BONUS: The Top Shows of 2024 - This Time with Friends

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[00:00:35] We are the Lorehounds, your guides to podcasts that go on too long and have to stretch into new episodes.

[00:00:40] But this year we planned it because it happened last year.

[00:00:43] And so here we are with the second part of our Public Second Breakfast where we interview all of the co-hosts and affiliates that we could get on the mic and find out what their top three shows are of the year.

[00:00:54] Don't forget if you missed it on the public feed and on the Patreon and Supercast feeds, you can find our top ten rankings for the Triarchy, the three of us, David, Alicia and I, and also the community rankings.

[00:01:06] So we used a rank choice system. We made sure that every vote that went in counted for something.

[00:01:12] You can enjoy that. I think it's about two and a half hours. Go check that out.

[00:01:16] If you want to send us any feedback on any of this, please send us an email to lorehounds at the lorehounds.com or you can head into our Discord server where we have a whole channel dedicated to all your debates of what are the top ten shows of 2024.

[00:01:30] Check all that out. It's in the link tree. And don't forget, if you want more Second Breakfast, you can sign up for Supercast or Patreon and support us and get a ton of bonus content.

[00:01:40] Thanks, everyone, and enjoy the conversations.

[00:01:50] All right. With me is Marilyn Arpukila, our favorite Tolkien scholar, here to give her three top shows of 2024.

[00:01:58] Marilyn, what do you got for me?

[00:02:01] Well, I'm going to cheat a little bit because, well, you'll see. I'm actually going to give you top five very quickly.

[00:02:10] But these are shows that would not appear on the Lorehounds, but I just wanted to show you the sort of...

[00:02:16] Oh, you don't have to pick a Lorehound show. You can always rank shows that we did not cover.

[00:02:21] And that's what I'm doing here. So, number five is Bridgerton.

[00:02:24] Okay.

[00:02:25] I'd never seen it before. Caught up with it and then watched the newest series to the end and then started watching Queen Charlotte.

[00:02:34] It's historical details in terms of costume and so forth are very, very good. And I like the plots.

[00:02:40] And, you know, it's not for, you know, young children. They do get very sexual in a lot of their things.

[00:02:47] But for some reason, that often bothers me. But in this case, it doesn't. So, you know, good on them.

[00:02:52] And then speaking of historical fiction, there's The Crown.

[00:02:56] Again, hadn't watched any of it when it was coming out year to year, but decided in the final season that we'd at least check it out.

[00:03:05] And as an historian of England, I know there's a lot of liberties that they took.

[00:03:10] I still enjoyed it as a series because kind of like what Rings of Power has taught me, I was taking it on their own terms.

[00:03:19] And I wanted to see, okay, what stories are they telling?

[00:03:22] Why are they telling it that way?

[00:03:24] And again, the production value is stunning.

[00:03:27] Yeah.

[00:03:28] And really interesting to listen to the official podcast because they several times referred, this is why I loved it.

[00:03:36] They referred to their research historian who they would go to for all kinds of questions and details.

[00:03:45] And so she had a lot to say.

[00:03:46] And I really loved that a lot.

[00:03:48] Oh, very nice.

[00:03:49] Okay.

[00:03:49] That's my indulgence.

[00:03:51] Number three for me is Shogun.

[00:03:53] Okay.

[00:03:53] Which is interesting because I never watched it.

[00:03:56] That is very interesting.

[00:03:57] How did you get there?

[00:03:58] I got there through the podcast, through having my own contributions historically included in feedback, through Nate's wonderful historical information.

[00:04:10] He's back for Pachinko.

[00:04:12] I know.

[00:04:12] I'm not going to watch Pachinko.

[00:04:14] I don't think I'm going to participate in it.

[00:04:16] I'm listening to it.

[00:04:17] I am listening, though.

[00:04:18] And it sounds fascinating.

[00:04:19] It's very clear that it's not my kind of show.

[00:04:22] So apologies to all you Pachinko lovers out there.

[00:04:25] Yeah, I did see two bits of it.

[00:04:29] Okay.

[00:04:29] I did see Mariko in the courtyard.

[00:04:33] Ah, okay.

[00:04:34] Beautiful scene.

[00:04:35] Famous scene there.

[00:04:36] And I watched John Black teaching the Shogun how to dance a hornpipe.

[00:04:42] That was just really cool.

[00:04:45] But I was drawn to it basically because of the Lord Hans' coverage.

[00:04:49] Mm-hmm.

[00:04:50] And, you know, hearing good things about it, it seemed to be really, if you're going to do a historical recreation in that sense,

[00:05:00] it seemed like they were firing on all cylinders and so much praise for it that I thought it had to be there.

[00:05:06] Yeah, beautiful subversion of violent tropes in favor of the story of an individual woman coming over, really taking over a society with her resistance.

[00:05:21] Yeah, yeah.

[00:05:22] No, it was great.

[00:05:24] So number two is Agatha.

[00:05:26] Okay.

[00:05:27] Again, wonderful production values, great podcast coverage from everybody.

[00:05:35] I contributed, you know, various comments and so forth.

[00:05:38] But I was disappointed that they stuck with the tired old stereotype of the witch.

[00:05:47] Because I taught courses on the religion of contemporary witchcraft.

[00:05:52] So I come at it from that angle.

[00:05:54] And I know about the ways that nature are used.

[00:05:58] I know about the concepts.

[00:06:00] The fact that this is a living, breathing, growing religion.

[00:06:04] There is a 501c3 category of churches that are, in fact, Wiccan covenants.

[00:06:09] Mm-hmm.

[00:06:10] And there are pagan representations on the world consultation to world religions.

[00:06:18] There are Wiccans serving in the military.

[00:06:21] The military can now get Wiccan images on their gravestones if they want to.

[00:06:26] So it's a real thing.

[00:06:28] And it was done so spectacularly.

[00:06:33] It was so eye-catching.

[00:06:34] It was so memorable and touching.

[00:06:37] That, once again, it's just going to reinforce, you know, the tired old stereotype.

[00:06:42] It'll be interesting to talk with Leisha about this when we get to Wicked.

[00:06:45] Yeah.

[00:06:45] You know, because Margaret Hamilton with her green skin was one of the classic creators of current day witch stereotypes.

[00:06:53] You don't know, there's a clip of her on Mr. Rogers circulating.

[00:06:56] Where she shows a lot of empathy for the Wicked Witch.

[00:06:59] And she goes, you know, she is someone who just is trying to get what she wants.

[00:07:06] And continues to be struck down.

[00:07:09] And you could see that there were sort of the roots of what would become Wicked in the original performance.

[00:07:18] Yeah, I tried to read the book and I just couldn't stand the depressing child abuse that was going on.

[00:07:25] Yeah, the book's a lot darker.

[00:07:26] I started reading it at one point and I had the same experience.

[00:07:29] I just couldn't go there.

[00:07:31] I loved the middle chunk.

[00:07:34] The first episode and the last episode of Agatha were the most disturbing and distressing to me.

[00:07:39] But the middle chunk where they're forming the coven, they're on the journey, they're doing all these things.

[00:07:46] That was good.

[00:07:47] There was character development.

[00:07:49] They were drawing upon, you know, things related to witchcraft in good ways.

[00:07:55] I love the character of Lilia.

[00:07:57] She was my favorite.

[00:07:59] And as listeners to the podcast will know, that became the Lilia of our little coven.

[00:08:05] Yeah, you did.

[00:08:09] And then it just all was spoiled for me by this woman who decides it's all right for her to kill witches.

[00:08:16] Well, at the same time, I think if we're going to fairly depict any group, it's not going to be all good and it's not going to be all bad.

[00:08:23] There's going to be good and bad members of that group.

[00:08:26] Of course there are.

[00:08:27] But the good members just have not gotten equal representation.

[00:08:32] I hear what you're saying.

[00:08:34] And with something as big and as well done as this series was, I'm just sorry that, you know, Lilia was really about the only one I can think of who, well.

[00:08:47] Jen got there in the end, I think.

[00:08:49] Jen was good.

[00:08:49] Alice was good.

[00:08:50] So it was all her coven mates, you know, who were like, okay, you know, I could live with this.

[00:08:54] I definitely could.

[00:08:55] I would say the good ones outnumbered the bad.

[00:08:58] Yeah.

[00:08:59] And yet Agatha remains the focus of attention and, you know, why Billy wants to go off with her to look for his brother.

[00:09:07] I, you know, I just don't get it.

[00:09:10] I don't get it.

[00:09:10] Anyway.

[00:09:11] But you liked it enough to make it your number two.

[00:09:13] I did.

[00:09:14] Based on quality and, you know, a whole lot of things.

[00:09:17] Number one was Rings of Power.

[00:09:19] I couldn't have seen that coming from a mile away.

[00:09:23] Yeah, I'm sure you could.

[00:09:25] Because you had your blindfold on, right?

[00:09:27] Yep.

[00:09:29] Yeah.

[00:09:29] Yeah.

[00:09:29] Yeah.

[00:09:29] No, it was so much better than season one.

[00:09:31] It was.

[00:09:32] It was.

[00:09:32] It was.

[00:09:32] It really improved.

[00:09:34] And again, thinking production values, the amount of time and energy put in, costuming,

[00:09:39] all the visuals, spectacular, Bear McCurry's amazing score, the unfolding of these characters.

[00:09:47] And yes, they're going off the reservation.

[00:09:49] They're going off the rails as far as, you know, people who want to stick to Tolkien's writings are concerned.

[00:09:56] And I certainly am one of those who respects the lore, otherwise I wouldn't be here, right?

[00:10:01] Mm-hmm.

[00:10:02] Having done the podcast of Rings and Rituals really helped me to develop a lens that said,

[00:10:10] I want to watch this as a story that the storytellers are developing.

[00:10:16] And they're Tolkien adjacent most of the time if they're not actually reproducing Tolkien.

[00:10:22] And so, I would not have had the kind of insight into orcs that I did if they had not done what they did in the two series.

[00:10:33] Which really stretched.

[00:10:35] I mean, there was lore justification for all the things they did.

[00:10:39] But golly, people had a hard time with it.

[00:10:42] And then as a result said, oh, well, Tolkien wouldn't like this.

[00:10:45] And all I can say to that is, oh, you've talked with him lately?

[00:10:49] Have you read?

[00:10:50] It's a little hard to have a conversation.

[00:10:52] All 12 volumes of the Histories of Middle-Earth and seen how his own ideas about orcs change over time.

[00:10:57] But, you know, David and I did that podcast episode and it was incredibly moving to me.

[00:11:04] And then this season, what happened when Adar put on Galatiril's ring?

[00:11:13] Completely out of left field.

[00:11:15] And it was so wonderful.

[00:11:18] You know, yes, there is a possibility for redemption.

[00:11:22] And then heartbreaking when it was cut off.

[00:11:27] So, yeah, I thought they did really well.

[00:11:29] You know, Elvon got me a bit fussed for a while.

[00:11:32] You know, he was a bit of a nudnik.

[00:11:38] I don't know what you want to call it.

[00:11:39] I called him worse thing at one point.

[00:11:42] But he redeemed himself in the end, you know, when he finally realized, okay, my friend's life really is more important to me than my own purity.

[00:11:51] In approaching to these issues of, you know, good and evil.

[00:11:54] And what are the tools that you use to accomplish your ends and so forth.

[00:11:58] So I'm really looking forward to where they go from there.

[00:12:01] And I hope that they continue on, you know, onward and upward.

[00:12:06] Yeah, it was a really great season.

[00:12:09] I'm looking forward to season three.

[00:12:11] And I'm glad that you put it at number one.

[00:12:13] I think that that's very fitting for you, Marilyn.

[00:12:16] Well, thanks.

[00:12:17] I probably am the only one who did out of all the folks that you're going to be.

[00:12:20] You know, it was under consideration for me.

[00:12:23] By the time I haven't, you know, I haven't actually put together my full list since.

[00:12:27] Oh, okay.

[00:12:27] Because I'm recording this in the past.

[00:12:30] And by the time this gets to people's ear holes, they'll have already heard probably my top ten.

[00:12:36] But that's still in the recesses of my mind.

[00:12:40] But for now, I have to dig into the recesses of your mind and ask you some rapid fire bonus questions.

[00:12:46] Uh-oh, you didn't tell me about this.

[00:12:48] All right.

[00:12:49] Carry on.

[00:12:49] I didn't, and I'm sorry.

[00:12:51] What was your biggest miss of the year?

[00:12:53] So a show that you wish you had watched and plan to watch in the future.

[00:12:59] Hmm.

[00:13:00] Yeah, you asked this last year, and I was prepared.

[00:13:05] Um, I'm just having a really hard time remembering what all the shows were that we covered this year.

[00:13:11] You got Dune, House of the Dragon.

[00:13:13] Uh, you've got Echo, the Marvel show.

[00:13:19] Well, I really wish I could have watched Echo.

[00:13:22] But I just, I'm just not into that level of violence.

[00:13:26] And people all said, oh, yeah, on the Pequila scale.

[00:13:28] And I'm like, okay.

[00:13:29] I really would have liked to have seen a Marvel story through the lens of indigenous concepts.

[00:13:37] Mm-hmm.

[00:13:39] So, I'm sorry that that didn't happen.

[00:13:42] Yeah.

[00:13:42] But, um.

[00:13:43] That's your biggest miss, then?

[00:13:46] I think so.

[00:13:47] Now, of course, as soon as we end this conversation, I'll think, oh, why didn't I say this?

[00:13:51] But.

[00:13:52] I think, I think that's a good big miss.

[00:13:55] I mean, it's one of my biggest misses of the year.

[00:13:57] Uh-huh.

[00:13:57] Uh-huh.

[00:13:58] And if I, I think you kind of already answered this by doing your top five.

[00:14:03] But your guilty pleasure wild card of the year.

[00:14:06] Something that wouldn't go on your top three, but you would like to give a shout out to anyway.

[00:14:11] Oh, no, this is the same answer as last year, and it's the librarians.

[00:14:15] Yeah.

[00:14:15] We still haven't finished that.

[00:14:18] Other things keep popping up and saying, oh, let's watch this now.

[00:14:21] Because librarians, thank goodness, are, you know, on free watch and various streaming methods.

[00:14:26] So, yes, it's, um, it's creative, it's entertaining, um, you know, they have challenges and so on, but there's character development.

[00:14:37] Um, and there is some, some lore going on there.

[00:14:43] Um, but it's just, it's nice to just kick back and relax and, you know, watch some of those.

[00:14:50] I don't say that it's a guilty pleasure.

[00:14:53] I don't.

[00:14:54] Yeah, it's a wild card.

[00:14:56] We're calling them.

[00:14:57] Yeah.

[00:14:58] Yeah.

[00:14:59] All right.

[00:14:59] So my, my candy pleasure, me, my popcorn pleasure.

[00:15:02] There you go.

[00:15:02] There you go.

[00:15:03] So last question, your most anticipated show of 2025, you know, severance and or, uh, you've got, um, uh, the wheel of time season three.

[00:15:17] Uh, a lot of, a lot of stuff going on.

[00:15:19] What's, uh, for you.

[00:15:21] Yeah.

[00:15:21] And or.

[00:15:22] Yeah.

[00:15:23] Yeah.

[00:15:23] It's a good one.

[00:15:24] Yeah.

[00:15:24] No, I remember again, it's interesting.

[00:15:27] That's one of the ones where we watched the first episode and said, oh, I don't want to spend any time with these people.

[00:15:33] And then everybody else said, oh, this is great.

[00:15:35] This is what I, and you guys kind of gently said, well, you know, there's this and there's that.

[00:15:41] And I got into it and I was like, oh, it's the hero's journey.

[00:15:45] And we did that wonderful episode together about that.

[00:15:48] Yeah.

[00:15:48] That was great.

[00:15:49] Yeah.

[00:15:50] No, you really helped me again, shift the viewing somewhat and see, okay.

[00:15:56] Yeah.

[00:15:56] We try.

[00:15:57] And I don't know how much of it was the phenomenon of, well, this isn't my star Wars because I don't really do that necessarily.

[00:16:04] Um, it's, I like to see the different worlds and things.

[00:16:11] Um, I forgot Acolyte.

[00:16:14] Golly.

[00:16:14] I just remember.

[00:16:15] Was that this year?

[00:16:16] That was this year.

[00:16:17] Yeah.

[00:16:17] Oh, holy cow.

[00:16:18] I guess Shogun is going to drop to number four.

[00:16:21] You're going to change it last minute, huh?

[00:16:23] Well, you know.

[00:16:25] All right.

[00:16:25] Fair enough.

[00:16:26] Because I watched it.

[00:16:26] I watched Acolyte.

[00:16:28] Yeah.

[00:16:28] You know?

[00:16:29] Yeah.

[00:16:30] Okay.

[00:16:30] I think I have to do that.

[00:16:31] And, and I was some pissed that they didn't renew it.

[00:16:35] I know.

[00:16:36] I'm still pissed about it.

[00:16:37] I hope, I hope they change their minds somehow.

[00:16:39] I don't think it's going to happen, but.

[00:16:41] But you see, this is the problem.

[00:16:42] I've already forgotten it because, you know.

[00:16:45] Yeah, I know.

[00:16:45] Moving into all these other things.

[00:16:46] So yeah.

[00:16:47] I'm really glad you said that, John.

[00:16:48] Yeah.

[00:16:49] No, the story was fantastic.

[00:16:50] The characters are great.

[00:16:51] The, the imagery, the concepts.

[00:16:55] We had some really serious discussions about things like social work and.

[00:17:00] Yeah.

[00:17:01] You know, telling a story from different points of view and how does that story actually look.

[00:17:08] And, you know, they're, they're still drinking from the well of, you know, evil characters are not as evil as you think they are kind of thing, which.

[00:17:17] Not my favorite trope, but, you know, it's interesting to see how people try to justify stuff.

[00:17:23] Yeah.

[00:17:24] But golly, that was just wicked to leave us.

[00:17:29] I know.

[00:17:30] With so many dangling threads.

[00:17:32] I know.

[00:17:33] And such a powerful series.

[00:17:34] And, you know, more than a little of it was due to the haters and that I really, that really distresses.

[00:17:40] Well, Marilyn, fear not.

[00:17:42] There's plenty more Star Wars coming in 2025.

[00:17:45] It's been a lovely year of podcasting with you.

[00:17:48] Likewise, John.

[00:17:48] And I hope you have a happy new year.

[00:17:50] And to you.

[00:17:51] Thanks a lot.

[00:17:52] It's John in the future now.

[00:17:54] Marilyn wrote to me just after we recorded and said, please, John, clarify after the recording that I really should have said the acolyte would be my number two and Agatha would be my number three.

[00:18:05] So, Marilyn, don't worry.

[00:18:07] We've corrected your rankings.

[00:18:15] Hey, Lorehounds.

[00:18:16] I'm Mark.

[00:18:16] And I'm Nicole.

[00:18:17] And this is not Nevermind the Music.

[00:18:20] Not quite.

[00:18:23] What are we talking about today, Mark?

[00:18:25] We are doing our wrap up for 2024 for the Lorehounds.

[00:18:30] First question.

[00:18:30] Top three shows of 2024.

[00:18:33] Who's going first?

[00:18:34] I'll go first.

[00:18:35] My top three shows for 2024 are like notably not Lorehound-y.

[00:18:40] But here it is.

[00:18:42] I really liked English Teacher.

[00:18:44] I thought that that was a hilarious show.

[00:18:45] You should binge it on Hulu and also follow him on Instagram because he has great content.

[00:18:51] I also really like him.

[00:18:52] Like the creator?

[00:18:54] The creator.

[00:18:54] He plays the English teacher and he's also the creator.

[00:18:57] And he is doing this big marketing push to have people watch the English teacher where he just posts the same video every day over and over again.

[00:19:05] And at first it was annoying, but now it's like it's really, really funny.

[00:19:10] I also really enjoyed season two of Shrinking.

[00:19:13] It's one of my favorite shows just as someone that like kind of lives in this counseling world, psychology world.

[00:19:19] Did you like season one of Shrinking?

[00:19:20] I did.

[00:19:21] I was a fan for sure.

[00:19:22] Because we're watching it now.

[00:19:23] We're catching up.

[00:19:24] I'm struggling a little bit with it.

[00:19:25] The jokes feel a little bit like the teenager talks like she was written by a 40 something.

[00:19:31] Well, yeah.

[00:19:32] A little bit.

[00:19:32] So I'm struggling with it, but we're still hanging in there.

[00:19:35] Season two is better.

[00:19:36] Okay.

[00:19:36] It gets like darker and more nuanced in a way that like really tickles me.

[00:19:41] And I just, I love the cast.

[00:19:42] I think it's just a great ensemble and they add more characters into the second season that feels very rich and great.

[00:19:48] So I'd check it out.

[00:19:50] Does Harrison Ford get frozen in carbonite at the end of the second season?

[00:19:53] I don't want to spoil it for you, Mark.

[00:19:55] Come on, be cool.

[00:19:56] And then the third, I kind of debated, but I am going to nod to the Lorehounds and say Agatha all along.

[00:20:01] I really, really enjoyed that.

[00:20:03] More than I thought I would.

[00:20:04] It was my first kind of real entry into the MCU, which I know is a weird path to take, but I really, really loved it.

[00:20:12] And I'm, I'm bummed that it didn't get more accolades during like the upcoming awards season that people didn't like honor Agatha because it was so good.

[00:20:21] Yeah.

[00:20:21] That was a good show.

[00:20:22] Love that show.

[00:20:23] How about you?

[00:20:23] All right.

[00:20:23] My three.

[00:20:24] I've got the second season of Interview with the Vampire.

[00:20:27] Did you watch that at all?

[00:20:29] So it's based on the Anne Rice books.

[00:20:32] And I read those years ago.

[00:20:34] I read a bunch of them, probably like half the series, which is like six books or whatever, back in the 2000s.

[00:20:39] And is Brad Pitt in it?

[00:20:41] Brad Pitt is not in this one.

[00:20:43] It's the guy who plays Grey Worm from Game of Thrones.

[00:20:46] Did you watch Game of Thrones?

[00:20:47] Oh, yeah.

[00:20:47] He's awesome.

[00:20:48] But anyway, second season, it's just, it's just so good.

[00:20:51] Like it, it's one of those things where they've changed so much from the books and it's so much better.

[00:20:56] I think like I reread the original book.

[00:20:59] It's based on first two seasons are based on the first book.

[00:21:02] And I just found myself liking the book so much less than the season of TV.

[00:21:07] So highly recommended folks.

[00:21:08] I'm sure it'll get full coverage by the Lorehounds next time around.

[00:21:11] My second one is, is a Lorehounds show, though not maybe the one people would think.

[00:21:15] True Detective Night Country, which is the newest season.

[00:21:18] I just really enjoyed the energy of it, the vibe of it.

[00:21:23] It, it had a lot of what I loved about the first season and the, I guess the third season of that show.

[00:21:30] So really liked that one.

[00:21:32] I did struggle with the last one because I participated in the Lord of the Rings and all that.

[00:21:37] I kind of really wanted to do that.

[00:21:39] But I think I'm going with the second season of House of the Dragon.

[00:21:43] I'm just so immersed in that world that it became appointment TV and so was Rings of Power.

[00:21:50] But there's something about, I don't even know that it's how good it was, second season of that show.

[00:21:54] But I'm just, I was sucking it all up.

[00:21:56] Like, I just really enjoyed it.

[00:21:57] I haven't seen that yet.

[00:21:58] We're still trying to finish Game of Thrones.

[00:22:01] My husband's saying we need to watch Game of Thrones before House of the Dragon,

[00:22:05] which I know isn't really the right order according to the timeline.

[00:22:09] It's the right order.

[00:22:10] Yeah.

[00:22:10] But like, according to like, we need, that's what we need to do.

[00:22:13] So we're almost done, but it's...

[00:22:15] You'll like it.

[00:22:15] It's good.

[00:22:16] It's a good show.

[00:22:17] Yeah, cool.

[00:22:17] All right.

[00:22:18] Biggest miss of the year.

[00:22:19] This does not mean the worst show.

[00:22:21] This is...

[00:22:21] Which show do you wish you watched that you were like, oh my God, I can't believe I didn't watch that.

[00:22:25] I wish I watched House of the Dragon.

[00:22:27] I wish that like I was following along with it because it's so much in the lexicon and the culture

[00:22:32] I live in that like I know stuff about it that's going to take away from the viewing experience.

[00:22:37] Yeah.

[00:22:37] We were moving during House of the Dragon season one and I felt so disconnected,

[00:22:42] like fearing spoilers and stuff.

[00:22:44] Like I hadn't read the book it was based on at the time, right?

[00:22:47] So it's so much better to be engaged when it's happening.

[00:22:50] How about you?

[00:22:51] I actually sort of have a tie.

[00:22:53] One is Shogun, which I've heard so many good things about it.

[00:22:56] Oh, I didn't see that either.

[00:22:56] I do not have Hulu.

[00:22:59] So I'll have to catch it some other way in the future.

[00:23:01] Hulu's the best one.

[00:23:03] Is it the best one?

[00:23:03] I think it's the best one.

[00:23:04] English teacher.

[00:23:06] Okay.

[00:23:06] Anything that's on like regular TV is on Hulu.

[00:23:10] That's true.

[00:23:11] I guess that's true.

[00:23:12] You watch more regular TV than me.

[00:23:13] You watch like sitcoms and stuff.

[00:23:15] Yeah.

[00:23:15] We Are Lady Parts is my other miss.

[00:23:17] I really liked the first season of that.

[00:23:18] I don't even know what that's on.

[00:23:20] I don't remember.

[00:23:20] It's on one of the random ones.

[00:23:22] It's about this British all-female, all-Muslim punk rock band.

[00:23:27] That's cool.

[00:23:28] It's funny.

[00:23:29] I've heard of it, but I never watched it.

[00:23:31] I kind of forgot that it existed.

[00:23:32] It just scratches an itch for me.

[00:23:34] I really liked the first season.

[00:23:35] So I have not seen second season.

[00:23:36] I don't even know how well-reviewed it was, but I wish I was watching it.

[00:23:40] Do you ever watch Sex Education?

[00:23:42] My wife watches that.

[00:23:43] It's good.

[00:23:44] It makes me uncomfortable because I walk in the room and I'm like, these are supposed

[00:23:48] to be high schoolers, right?

[00:23:49] And I'm like, yeah, I can't.

[00:23:51] Well, that's happening.

[00:23:52] I can't watch that.

[00:23:53] Like, sorry, you can perv if you want, wife.

[00:23:56] I'm not perving.

[00:23:58] Okay.

[00:23:59] Perv.

[00:24:00] Guilty pleasure for you.

[00:24:02] Oh my gosh.

[00:24:02] Is there a show you watched?

[00:24:03] I know you've made some illusions.

[00:24:05] Are there some shows you watched that you sort of aren't so sure are good, but you loved

[00:24:10] them?

[00:24:10] No.

[00:24:11] All the shows I watch, I'm not so sure are good, but I love them.

[00:24:14] Yeah.

[00:24:15] Love is the latest season of Love is Blind.

[00:24:17] A hundred percent.

[00:24:18] Got so into it.

[00:24:20] Do you watch Love is Blind?

[00:24:21] No.

[00:24:21] You mentioned it before.

[00:24:22] Do you know the premise of it?

[00:24:23] Blind date stuff?

[00:24:25] No.

[00:24:25] No.

[00:24:25] So they bring a bunch of couples, they're pre-screened and like personality tested, I'm

[00:24:30] sure, into an environment that they date in between a wall.

[00:24:36] Like they put them in pods.

[00:24:37] Oh.

[00:24:37] The pods like share a wall that you can communicate through and they date and propose and accept

[00:24:45] the marriage proposal without seeing each other.

[00:24:49] And then they do like a big reveal that they see each other.

[00:24:52] And then they go on a honeymoon together.

[00:24:56] And that's usually where things fall apart.

[00:24:58] About like four weeks into the whole experience, they go and have a wedding and they decide

[00:25:02] on the altar if they're going to actually marry this person.

[00:25:05] That's a healthy foundation.

[00:25:06] It's delicious.

[00:25:10] And sometimes like it works, but sometimes they see each other and they're like, nope.

[00:25:14] Yikes.

[00:25:15] My guilty pleasure.

[00:25:16] I feel kind of bad because I don't know if this is good or bad.

[00:25:20] I really enjoyed it, though.

[00:25:21] It's called Three Body Problem.

[00:25:23] Have you heard of this?

[00:25:23] It's on Netflix.

[00:25:24] I've seen it.

[00:25:25] It was great.

[00:25:26] Yeah.

[00:25:26] See, I really enjoyed it.

[00:25:27] But like, I'm kind of like, I don't know if this is good.

[00:25:30] Like, I don't know that I buy like all these 30 year old supermodel PhDs.

[00:25:36] Like they all he's like super.

[00:25:38] Oh, there's something about something else.

[00:25:40] There's something about.

[00:25:41] So I'm a sucker for search for extraterrestrial intelligence stuff.

[00:25:45] So it's like, what if what if an alien answered the message that they sent out in the 70s?

[00:25:49] That's like the premise.

[00:25:50] And stuff starts getting weird 30 years later, 40 years later when they start communicating.

[00:25:54] I'm thinking of a show called Bodies.

[00:25:56] I don't know what that is.

[00:25:57] But it's based on the comic book.

[00:25:59] The Lorehounds will know.

[00:26:00] Lorehounds respond.

[00:26:01] Can you let us know?

[00:26:02] Three Body Problem is based on a series of novels that I think originally

[00:26:06] Mandarin language novels.

[00:26:07] But I don't know.

[00:26:08] I'm really enjoying it.

[00:26:09] But I'm not so sure how good it is.

[00:26:11] But but I like it.

[00:26:13] I'm a sucker for it.

[00:26:14] Last question.

[00:26:15] Most anticipated show of 2025?

[00:26:20] I've been really into Silo lately, and I'm eager to see where that goes.

[00:26:24] I'm like, you know, I'm caught up with season two.

[00:26:26] So I just want to keep watching that.

[00:26:28] That's what I'm really into right now.

[00:26:29] I wonder if season three will probably be 2026.

[00:26:32] Maybe.

[00:26:33] Maybe.

[00:26:33] But they'll have to finish.

[00:26:34] Because it's still going into 2020.

[00:26:35] Yeah.

[00:26:36] We probably only have a few episodes left, but.

[00:26:37] I don't really have my finger on the pulse of like what's anticipated.

[00:26:41] Yeah.

[00:26:41] What's your most anticipated show?

[00:26:43] We've got another tie.

[00:26:44] Severance.

[00:26:45] You watch Severance?

[00:26:46] I don't.

[00:26:47] But everyone says.

[00:26:49] Watch it.

[00:26:49] To watch it.

[00:26:50] It's so weird.

[00:26:50] We started and like we got through two episodes and I was like, I can't do this show.

[00:26:55] And but I think I need to like keep.

[00:26:57] I mean, you got to stay the course.

[00:26:58] Yes.

[00:26:59] That's what everyone says.

[00:26:59] Three or four episodes and it starts to make sense.

[00:27:01] Right.

[00:27:02] So Severance is great.

[00:27:03] Okay.

[00:27:03] Or season three of Wheel of Time.

[00:27:05] I go back way back with Wheel of Time and it's an imperfect show, but it's a point

[00:27:09] of viewing for me just because it scratches an itch ever since I was like 13 or whatever.

[00:27:13] So that's what we got.

[00:27:14] That's what we got.

[00:27:15] Thanks for listening.

[00:27:19] Wait, wait.

[00:27:19] Can we cue the theme music now?

[00:27:24] I don't know.

[00:27:33] Jean, how are you doing?

[00:27:35] I'm good, David.

[00:27:36] How are you?

[00:27:37] Hanging in there, man.

[00:27:38] Crazy time of year.

[00:27:39] Ah, the best time of year.

[00:27:42] Some people would say the best time of year.

[00:27:44] I'm just ready to start my vacation next week.

[00:27:47] There you go.

[00:27:47] There you go.

[00:27:48] Yeah.

[00:27:50] So how has your year in television been?

[00:27:54] Um, it's been great.

[00:27:56] Yeah.

[00:27:57] I thought that every, for the most part, everything that I watched, I loved.

[00:28:01] Okay.

[00:28:02] Um, so there was a lot of highs, not too many lows, but definitely a lot of highs.

[00:28:08] It seemed like there was a lot of television this year.

[00:28:11] There was.

[00:28:12] Like trying to, I haven't even touched my top 10 list and I went to look at it the other

[00:28:18] day and I just, in the last six months or so, I've just been throwing things at my list

[00:28:24] and then just not even dealing with it.

[00:28:25] And I'm going back and I'm going, oh my gosh, what a mess.

[00:28:28] And the number of shows that I started that didn't finish.

[00:28:31] Right.

[00:28:32] And the things that were overlapping, it was just, it was like a hectic year.

[00:28:35] Yeah.

[00:28:35] When John said, give me a top three, I'm like three.

[00:28:38] Dude.

[00:28:39] Come on, man.

[00:28:40] Three?

[00:28:41] Like, oh gosh, how do I do that?

[00:28:43] Well, otherwise our top 10 podcast with all the co-hosts would be like four hours long.

[00:28:47] Of course.

[00:28:48] And even my top three is in flux constantly.

[00:28:52] Yeah.

[00:28:52] Right.

[00:28:53] I might just end up going on vibes when I do mine.

[00:28:56] There you go.

[00:28:56] I think that's a good idea.

[00:28:57] Yeah.

[00:28:58] It's very simple.

[00:28:58] I have an idea of what might be yours, but we'll see.

[00:29:01] Okay.

[00:29:02] Okay.

[00:29:03] Here, take your headphones off for a second and I'll tell the listening audience.

[00:29:06] I think he's going to pick the penguin.

[00:29:08] All right.

[00:29:09] Come back.

[00:29:09] Come back.

[00:29:13] Oh, okay.

[00:29:13] Okay.

[00:29:14] Good.

[00:29:14] So we'll see what the, see if I'm right.

[00:29:17] All right.

[00:29:17] So hit me with your number three.

[00:29:19] Wow.

[00:29:21] Number three.

[00:29:23] That's going to be Agatha.

[00:29:26] Oh, nice one.

[00:29:28] Very cool.

[00:29:29] My number three is Agatha.

[00:29:31] Okay.

[00:29:32] I absolutely adore this show.

[00:29:34] I love it.

[00:29:36] I have nothing negative to say about any of the three that I'm going to name.

[00:29:40] Okay.

[00:29:40] Okay.

[00:29:41] So they're just outstanding viewing.

[00:29:45] And again, I would say that, you know, today Agatha is three, but Agatha could very

[00:29:51] well be one on Saturday.

[00:29:54] You know what I mean?

[00:29:55] So this is how I'm feeling.

[00:29:58] Some serious fluidity.

[00:29:59] Yeah, definitely.

[00:30:00] But I really loved the show.

[00:30:03] I loved the vibe.

[00:30:04] I loved the acting, the costuming, the colors, just everything on screen.

[00:30:11] Everything that I heard was just outstanding.

[00:30:15] And the story itself was great.

[00:30:17] Great.

[00:30:18] Enough comic book tie-in for you?

[00:30:20] Yeah, definitely.

[00:30:21] Enough comic book tie-in and also real life human tie-in.

[00:30:25] And, you know, when we spoke about it, you know, on our pod, Alicia and I, I kept bringing

[00:30:31] back, going back to this point where, you know, they're telling this story, a very human

[00:30:36] story, a very relatable story from this fantastical type of world filled with magic and, you know,

[00:30:43] superpowers and things like that.

[00:30:44] But at the core, it's a very real and...

[00:30:48] It's interesting.

[00:30:49] I was talking to Anthony and Steve earlier, recording their top threes.

[00:30:55] And Mr. and Mrs. Smith made it on one of their lists.

[00:30:58] Okay.

[00:31:00] And it's the same thing.

[00:31:02] It was a, it's a, it's a kind of romantic comedy, but it's about human, you know, it's

[00:31:07] about relationships between, you know, romantic partners and dating and all of this kind

[00:31:13] of stuff.

[00:31:13] But then it has this crazy outer wrapper of, oh, we're assassins, right?

[00:31:17] But that crazy outer wrapper allows you to get inside this issue or these issues and

[00:31:24] these stories in a different way, where if it was just like, oh, here's a relationship

[00:31:28] about two people dating, we'd be like, you know, like move on.

[00:31:33] But because it's crazy and full of action and same with Agatha, it was this, oh, there's

[00:31:41] this magic and there's all this drama stuff going on.

[00:31:43] But then when it really gets down to it, it's about grief and pain and how we can get

[00:31:47] in touch with our feelings and a lot of stuff.

[00:31:51] To the point you just said, I think the, because these stories take place in these fantastical

[00:31:57] worlds, I think it gives filmmakers and showrunners an opportunity to really dig into things that

[00:32:04] they might not be able to dig into if we were saying this was real.

[00:32:09] You know what I mean?

[00:32:10] So this was really an example of them being able to take something truly, truly, you know,

[00:32:20] magnificent and, you know, kudos to Marvel for letting them do what they did.

[00:32:25] Seriously, right?

[00:32:27] After some of the things that Marvel Studios has given us?

[00:32:31] Yes.

[00:32:31] Like, thank you for just, you know, landing a solid show.

[00:32:34] Absolutely.

[00:32:35] Giving the showrunners the room to run.

[00:32:37] To breathe, you know?

[00:32:39] And they did breathe.

[00:32:41] Yeah.

[00:32:41] And it was wonderful to watch.

[00:32:43] And I think that's something that, you know, we lore hound, that's what we feast on is

[00:32:49] good human stories, right?

[00:32:51] Yes.

[00:32:51] Yes.

[00:32:51] When the heart, when the heart is in conflict with itself?

[00:32:55] Oh, God.

[00:32:56] All right.

[00:32:57] What's your number two?

[00:32:57] What's your number two?

[00:32:58] My number two is Shogun.

[00:33:00] Okay.

[00:33:01] Nice word.

[00:33:02] Very cool.

[00:33:02] I like it.

[00:33:03] My number two is Shogun.

[00:33:04] Again, another great, great acting.

[00:33:08] Visually stunning.

[00:33:11] Full of heart, as you would say.

[00:33:14] And just really gripping.

[00:33:18] You know, I'm someone who watched the original Shogun.

[00:33:24] Yeah.

[00:33:25] Same with me.

[00:33:26] Yep.

[00:33:26] Not as a child, but as a young adult.

[00:33:28] Okay.

[00:33:29] I think I watched it when it was airing on TV.

[00:33:31] Okay.

[00:33:32] Okay.

[00:33:32] I didn't see it as a child.

[00:33:35] I saw it as a young adult.

[00:33:37] And knowing, you know, the basics of the story, this still held my attention.

[00:33:43] I was still in awe of this story.

[00:33:46] And it could have very well gone in a different way.

[00:33:49] It could have very well been like, ah, been there, done that.

[00:33:53] And it wasn't anything but that.

[00:33:56] The authenticity of the characters, how they played their roles.

[00:34:03] Just really, really good stuff.

[00:34:06] Right on.

[00:34:07] Very cool.

[00:34:08] Yeah.

[00:34:08] And we'll see what they can do, if they can pull off future episodes.

[00:34:12] We'll see.

[00:34:13] Or seasons, I mean.

[00:34:14] Sorry.

[00:34:14] Yeah, it's, I, there was a, there was a kind of deep satisfaction knowing that they were going to tell the one story in the one season and call it good.

[00:34:28] Right.

[00:34:30] And then when they went to announce that, hey, we're going to do some more, I'm simultaneously nervous and excited.

[00:34:39] Because the story, the crafting of that visual storytelling that they did was just exquisite.

[00:34:48] And the stories, like you said, and the actors are so good.

[00:34:51] It's so compelling.

[00:34:52] I just don't want them to mess up the season one because they're trying to do a season two.

[00:34:56] I don't, I see it differently.

[00:34:58] I see it differently.

[00:34:59] I'm, I'm here for the season two if we get it.

[00:35:02] Okay.

[00:35:03] And if it's.

[00:35:04] Oh my, I'll be there.

[00:35:05] I'll be there.

[00:35:05] No, right.

[00:35:06] But if it's not good, I'm still going to watch season one.

[00:35:11] You know what I'm saying?

[00:35:11] I'm still going to watch season one.

[00:35:13] What we just saw will not be in any way diminished by what might come.

[00:35:20] Cool.

[00:35:21] So that's where I'm at with a season two.

[00:35:23] So hopefully they get to do it and they get to do it well.

[00:35:26] And they do it right.

[00:35:27] Yeah.

[00:35:27] Let's hope that they do it right.

[00:35:29] Cool.

[00:35:30] So what is your top show for, for today, for 2024?

[00:35:36] Cause we know it could shift around.

[00:35:38] I mean, you know, if you know me, then, you know, if you've heard me speak, then there's

[00:35:44] really no, no question.

[00:35:46] Right.

[00:35:46] So like I.

[00:35:47] It is the penguin.

[00:35:48] It is penguin.

[00:35:49] That was right.

[00:35:50] That was right.

[00:35:51] It is penguin.

[00:35:52] Yeah.

[00:35:53] I mean, right.

[00:35:55] Come on.

[00:35:55] Right.

[00:35:56] Come on.

[00:35:56] Yeah.

[00:35:57] This is everything that I love is gangster shit is crime.

[00:36:03] Street.

[00:36:04] It's just street level.

[00:36:05] Young man struggling.

[00:36:07] Gritty.

[00:36:07] Just gritty.

[00:36:09] You know, it's New York.

[00:36:11] It's, it's, you know, and not the Broadway side of the city.

[00:36:16] Just really streets that we know streets that I've walked, but just, you know, it's feeling

[00:36:25] that I've had.

[00:36:26] Right.

[00:36:28] Embodied in, in parts of this show.

[00:36:30] And I thought, you know, Colin Farrell was amazing.

[00:36:37] I barely, maybe a couple of two, three times where I was like, maybe I have an idea of a

[00:36:43] thought that that might be him, but never did he break out of that, that makeup or that

[00:36:50] characterization.

[00:36:51] He was so buried down.

[00:36:53] Colin Farrell was so buried down inside there that that was a performance.

[00:36:58] I don't know because he was so natural in the body, the weight of the body, the face,

[00:37:06] the scarring, the, the, the injury and, and just all of the psychological pain as well

[00:37:12] as the physical pain that, that I'm assuming Penguin is in all the time.

[00:37:15] Look, man, I'm in my fifties, right?

[00:37:17] I wake up and the shit hurts for like no reason.

[00:37:20] Like why, why does this hurt?

[00:37:24] And he, you know, for him to pull that off was just a performance of a lifetime.

[00:37:28] It was, it really was.

[00:37:29] And, you know, it was emotional.

[00:37:31] It was gripping.

[00:37:33] And it left, you know, me thinking like, this is how things get done.

[00:37:40] Let people tell their stories.

[00:37:43] You know, we've had, these are two examples of between Agatha and Penguin where the showrunners,

[00:37:52] the storytellers got to tell their story.

[00:37:54] Right.

[00:37:55] And as fantastical and as imaginary and as, you know, you know, high fantasy, whatever

[00:38:02] you want to call it.

[00:38:03] When people get to tell their stories, you, it's going to sink or swim, but at least, you

[00:38:13] know, it's theirs.

[00:38:14] Mm-hmm.

[00:38:15] Right, right, right, right, right.

[00:38:17] Not, not like the show that shall not be me.

[00:38:20] Yes.

[00:38:21] Which was a, I mean, no disrespect to Dr. Frankenstein, but it really was an assemblage of parts.

[00:38:29] I mean, that could be disrespect to Dr. Frankenstein because at least he got the monster.

[00:38:34] Exactly.

[00:38:35] He got it working.

[00:38:35] He actually worked.

[00:38:38] Where they took it apart and they gave it to another director.

[00:38:41] Right.

[00:38:42] I mean, it was just a complete, and it's like, guys, draw a box, assign a budget, approve the

[00:38:49] people.

[00:38:50] Get out the way.

[00:38:51] And get out the way.

[00:38:52] And then, you know, if you need to do some checks on the outside.

[00:38:55] Of course.

[00:38:56] Of course.

[00:38:56] You know, stay on the outside of that box.

[00:38:58] Of course.

[00:38:58] And let the creators bounce around inside the box.

[00:39:00] Right.

[00:39:00] But once you cross that interior line, you're now out of the executive zone and you're in

[00:39:06] the creative zone.

[00:39:07] And we don't want that.

[00:39:08] Right.

[00:39:08] I mean, there may be an executive who is creative from time to time, but, you know,

[00:39:12] the more often than not, give the creatives their box.

[00:39:15] Look at the Wachowskis when they did the first Matrix.

[00:39:19] Yes.

[00:39:20] Shoestring budget.

[00:39:21] Yes.

[00:39:21] And man, they knocked that thing out the park.

[00:39:23] Nailed it.

[00:39:24] Right?

[00:39:24] Nailed it.

[00:39:25] Because they had a box and they had a budget and that was it.

[00:39:29] And go create.

[00:39:30] You need constraints.

[00:39:31] Right.

[00:39:32] But you don't need people second guessing you.

[00:39:35] Right.

[00:39:36] Right.

[00:39:36] So.

[00:39:37] So, yeah.

[00:39:38] Penguin is number one for me today.

[00:39:41] And again, John, with this, you know, only three.

[00:39:45] There are so many other shows that deserve to be, you know, mentioned.

[00:39:51] A Man Inside with Ted Danson.

[00:39:53] The Fallout TV show.

[00:39:55] Yep.

[00:39:55] We're watching Silo.

[00:39:57] I'm watching Silo and just Abbott Elementary.

[00:40:04] Just so.

[00:40:05] There were just so many good TV shows.

[00:40:08] The Acolyte.

[00:40:09] So many things that.

[00:40:10] Dude, Skeleton Crew right now.

[00:40:12] Skeleton Crew is really good.

[00:40:15] Like, my kid is into it.

[00:40:17] You know what I mean?

[00:40:18] Totally.

[00:40:18] Yeah.

[00:40:20] It's just.

[00:40:20] There's good stuff going on.

[00:40:22] There's good stuff going on.

[00:40:23] Prophecy.

[00:40:24] Doom.

[00:40:24] Prophecy.

[00:40:25] Right.

[00:40:25] Right.

[00:40:26] Right.

[00:40:26] You know, and there's just.

[00:40:27] The magic crazy space eye wizard dude.

[00:40:30] Arcane season two.

[00:40:31] Right.

[00:40:32] Dude, I heard that Arcane is one of the most expensive shows.

[00:40:36] 250 million.

[00:40:38] Like 14, 50 million an episode.

[00:40:41] Yeah.

[00:40:41] That's insane.

[00:40:42] That's.

[00:40:42] And it got.

[00:40:43] And it's not getting numbers.

[00:40:44] Nope.

[00:40:44] Like a 14, 15 million dollar episode.

[00:40:46] Mm-mm.

[00:40:47] Mm-mm.

[00:40:48] But it was a good show.

[00:40:50] I wish they would have.

[00:40:52] What was that late hit Netflix last year about that weird alien planet?

[00:40:57] I'm blanking the name.

[00:40:58] I don't remember.

[00:40:59] Oh, it was so good.

[00:41:00] Anyway.

[00:41:01] Yeah.

[00:41:01] Anyway.

[00:41:01] I wish they could have splashed some of that money at those guys.

[00:41:05] Right on.

[00:41:06] So what is your air quotes guilty pleasure show?

[00:41:12] What's a show that you love and you watch it, but you'd be a little bit like, I don't think

[00:41:20] I would put this on my top 10 list because it's just like a Twinkie.

[00:41:23] It's just like the sugary snack.

[00:41:27] Wow.

[00:41:27] I don't think I had a guilty pleasure.

[00:41:29] Really?

[00:41:30] Yeah.

[00:41:30] I don't think so.

[00:41:31] You got no reality TV shows?

[00:41:33] No.

[00:41:34] I don't do reality TV shows, period.

[00:41:36] Okay.

[00:41:36] So that's out of the, that's not even in my realm.

[00:41:39] Um, but I don't think there's anything that I would be like, Oh man, I shouldn't tell

[00:41:44] people I've watched it.

[00:41:46] You know, I don't have one of those this year.

[00:41:48] Or you put it on your sleeve and you go, yeah, I love this show.

[00:41:50] Right, right.

[00:41:51] I don't care what you think.

[00:41:52] I don't, I don't have one of those.

[00:41:54] I really don't.

[00:41:54] I think, I think my, the things that I've watched this year, I would champion.

[00:41:59] And, you know, so what is a show that might not be credible in some ways, like, you know,

[00:42:08] big budget, big actors, right.

[00:42:09] You know, prestige kind of things.

[00:42:11] But when you watch it, it just made your heart sing.

[00:42:15] Ooh, now that's a tough question.

[00:42:17] Just fun.

[00:42:18] It was just fun as hell.

[00:42:20] Hmm.

[00:42:21] What's yours?

[00:42:22] Give me a minute.

[00:42:23] What's yours?

[00:42:23] Well, you know, last year I, cause I haven't gone, like I said, I haven't gone through my

[00:42:27] list this year and this year was crazy.

[00:42:28] Cause when I was in between our, you know, marquee shows, I was kind of just trying to

[00:42:34] like lay low and, and let my brain rest.

[00:42:37] Last year it was a hundred foot wave, which is, uh, I think it's max.

[00:42:43] It's an HBO.

[00:42:44] I don't know if it's HBO or, or max, but it's on HBO max, you know, it's on the max network.

[00:42:49] And it's about this, uh, surfer guy and a group of other surfers who are all in, uh, what

[00:42:55] is that?

[00:42:56] I forget the name of the place off of, uh, on Portugal.

[00:42:58] On the Portuguese coast where they get that a hundred foot wave, like the biggest wave

[00:43:03] in the world.

[00:43:04] Oh boy.

[00:43:05] And these people are just, it's craziness.

[00:43:09] And you know, there's the main character guy.

[00:43:11] I mean, this is real, this is a documentary and he's, uh, he's a father and he's got tons

[00:43:15] of kids.

[00:43:16] They live in Hawaii and he's like this, you know, he's invented all these things about

[00:43:20] how to do big wave surfing and all this kind of stuff.

[00:43:22] And he just keeps throwing his body into this, into these like deadly situations.

[00:43:27] And I'm like, bro, you're a father.

[00:43:29] You got, you know, people to take care of, but he's so intense and he's so wound up.

[00:43:33] But on the outside, he's a chill guy, but it's gorgeous.

[00:43:37] Like the documentary photography is beautiful.

[00:43:41] The shots that they get from the surfing, all the different surfing things.

[00:43:45] And just seeing this industry of big wave surfing, the drones, the jet skis, the special inflatable

[00:43:51] suits, the thousands of people who crowd this coastline for these big wave things.

[00:43:57] It's it's, but it's so well done.

[00:43:59] But these people are like the furthest thing from my life.

[00:44:02] Okay.

[00:44:02] And I love it.

[00:44:04] The Black Doves.

[00:44:05] Oh, I just started that the other day.

[00:44:08] I don't even know if I'm going to get into it all the way.

[00:44:10] The Black Doves.

[00:44:11] All right.

[00:44:11] Yeah.

[00:44:12] Yeah.

[00:44:13] I'll say that.

[00:44:14] I'll say that.

[00:44:14] I'll say the Black Doves.

[00:44:15] I watched episode one.

[00:44:17] Yeah.

[00:44:18] It's, it's.

[00:44:19] It reminded me a little bit of Mr. and Smith, Mr. and Mrs. Smith.

[00:44:21] But it's not.

[00:44:23] Okay.

[00:44:23] All right.

[00:44:23] All right.

[00:44:24] All right.

[00:44:24] And the way I haven't seen Mr. and Mrs. Smith's, let me just put that out there.

[00:44:27] But the way he just described it, it's not that.

[00:44:31] You should see Mr. and Mrs. Smith though.

[00:44:33] Okay.

[00:44:33] Okay.

[00:44:34] I'll put it on my list.

[00:44:35] Just for the Danny Glover of it all, because he's so good.

[00:44:38] Okay.

[00:44:38] I'll put it on my list.

[00:44:39] As a creative producer.

[00:44:41] Right.

[00:44:41] As a writer.

[00:44:42] I'll put it on the list.

[00:44:44] He's, he's, he's a sharpshooter.

[00:44:46] It's, it's more.

[00:44:47] Danny.

[00:44:47] Did I say Danny Glover?

[00:44:48] Is that the right name?

[00:44:50] Danny Glover or Donald.

[00:44:51] No, I'm not thinking.

[00:44:52] Why don't I think you're saying Danny Glover?

[00:44:53] Donald Glover.

[00:44:55] Gambino.

[00:44:56] Donald Glover.

[00:44:57] Is it Donald Glover?

[00:44:59] Yeah.

[00:44:59] That's his name, isn't it?

[00:45:00] Mr. and Mrs.

[00:45:01] My, you know, my, it's that thing that happens to you where the words stop, stop making sense.

[00:45:06] You make the sounds, but they don't connect to your brain.

[00:45:08] I thought, I thought you were saying that the Danny Glover was, was a writer on the show.

[00:45:14] I'm tripping.

[00:45:15] But it's Donald Glover.

[00:45:16] It's Donald Glover.

[00:45:17] Donald Glover.

[00:45:17] Yes.

[00:45:17] It's Donald Glover.

[00:45:18] Yeah.

[00:45:18] I was just thinking, oh, Danny Glover's on the road.

[00:45:21] Yeah.

[00:45:21] Oh, I got to watch this.

[00:45:23] I got the Glover's.

[00:45:24] I got to get this.

[00:45:25] But, um, yeah.

[00:45:26] So I'm saying Black Dubs.

[00:45:27] They're already mad at me because I got, uh, you know, I got Star Trek V at the bottom

[00:45:31] of my, uh, OG movie list.

[00:45:33] So they're giving me a hard time about that.

[00:45:35] That's okay.

[00:45:37] That was all right.

[00:45:38] We don't apologize on no house.

[00:45:40] Hey.

[00:45:40] That's right.

[00:45:41] That's right.

[00:45:41] That's right.

[00:45:42] My take's my take.

[00:45:43] That's right.

[00:45:43] We don't apologize over here.

[00:45:45] But yeah.

[00:45:45] All right.

[00:45:45] So, uh.

[00:45:46] The Black Dubs.

[00:45:47] So, uh.

[00:45:47] The Black Dubs.

[00:45:47] The Black Dubs.

[00:45:48] Okay.

[00:45:49] So, it's because I watched the first episode.

[00:45:51] Some of the quality was like.

[00:45:52] That's what I'm saying.

[00:45:54] I, I'm not saying it's the best.

[00:45:56] Gotcha.

[00:45:57] But.

[00:45:57] You loved it.

[00:45:58] Yeah.

[00:45:58] It's enjoyable.

[00:46:00] Invigorating.

[00:46:01] Cool.

[00:46:01] Right on.

[00:46:02] It's enjoyable.

[00:46:02] Yeah.

[00:46:03] So, comics versus you and Alicia have a busy year.

[00:46:08] Yeah.

[00:46:08] 2025 is going to be amazing.

[00:46:11] It's going to be amazing.

[00:46:12] We're putting the show tracker together.

[00:46:14] Which, you know.

[00:46:14] Subscribers can get access to.

[00:46:16] And we're looking at the run.

[00:46:17] And man.

[00:46:18] It is stacked this year.

[00:46:20] Yeah.

[00:46:20] Anything.

[00:46:20] What's your number one for next year for a comics.

[00:46:23] Oh.

[00:46:24] Comics.

[00:46:24] Superman.

[00:46:25] Superman.

[00:46:26] DC James Gunn.

[00:46:27] Superman.

[00:46:29] Okay.

[00:46:29] Because this is going to set.

[00:46:31] You know.

[00:46:31] Set the bar.

[00:46:33] It's going to make or break James Gunn's DC universe, I think.

[00:46:37] Okay.

[00:46:38] So, there's a lot riding on this movie.

[00:46:40] And we shall see.

[00:46:42] I saw today that there may be a trailer next week.

[00:46:48] So.

[00:46:48] Do we have a release date or a release time frame?

[00:46:52] June.

[00:46:52] June-ish.

[00:46:54] No.

[00:46:54] I'll give you the exact date.

[00:46:56] Give me a minute.

[00:46:56] But it is June.

[00:46:57] Okay.

[00:46:57] It's all right.

[00:46:58] We'll get it in the show tracker one way or the other.

[00:47:02] July.

[00:47:02] July 11th.

[00:47:04] July 11th.

[00:47:05] July 11th.

[00:47:06] July 11th.

[00:47:07] 2025.

[00:47:10] July 11th.

[00:47:11] Okay.

[00:47:11] That's a big one.

[00:47:12] Yeah.

[00:47:12] So, that's.

[00:47:13] I think that.

[00:47:14] That is the most important.

[00:47:17] Cool.

[00:47:18] Superhero comic movie.

[00:47:21] Of the last five years.

[00:47:24] Because.

[00:47:25] I don't.

[00:47:25] I think you're right.

[00:47:26] I think.

[00:47:26] I think I'm with you on that.

[00:47:27] Because if they fuck up Superman.

[00:47:30] That's it.

[00:47:31] And you know.

[00:47:32] I'm a.

[00:47:33] You know.

[00:47:33] Cavill is my Superman.

[00:47:35] I'm putting that out there right now.

[00:47:36] So, you know.

[00:47:38] That's my guy.

[00:47:40] Cavill is my guy.

[00:47:41] That is my Superman.

[00:47:42] Okay.

[00:47:43] So, there's a lot riding on this movie.

[00:47:46] So, I would say Superman.

[00:47:47] Sounds good.

[00:47:48] All right, my man.

[00:47:49] We'll have a great holiday season.

[00:47:51] Give my love to your family.

[00:47:52] We miss you guys.

[00:47:53] Absolutely.

[00:47:53] Absolutely.

[00:47:54] My love to everyone.

[00:47:55] You still need to get yourself up to Vermont.

[00:47:57] Man, I know.

[00:47:57] I know.

[00:47:58] But, you know.

[00:47:59] It's cold.

[00:48:00] It is cold right now.

[00:48:02] I'm telling you.

[00:48:03] It's cold.

[00:48:04] All right, man.

[00:48:05] Peace.

[00:48:05] Be well.

[00:48:06] Take care.

[00:48:13] Aaron.

[00:48:14] Host of Radioactive Ramblings.

[00:48:16] How you doing today?

[00:48:18] I'm doing pretty good.

[00:48:19] How are you today, John?

[00:48:20] Just dandy.

[00:48:21] I get to talk with you.

[00:48:23] Just about the best TV of the year.

[00:48:25] No stakes.

[00:48:27] What's going on with your TV year?

[00:48:31] So, my top three.

[00:48:33] I have two serious shows and one less serious show in my number three spot.

[00:48:40] Very nice.

[00:48:40] I like it.

[00:48:42] My number three show.

[00:48:43] Should I start from the bottom and go up or am I starting from the top?

[00:48:46] I think so.

[00:48:46] You got to keep upping the ante.

[00:48:49] All right.

[00:48:50] So, I'll start with my number three show, which that was my show that I decided was going to be a little bit more fun and less serious.

[00:48:58] And it ended up being Mr. and Mrs. Smith.

[00:49:01] Oh.

[00:49:02] Is that less serious?

[00:49:03] I think it's a serious show.

[00:49:05] I think compared to some of the prestige television that I watched this year, which I kind of hate to use that word because I think that all television has its own merits and interesting things going on.

[00:49:17] But as far as the production and everything, I thought it was so impressive.

[00:49:21] And I'm just a big Donald Glover fan.

[00:49:24] So, I had to put that somewhere on my list.

[00:49:28] That's a good one.

[00:49:29] Yeah.

[00:49:30] The comedy in that...

[00:49:31] There is a lot of comedy in that show, but I think it acts more as an enhancer of the drama for me.

[00:49:36] So, I'm glad you put this on your list.

[00:49:38] Yeah.

[00:49:39] I actually started watching it because I heard the one shot that was done on the Lorehounds.

[00:49:44] Oh.

[00:49:44] So, it did its job.

[00:49:46] Yes.

[00:49:46] It absolutely did.

[00:49:47] Same thing with Pachinko, actually.

[00:49:49] I watched the first episode the other day.

[00:49:51] Nice.

[00:49:52] You liking it so far?

[00:49:53] I'm liking it a lot so far.

[00:49:55] I think it's pretty fantastic.

[00:49:56] The acting in both of these shows, it's just incredible.

[00:50:00] It goes above and beyond.

[00:50:02] Yeah.

[00:50:02] David, Alicia, and Nate are on a mission to make the whole world Pachinko Watchers.

[00:50:07] And maybe they will succeed one day.

[00:50:09] Starting with you.

[00:50:10] They succeeded with me, at least.

[00:50:11] Yeah.

[00:50:12] What's your number two?

[00:50:13] My number two, this, of course, being the genesis of Radioactive Ramblings, had to be on here.

[00:50:20] And it is Fallout.

[00:50:22] Very nice.

[00:50:24] Yeah.

[00:50:24] The costume design, everything about the world was just so fantastic.

[00:50:28] I've been a Fallout fan for probably, oh God, over a decade, which is crazy because I'm only 20 years old.

[00:50:36] But yeah, Fallout, it just really captured my imagination.

[00:50:41] And it's exactly what I wanted to see on screen out of a video game adaptation.

[00:50:46] Big year for video game adaptations.

[00:50:48] It was.

[00:50:49] It was.

[00:50:50] Well, okie dokie, what was your number one?

[00:50:55] So, my number one actually landed here because it made me feel, this show made me feel a little bit gullible.

[00:51:04] And it was the Penguin.

[00:51:06] Ok.

[00:51:08] Why gullible?

[00:51:09] Go on with that.

[00:51:11] Yeah, let me explain a little bit.

[00:51:12] So, I, throughout the course of watching this show, at various points, was rooting for the Penguin.

[00:51:21] And by the end of the series, when I got to the last few episodes, I was like, wow, that was a really, really stupid.

[00:51:28] I don't know how I saw this guy as anything other than just a straight up villain throughout this series.

[00:51:33] So, the show did a good job of making me sympathize with him towards the beginning.

[00:51:37] And then, at the very end, ripping it all away from me.

[00:51:41] Yeah.

[00:51:41] That's a good point.

[00:51:42] And it's a real testament to the show because I don't think we would be wanting to watch a show where every week we can't sympathize, empathize with the main character.

[00:51:52] Yeah.

[00:51:52] Very much like Walter White in Breaking Bad in that regard.

[00:51:56] Yep.

[00:51:57] Very Breaking Bad show.

[00:51:58] Yeah.

[00:51:59] Well, cool.

[00:52:00] That's a good pick for number one.

[00:52:01] That's a real, that's a very good show.

[00:52:03] All three of your picks were on my list.

[00:52:05] Oh, really?

[00:52:06] Absolutely.

[00:52:06] So, you will hear where they are, the listener, if you listen to the main episode, which is already out.

[00:52:13] So, there's no excuses.

[00:52:16] I'm excited to hear these bonus questions that you've got for me.

[00:52:20] Yeah.

[00:52:20] So, we're going to start off here with a guilty pleasure.

[00:52:23] What's your guilty pleasure show of the year?

[00:52:26] Ooh, guilty pleasure.

[00:52:28] I don't know if it's necessarily guilty, but...

[00:52:33] You don't have to feel guilt.

[00:52:34] You can just say, it's a dumb show I like.

[00:52:37] Yeah.

[00:52:37] Bob's Burgers, hands down.

[00:52:39] I've...

[00:52:39] Okay.

[00:52:40] I'm always a Bob's Burgers fan.

[00:52:42] That's a good one.

[00:52:43] I haven't watched anything recent, but I did love Bob's Burgers for a while.

[00:52:47] And of course, a Thanksgiving stable.

[00:52:49] The only show really putting out quality Thanksgiving media.

[00:52:52] Yeah.

[00:52:55] And Linda's Thanksgiving song that she sings is classic.

[00:53:00] Right, right.

[00:53:00] And her Valentine's Day.

[00:53:01] She's got great songs.

[00:53:02] Great songs overall.

[00:53:03] See, I'm old enough to know when Linda, the guy who plays Linda, was just a YouTuber doing like a mom shtick.

[00:53:12] Yes.

[00:53:13] Seeing clips of that online, it's just hilarious.

[00:53:16] See, I was in like middle school when that came out, and we were just laughing so hard at this.

[00:53:21] Guy becomes a serious actor.

[00:53:22] It's very funny.

[00:53:23] It's very funny.

[00:53:24] It's been a trip for us millennials.

[00:53:28] So the next one I'm going to give you is your biggest miss of the year.

[00:53:31] What's a show you really wanted to watch, but you didn't get around to?

[00:53:35] Hmm.

[00:53:36] Are we counting shows that I haven't watched in their entirety, or just shows that I have completely missed?

[00:53:42] You could count partial watches if you want.

[00:53:46] Since I've only seen the first episode of Pachinko, I'm probably going to put that into my biggest miss category.

[00:53:52] I wish I would have gotten on that train a little bit sooner.

[00:53:55] Okay.

[00:53:55] Yeah.

[00:53:56] Yeah.

[00:53:56] Yeah.

[00:53:56] I too feel a little FOMO for the Pachinko stuff, but I'm like, well, now I have like two years to do whatever I need to do.

[00:54:02] For sure.

[00:54:05] And lastly, your most anticipated show of 2025.

[00:54:10] Most anticipated?

[00:54:13] I would say and or if it's still coming out in 2025.

[00:54:17] I know there's been some questions about that, but I think it's pretty set now.

[00:54:22] That's definitely my most anticipated.

[00:54:24] Well, that was also the community's most anticipated show for 2025 by like double the next one.

[00:54:32] Wow.

[00:54:33] All right.

[00:54:33] So I'm glad I'm in step with the community on this one.

[00:54:36] You felt, you know, can you hear the people sing, right?

[00:54:43] All right, Aaron.

[00:54:44] Well, this was a lot of fun.

[00:54:45] Thank you so much for being a part of our community this year.

[00:54:48] It's been so nice to welcome you and Chase and Richard to the network.

[00:54:53] Yeah.

[00:54:54] Thank you guys so much for hosting us.

[00:54:56] We always, we love to be a part of this community and it's just such a welcoming place.

[00:55:01] And the conversations being had all around are just so much fun.

[00:55:06] So thank you guys so much.

[00:55:14] John sounds like James Earl Jones.

[00:55:17] It's ridiculous.

[00:55:17] Oh, really?

[00:55:18] Well, that would have been nice.

[00:55:19] I think it would have been funny, but.

[00:55:21] You know, we lost him too soon.

[00:55:23] It would be nice for John to just take over.

[00:55:26] Oh, yeah.

[00:55:26] I like that idea.

[00:55:28] There's a lot of voice work to be done.

[00:55:30] There is.

[00:55:31] There are so many films and shows where we need him.

[00:55:34] We need that voice back in place.

[00:55:37] Who would have thought it was going to be John from the Lorehounds?

[00:55:40] I know.

[00:55:41] Maybe we should secretly record his voice and send in an audition tape to the studio.

[00:55:48] Are you there, Steve?

[00:55:50] I'm here.

[00:55:51] Oh, you're faint and mouthful of food, which is.

[00:55:56] On brand?

[00:55:56] Do no knows of podcasting.

[00:55:58] I have no food in my mouth and I'm fine, but you keep on constructing your own narrative.

[00:56:05] Well, if you were not chewing food, my mind only goes to worse places.

[00:56:11] So, I mean, is it possible that your ears are the problem?

[00:56:14] No.

[00:56:14] It's not a me issue.

[00:56:16] Cannot be.

[00:56:16] You know, but my ears are a problem in terms of the amount of hair that they're growing these days.

[00:56:22] I don't know if I needed to know that on this podcast, but I think I'll just have to.

[00:56:26] Which podcast did you need to know?

[00:56:28] Yeah.

[00:56:31] All right.

[00:56:32] So, why are we here?

[00:56:32] We're here for the Lorehounds.

[00:56:34] End of year, something or other.

[00:56:37] Yeah.

[00:56:37] So, we love to check in with all of our affiliates and co-hosts and to get a quick check in on what they felt that their favorite shows were for the year.

[00:56:52] Now, I do have a point of clarification.

[00:56:55] Our list.

[00:56:56] Yes.

[00:56:58] Should it just be shows that came out in 24 or are they shows that we're enjoying or we enjoyed in 24?

[00:57:06] They are shows that within a reasonable degree either started or ended in 2024.

[00:57:15] So, my rewatch of the Rockford Files wouldn't apply.

[00:57:19] Well, evergreen as it is.

[00:57:22] One of my favorite Rockford Files episodes was he rolls up to a house or a business or something that he's going to investigate in.

[00:57:32] And in the passenger seat of his car, he has a business card maker, kind of like one of those old-style credit card presses.

[00:57:40] Just in the passenger seat of his car.

[00:57:42] And he just printed himself a business card for the identity that he needed for that investigation.

[00:57:48] Man, always thinking.

[00:57:49] Always thinking this guy.

[00:57:51] Telling you what, man.

[00:57:53] You know, I was like, I got to get one of those for myself.

[00:57:56] You know, just print a business card on the spot.

[00:57:58] All right.

[00:57:59] So, reasonably close to 2020.

[00:58:02] If it's reasonable to fit within the 2024 year timeframe, then that's what we're looking for.

[00:58:08] All right.

[00:58:09] Take it away, David.

[00:58:11] Steve, what is your third most favorite show of 2024?

[00:58:15] My third most favorite show of 2024 would be Baby Reindeer.

[00:58:22] Oh, wow.

[00:58:24] Wow.

[00:58:25] I think I watched one episode, maybe two, and then didn't get much beyond.

[00:58:30] It was a...

[00:58:31] What made it enjoyable for you?

[00:58:34] How unenjoyable it was.

[00:58:37] It's like the ultimate in cringe, isn't it?

[00:58:39] Oh, it's...

[00:58:40] Yeah.

[00:58:40] It's an amazing...

[00:58:43] Like, I mean, it is...

[00:58:44] It's kind of like a master class in cringe on, like, so many different levels.

[00:58:48] Mm-hmm.

[00:58:50] You know, this...

[00:58:51] You know, as reliable as the narrator can be, I suppose.

[00:58:54] I mean, like, you know...

[00:58:55] Because it's pretty, you know, autobiographical.

[00:59:00] And, I mean, this...

[00:59:02] It's a pretty vulnerable story to tell about yourself.

[00:59:06] And it's just...

[00:59:08] It's...

[00:59:09] I don't know.

[00:59:09] I think my wife and I went through it in, like, one sitting.

[00:59:13] Wow.

[00:59:14] It's bonkers.

[00:59:15] It's bonkers.

[00:59:16] And it really does draw you in.

[00:59:19] If it is autobiographical, it's just a horrific story to tell about yourself.

[00:59:28] And there was some controversy, wasn't there?

[00:59:30] Because I believe the woman in question, the real person, the quote-unquote real person,

[00:59:36] there was some objection by her or she...

[00:59:39] Yeah, she was...

[00:59:40] My understanding, she went and she got interviewed and it might have been Pierce Morgan.

[00:59:45] And she was, you know, refuting everything.

[00:59:47] And pretty quickly after she was refuting everything, it was like, oh, no, this seems about right.

[00:59:54] Great.

[00:59:55] So, life and art are intertwined, deeply intertwined here.

[00:59:59] I'm curious, Anthony, did Baby Reindeer make your list at all?

[01:00:03] It did not make my list.

[01:00:04] Got it.

[01:00:05] The third show on my list was Mr. and Mrs. Smith.

[01:00:09] Aha!

[01:00:10] Very good show.

[01:00:11] I enjoyed that a lot.

[01:00:12] Loved Mr. and Mrs. Smith.

[01:00:13] Did not enjoy the original film.

[01:00:16] Mm-hmm.

[01:00:16] So, I think I'm a little bit more open to a remake if...

[01:00:23] I feel like the source material didn't quite hit the sweet spot.

[01:00:28] Mm-hmm.

[01:00:28] Like, this could be improved upon.

[01:00:31] Absolutely improved upon.

[01:00:33] Loved this show.

[01:00:35] The history between these two really works well.

[01:00:38] Perfect tonal balance between kind of comedic action.

[01:00:45] Mm-hmm.

[01:00:45] But also, it's more rom-com than anything else.

[01:00:49] Mm-hmm.

[01:00:49] So, I quite liked it.

[01:00:51] Yeah.

[01:00:51] It was phenomenal.

[01:00:52] And I would love to see this as a kind of an anthology show where we maybe we get different

[01:00:58] couples in the future.

[01:01:00] And they start to play with it a little bit.

[01:01:02] Yeah.

[01:01:02] Yeah.

[01:01:02] Steve, you enjoyed Mr. and Mrs. Smith.

[01:01:05] Yeah.

[01:01:05] This was actually my number two.

[01:01:07] Oh, perfect.

[01:01:08] Yeah.

[01:01:08] Yeah.

[01:01:08] So, yeah.

[01:01:11] It was actually Anthony was the one who recommended it.

[01:01:14] And I was a little surprised because it didn't necessarily scream, this is an Anthony recommendation

[01:01:20] type show.

[01:01:21] So, and it's another one that we, I think we went through it pretty quickly.

[01:01:27] Really enjoyed the chemistry between the two leads.

[01:01:32] Really liked the, because again, going back to the original, it's like the movie, it's

[01:01:36] like, yeah, I'm sure it's fun.

[01:01:38] It's kind of weird or whatever.

[01:01:39] And, you know, but this, I really liked the kind of the decay of the relationship and the

[01:01:47] sense of if you're going to be this type of a person, what is your capacity for love?

[01:01:53] And I think it touched on those things in a way that was, I think, pretty interesting.

[01:01:58] And also, like they said, it's, it's funny, it's action, but it's, I didn't feel like anything

[01:02:03] was sacrificed of those elements to tell the story.

[01:02:07] And that was really, really just a fun ride.

[01:02:11] But also like, I cared, I cared about people that you shouldn't care about and it was kind

[01:02:17] of, and they were okay with that.

[01:02:18] I don't know.

[01:02:18] I just, I just thought, I thought it was, it was, it was definitely put together in my

[01:02:22] opinion.

[01:02:23] I really loved the chemistry with Danny Glover and Maya Erskine.

[01:02:26] And I, this feels like a Glover show.

[01:02:30] Like this just falls so well into his wheelhouse and the kinds of things that he creatively

[01:02:35] gets involved in.

[01:02:36] So, right.

[01:02:38] Anthony, your number two.

[01:02:40] The Great British Baking Show.

[01:02:43] Oh, okay.

[01:02:44] I, I never miss an episode.

[01:02:46] This is one of the few ones my wife and I watched together.

[01:02:50] What made this season particularly good above other seasons?

[01:02:54] Well, okay.

[01:02:56] I could, I could talk about this.

[01:02:58] Last time I talked about this on a show, I got an emailer telling me that I spoiled the

[01:03:07] final episode for her.

[01:03:09] And I don't want to make the same mistake as I did before.

[01:03:13] So I'm not going to spoil the final episode, but I will say this.

[01:03:18] Having lived for a time in Britain, I love all of the subtle insults that are leveled both

[01:03:29] by the contestants and the hosts.

[01:03:32] I love all the innuendo.

[01:03:34] Not necessarily the innuendo.

[01:03:35] It's sort of like, it's a little bit like it's the word disappointing, but the subtext is,

[01:03:44] this is dog shit and you should be ashamed.

[01:03:47] You should go home and never show your face again.

[01:03:50] And if it's the subtext and it's sort of the, the way it just, just that subtle amount of eye

[01:03:58] contact.

[01:04:00] And anyway, I do love, I do love watching people bake beautiful food and, and talk about it.

[01:04:06] But for me, it's the Britishisms of the show that really.

[01:04:11] Got it.

[01:04:12] Bring it to new heights.

[01:04:13] This was the first season where we got a shoulder pat instead of a handshake.

[01:04:18] So you're watching great Britain.

[01:04:21] Oh yeah.

[01:04:22] Fantastic.

[01:04:23] I don't skip the intro either.

[01:04:24] I watch the intro every single time.

[01:04:26] For me, that was one of the biggest slights of the entire show.

[01:04:33] So, so yeah, so it's already subdued.

[01:04:37] Like the greatest thing that you can have is for Paul Hollywood to give you a handshake.

[01:04:41] Like you could like dine out on that bit of lore for the rest of your life.

[01:04:45] Right.

[01:04:46] The fact that it wasn't good enough for a handshake, but he called out the fact that

[01:04:52] he was giving a shoulder pat.

[01:04:54] For the rest of her life, that woman will think, was he insulting me or complimenting me?

[01:05:00] I don't know.

[01:05:00] Was it patronizing?

[01:05:01] Yeah.

[01:05:02] And she will replay that moment in her mind for the rest of her life, not knowing if it

[01:05:07] was good or bad.

[01:05:08] And that's the kind of stuff that I love.

[01:05:11] And that brings us round to your number one, Steve.

[01:05:15] What is your top show of 2024?

[01:05:18] Much to Anthony Chagrin.

[01:05:19] I'm going to go with the Penguin.

[01:05:21] Aha!

[01:05:22] Anthony, you caught a lot of flack on the community Discord for your takes on the Penguin.

[01:05:27] Yeah, yeah.

[01:05:28] Not unlike my opinions of Star Trek V, which I've put on the bottom of my OG ranking, or

[01:05:35] the fact that I think Joel is a monster in The Last of Us.

[01:05:38] So I feel for you in that same brotherly space of, I'm pretty clear about my thoughts and feelings

[01:05:44] about this, but everybody else seems to think I'm crazy.

[01:05:48] There were things I liked about the Penguin, but let's not dwell on the negative.

[01:05:53] Let's let Steve wax on up with the show that he most loves.

[01:05:57] Well, I mean, really, if you want to understand how much I like it, I would suggest you would

[01:06:01] go listen to properly Howard and catch the two episodes where we look at the first and then

[01:06:08] do the summary of the show.

[01:06:11] So it's a show that I was a little hesitant to, I mean, I was going to watch it for sure

[01:06:19] because I like things Batman related.

[01:06:22] Are you a Batman stan?

[01:06:24] I think you are because you guys talked about it.

[01:06:26] I can't say that I've ever seen a comic book.

[01:06:31] I mean, I've seen them, but I've never read one.

[01:06:32] So it's like, I am definitely a Batman.

[01:06:35] There's a segment of the Batman stans that are just strictly the movies.

[01:06:40] And I'm like, I'll do an apologetics on Batman and Robin as well.

[01:06:44] If anybody needs.

[01:06:49] I really liked the Batman.

[01:06:51] I like the Batman more than Anthony did.

[01:06:53] Um, so I think I was already a little bit more, uh, you know, uh, ready to watch this

[01:07:00] show.

[01:07:00] Um, but I was, I was kind of like, I didn't know what, what, what exactly what to expect.

[01:07:04] Um, because the penguin is a very, uh, he's, he's been portrayed in so many different ways,

[01:07:10] but, um, I was curious how compelling they were going to make it like, cause penguin always

[01:07:15] felt like he was, is he really an adversary for Batman?

[01:07:19] Like, I mean, uh, what, what is he bringing to the table?

[01:07:23] And this, this episode, I think, um, really, I mean, where this, this whole season did something

[01:07:28] with him, not only in the Batman universe, but just as a, as a show, a standalone show.

[01:07:33] If you, I mean, since there really is no, no Batman, uh, in it other than like a couple

[01:07:39] of, uh, you know, allusions to it.

[01:07:40] I think, um, I think it stands alone as, as a, as a compelling show.

[01:07:45] The fact that it has the overlay of this is developing something that, um, is going to,

[01:07:49] you know, you know, contribute to the next film is, is even more, uh, I think it's more

[01:07:54] creative to, to do that with like, I know they, the Marvel movies do that, but this feels,

[01:07:59] um, this feels like a great way to get to that next film where we don't have to do all

[01:08:05] this backstory.

[01:08:06] Uh, we can just insert the penguin in this new role and we could see how that, that plays

[01:08:12] out instead of having to develop a villain more so in the, in the next movie.

[01:08:16] I kind of feel like they cracked the code with bouncing between the small screen and the big

[01:08:22] screen in a way that Marvel has yet to be fully successful with.

[01:08:27] Like Marvel's come close a couple of times, but this felt you could be a casual fan, you

[01:08:33] know, just a casual viewer stumble across the penguin and you could be in this world and

[01:08:38] get this storyline without knowing anything else about the Batman.

[01:08:43] Maybe except for the very end little scene, but you know, otherwise it's just a really

[01:08:47] compelling crime drama.

[01:08:49] And then yet it, when the movie, the next movie comes out, this adds so much layer and,

[01:08:55] uh, so many layers of complexity and motivation and just really ramps the stakes in such a way.

[01:09:01] So yeah.

[01:09:01] Yeah.

[01:09:01] And beyond just the penguin himself, right?

[01:09:03] I mean, I think just, just an Anthony and I talk about the importance of Gotham city

[01:09:08] as a character in many of these films.

[01:09:11] And this gives us just more in, you know, we get to see more of Gotham city that, uh,

[01:09:17] that we, that we may never even have to encounter, but we understand it as a backdrop even further,

[01:09:23] um, because of this film.

[01:09:25] So I, I, or because of the show, I really, uh, I, so I, I'm, I'm, it, it serves me, you

[01:09:31] know, well to go, okay, now I'm excited for the next one in a new way.

[01:09:34] But also I could keep watching these types of spinoffs at, you know, ad nauseam, to be

[01:09:40] honest.

[01:09:41] Agreed.

[01:09:42] Yeah.

[01:09:42] Good pick.

[01:09:42] It's going to be high in my list as well.

[01:09:44] When I get around to it, Anthony, that brings us around to your number one pick for 2024.

[01:09:49] Number one pick, um, the final season of curb your enthusiasm.

[01:09:55] Wow.

[01:09:55] You and John are going to, John's going to like to hear this.

[01:09:58] He was very low season.

[01:10:00] I think, I think the show only got better over the year, you know, sort of like if you

[01:10:05] think of shows in terms of arcs, you know, you, a lot of times the pilot season with dramas

[01:10:12] are just kind of getting sea legs and then they really pick up the pace.

[01:10:18] Um, sometimes there's a dip in the second season was short series.

[01:10:22] Like they had a great idea for a first season, a lot of success, little bit of a dip in the

[01:10:29] second season.

[01:10:31] Curve is one of these weird shows where every season got better.

[01:10:36] Like the first season is, is almost unwatchable in my mind.

[01:10:42] And he did so many of these things.

[01:10:45] 12 seasons.

[01:10:47] Yeah.

[01:10:47] Yeah.

[01:10:48] Yeah.

[01:10:48] I think, I think that there has been a move in comedy away from something that would be

[01:10:55] specifically thought of as Jewish humor.

[01:10:57] Mm-hmm.

[01:10:58] And I think Jewish, are you a Mizell fan?

[01:11:02] You know what?

[01:11:03] It's a good point.

[01:11:04] I, I, I did watch that.

[01:11:07] Didn't enjoy it nearly as much, but I, I could see that that as a, as an iteration of Jewish

[01:11:12] humor as well.

[01:11:13] I, I think for the most part, for, I don't know, like 50 years, most of Hollywood comedy

[01:11:22] was kind of post vaudeville.

[01:11:24] Mm-hmm.

[01:11:25] And somehow there's been a shift really.

[01:11:29] I think, I think sort of a lot of people mark Seinfeld as the end of this.

[01:11:34] That's what was in my mind.

[01:11:35] Yeah.

[01:11:36] The, the end of this sort of this era of, of really Jewish influenced humor.

[01:11:42] Mm-hmm.

[01:11:43] And I think Larry David was kind of the one holdout, you know, still doing the kind

[01:11:50] of thing that I recognize and, and really just love the most.

[01:11:55] Mm-hmm.

[01:11:56] Like that, that's my sweet spot.

[01:11:58] I, I think he's, it's brilliant.

[01:12:01] And in addition to that, impressive that most of the show is unscripted.

[01:12:06] Um, it's a, it's a real capstone to, uh, an incredible amount of content produced and

[01:12:14] holding to a creative vision and delivering year on year on year and season after season.

[01:12:20] Yeah.

[01:12:21] You know, and in some ways it kind of belongs into a hall of fame kind of thing.

[01:12:24] On top of that, it really goes, it really has to go into Ted Danson's sort of hall of fame

[01:12:30] case.

[01:12:31] Mm-hmm.

[01:12:32] Like, I think you put him in maybe four of the top 10 sitcoms of all time.

[01:12:37] Mm-hmm.

[01:12:38] And this has got to be one of them.

[01:12:40] And so I, I, uh, I appreciate, you know, he's not a major character on this particular

[01:12:45] show, but it is, it is some of his best work.

[01:12:48] All right.

[01:12:49] Uh, bonus question.

[01:12:51] What is your guilty pleasure?

[01:12:53] Something that you would not credibly put on a top 10 ranking list, but you love it nonetheless.

[01:13:01] Steve?

[01:13:02] I'm, I'm a sucker for Ink Master.

[01:13:08] Not, uh, Forged in Fire?

[01:13:09] Oh, dude, I love Forged in Fire.

[01:13:12] This blade will kill.

[01:13:14] Oh my God.

[01:13:15] So Forged in Fire is such a guilty pleasure that I can only watch it when my wife's out

[01:13:19] of the house.

[01:13:20] Yeah.

[01:13:21] Out of town, right?

[01:13:22] Yeah.

[01:13:22] Yeah.

[01:13:22] I mean, it is.

[01:13:23] Yeah.

[01:13:24] It will kill.

[01:13:25] I mean, I, I, I, yeah.

[01:13:27] Uh, uh, Dave Markita.

[01:13:29] Oh my gosh.

[01:13:29] It's just, yeah.

[01:13:30] I don't know if Anthony, if you've ever seen Forged in Fire, but good Lord, it is.

[01:13:33] Now it's not, I mean, I did like knife or death when that was brief for a while.

[01:13:37] I missed that one.

[01:13:39] Yeah, that's good stuff.

[01:13:41] Uh, but yeah, Forged in Fire.

[01:13:42] I'm like, there was a point where I started like Googling, like, you know, uh, like forges,

[01:13:47] like I was thinking about maybe, maybe it's time for a home forge.

[01:13:51] Do you think you're a, I don't think you live in an HOA, but you're in a mildly suburban

[01:13:57] neighborhood.

[01:13:57] I'm out, I'm out in the country.

[01:13:58] I can, I can.

[01:13:59] Oh, you can do whatever you want.

[01:14:01] Yeah.

[01:14:01] Yeah.

[01:14:03] Absolutely.

[01:14:04] I'm so glad you mentioned Forged in Fire.

[01:14:05] That's, that really is.

[01:14:08] Oh man, that's so good.

[01:14:09] But anyway, you started to say, uh.

[01:14:11] Oh yeah.

[01:14:11] Ink Master.

[01:14:12] I love, I love Ink Master.

[01:14:14] Um, uh, it's not as, I don't think it's as good as it used to be.

[01:14:18] Um, uh, once it kind of exclusively became, I think a Paramount Plus jam, just, it just,

[01:14:23] uh, shortened a bit.

[01:14:25] Um, and I feel like the, the earlier seasons were, um, they felt like there was much more

[01:14:32] detailed critique and, and, uh, understanding of like some of the, um, the techniques that

[01:14:37] go into, into tattooing.

[01:14:39] But, uh, um, I still, I still enjoy, I, I enjoy when this one, this season was a little bit

[01:14:45] disappointing.

[01:14:46] There wasn't as many bad tattoos.

[01:14:47] I love the bad tattoos.

[01:14:49] Right.

[01:14:50] That, that, that, you know, somebody's so far out of their, their, uh, strength, but they

[01:14:56] have to do it anyway.

[01:14:57] And it's like, someone gets a portrait that just looks like, is it supposed to be like

[01:15:00] their, their, uh, their, their aunt that passed away and they just, and it ends up looking

[01:15:04] like a pug.

[01:15:04] That's my favorite.

[01:15:05] And it's not like the, uh, you know, is this cake or the, you know, what, what is the other

[01:15:09] one?

[01:15:10] The, there's like a dessert one, um, where they make snack foods and stuff.

[01:15:14] My daughter watches a few of these things and, you know, there you just, it's fine.

[01:15:18] There's no stakes, but getting a tattoo on your body for a challenge.

[01:15:24] Okay.

[01:15:24] I have a followup on this.

[01:15:26] So Steve, you just recently got another major tattoo on your body.

[01:15:32] Oh.

[01:15:33] Um, did you find this artist via the show?

[01:15:39] Yes.

[01:15:39] It's that he's actually a judge.

[01:15:41] Are you serious?

[01:15:42] Yeah.

[01:15:43] And then sort of, I, I'm not, I don't know the show, so, but I'm sure some people

[01:15:47] will, what is the name of the tattoo?

[01:15:51] DJ Tambi is that he's, he's a four-time winner of the show and now he's a judge.

[01:15:55] Okay.

[01:15:56] And, uh, can you just describe the tattoo for us?

[01:15:59] Uh, it is a, uh, black and gray photo realistic stay puff marshmallow man, uh, um, surrounded

[01:16:08] by full color slimers, three different versions of Slimer from the real ghost busters cartoon.

[01:16:15] Yeah.

[01:16:16] And I, have you seen, have you, have you laid eyes on this?

[01:16:20] I've seen a photo.

[01:16:21] I've certainly seen a photo.

[01:16:22] Now I have the same question my wife had, and that is we were a little bit thrown by

[01:16:28] the three slimers.

[01:16:30] Like it seems like two, too many slimers.

[01:16:34] Shouldn't there only be a single Slimer?

[01:16:36] Can you explain why there are three slimers?

[01:16:38] Well, he wanted to, to do multiple ghosts and he researched, uh, the, the real ghost

[01:16:47] busters cartoon.

[01:16:48] And really there's no like memorable or, or iconic other ghosts on there.

[01:16:56] Like they're just sort of.

[01:16:57] Right.

[01:16:58] Episodic.

[01:16:58] Another ghost would show up.

[01:16:59] And so you can almost have a spinoff, like a scrappy do kind of thing with Slimer.

[01:17:03] Couldn't you?

[01:17:03] Totally.

[01:17:04] Yeah.

[01:17:04] So this, so I mean, Slimer was obviously the most featured and he's like, well, I really

[01:17:08] love this color.

[01:17:09] I really love this look.

[01:17:11] Uh, he says, and I, I want to do, so he did three different versions and it's, um, and

[01:17:17] he's a ghost.

[01:17:17] So it's, I think it's okay.

[01:17:21] I feel like we need a photo of this on the discord.

[01:17:24] Yeah, I can make that happen.

[01:17:26] Okay.

[01:17:27] All right.

[01:17:27] That's fabulous.

[01:17:28] With Steve's permission.

[01:17:29] Of course.

[01:17:30] Of course.

[01:17:31] Informed consent.

[01:17:32] Uh, ongoing and prior, uh, prior and ongoing consent.

[01:17:36] Yeah.

[01:17:36] And, uh, DJ Tammy posted this on his Instagram.

[01:17:39] Oh, well then now it's public.

[01:17:41] Yeah.

[01:17:41] And it's getting a lot of, a lot of, uh, positive feedback.

[01:17:45] Lots of shares.

[01:17:46] So.

[01:17:46] Fantastic.

[01:17:47] Fantastic.

[01:17:49] Anthony.

[01:17:50] Uh, guilty pleasure.

[01:17:52] No pleasures are guilty.

[01:17:53] Like you should be open with your pleasures.

[01:17:55] Right.

[01:17:55] But anyway, we, we like to spin it that way.

[01:17:57] So I want to say that for most of my life, I've really turned up my nose at folks who were

[01:18:07] into reality television.

[01:18:09] Mm-hmm.

[01:18:10] And.

[01:18:11] Like your co-host Steve.

[01:18:12] Like so much, so, so much that like, I, I would like make moral judgments about these

[01:18:17] people.

[01:18:17] Wow.

[01:18:18] Like this is the downfall of a society.

[01:18:20] You're that kind of guy.

[01:18:21] I, I, I really am kind of, kind of an asshole.

[01:18:23] Uh, I am why Trump was elected just in case you were wondering why Trump was reelected.

[01:18:29] It was my fault.

[01:18:30] So, um, I found through my father, the show called alone.

[01:18:37] I don't know it.

[01:18:38] Which is reality television that's on the history channel.

[01:18:43] And I would only watch it at my father's house when I was visiting California.

[01:18:46] And basically it's kind of like, what if you take a survivalist and you put them in the

[01:18:55] Arctic and just.

[01:18:56] I love the logo here.

[01:18:57] That's got, it's like a wolf.

[01:18:59] Yeah.

[01:18:59] That runs into the trees and there's somebody walking off into a snowstorm.

[01:19:04] Yeah.

[01:19:04] There you go.

[01:19:05] Yeah.

[01:19:05] Ooh, I can, I feel cold right now.

[01:19:07] So take, you know, take some sort of survivalists out of, you know, rural Arkansas who thinks

[01:19:13] that he's God's gift to nature.

[01:19:16] And then you put them in the Arctic with legitimate grizzly bears and, uh, big cats and wolves and

[01:19:26] tell them like you, you can only bring 10 items.

[01:19:30] You're going to have to survive for 90 days or however long they've got to outlast these

[01:19:35] other contestants, but they don't ever meet any of the other contestants.

[01:19:40] So a lot of it is sort of the psychological ramblings of mad men who like cannot take the isolation

[01:19:48] and, and, you know, they're, they're, they're basically freezing to death and they're starving

[01:19:52] to death and you get to watch it.

[01:19:54] And it's, it's, it's, it's horrible and I feel horrible, but I can't look away.

[01:19:59] This is a, it's a really fascinating evolution of the naked and afraid kind of, uh, scenario.

[01:20:06] And there's a whole bunch of other ones too.

[01:20:08] Naked and afraid.

[01:20:10] Okay.

[01:20:10] Um, but for some reason, this one like really hits my sweet spot.

[01:20:15] Cause I, I, I like to think, you know, I'd like to think like, I'm going to go out there

[01:20:19] and be able to hack it.

[01:20:21] It'd be really, it'd be really fun to build a fort, build a fire.

[01:20:24] Sounds like, sounds like camping.

[01:20:26] So first I've ever heard somebody who dies vicariously through a show.

[01:20:31] I, I keep saying they're going to keep doing this show until someone like literally dies.

[01:20:37] Legit dies.

[01:20:38] Yeah.

[01:20:38] Legit dies.

[01:20:39] And, and they're going to have it all on camera.

[01:20:41] But is it, would it be cynical for me to say the fact that that would be an incredible ratings

[01:20:45] boost for them?

[01:20:46] It would be a ratings boost for sure.

[01:20:48] However, I wonder if the network would allow, like it would be a YouTube sensation, right?

[01:20:53] I doubt that they would actually allow them to.

[01:20:57] Cause a lot of these shows, I mean, you, you see it on the margins.

[01:21:00] Sometimes there's, there's medics in camps nearby.

[01:21:02] They have radios.

[01:21:03] They have like ways to take care of them.

[01:21:06] But yeah, I mean, this could, you could have a little weird, uh, freak accident and somebody

[01:21:11] could die quite easily.

[01:21:12] You know, I think one of the seasons there was a dude who like, he accidentally burned

[01:21:17] down his, he actually burned down his fort and he was, he could, he was, he was,

[01:21:23] he's just going to be out, out of doors, uh, all night long in the Arctic.

[01:21:28] And they said, oh, well, there's a storm.

[01:21:30] So the earliest we can get to you is, you know, tomorrow, which is about 12 hours from

[01:21:34] now.

[01:21:36] And he just had to figure out how to make it work.

[01:21:39] Wow.

[01:21:39] My wife thinks I'm a total dummy.

[01:21:42] She says, all this is scripted.

[01:21:44] There's no way that they're putting these people in actual danger.

[01:21:47] It's like, oh no, people are that dumb.

[01:21:49] People will put themselves in danger.

[01:21:51] And 11 seasons of dumb.

[01:21:54] Yeah.

[01:21:54] Yeah.

[01:21:55] So I like it.

[01:21:57] It's, it's certainly a guilty pleasure.

[01:21:59] I feel guilty.

[01:21:59] Absolutely.

[01:22:00] I think it falls perfectly into that category.

[01:22:03] Well, guys, this was a lot of fun.

[01:22:05] Uh, and I think we're looking forward to severance, right?

[01:22:09] We're going to do our joint coverage project.

[01:22:12] That is right around the corner.

[01:22:13] It is right around the corner.

[01:22:15] We were looking at, uh, 2025.

[01:22:16] It's going to be a very busy year this year.

[01:22:19] A lot of big, big marquee shows coming back and severance is going to pretty much be the

[01:22:24] one that kicks it off.

[01:22:25] So we're going to be doing, uh, the four of us doing a episode by episode recap weekly.

[01:22:32] And you and, uh, Anthony have already done your season one recap and we have that out on the

[01:22:37] special feed.

[01:22:38] It's a whole separate feed.

[01:22:39] So you got to make sure you go subscribe to that.

[01:22:40] Yeah.

[01:22:41] Do a search for, um, severance lore hounds and you'll find it.

[01:22:45] Perfect.

[01:22:45] What else is, uh, properly Howard up to these days?

[01:22:48] Well, right after we finish, um, talking with you, David, we will be reviewing the worst movie

[01:22:57] ever made cocktail.

[01:23:01] Oh, nice.

[01:23:02] Tom Cruise, uh, juggling bottles and, uh, mixing things.

[01:23:07] Yeah.

[01:23:07] Oh yeah.

[01:23:08] Good stuff.

[01:23:09] Juggling bottles, juggling women, juggling his own, his own mortality, his own morality.

[01:23:16] A lot of juggling happen.

[01:23:18] I can't wait to hear the podcast.

[01:23:27] Thank you to everyone who stuck around for our three and a half hours, give or take of

[01:23:32] bonus content and top 10 rankings.

[01:23:35] Don't forget to click the link tree in the show notes to check out more of the voices that

[01:23:38] you heard from today.

[01:23:39] There's plenty of content to be had over the winter break.

[01:23:42] I hope everyone has a wonderful and restful holiday.

[01:23:46] I hope everyone has some time to spend with the people that they love.

[01:23:50] See you all in the new year, starting our list for 2025.

[01:23:55] The Lorehounds podcast is produced and published by the Lorehounds.

[01:23:58] You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at thelorehounds.com slash contact.

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[01:24:09] Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any

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