodes to us. However, the story and characters are still very compelling and definitely do a good job of keeping me engaged. I really do like the moral dilemma we were presented with in the first set of episodes.

[00:42:34] Out of what we've seen from Invincible, though, I'd probably be giving this grouping of episodes a lower grade than its colleagues, considering some of the quality issues. So definitely a 7.3 out of 10 for me. The quality issues, there's actually, I've seen a ton of clips. And while I was watching, I noticed too, there's just like PNGs that were not sized correctly. And it's just a ton of stuff.

[00:43:01] It's a little weird considering it took them like, what, a whole year? Or not a whole year, right? It's been honestly not long since the last season. Yeah, they finished up in March, I think, of last year. Oh no, what it was is they did all of these and last season's episodes together, I believe, which was like two years after the first season or something like that. Oh, I don't know.

[00:43:30] I don't know about the development cycle. Just a little interesting. I mean, I don't think it's a problem with the artists or anything. It's definitely like a problem with Amazon's funding. Yeah, it's how they work their people. That's always the problem with a lot of animation, I feel like. And I will say, on the quality, I agree with you, there have been some noticeable issues.

[00:43:55] My biggest thing though, too, is I try to remember that I've also been spoiled by a lot of shows with insane animation. I mean, I feel like a lot of the anime that we all watch. I feel like, at this point, it's backed by Amazon, right? Like, Amazon's bigger than any anime company we've ever enjoyed a show or movie from. It has so many eyes on it. I think that, like, I don't know.

[00:44:22] Like, I feel like just, like, because the style of it, I enjoy the style of animation for this show, actually. Even though it's, like, more simple, I like it. And I think that, I don't think it's fair to give Amazon an out here just because we enjoy shows with a lot more intensive animation. Fair enough. I can see where you're coming from. I will say the Invincible animation. I like how comic book-y it is.

[00:44:51] No, yeah, that's why I like it a lot because it feels like I'm reading the comic, you know? Well, yeah, like, every panel I see, I mean, obviously in some of them there's, like, some more details with the gory bits. Maybe here and there there's a few panels that are a little bit more detailed, but for the most part it looks pretty one-to-one. Mmm, kind of. There's a lot of differences, I would say, but I feel like it's as one-to-one as you're gonna get with a comic and a show. Well, yeah.

[00:45:18] I think that the season is about to ramp up and get really good, but I do think that there is a few things that felt a little rushed. Kind of like, just maybe like Cecil's decision-making and argument with Mark felt a little rushed, and Mark and Eve felt a little rushed. Right. But I think the rest of the season is probably gonna iron out very well. I think, and I think Aaron, you agree with me on this one.

[00:45:45] And honestly, I think we probably all agree on this point, but Mark is being a bit short-sighted and hypocritical. I know I said that earlier, so I'm not gonna, like, expand upon that too much. But his views on reform are really hypocritical. I mean, he's come to accept, I feel like, his, you know, everything Omni-Man's done. Maybe not, like, fully, I guess, but he's definitely bridging the divide between them.

[00:46:13] He was when they were still in contact before Omni-Man got taken away. And he's willing to believe that there's good inside his father. And he can't seem to do that for people who opposed him in the past or don't have anything to do with him. And that's the problem that I'm having with him, I guess, right now. But he also could just be in the process of changing.

[00:46:40] But he needs to accept that people deserve a second chance as long as they're working towards being better. I mean, for instance, Rex, right? Like, Rex sucked, and now Rex is awesome. And he needs to just kind of get it through his head. It's not black and white. And also, this batch of episodes was, like, I'd say a solid 8 out of 10, in my opinion. I have one thing I want to mention about the Mark Omni-Man thing.

[00:47:09] It's like, I do think, obviously, Mark is probably slowly on the path of trying to forgive his father. But I think it's a little disingenuous for Cecil to be like, well, Mark, you forgave your dad. No, he didn't. I'm not, like, trying to, like, argue with you. I just, like, this is the point I just want to make. It's like, we saw he went to Thraxa, and his dad was like, Mark, it's good to see you. And Mark was like, what the fuck? I'm leaving.

[00:47:39] You're really going to let these millions of people die. And then Mark was, like, faced with that crazy, like, ultimatum. And, like, also, he was like, also, this is your brother who's done no wrong, by the way. He's a literal newborn. Like, he's also your blood. Like, you should probably, like, take care of him or whatever. And I think, like, I think, like, Mark just had, like, a really troubling decision to make. And I think he made the right decision there.

[00:48:08] And I don't think it's fair to be like, well, you just forgave your dad. It's like, bro wanted to stop the erasure of a people and his save his younger brother. Like, I don't think it's. Yeah, who happened to be of that race of people. Like. Yeah. Like, I don't think it's fair to be like, well, he only thinks his dad deserves a second chance and not these other people. It's like, also, he doesn't think that.

[00:48:34] But, obviously, he has a connection to his dad who he grew up for 17 years of his life knowing. Or not knowing, but feeling like he was a loving and caring father. Yeah. Who, like, wanted the best for him. And had, like, a crazy stressful, like, departure from that reality. In which he took on his father to save as many people as he could. Not very well, but he did as best as he could. Yeah. And honestly, that.

[00:49:02] He was almost beat to death by his father. Like. That last episode of season one is still, like. Yeah. One of the best episodes of the show. It was so well done. And then Alan and Mark vibing out at the end on the moon was cool. I always loved their dynamic. But, yeah. I will say. I do think. You know. I'm not going to get into it on the mic, obviously.

[00:49:28] But, you know, I've got my own family stuff. So, I do suppose I might be projecting a little bit onto this. No, like. Like, I definitely do think it's fair to say he's short-sighted. When he's like. Fucking Darkwing should be in. Like. I mean, I guess he should serve the time, right? He should do a certain amount of true sentencing. And proper recovery.

[00:49:58] Because he did. It was only maximum a few months that he wasn't. Out free. I do suppose he's putting his life on the line now. So, I guess he is trying to repay that debt. But. And I feel like we'll just have to see, I guess, where it goes with Darkwing, too. It's definitely unfair for Mark to be like. These people should rot in prison for the rest of their lives. Like, maybe Sinclair should. But. I don't. Yeah. I don't feel that way about Darkwing.

[00:50:27] I don't think he should get to pick and choose. And it's definitely just that. I don't know. He's got to apply the. When he's killed. But. True. He's got to apply that logic, though. Of people deserving second chances to everyone. Yeah. Because, I mean, he applies that to Rex as well. Like I said. I love Rex. And he should try. I mean, I feel like that's the true, like, essence of being a hero.

[00:50:53] Remember, he was, but not like he really had a choice, but he was like an assassin before. Oh, yeah. I always forget about that. Rex is like little, little lower dump that he gives. They gave was sad. It's always so sad with him. Yeah. He had a really troubling life. He's a lot more sympathetic than you would ever think when you first set eyes on that character in the first season.

[00:51:27] He was just so hateable from the start. But it's a testament to the writers that they were able to make us care about someone. Yeah. So easy to hate. Out of this batch of episodes, I definitely thought that episode one was the weakest out of the three. Although it did give us a little bit of insight into Alan and Nolan, which I really appreciated. But I think episode two stood out because of the Cecil backstory.

[00:51:57] I don't know why, but Cecil has always been one of my favorite characters. Maybe it's just I think he's really well written. Walton Goggins is also a favorite on this channel because he's been killing it recently. He has been. And I saw him in a Super Bowl commercial today, too. He's in White Lotus, too, right? In what? White Lotus. Yeah, he's going to be in the new season of White Lotus, which... I keep seeing flicks of him shirtless on a horse.

[00:52:22] Walton Goggins is a favorite on this network because of both his work in Fallout and in Invincible and soon to be White Lotus. It's always great to see him on screen. I mean, I'm going to have to copy Richard here and say that this was a pretty solid 8 out of 10 for me. Overall, I'm excited for this season and I just can't wait to see more. Yeah, I do have one question for you just because me and Chase already at least have an inkling of what's coming next.

[00:52:52] What do you think is going to happen with the Angstrom stuff? You got any theories cooking up? I think that Angstrom Levy is going to be the first case of, like, rehabilitation that Mark accepts. And I think that's going to be, like, instrumental to him developing in that way. I love that theory. I actually really do, too. That's a good one. We'll see. I'm excited to see what'll happen. I didn't think that Angstrom was coming back this soon.

[00:53:19] I thought it was going to be much later that we would see him again. All right, everybody. I think that's all we have for today. So thank everyone for joining us and we hope you all tune in again. Yeah. And before we let you guys go, I just wanted to give a quick shout out to all the other podcasts in the network. First of all, to the ones who make all of this possible, our parent podcast, The Lorehounds.

[00:53:47] They're currently doing some joint coverage with Properly Howard Movie Review and they're doing Severance together, which is its own feed. So if you want to tune into their Severance coverage, which me and Chase have been having a blast watching Severance and been listening to all of their coverage over there on the Lorehounds and Properly Howard. And they're having a ton of fun. So definitely go check that out. Subscribe to the unique feed for this show.

[00:54:15] Also in the network are excellent podcasts like Wool Shift Dust, which Alicia just with her co-host Luke finished up the new season of Silo. So season two of Silo has just ended. Alicia also has her Star Wars Canon Timeline podcast, which I believe she has some things cooking over there that she's going to release soon. And Marilyn Arpikila and her co-host Dr. Sarah Brown over on Rings and Rituals.

[00:54:44] They'll have some things coming out before the next season of The Rings of Power. They go through and they talk about how Ritual intersects with The Rings of Power. It's a very interesting podcast. And of course, the newest affiliate, Nevermind the Music. Mark and Nicole are going very strong. They are doing great with their first season of Nevermind the Music. And they're doing a lot of interesting crossovers with the Severance podcast as well. So go give them a listen.

[00:55:12] And links to all of these as well as info on how to get a hold of us are going to be in the show notes.

[00:55:54] Hey everyone, David here. Severance is back. The Lorehounds are partnering with Properly Howard to bring you in-depth weekly coverage of Season 2. Join me, John, Anthony, and Steve as we unpack every twist, theory, and revelation. We've created a dedicated feed just for our Severance coverage.

[00:56:17] Simply search for Severance Lorehounds in your podcast app or find the direct link in our link tree. Our weekly episodes dig deep into the show's mysteries, themes, and bigger questions about identity and consciousness that make Severance so compelling. Season Pass and regular community subscribers get ad-free access to our weekly episodes, plus exclusive content like our Supply Closet bonus series,

[00:56:46] featuring fascinating conversations with experts like the team from Nevermind the Music. We've explored the neuroscience of memory and personality, decoded the hidden meanings in the show's musical themes, and there's much more to come. You'll also get Steve and Anthony's complete Season 1 rewatch series. We believe in total transparency with our listeners. And unlike Mammalians Nurturable,

[00:57:14] we're happy to share all of our secrets. Find the link for the Severance feed in the show notes below, or search Severance Lorehounds wherever you get your podcasts. Come theorize with us about what's really happening at Lumen.