Dune: Prophecy - Series Preview

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[00:01:16] Welcome to the Dune Prophecy Podcast, where the Lorehounds your guides to the secrets of

[00:01:22] the sisterhood.

[00:01:23] I'm David.

[00:01:23] And I'm Alicia and this is our season preview podcast for the upcoming Dune Prophecy series

[00:01:28] on HBO Max.

[00:01:30] In this episode we're going to run through the setup and context for the show so that you'll

[00:01:35] be ready when the season starts on Sunday, November 17.

[00:01:41] That's Monday, November 18th for the rest of us.

[00:01:44] Sorry, main character energy over here in the United States.

[00:01:48] For the show and anything Dune related, you can get in touch with us by sending email to dune at the lorehounds.com or visiting the website, the lorehounds.com.

[00:01:57] And there is a contact form there too.

[00:02:01] And voicemails are definitely encouraged as well.

[00:02:03] Yeah, and you can use the voicemail tool on the website or just use your smartphone's voice memo app and send those voicemails to the same Dune email address.

[00:02:12] We would also like to invite you to join our conversation on the community discord server.

[00:02:17] We've got a special channel set up.

[00:02:20] We've got a great mod team and everything.

[00:02:23] There's links for the email and the website and the discord all in the show notes below.

[00:02:29] And as always, we will have notes about our upcoming schedule and details about supporting the community at the end of the podcast.

[00:02:36] Alicia, how are you doing?

[00:02:37] Are you ready for silo?

[00:02:38] Because that's your big next big project.

[00:02:42] Well, it's funny.

[00:02:43] They're mixing together.

[00:02:44] And there's also, you know, Hugh Howey has another series called Sand.

[00:02:49] So it's, yeah, they're mixing together and becoming sand in my head.

[00:02:53] But no, it's, I am deep in both worlds.

[00:02:57] I'm very, very excited.

[00:02:58] We just finished recording our Agatha wrap up pod.

[00:03:02] So I can send that out into the world.

[00:03:04] And, you know, I've seen my child off to school, you know.

[00:03:09] Right, right.

[00:03:09] And, you know.

[00:03:10] And be ready for the next.

[00:03:12] For the hard sci-fi, yeah.

[00:03:14] That's right.

[00:03:15] That's right.

[00:03:15] So I was trying to think about our general spoiler warning here because this show is being inspired by the extended Dune universe, a book from the extended Dune universe.

[00:03:27] But also connected.

[00:03:29] Series, yeah, yeah.

[00:03:30] And connected to the movies.

[00:03:33] We're going to talk about a bunch of that.

[00:03:36] But there's a bunch of concepts and characters and movements and other parts of the Dune universe that we want to be careful around spoiling in case folks haven't read the books or don't know all the concepts.

[00:03:49] So I'm not sure how we want to navigate around some of that stuff.

[00:03:53] I think we'll just try to be careful about any specific details, but we'll talk about particular important aspects.

[00:04:03] So I mean, I guess we don't want to like, we don't have time to get too deep into book spoilers in this episode anyway.

[00:04:09] But my thinking about the Dune property in general when it comes to spoilers is Frank Herbert's style is that he tells you flat out right up front, so-and-so is going to die.

[00:04:23] Right.

[00:04:23] And it's so-and-so is doing it.

[00:04:26] And, you know, it just tells you all this.

[00:04:27] And then it's just about how we see the pieces come together that make that inevitable.

[00:04:34] Even knowing it, you can't avoid that inevitable outcome in a way.

[00:04:39] The first three chapters of the first Dune book basically spell out the flow of the plot for you.

[00:04:45] Right.

[00:04:46] Exactly.

[00:04:48] So, yeah, I don't know.

[00:04:49] I struggle with knowing what should be counted as a spoiler in the Dune world because, like, I assume people who have listened to this have at least watched the Villeneuve movies probably.

[00:05:02] Right.

[00:05:03] Right.

[00:05:03] Maybe 1984 as well.

[00:05:05] Probably a lot have read at least the first book.

[00:05:09] Mm-hmm.

[00:05:10] I'm sure a good number.

[00:05:11] Not as many of us have seen the movies.

[00:05:13] Right, right, right.

[00:05:14] I think it would be that way.

[00:05:15] So, I think we'll try to keep it conceptual and not get into specific things because the idea for this podcast is really to prep you with the context for what it is you're going to be watching.

[00:05:26] Because if you just dropped into the show without any navigational markers, it could be – I mean, I'm sure they're going to do a good job.

[00:05:34] But our job is to prepare you with that extra layer of information so you can really immerse yourself in the world.

[00:05:42] So, the series, I guess a couple of quick details.

[00:05:47] This is going to be an HBO original series.

[00:05:49] It bounced back and forth between the Max title and HBO.

[00:05:53] Anyway, it's an HBO drama now.

[00:05:56] It's going to be six episodes with a weekly release schedule kicking off in the United States on November 17th.

[00:06:06] And our plans for coverage are – I think we're going to try to record on Tuesday mornings.

[00:06:12] Tuesday mornings is U.S. time.

[00:06:14] And then we'll get the episodes out shortly thereafter.

[00:06:19] And we're not going to do a season pass or anything like that.

[00:06:22] This is a season one of a new show.

[00:06:25] And so, we're just going to keep this one pretty simple and make it available for everyone.

[00:06:30] Again, we have the Discord.

[00:06:32] And we're going to have different individual channels for each of the episodes.

[00:06:36] So, you can talk without worrying about being spoiled from episode to episode.

[00:06:41] And then we've also developed a show guide.

[00:06:43] And if you're new to the Lorehounds and haven't seen what these show guides are,

[00:06:47] we kind of put an online encyclopedia and guide together using a platform called Notion.

[00:06:55] And we can make basic information available for you so that you can quick reference.

[00:07:00] Oh, who is that?

[00:07:01] I see this face.

[00:07:02] Who's that character?

[00:07:03] Who are they related to?

[00:07:04] What world is this?

[00:07:06] And so, it just gives you that.

[00:07:08] It's a really great second screen experience.

[00:07:10] So, as you're watching the show, you can look it up on your phone.

[00:07:13] And you can get quick reference information to help keep you oriented in the world.

[00:07:17] Because, again, in a new world, a new property, you may not have all the bits and pieces together.

[00:07:22] So, the show guide.

[00:07:23] Normally, we put those as a subscriber benefit, either a season pass or regular subscribers.

[00:07:28] This time, we're just going to make it sort of publicly available so that everybody can access the resource.

[00:07:33] And then we'll see about what happens in future seasons, in success, as they say.

[00:07:40] So, Alicia, you and I both share a love for Dune.

[00:07:48] And how did you come to the property?

[00:07:51] How were you exposed to the books?

[00:07:52] What's your sort of personal experience with this story?

[00:07:58] So, I was definitely introduced by my mom.

[00:08:02] I thought that she watched the movie first, but we talked about it recently.

[00:08:05] And she says that she read the book first, but probably like the book to prep for the movie.

[00:08:10] But anyway, but she just got really into it and like read all of the books that were available at that time, including the, you know, the son, the Brian Herbert, Kevin J. Anderson ones.

[00:08:21] And at some point, yeah, she was like the main person probably when I was a teenager who would give me seminal science fiction books to read.

[00:08:32] And this was probably the first.

[00:08:35] So, I don't remember the first time I read it.

[00:08:37] I remember maybe I watched the 84 movie first.

[00:08:40] I honestly don't remember when they came into my life because they were just like always been there.

[00:08:46] I am always surprised revisiting how well and in how much detail I remember this story, which is like a testament to Frank Herbert's writing especially, but also to, yeah, just how many times I've read it.

[00:09:04] How often do you revisit?

[00:09:06] Do you have a time frequency or is it just sort of as catch as catch can kind of?

[00:09:10] Yeah, no, I'm way too chaotic for that.

[00:09:14] I mean, you know, so I revisited a couple of times recently, obviously for podcasting reasons.

[00:09:19] The first book, it's been a while since the first two Dune Messiah being the second one are the two that I revisit the most.

[00:09:27] And now I am.

[00:09:29] So I started because this series, it's set 10,000 years before the original book, Dune, before that series.

[00:09:37] There are books set around that time written by Frank Herbert's son, Brian Herbert and Kevin J. Anderson, which are based on Frank Herbert's notes.

[00:09:48] He left behind, you know, hundreds of pages of notes when he died.

[00:09:53] And so you and I both started reading the first book in a trilogy called The Great Schools of Dune called Sisterhood of Dune in preparation for this.

[00:10:03] And but then as we started to see the trailer and everything, we noticed that the characters have mostly different names.

[00:10:12] There's like few overlaps and the characters that we do know are much older.

[00:10:16] So we figured out that actually this takes place after the trilogy and after novella that comes after that.

[00:10:22] So we'll talk about that more as we go, I guess.

[00:10:25] Yeah, we've got definitely want to talk about how that all fits together, how all the different world pieces fit together.

[00:10:31] Right.

[00:10:32] And I'm loving that part of the timeline.

[00:10:34] Okay.

[00:10:35] Oh, awesome.

[00:10:35] That's great.

[00:10:37] Yeah, I've only ever read the core six books by Frank Herbert.

[00:10:42] I must have seen the movie first, but like you, I don't remember when I first encountered it.

[00:10:49] It was just something around.

[00:10:51] And I remember being a little kid and being at the bookstore.

[00:10:56] And I've talked about this before on past podcasts, Powell's books.

[00:10:59] I grew up in Portland, Oregon.

[00:11:01] And so I went to the original Powell's even before where it is now.

[00:11:05] And, you know, the cover is very iconic and I remember it very well.

[00:11:11] And I just, yeah, I don't remember when or how I first read the series.

[00:11:17] I think the most impactful time for me was when I definitely read it in my early 20s, college age years.

[00:11:23] And it really just blew my mind because it was a, this complete world that was in depth, not unlike a Tolkien world where, you know, the moon phase and, you know, the depths of this organization or this institution.

[00:11:39] There's a greater history that is been completed, but yet is not present on the page.

[00:11:46] But you can tell by the density and the thought and the way that the characters are relating to each other.

[00:11:51] And I was just taken with that incredible density of detail.

[00:11:57] And it really moved me.

[00:11:59] And so, like you, I think I've revisited it every once in a while.

[00:12:02] I don't have a frequency.

[00:12:03] As it comes up, I'll reread it.

[00:12:06] I definitely have favorites in the six books.

[00:12:09] I have other ones that are not favorites in the six books.

[00:12:13] It gets a little weird sometimes with some of his stuff in there.

[00:12:16] But I absolutely love the 84 movie.

[00:12:21] It's a hot mess, but, you know, it's a nostalgia thing, right?

[00:12:24] It represents more than just a plot and writing.

[00:12:29] It's something that hits in a nostalgia way.

[00:12:34] I think people are too hard on it, to be honest.

[00:12:38] I've never seen the miniseries.

[00:12:41] I think you've seen it.

[00:12:44] Yeah.

[00:12:45] I mean, to be honest, there are some things, because it's a miniseries, there are some things that it can do well.

[00:12:50] But there are also, you know, it's some really laugh out loud, bad moments, CGI acting.

[00:12:59] Yeah.

[00:12:59] There are some grown moments.

[00:13:01] But it does have the dinner party scene.

[00:13:04] Okay.

[00:13:07] I have seen both of the Villeneuve movies and enjoyed them.

[00:13:15] And we'll talk about a little bit more of that when we talk about the world building and the different worlds that are being represented in books and stuff.

[00:13:24] But yeah.

[00:13:24] So, oh, and I've seen the documentary about Jodorowsky.

[00:13:28] Yeah, that's very good.

[00:13:29] Which is an amazing documentary.

[00:13:31] It's so fun.

[00:13:32] And Jodorowsky is a wild character.

[00:13:36] It's just a fascinating story.

[00:13:40] Yeah.

[00:13:40] To hear him tell it, especially.

[00:13:42] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:13:43] And then I've got the, what is it called?

[00:13:47] A Masterpiece in Disaster, which is the oral history of the making of the 84 movie.

[00:13:52] And I dip into that every once in a while.

[00:13:55] Yeah.

[00:13:55] But I have not read any of Brian and, is it Kevin and Jane?

[00:14:02] Kevin.

[00:14:02] Yeah.

[00:14:02] I haven't read any of their books.

[00:14:05] I cracked into the Sisterhood of Dune book.

[00:14:09] And I'm not sure how I feel about it.

[00:14:15] It's, I'm having trouble recalibrating from Frank Herbert's writing style to his son's style.

[00:14:24] And I'm not sure where I am there.

[00:14:27] And I'm finding that it's hard for me to pick up and find the energy to read.

[00:14:32] So.

[00:14:33] What do you find different between the writing styles?

[00:14:36] I mean, I find things different too.

[00:14:37] I'm just curious if it's the same.

[00:14:38] Yeah.

[00:14:39] I'm enjoying it though.

[00:14:40] Yeah.

[00:14:41] Yeah.

[00:14:41] And I know you said you were, and obviously that carries a lot of weight with me if you're enjoying it.

[00:14:46] No, I mean, but we have different tastes.

[00:14:48] So I'm just curious what's not jiving.

[00:14:50] Yeah.

[00:14:51] I don't know.

[00:14:51] There's something in the writing, the tone of the characters.

[00:14:56] Hmm.

[00:14:57] Hmm.

[00:14:57] And, and in terms of, I'm sorry, I've got a little sand trout here trying to get my attention.

[00:15:05] And it is, you know, I've heard people describe it as space opera, you know, is the style.

[00:15:14] And I'm.

[00:15:15] Sure.

[00:15:15] But the original Dune as well.

[00:15:17] Yeah, it's true.

[00:15:20] I'm not sure where I am with it yet.

[00:15:22] I, I, I, I don't know.

[00:15:25] I'm, I'm so in enamored with the original six books and they mean something.

[00:15:32] Mm-hmm.

[00:15:32] In a, in a way for me.

[00:15:34] And I don't know that I've ever really cared.

[00:15:37] I've never cared to go and read the extended universe.

[00:15:40] Uh-huh.

[00:15:42] Um, and, uh, I'm happy with the, the six books and I never, I never was curious about why or how these things were created or how things got started.

[00:15:51] So maybe that's part of it.

[00:15:52] Maybe it's part of his writing style and his depiction of character.

[00:15:57] So, um, I don't really know why.

[00:15:59] We should say there's two authors here.

[00:16:01] Yeah, yeah, their style.

[00:16:02] Um, and, uh, yeah, I'm not really sure.

[00:16:05] I can't put my finger on it yet.

[00:16:07] So.

[00:16:08] It's, um, it's, it's snappier.

[00:16:11] It's more action focused.

[00:16:13] And it's also, um, it tells the story from, I mean, not that the, the prior, the, you know, Frank Herbert books also talk from multiple viewpoints, but this, it's not just multiple viewpoints within like the Atreides family and the siege, you know, it's multiple viewpoints.

[00:16:31] Well, that's true.

[00:16:32] The Harkonnens are in Dune too, but I don't know.

[00:16:36] I, what I like about it is it makes the Harkonnens more sympathetic to me.

[00:16:40] Sure.

[00:16:41] Sure.

[00:16:41] That's one of the things I like about it.

[00:16:42] And I always just was very interested in, this is a set in the aftermath of the Butlerian Jihad, which is when they killed all the thinking machines.

[00:16:51] So that's the, the Dune prophecy, um, TV show is set in that aftermath as well.

[00:16:57] Where they're.

[00:16:57] We're going to get into that.

[00:16:58] Yeah.

[00:16:59] Yeah.

[00:16:59] So, well, let's, let's segue then, and we can use the, this framework to continue to explore some of this context.

[00:17:07] There's a whole bunch of production background to this story that is pretty complex and we don't need to spend too much time on it.

[00:17:18] Other than, uh, you know, we can touch on some of the, the key salient points.

[00:17:23] The, um, title, the property for this was part of, um, legendary films, 2016 acquisition for the rights to Dune.

[00:17:35] And they, uh, had Denis Villeneuve attached to direct the pilot of this.

[00:17:44] And then there was a whole bunch of changes.

[00:17:47] So we, we changed, uh, what three different, four different showrunners.

[00:17:53] Am I counting right there?

[00:17:55] We.

[00:17:57] Yeah.

[00:17:58] There's a Villeneuve detached himself from this.

[00:18:01] We had multiple director changes.

[00:18:05] Um, and we had a lot of changes in the production timeline where they were going to start in 2020 and it got delayed because of the pandemic.

[00:18:17] And then it got restarted and then it was delayed again because of strike.

[00:18:22] And then it got restarted again.

[00:18:25] And so, um, it went through a whole bunch of evolutions as well as casting.

[00:18:29] We'll talk about some casting in a little bit.

[00:18:31] But, and then they changed the title cause that was going to be Dune Sisterhood.

[00:18:36] I can't remember now.

[00:18:37] Yeah.

[00:18:37] The Dune, the sisterhood.

[00:18:38] And then they changed it to Dune Prophecy and, uh, HBO got involved.

[00:18:43] And then we are, are finally here.

[00:18:45] So it went through a really turbulent set of changes.

[00:18:49] And, but it's clearly part of the world, I guess the kind of a branch timeline, if you will, of the Villeneuve verse.

[00:19:01] Right.

[00:19:02] So it's very much connected to the movies, but inspired by the book that we've been mentioning.

[00:19:08] Well, I mean, inspired by, I mean, cause actually I thought, I thought that it was going to be inspired by Sisterhood of Dune.

[00:19:17] And I think that was because they were calling it Dune Sisterhood at first.

[00:19:20] And I think a lot of people made that assumption.

[00:19:22] But then when we look at the characters, like, um, like, uh, Emily Mortimer is playing, right.

[00:19:29] Is, am I right?

[00:19:30] No, sorry.

[00:19:30] Emily Watson.

[00:19:31] Emily Watson is playing Valia Harkonnen, who is a character in Dune Sisterhood.

[00:19:36] But she, when we look at, see her in the trailer, she's older and she's in a different, more advanced position.

[00:19:43] So, um, that's, I started to dig in and Mark Strong's character, he's the emperor, uh, Emperor Javico, Carino.

[00:19:54] And in the third book in the Great Schools of Dune trilogy, he's only 12 years old.

[00:20:00] So then there's this other, uh, short novella called Imperial Courts.

[00:20:05] It's only 40 pages long, published in 2022.

[00:20:08] And it's in the Sands of Dune collection.

[00:20:10] In that one, that character is 23.

[00:20:13] So that is like the closest we have to this TV show, um, in terms of timeline that is written.

[00:20:21] So I think they've done something very clever here in, they're like, we'll take all of this

[00:20:26] stuff leading up to it as source material.

[00:20:29] And then we'll just set it just after that in the timeline.

[00:20:32] So we can do whatever we want, basically.

[00:20:34] Because it's 10,000 years until the next piece of Dune.

[00:20:38] Right, right.

[00:20:39] Right.

[00:20:39] And the story is going to focus around the formation of the Bene Gesserit primarily.

[00:20:48] And I think we'll get some connection to some of the other schools and power structures.

[00:20:54] And we'll talk about that in a second.

[00:20:56] Well, I'm wondering now if it's later than that though, because Valia Harkonnen seems to

[00:21:00] already be the Reverend Mother.

[00:21:04] Right.

[00:21:05] And so I don't, it's, it's, I don't know how much we can use the books as understanding,

[00:21:10] right?

[00:21:11] Like, so yeah, they're going, they're adapting, uh, the material to fit into the Villeneuve

[00:21:17] verse.

[00:21:18] Right.

[00:21:18] Right.

[00:21:19] So.

[00:21:19] But it seems they're setting it later in the timeline because of the names they used.

[00:21:25] Right, right.

[00:21:26] So I, I don't know how to square those two things without that, without actually having

[00:21:30] talked to them.

[00:21:30] Yeah.

[00:21:31] So, but we're looking at the formation of the Bene Gesserit, uh, whether it's the initial

[00:21:35] formation or feels like they're already in.

[00:21:38] Early days at least.

[00:21:39] And yeah, and they're, they're working.

[00:21:41] And so they're at, maybe this is a, um, a, uh, uh, pivotal moment in their formation

[00:21:50] and in terms of them establishing their power throughout the Imperium.

[00:21:54] So I think it's something important to, to kind of, uh, point out for people who are new

[00:22:01] to the Dune world that Frank Herbert's envisioning of this world is that it's our humanity, yours

[00:22:10] and mine, all of us listening together in a millennia from now.

[00:22:15] So there's no Star Trek, there's no transporter beams, there are no aliens and Romulans and

[00:22:21] Klingons and such, but this is literally our humanity gone to the stars and what will happen

[00:22:28] to our species in generation after generation after generation.

[00:22:33] So I think it's a, it's kind of a key point to, to recognize that he's really looking at

[00:22:39] our, that's part of what he was writing about is what happens to the human species when we're

[00:22:44] that old, like when we've been around for that long and the different things that we get

[00:22:48] up to.

[00:22:49] Right.

[00:22:50] So you, um, and you, Luke and I had a conversation on a forthcoming breakdown of part of the

[00:22:58] book Dune, the original book Dune, um, about this show.

[00:23:02] Uh, and by the way, I'm going to, so I'm going to, I'm going to clip that conversation from

[00:23:06] there and include it with a summary of this Imperial court story that I just told you about

[00:23:10] and make a little episode of that.

[00:23:12] Um, but yeah, so sorry, I lost my train of thought.

[00:23:18] Sure.

[00:23:18] Let me marker that.

[00:23:19] Yeah.

[00:23:20] Um, sorry.

[00:23:21] What were you saying just before that?

[00:23:22] Uh, Frank Herbert's, um, Dune about his, that this is humanity.

[00:23:28] Uh, this is us, our humanity in 10,000 year, you know, in.

[00:23:32] Oh, right, right, right.

[00:23:32] Okay.

[00:23:33] Oh yeah.

[00:23:33] Marker Brecken.

[00:23:34] Um, so yeah, we were talking about how, you know, the current moment with artificial intelligence

[00:23:40] and what would Frank Herbert think about that?

[00:23:45] And it's because this leads up to this Butlerian jihad that we already mentioned.

[00:23:49] It is basically when, um, humanity had been enslaved by the machines for like more than

[00:23:56] a thousand years and they fought back and took them out.

[00:24:00] And so they just decided they had to wipe out all machines.

[00:24:04] Um, but yeah, then they needed to train human brains to work like machines to be able to accomplish

[00:24:12] the same things like traveling through space.

[00:24:14] Right.

[00:24:14] There was a, there was a functional need in some way and we needed to replace the machines

[00:24:19] with humans to fix those needs.

[00:24:21] Yeah.

[00:24:22] Yeah.

[00:24:22] So the trilogy takes place about a hundred years after that jihad.

[00:24:26] So then, um, it's, yeah, it's, it's a time of like just figuring things out and,

[00:24:33] you know, establishing the new, the new, uh, empire and, and these, these schools.

[00:24:39] So I'm hoping that we see not just the Bene Gesserit, I'm hoping we also see the Mentats

[00:24:44] and the Spacing Guild and all the rest of the Sook School for the doctor.

[00:24:49] Well, let's, let's do that.

[00:24:51] Let's go through some of these key elements, uh, in our outline here and, and we'll use

[00:24:55] both the political landscape and the characters as a way to sort of take apart and, and prep

[00:25:01] some context.

[00:25:02] So the, the key characters are going to be a pair of sisters, uh, who come from the Harkonnen

[00:25:10] family or Harkonnen.

[00:25:11] Either one is right.

[00:25:12] As far as I can tell from the internet, nobody has definitively said, uh, and it's Valia

[00:25:20] Harkonnen and Tula Harkonnen.

[00:25:22] I don't know.

[00:25:23] I'm going to, I'm going to switch back and forth.

[00:25:24] I apologize.

[00:25:25] And those are characters in those books that we were talking about.

[00:25:28] Those two.

[00:25:28] Right.

[00:25:29] And Valia is played by Emily Watson and Tula is, uh, played by Olivia Williams, who we love

[00:25:35] very much.

[00:25:35] We seek it.

[00:25:36] We've gotten a lot of, uh, her in these last couple of years, which is great.

[00:25:39] And Valia is the leader of the Bene Gesserit Sisterhood and she's running a quote unquote

[00:25:43] school for young women.

[00:25:45] And, uh, Tula, uh, who is a Reverend Mother within the, the, uh, organization has a bit of

[00:25:52] a complex relationship as far as we can tell with her sister.

[00:25:55] And, uh, we can say that we're going to be following the, um, primary storyline of these

[00:26:03] two.

[00:26:03] These, these two are going to be our entry points.

[00:26:05] So that brings up the, this question of will, what are the Bene Gesserit and how did they

[00:26:13] become developed?

[00:26:14] And this is one of those things where like, how far do we go with spoilers?

[00:26:19] I mean, explaining the Bene Gesserit.

[00:26:22] I mean, I think we can just say, you know, this is, um, the Rebecca Ferguson character,

[00:26:28] uh, you know, Jessica, these, that's the order that she's a part of.

[00:26:33] They're the space witches and they have.

[00:26:35] So in the timeline that we are talking about now, there was, there is in the books, the

[00:26:41] last of the sorceresses, which are like even more impressive.

[00:26:44] So I'm hoping that we see that because that's a nice, when you have a prequel problem where

[00:26:49] you're like, how do you escalate from the spectacle that's already been shown?

[00:26:54] Um, and so one way to do it is if you include something like the sorceresses, that's an excuse

[00:26:58] for like, oh, and now the powers are even bigger.

[00:27:01] Okay.

[00:27:02] And I know nothing about the sorceresses, uh, in this, and I think it's referenced even

[00:27:06] in the trailer, some material that they're referenced in for the show.

[00:27:11] Okay.

[00:27:12] I feel like I saw that somewhere that there's some connection.

[00:27:16] Yeah.

[00:27:17] So that's a good question.

[00:27:19] So I guess one of the things that we could say, and they, they talk about in the trailer

[00:27:23] is that they're thinking about the destiny of the human race and beyond just any political

[00:27:31] leader or a, a, a, a particular run of, of emperors or whatever, but they're looking

[00:27:37] at the genetic destiny of the race overall.

[00:27:41] And they are also, if we've seen the movies, you understand that they have what some might

[00:27:48] consider, uh, superhuman powers, almost magical powers.

[00:27:52] That's why they're sort of called quote unquote, which is, um, because people don't understand

[00:27:57] what they do.

[00:27:58] And it all comes from very deep study of the human condition, I guess.

[00:28:03] Yeah.

[00:28:03] And some drugs that they take that unlock their connection to, yeah.

[00:28:09] And connection to prior generations.

[00:28:11] Exactly.

[00:28:12] So, um, we then have Emperor Javako Corino.

[00:28:18] I'm not sure I'm pronouncing his, the first name correctly, but it's going to be played,

[00:28:21] that character is going to be played by Mark Strong.

[00:28:24] And this is the, um, and we'll see where they drop us in on the timeline of the emperors,

[00:28:31] the Padishah emperor and all of that stuff.

[00:28:34] But the Imperium is struggling to maintain a sense of order and development following the

[00:28:41] Butlerian Jihad.

[00:28:43] Right.

[00:28:43] And so this is like a perilous time.

[00:28:45] There's a lot of political maneuverings and, and, uh, uh, uh, you know, people, uh, uh,

[00:28:53] maneuvering to try to gain a corner or, uh, establish themselves a little game of thronesy,

[00:28:58] I guess we could say.

[00:28:59] Yeah.

[00:29:00] Yeah.

[00:29:00] So the short story, um, that, uh, that I'm going to do the summary for is set just as he

[00:29:07] has ascended to the throne.

[00:29:09] Okay.

[00:29:09] When the previous emperor had died, which, and it's funny cause I'm reading these things

[00:29:13] out of order.

[00:29:14] I was just reading Sisterhood of Doom and now I've jumped past two other books to read this

[00:29:18] story and, uh, the name of the emperor who dies.

[00:29:21] I'm like, Oh, Oh, okay.

[00:29:23] That's a spoiler.

[00:29:26] Fair enough.

[00:29:27] Are you a Mark Strong fan at all?

[00:29:30] I like Mark Strong.

[00:29:31] Yeah.

[00:29:31] Yeah.

[00:29:32] Yeah.

[00:29:32] I mean, sure.

[00:29:33] I don't have posters in my room, but yeah.

[00:29:35] He brings a lot of gravity to his role.

[00:29:37] So we're looking forward to seeing him in this.

[00:29:40] So then we have, I believe what they're calling the noble houses in this, which we

[00:29:45] sort of, if you're part of the, uh, Dune, you know, if you've been reading or in, and

[00:29:50] watching the movies, then you'll have heard of something called the lands rad, which is really

[00:29:54] just the, the council, uh, or the coming together, the sort of quasi parliamentarian system

[00:29:59] that the noble houses order themselves by.

[00:30:03] It's a Dutch word actually.

[00:30:05] So it just literally means council of countries basically.

[00:30:09] Right.

[00:30:10] And so, you know, the noble houses are trying to figure out their positioning and their

[00:30:15] relevance.

[00:30:16] And there's lots of resource competition because war does that, you know, it breaks shipping

[00:30:21] lines and destroys equipment.

[00:30:23] And so there's a, um, whole feeling like people are really struggling to pull themselves together.

[00:30:30] So we're going to see some political machinations, I'm sure among the noble houses.

[00:30:35] And if you go on the show guide, I've got some, uh, we've got some character, uh, onscreen

[00:30:40] references there.

[00:30:41] And we have at least one Atreides and we have at least one other, um, Harkonnen family member

[00:30:47] that have been listed as named cast members with, um, uh, a little bit of information

[00:30:54] about them.

[00:30:54] There's so much yet that we don't know.

[00:30:56] And that'll be Kieran Atreides and Harrow Harkonnen.

[00:31:00] Yeah.

[00:31:01] So then the Butlerian movement, do you want to set us up a little bit with, uh, who the

[00:31:08] Butlerians are?

[00:31:09] Yeah.

[00:31:10] So this is actually Butler was the Carino family before, and then they changed their

[00:31:16] name afterwards.

[00:31:16] Like, um, but there was a Serena Butler who was, who kind of led the movement about taking

[00:31:24] down the machines.

[00:31:25] But then after the fall of the machines, they're still around, you know, trying to make sure

[00:31:31] that this is enforced.

[00:31:32] Like nobody go back to using machines because remember when they enslaved us for a thousand

[00:31:36] years.

[00:31:37] Um, and, but then there, it, there becomes a bit of zealotry on that side as well.

[00:31:43] So this creates more political tensions where often the Carino family, you know, who becomes

[00:31:49] emperor, they're trying to navigate the best way to keep all the parts together, you know,

[00:31:55] and they don't want any, anyone who's going too far.

[00:31:58] They're like, uh, okay, got to deal with them.

[00:32:00] And, and also how they get along with the, um, the various schools and things like that.

[00:32:07] Right.

[00:32:07] Because the, the universe is big and, uh, there are people all over the place and to, um, continue

[00:32:16] to use a computer or a thinking machine of some kind, kind of easy in a lot of ways because

[00:32:21] you just kind of, you know, keep it hush hush and you, you know, you go about your business.

[00:32:26] And so the Butlerians are out still scouring the universe and the world looking for traces

[00:32:32] and remnants and evidence of people using, because just to let go of technology and like,

[00:32:37] we're, we're so dependent on our computers.

[00:32:39] If somebody came along today and said, right, your laptop's out the window.

[00:32:43] Right.

[00:32:44] Like, how do I do this?

[00:32:45] How do you, yeah.

[00:32:47] So, and, and, you know, it was like, oh, I found an old, uh, iPod, you know, like I'll,

[00:32:51] I'll keep that in my closet and continue to listen to music on it.

[00:32:55] So the, the Butlerians are very zealous and with this religious fervor.

[00:33:01] So then we have, I think, I, I don't know that we're going to get them, but there's something

[00:33:05] we should maybe keep an eye on, which is the Venhold Spacing Company, which is a organization

[00:33:10] that has a near monopoly on space travel.

[00:33:13] Hmm.

[00:33:14] And I don't think it's a spoiler to say, this is going to be the thing that becomes the

[00:33:19] guild.

[00:33:20] I think, uh, the spacing guild.

[00:33:21] So in the movies, and if you've seen the 84 movie, we, you know, we get to see a guild

[00:33:26] navigator, but the idea is that, you know, to be able to navigate space, you need a big

[00:33:32] brain calculating a lot of, uh, potentials and dangers and how do you get around the universe.

[00:33:38] And, uh, so the Venhold Spacing Fleet is the thing that is holding the Imperium together.

[00:33:45] Right.

[00:33:45] And if you've seen the 84 movie and they bring in, you know, the sort of morphed human, well,

[00:33:53] it doesn't even look human in a tank.

[00:33:55] This comes from, uh, these are Spacing Navigators.

[00:33:58] This is also in this trilogy.

[00:34:00] You, you meet one of them, especially, um, they have become like, they've just devoted

[00:34:06] their entire minds to these complex maths that are required to fold the universe across

[00:34:11] space and to see and predict through time that they, their bodies just kind of atrophy

[00:34:17] and they live in these tanks of spice where they're so heavily addicted.

[00:34:20] They can't survive outside of that atmosphere.

[00:34:24] And I think we'll talk a little bit about spice when we get, uh, a couple of sections

[00:34:28] down into the question of, of Arrakis, cause that's a very connected.

[00:34:32] That's a source.

[00:34:33] Yeah.

[00:34:34] Yeah.

[00:34:34] So then we have something that you've mentioned a couple of things, uh, a couple of times.

[00:34:39] We have the great schools.

[00:34:40] The Bene Gesserit is of one of the great schools, but we also have the Sook Medical School

[00:34:45] and the Mentat School.

[00:34:46] You want to tell us a little bit about both of those organizations?

[00:34:49] Um, so the Sook Medical School is basically where they train doctors, um, and they do some,

[00:34:58] this sort of conditioning where you're not supposed to be able to, it's like taking the

[00:35:04] Hippocratic oath to the nth degree where they are conditioned that they cannot cause harm.

[00:35:09] Although maybe in the original story, there are ways through that.

[00:35:12] Um, but that's, that's the idea.

[00:35:15] And they get these like tattoos, these diamond tattoos on their forehead in the books, at least.

[00:35:19] Uh, to signify that.

[00:35:20] And then the Mentat School, they are really the ones who are more the human computers, um,

[00:35:27] where their brains are just trained to be extremely observant and analytical at all times, which

[00:35:33] kind of can make them more mechanical and personality or maybe, yeah.

[00:35:39] Reserve, like there's a more Spock-like.

[00:35:42] More Spock-like.

[00:35:43] That's a good way of putting it.

[00:35:44] That's a good way of putting it.

[00:35:44] I was just earlier today recording, uh, an episode with Ian from the Captain's Pod podcast

[00:35:51] to talk about the Star Trek, the motion picture for the 45th anniversary.

[00:35:54] So I've got Star Trek right on my brain here.

[00:35:56] So I've got all these right here.

[00:35:59] Right.

[00:35:59] So the Mentats are, are replacing the function of computation.

[00:36:04] Right.

[00:36:05] Uh, in sort of like doing your accounting and, uh, crunching your numbers and, uh, and doing

[00:36:10] all that kind of stuff.

[00:36:13] Um, I think in the Souk Medical School too, I think what's important to add is that this

[00:36:19] is a period of the Imperium that, you know, there is, um, all these noble, there are all

[00:36:27] these noble houses, poisoning, assassination, uh, spies.

[00:36:33] It's very futile in a lot of ways.

[00:36:35] And so that if you, not unlike the maesters from Game of Thrones, you go through a training

[00:36:40] and you wear a robe and these chains, you're trusted to be neutral.

[00:36:46] You're trusted to provide information.

[00:36:48] You're trusted to send the raven when you're told to send the raven, right?

[00:36:52] You don't hold a political allegiance.

[00:36:56] You just serve a function or a role.

[00:36:58] So the Souk Doctors are really caring for the human beings outside of Emperor this, Noble

[00:37:05] House that, whatever.

[00:37:06] I'm a Souk Doctor.

[00:37:07] I, I fix people.

[00:37:09] I help people.

[00:37:09] Right.

[00:37:10] Mm-hmm.

[00:37:11] Is that fair?

[00:37:11] Do you think it's a fair characterization?

[00:37:13] Yeah.

[00:37:14] I mean, I think, well, it's hard for me to talk more about the Souk Doctors without talking

[00:37:18] about a particular character journey that I think were, you might consider too spoilery.

[00:37:23] Okay.

[00:37:25] But I mean-

[00:37:26] From the original books or, yeah.

[00:37:28] Yeah.

[00:37:29] Well, we see it in the first, in the movie.

[00:37:31] Right.

[00:37:31] But I think that's the point is, is that that diamond on their forehead is supposed to signify

[00:37:36] that they're trustworthy.

[00:37:37] Right.

[00:37:38] Beyond, they're beyond political allegiance.

[00:37:41] Their allegiance is to the human condition.

[00:37:43] So this, yeah, this is a question that comes up again and again in the series.

[00:37:47] Like, what does it mean to be trustworthy?

[00:37:49] And why, you know, we want to, why do we want to place blind trust in any group or way

[00:37:55] of thinking?

[00:37:56] Right.

[00:37:57] And then, oh, we also have, maybe we should mention the, this is shortly after the creation

[00:38:03] of the Orange Catholic Bible.

[00:38:04] I don't know if they'll do that.

[00:38:06] I don't think they'll do that.

[00:38:07] I think they would edge that off to the side because it's such a complex topic.

[00:38:12] So basically it was, there was a group that decided, oh, you know, it's best for humanity

[00:38:18] in the wake of this revolution that we just had.

[00:38:21] Let's squish all of the religious texts in the universe together into one Bible and simplify

[00:38:29] it all.

[00:38:29] And so this caused rioting and war around the universe.

[00:38:33] A lot of people were unhappy.

[00:38:35] Yeah.

[00:38:35] The exact opposite of the intention.

[00:38:37] Right.

[00:38:38] Right.

[00:38:38] It was supposed to be unifying, but it became very divisive.

[00:38:42] Yeah.

[00:38:43] And we see that in the original, you know, we see, we hear that in the original books

[00:38:47] and there's a whole hurry.

[00:38:49] By then it's just normal.

[00:38:50] Yeah.

[00:38:51] Exactly.

[00:38:51] By then it's just like, oh, this is our religious texts.

[00:38:54] So, yeah.

[00:38:55] So I think the next thing we can talk about is Arrakis, which we know is the planet Dune,

[00:39:00] which forms the basis for the original books and 84 and movie in the Villeneuve movies.

[00:39:08] And the importance of Dune as this desert planet where there are these giant worms.

[00:39:16] And there's another thing called spice, which can be sort of vacuumed up from the sand floor,

[00:39:24] from the desert floor.

[00:39:25] And when taken, it can create longevity.

[00:39:29] So it's a geriatric.

[00:39:30] It preserves life and extends life.

[00:39:33] It also is psychotropic.

[00:39:37] It can have effects on people in very powerful ways.

[00:39:43] And when distilled, as we saw in the movie, it will basically unlock the ability for somebody

[00:39:51] who's been trained in many Jesuit techniques to step to a greater awareness and consciousness

[00:39:58] level, I guess we could say, without getting too specific on the powers.

[00:40:02] Because I think we want to see some of that emerge in the show is what's at stake here

[00:40:08] in consuming the spice for Benny Jesuit.

[00:40:11] I wonder if they're, though, going to pitch the show with the, I mean, have it develop with

[00:40:16] the assumption that people have seen the movies, because that's already a central question that's

[00:40:20] well addressed in the Villeneuve films.

[00:40:23] It's true.

[00:40:25] One interesting thing about the spice is that once you start, it's just like completely addictive.

[00:40:29] It does a lot of good things for you, but you can't stop.

[00:40:33] Right.

[00:40:33] Ever.

[00:40:34] Very important.

[00:40:35] So spice not only gives Benny Jesuit an edge on what they're working on, but it also, as we

[00:40:40] talked about before with the guild navigators, it gives them the ability to see beyond across

[00:40:46] space and time to be able to navigate.

[00:40:48] And so it becomes, and I think originally Frank Herbert, when he was writing, he was like, well,

[00:40:56] what could we take?

[00:40:57] There's a key resource, and in his mind it was oil.

[00:41:00] Like, what do we, how can I take that and sort of turn it around a little bit and play

[00:41:07] with it and then create something that the universe can't exist without?

[00:41:11] And so spice is a primary commodity in this world, in this part of time.

[00:41:18] And so, as you said, people, once they start to take it, they can't stop taking it.

[00:41:24] And so that drives trade, right?

[00:41:28] And so, and there's only one place in the universe where this comes from.

[00:41:32] It can't be synthesized.

[00:41:34] It has to be harvested naturally.

[00:41:36] And that is on Arrakis.

[00:41:38] And we know that on Arrakis, there was a population of people called the Fremen.

[00:41:42] And we only have one named Fremen character in the show.

[00:41:48] And Michaela, I believe is her name.

[00:41:52] And she is somehow attached to the Carino family and to Mark Strong's emperor character.

[00:41:59] But little is known yet on what role she's playing.

[00:42:02] We do see a glimpse of her in the trailer, but we don't have a lot of other information,

[00:42:06] unless you've heard or read anything.

[00:42:08] No, no.

[00:42:09] But just to point out that the, well, two things.

[00:42:12] One is that look out for blue eyes, because blue eyes, like totally blue eyes, no whites.

[00:42:18] That's a signifier of spice addiction.

[00:42:21] And also the, what is it, the Venport spacing, they are based on Arrakis.

[00:42:26] Because as I said, the spacing guild, or the navigators, they need this spice.

[00:42:32] Right, right.

[00:42:33] And without the navigators consuming spice, then there is no interstellar trade beyond local system.

[00:42:40] Like anything that is beyond, between planetary systems throughout the galaxy is impossible.

[00:42:48] Well, you know, then we get into Newtonian physics, right?

[00:42:51] You know, where it's like, you know, it takes 50 light years to get somewhere and all of that kind of fun stuff.

[00:42:58] All right, so let's touch on a few of the other key characters.

[00:43:01] We talked about Mark Strong already.

[00:43:03] We talked about the two Harkonnen sisters.

[00:43:07] We have Empress Natalia, who is somehow key to, she's married to Javako Carino, to Mark Strong's character.

[00:43:19] And somehow she's playing a role that she holds a bunch of political power and is a unifying factor in this post-jihad world.

[00:43:35] And so-

[00:43:36] She could be a Bene Gesserit herself, maybe.

[00:43:39] Well, and then we have her daughter, or their daughter, Princess Inez.

[00:43:46] I'm not sure how to pronounce her name.

[00:43:47] Inez, I would say.

[00:43:48] I am.

[00:43:49] Inez, who is the heir to the throne.

[00:43:52] And obviously he's probably dealing with a lot of parental pressures, you know, saying like, you've got to step up.

[00:43:58] And because we know from Shogun and House of the Dragon that if you don't have an heir, your rule is imperiled.

[00:44:06] And it's very difficult to get people to have confidence in your ability to rule.

[00:44:14] There's also a character, a brother character, I believe, Constantine Carino, who's like maybe a half-sibling to Inez.

[00:44:22] And then we have the mysterious character, named Desmond Hart, played by Travis Fimmel, who is a soldier with a mysterious past.

[00:44:40] He seems very charismatic.

[00:44:43] And in the trailer, we see him engaging with the emperor and trying to convince the emperor of something.

[00:44:52] Something we don't know yet.

[00:44:54] I'm most intrigued by him, and I promise to try not to call him Ragnar.

[00:44:58] Okay.

[00:44:59] From Vikings, if anyone doesn't know.

[00:45:01] Oh, okay.

[00:45:02] I was thinking more of what was the other sci-fi series that got canceled after two seasons.

[00:45:08] I'll think of it in a second.

[00:45:09] I think he was also in Sons of Anarchy, but I only ever watched that over my ex's shoulder.

[00:45:14] Was he?

[00:45:15] I think he was a different character.

[00:45:16] Anyway.

[00:45:17] Let me look him up.

[00:45:18] Yeah.

[00:45:19] Like I said, I didn't really watch it.

[00:45:20] But yeah, so I'm most intrigued based on the trailer that, I don't know, could he have some sort of sorcerer power or something like that?

[00:45:32] But they're making implications that he has some sort of unexpected power in the trailer.

[00:45:37] So I'm curious.

[00:45:39] Raised by Wolves was the show that I was thinking of.

[00:45:41] Right.

[00:45:41] Yeah, he was in that.

[00:45:42] Yeah.

[00:45:43] And I believe, yeah, he was in Vikings, and he's been in a lot of stuff, but he was not in Viker 1.

[00:45:50] Okay.

[00:45:51] Like I said, I don't watch that show.

[00:45:54] I don't go there.

[00:45:55] So he's our big mystery character where we have yet to see what's going to emerge.

[00:46:00] And then, yeah, we've got, if you go into the show guide, which we'll put a link in the show notes, and we'll put that also, I'll link on the Discord.

[00:46:07] I've got a full list of all the other named characters that we can derive from the IMDB and other articles that are out there.

[00:46:14] And I'm sure we've got a lot more characters.

[00:46:17] Any other characters that you think we should touch on here?

[00:46:20] Did you mention the Reverend Mother, Kasha Jinjo?

[00:46:24] No.

[00:46:25] Yeah, the Emperor's Truthsayer.

[00:46:26] Yeah.

[00:46:27] So should we explain what a Truthsayer is?

[00:46:29] Yeah, I think that's a good idea.

[00:46:30] Yeah, go for it.

[00:46:31] It's somewhat self-explanatory, but basically it's someone who is especially attuned to being able to tell whether or not someone's lying.

[00:46:40] So in the books you read about people really are afraid of, if they have secrets, you don't want to face a Truthsayer because they are almost certainly going to be able to get your secrets out of you and tell what the truth is.

[00:46:54] Right.

[00:46:54] And they are, yeah.

[00:46:55] And if you're petitioning the Emperor or you're trying to do a trade negotiation, you don't even have to be the Emperor to have a Truthsayer.

[00:47:04] You could just be having a trade negotiation with somebody.

[00:47:07] You have a Truthsayer present and that person is doing the due diligence of like, yep, that person's selling the truth.

[00:47:13] They actually have that many containers of that product and et cetera, et cetera.

[00:47:17] So a pretty key component because if you can't be trusted in a big world, it's really important to have the assurities.

[00:47:31] So, right.

[00:47:32] So the trailer, you got to watch the trailer just before we sat down to record.

[00:47:38] I was starting to, but then I had to juggle a bunch of other stuff.

[00:47:41] What are you seeing visual?

[00:47:43] Let's start off.

[00:47:43] Let's just talk about how this show is looking.

[00:47:45] What are you seeing from a visual standpoint?

[00:47:47] I mean, visually, ever since the first teaser, I'm like, that's going to knock it out of the park.

[00:47:54] And this trailer accomplishes that.

[00:47:56] I think this trailer got me more excited.

[00:47:57] Also, just in conjunction with having been, being, having, you know, been, how do I conjugate these verbs?

[00:48:06] I ain't good with words.

[00:48:08] With the fact that I've just been reading these books and, you know, from this part of the timeline, it got me extra excited about the story.

[00:48:18] But visually, like one of the most striking things that I'm curious about is like at one point you see someone hanging upside down as sand rains down and it almost looks like they're covered in blood.

[00:48:27] I'm like, what is happening there?

[00:48:32] I've been toying with the idea of doing a full trailer breakdown, so maybe I'll get into that before.

[00:48:38] Yes, please do.

[00:48:40] Time.

[00:48:41] I need more time.

[00:48:42] I know.

[00:48:42] I know.

[00:48:45] How do you feel about the aesthetic of what they're showing us?

[00:48:48] Since I am on record with the movies, the Villeneuve movies, having one problem, which has to do with the diction of the characters, the way the characters are speaking.

[00:49:02] So far, what I've seen in this trailer, it's sounding good to me, but then visually, this trailer feels placed correctly for me.

[00:49:12] If we're going to take from our own mental perceptions of human history in times of feudalism, in a sort of quasi-Western European context, this looks right to me from that regard.

[00:49:28] The thing that we had that look in Villeneuve's world, but then they spoke like they were people from North America in this day and age, and that just sort of threw me because I wanted a quasi-Sixperian sort of accent.

[00:49:41] But visually, it looks good for me from a developmental time frame.

[00:49:47] Yeah.

[00:49:48] So you're saying the diction is better for you in this?

[00:49:51] So far.

[00:49:51] I mean, we've only seen the one trailer.

[00:49:53] I had no problem with it in the films, and I have no problem with it here.

[00:49:56] I mean, visually, it seems to nail it.

[00:49:58] I was only concerned about just because there was so – like, this has been in development for so long, and it's, you know, all the shifting around showrunners, and then it seemed like they weren't promoting it and stuff.

[00:50:09] But now I do have the confidence that they've figured it out and that they are going to deliver something that's really enjoyable.

[00:50:19] And only six episodes, so.

[00:50:20] Right.

[00:50:21] Very tight.

[00:50:22] And two at once, right?

[00:50:24] No, I think it's going straight.

[00:50:25] I mean, the first – oh, the first week I thought was two or no?

[00:50:28] No.

[00:50:29] Oh, okay.

[00:50:29] As far as I'm aware, it's one for six weeks.

[00:50:32] Yeah.

[00:50:33] So.

[00:50:34] Okay, good.

[00:50:34] We can check that.

[00:50:35] Oh, no, you're right.

[00:50:36] You're right.

[00:50:36] Sorry.

[00:50:36] Yeah.

[00:50:37] Yeah.

[00:50:38] We're so used to double drops or triple drops.

[00:50:40] It's a very normal thing.

[00:50:43] Story hints.

[00:50:45] I mean, I think we can see that there's going to be a lot of political intrigue here.

[00:50:49] This is going to be very, very heavy on the politics, I think, with this sort of quasi-mystical, religious thing where we're going to – you know, the perception of what the Bene Gesserit are versus what they're really doing, I think, is –

[00:51:06] something that they might play with.

[00:51:08] Yeah.

[00:51:08] And that the whole storyline is always played with.

[00:51:12] Right.

[00:51:12] So – and obviously, we have an entry point with the Harkonnen sisters, Balia and Tula, and what their relationship is in guiding the Bene Gesserit.

[00:51:23] So I think we're going to see a lot of dynamics there.

[00:51:26] So both geopolitical as well as inter-family dynamics.

[00:51:31] Yeah.

[00:51:32] I think we didn't mention that there's also someone who's apparently the ex-mistress of the emperor.

[00:51:39] And this is something that, especially in this part of the timeline, the emperor might have a wife for political reasons and then openly have one or more other mistresses for romance.

[00:52:19] Right.

[00:52:21] So maybe –

[00:52:21] but maybe where are you with – as we said, this show has gone through – it had a very troubled production history, but we're here.

[00:52:30] It's coming.

[00:52:31] It's produced.

[00:52:32] It's ready to go on screen.

[00:52:33] How are you feeling about all of this?

[00:52:36] I am – personally, I'm currently very psyched for this.

[00:52:41] Awesome.

[00:52:41] I think that – yeah, I always say that Dune should be a miniseries.

[00:52:46] So this is not obviously the original book, but we're going to be dipping our toe in all of the same lore and concepts and themes.

[00:52:56] And I think this is a perfect format to do it.

[00:52:59] And I said before, I think it's very clever of them to set this, you know, first of all, 10,000 years in the past, but then also just after the books that have been released there, presumably.

[00:53:12] We don't know for certain how much they're going to follow those plots of the books.

[00:53:16] But I assume – I think that they probably set it this time to, like, give them plenty of room to do whatever they want.

[00:53:21] So I think that was an inspired choice, and I can't wait to see what they've done with it.

[00:53:27] But –

[00:53:27] Do you – are you aware of any conversation around this being a multi –

[00:53:33] A multi-season thing?

[00:53:34] Season show, yeah.

[00:53:36] I haven't heard anything, but I haven't been looking.

[00:53:39] No, I mean, it seems like for a while confidence was low, and maybe only recently it's picking up again.

[00:53:45] I don't know necessarily what's changed that.

[00:53:48] So maybe – I think the idea is that it's a standalone season, but if it does well, you know.

[00:53:55] We can see more.

[00:53:57] Okay.

[00:53:58] Well, fingers crossed.

[00:53:59] I am nervously optimistic.

[00:54:01] I've been that way already in these last weeks.

[00:54:05] So I am very hopeful.

[00:54:09] And I really don't have a lot of deep expectations, you know, specifically.

[00:54:18] They've been really closed about what – you know, there's not a lot of hints or directional guidance as to what we're going to get other than, hey, there's political intrigue, there's family, this kind of stuff.

[00:54:30] So I'm just hopeful.

[00:54:32] They've got a great-looking cast.

[00:54:33] The trailer looks right, feels right.

[00:54:36] It feels like they're putting a good amount of post-production work into it.

[00:54:42] So I'm hopeful.

[00:54:44] And I'm excited.

[00:54:45] I'm excited to see something from the Dune universe break out of the – off the big screen.

[00:54:54] And Ian and I were talking about this today in regards to Star Trek, the motion picture.

[00:54:59] You know, it's very – we see oftentimes big picture going to small screen, but going from small screen to big screen is sometimes harder.

[00:55:08] But anyway, I'm just happy to see a transition across the boundary between a movie and a television show.

[00:55:16] And I agree with you.

[00:55:18] Dune works better in a miniseries style rather than a big movie style.

[00:55:25] Right.

[00:55:25] So.

[00:55:27] Great.

[00:55:28] Well, I think that wraps it up.

[00:55:29] Do you have any other thoughts or notes that you wanted to throw in?

[00:55:32] No.

[00:55:33] Just give me my grappling hooks and a thumper.

[00:55:37] I'm ready to ride this sandworm.

[00:55:39] Right on.

[00:55:40] Well, let's just quickly check in with any scheduling notes.

[00:55:46] What have you got coming up for – what did you just put down and what are you about to work on?

[00:55:53] So just wrapping up, Agatha, with this – there's a wrap-up that I now have all the recording pieces.

[00:56:00] I just have to edit them together early this coming week.

[00:56:04] And you participated as well.

[00:56:06] Yes.

[00:56:07] Got to have some fun with that.

[00:56:07] Yep.

[00:56:08] So I think I can reveal the topic now.

[00:56:10] It was a – we formed a coven.

[00:56:13] So it was an eight-person personality test.

[00:56:16] I got made fun of for using spreadsheets.

[00:56:20] No one should ever shame you.

[00:56:22] We're very pro-spreadsheet here.

[00:56:24] Yeah.

[00:56:25] But, yeah.

[00:56:26] And then, obviously, Silo is starting – it's dropping two days before Dune Prophecy.

[00:56:33] So Luke and I got screeners, and we've been pre-recording and prepping that.

[00:56:37] And I also have season passes for Silo on Supercast.

[00:56:41] So, yeah, we – there's going to be extra weekly spoiler casts that Abby and I are going to be doing, taking a deep dive into one theme per episode.

[00:56:53] Okay, great.

[00:56:54] And other key spoilers from the books.

[00:56:57] And, yeah.

[00:56:57] Let me punctuate something on there really quick because that's going to be on the Wool Shift Dust feed.

[00:57:02] You're not going to get those episodes on the Lorehounds feed.

[00:57:05] So that – we know it takes a little bit of work.

[00:57:08] It's not that much work, but, you know, you've got to do something, which is go to the show notes.

[00:57:14] Yeah.

[00:57:15] Go to the link tree.

[00:57:16] Look for Wool Shift Dust and then subscribe to that feed because that's on separate feeds.

[00:57:21] That's your feed, Alicia.

[00:57:22] Mm-hmm.

[00:57:23] And you have your own ecosystem around that.

[00:57:27] And I highly encourage everyone to check out the season pass option.

[00:57:31] It's a really great way to support the Wool Shift Dust podcast without the rigmarole of a recurring subscription, although we like recurring subscriptions.

[00:57:43] But then it also gets you access to the bonus material that you're setting up for the silo coverage.

[00:57:49] So it's a really nice option, flat one-time fee, and you get the extra stuff.

[00:57:55] And you get to help Alicia and the crew put things together.

[00:57:59] Yes.

[00:58:00] Yes, absolutely.

[00:58:01] I'm trying to turn this into a full-time thing, takeover from other work.

[00:58:07] So any subscriptions, season pass or otherwise, deeply appreciated.

[00:58:12] Absolutely.

[00:58:13] And you can also find on the Supercast the Canon Padawan subscription, which is part of the Star Wars Canon Timeline podcast.

[00:58:19] And I've come up with a new plan I'll be talking about over on that podcast for regular content that's going to be coming out in that feed as well.

[00:58:28] And in the public feed, we are still working through our resweep of the Hive Republic.

[00:58:34] Got it.

[00:58:35] Great.

[00:58:35] On the main Lorehounds feed, yeah, you and John just finished up Agatha.

[00:58:41] I think John is going to take on Skeleton Crew.

[00:58:45] So you're going to be piloting Silo.

[00:58:47] I'm going to be piloting Dune Prophecy.

[00:58:49] And hopefully John is going to pilot Skeleton Crew and we can actually – it's like a hot lore winter.

[00:58:54] I don't know what to – this is madness.

[00:58:59] So hopefully that will happen.

[00:59:01] As I mentioned, I have a Star Trek-related podcast, a crossover podcast.

[00:59:05] That'll be out in December for the anniversary of the Star Trek motion picture, December 7th.

[00:59:12] And Wicked is also coming out there.

[00:59:14] Wicked will also be out.

[00:59:16] Oh, that's right.

[00:59:17] Yeah, you've got that.

[00:59:18] Now, look, we have a ton of stuff going on, so I don't want to spend another half an hour going over everything.

[00:59:22] But make sure to go to the link tree.

[00:59:25] Check out Nevermind the Music.

[00:59:26] Check out Radioactive Ramblings.

[00:59:29] Steve and Anthony at Properly Howard are on a break.

[00:59:32] I think Marilyn and Sarah are on a little break with Rings and Rituals.

[00:59:35] Anybody else that we should mention?

[00:59:38] Nope.

[00:59:38] I think that's it.

[00:59:40] Yeah.

[00:59:40] January, you guys pick back up – what's it called?

[00:59:44] Severance.

[00:59:45] Yes, that's right.

[00:59:45] We're going to do this joint coverage of Severance.

[00:59:48] 2025 is going to be crazy because we've got Andor.

[00:59:50] We've got White Lotus.

[00:59:52] Wheel of Time.

[00:59:53] Wheel of Time, which they held this year, which I was really surprised about.

[00:59:56] But thankfully.

[00:59:58] Because that would have been –

[01:00:00] Too much.

[01:00:01] Too much.

[01:00:02] Awesome.

[01:00:03] Okay.

[01:00:03] Well, I think that's it for now.

[01:00:06] Let's just do a quick, simple shout-out.

[01:00:09] Do you want to give a quick shout-out to our Discord server boosters?

[01:00:13] Sure.

[01:00:13] Sure.

[01:00:14] So, thank you to Aaron K., Taylor the Thriller, Dorg of the Ninjas, Doob71, Athena, Jalea, Tina, Lestu, Nancy M., and Ghost of Perdition.

[01:00:23] And thank you, Richard W.

[01:00:26] Those are all the folks who help our community Discord server maintain a higher status.

[01:00:31] It gives us more bells and whistles and stuff.

[01:00:32] And then to our Loremasters, who are our top-tier subscribers, we always like to give them a shout-out every time.

[01:00:38] Because without your support, we would be very hard-pressed to produce all of the content that we do.

[01:00:45] So, to them and to all of our subscribers and to everyone who listens, thank you.

[01:00:50] But especially to...

[01:01:28] Thank you all so very much.

[01:01:30] And we will see you just a few days after November 17th for the first episode of Dune Prophecy.

[01:01:37] Alicia, thanks so much.

[01:01:39] Thank you.

[01:01:39] We'll see you in a few days.

[01:01:41] The Lorehounds Podcast is produced and published by The Lorehounds.

[01:01:45] You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at thelorehounds.com slash contact.

[01:01:50] Get early and ad-free access to all Lorehounds Podcasts at patreon.com slash thelorehounds.

[01:01:56] Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any employers or other entities.

[01:02:02] Thanks for listening.