The Boys - Season 4 Recap

[00:00:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Hello and welcome back to the Radioactive Ramblings podcast. I'm one of your hosts, Aaron.

[00:00:26] [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm your other host, Chase.

[00:00:29] [SPEAKER_00]: First I feel like we should address that we are back from our long hiatus. It's been

[00:00:36] [SPEAKER_00]: a mix of scheduling issues and burnout and other personal issues going on here and there.

[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_00]: But now we're back and we're better than ever really ready to start releasing podcasts again.

[00:00:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Chase, it's been a strange month and a half but we're here now.

[00:01:02] [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah are you looking forward to getting some podcasts back up and running?

[00:01:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah I'm excited to be back finally recording again and talking about The Boys again.

[00:01:18] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah so we had originally planned on doing episode by episode coverage of The Boys but obviously

[00:01:26] [SPEAKER_00]: that fell apart on us just a little bit. So we are going to do in this episode just a full

[00:01:34] [SPEAKER_00]: season review. Talk about everything that was in those last few episodes that we didn't review.

[00:01:40] [SPEAKER_00]: Get a good picture of what's been happening. Kind of give a wrap up to the season and give you

[00:01:46] [SPEAKER_00]: guys our thoughts. Chase, was there anything else you wanted to talk about in this episode?

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Did you want to focus more on like the last few episodes or do we just want to do like a

[00:01:58] [SPEAKER_01]: general season review? I think we'll talk about the season as a whole for sure. I think

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_01]: we're going to focus a little bit more on the episodes we missed covering because we have quite

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_01]: a comprehensive coverage of the other episodes so yeah. Also I kind of want to talk about where

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I think the story of The Boys is going and the next season probably which I think they said

[00:02:27] [SPEAKER_01]: is going to be the last season right? Yeah they said that there's going to be one more

[00:02:32] [SPEAKER_00]: season of the mainline series. In between then and now there's going to be a new Gen V season

[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_00]: but they didn't say if that was going to be the last Gen V season I don't know if they're

[00:02:41] [SPEAKER_00]: having them like end at the same time or if they're going to keep Gen V going after.

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I guess we'll just have to see where those characters end up at the end of The Boys.

[00:02:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. And they also announced another spin-off series. Did you see anything about this?

[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_00]: I did not see that. So it's apparently Stormfront and Soldier Boy is going to be the spin-off.

[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_00]: What the hell? Yeah it's about like the beginnings of Vaught. I don't know about

[00:03:18] [SPEAKER_00]: this one. I feel like they might... I don't have high hopes for it to be quite honest.

[00:03:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah I feel like Stormfront and Soldier Boy are interesting characters for sure but I don't know

[00:03:30] [SPEAKER_00]: how they are going to be as main characters. Yeah they're both such assholes. They're good

[00:03:38] [SPEAKER_00]: as villains and complementary characters but having them be the stars of their own show.

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_00]: It could be something a little bit different maybe they're just in it but

[00:03:47] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I don't know that I would really be that into a show where the two main characters are just

[00:03:54] [SPEAKER_00]: straight up like racist awful villains. Yeah. I don't know either.

[00:04:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Anyways getting back on track, a lot of shows have wrapped up or are currently

[00:04:08] [SPEAKER_00]: wrapping up right now but the summer is far from over in terms of content so send some emails

[00:04:13] [SPEAKER_00]: over to Radioactive at theLorhounds.com, head to the Lorhounds website and use the contact form or

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_00]: leave us a voicemail. Voicemail tool is simple to use and we can drop your feedback right into the

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_00]: pod. Now for some of our previous episodes we had I believe it was one or two pieces of feedback

[00:04:30] [SPEAKER_00]: that we recorded with and just weren't able to get out. We had some audio quality issues on

[00:04:39] [SPEAKER_00]: our end and things like that so we are just going to start a fresh slate here and we're going to try

[00:04:45] [SPEAKER_00]: incorporate some of that feedback later on in the episode just from what we recall from that.

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Wait what happened with the feedback? So basically we got one voicemail that was really

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_00]: for some reason it sounded fine when you listen to it just on your laptop whatever.

[00:05:06] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean we could just like summarize what they tried to say. Yeah exactly, exactly.

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_01]: And Chase you want to tell us about Discord? I would love to. Everyone please join us on Discord

[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_01]: there are channels set up for all the shows and projects this summer and great conversations you

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_01]: don't want to miss out on so check the show notes of this episode or any episode

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_01]: for the links to the Discord and all the affiliate podcasts.

[00:05:40] [SPEAKER_00]: Awesome and now that we're back we should probably get into some of the setup, the hot takes

[00:05:47] [SPEAKER_00]: just giving our general impressions on the second half of this season and how we thought it

[00:05:52] [SPEAKER_00]: went. Let's start off with a quick synopsis. Boy Season 4 has ended with a bang and brought

[00:05:57] [SPEAKER_00]: us the death of Victoria Newman butcher's super parasite homelander as the puppet master of the

[00:06:02] [SPEAKER_00]: US government with the boys kidnapped her on the run there's almost no hope left for our heroes

[00:06:07] [SPEAKER_00]: who have lost at every opportunity to stop the threat of Vaught and the Supes. All right and

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Chase do you have any thoughts about where this season ended right off the bat? Oh by the way

[00:06:20] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna switch around the order this is now our spoiler section.

[00:06:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay yeah yeah um so for this season I honestly think it took uh an interesting turn because

[00:06:35] [SPEAKER_01]: I thought it wasn't gonna be as similar to the comics as it ended up being

[00:06:44] [SPEAKER_01]: um because like the the butcher with like the super so in the comics all of the boys have like

[00:06:54] [SPEAKER_01]: super strength because they took like a form of V that like didn't give them like crazy powers

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_01]: but they all have super strength so they're actually like able to kill soups that way.

[00:07:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Um so like seeing butcher like have like real powers now is like kind of like

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_01]: very much like the comics and him being so focused on like the genocide of the all soups

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_01]: is like also very much like the comics. I thought he was gonna I mean I think I kind of predicted it

[00:07:27] [SPEAKER_01]: in our earlier episodes when I was talking about I think butcher is gonna be

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_01]: um more on the evil side and in opposition to the boys by the end of the show so I think that's kind

[00:07:39] [SPEAKER_00]: of where it's going. Yeah I mean I think that butcher has been starting to lean that direction

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_00]: for a couple of seasons now where you can see him doing his whole anti-soup as as a rule thing

[00:07:52] [SPEAKER_00]: and you had him with the soup virus and he he was really trying to find a way forward

[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_00]: without falling into that darkness that's within himself and by the end once it becomes clear that

[00:08:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Ryan's not going to help him in the immediate and there's not a lot that they can really do

[00:08:11] [SPEAKER_00]: about it. It feels like it just became too much for him and he had to give in to that

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_00]: parasite in his brain the the Joe Kessler parasite if you will. I mean I don't know if he

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_01]: had to I mean it did seem like it saved his life but um which I'm not I don't really fully

[00:08:31] [SPEAKER_00]: understand how giving into the like genocidal tendencies saved him from from the cancer killing

[00:08:40] [SPEAKER_00]: him is it just because it might be because like Joe Kessler parasite whatever we want to call that

[00:08:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just going to refer to his as to his Vdup tumor is Joe Kessler from now on

[00:08:52] [SPEAKER_00]: so Joe Kessler is in his head and maybe Joe Kessler is like slowly killing him with during that and

[00:08:59] [SPEAKER_00]: then stops slowly killing him after he gives in and does what Joe wants I don't know it's very

[00:09:05] [SPEAKER_00]: murky on why that really saved him maybe it didn't save him and it just bought him some time

[00:09:10] [SPEAKER_01]: but that was confusing for me. I think what happened is like him not giving into like the

[00:09:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Joe Kessler like uh dialogue options is like him like subconsciously fighting against the parasite

[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_01]: and then him giving into it is like letting the parasite work its magic so like the parasite

[00:09:33] [SPEAKER_00]: is healing him now or some shit like that. Yeah that's a good uh good theory that now instead

[00:09:41] [SPEAKER_00]: of working against the parasite it's like it's like I mean it's basically a parody of venom

[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_00]: so it's it's like the symbiote where it's working with Butcher now instead of working against him

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_00]: which is pretty cool I enjoyed that they gave him those powers I think that they fit him pretty

[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_00]: well. Now for production details really the only thing I have to say about this because we talked

[00:10:04] [SPEAKER_00]: about the production in earlier episodes is about the critical reception of this season of the

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_00]: boys a lot of people have criticized the series fourth season some of them being like kind of

[00:10:15] [SPEAKER_00]: ridiculous and offensive reasons which we're not going to talk too much about that because I think

[00:10:21] [SPEAKER_00]: you all already get the gist but there were a lot of like valid criticisms of the season that I saw

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_00]: like the ending was a little rushed or there were just some things at the end there that kind of

[00:10:37] [SPEAKER_00]: made me think as a viewer and seem to make a lot of other viewers think that

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_00]: they might have lost the charm that they had in the first three seasons not or not so much the charm

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_00]: but they've lost a little bit of that core of the show which I guess is only natural for a show

[00:10:53] [SPEAKER_00]: that's been going on for now four seasons going on five seasons with spin-offs and things like that

[00:10:59] [SPEAKER_00]: you know there tends to be a little bit of burnout some of the characters felt a little

[00:11:05] [SPEAKER_00]: different than how we were used to seeing them uh chase any thoughts on any of that

[00:11:11] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah some of the characters I mean Frenchie for example felt pretty empty this season

[00:11:20] [SPEAKER_01]: I do kind of have a little bit of a hot take about the season I thought it started off way

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_01]: weaker than it ended like I think the last few episodes were much better than the first few

[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_01]: but um yeah I I do agree with the fact that it feels like the season as a whole actually was

[00:11:39] [SPEAKER_00]: a little rush yeah which is strange because they took a lot of time in between the seasons so

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_00]: and the special effects look great looked great so it didn't feel rushed from maybe a

[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_00]: like a technological standpoint or from amazon rushing through things standpoint but oh writing

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_00]: just felt right for sure though yeah and do we know was this one of the shows that got

[00:12:06] [SPEAKER_00]: affected by the writer strike like did they maybe have to record some stuff with

[00:12:10] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean I would only have to assume right like yeah I mean it was definitely a little bit weaker as

[00:12:18] [SPEAKER_00]: a season but I don't disagree with you that it started to get stronger towards the end

[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_00]: maybe that's just because they started actually building up things the first few episodes felt

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_00]: a little bit slow and like not a lot was accomplished I don't know if you agree with that

[00:12:32] [SPEAKER_01]: it feels like the first few episodes were directionless that's the only way I could describe it like

[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_01]: things were happening but I didn't like feel like those things were building towards anything

[00:12:45] [SPEAKER_01]: until we got to like the episode with the virus I feel like yeah which we can talk about the

[00:12:52] [SPEAKER_00]: virus a little bit later but I have I have some thoughts about the virus um should we get into our

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_00]: hot takes this season uh yeah you want to start us off yeah um so I really loved butchers venom

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_00]: esk powers um even though I feel like they didn't quite suit him we already talked about this that

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a little bit confused about whether or not he's still dying but I put the venom esk powers

[00:13:21] [SPEAKER_00]: under hot takes just because a lot of people were kind of pissed off that he didn't have

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_00]: the same superpowers that he had when he was taking temp fee um I mean I think that that criticism is a

[00:13:32] [SPEAKER_00]: little off just because we learn out or we learn towards the end that he isn't really the one with

[00:13:40] [SPEAKER_00]: superpowers but it's his brain tumor with superpowers so it makes a lot more sense as you go

[00:13:45] [SPEAKER_00]: through the season and sort of learn some critical information but I could see that as

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_00]: something people were upset about at the beginning um we've talked about this one quite a bit as well

[00:13:57] [SPEAKER_00]: but the frenchie and kamiko romance I mean I don't know man it it feels like they put a button on it

[00:14:04] [SPEAKER_00]: and then just decided to walk it right back it's too little too late in my mind they could have

[00:14:10] [SPEAKER_00]: gone with the frenchie and kamiko romance earlier or just stuck with not doing it all

[00:14:16] [SPEAKER_00]: and having them gain a more platonic relationship uh it didn't yeah it feels like it was written as

[00:14:25] [SPEAKER_01]: like fan fiction like they spent like that whole first few episodes of the season with frenchie

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_01]: and kamiko basically being like like sorry I like see you as family and like I value our

[00:14:41] [SPEAKER_01]: relationship deeply but I don't think it's in a it's one of romance and frenchie being okay with that

[00:14:47] [SPEAKER_01]: and then they walk it all back and it's like what are we doing I don't understand why we're

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_01]: ruining like the only good part about frenchie writing this season I don't yeah I don't really

[00:15:05] [SPEAKER_00]: get it either it that was the one thing that kept me engaged with frenchie like you said the

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_00]: one good piece of his writing was this new relationship he was building with kamiko that

[00:15:16] [SPEAKER_00]: wasn't about him having a crush on her and them just becoming like a little family they really

[00:15:23] [SPEAKER_00]: were great best friends and and partners together and then the whole frenchie and prison thing

[00:15:32] [SPEAKER_00]: happens which oh good lord the frenchie and prison thing I fucking hated that I'll I'll be

[00:15:38] [SPEAKER_01]: honest I think that that was a really weak it was just a good way to get him out of the story

[00:15:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like that's what they did it like they didn't know what to do with his characters so they're

[00:15:49] [SPEAKER_01]: like oh we can make him feel regretful and he'll turn himself in and go to prison so we can have

[00:15:55] [SPEAKER_00]: a few episodes without him yeah it just was like a weird continuation of the colin plot line

[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_00]: which they did not do anything to make us care about that plot line yeah and they like they fumbled

[00:16:12] [SPEAKER_01]: so hard this season with some things it was like a steep drop-off writing wise in my opinion

[00:16:21] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I mean just thinking about what they could have done with we'll use that plot line as

[00:16:27] [SPEAKER_00]: an example where they could have had frenchie developing this relationship with colin and not

[00:16:32] [SPEAKER_00]: had it be a thing about him murdering the family meanwhile he's starting his relationship with

[00:16:38] [SPEAKER_00]: kamiko in a platonic way they're becoming closer learning how to navigate their relationship

[00:16:43] [SPEAKER_00]: and frenchie is kind of learning how to navigate a relationship that isn't with kamiko

[00:16:47] [SPEAKER_00]: romantically which he has been like avoiding for what two and a half seasons so even

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_00]: seeing it go in a direction like that would have been much better than all this random shit that just

[00:16:59] [SPEAKER_01]: happens yeah you know what they could have done just have him have a normal guiltless relationship

[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_01]: with colin but colin helps frenchie understand the guilt that he's feeling over killing innocent

[00:17:15] [SPEAKER_01]: people and have him like nurture him through that but no it has to be some weird twisted

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_01]: thing about him killing colin's family for no reason yeah I mean they had him at the beginning

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_00]: of the season clean a platonic relationship with kamiko and he just like goes downhill and it

[00:17:38] [SPEAKER_00]: it feels like just the same way that people complain about hui torture in this show

[00:17:45] [SPEAKER_00]: just is for frenchie like they're putting him through the ringer in this season not that

[00:17:49] [SPEAKER_00]: hui isn't also going through the ringer mind you but frenchie is just hui more so I think

[00:17:55] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah hui for sure he's uh both getting physically and emotionally tortured all throughout this season

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_00]: it's hard to watch him in in some of these especially the tech night episode that was

[00:18:08] [SPEAKER_00]: so fucked up moving on with some of my other hot takes the soup killing virus they started

[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_00]: this plot line in gen v right at the end and it just feels like an unfulfilled plot it felt so

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_00]: central to the season and then they just didn't use it and I was not a fan of it like what are we

[00:18:31] [SPEAKER_00]: doing here why did we go through this whole season we had so much of it devoted to getting a

[00:18:37] [SPEAKER_00]: sample so that we could make it we had like a whole episode they broke stan edgar out of prison

[00:18:42] [SPEAKER_00]: and then they just don't use the virus and maybe they could use it in the final season but at this

[00:18:47] [SPEAKER_00]: point they've built it up for a whole season and then just gave us no payoff what the weird thing is

[00:18:52] [SPEAKER_01]: is like it's too potent and not potent enough it's like it's gonna kill every single soup if you

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_01]: release it it's set for homelander because it's not like it's like viral enough but not like deadly

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_01]: enough or some shit so it's like in a weird like I don't know stasis chamber or something where it's

[00:19:14] [SPEAKER_01]: like oh we can't use it because it'll kill every soup so that's like the moral issue and then like

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_01]: we also like can't use it because even if we did it wouldn't kill homelander so we need to like

[00:19:28] [SPEAKER_01]: make it more potent but less viral and I don't know how they're ever gonna do anything with

[00:19:35] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I would have really rather had but your take out newman with the virus and haven't like have it be

[00:19:42] [SPEAKER_00]: the less potent version that would take out newman but wouldn't start in apocalypse I think that would

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_00]: have been like an interesting way to end the season um but they had him rip them or rip

[00:19:54] [SPEAKER_00]: newman apart with the venom powers instead which that it feels like they could have slotted

[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_00]: a little bit of resolution and build up with the soup virus into that final episode that way

[00:20:09] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I really loved how sister sage orchestrated pretty much the whole season

[00:20:15] [SPEAKER_00]: uh it was so phenomenal phenomenal the reveal right at the end that she did it just to see if

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_00]: she could that was fantastic I mean it's I thought the character was done for which was a shame because

[00:20:30] [SPEAKER_00]: I was really enjoying sister sage and then they bring her back at the end and you can tell that she

[00:20:35] [SPEAKER_00]: is going to be huge in season five in that last act of the of the series and I'm really excited

[00:20:44] [SPEAKER_01]: to see what they do with her yeah I feel like sister sage was one of the well-written characters

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_01]: this season actually I think she got a lot of great scenes and her parts of the story were very

[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_01]: interesting so it's good to see she's getting the credit she deserves um and you know I think

[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_01]: having a mass more mastermind character less like oh I'm just gonna go and kill everything in my

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_01]: way it's like a very interesting character and the boys um considering how like usually that's

[00:21:20] [SPEAKER_01]: how the boys have to act more mastermindy um while the soups are just like doing whatever the

[00:21:27] [SPEAKER_00]: fuck they want but yeah yeah they're having to fight someone on their level a little bit more

[00:21:34] [SPEAKER_00]: when they're just fighting the soups it's like okay yeah these guys are really strong

[00:21:37] [SPEAKER_00]: and powerful but they're all egomaniacs and really stupid so you know we can get things done

[00:21:45] [SPEAKER_00]: but with sister sage it just adds that level of organization to homeland or side that he didn't

[00:21:52] [SPEAKER_00]: have before just doing erratic shit all right and chase do you have any hot takes from this

[00:21:58] [SPEAKER_01]: season um just like I feel like the whole season as a whole is a step below the rest of

[00:22:07] [SPEAKER_01]: the seasons don't think that's really a hot take though um also I felt like it would have been more

[00:22:15] [SPEAKER_01]: interesting to have butcher uh become more of like a father like role model for Ryan then

[00:22:24] [SPEAKER_01]: back to is like I want to kill all soups in the world no matter what character

[00:22:31] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I think that that would have been a good deviation from the comics too uh to have maybe

[00:22:37] [SPEAKER_00]: butcher be that caring person and try and bring Ryan into the fold instead of going the full

[00:22:45] [SPEAKER_00]: genocidal soup route which you know I I think that they did good good work getting him to

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_00]: that point but it still would have been interesting to see Ryan flip I really wanted Ryan to come

[00:22:59] [SPEAKER_00]: over to the boys side at the end of the season yeah I completely agree with that uh any other hot

[00:23:07] [SPEAKER_00]: takes from this season before we move on to some character discussion uh no all right well I think

[00:23:16] [SPEAKER_00]: we are going to take a quick break and we will be right back and we're back for a discussion

[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_00]: of our characters in the boys season four let's start off with a character who

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_00]: she was a little bit rocky at the beginning of the season they weren't doing much with her

[00:23:40] [SPEAKER_00]: but she went on to be one of the standouts and in this season some of the best performances in

[00:23:46] [SPEAKER_00]: my opinion uh starlight I think that her new powers are great but it does feel like her

[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_00]: personality is changing in a way that doesn't feel like the Annie we knew anymore and that's okay

[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_00]: but the writers haven't really put in the work to make us see her change as a person to justify her

[00:24:06] [SPEAKER_00]: actions being different in this season I just the through line of the season has kind of been

[00:24:12] [SPEAKER_00]: that the writers are making big changes to characters without really explaining it or

[00:24:17] [SPEAKER_00]: giving us the story of how they got to that point yeah it feels like they just like

[00:24:23] [SPEAKER_01]: threw in her backstory as being like a shitty person and it's like that would work for like a

[00:24:30] [SPEAKER_01]: lot of characters but I feel like it doesn't work for her because her whole thing has been like

[00:24:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I was raised to like see right from wrong and like I like I won't allow like this to like

[00:24:46] [SPEAKER_01]: go on because this is like like bad things are happening and I like I can stop it so like

[00:24:53] [SPEAKER_01]: I will stop it and then like her character like turns out to be like oh yeah actually you're just

[00:24:59] [SPEAKER_01]: a shitty person until you got into the seven like I don't I don't understand what the fuck is going on

[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_01]: but yeah it's like character assassination yeah they really are just like they're like

[00:25:18] [SPEAKER_01]: you know what you know it'd be a sick turn of events if it turns out the like one genuinely

[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_01]: good person in the show is just a shitty fucking person actually like okay what the fuck yeah it

[00:25:39] [SPEAKER_00]: was a little bit ridiculous it and then they had some stuff where starlight was like upset with

[00:25:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Huey for his own abuse are cheating on her like okay bro like the starlight that we saw in the first

[00:25:58] [SPEAKER_00]: like three seasons would not have been mad at him for for that like it just feels like they've

[00:26:04] [SPEAKER_00]: done a 180 with their character for real and let's move on to butcher we we've already given him

[00:26:10] [SPEAKER_00]: a little bit of airtime but butcher giving into the castle parasite going full suposide mode

[00:26:16] [SPEAKER_00]: it's a it's a good place to have him as like the final villain of the of the show

[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_00]: his character is going to be starting this final season in a really dark place and I don't think

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_00]: that he's going to come back from it and be the ultimate hero of the show he's gone down this

[00:26:34] [SPEAKER_01]: path and I think he's got to stick to it now yeah I feel like it's fully within his character

[00:26:39] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not angry or upset with what they've done with butcher I just thought it would have been

[00:26:46] [SPEAKER_01]: more interesting for them to make him actually take the good guy route but I mean from the first

[00:26:53] [SPEAKER_01]: like minute you see this guy in season one you're like this guy's not a great person is he

[00:26:59] [SPEAKER_01]: this guy's shady as fuck so like this is this is not like a surprise to me and I don't think

[00:27:09] [SPEAKER_01]: butcher's character and how it's going is a product of bad writing yeah I'm with you and

[00:27:17] [SPEAKER_00]: I think that they showed us even more that even before beckham was kidnapped by vaude and

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_00]: and uh butcher has started his crusade to figure out what's going on at vaude

[00:27:33] [SPEAKER_00]: um even when he was with becka he was a fucking awful husband he was cheating on her all the time

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_00]: he was never around and it took her leaving for him to really like appreciate his wife

[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_00]: in any meaningful way so it's just shown to us over and over again that this guy is

[00:27:53] [SPEAKER_00]: he's an asshole and that little glimmer of humanity that we saw in him when he was trying to

[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_00]: bring ryan over that's not the real him joe kessler is is the real him I think yeah it's like

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_01]: all the good things he was doing was him trying to make all the wrongs he's done to becka right

[00:28:17] [SPEAKER_01]: and then he like couldn't go through with it and he just fell back on his natural tendencies

[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah it's very sad but well within his character

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_00]: poor hui hui hui hui this man has been through the ringer over and over and over again this season

[00:28:41] [SPEAKER_00]: every episode is like a new injustice visited upon hui and his poor psyche get that man a therapist

[00:28:50] [SPEAKER_00]: he needs a therapist more than anyone I've ever seen in film and television he's been abused

[00:28:57] [SPEAKER_00]: his dad died forgot who he was um he was abused in tech night's dungeon he was tricked by a

[00:29:07] [SPEAKER_00]: shapeshifter let it's just thing after thing with this poor fucking guy yeah i was having a bad

[00:29:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I would say day but it's multiple days Rose just having a bad time in general bad like year and a half

[00:29:25] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah so hui other than that he his character hasn't changed much this season in my opinion

[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you have anything different to say about that chase no I feel like his

[00:29:36] [SPEAKER_01]: character is definitely like season two just hui again which I think is fine though I feel

[00:29:43] [SPEAKER_01]: like his character is mostly flat throughout the show it's our first season three when he

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_01]: starts taking temp v like a meth head but other than that he's pretty much the same guy

[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I think that the one interesting thing that we sort of saw with him in terms of personal

[00:30:04] [SPEAKER_00]: growth this season was his interaction with a train where he kind of forgives atron not really

[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_01]: forgives but because I don't know if you I feel like he I feel like he forgives him

[00:30:17] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I mean I guess so I in my head I'm like how do you forgive someone for for that but it

[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_00]: it does seem like hui genuinely is like okay you've you've done enough where you're at least

[00:30:28] [SPEAKER_00]: starting to make a positive impact and he sort of recognizes a train for doing that

[00:30:34] [SPEAKER_00]: I speaking of a train I was fucking shocked that guy made it through the season

[00:30:40] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah I thought they were setting him up for death for the longest time too

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah for every single time we saw him he was doing something like noble or good and

[00:30:52] [SPEAKER_00]: that's always the sign of of a evil character that's sort of redeeming themselves becoming

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER_00]: in fucking six feet under but I'm glad that he made it to the end he could very much play a big

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_00]: role in season five if they wanted to go that direction but I hope he finds some peace I hope

[00:31:13] [SPEAKER_00]: that he's able to reconnect with his family I want a train to have a good ending even though

[00:31:20] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of hated him at the start of this series he's really grown on me throughout the past

[00:31:26] [SPEAKER_01]: four seasons yeah he definitely takes a u-turn with this character and it's crazy to think that

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_01]: he is one of the less offensive heroes in the seven yeah I mean considering the first time we

[00:31:41] [SPEAKER_00]: meet him he fucking turns Robin into sidewalk soup we yeah it's crazy that

[00:31:55] [SPEAKER_00]: so anyway considering that's the first time we see him it's a little it's surprising that he's

[00:32:04] [SPEAKER_00]: one of the least offensive members of the seven and the person that we kind of resonate with

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_00]: the most on there after Annie gets kicked off speaking of the seven we should talk a little bit

[00:32:17] [SPEAKER_00]: about this minor character homelander god every season this guy just loses his mind more and

[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_00]: more and gets so much more ridiculous this man is fucking insane and ridiculous his interactions

[00:32:33] [SPEAKER_00]: with firecracker at the end when he's like telling her to go further down the table because

[00:32:39] [SPEAKER_00]: she was coughing and then he like puts her breast milk aside because he doesn't want to drink it

[00:32:43] [SPEAKER_00]: anymore oh my god they do such a good job at making this guy like a comic relief character

[00:32:49] [SPEAKER_00]: as much as he is a horrifying villain yeah the way he just like treats firecracker

[00:32:58] [SPEAKER_00]: is just so funny to me yeah and god Anthony star I hope the rumors about him being like

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_00]: homelander in some ways in real life aren't true but just from watching this show he plays the

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_00]: character a little bit too well he just plays this sociopathic broken man so well and I don't

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_00]: think that I could imagine anyone else in this role yeah I'd have to agree with you there I think

[00:33:33] [SPEAKER_01]: he quite literally is the greatest on-screen villain actor we've seen in TV shows

[00:33:45] [SPEAKER_01]: um now that is a heart take I think he I don't I think it's not because homelander is the

[00:33:53] [SPEAKER_01]: greatest villain I think Anthony star does the greatest portrayal of him like I don't think I've

[00:34:01] [SPEAKER_01]: ever seen someone play a villain so perfectly before yeah he he just is that character there

[00:34:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Anthony star is going to be homelander for ever and ever when people read the comics now they're

[00:34:18] [SPEAKER_00]: imagine Anthony star in the place of the little comics and yeah it's just he's that guy and

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_00]: other than that I don't know if there's much to say about his character development this season

[00:34:34] [SPEAKER_00]: he just goes further and further into the insane rabbit hole of losing his god damn mind every

[00:34:40] [SPEAKER_00]: time we see him and it's it's not getting any better for him he's not making a recovery the way

[00:34:48] [SPEAKER_01]: train is that's for fucking sure it's not possible it's not possible for homelander to ever redeem

[00:34:57] [SPEAKER_00]: so yeah that's uh though what if they just like flip the script on us from from the comics and

[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_00]: made homelander the the final hero of the series he flips sides Ryan he can't ever be a hero

[00:35:15] [SPEAKER_01]: he literally cannot dude he can't undo all of the horrible shit he's done I mean atrian can't

[00:35:24] [SPEAKER_01]: undo his shit either but I feel like there are ways for him to repent like yeah atrian is killed

[00:35:33] [SPEAKER_01]: exponentially less people done exponentially less harm than homelander in every way

[00:35:43] [SPEAKER_00]: and don't forget about atrain ending uh ending racial tension in the u.s with his

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_00]: kyley Jenner commercial no kyley Jenner was inspired by that she was she wishes she was atrain

[00:35:58] [SPEAKER_00]: atrain did it first nothing better than the original all right sister sage speaking of

[00:36:08] [SPEAKER_00]: homelander it's impossible to talk about homelander without talking about his relationship with

[00:36:12] [SPEAKER_00]: sister sage because she was really the one driving him this season whether he was aware of it or not

[00:36:21] [SPEAKER_00]: everything that happened from his appearances on television to his uh his supporters doing

[00:36:29] [SPEAKER_00]: certain things or this or that sister sage was really running the show for homelander and

[00:36:36] [SPEAKER_00]: he had a hard time with that homelander does did not like the idea that someone wouldn't agree

[00:36:42] [SPEAKER_01]: with him 24 7 yeah homelander wants everyone to be subservient to him and he pretends like he hates

[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_01]: yes men but that's what he wants he wants everyone to think and say that he's the smartest and

[00:37:02] [SPEAKER_01]: that he knows best when like obviously he's not the smartest and he doesn't know best and

[00:37:12] [SPEAKER_01]: sister sage is the smartest and she knows best but um or i don't know if she knows best considering

[00:37:20] [SPEAKER_00]: she's not a good person either but um yeah i mean maybe she knows best she's just not doing best

[00:37:30] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah exactly yeah um it's so fucked up to me the way that sister sage just did all of this

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_00]: to see if she could i mean shit that it's just like she lobotomizes herself to watch

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER_01]: shows that would bore her usually so it's it's not that crazy that she would toy with like

[00:38:01] [SPEAKER_00]: the most powerful beings on the planet yeah i mean it's fitting for sure you got to do

[00:38:07] [SPEAKER_00]: something to entertain yourself at a certain point is lobotomy really worth it you know got

[00:38:13] [SPEAKER_01]: to find other ways to entertain yourself i mean i don't know you're the one who has one so i oh really

[00:38:23] [SPEAKER_00]: i've got a lobotomy that would explain a lot all right let's move on to newman um r.i.p to

[00:38:33] [SPEAKER_00]: one of the best villains in the series uh outing her as a soup on live tv another fucking crazy

[00:38:40] [SPEAKER_00]: homeland removed from this season and then queen got ripped apart by butchers tentacles and loved

[00:38:50] [SPEAKER_00]: her as a character sad to see her go but her story ended in a good place i think that her

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_00]: arc this season uh was very fulfilling in my mind yeah her character was actually quite enjoyable

[00:39:04] [SPEAKER_00]: for the most part this season yeah um i mean the way that at the end she's trying to make a deal

[00:39:14] [SPEAKER_00]: with the boys and is almost successful in that i i enjoy that she's not a straight up evil person

[00:39:23] [SPEAKER_00]: in the way that homelander is but is doing things a little bit more because of circumstances and

[00:39:31] [SPEAKER_00]: maybe some strange mental desire to be powerful or yeah i don't know but she's she was one of the

[00:39:41] [SPEAKER_00]: more compelling characters this season she was written really well throughout the whole thing

[00:39:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and any scene that she was present in i knew it was going to be good i knew that we were going

[00:39:51] [SPEAKER_00]: to get some nice information it was never boring and it was never pointless when she was on screen

[00:40:00] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah totally agree yeah um are there any other characters we want to touch on before we move

[00:40:08] [SPEAKER_00]: into some of the cinematography special effects themes ideas stuff like that no i think we've

[00:40:17] [SPEAKER_00]: covered all the important players yeah um so let's take a quick little respite from from the plot

[00:40:27] [SPEAKER_00]: and the story to talk about some cinematography some special effects i never noticed a single problem

[00:40:35] [SPEAKER_00]: with the special effects this season everything kind of felt on point looked great to me amazon

[00:40:41] [SPEAKER_00]: i'll never really disappoints with their special effects though well unless it's the wheel of time

[00:40:46] [SPEAKER_00]: season one um but yeah especially not their marquis shows like the boys they don't they don't

[00:40:54] [SPEAKER_00]: really fuck things up with that they always do a good job yeah i feel like the boys the effects

[00:41:01] [SPEAKER_01]: are so good that it like it's it's almost like immersive like they they look so real

[00:41:12] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah um i would expect all of the powers basically to look like that in real life and i think

[00:41:18] [SPEAKER_01]: that's the point so they really hit home with the special effects yeah i mean you you know what's

[00:41:26] [SPEAKER_00]: good when you're not noticing it because clearly if you're not noticing it then it's just it's

[00:41:31] [SPEAKER_00]: doing its job and immersing you into that other reality which is great um did you have any other

[00:41:39] [SPEAKER_00]: thoughts on how it was shot any of the production details the sets things like that um

[00:41:51] [SPEAKER_01]: i don't know um i think it was all great uh cinematography wise um i guess one of the

[00:42:00] [SPEAKER_01]: things i thought was really funny was how well they did the venom shit under butchers skin like how

[00:42:09] [SPEAKER_01]: like it really did look like something was moving around in his veins under his skin

[00:42:16] [SPEAKER_00]: oh that was freaky as fuck i i made my skin crawl every time i watched that thing crawling

[00:42:24] [SPEAKER_00]: around in him oh good god it reminds me of like leeches there you know no you know what it

[00:42:32] [SPEAKER_00]: reminds me of it reminds me of the illithid from balder's gate that's kind of what it was

[00:42:38] [SPEAKER_01]: going to be exactly what it's like actually yeah except isn't that shit just like in your brain

[00:42:46] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah i think so yeah oof all right so let's talk about some of the themes and ideas of this season

[00:42:56] [SPEAKER_00]: chase to what extent did the ends justify the means in uh in a situation like this

[00:43:13] [SPEAKER_00]: sorry about that folks we had a little uh technical issue on our end with uh our recording

[00:43:21] [SPEAKER_00]: and but we're back and so chase to what end ends no way fuck to what extent do ends justify the

[00:43:33] [SPEAKER_01]: means that's what i was trying to get out of my mouth oh my god i gave a whole darn spiel but

[00:43:39] [SPEAKER_01]: my mic was busted um and so i said i do not think genociding all of the soup community just to kill

[00:43:50] [SPEAKER_01]: like the top one percent of soups that are the actual danger and evil doers is valid

[00:44:00] [SPEAKER_00]: wait are you trying to talk i think your microphone cut out again yeah fuck you

[00:44:05] [SPEAKER_01]: i mean yeah buddy

[00:44:10] [SPEAKER_00]: anyway yeah i i mean i think that's the only valid opinion to have is that butcher is going way too

[00:44:17] [SPEAKER_00]: far with this shit i think if that if you're in favor of genociding all the soups like you're

[00:44:25] [SPEAKER_00]: you're just an asshole but yeah i there's no justifying that in any context so i mean

[00:44:34] [SPEAKER_00]: butcher is fucked up he's gonna be a villain if he continues going down this path

[00:44:40] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah it's it's pretty cut and dry in my opinion yeah yeah and another major theme of

[00:44:48] [SPEAKER_00]: this season especially at the end was politics being controlled by the elite whatever yeah that was

[00:44:57] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of the whole thing with vaught ending up being in control of the government by a

[00:45:02] [SPEAKER_00]: homelander at the end just the the boys has always been a lot about corporate

[00:45:08] [SPEAKER_00]: greed and what happens when companies are unchecked stuff like that um that that's always been

[00:45:15] [SPEAKER_00]: a pretty big part of the show which is so ironic because the show is produced by amazon

[00:45:25] [SPEAKER_00]: another major theme in this season um there were there was a lot to do with it felt like class divides

[00:45:34] [SPEAKER_00]: you know soups and people without power it just there was a lot of of illusions to those

[00:45:45] [SPEAKER_00]: things i they weren't really front and center in the season but it was definitely a little bit at play

[00:45:51] [SPEAKER_00]: when when they were writing these scripts jc have any thoughts about that yeah um i think we kind of

[00:45:59] [SPEAKER_01]: get a lot of the themes from the show especially this season shared to us through like the fire

[00:46:09] [SPEAKER_01]: cracker convention like um we get like a lot of fanaticism i would say is like a theme or idea we see

[00:46:20] [SPEAKER_01]: in the show um and like you wrote in the notes a lot of crazy shit that mirrors the real world

[00:46:29] [SPEAKER_01]: in i don't know like misinformation and such stuff like that yeah just the way that things

[00:46:39] [SPEAKER_00]: spread like misinformation spreads and conspiracy theories and populist leaders with

[00:46:49] [SPEAKER_00]: very cult like followings i mean it's um it's all very reminiscent of the real world not even

[00:46:56] [SPEAKER_00]: reminiscent like it's it's a direct and very clear parody anything that you see in the show you

[00:47:02] [SPEAKER_00]: can point to something in real life and be like oh that's what they're trying to say um which

[00:47:08] [SPEAKER_00]: uh i feel like this season was definitely way more forward with that type of messaging they

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_00]: didn't they've never been a subtle show which i feel like people were missing

[00:47:22] [SPEAKER_00]: missing points of the show beforehand but yeah i don't think it's ever been a subtle show it's

[00:47:27] [SPEAKER_00]: always been very obvious in its messaging and i appreciate that i think that the satire they

[00:47:33] [SPEAKER_01]: do of the real world is always very funny yeah usually it's very very spot on so i enjoy it i think

[00:47:43] [SPEAKER_01]: um people who are upset about it have poor media literacy because it's been in the show since

[00:47:51] [SPEAKER_01]: season one um it's just it's definitely more out there now they're doing a lot more this season

[00:48:00] [SPEAKER_01]: they're being a lot bolder with it but i enjoy it yeah they're doing a lot more with the characters

[00:48:06] [SPEAKER_00]: mirroring like real life stuff um and not just the overall themes because the themes have always

[00:48:12] [SPEAKER_00]: been there but i think that the direct lines that you can draw between real world figures

[00:48:18] [SPEAKER_00]: in this season is definitely a lot stronger um should we move on to some most and least

[00:48:25] [SPEAKER_00]: favorite moments of the season to start getting towards the end here uh yeah all right uh do you

[00:48:35] [SPEAKER_01]: have a most favorite moment or two from the season chase um i think um my most favorite moment is probably

[00:48:49] [SPEAKER_01]: when butcher brings the guy into like his garage or wherever he had him like chained up the scientist

[00:48:57] [SPEAKER_01]: guy uh i thought that was like a really funny and unexpected turn of events honestly um when

[00:49:06] [SPEAKER_01]: it especially gives you cut off his leg um like the fact that he had kidnapped him i thought

[00:49:14] [SPEAKER_01]: that was a very funny moment i enjoyed that a lot yeah it was it was even funnier when he's laying there

[00:49:23] [SPEAKER_01]: and he sees butcher like talking to nobody yeah he's like god damn it i've got captured by a tweaker

[00:49:32] [SPEAKER_01]: but yeah that was so good uh least favorite moment i was gonna say probably frenchy reliving his past

[00:49:45] [SPEAKER_01]: arc but worse but now it's probably the frenchy kimiko relationship stuff yeah we already talked

[00:49:58] [SPEAKER_00]: about this but such a weird choice that they made there at the end just we need to pick a lane here

[00:50:05] [SPEAKER_00]: for sure yeah i swear to god if if they start season five and they do this shit again where

[00:50:11] [SPEAKER_00]: they're like so we can't be in a relationship i'm gonna throw a brick at my tv yeah i will throw

[00:50:15] [SPEAKER_01]: a tantrum and a fit there will be there will be issues um another least favorite moment is probably

[00:50:26] [SPEAKER_01]: um probably one of the times the deep is having sex with the dam octopus

[00:50:36] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah that was uh i don't know how they why they decided they just keep making this man

[00:50:46] [SPEAKER_00]: fucks the animals on screen we don't really need to be seeing all that bro is actually obsessed with

[00:50:56] [SPEAKER_00]: octosie it first it was timothy who we fucking ate and now it's oh what was her name what was that

[00:51:04] [SPEAKER_00]: octopus's name i don't know but he killed her right yeah you got like angry at her and broke her

[00:51:11] [SPEAKER_01]: fucking fish tank which doesn't make sense because can't octopuses or octopi however you say the

[00:51:20] [SPEAKER_01]: plural um can't they like live outside of the water for like a fairly long amount of time

[00:51:27] [SPEAKER_01]: and then also i'm pretty sure they can like she could have climbed under that door like i think

[00:51:33] [SPEAKER_00]: they can squeeze in really tight spaces yeah but also why was she completely fine when she was

[00:51:41] [SPEAKER_00]: having sex with the deep like in his bed that's what i'm saying like isn't that even harder to

[00:51:46] [SPEAKER_01]: breathe you got a cock in your mouth but like

[00:51:54] [SPEAKER_01]: but you know what i mean right

[00:52:03] [SPEAKER_01]: words of wisdom words of wisdom i mean is anyone arguing with my point there am i wrong

[00:52:10] [SPEAKER_00]: i i guess not but um any other least least or most favorite points before i start my

[00:52:19] [SPEAKER_01]: my top list uh probably ashley rubbing her discharge on hui's face yeah that was that's

[00:52:29] [SPEAKER_00]: part of my i let i'll go into my least with that the hui torture especially when he was

[00:52:36] [SPEAKER_00]: in tecknight's sex dungeon and that was just too much like you're you're doing too much to this guy

[00:52:43] [SPEAKER_00]: right now if we didn't need all that there was he did not have to go through that for the plot to

[00:52:50] [SPEAKER_00]: move forward no he did actually

[00:52:58] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah well we'll have to agree to disagree on that one but did he have to but they had to

[00:53:05] [SPEAKER_01]: make an episode of it uh a whole episode it was way too much of it that's for damn sure

[00:53:12] [SPEAKER_01]: that i feel like it was a large portion of it i felt like i was watching him get abused for quite a while

[00:53:19] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah i mean he was they showed us a lot they started off with him fucking sitting on a chocolate

[00:53:26] [SPEAKER_00]: cake and then they end with him being full on just traumatized for life not that he hasn't

[00:53:34] [SPEAKER_00]: been traumatized a million other ways this season too but this uh this was particularly

[00:53:40] [SPEAKER_00]: this was one of the rougher ones this and his dad were were the two standout hui torture moments

[00:53:46] [SPEAKER_00]: this uh this season um i would say that my other least moment it was them doing nothing with

[00:53:54] [SPEAKER_00]: the soup killing virus at the end of the season they they could have done something to get us

[00:54:00] [SPEAKER_00]: excited about maybe them using it next season the way that they ended things with that virus

[00:54:06] [SPEAKER_00]: it just makes me think that they're going to abandon the plot line but i don't know uh now on

[00:54:11] [SPEAKER_00]: to some of the the better things that were in this season some of my favorites joe kessler

[00:54:17] [SPEAKER_00]: being in butchers had as soon as he appeared on screen we were kind of speculating that he

[00:54:21] [SPEAKER_00]: wasn't real the internet was abuzz with theories about him being a figment of butcher's imagination

[00:54:28] [SPEAKER_00]: and it ended up being even a step further than that not only is kessler in butchers had but kessler is

[00:54:36] [SPEAKER_00]: a brain tumor that got shot up with compound v when butcher took the v and now it's a parasite

[00:54:44] [SPEAKER_00]: in his body and i just i think that was a really cool direction for them to go in it was an

[00:54:49] [SPEAKER_00]: interesting way for them to handle the transition from butcher taking temp fee to being sick to

[00:54:56] [SPEAKER_00]: needing him to stick around for another season and be a more villainous character i think that

[00:55:02] [SPEAKER_00]: the way that they handled that in retrospect all works very well for me as a as a viewer

[00:55:10] [SPEAKER_00]: i would have to agree my other most i loved that they brought stan adger back for that episode

[00:55:15] [SPEAKER_00]: on the farm i thought that was really funny i i just love giancarlo esposito as an actor

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_00]: and so seeing him come back and be that sort of menacing on-screen presence without being a

[00:55:29] [SPEAKER_00]: physically intimidating person is just awesome he's really great at that at being intimidating without

[00:55:35] [SPEAKER_00]: needing to be a vast physical presence it's it's always cool to watch him play the villain

[00:55:42] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah i think he's a great actor and he portrays characters like that very well i think

[00:55:49] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah always the the brains of the operation but still scary nonetheless some comparisons and

[00:55:56] [SPEAKER_00]: connections to other media i mean there were just so many pop culture and real world references

[00:56:04] [SPEAKER_00]: in the season that if we sat here going through them it would take us all day but i mean to just

[00:56:10] [SPEAKER_00]: go through a few of the superhero comparisons we had hui dressing up to pretend to be webweaver

[00:56:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and webweaver was obviously like a spider man trope a really disgusting spider man trope but a

[00:56:23] [SPEAKER_00]: spider man trope nonetheless butcher got some venom-like powers um and then obviously we had our

[00:56:31] [SPEAKER_00]: other characters who have been around for seasons that have connections to other characters but

[00:56:36] [SPEAKER_00]: chase did you notice any other new characters who are kind of a version of another comic book

[00:56:43] [SPEAKER_01]: no not really i mean i guess like star lights new powers are like kind of like captain marble

[00:56:50] [SPEAKER_01]: if i had to make um a comparison but otherwise no yeah i didn't know who like firecracker was meant

[00:56:59] [SPEAKER_00]: to be like superhero wise i think that she's more uh an allusion to real world

[00:57:07] [SPEAKER_00]: pol like political figures and qanon and stuff like that then she was meant to be an actual superhero

[00:57:13] [SPEAKER_00]: parody um i feel like there's got to be a sister sage uh one for one somewhere in in marvel or

[00:57:22] [SPEAKER_00]: dc but i can't think of any anyone who fits the bill well in marvel i know like the smartest

[00:57:28] [SPEAKER_01]: personal live is a read richard so i don't think that's the connection um and then in dc

[00:57:38] [SPEAKER_00]: it's batman or like oh yeah and tec night is supposed to be like kind of a batman character

[00:57:44] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah tec night is batman but instead of like being obsessed with his childhood trauma he's obsessed

[00:57:51] [SPEAKER_01]: with like fucking holes and uh he's uh freak knight he's a weirdo bro when the butler turned on him

[00:58:01] [SPEAKER_01]: that had me dying yeah dude oh my god guy had had enough and rightfully so i still get the

[00:58:13] [SPEAKER_01]: tick tock clips of them being like and 300 million to black lives matter and then it switches to

[00:58:19] [SPEAKER_01]: a minute goes slow mo and he goes not those people yeah oh my god fucking tec night i thought he was

[00:58:29] [SPEAKER_00]: a weirdo when he showed up in gen v but the boys as always cranks it up to 11 on fucking everything

[00:58:36] [SPEAKER_00]: gotta love it yeah this season obviously had a lot of connections to real life politics which

[00:58:44] [SPEAKER_00]: we don't we're not going to spend too much time on that you you get the picture on that but

[00:58:50] [SPEAKER_00]: they're definitely a lot more obvious in this season and i i don't mind it at all

[00:58:58] [SPEAKER_00]: chase any thoughts before we get into some feedback um i think we covered everything

[00:59:06] [SPEAKER_00]: so let's get into some of our feedback we got a few really got a lot of feedback holy crap

[00:59:13] [SPEAKER_01]: i'm i'm happy to hear that everyone's enjoying our our pod and sending us stuff to talk about

[00:59:21] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah um yeah we got some some good pieces of feedback here first off let's start off with

[00:59:29] [SPEAKER_00]: Nancy who is a very big part of the Lorehounds community Nancy helps out with um some of the

[00:59:36] [SPEAKER_00]: admin administrative stuff over at the Lorehounds and is just all around a great member of the

[00:59:42] [SPEAKER_00]: community so thank you for writing in Nancy i'm sorry it took us so long for actually for everyone

[00:59:47] [SPEAKER_00]: who wrote in sorry it took us so long to get to your guys's feedback uh but thank you nonetheless

[00:59:52] [SPEAKER_00]: for being listeners and engaging with us we really do appreciate it uh Nancy says hi everyone

[00:59:59] [SPEAKER_00]: i am a new listener to your pod i watched the first episode of uh fallout but it wasn't for me

[01:00:04] [SPEAKER_00]: i did hear you promote the boys with the Lorehounds and decided to check it out

[01:00:09] [SPEAKER_00]: i was hooked right away so the last week or so i binged the first three seasons and just finished

[01:00:15] [SPEAKER_00]: the first episodes of season four today listen your first episode of the season

[01:00:19] [SPEAKER_00]: first of all my compliments on your coverage i thought you did a great job thank you Nancy

[01:00:24] [SPEAKER_00]: i love that sometimes you had different opinions about plot and characters

[01:00:27] [SPEAKER_00]: i think that's good for the listener forces us to think about where we land

[01:00:30] [SPEAKER_00]: i'm so glad someone feels the same way i do about frenchie couldn't they come up with something

[01:00:36] [SPEAKER_00]: different for him i hope that he opens up to kamiko i have so much sympathy for butcher

[01:00:41] [SPEAKER_00]: after the episode where he has those memories of his childhood and then his brother committing

[01:00:46] [SPEAKER_00]: suicide wow i'd be very screwed up as well yeah uh yeah butcher goes through it and in his

[01:00:51] [SPEAKER_00]: childhood i'm a bit confused about where they're going with ryan i thought after a good game of

[01:00:57] [SPEAKER_00]: foosball and a good talk with butcher not to mention his horror at killing the poor actor he'd

[01:01:02] [SPEAKER_00]: run from homelander as fast as his soup legs would take him and victoria's daughter what kind of

[01:01:08] [SPEAKER_00]: superpower is it to have killer tentacles coming out of your mouth victoria will be really sorry

[01:01:13] [SPEAKER_01]: for what she did if the deep finds out oh no no tentacle is safe from the

[01:01:25] [SPEAKER_00]: that got me that was that was very good that was the first time i've read that i've read this email

[01:01:31] [SPEAKER_00]: so that was uh that caught me off guard uh nancy listener from canada um thank you so much for

[01:01:38] [SPEAKER_00]: writing in nancy and for giving us a good laugh at that one yeah i mean let's let's start off with

[01:01:43] [SPEAKER_00]: some of this stuff i think that i'm glad that you agree with us about frenchie and kamiko because

[01:01:50] [SPEAKER_00]: it's an opinion that i haven't seen a lot of on the internet and so i don't know where a lot of

[01:01:57] [SPEAKER_00]: the internet wow i'm not always on the internet i live a very um present life i live in the

[01:02:06] [SPEAKER_00]: moment you could say yeah on the internet but i i haven't seen any of these opinions like stated

[01:02:19] [SPEAKER_00]: too often on on the internet so it's good to know that some people are with us and are thinking

[01:02:26] [SPEAKER_00]: the same thing because it's hard to get a read occasionally um i have a lot of sympathy for butchers

[01:02:33] [SPEAKER_00]: well but at the same time i have a hard time liking him anymore he's still he's a really

[01:02:44] [SPEAKER_00]: compelling character but i'm kind of hating him in a good way though i think that the show is

[01:02:50] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of wanting us to to start to fall out of favor with butcher as a character yeah i think

[01:02:57] [SPEAKER_01]: what happens to him or what happened to him as a kid and what happened to his brother and his

[01:03:03] [SPEAKER_01]: relationship with his brother really fucking sucks and his dad was a damn piece of shit um

[01:03:12] [SPEAKER_01]: and homelander or not homelander sorry oh sorry about that butcher he's probably angry that i

[01:03:17] [SPEAKER_01]: called him homelander but um but butcher definitely like got lasting trauma and is definitely really

[01:03:27] [SPEAKER_01]: fucked up about those things um so it like kind of makes you feel for the guy but at the same time

[01:03:35] [SPEAKER_01]: like he's also like a piece of shit so like you're like dang like that i kind of understand

[01:03:44] [SPEAKER_01]: why he's like an asshole but at the same time like he's becoming the bad guy yeah i mean it's just another

[01:03:55] [SPEAKER_00]: example of him and homelander being two sides of the same coin where they both had these people

[01:04:01] [SPEAKER_00]: exactly and they they both had their awful childhoods in different ways and now they're

[01:04:07] [SPEAKER_00]: both doing fucked up shit because they have unresolved trauma that they are not gonna

[01:04:12] [SPEAKER_00]: ever be able to work through so it's it's a really good that generational trauma

[01:04:20] [SPEAKER_00]: it really is it really is vaught did a number on both of them i mean when you think about it

[01:04:26] [SPEAKER_00]: vaught really is um the cause of a lot of their trauma not butcher's childhood but some of butcher's

[01:04:33] [SPEAKER_00]: recent trauma butcher's childhood was uh a different different different i was gonna say

[01:04:42] [SPEAKER_00]: no i think his dad had a damn job man no i was i was thinking more about like what happened with

[01:04:49] [SPEAKER_00]: becca uh for for that side of butcher yeah um but yeah um i'm also confused about where they're

[01:04:59] [SPEAKER_00]: going with ryan i literally i have no clue what they're gonna do with him i fucking hate that

[01:05:03] [SPEAKER_00]: they had ryan kill grace that poor kid i i wanted to see him at least have a chance at not feeling

[01:05:12] [SPEAKER_01]: guilty about everything for the rest of his life well i i was convinced at the beginning of this

[01:05:19] [SPEAKER_01]: season that ryan really was gonna like turn to the good guy's side i think i would talk about it a

[01:05:26] [SPEAKER_01]: little bit in our other episodes um but he just keeps making mistakes and then like staying with

[01:05:33] [SPEAKER_01]: homelander the guy who keeps basically forcing him to make the mistakes i don't i don't understand

[01:05:40] [SPEAKER_01]: i mean he is a kid so he's not really fully responsible but still yeah and i think that

[01:05:48] [SPEAKER_00]: we had a good moment where we saw that he would be able to stand up for himself when he was at the

[01:05:53] [SPEAKER_00]: puppet show uh doing his little like christmas special or whatever and he stands up and makes

[01:06:01] [SPEAKER_00]: his announcement and butcher sees that on on tv i think that was a really good moment where

[01:06:08] [SPEAKER_00]: they could have worked with that and shown us ryan's side where he has that defiance in him like

[01:06:14] [SPEAKER_00]: he's a powerful ass soup he he can think for himself thank you so much for writing in nancy

[01:06:22] [SPEAKER_00]: we hope that you continue to listen now that we're back from our very extended hiatus and um

[01:06:31] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah thank you for tuning in i hope you enjoyed the rest of the season

[01:06:34] [SPEAKER_00]: and if you want to write in let us know what you thought about the season as a whole

[01:06:40] [SPEAKER_00]: we would love to hear from you so thank you yeah thanks for our goat nancy yes excuse me sir

[01:06:48] [SPEAKER_01]: are you gonna let me talk oh my god whoa all right go ahead go ahead i know you're already ruined it

[01:06:55] [SPEAKER_00]: wow okay okay all right let's move on to our very good friend of the podcast peli peli has been a

[01:07:07] [SPEAKER_00]: longtime writer-interf during this season of the boys and we are very lucky to have peli writing in

[01:07:14] [SPEAKER_00]: for our last episode so without further ado let's get into his email hi there my

[01:07:22] [SPEAKER_00]: v-addicted friends in my ears when i first heard of the virus i thought it was a wmd that it was

[01:07:29] [SPEAKER_00]: airborne learning that it is something you inject does change things a bit some of the things related

[01:07:35] [SPEAKER_00]: to it in the pre in the previously on i don't recognize i assume that's gen v stuff for whatever

[01:07:41] [SPEAKER_00]: reason i didn't watch it as it aired and i am as of this episode rejecting it because it seems

[01:07:47] [SPEAKER_00]: that it is required watching after all of this i am at 11 minutes in and even more convinced that

[01:07:55] [SPEAKER_00]: sage knows who leaked the footage it didn't run itself out is deliberate i can't see g and carlo

[01:08:02] [SPEAKER_00]: esposito in anything without thinking gust spring i'm really enjoying it without getting too

[01:08:07] [SPEAKER_00]: political the hyper capitalism scenes both the digs at marvel and the general w w d c e3 c

[01:08:14] [SPEAKER_00]: fives it being fiction does help but put the above mentioned real life events in a perspective how

[01:08:21] [SPEAKER_00]: ridiculous they are all that's missing is a look at under your chair it's a vop box on me moment to

[01:08:27] [SPEAKER_00]: really tie the bow oh boy homelander is doing the cool uncle approach and i think it might work

[01:08:33] [SPEAKER_00]: butcher won't be able to give him infinite freedom because he actually cares this won't end well

[01:08:38] [SPEAKER_00]: animal farm is pretty different from how i remember it i honestly thought the camo family was going to

[01:08:44] [SPEAKER_00]: be an easy family drama not that demented phasing was going to happen it was a good and sad ending

[01:08:51] [SPEAKER_00]: to this chapter this is already running along see you guys for episode six thank you for writing

[01:09:00] [SPEAKER_00]: all right let's get right into it chase where do you want to start

[01:09:07] [SPEAKER_01]: um i i don't remember did they not do a good job integrating the gen v stuff into

[01:09:15] [SPEAKER_00]: the episode i i think that some of it if you didn't see gen v it would have been a little bit

[01:09:20] [SPEAKER_01]: confusing i think maybe like the characters like sam and like yeah probably yeah and i do think

[01:09:28] [SPEAKER_00]: that the sup virus is kind of a big thing to have introduced in another show especially considering

[01:09:34] [SPEAKER_00]: how much they used it in this season yeah that that is fair that is fair yeah but other than that

[01:09:42] [SPEAKER_00]: they i think they did a fairly good job at separating the two things um it it didn't feel

[01:09:50] [SPEAKER_00]: like required to me it felt more like if you know you know uh it just kind of added to the

[01:09:57] [SPEAKER_00]: story but i can see how in some places it definitely would have given that vibe of like

[01:10:03] [SPEAKER_00]: making it inaccessible to certain viewers which is a shame because it was a really great show on

[01:10:09] [SPEAKER_00]: its own and yeah i think that the interconnected show thing is maybe a mistake that too many

[01:10:18] [SPEAKER_00]: franchises are falling into these days they're all falling into the marvel trap

[01:10:25] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah um and i think about the virus i think it's more like hiv than an airborne disease i think

[01:10:32] [SPEAKER_01]: they're talking about how it could be transmitted transmitted through bodily fluid right yeah i

[01:10:40] [SPEAKER_00]: think that's how they said it it can spread when it's not the crazy viral airborne version

[01:10:45] [SPEAKER_00]: that they started talking about later on yeah yeah i think that the idea of it being both

[01:10:54] [SPEAKER_00]: like they it could be just an injection type of thing or it could be that airborne like weapon

[01:11:00] [SPEAKER_00]: of mass destruction um it makes it interesting but it also makes it kind of confusing if the

[01:11:07] [SPEAKER_00]: feel like making it you know yeah yeah um and about i can't see gene carlo esposito in anything

[01:11:19] [SPEAKER_00]: without thinking gustfring yeah i can't either every time i see him whether it's in this or in

[01:11:24] [SPEAKER_00]: the mandalorian i'm like i'm thinking about breaking bad just because he embodied that character

[01:11:30] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah um the hyper capitalism scenes yeah i agree those were done so well because every time they

[01:11:40] [SPEAKER_00]: showed one of those conventions they even did a direct parody of the marvel phases where they

[01:11:44] [SPEAKER_00]: were showing like the next three phases of vaut i thought that was hilarious yeah that was really

[01:11:49] [SPEAKER_01]: funny to me um and i agree with the homelander cool uncle approach he's really just letting ryan

[01:11:57] [SPEAKER_01]: do whatever the hell he wants um and i mean butcher tries to treat him like an actual father

[01:12:04] [SPEAKER_01]: would or an actual responsible adult would i mean as much as butcher can act like a responsible

[01:12:12] [SPEAKER_01]: adult but yeah um so of course ryan's i guess yeah that's a good point for why ryan always

[01:12:20] [SPEAKER_01]: runs home to homelander because he loves freedom as all kids do yeah i do think a certain part of ryan

[01:12:32] [SPEAKER_00]: recognizes that butcher is trying to do the right thing for him because you know he spent most of

[01:12:39] [SPEAKER_00]: his life with becca as his mother and i'm sure that she was a a good like and present mother

[01:12:45] [SPEAKER_00]: uh and then he was with grace malary for a while who i can only assume is kind of like

[01:12:53] [SPEAKER_00]: very structured and trying to do the right thing for ryan in raising this incredibly super powered

[01:13:00] [SPEAKER_00]: person and then you've got butcher trying to like take over that this season and yeah kids kids

[01:13:08] [SPEAKER_00]: love it when adults let them do whatever the hell they want so the promise of homelander

[01:13:13] [SPEAKER_00]: seems a little too good and finally homelander starts to exert a little bit more influence

[01:13:20] [SPEAKER_00]: and control over ryan in the last few episodes and i don't know if that's gonna sit well with ryan i

[01:13:28] [SPEAKER_00]: don't know if it would have sit well with ryan had the whole grace malary thing not happen uh chase

[01:13:34] [SPEAKER_00]: do you have anything to say about the the cambell family episode in the hospital anything about

[01:13:42] [SPEAKER_01]: hui's uh huis dad um just that it felt weird for them to end it with just them like basically injecting

[01:13:54] [SPEAKER_01]: him with like the thing that would kill him i forget what it was it just like put him to sleep

[01:14:00] [SPEAKER_01]: right and then yeah i think it was basically like euthanasia yeah um i felt like it was kind of

[01:14:08] [SPEAKER_01]: weird for them to have that whole like arc almost and then they're just like okay yeah we're actually

[01:14:14] [SPEAKER_01]: just gonna kill you and actually instead of just letting him die in the first place yeah it was

[01:14:23] [SPEAKER_00]: also weird that they did that and then they didn't have his mother around really okay that's what i

[01:14:30] [SPEAKER_01]: was gonna say too it was like as soon as they did that they we saw his mother i think for like

[01:14:34] [SPEAKER_01]: maybe like five minutes after that and then it was like she was gone yeah which i liked their dynamic

[01:14:44] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah um but i don't know like it was just so weird i'm like thinking back it was like that

[01:14:57] [SPEAKER_01]: was completely gone from my head because they literally like chopped it out of the rest of the

[01:15:03] [SPEAKER_01]: story for the rest of the season oh my god that like reminded me yeah what the heck happened to that

[01:15:11] [SPEAKER_01]: dude they actually did nothing with that yeah i i don't really understand it they they had

[01:15:21] [SPEAKER_00]: hui's mom there as a character and then in the last like three episodes three was it three or four

[01:15:26] [SPEAKER_00]: episodes i don't know but she just like wasn't a thing anymore and it was um it was a little bit upsetting

[01:15:35] [SPEAKER_00]: because why why did you introduce this character just to get rid of her the second

[01:15:39] [SPEAKER_00]: she know it feels like the frenchie thing where they just didn't know what to do with the character

[01:15:44] [SPEAKER_00]: and instead of finding a good way to write in hui's mom or write in frenchie into those

[01:15:49] [SPEAKER_00]: few episodes they were like well hui's in prison or i'm not hui fucking frenchie's in prison

[01:15:59] [SPEAKER_01]: hui's in prison you know it's crazy you know it's crazy what her whole thing was like i wasn't there

[01:16:05] [SPEAKER_01]: for you as a kid but i'm here now and then now she's not here yeah because he was what the heck man

[01:16:16] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah because hui's dad was always there for him in the show so it's not like yeah and now he's

[01:16:20] [SPEAKER_01]: dead and she's fucking gone suddenly he has no one bro what the fuck rick hui

[01:16:27] [SPEAKER_00]: all right pq more hui abuse once again jeez that poor guy all right well let's see was there anything

[01:16:37] [SPEAKER_00]: else yeah i think that is it in terms of feedback um you guys thank you so much for writing in

[01:16:46] [SPEAKER_00]: once again we're sorry that it took us a little while to get to your feedback and get a new episode

[01:16:52] [SPEAKER_00]: out but we do appreciate your patience we appreciate you writing in to be a part of the conversation

[01:16:57] [SPEAKER_00]: because it makes this a whole lot more fun so if you are tuning in to our final episode of our

[01:17:06] [SPEAKER_00]: boys coverage until we come back for next season of course uh then thank you for listening chase

[01:17:13] [SPEAKER_00]: do you have any closing thoughts before we wrap things up here yeah i want to say sorry for the

[01:17:21] [SPEAKER_01]: long hiatus everyone we did promise a weekly show and we did not deliver and we're sorry for that

[01:17:28] [SPEAKER_01]: and we also want to say thank you to the lore hounds for sticking with us and being very

[01:17:35] [SPEAKER_00]: understanding of our circumstances yeah thank you so much for sticking with us through it all

[01:17:42] [SPEAKER_00]: and giving us this platform because yeah we've been uh leaving this podcast on the back burner

[01:17:51] [SPEAKER_00]: while other things have been going on for the past uh like month and a half specifically i've

[01:17:57] [SPEAKER_00]: been delaying the podcast it's more my fault than anyone else is we of course we've had some

[01:18:02] [SPEAKER_00]: mutual scheduling problems but it was more uh more my fault that this has been delayed a

[01:18:07] [SPEAKER_00]: bit but we are hopefully going to be back now to some regularly scheduled podcasts

[01:18:15] [SPEAKER_00]: we're gonna try and re-record the elden ring podcast that we were wanting to get out because

[01:18:21] [SPEAKER_00]: some some strange things happened with the audio files um some what what did happen with our

[01:18:29] [SPEAKER_00]: with the audio files i remember there was some kind of problem with it i think what happened is

[01:18:33] [SPEAKER_01]: you said we could leave the the like what is this zen caster before the thing had like fully downloaded

[01:18:42] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah the audio files so yeah once everyone has um listened to this episode just go into

[01:18:50] [SPEAKER_01]: the discord and say erin's a piece of shit uh we'll know you've listened and it'll be a nice

[01:18:56] [SPEAKER_01]: nice little um ego boost for us to know that people are listening still yeah you can even

[01:19:04] [SPEAKER_00]: at me when you tell me i'm a piece of shit we mentioned that we were thankful to the

[01:19:10] [SPEAKER_00]: lorehounds for sticking with us while we were on this hiatus so let's give a quick shout out to

[01:19:15] [SPEAKER_00]: a lot of the programming that they have going on right now the main lorehounds feed

[01:19:21] [SPEAKER_00]: is going to be covering the rings of power coming up soon that's the show that really started them off

[01:19:27] [SPEAKER_00]: and that's coming back in just a couple weeks and i think that everyone over in the lorehounds

[01:19:34] [SPEAKER_00]: community is getting really hyped to start talking about that again so go over there they've got

[01:19:40] [SPEAKER_00]: a preview podcast out for the trailer and they're just they're always having great conversations

[01:19:46] [SPEAKER_00]: about movies and television check them out and over on the affiliate side there is of course

[01:19:54] [SPEAKER_00]: rings and rituals will shift dust properly howard movie review the severance podcast is going to be

[01:20:01] [SPEAKER_00]: coming back at a later date um once severance is sort of figured out and they have a like final

[01:20:10] [SPEAKER_00]: release date for that on apple tv plus and of course the star wars canon timeline podcast

[01:20:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and links to all of those shows are going to be in our show notes and once again thank you all

[01:20:22] [SPEAKER_00]: so much for listening and we hope to see you in the next episode