John and Marilyn jump into the future in the Season 3 premiere of Foundation.
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00:20 --> 00:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to The Lower Hounds podcast with The Lower Hounds Your Guides to Psycho History.
00:24 --> 00:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm John.
00:25 --> 00:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm Marilyn.
00:26 --> 00:29 [SPEAKER_01]: This is our coverage of Foundation on Apple TV+.
00:29 --> 00:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Season three episode one, a song for the end of everything.
00:35 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_01]: If you want to get in contact with us, send an email to empireatthelorhounds.com or head to our Discord server from the link tree in the show notes.
00:44 --> 00:53 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you like what you've heard from us and you want to support us or get ad-free and bonus content, check the same link tree for our Patreon and supercast subscription options.
00:54 --> 00:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Marilyn, it's our first episode.
00:57 --> 00:59 [SPEAKER_00]: And we have to address the elephant in the room.
01:00 --> 01:02 [SPEAKER_00]: David's not here.
01:03 --> 01:03 [SPEAKER_00]: David's not here.
01:05 --> 01:11 [SPEAKER_00]: David watched the first episode and a half of the season and he wasn't a big fan of it and he didn't want to.
01:12 --> 01:19 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, we tried to not cover things that were not really into because it makes for worse content and we don't want this to become a chore.
01:20 --> 01:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So he wasn't very into it this season.
01:22 --> 01:23 [SPEAKER_00]: That's okay.
01:24 --> 01:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Marilyn and I were both really into it when we got our hands on these screeners.
01:27 --> 01:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And so Marilyn is going to be my co-host to this entire season.
01:31 --> 01:32 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to have a great time doing it.
01:32 --> 01:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So thank you, Mark, for being here.
01:34 --> 01:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I thank you for asking me, John.
01:37 --> 01:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm quite delighted and thrilled.
01:38 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_01]: It would be very exciting.
01:41 --> 01:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it will be.
01:42 --> 01:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we're in for a really great season as much as I may have put a damper on things by saying David wasn't a big fan.
01:47 --> 01:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a big fan of what I've seen so far.
01:49 --> 01:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I've seen the first two episodes and I think it's great now.
01:54 --> 01:55 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to spoil anything in episode two.
01:56 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_00]: We are of course not going to spoil anything future and I haven't seen much further and I think it'll be very easy to separate because it's different subject matters.
02:03 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_00]: But I just want to say
02:06 --> 02:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a huge fan of the season.
02:08 --> 02:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I think this is going to be a great time.
02:09 --> 02:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We do have screeners, but we're not going to talk about anything ahead, and we're going to stay as close to in real time of our watching as possible.
02:17 --> 02:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're going to try not to watch as much as possible, just with scheduling we might have to every now and then, but we'll be very careful about spoilers.
02:23 --> 02:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and I haven't watched season two yet.
02:25 --> 02:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, episode two yet.
02:26 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So you keep me accountable.
02:28 --> 02:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, do my best.
02:29 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I will do my best.
02:31 --> 02:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But I gotta say, the trailer just made me think, oh, no, you know, with with Goyer still present, but sort of on the out.
02:40 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_01]: They decided to turn this into was bang violent, you know.
02:45 --> 02:49 [SPEAKER_01]: sci-fi battles and all the rest of it, because that's pretty much all they showed us just about.
02:49 --> 02:53 [SPEAKER_01]: But watching the first episode relieved all of those fears for me.
02:54 --> 02:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I have a still a thing to say about it, but we'll get there when we get there.
02:57 --> 02:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, let's get through our hot takes in a minute.
02:59 --> 03:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I will say in a modern sci-fi show, you need a little bit of wisdom to keep the audience going.
03:05 --> 03:05 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I get that.
03:06 --> 03:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I get that.
03:07 --> 03:13 [SPEAKER_00]: But I think that so far, in the episode one, they really stayed true to the seldom type.
03:14 --> 03:15 [SPEAKER_00]: conflicts, right?
03:15 --> 03:17 [SPEAKER_00]: These, these less violent conflicts.
03:17 --> 03:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm, I may push back on a little bit.
03:19 --> 03:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
03:19 --> 03:19 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
03:20 --> 03:20 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
03:20 --> 03:20 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
03:20 --> 03:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm fair enough.
03:21 --> 03:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I say we're talking about.
03:22 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So by the way, because we're recording these ahead, we're going to be recording these a little bit ahead of time.
03:27 --> 03:28 [SPEAKER_00]: We're not going to do live feedback.
03:29 --> 03:30 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to hold that.
03:31 --> 03:33 [SPEAKER_00]: until we get a core, I'm probably around the mid-season.
03:34 --> 03:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm telling you this now, Marilyn, if you're okay with this.
03:36 --> 03:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
03:37 --> 03:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Around the mid-season and probably around the finale.
03:39 --> 03:41 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll see how much feedback we have.
03:41 --> 03:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe we'll do more if we get more feedback.
03:42 --> 03:43 [SPEAKER_00]: But sure.
03:43 --> 03:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we're going to have to do it that way because we're going to be ahead.
03:47 --> 03:51 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's all the housekeeping in general.
03:51 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to, before we do hot takes talk about our history with the foundation books.
03:55 --> 03:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
03:55 --> 03:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
03:55 --> 03:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Can you tell me your history with Asimov in general and the foundation books?
03:59 --> 04:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I can't tell you exactly when I first read it, but it was certainly like the very early seventies or late sixties.
04:07 --> 04:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So the first three books, you know, the first book was a collection of short stories that was published in the forties.
04:16 --> 04:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
04:16 --> 04:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And then is that the robot?
04:19 --> 04:23 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, the first stories in the fine one of foundation.
04:24 --> 04:27 [SPEAKER_01]: were particles that were knit together to make this.
04:28 --> 04:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, and you can tell by reading them because they do seem serialized in a way.
04:33 --> 04:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you have an episode here, then you can afford to do years, and then here's another bit, and then here's a bit, so on.
04:40 --> 04:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But he got better as he went along, and I've read all those, and then years later when he started doing more, I read those.
04:49 --> 04:53 [SPEAKER_01]: So I read the sequels, which came out after the original trilogy.
04:53 --> 04:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And then I read the prequels.
04:54 --> 04:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And I have to say, I think of those three chunks, the prequels really are the best.
04:59 --> 05:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think you finally found his foot, feeding foot as far as feet.
05:04 --> 05:05 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the word.
05:05 --> 05:08 [SPEAKER_01]: He finally found his feet back and find my words.
05:10 --> 05:15 [SPEAKER_01]: As an author, writing a continuous story, creating characters, doing all these things.
05:15 --> 05:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And it really was quite fascinating.
05:19 --> 05:37 [SPEAKER_01]: some of the things that he came up with relative to you mentioned the iRobot series that that becomes more obvious in these people values so he does connect all three series the robot series the galactic empire series and the the foundation series eventually you kind of retroactively connect them all
05:38 --> 05:44 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's interesting when certain things happen to think, oh, yeah, well, you know, prior to this, this is what can you get into this and so forth.
05:45 --> 05:46 [SPEAKER_00]: What would denial all about do?
05:48 --> 05:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I pretty much.
05:49 --> 05:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
05:51 --> 05:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Very cool.
05:52 --> 05:55 [SPEAKER_00]: So you've read all of the foundation books that order or not.
05:55 --> 05:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
05:55 --> 05:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
05:56 --> 05:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I was not sure if you were talking about the sequels, too.
06:00 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I couldn't all see mention them.
06:01 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
06:01 --> 06:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I did.
06:02 --> 06:05 [SPEAKER_01]: They're probably the weakest of those three chunks.
06:06 --> 06:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I've heard that.
06:06 --> 06:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I've heard that.
06:08 --> 06:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I read the first foundation book a while ago when we were covering season one season two rather season two, you know, we have full coverage of that.
06:17 --> 06:19 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're new here, you can go back and listen to all that.
06:20 --> 06:24 [SPEAKER_00]: We weren't a podcast during season one, so there's nothing there, but season two, we've got full coverage.
06:25 --> 06:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And I actually didn't love the book that much the first read.
06:28 --> 06:28 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
06:28 --> 06:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I reread it over the last few days.
06:31 --> 06:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely fantastic.
06:32 --> 06:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what change for me.
06:34 --> 06:35 [SPEAKER_00]: You'd be at which is ready for it this time.
06:35 --> 06:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I think so.
06:37 --> 06:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And also the writing style was so very forties and fifties.
06:42 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I can be very off putting.
06:45 --> 06:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I did actually go back and I read the first empire book and then I read two robot books and then I went back and re-read foundation.
06:53 --> 06:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
06:54 --> 06:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think I was ready for asthma of this time.
06:56 --> 06:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
06:56 --> 06:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, sure.
06:57 --> 06:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Because foundation is deep asthma.
07:00 --> 07:19 [SPEAKER_01]: definitely and he's a man of ideas and sometimes that can be difficult for people who want stories that you know have a lot of action and it right and she and all that kind of stuff and right and yeah sometimes I mean when I was rereading second found foundation and empire for this even preparation for this
07:21 --> 07:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought you know there's just an awful lot of chapters which are a bunch of white guys sitting in room smoking and talking politics and it's like well let's keep moving here
07:33 --> 07:42 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, and I think that's a really fascinating point because it is very much a white man in the forties vision of the future, right?
07:42 --> 07:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is extremely patriarchal.
07:46 --> 07:49 [SPEAKER_00]: You get the sense that this is a predominantly white society.
07:51 --> 07:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Now we have the show, which is incredibly diverse.
07:54 --> 07:55 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the most diverse shows on TV, I'd say.
07:56 --> 07:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
07:56 --> 07:59 [SPEAKER_00]: And we interviewed David Guyer Lassies, and not the humble brag.
07:59 --> 08:03 [SPEAKER_00]: But we interviewed David Guyer Lassies, and you can go back on the feed and check that out if you missed it.
08:03 --> 08:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And he said, you know, we said, what do you, how do you approach this?
08:07 --> 08:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And he, he basically was saying, I think this was in our interview, not somebody else did.
08:11 --> 08:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I think this was in our interview, I haven't been doing it a while, I should go back.
08:14 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_00]: That he just cast for the character, not for the race or the sex.
08:18 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
08:19 --> 08:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's great.
08:20 --> 08:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I think Gal Dornick works really well as a woman.
08:23 --> 08:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Wonderful.
08:24 --> 08:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Wonderful.
08:24 --> 08:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and I have to say, you know, we do know that as most head issues around women and being grabbing.
08:31 --> 08:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure it did.
08:33 --> 08:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And
08:34 --> 08:41 [SPEAKER_01]: There's two characters in one in the second volume, one in the third volume of the original trilogy, two women characters.
08:41 --> 08:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Who are some of my favorite women characters in literature?
08:44 --> 08:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
08:45 --> 08:47 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's a really interesting add mixture.
08:48 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You read from these ones, respect to me.
08:51 --> 08:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, this is fantastic.
08:52 --> 08:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And then you go clunk over something that really, really dates it again.
08:57 --> 08:58 [SPEAKER_00]: And then you read another thing.
08:58 --> 09:01 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, well, you're counting women in children in the senses.
09:01 --> 09:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, why wouldn't you?
09:02 --> 09:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Why do you write it?
09:03 --> 09:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Hello.
09:05 --> 09:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, anyway, anyway.
09:07 --> 09:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So I, I'm actually currently reading, uh, not tech about Asian.
09:11 --> 09:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, it's very confusing because the third book is second foundation.
09:14 --> 09:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I know.
09:14 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I know.
09:15 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I know.
09:15 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm currently reading.
09:16 --> 09:16 [SPEAKER_00]: What is your empire?
09:16 --> 09:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm hoping to finish this series.
09:19 --> 09:23 [SPEAKER_00]: soon, the main, the trilogy, the original trilogy series.
09:24 --> 09:30 [SPEAKER_00]: But overall, I just think that this show is such a fascinating example of a show by inspiration.
09:31 --> 09:37 [SPEAKER_00]: It's taking the ideas of foundation and it's using them as colors on the palette, right?
09:37 --> 09:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's painting a new story using that.
09:40 --> 09:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's an absolutely brilliant done show.
09:42 --> 09:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Season one was good.
09:44 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Season two was great.
09:46 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
09:46 --> 09:48 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think season three can be great too.
09:48 --> 09:49 [SPEAKER_00]: We just got to get there.
09:49 --> 09:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Could be, you know, we're only in the beginning.
09:51 --> 09:52 [SPEAKER_01]: fingers crossed.
09:53 --> 09:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
09:53 --> 09:55 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm really looking forward to seeing the rest of the season.
09:56 --> 10:02 [SPEAKER_00]: So now that we've gotten through our first episode housekeeping and don't worry folks, we'll get to the hot takes sooner next episode.
10:03 --> 10:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Give me your hot take on this premiere episode, Marilyn.
10:07 --> 10:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Except for the opening scene.
10:10 --> 10:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I was still at it.
10:11 --> 10:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I was thrilled.
10:13 --> 10:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I really like the way they're bringing in characters whose names are very familiar to me and giving us different polish on them, so to speak.
10:21 --> 10:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I like very much what you talked about painting with the original stories.
10:27 --> 10:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And in terms of the changes that they've made, particularly around how they have set up empire and what it is and how it works.
10:35 --> 10:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
10:36 --> 10:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely brilliant.
10:37 --> 10:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And you know, the challenge throughout I think has been what do you do the series in which all of your lead characters are going to be dead by the next chapter episode section, whatever.
10:50 --> 10:52 [SPEAKER_00]: You make sure they don't die or they're clones.
10:54 --> 10:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, exactly.
10:54 --> 10:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
10:55 --> 10:58 [SPEAKER_01]: They just decided to do that, which is an interesting choice.
10:58 --> 11:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And particularly if you set it aside next to the rings of power.
11:03 --> 11:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
11:03 --> 11:07 [SPEAKER_01]: And the choices that they made dealing with that very same issue of, okay.
11:09 --> 11:11 [SPEAKER_01]: else live quote unquote forever, right?
11:11 --> 11:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Humans come and go throughout.
11:13 --> 11:18 [SPEAKER_01]: How do we tell the whole story of the second age and not lose our characters?
11:18 --> 11:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And so they made a different choice.
11:20 --> 11:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And both choices have their validity and also, you know, there's something boxed.
11:24 --> 11:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But during, basically, I really like the things that they're doing.
11:28 --> 11:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Me too.
11:28 --> 11:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I really love the fact that the different characters that get to stay around stay around for different reasons, right?
11:34 --> 11:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
11:35 --> 11:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Harry, seldom, Volt Harry, seldom at least is a digital version.
11:39 --> 11:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Gale is in a cryopod.
11:41 --> 11:47 [SPEAKER_00]: The Cliong are just clones and demos elsewhere about like every character that's going to stick around is there for a reason.
11:47 --> 11:51 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's not just, well, we felt like giving them stick around so we made a lazy excuse.
11:51 --> 11:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I really think they're doing it brilliantly.
11:53 --> 11:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes.
11:54 --> 12:00 [SPEAKER_01]: There's very little jazz hands about why some of them are carrying on and others of them are it.
12:00 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
12:01 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
12:01 --> 12:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's this little look back.
12:02 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_01]: There's this little hints.
12:04 --> 12:09 [SPEAKER_01]: We do hear much love characters refer to stuff.
12:09 --> 12:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
12:11 --> 12:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, any other thoughts on your hot takes?
12:15 --> 12:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, just like I can't wait to see all the directions are going to take all these really interesting points in.
12:22 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, the one major change that I'm sorry that they did, I will be very interested to see how that unfolds.
12:31 --> 12:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll get there when we get there.
12:32 --> 12:33 [SPEAKER_01]: In our discussion.
12:34 --> 12:40 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm going to represent David here and say, the show is an incredibly beautiful.
12:40 --> 12:42 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, nobody does sci-fi like Apple.
12:43 --> 12:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Like Apple really has shine as shown.
12:46 --> 12:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
12:47 --> 12:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Are they're shining with sci-fi lately?
12:50 --> 12:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you know, when in doubt, go to the past participle.
12:55 --> 12:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Or present is shining.
12:56 --> 12:58 [SPEAKER_00]: If a present participle, yeah, yeah.
12:58 --> 12:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
13:00 --> 13:02 [SPEAKER_00]: So I just think that it's beautiful.
13:02 --> 13:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, not just the VFX, but having lead pace go face to face with a camel to introduce what this current iteration of Brother Day is.
13:14 --> 13:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes.
13:16 --> 13:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Having, you know, the scene where Brother Dawn gets pooped or anonymous, I guess it was dirt in the end.
13:23 --> 13:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But having, having Demorselle pull the brim radiant out of her chest.
13:28 --> 13:33 [SPEAKER_01]: That was, oh my gosh, was that every stunning, really, really amazing concept.
13:33 --> 13:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And the colors, just the colors themselves.
13:35 --> 13:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
13:36 --> 13:45 [SPEAKER_01]: They've it brilliant, contrasting light, the sense of bright, not in the sense of, you know, pale shades of glitter.
13:45 --> 13:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
13:46 --> 13:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
13:46 --> 13:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And bringing in bringing in the mythologies, you know, I'm gonna have a lot to say about a certain scene in all of mythological points.
13:52 --> 13:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, I saw your nose.
13:56 --> 13:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm excited to get to that.
13:57 --> 14:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Practicing up for when we start to bring in rituals.
14:01 --> 14:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Foundation rituals?
14:03 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
14:03 --> 14:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess foundation and rituals.
14:06 --> 14:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Foundation and ritual would be a good title to a similar podcast, wouldn't it?
14:11 --> 14:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, absolutely.
14:11 --> 14:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Foundation and Empire, you know what I'm saying?
14:13 --> 14:13 [SPEAKER_00]: That's great.
14:13 --> 14:14 [SPEAKER_00]: That's great.
14:15 --> 14:16 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
14:16 --> 14:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I will also say my criticism of this episode is that it is a huge exposition dump.
14:23 --> 14:32 [SPEAKER_00]: My praise for this episode is this show needs an exposition dump at the beginning of each season because it's going a few, it's going a hundred fifty two years of a future, right?
14:33 --> 14:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
14:33 --> 14:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And so this time you, yeah.
14:36 --> 14:41 [SPEAKER_00]: So you cannot do this show without doing a little bit of over-explaining in the beginning.
14:42 --> 14:43 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want that to happen every episode.
14:44 --> 14:46 [SPEAKER_00]: But as long as it's mostly this episode, I think it's fine.
14:47 --> 14:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's fine.
14:47 --> 14:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no.
14:48 --> 14:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I remember you saying that after telling me your initial reactions to it all, and so I was prepared, I guess in a sense, because as I was watching, and I'm thinking, I don't have any objection to this.
14:59 --> 15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate the reminders here and there.
15:02 --> 15:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, some of my members, some of my didn't.
15:04 --> 15:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I mean, having Gale narrate everything, I was a little tired of her voice by the end of the episode, but in general, again, it's necessary.
15:13 --> 15:15 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a necessary device for a show like this.
15:15 --> 15:18 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a very unique show, the very unique structure.
15:18 --> 15:22 [SPEAKER_00]: It needs that extra little jizz just to get you along here.
15:22 --> 15:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they've already used her as an aerator before.
15:25 --> 15:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
15:26 --> 15:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, plenty of times.
15:27 --> 15:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we can say it's a common thread throughout.
15:31 --> 15:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And the same way that the structure that they gave to Empire is a common thread throughout.
15:37 --> 15:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
15:39 --> 15:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
15:39 --> 15:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And just stellar performances all around.
15:42 --> 15:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought everyone did brilliantly.
15:44 --> 15:49 [SPEAKER_00]: You know what's shocked me is how well I don't remember his name but the actor for Brother Dom.
15:50 --> 15:53 [SPEAKER_00]: How well the actor for Brother Dom is playing a cost day.
15:54 --> 15:55 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, he's doing the lead pace of voice.
15:56 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_00]: He's holding himself like Lee Pays.
15:58 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
15:58 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
15:59 --> 16:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very interesting, well, liminal spaces are always of interest to me.
16:03 --> 16:06 [SPEAKER_01]: So we're very deadly in liminal time right now.
16:07 --> 16:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And I just think that actor is really nailing it.
16:09 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_00]: He first of all, he looks like a young Lee Pays.
16:12 --> 16:14 [SPEAKER_00]: He does do, they cast him well for that.
16:14 --> 16:15 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not either his control.
16:17 --> 16:24 [SPEAKER_00]: But just his mannerisms are becoming more brother-day as he's ten days away from inauguration.
16:25 --> 16:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's had to play so many different brother-dons.
16:29 --> 16:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's very good at, you know, willing in this iteration,
16:35 --> 16:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I have to be this.
16:37 --> 16:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
16:37 --> 16:39 [SPEAKER_00]: He was like a scared kid in the first one, right?
16:40 --> 16:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
16:40 --> 16:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And then the next one, he was a very uncertain teenager, if you will, because he began to suspect that the purity of the transitions was was changing and he was keeping it in deep dark secret because the first he thought it was just him.
16:56 --> 16:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And then he was right.
16:58 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And then he was right.
16:59 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But it wasn't that he was defective.
17:02 --> 17:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It was that something else had been done.
17:05 --> 17:06 [SPEAKER_01]: to make the genetic drift happen.
17:08 --> 17:08 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
17:08 --> 17:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And now this one, I just love his so full of confidence and assurance and authority.
17:13 --> 17:18 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's interesting, you say that you're seeing him preparing a step into Dave's role because I didn't think about that at all.
17:18 --> 17:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I just thought about it as, wow, this iteration of dawn is much more confident.
17:25 --> 17:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It's almost like he had to become confident because his older brother was not.
17:30 --> 17:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
17:31 --> 17:37 [SPEAKER_01]: But I have to keep reminding myself, these are not the empires that you're looking at less time.
17:39 --> 17:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I, it's, you feel the sense of continuity regardless, even though you know, okay, this, this one is not the one that ran away with Sarah, then they had baby and whatnot.
17:50 --> 17:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, of course, the back of my mind, I'm thinking, so when are we going to hear about that again?
17:55 --> 17:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Or will we?
17:56 --> 17:57 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I think we will.
17:57 --> 18:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the child or the grandchild or whoever in terms of the number of years that have transpired.
18:02 --> 18:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Could create an exception crisis, right?
18:04 --> 18:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, most than questionably.
18:07 --> 18:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
18:08 --> 18:11 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, well, why don't we get into the main episode now that we've given our hot takes?
18:12 --> 18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
18:12 --> 18:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's start with the narration.
18:14 --> 18:22 [SPEAKER_00]: A hundred fifty two years since the second crisis, the foundation controls the periphery and is pushing into the middle band, a string of independent planets.
18:23 --> 18:28 [SPEAKER_00]: The Klanic dynasty must use jump gates without the spacers, which has slowed the spread of empire.
18:30 --> 18:35 [SPEAKER_00]: So that climax of last season really put a damper on empire, it seems like.
18:36 --> 18:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah.
18:37 --> 18:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, how could it not?
18:39 --> 18:45 [SPEAKER_01]: that the, you know, you think back to the model that, that Osamaugh was working from the Roman Empire.
18:45 --> 18:47 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why they had to build all those roads.
18:48 --> 18:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And as long as the roads were safe and secure and, you know, people could move across along them very quickly, they had that chance to expand out.
18:58 --> 19:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But once they overreached and they were constantly pulling back,
19:02 --> 19:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, locals would pry up the stones to build up their barns and pouses and things.
19:08 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And the road just began to deteriorate and so did the empire.
19:11 --> 19:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, it caused an effect hard to say, but they seemed to run in tandem.
19:15 --> 19:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So I thought it was an interesting way of depicting that same thing.
19:19 --> 19:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And a good demonstration that if you're having, if you have galactic ambitions, you have to be able to travel quickly from place to place.
19:26 --> 19:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, exactly.
19:28 --> 19:30 [SPEAKER_00]: And here we have the foundation being able to do that.
19:30 --> 19:32 [SPEAKER_00]: And so they're expansionists.
19:32 --> 19:33 [SPEAKER_00]: They're trying to push into the middle band.
19:33 --> 19:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And empire is doing everything it can to push the foundation back.
19:40 --> 19:41 [SPEAKER_00]: To hold the back.
19:41 --> 19:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I would say not even push.
19:42 --> 19:45 [SPEAKER_00]: They're just like holding your life here.
19:45 --> 19:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, fingers in the dark time.
19:48 --> 19:53 [SPEAKER_00]: And now we see, of course, we have a new focal point here.
19:55 --> 20:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So on Cogin, the mule meets an army alone and unarmed, arched Duke Belarian.
20:01 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying that based on what I heard, we don't have subtitles.
20:04 --> 20:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So arched Belarian attempts to get his daughter back from the mule.
20:11 --> 20:17 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mewel demands as ransom the entire planet and to be named Warlord, which makes the arts duke laugh, of course.
20:18 --> 20:24 [SPEAKER_00]: The arts duke says this will trigger a war between the Empire and Foundation, and the Mewel says he intends to consume both.
20:25 --> 20:29 [SPEAKER_00]: When the Mewel's demands go unmet, he causes the entire army and space fleet to kill each other.
20:30 --> 20:35 [SPEAKER_00]: He takes the arts to archduke's signet, freshly bitten off, and centers away.
20:37 --> 20:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I know you have a lot of thoughts on this, so go for it.
20:39 --> 20:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, when did she start with the recognition that we have a recast of the mule?
20:45 --> 20:54 [SPEAKER_00]: We did have a recast of the mule, so the actor, I don't have the actor's names on top of it, but this is your own great joy from Game of Thrones.
20:54 --> 20:55 [SPEAKER_00]: He was in the last couple of seasons.
20:56 --> 20:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay, interesting.
20:57 --> 21:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I deeply regret that he looks so much like the character from
21:05 --> 21:08 [SPEAKER_01]: the previous June series that we saw, June prophecy.
21:08 --> 21:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I had to really hard time when I'm watching the Julia.
21:13 --> 21:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no, it's not that.
21:14 --> 21:14 [SPEAKER_01]: It's this.
21:16 --> 21:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Even the way they hold their eyes.
21:18 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_01]: It just, it really, it's, well, I'm getting used to it, but it was, it was something of a shock.
21:25 --> 21:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I didn't really watch student prophecy.
21:28 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_00]: I watched the first couple episodes.
21:29 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:29 --> 21:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:30 --> 21:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:30 --> 21:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:30 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:31 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:31 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:32 --> 21:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:32 --> 21:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:33 --> 21:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:33 --> 21:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:34 --> 21:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:35 --> 21:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:35 --> 21:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:35 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:36 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:36 --> 21:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:37 --> 21:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:37 --> 21:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:37 --> 21:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:38 --> 21:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:38 --> 21:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:38 --> 21:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:39 --> 21:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you.
21:39 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:40 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:40 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:40 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:41 --> 21:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:42 --> 21:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:44 --> 21:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:44 --> 21:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:44 --> 21:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:45 --> 21:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:45 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you.
21:46 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank
21:47 --> 21:58 [SPEAKER_01]: through other than, you know, physical physics means, you know, just controlling people without the usual, you know, weapons and armies and all that kind of stuff.
21:58 --> 22:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's sort of, it's a psychic kind of a thing, so it makes it even harder to say, nope, this is not the same thing as that.
22:07 --> 22:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I thought he did a great job.
22:09 --> 22:10 [SPEAKER_00]: The meal from last season.
22:10 --> 22:12 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know exactly why he was recast.
22:12 --> 22:15 [SPEAKER_00]: There were some rumors about allegations.
22:16 --> 22:21 [SPEAKER_00]: There was also just the fact that maybe they wanted a bigger actor for this season because it's going to be the main villain.
22:21 --> 22:28 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems like at least based on the trailers and based on this episode he's setting up to be a pretty big problem.
22:29 --> 22:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, I admit to being confused at first, and all the more so, because the look just made me think, dude.
22:35 --> 22:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
22:35 --> 22:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, but I, you know, I got over it.
22:38 --> 22:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So I actually liked the scene.
22:40 --> 22:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought I thought it made him, it was a great way to introduce a very formidable foe, right?
22:44 --> 22:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Like this is someone who could take down an army.
22:46 --> 22:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we got there.
22:48 --> 22:54 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, unfortunately, they are demonstrating the power of this individual.
22:55 --> 23:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And when it is, you know, the visual presentation and not something you can read about, I understand why they felt the need to emphasize more of the physical stuff.
23:08 --> 23:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But as far as I'm concerned, it was far more valid than in the books.
23:12 --> 23:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And to my mind, not necessary.
23:17 --> 23:22 [SPEAKER_01]: But also, just to side note here, I think, you know, the wonderful opening images, it's beautiful.
23:22 --> 23:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:23 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we see his face as one of the last images on the right.
23:28 --> 23:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
23:28 --> 23:29 [SPEAKER_01]: During an intro.
23:29 --> 23:32 [SPEAKER_01]: So next time you watch it, see, look at it and see what you think about that.
23:32 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna, I'm gonna check that out.
23:34 --> 23:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
23:35 --> 23:40 [SPEAKER_01]: As above himself, no, there's a couple of pertinent quotes to this.
23:40 --> 23:47 [SPEAKER_01]: He, in the current's the space he wrote, what could be more eloquent as a condemnation of war than war itself?
23:48 --> 23:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So he was basically, again, so he was born in Zara's Russia and immigrated with his parents.
23:57 --> 24:03 [SPEAKER_01]: His life was lived during that time of extreme violence and pogroms because they were Jewish.
24:04 --> 24:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So I can see why he was led to have this adversion to violence.
24:08 --> 24:12 [SPEAKER_01]: But throughout the series, the first three book, well, throughout the entire series,
24:13 --> 24:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Various characters over time say violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
24:20 --> 24:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
24:21 --> 24:23 [SPEAKER_01]: So we've heard that once or twice.
24:23 --> 24:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
24:24 --> 24:27 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not like they completely dropped it and ignored it.
24:29 --> 24:35 [SPEAKER_01]: So if the meal is as incompetent as he is, that is where his terror lies in the book series.
24:36 --> 24:47 [SPEAKER_01]: But here, yes, it's gobsmacking to suddenly have your ship's turn and kill each other and to have all your army's right and to do all that.
24:47 --> 24:50 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of, whoa, what is this dude?
24:51 --> 24:55 [SPEAKER_01]: But then, you know, the force of the guy that bite off his own finger, I'm sorry.
24:55 --> 24:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't watch that.
24:57 --> 25:01 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, as it happened, I was eating dinner.
25:01 --> 25:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, this was a really bad choice.
25:05 --> 25:08 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's shocking.
25:09 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think with that emotional charge, you also get that stronger sense of, okay, this guy is crazy nuts.
25:18 --> 25:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And has this ability that we don't understand, but in the books, the meal was such a different character.
25:26 --> 25:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And they took a completely different
25:29 --> 25:36 [SPEAKER_01]: tack to presenting him, to having him taking over, you know, one by one that the areas that he did.
25:38 --> 25:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And I missed that.
25:39 --> 25:41 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I was looking forward to seeing that represented.
25:41 --> 25:43 [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know.
25:43 --> 25:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I think book people will have to come to terms with that in some fashion or other.
25:48 --> 25:53 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's clear that they've made the choice to go the violent route as much as possible.
25:54 --> 25:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm sorry for that.
25:56 --> 26:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'll admit I have not gotten up to the big new old sections of foundation and empire.
26:02 --> 26:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'll be very interested to hear your thoughts when you do.
26:06 --> 26:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I might feel differently once I get there.
26:08 --> 26:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh-huh.
26:09 --> 26:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I, as of right now, I'm okay with having a more violent villain as well as the political situation that the foundation is finding itself in.
26:18 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I would be more bothered if the foundation we're getting really violent because that would feel very anti-sildened to me.
26:23 --> 26:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Well.
26:25 --> 26:27 [SPEAKER_00]: No, maybe I haven't read it yet.
26:29 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.
26:30 --> 26:32 [SPEAKER_00]: But anyway, I, I,
26:33 --> 26:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't have a preconceived notion of the meal.
26:35 --> 26:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'll say many characters have been completely changed.
26:39 --> 26:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, Selver Harden saying violence is the last refuse of the incompetent.
26:43 --> 26:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
26:43 --> 26:46 [SPEAKER_00]: To Selver Harden do a lot of gunsling in the first couple of seasons.
26:46 --> 26:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, she does.
26:47 --> 26:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, she does.
26:48 --> 26:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Plus, you know, Homer Malo completely different character in the books.
26:52 --> 26:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
26:52 --> 26:55 [SPEAKER_01]: That was okay for for every reason for me.
26:55 --> 26:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It was successful now.
26:59 --> 27:12 [SPEAKER_01]: The part of the reason why I wish the meal hadn't been altered is because he becomes such a central driver for one of the two women characters who I like so much.
27:13 --> 27:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm afraid that they may just be omitting her all together.
27:17 --> 27:20 [SPEAKER_01]: But we'll say, we'll say, it's early days.
27:20 --> 27:22 [SPEAKER_01]: It's only episode one.
27:24 --> 27:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we've already gotten rid of Archduke Ballarian, which I love that actor.
27:29 --> 27:31 [SPEAKER_00]: He's he's fantastic.
27:31 --> 27:31 [SPEAKER_00]: He's in the witch.
27:32 --> 27:36 [SPEAKER_00]: He he does a lot of voice acting in video games because he just got like one of the deepest voices out there.
27:37 --> 27:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Love him.
27:38 --> 27:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Love him.
27:39 --> 27:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely brilliant.
27:41 --> 27:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you a fan of this guy?
27:42 --> 27:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I've never heard of him.
27:43 --> 27:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't recognize him.
27:45 --> 27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you know.
27:47 --> 27:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I kind of want to tell you to watch the witch.
27:49 --> 27:51 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not it's not really violent.
27:51 --> 27:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's it's horror, but it's it's I don't do hurry the judge.
27:55 --> 28:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It's an allegory, but it's it's an allegory for the deadly sentence.
28:00 --> 28:01 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's interesting.
28:01 --> 28:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Very Christian in influence.
28:03 --> 28:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I think you would like him a lot and he's the father in that.
28:06 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_00]: He's a colonial era.
28:08 --> 28:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Very religious father.
28:09 --> 28:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
28:11 --> 28:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
28:11 --> 28:13 [SPEAKER_01]: There were a lot of those around.
28:13 --> 28:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
28:13 --> 28:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
28:14 --> 28:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Besides as a Quaker, you know, I don't think.
28:17 --> 28:24 [SPEAKER_01]: too much of the pilgrims and the appearance and because they've burned a bunch of us and executed us.
28:25 --> 28:28 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll just go back and carry with us at a town.
28:28 --> 28:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
28:29 --> 28:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
28:29 --> 28:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, this guy in the movie was so extreme that they kicked him out of town and that's the whole start of the movie.
28:34 --> 28:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
28:34 --> 28:38 [SPEAKER_00]: They said take your family and go if you're not going to live in peace over.
28:38 --> 28:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's right.
28:39 --> 28:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And they go off into the woods and they eventually went by one go crazy nuts.
28:43 --> 28:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Try to kind of.
28:45 --> 28:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
28:45 --> 28:49 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I remember when I remember when it came out and I remember reading things about it thinking that.
28:50 --> 28:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it's very good.
28:51 --> 28:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's the best part of it ever made.
28:53 --> 29:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, on the other side, it's slamming, you know, pagan practices and all that sort of thing.
29:00 --> 29:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So they're kind of, it's a one, two punch for me.
29:03 --> 29:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I actually don't think they slam pagan practices.
29:06 --> 29:07 [SPEAKER_00]: It's anyway.
29:08 --> 29:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, we don't have to go there right now.
29:10 --> 29:11 [SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about that program.
29:11 --> 29:12 [SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about this one.
29:12 --> 29:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, exactly.
29:13 --> 29:15 [SPEAKER_00]: And we had loved him in that movie.
29:15 --> 29:16 [SPEAKER_00]: He's great here.
29:16 --> 29:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I wonder why he's taking a lot of these roles where you're in it for a little bit and then you're out.
29:22 --> 29:26 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think, but great addition for the few minutes you was here.
29:26 --> 29:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
29:27 --> 29:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And you was scary.
29:29 --> 29:31 [SPEAKER_01]: The meal was unquestionably scary.
29:31 --> 29:32 [SPEAKER_01]: He was
29:33 --> 29:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You'll pardon the expression.
29:34 --> 29:35 [SPEAKER_01]: That should be easy.
29:35 --> 29:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, I'm sorry.
29:37 --> 29:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And you could believe that if you do, but I don't think you do.
29:41 --> 29:47 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I will say as much as I am excusing the violence here, you know, the presence of it in the show, not that he did was right.
29:47 --> 29:52 [SPEAKER_00]: But as much as I'm saying this doesn't bother me, I hope that this is not what he does every time he walks into a room.
29:53 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope so.
29:54 --> 29:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I hope that he's more interesting than just the guy who makes you all kill each other.
29:58 --> 30:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Which, you know, as you say after two or three times, you just say it coming and it's kind of whole hum.
30:04 --> 30:06 [SPEAKER_00]: So I trust David Goyer.
30:06 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_00]: He was still showing over the season.
30:09 --> 30:10 [SPEAKER_00]: He was writing a lot of this.
30:10 --> 30:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
30:10 --> 30:13 [SPEAKER_00]: You trust him to not be doing a boring thing with him.
30:14 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
30:16 --> 30:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope you're right.
30:18 --> 30:18 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
30:18 --> 30:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Any other thoughts on the scene?
30:21 --> 30:21 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
30:22 --> 30:22 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
30:22 --> 30:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's take a break and we'll come back and continue on.
30:45 --> 30:47 [SPEAKER_00]: We're back and ready to convene with Brother Dawn.
30:48 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Demorazelle tells Dawn the third crisis is approaching, but also that a new inflection point has suddenly appeared.
30:55 --> 30:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Dawn travels to Clarence Station to meet with the Galactic Council.
30:59 --> 31:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Dawn walks through a group of protesters, which throw dirt at him, and tells the council it is time to support the merchant princes a group of dissenters within the foundation.
31:10 --> 31:19 [SPEAKER_00]: With ten days to go before his inauguration, Dawn calls the presiders' bluff and gets a vote on a proposal.
31:20 --> 31:22 [SPEAKER_00]: There was no change in the upcoming inflection point.
31:25 --> 31:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I love this Don, and we were talking about it before, but really a man, a man about business, right?
31:31 --> 31:31 [SPEAKER_00]: He comes in.
31:32 --> 31:34 [SPEAKER_00]: The presenter goes, well, brother, day isn't here.
31:34 --> 31:39 [SPEAKER_00]: He goes, we could wait ten days and we could also have another vote about your status.
31:39 --> 31:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
31:40 --> 31:43 [SPEAKER_01]: He's very sharp, very very sharp.
31:43 --> 31:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Also, I really appreciated seeing Don and Deborah Zell working in such unity.
31:48 --> 31:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I agree.
31:48 --> 31:50 [SPEAKER_00]: And she gives him kudos, right?
31:50 --> 31:50 [SPEAKER_00]: She goes that way.
31:50 --> 31:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
31:51 --> 31:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
31:52 --> 31:52 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
31:52 --> 31:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And I, I like seeing him have such confidence.
31:55 --> 32:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And I thought that having a galactic council scene was an excellent way to show Dawn's baturing.
32:02 --> 32:31 [SPEAKER_01]: because what you know talk about being wise about you know human machinations and political currents and all that kind of thing and there was the whole symbolism of what they threw at him was dirt from a planet and like I only watched it once so I can't remember the specifics of that but it kind of brought home some of the reason why they were the protesters were right we're making so much noise right
32:32 --> 32:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, so this is, it's really interesting because now that I'm reading the books, he's really mixing and matching the timelines here, right?
32:38 --> 32:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the strangers are happening after the, the, the empire business and it's, uh, it's really, really mixing and matching, but that's okay with me.
32:46 --> 32:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I think as long as we, we touch all these points, it will be a lot of fun.
32:50 --> 32:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
32:50 --> 32:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, I, I did note that he's been in touch with a brand new mallo.
32:54 --> 32:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So is it, I assume, I mean, this is related to Huber mallo.
32:57 --> 33:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, possibly, you know, the child for a grandchild.
33:00 --> 33:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, because we know, uh, constant, brother constant, and Obermallow got along.
33:06 --> 33:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, they did.
33:07 --> 33:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I thought the galactic council scene was an excellent way to show him a tour.
33:12 --> 33:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I also thought it was an interesting play to suggest that the empire merges with the foundation.
33:20 --> 33:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Now that the merchant prince is revealing, um, it,
33:24 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a different flavor from what I would have expected from the trilogy.
33:27 --> 33:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think they're merging with the foundation.
33:31 --> 33:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, just since so far as there's a foundation representative on this council.
33:37 --> 33:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, they're being diplomatic here.
33:40 --> 33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, which I can't really see happening and never did happen to my knowledge in the books.
33:46 --> 33:49 [SPEAKER_00]: We have Russian and Chinese ambassadors here.
33:49 --> 33:50 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, like it.
33:50 --> 33:50 [SPEAKER_00]: That's fine.
33:51 --> 33:51 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's fine.
33:51 --> 33:52 [SPEAKER_00]: There's no ambassador there.
33:52 --> 33:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Sure.
33:53 --> 33:53 [SPEAKER_01]: No, that's fine.
33:53 --> 33:58 [SPEAKER_01]: But I mean, it's just outside the sphere of the original, but it's not for sure.
33:58 --> 34:00 [SPEAKER_01]: It raises some more interesting points.
34:01 --> 34:05 [SPEAKER_01]: It also felt very odd to me to have the Empire using the Seldon Plan.
34:07 --> 34:08 [SPEAKER_00]: That is very strange.
34:09 --> 34:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I wonder if this was a goyer idea since it was introduced at the end of season two.
34:12 --> 34:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I think most of this season is still going to be goyer ideas the whole time.
34:17 --> 34:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, or you know his writers or I know he has a writers room too.
34:21 --> 34:24 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I think that's within his purview.
34:24 --> 34:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's really interesting because
34:27 --> 34:33 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, at this point, we know from this episode that Demerzel knows this empire will end, right?
34:33 --> 34:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Like one day she will lose her purpose.
34:35 --> 34:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
34:36 --> 34:48 [SPEAKER_00]: But she does, you know, as, as a positronic robot with the zero-thlaw, she does want humanity to go on without her, without, without empire, too.
34:49 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And so she's still for, again, she, she goes, I ask myself why he gave it to me.
34:57 --> 34:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Right?
34:58 --> 35:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and so do a bunch of the residents.
35:02 --> 35:06 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a very, I have some speculation at the end as to why that might have happened.
35:07 --> 35:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Have you read second foundation yet?
35:10 --> 35:12 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I'm only in foundation and empire and pretty early on.
35:13 --> 35:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
35:13 --> 35:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, then I won't spell it beyond just to say that the representation of the prime radiant is clearly the physical representation is clearly a go ahead representation.
35:25 --> 35:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
35:26 --> 35:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's an improvement among so many improvements.
35:29 --> 35:31 [SPEAKER_01]: But when you get there, I'll be interested to hear.
35:31 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's beautiful in the show.
35:34 --> 35:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I absolutely have no idea what as Mal was thinking of back in the day.
35:39 --> 35:41 [SPEAKER_00]: But beautiful in the show.
35:41 --> 35:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I mean, it's one wonders how you read it if you're not a robot.
35:47 --> 35:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, or Harry Selden, or someone steeped in secular history.
35:51 --> 35:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Even then, like, what language is that?
35:54 --> 35:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Methodics.
35:56 --> 35:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh boy, not for me.
35:58 --> 35:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Not for me either.
36:00 --> 36:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, I will say one thing on the galactic council here.
36:05 --> 36:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't love that they say in the narration.
36:07 --> 36:10 [SPEAKER_00]: The galactic council is as old as Empire, right?
36:10 --> 36:12 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what you feel right to me, right?
36:12 --> 36:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Like Empire was an absolute monarch for a while.
36:14 --> 36:15 [SPEAKER_00]: That was the whole point.
36:15 --> 36:16 [SPEAKER_00]: It was very, very strong.
36:16 --> 36:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I think they should have said.
36:19 --> 36:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
36:19 --> 36:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I think they, they, Gayle should have just been saying, you know, as it weakened the people demand a representation, they became like the council.
36:26 --> 36:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I think I would have been fine.
36:28 --> 36:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Minor critique, but I was like, uh, it would have been nicer to say it's out of weakness that this even exists.
36:34 --> 36:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Definitely.
36:35 --> 36:36 [SPEAKER_00]: And empires annoyed that it has to exist.
36:37 --> 36:46 [SPEAKER_01]: and all of your nobles nibbling around the edges, and some of the great generals trying to rebel and whatever.
36:46 --> 36:53 [SPEAKER_01]: They're not queuing as closely to the line of Roman history as was as above himself.
36:54 --> 36:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But that's okay.
36:58 --> 37:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just really enjoying this whole brother Dawn deal.
37:03 --> 37:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And the Galactic Council, I think there could be some interesting stuff there.
37:07 --> 37:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Like you said, foundation representation is interesting.
37:09 --> 37:12 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if I call it representation actually, because it sounds like an ambassador.
37:12 --> 37:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think there.
37:13 --> 37:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, you may be right.
37:14 --> 37:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we see her at the dinner table.
37:17 --> 37:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't even, but is she in the Galactic Council?
37:20 --> 37:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think so.
37:21 --> 37:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I didn't think so.
37:22 --> 37:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I thought you were saying she was at the Galactic Council and I just missed it.
37:25 --> 37:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.
37:26 --> 37:29 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm not clear on that one way or the other.
37:29 --> 37:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
37:29 --> 37:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.
37:30 --> 37:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Only one watch.
37:31 --> 37:31 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all right.
37:31 --> 37:37 [SPEAKER_01]: But the fact that they're even talking to the foundation and receiving them in this August manner, very different.
37:37 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, buddy, we did try to destroy your whole civilization.
37:40 --> 37:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I know.
37:41 --> 37:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Sorry.
37:42 --> 37:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
37:44 --> 37:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's interesting because the foundation was supposed to be underground.
37:49 --> 37:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, isn't it?
37:49 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I assume the foundation was going to be underground after at the end of last season.
37:54 --> 37:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Keep reading.
37:56 --> 38:00 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I just, I don't know why.
38:00 --> 38:02 [SPEAKER_01]: They really couldn't.
38:02 --> 38:10 [SPEAKER_01]: The TV series really, I don't think could really leave them underground and still be as faithful as they have been to the world.
38:10 --> 38:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Still go forward in the story.
38:12 --> 38:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
38:12 --> 38:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
38:13 --> 38:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
38:13 --> 38:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I see what you're saying.
38:14 --> 38:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
38:15 --> 38:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I see what you're saying.
38:16 --> 38:16 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
38:16 --> 38:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, let's move on.
38:17 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_01]: The original story, you know, the original planet was not destroyed.
38:22 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
38:22 --> 38:24 [SPEAKER_01]: So they didn't have to go anywhere else.
38:25 --> 38:27 [SPEAKER_00]: And then we get new terminus, but not yet.
38:27 --> 38:30 [SPEAKER_00]: First we've got to go visit with the other versions of Empire.
38:31 --> 38:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Dusk and day.
38:33 --> 38:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, torment.
38:34 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
38:34 --> 38:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Dusk, torment himself with recordings of the previous dusk deaths.
38:40 --> 38:45 [SPEAKER_00]: He laments the incompetence of Clia on the seventeenth, who the spacer, who lost the spacer's last season.
38:46 --> 38:50 [SPEAKER_00]: He and Dawn discuss their political predicament and muse over the mule.
38:51 --> 38:58 [SPEAKER_00]: After dinner with foundation ambassador Quent and Zefer Varellis, again, no subtitles, so if I'm a little wrong on that, sorry.
38:59 --> 39:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Dusk goes off to find day.
39:01 --> 39:08 [SPEAKER_00]: He finds day on a bender with his lover and drug dealer song, letting it all hang out while he avoids his duties.
39:09 --> 39:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Dust tells day, it's time to get rid of song, or it will be done for him.
39:14 --> 39:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Day finally goes to work and sees the impending inflection point in the prime radiant.
39:18 --> 39:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Darkness comes and the end of Empire is in four months.
39:23 --> 39:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Ending the usefulness of the prime radiant and making extinction possible.
39:28 --> 39:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I kind of say, boy, something awakened to me when Lee Pace goes, welcome to my film, shirtless on the balcony.
39:36 --> 39:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I was, oh,
39:38 --> 39:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to know what we'll go for each other.
39:44 --> 39:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Something within me, Marilyn.
39:45 --> 39:46 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
39:46 --> 39:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
39:47 --> 39:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, it's, it's your reaction.
39:50 --> 39:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Mr. Pace.
39:51 --> 39:51 [SPEAKER_00]: No judge.
39:51 --> 39:54 [SPEAKER_00]: You can't do that to me on a random weekday.
39:56 --> 39:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yes, he can.
39:58 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's interesting.
39:59 --> 40:07 [SPEAKER_01]: I was really glad that they had that useful reminder that this is not the same plan who lost the spacers last season.
40:07 --> 40:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, we know that spoiler, the previous season folks, we know that because we watched him floating off in the space.
40:14 --> 40:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
40:15 --> 40:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Nevertheless, I can absolutely see a continuity in character and in response from that day to this day.
40:25 --> 40:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, because it's always the pace, I think that makes it more difficult to say, wait a minute, this is not the seventeenth, this is the whatever it is, eighteenth or nineteen, I don't know.
40:34 --> 40:37 [SPEAKER_00]: This, I mean, he seemed like a completely different person of me.
40:37 --> 40:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought he did a great job.
40:39 --> 40:42 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was much different than the previous day.
40:42 --> 40:48 [SPEAKER_00]: The previous day, they was patch on, but he wasn't, he wasn't like uncaring, right?
40:49 --> 40:50 [SPEAKER_00]: He did want to get the job done.
40:51 --> 40:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And this guy is just like, if you like peanut coladas,
40:56 --> 40:58 [SPEAKER_00]: He's making camels and ferrets.
40:59 --> 41:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I love, I'll just remember the girl with the yeast from dust.
41:03 --> 41:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Because she's from the yeast factory or something.
41:09 --> 41:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I can easily see a continuity between the petulant but well-intentioned and the ciberitic.
41:19 --> 41:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, constantly knew it.
41:21 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Because he has the only ten more days to live, quote unquote.
41:27 --> 41:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Sorry.
41:27 --> 41:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Day has more to use the loop.
41:29 --> 41:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Will they're all going to get it?
41:31 --> 41:32 [SPEAKER_01]: What?
41:32 --> 41:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Day is going to be coming off.
41:35 --> 41:35 [SPEAKER_00]: But sorry.
41:35 --> 41:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Day is going to become dusk.
41:37 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Disney come dust and then I don't know does does does immediately die because there were some comments about six months I think that's got six months, right?
41:47 --> 41:54 [SPEAKER_01]: There's there's a brother night and I GHT and it's the brother nights that get dissolved.
41:54 --> 41:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know how long the period of time there is between.
41:56 --> 41:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought they did.
41:58 --> 41:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
41:58 --> 41:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but that sounds reasonable.
42:00 --> 42:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
42:01 --> 42:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Sounds reasonable.
42:03 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you know, they get to cuddle the baby for six months and then grandpa goes off to the sunset.
42:10 --> 42:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And as you noted, they're opening talking about the decanting.
42:13 --> 42:14 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
42:14 --> 42:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I know.
42:14 --> 42:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I was like, oh, this is not a secret anymore.
42:17 --> 42:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I would have thought the Demerzel tamp that down with the memory deletion at some point.
42:24 --> 42:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, evidently, maybe she's gone too much outside her honors.
42:33 --> 42:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, she's juggling so many things.
42:35 --> 42:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, plus she's having her own personal crisis, which we will bring up shortly.
42:41 --> 42:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, my first reaction to the whole thing was we say day looking like John the Baptist and acting like Nero in the final days of Rome.
42:49 --> 42:53 [SPEAKER_01]: So again, I really think that they're emphasizing this fall of empire trope.
42:55 --> 42:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
42:56 --> 42:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And dry, I mean, the pink camels are crying out loud.
42:58 --> 43:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't even not think of the Middle East when you see a camel apologies that's stereotypical I know.
43:03 --> 43:18 [SPEAKER_01]: But between that and his, you know, the hair, the first scene we see of him is, you know, he's, instead of being the classic emperor, clean, cut, clean, shaving, he's got the beard and the mustache and they hair down, it was shoulders and, you know, he's got the blue and white.
43:18 --> 43:20 [SPEAKER_00]: He's got the blue and white or full drugs as he says.
43:20 --> 43:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it looks like John the Baptist to me.
43:23 --> 43:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
43:24 --> 43:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't put the John of the Baptist together, but I don't know what you did.
43:27 --> 43:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
43:28 --> 43:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
43:29 --> 43:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And I, you know, Don and Dusk are trying to hold it together, which again mirrors season two's Don and Dusk are trying to hold it together while that day, the seventeen was, you know, going off the rails.
43:43 --> 43:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's probably another reason why I'm just feeling this continuity.
43:46 --> 43:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Don of course is anticipating it all with pleasure.
43:49 --> 43:50 [SPEAKER_01]: It's interesting.
43:51 --> 43:51 [SPEAKER_01]: What was your word?
43:54 --> 43:59 [SPEAKER_01]: about dusk and anticipating his torture torment himself.
43:59 --> 44:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I just felt he was being really cynical.
44:05 --> 44:19 [SPEAKER_01]: and using this fierce cynicism watching each of the further nights before him being disintegrated and noting the individuality of the response because again, they're not supposed to be individuals.
44:20 --> 44:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Another way of emphasizing the fact that the original plan got messed up and I believe it was in season two that we learned that it was one of the
44:30 --> 44:40 [SPEAKER_01]: rebel groups or whatever that introduced the genetic variation into one of the little embryos in there and floating in there.
44:41 --> 44:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And you have to extend it more.
44:43 --> 44:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's something where they can do because they've lost the quote unquote purity of the original.
44:47 --> 44:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Right up.
44:50 --> 44:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, emphasized genetic purity has been lost.
44:54 --> 44:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
44:55 --> 44:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And both of them want to try and preserve empire.
44:59 --> 45:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But when Dimresel shows all three of them that the prime radiant indicates the end of empire and the end of the cessation because of the mule, I'm wondering how that's going to affect the three of them in terms of their attitudes towards, you know, will dusk suddenly say, oh, well, I saw going to go down and ask it anyways.
45:17 --> 45:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, why don't I might as well get out before, you know, the palace falls around my ears.
45:23 --> 45:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I wonder that too.
45:24 --> 45:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, this dusk does seem to be a little nileist.
45:28 --> 45:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
45:29 --> 45:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
45:29 --> 45:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's like if I rush toward it and embrace it as much as I possibly can, maybe it won't hurt quite so much.
45:36 --> 45:38 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, hurt any emotional sense, not in a physical sense.
45:38 --> 45:40 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't look like it's a painful process or whatever.
45:41 --> 45:43 [SPEAKER_00]: No, it looks like it's pretty quick, honestly.
45:43 --> 45:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it raises an interesting philosophical question, which is, do you want to know the day you're going to die?
45:51 --> 45:54 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, that's that comes up in one of the empire books, right?
45:54 --> 45:58 [SPEAKER_00]: That that's uh, in pebble in the in the sky.
45:58 --> 46:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I have read those, but I'm not surprised that it does.
46:01 --> 46:08 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the only empire book I've read, but there's this whole thing where everybody on earth at that point has to submit themselves to die at sixty.
46:09 --> 46:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's yeah, there's books and authors who use that con.
46:14 --> 46:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
46:15 --> 46:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And people will be like proud of it.
46:18 --> 46:21 [SPEAKER_00]: They're like, you know, I've got ten years and two days left.
46:21 --> 46:24 [SPEAKER_00]: They're using every one of them.
46:24 --> 46:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
46:24 --> 46:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
46:25 --> 46:33 [SPEAKER_01]: There's this book that I absolutely adore about life of nuns in a comment in the southeast part of England.
46:34 --> 46:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And one of them at one point says, I just wish I knew what day I was gonna die.
46:39 --> 46:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And they said, my sister, and she says, so that I know what to read next.
46:48 --> 46:50 [SPEAKER_00]: That's fine.
46:50 --> 46:50 [SPEAKER_00]: That's very funny.
46:51 --> 46:53 [SPEAKER_01]: It depends on any number of things I suppose.
46:54 --> 46:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
46:55 --> 46:58 [SPEAKER_00]: I am really loving this trio right now.
46:59 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I think every season has another really interesting trio and this trio has a dynamic that feels ripe for comedy.
47:08 --> 47:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's the same actors every time.
47:11 --> 47:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I know.
47:12 --> 47:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I think they must be growing bouncing off each other in some ways.
47:17 --> 47:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
47:17 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_01]: And deepening and
47:20 --> 47:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, they've got marvelous material to work with.
47:22 --> 47:32 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm hoping they're having a time with their lives because I don't think that any of them will ever be in a project that's exactly like this one.
47:32 --> 47:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no.
47:33 --> 47:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, what could be right?
47:35 --> 47:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Anything that was like this one would be just a rip off of this one.
47:39 --> 47:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
47:39 --> 47:46 [SPEAKER_01]: But having such a chance to display the full range of your acting skills and kind of chops, can you bring to?
47:46 --> 47:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
47:47 --> 47:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And episode, it's really remarkable.
47:51 --> 47:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, why don't we talk about the vault?
47:53 --> 48:01 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a new terminus where the foundation has rebuilt the headquarters while the faction of traders is threatening to succeed.
48:02 --> 48:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Ebbling miss goes to the vault and knows the no field to awaken Harry Selden ahead of the third crisis.
48:09 --> 48:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Seldin deduces that the merchant princess had risen as the religious age ended.
48:14 --> 48:20 [SPEAKER_00]: When he learns that empire is holding on better than expected, he says it's because he gave them the prime radiant.
48:20 --> 48:23 [SPEAKER_00]: When Evelyn demands a reason why Seldin ejects him.
48:26 --> 48:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I've been asking that question myself.
48:28 --> 48:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm really glad that we have Evelyn miss.
48:30 --> 48:34 [SPEAKER_01]: He's a significant character in foundation and empire.
48:38 --> 48:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I like that they've toned him down a little bit.
48:40 --> 48:45 [SPEAKER_01]: He still uses one of his favorite exclamations of galaxy.
48:48 --> 48:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's not quite so much of a weird screwball in this instance, but although he's still something in the parody of the scholar, which is what he is.
49:00 --> 49:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's been studying all his life.
49:02 --> 49:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is just the most proudest moment of his life.
49:07 --> 49:09 [SPEAKER_01]: He's been waiting for this encounter with self.
49:10 --> 49:13 [SPEAKER_01]: He wants to tell something all about how excited he is about it.
49:15 --> 49:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And then when Seldon tells him that he gave the prime rating to Empire, Mrs. astounded, and he gets booted back out.
49:21 --> 49:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, right exactly.
49:23 --> 49:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I love their interaction, the whole thing.
49:25 --> 49:26 [SPEAKER_00]: From... Is it great?
49:26 --> 49:27 [SPEAKER_00]: No, my no-field.
49:27 --> 49:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, dude.
49:28 --> 49:29 [SPEAKER_00]: It's never done that.
49:29 --> 49:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Well done.
49:31 --> 49:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, that was perfectly played, pitch perfect because you expect he's going to say, get out of my hair and then he says, wow, that's impressive.
49:39 --> 49:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:40 --> 49:41 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, you weren't to sit down in my office.
49:42 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
49:43 --> 49:44 [SPEAKER_01]: You weren't a visit.
49:44 --> 49:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
49:45 --> 49:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You weren't a visit.
49:46 --> 49:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Until you make me angry.
49:47 --> 49:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
49:48 --> 49:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Or, you know, question my actions.
49:52 --> 49:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
49:52 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Probably the worst thing anybody could do.
49:54 --> 49:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, but don't question those psychostoria.
49:57 --> 49:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
49:58 --> 50:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And I like the way that they are emphasizing, even if they're not going to show us a lot of it.
50:03 --> 50:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And they've showed it a little bit, but they might show us more than they might not.
50:06 --> 50:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But they're emphasizing that the traders, revealing, is setting up to be the next crisis.
50:16 --> 50:33 [SPEAKER_00]: It's something that happens in the books to where, every time, while the traders in general, but every time that there's a seldom crisis coming, there's certain characters who go, my seldom sense is tingling, and they go, I feel it, there's a seldom crisis coming.
50:34 --> 50:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel the force of the crisis, right?
50:38 --> 50:44 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I mean, no spoilers from the books other than the fact that the traders were a faction in the book too.
50:44 --> 50:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
50:45 --> 50:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
50:46 --> 50:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
50:46 --> 50:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And play an important role.
50:48 --> 50:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
50:49 --> 50:57 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's fascinating again to me how he's echoing the books without simply replicating them.
50:59 --> 50:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
50:59 --> 51:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Step by step.
51:01 --> 51:03 [SPEAKER_01]: What you called it painting with the what?
51:03 --> 51:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you using the palette of the book using the palette of the books.
51:07 --> 51:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, this whole scene is an excellent example that the vaults in the books is nowhere near is interesting.
51:14 --> 51:17 [SPEAKER_00]: No, the vault is just the series of recordings, right?
51:17 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just yeah, exactly a hologram plays after every crisis and it's like hey, good job
51:22 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
51:23 --> 51:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
51:23 --> 51:26 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're here a good job, if not, I guess you died.
51:26 --> 51:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's keep it going with the recording, you say.
51:28 --> 51:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I have no idea if I'm talking to anybody or not.
51:31 --> 51:39 [SPEAKER_01]: If anybody is a person and they actually do mention in the books that there were one or two crises where nobody even went to the vault.
51:40 --> 51:41 [SPEAKER_00]: No, really.
51:41 --> 51:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Because they felt confident enough that they knew what was going on and what they needed to do.
51:46 --> 51:51 [SPEAKER_01]: But they also, in the books, raises interesting questions, and I'm not sure if they're going to do this or not.
51:51 --> 52:09 [SPEAKER_01]: The tension between on the one hand, the only way cycle history can work if it's dealing with massive numbers of the individuals, behaviors that then make them predictable, whereas the actions of a single individual
52:11 --> 52:13 [SPEAKER_01]: are supposedly not predictable.
52:14 --> 52:25 [SPEAKER_01]: And therefore, when the leaders of the community say, oh, it's a sudden crisis we have to do this out of the other, you get this pushback of, no, the best thing we can do is do nothing because it's not supposed to come about the resolution.
52:26 --> 52:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Through the interventions of individual people.
52:29 --> 52:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, but leaders can be more than individuals, right?
52:32 --> 52:33 [SPEAKER_00]: They can move masses.
52:34 --> 52:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So, well, I think that's one of the points, perhaps that as a moment is making it.
52:37 --> 52:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
52:38 --> 52:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
52:38 --> 52:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
52:39 --> 52:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Like Salver Harden, sure, solve the first crisis, because, or the second crisis, kind of both, right?
52:47 --> 52:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, in the books, there's a different set of crisis, but in here, Selver Harden solves the first crisis, the second crisis is, you know, Hover Malo is involved in all that and all reals.
52:58 --> 53:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And each one of these are individual actions, but they impact so many different people that you could see how that affects psychohistory.
53:06 --> 53:13 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think the best explanation I can come with right now for that is looking at the masses statistical
53:15 --> 53:16 [SPEAKER_01]: numbers and variables.
53:18 --> 53:30 [SPEAKER_01]: The projection is that some bell relatively like figure will result from all of this and therefore will act in race that that psycho history.
53:30 --> 53:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
53:31 --> 53:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that didn't predict that it was going to be this particular general this time, but they did predict that
53:37 --> 53:41 [SPEAKER_01]: as the power of the Emperor fades, then the generals are going to increase and so on and so on.
53:42 --> 53:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very similar to me to the pattern of the Wheel of Time.
53:46 --> 53:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
53:47 --> 53:52 [SPEAKER_00]: So when the pattern is demanding that the dragon should be reborn a bunch of false dragons pop up.
53:52 --> 53:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
53:53 --> 54:01 [SPEAKER_00]: So all these things like the pattern will give you a new thing that you a new figure to fit the the bill of the main arc of history.
54:02 --> 54:04 [SPEAKER_00]: if the individuals fail, right?
54:05 --> 54:08 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's the same thing as, uh, Spobimmy with Tolgan.
54:08 --> 54:18 [SPEAKER_00]: She's the individuals can take actions, but really, Evers plan is going to go whatever, you know, whatever is going to happen is going to happen.
54:18 --> 54:20 [SPEAKER_00]: It's who's involved that can change.
54:20 --> 54:23 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's, it's how it happens exactly.
54:23 --> 54:31 [SPEAKER_01]: But you still have this tension between, um, was it the individual or what it did happen to me?
54:33 --> 54:35 [SPEAKER_01]: If not this one, then someone else.
54:35 --> 54:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And how important are the individual actions?
54:38 --> 54:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And that, of course, he also have the whole free will versus fake questions.
54:41 --> 54:46 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's a fascinating concept in and of itself, and it can lead to lots of different discussion.
54:46 --> 54:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's really interesting because it raises a lot of religious questions in society that is a math-based, right?
54:55 --> 54:56 [SPEAKER_00]: This is science.
54:57 --> 55:02 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's why this series is so interesting to talk about.
55:03 --> 55:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And at the same time, mathematics is a language.
55:06 --> 55:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
55:07 --> 55:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And you use a language to tell a story.
55:10 --> 55:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Has a lot better rules that English though?
55:14 --> 55:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think, you know, really deep mathematicians, if they're honest, we'll tell you that the laws of mathematics are not quite as rigid as
55:24 --> 55:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Many of us believe now that maybe because different approaches are taken.
55:28 --> 55:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not a mathematician.
55:30 --> 55:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I did not take any math after high school.
55:32 --> 55:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I managed to scrape by a high enough of my AP score.
55:37 --> 55:43 [SPEAKER_01]: College math that I did not have to ever set foot in a mathematics class again, which was fine with me.
55:43 --> 55:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I too did the same thing.
55:44 --> 55:48 [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't take any math in college because I was scored well enough in high school.
55:48 --> 55:52 [SPEAKER_01]: But it came along and just completely wrecked me.
55:52 --> 55:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I'd tend to find mathematically up until that point and that was when I just said, no, sorry.
55:56 --> 55:58 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll leave it to Harry Selden and Gale Dornick.
55:59 --> 55:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we will.
55:59 --> 56:01 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's let them handle all the math for us.
56:01 --> 56:03 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll just talk about this show.
56:03 --> 56:06 [SPEAKER_00]: But first, let's take our second break and get right back to it.
56:26 --> 56:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you ready, Marilyn?
56:28 --> 56:28 [SPEAKER_00]: To go to Haven.
56:29 --> 56:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, interesting place.
56:31 --> 56:37 [SPEAKER_00]: The traders have established a stronghold on Haven and are preparing for a civil war using Imperial weapons.
56:38 --> 56:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Han Pritcher and another foundation or scout, uh, uh, sorry, another foundation or scout for proof of the Imperial collaboration.
56:48 --> 56:55 [SPEAKER_00]: They see a trade happen, but need to secure proof, conspots, randu malo, leader of the traders pick up the shipment.
56:57 --> 57:01 [SPEAKER_00]: The Foundationers chase Rando, but he gets away, and they flee to New Terminus.
57:02 --> 57:08 [SPEAKER_00]: The woman tries to kiss Han, but he holds up a necklace to stop her just in time to see and alert about the mule.
57:09 --> 57:16 [SPEAKER_00]: On New Terminus, Han requests permission to investigate the mule instead of the traders as he thinks they are distraction from his mutant abilities.
57:16 --> 57:25 [SPEAKER_00]: When Friture lashes out, Mayor Indberg suspends Han's privileges, wants privileges, but not before Han seals the leader's keys.
57:27 --> 57:29 [SPEAKER_00]: What did you think of Mayor Inber first of all?
57:30 --> 57:35 [SPEAKER_00]: That was honestly one of the parts of the episode that I didn't enjoy.
57:35 --> 57:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was a little over the top.
57:37 --> 57:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, he is absolutely spun on in terms of the book, Mayor Inber.
57:42 --> 57:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, really?
57:42 --> 57:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely.
57:44 --> 57:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I kind of want him to go, would you like a jelly, baby?
57:47 --> 57:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, from back there now.
57:49 --> 57:55 [SPEAKER_01]: No, his line, I am the foundation, you know, play Louis the Fourteenth.
57:56 --> 57:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's exactly...
57:59 --> 58:10 [SPEAKER_01]: the flavor that has come about by foundation and empire in terms of how the foundation has developed as a civilization.
58:11 --> 58:16 [SPEAKER_01]: You have these mayors that are a mayorful life and then it's a heritage position.
58:16 --> 58:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's no longer voted.
58:17 --> 58:19 [SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of authoritarianism.
58:20 --> 58:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Democracy is not very much an evidence.
58:24 --> 58:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought that they were very efficient about presenting all those ideas in this one person who is utterly obnoxious, but, you know, that's kind of old way, isn't it?
58:34 --> 58:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
58:34 --> 58:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And the same thing of, um, preacher insisting that the mule is the danger, and nobody believing him, or at least, you know, in Bernab, believing him.
58:47 --> 58:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And probably a lot of the foundation not believing him either.
58:52 --> 58:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Certainly thankfully they announced the cast for Mayor Amber, otherwise I wouldn't have known his name.
58:56 --> 59:00 [SPEAKER_00]: They're not they're not naming a lot of people in this like they didn't name the other foundation or with Han.
59:01 --> 59:04 [SPEAKER_01]: No and that makes me really wonder is this woman.
59:06 --> 59:13 [SPEAKER_01]: going to be beta, B, B, A, Y, T, A, who is one of my favorite characters in the whole series.
59:13 --> 59:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
59:14 --> 59:17 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just not sure how they're going to use it.
59:17 --> 59:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And of course they do the whole tease of, I have no idea what it is that Han has around his neck for the holds up to indicate that he is, he is, what, monogamous, committed.
59:29 --> 59:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a hybrid crystal.
59:30 --> 59:31 [SPEAKER_00]: You say he's a Jedi.
59:31 --> 59:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Who are you?
59:32 --> 59:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Can't confirm it.
59:34 --> 59:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Or he's a man, he's a monk or you know, who does?
59:37 --> 59:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
59:37 --> 59:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, the religious era is over though.
59:39 --> 59:41 [SPEAKER_00]: We can't, we can't have any more monks in the foundation.
59:42 --> 59:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, the religious era may be over in a lot of people's eyes, but that doesn't mean there aren't still people who are very religious.
59:47 --> 59:48 [SPEAKER_00]: That's true.
59:49 --> 59:49 [SPEAKER_00]: That's true.
59:50 --> 59:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But I didn't get the sense it was a religious thing, but maybe it was, you know, we'll find out.
59:54 --> 59:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it could be, you know, like a wedding ring, right?
59:57 --> 01:00:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It could be that the necklace is a symbol of marriage.
01:00:00 --> 01:00:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:00:01 --> 01:00:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:00:02 --> 01:00:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Who knows?
01:00:02 --> 01:00:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess we'll find out as we go along.
01:00:06 --> 01:00:08 [SPEAKER_00]: What do you think of this, this hot and cold planet?
01:00:08 --> 01:00:14 [SPEAKER_00]: This, this one side is, is it will burn you alive the other side using, and you're going to chase the moon.
01:00:15 --> 01:00:22 [SPEAKER_01]: They gave us this incredible visual representation of this remarkable concept straight from the books.
01:00:23 --> 01:00:33 [SPEAKER_01]: you know, a planet that had that it called a ribbon because it's a ribbon around the planet, which is the only safe zone, but within that safe zone, it is like a tropical paradise.
01:00:34 --> 01:00:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Hence, haven is the name of the planet.
01:00:36 --> 01:00:46 [SPEAKER_01]: But instead of having, you know, a lot of exposition explaining it, they just show you that they're situated bodies of the people who tripped over the line, they're got shoved over something.
01:00:46 --> 01:00:47 [SPEAKER_01]: That's crazy.
01:00:47 --> 01:00:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:00:48 --> 01:00:51 [SPEAKER_01]: The moon thing, I think, is original to this series.
01:00:51 --> 01:00:53 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember any of you mentioning that they chased them.
01:00:54 --> 01:01:01 [SPEAKER_01]: But it reminded me of the previous season when we had Harry Selden as a child on that planet.
01:01:03 --> 01:01:04 [SPEAKER_01]: which was so very close to the movement.
01:01:04 --> 01:01:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Those creatures could, the creatures could get out, pass them and then fly up to the movement because it was on one of its cycles in which it was very close.
01:01:12 --> 01:01:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And they had to do that for their own biological whatever.
01:01:16 --> 01:01:22 [SPEAKER_01]: So I thought it was another interesting way to depict plain, it's that are quite different from our own.
01:01:23 --> 01:01:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was great.
01:01:24 --> 01:01:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know, one of the criticisms I'm going to talk tonight, one of the criticisms of Star Wars that we see is that all these planets start to feel very semi, right?
01:01:33 --> 01:01:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
01:01:34 --> 01:01:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is one where this did not feel the same as anything I've ever seen in sci-fi.
01:01:39 --> 01:01:40 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I know.
01:01:41 --> 01:01:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I've not seen anything else like it anywhere either.
01:01:44 --> 01:01:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Very cool.
01:01:45 --> 01:01:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Very, very cool as a ribbon plant.
01:01:47 --> 01:01:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:01:48 --> 01:01:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I love this idea of like, don't get outside the safe zone or you're going to be done for.
01:01:53 --> 01:01:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Seriously.
01:01:54 --> 01:01:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And you asked the question, why is this not all cleaned up in me for it was just an amenity for the community?
01:01:59 --> 01:02:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I asked that.
01:02:02 --> 01:02:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I didn't.
01:02:03 --> 01:02:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't write that.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Who wrote this?
01:02:07 --> 01:02:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, but I didn't write that side did not write that side.
01:02:10 --> 01:02:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Who's been in our outline?
01:02:13 --> 01:02:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Could have been David.
01:02:14 --> 01:02:15 [SPEAKER_00]: He did watch this episode.
01:02:16 --> 01:02:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, OK.
01:02:16 --> 01:02:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, there you go.
01:02:17 --> 01:02:19 [SPEAKER_01]: He should have given us his initials.
01:02:19 --> 01:02:32 [SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, I think the simple answer is, it's, I mean, that amount of land, and otherwise, in habitable space, every single inch is precious.
01:02:34 --> 01:02:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And the people who are native there,
01:02:38 --> 01:02:44 [SPEAKER_01]: are not really going to be all that interested in having, you know, people were by the plants sort of coming as a sort of vacation spot.
01:02:45 --> 01:02:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Calgon was supposed to be the vacation island.
01:02:47 --> 01:02:59 [SPEAKER_01]: And I pronounce it Calgon because it reminds me of that came from back in the sixties for, I think it was a bath oil called Calgon.
01:03:00 --> 01:03:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And the tagline was Calgon, take me away.
01:03:04 --> 01:03:08 [SPEAKER_01]: how you're supposed to be luxuriating in this wonderful, you know, cyber-dick sort of thing.
01:03:08 --> 01:03:14 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's exactly what the planet Calgan is supposed to be if he has some horrible stuff.
01:03:14 --> 01:03:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
01:03:16 --> 01:03:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it's a false connection, but I just thought it was funny.
01:03:19 --> 01:03:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I like that.
01:03:21 --> 01:03:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I like, you know, make all the connections you want.
01:03:23 --> 01:03:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe they'll come together.
01:03:24 --> 01:03:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Remember, David Goyer came on our podcast to tell us that we were running about Marclay.
01:03:28 --> 01:03:30 [SPEAKER_00]: So, we got to do it.
01:03:30 --> 01:03:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not clinging to it the way you guys think to Marclay.
01:03:32 --> 01:03:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Listen, I didn't cling to Marclay at all.
01:03:34 --> 01:03:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't take any responsibility.
01:03:35 --> 01:03:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I beg your pardon.
01:03:37 --> 01:03:37 [SPEAKER_00]: I beg your pardon.
01:03:37 --> 01:03:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't beg.
01:03:39 --> 01:03:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't beg so.
01:03:40 --> 01:03:41 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, I say I beg your pardon for implying.
01:03:41 --> 01:03:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, okay.
01:03:42 --> 01:03:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
01:03:44 --> 01:03:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I'll be interested if any listeners remember that.
01:03:47 --> 01:03:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Add and add the same.
01:03:49 --> 01:03:50 [SPEAKER_00]: That was a very funny.
01:03:50 --> 01:03:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but no, I'm glad that David hooked on to Markle, because it got David Goyer to come on and tell us how wrong we were.
01:03:58 --> 01:03:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
01:03:59 --> 01:04:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you know, he had to set the record straight.
01:04:03 --> 01:04:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So I mentioned before that Randy Melopossibly, I just said enough, or we both mentioned somebody mentioned, a possible descendant of Hobart and were the constant.
01:04:12 --> 01:04:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And this character seems to be doing a stand-in
01:04:17 --> 01:04:28 [SPEAKER_01]: for one of the characters from the second volume in the series, but the one arm, and being a trader, trader, I have to pronounce it carefully, I think it's a trade tour.
01:04:31 --> 01:04:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So, again, they're kind of playing around with this, but I really, I'll be interested to see if this woman is supposed to be beta or not.
01:04:39 --> 01:04:41 [SPEAKER_01]: But they never gave us her name, so,
01:04:42 --> 01:04:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, maybe she was just a random person that the Rebellion Foundationers sent out.
01:04:46 --> 01:04:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that could be.
01:04:47 --> 01:04:50 [SPEAKER_01]: To Han, just say, okay, help him out to what he ever needs to have done.
01:04:51 --> 01:04:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, Han's got his own thing going on.
01:04:52 --> 01:04:54 [SPEAKER_00]: We're definitely going to see more Han.
01:04:54 --> 01:04:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And I enjoyed the pod racing, too.
01:04:55 --> 01:04:56 [SPEAKER_00]: That was very good.
01:04:57 --> 01:05:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes, and such a very short incident.
01:05:02 --> 01:05:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
01:05:03 --> 01:05:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And yet they put so much into it, so much greater.
01:05:06 --> 01:05:08 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the kind of the exposition we need, right?
01:05:08 --> 01:05:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It is.
01:05:09 --> 01:05:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
01:05:10 --> 01:05:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't tell me.
01:05:11 --> 01:05:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, and it's easier to do with some things than others, of course.
01:05:15 --> 01:05:20 [SPEAKER_01]: But, no, I thought this was a superb scene from the perspectives.
01:05:21 --> 01:05:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
01:05:23 --> 01:05:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we have no more candy from Mayor Inber.
01:05:25 --> 01:05:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's move on to Demosia.
01:05:28 --> 01:05:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Even that detail.
01:05:29 --> 01:05:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Even that detail wasn't the book.
01:05:31 --> 01:05:31 [SPEAKER_00]: That's funny.
01:05:31 --> 01:05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: But he had these different candies that he did.
01:05:33 --> 01:05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:05:34 --> 01:05:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I really like that whole thing a lot.
01:05:36 --> 01:05:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm played him really well by making pissing him off with all the candy stuff and then grabbing his jacket and, you know, plumbing the key.
01:05:46 --> 01:05:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Yep.
01:05:46 --> 01:05:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
01:05:48 --> 01:05:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Demosia is up next.
01:05:50 --> 01:05:51 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the last section here.
01:05:52 --> 01:06:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Illuminist priestess arrives to meet with Demerzel, who invited her under the pretense of meaning with Empire.
01:06:02 --> 01:06:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Demerzel tells her that she will only have her memories of these conversations, we'll have them on the way to a poisonous apple orchard.
01:06:12 --> 01:06:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Demerzel reveals herself to be a robot and expounds upon the three laws of robotics, as well as the Zira flaw to protect humanity above the individual.
01:06:22 --> 01:06:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Emrezel says the robots went to war with each other, and an important man was killed in the name of the zeroth law, ending things and leading her to become programmed to serve one person.
01:06:35 --> 01:06:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Emrezel shows the priestess the prime radiant from her chest, and says she thinks Harry seldom wanted her to see the end of empire.
01:06:43 --> 01:06:47 [SPEAKER_00]: She asked the priestess to help her decide what she is if she outlives empire.
01:06:51 --> 01:06:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, well, rich, rich, rich, rich with all kinds of metaphors here.
01:06:58 --> 01:07:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I say, I'm really glad that we're following up on this one.
01:07:01 --> 01:07:05 [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't see anything about the triple blessings last season.
01:07:05 --> 01:07:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I'm thrilled that we're back here again.
01:07:07 --> 01:07:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
01:07:08 --> 01:07:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:07:08 --> 01:07:16 [SPEAKER_00]: And we had this whole bit where Demerzel was going on the journey, just as Brother Day was, right?
01:07:16 --> 01:07:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
01:07:17 --> 01:07:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And Brother Day notably did not get a vision.
01:07:20 --> 01:07:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And we never knew if Kim Resell did or not, right?
01:07:23 --> 01:07:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:07:23 --> 01:07:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And the fact that massive numbers of people throughout the galaxy practice this religion, I'm wondering perhaps that it was not all that present on Trent Oran and in the Empire that it's core because it represented a very large power base.
01:07:43 --> 01:07:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:07:44 --> 01:07:46 [SPEAKER_01]: that could, very well seen you threatening.
01:07:46 --> 01:07:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why they were so upset when they said, I'm going to go to the central mother planet.
01:07:53 --> 01:07:57 [SPEAKER_01]: And see what I can do because there was politics going on.
01:07:57 --> 01:08:02 [SPEAKER_01]: The whole business of could, could empire have a soul because they were clones, I'm not.
01:08:03 --> 01:08:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:08:04 --> 01:08:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Quarter, quarter, quarter.
01:08:05 --> 01:08:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so in general.
01:08:09 --> 01:08:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm trying to remember, I think that Demosal,
01:08:13 --> 01:08:24 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I guess she didn't actually use the word fesser in the whole conversation, but that's exactly the function, I think, that she is asking this princess to take.
01:08:24 --> 01:08:25 [SPEAKER_00]: That's true.
01:08:25 --> 01:08:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Which again, humanizes this robot so much.
01:08:30 --> 01:08:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:08:30 --> 01:08:33 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, do robots need advice?
01:08:34 --> 01:08:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Do robots worry about their deeds and their things they do and don't do?
01:08:40 --> 01:08:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it was stated here that for the first time, there will be a temple of illuminists established on territory.
01:08:48 --> 01:08:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:08:49 --> 01:08:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So I may have gotten that wrong.
01:08:51 --> 01:08:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's right.
01:08:52 --> 01:08:53 [SPEAKER_00]: At least in this era, right?
01:08:54 --> 01:08:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, at least in this era.
01:08:55 --> 01:08:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:08:56 --> 01:08:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:08:56 --> 01:09:00 [SPEAKER_01]: But it was just replete with a mythic and religious symbolism.
01:09:01 --> 01:09:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Particularly the tree, you know, you have this tree with literal golden apples.
01:09:06 --> 01:09:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Better poison.
01:09:07 --> 01:09:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Foreigned by the fluids of the executed robots.
01:09:10 --> 01:09:12 [SPEAKER_01]: They were poisonous to humans.
01:09:12 --> 01:09:17 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm reminded of the golden ass apples of the Hezbrus Garden in Greek mythology.
01:09:18 --> 01:09:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So maybe the dragon is now in the apples.
01:09:21 --> 01:09:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Can you tell us that myth?
01:09:23 --> 01:09:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's more of an image than anything.
01:09:26 --> 01:09:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it was the gift, the wedding gift of Zeus to Hera.
01:09:31 --> 01:09:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's an app.
01:09:32 --> 01:09:33 [SPEAKER_01]: It's an apple tree.
01:09:33 --> 01:09:38 [SPEAKER_01]: The apples are golden and it has a dragon wound around the trunk to guard it.
01:09:39 --> 01:09:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Or is Demer's Elva dragon?
01:09:41 --> 01:09:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, she's been the guardian of this empire thing for a long time.
01:09:45 --> 01:09:51 [SPEAKER_01]: And yet, you know, the golden apples are produced from the dead bodies of her fellow beings.
01:09:53 --> 01:09:57 [SPEAKER_01]: So, just layer upon layer upon layer, possible interpretation.
01:09:58 --> 01:10:15 [SPEAKER_01]: And then, of course, we have from the Tanakh, from the Thronehive Testament, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, and dimmer cells about to offer our large amount of information to the luminous priestess of the good and evil, done by both humans and robots.
01:10:16 --> 01:10:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know,
01:10:20 --> 01:10:25 [SPEAKER_01]: trying to eat from this tree wound up not working out too well for anybody.
01:10:26 --> 01:10:30 [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, is this going to be a good thing or a bad thing?
01:10:31 --> 01:10:32 [SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if it's a good thing.
01:10:32 --> 01:10:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if I
01:10:38 --> 01:10:53 [SPEAKER_00]: the precess what was your name uh... the laris i did not catch it all well we'll figure this out next next time really miss yeah when we get some titles will figure this out uh... i wonder if she's going to be chasing the lost time
01:10:54 --> 01:10:58 [SPEAKER_00]: if she's going to be trying to figure out what memories are deleted when she's not remember.
01:10:58 --> 01:11:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because we do know that there's at least one planet in the galaxy that has figured out how to do that.
01:11:03 --> 01:11:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the planet to which the day of the dawn of that time and Sarah, the ruler that planet escaped to.
01:11:12 --> 01:11:17 [SPEAKER_00]: And I also wonder is if she figures out that she went to this orchard,
01:11:17 --> 01:11:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is not something I've seen.
01:11:19 --> 01:11:20 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm not like watching a head and spoiling it.
01:11:20 --> 01:11:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
01:11:21 --> 01:11:22 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no.
01:11:22 --> 01:11:26 [SPEAKER_00]: But I wonder if she's going to get back to that orchard because she figured out that she was there.
01:11:27 --> 01:11:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe she leaves bread crumbs or something.
01:11:31 --> 01:11:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And she eats an apple because you can't remember that they're poisonous.
01:11:36 --> 01:11:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll tell her within this conversation that's erased.
01:11:38 --> 01:11:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Interesting.
01:11:40 --> 01:11:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Interesting.
01:11:43 --> 01:11:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's a lot you can do with this.
01:11:45 --> 01:11:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, it's a brilliant, brilliant concept and completely foreign to the books to the best of my knowledge.
01:11:52 --> 01:11:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't, I haven't read all the robot series, I've read none of the, the other one.
01:11:57 --> 01:12:00 [SPEAKER_01]: but it's definitely not in the Foundation series book.
01:12:02 --> 01:12:05 [SPEAKER_01]: But as you mentioned, we're returning to the conflict for a stress from season one.
01:12:06 --> 01:12:13 [SPEAKER_01]: We have Demersel, a robot, is a firm follower of the luminous and the luminous themselves, be her in that light.
01:12:14 --> 01:12:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Even though most would say that she has no soul, and all including herself would say that she's not human.
01:12:23 --> 01:12:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So, they're really playing with this borderline thing, which throughout the entire foundation series, as above also does.
01:12:33 --> 01:12:37 [SPEAKER_01]: So, do you want to go through the robotic laws?
01:12:37 --> 01:12:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Just so people know what they are, there might be some listeners who not think counted those before.
01:12:40 --> 01:12:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Marilyn, congratulations.
01:12:42 --> 01:12:45 [SPEAKER_00]: You've just invented the positronic brain.
01:12:45 --> 01:12:48 [SPEAKER_00]: What's the first thing that you tell the robot?
01:12:49 --> 01:12:55 [SPEAKER_01]: a robot may not injure a human being or through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
01:12:56 --> 01:13:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Rule number two, a robot must obey the orders given it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the first law.
01:13:05 --> 01:13:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Number three, a robot must protect its own existence, as long as such protection does not conflict with the first or second law.
01:13:14 --> 01:13:15 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's all, you know, pretty straightforward.
01:13:16 --> 01:13:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, hierarchical.
01:13:19 --> 01:13:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, making, making, you know, either were decisions quite clear, you know, the zeros and the ones, you know, it's, you know, it's, you know, it's well, binary and it's clear until Demmerzell says it got really complicated.
01:13:31 --> 01:13:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Because they had the introduction of zeroes law.
01:13:35 --> 01:13:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Survival of humanity must be prioritized over the survival of any one human to which the priestess responds, you recognize the greater good.
01:13:47 --> 01:13:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I say something?
01:13:49 --> 01:13:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought I took it as zero-thlaw was to combat the complication.
01:13:57 --> 01:14:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Was that there were too many complications with figuring out what hurts an individual human so they added this above it.
01:14:03 --> 01:14:05 [SPEAKER_01]: That could be, as I say, I've never read the robot.
01:14:06 --> 01:14:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm not taking it from that.
01:14:07 --> 01:14:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm taking this from the dialogue.
01:14:08 --> 01:14:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was what I was saying, but I maybe I misread it.
01:14:12 --> 01:14:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm misunderstanding what she's trying to say.
01:14:15 --> 01:14:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I just took it as, you know, after existing for thousands of years with the first three, they found they realized, well, wait a minute, what about this conflict that, you know, often times the survival of the Lord.
01:14:30 --> 01:14:35 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the classic spock thing, you know, the needs of the many outweighs, the needs of the few, or the one.
01:14:35 --> 01:14:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:14:36 --> 01:14:39 [SPEAKER_01]: At the same time, that phrase, the greater good,
01:14:41 --> 01:14:43 [SPEAKER_01]: has been used in a lot of negative ways.
01:14:43 --> 01:14:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm thinking now particularly of the Harry Potter series.
01:14:47 --> 01:14:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Or, it's just a real world.
01:14:49 --> 01:14:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And, well, of course, the real world, yeah, absolutely.
01:14:53 --> 01:14:57 [SPEAKER_01]: So, is recognized in the greater good, a good thing?
01:14:57 --> 01:14:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Or a bad thing.
01:14:58 --> 01:14:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:14:59 --> 01:15:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And I loved how Timmer so complains about hard, how hard her task is.
01:15:04 --> 01:15:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And she says, you humans seem to want extinction.
01:15:10 --> 01:15:10 [SPEAKER_00]: We're only good at that.
01:15:11 --> 01:15:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, maybe if you're given.
01:15:15 --> 01:15:29 [SPEAKER_01]: She's looking at, you know, eons upon eons upon eons of time with these first three laws and things becoming more and more and more complex, which I guess is sort of the general trend of human development anyway.
01:15:31 --> 01:15:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And then the zero of law comes along and they hope that it's going to make it better and they're dealing with ethical questions now.
01:15:40 --> 01:15:42 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not the simple ones of zeros anymore.
01:15:43 --> 01:15:47 [SPEAKER_01]: They're asking for judgment, evaluation.
01:15:48 --> 01:15:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're getting kind of close to the squishy edge of a few many kinds of things.
01:15:56 --> 01:16:00 [SPEAKER_01]: And the priest has asked her why did Selden give you an apple?
01:16:00 --> 01:16:04 [SPEAKER_01]: You cannot eat, meaning the priority.
01:16:05 --> 01:16:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And then there's a replies, he wanted me to see the end of empire.
01:16:11 --> 01:16:13 [SPEAKER_01]: which is what has projected her own crisis.
01:16:13 --> 01:16:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:16:14 --> 01:16:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Because she says, I do not know what I am without empire.
01:16:20 --> 01:16:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And this slide be to his speculation.
01:16:22 --> 01:16:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Perhaps, Vault Harry wished to introduce uncertainty into Denver's own.
01:16:27 --> 01:16:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Recognizing her is the most difficult opponent in the end, because of her fierce desire to maintain empire.
01:16:36 --> 01:16:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm.
01:16:37 --> 01:16:38 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think?
01:16:38 --> 01:16:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's probably right.
01:16:40 --> 01:16:47 [SPEAKER_00]: This this weekend's demos all because if she gets into a stage of acceptance, she'll fight less.
01:16:48 --> 01:16:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:16:48 --> 01:16:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:16:49 --> 01:16:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I think you're absolutely right with that.
01:16:50 --> 01:16:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's a really great read there.
01:16:52 --> 01:16:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's interesting that Volt Harry can't even zero it on that himself.
01:16:58 --> 01:16:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:16:58 --> 01:17:01 [SPEAKER_00]: He's not even that quite quite that chore.
01:17:01 --> 01:17:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Seems like.
01:17:02 --> 01:17:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Or do you think he is sure?
01:17:04 --> 01:17:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
01:17:04 --> 01:17:05 [SPEAKER_00]: What?
01:17:05 --> 01:17:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Why he gave her the primary
01:17:09 --> 01:17:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I know, I'm not.
01:17:10 --> 01:17:14 [SPEAKER_01]: This was the first time I came up with an explanation that seemed even vaguely possible.
01:17:14 --> 01:17:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I like that.
01:17:17 --> 01:17:20 [SPEAKER_00]: He gave her knowledge as a weapon, but against her.
01:17:21 --> 01:17:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Which is exactly what the apples of the knowledge of good and evil were all about.
01:17:26 --> 01:17:29 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm back to all my deep mythic resonances here.
01:17:29 --> 01:17:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It's really, really quite extraordinary.
01:17:32 --> 01:17:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I could, I'm trying to remember how much she actually knew about Deborah Zo.
01:17:40 --> 01:17:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, or how we eventually heard more about it.
01:17:42 --> 01:17:45 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know how Voltaire gets his news, right?
01:17:45 --> 01:17:45 [SPEAKER_01]: So I guess.
01:17:46 --> 01:17:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:17:46 --> 01:17:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I think he just knew that himself was a robot because he, um, he, he controlled all the molecules within his vault, right?
01:17:54 --> 01:17:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And she was in the vault.
01:17:55 --> 01:17:58 [SPEAKER_00]: So he could sense, she was part of Toronto.
01:17:58 --> 01:17:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:17:58 --> 01:17:59 [SPEAKER_00]: She was not, he human.
01:17:59 --> 01:17:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
01:17:59 --> 01:17:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
01:17:59 --> 01:18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
01:18:00 --> 01:18:01 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
01:18:01 --> 01:18:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's when he hands it over to him in his place.
01:18:03 --> 01:18:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah.
01:18:05 --> 01:18:08 [SPEAKER_01]: But the priestess characterizes it in exactly those terms.
01:18:09 --> 01:18:10 [SPEAKER_01]: He gave you an apple.
01:18:10 --> 01:18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: He gave you a temptation.
01:18:12 --> 01:18:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
01:18:12 --> 01:18:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Demousel is now in the place of Eve.
01:18:16 --> 01:18:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And she's eating the apple.
01:18:17 --> 01:18:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Who's Adam?
01:18:20 --> 01:18:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Empire?
01:18:22 --> 01:18:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Or Selden.
01:18:24 --> 01:18:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I think Empire is the thing that's going to be brought down.
01:18:27 --> 01:18:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
01:18:29 --> 01:18:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I just meant the two to populate the earth.
01:18:32 --> 01:18:37 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the humans of Selden and the robots of Demousel.
01:18:37 --> 01:18:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, in a way, the two are definitely invested in the future of humanity.
01:18:42 --> 01:18:47 [SPEAKER_01]: They just have extremely different ideas about how to bring that up, right?
01:18:47 --> 01:18:51 [SPEAKER_01]: But they're both using mathematics.
01:18:52 --> 01:18:54 [SPEAKER_01]: They're both using the binary system.
01:18:54 --> 01:18:56 [SPEAKER_01]: They're both using the zeros and the ones.
01:18:56 --> 01:18:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's really, really fascinating to me.
01:19:01 --> 01:19:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So, a speculation I had will dimmer as well becomes susceptible
01:19:05 --> 01:19:08 [SPEAKER_01]: to the meal because she has become so human.
01:19:09 --> 01:19:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I like that idea a lot.
01:19:12 --> 01:19:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if it'll work.
01:19:16 --> 01:19:31 [SPEAKER_00]: That was the whole thing last season because we weren't sure if incarnation Harry, the one with Gail was a robot or if he was a human and then the men tats worked on him so we assumed human and probably so because he can be in cryosleep.
01:19:33 --> 01:19:36 [SPEAKER_00]: but yeah, I don't know.
01:19:36 --> 01:19:37 [SPEAKER_00]: It would be very cool if she could.
01:19:38 --> 01:19:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And yet, do I remember correctly from the previous season that when they were inside their ship on the ship?
01:19:47 --> 01:19:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I said, Manhattan.
01:19:47 --> 01:19:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I said, Manhattan is mentality.
01:19:49 --> 01:19:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Sorry.
01:19:49 --> 01:19:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
01:19:50 --> 01:20:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, I'm too, too, I'm too, I'm
01:20:03 --> 01:20:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't recall that.
01:20:05 --> 01:20:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so I guess I know that the person they were looking at initially did not scan correctly as the person that he was in person.
01:20:16 --> 01:20:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well, we'll leave that for now.
01:20:19 --> 01:20:31 [SPEAKER_01]: And then my other question will vault Harry turn Ebbling Miss toward the truth about the meal in order to correctly anomaly and help with the plan back online once more.
01:20:32 --> 01:20:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think Harry knows about the meal.
01:20:37 --> 01:20:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think Voltaire knows about the meal at all.
01:20:41 --> 01:20:43 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the meal is an anomaly.
01:20:44 --> 01:20:47 [SPEAKER_00]: And this cell doesn't have to not have sources out of it, right?
01:20:47 --> 01:20:49 [SPEAKER_00]: He didn't know that Empire was holding on.
01:20:50 --> 01:20:51 [SPEAKER_00]: He had to be told that by Evelyn Mess.
01:20:51 --> 01:20:53 [SPEAKER_00]: He's the one who's included.
01:20:54 --> 01:20:55 [SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
01:20:56 --> 01:21:00 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think if anything, Evelyn Miss goes, hey, this seems bad.
01:21:00 --> 01:21:01 [SPEAKER_00]: What do we do?
01:21:02 --> 01:21:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's coming along in the future, I think.
01:21:05 --> 01:21:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably.
01:21:06 --> 01:21:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So, I won't give a new spoilers.
01:21:10 --> 01:21:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
01:21:11 --> 01:21:12 [SPEAKER_00]: No book spoilers here.
01:21:13 --> 01:21:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's keep it clean, Marilyn.
01:21:15 --> 01:21:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I always do my best to keep it clean, John.
01:21:20 --> 01:21:21 [SPEAKER_01]: With varying levels of success.
01:21:21 --> 01:21:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's the episode.
01:21:23 --> 01:21:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, great first episode.
01:21:25 --> 01:21:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought I'm really excited for the rest of them.
01:21:29 --> 01:21:30 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to be recording these ahead of time.
01:21:30 --> 01:21:32 [SPEAKER_00]: So you should be getting them the day.
01:21:32 --> 01:21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I think embargo ends at like three a.m.
01:21:36 --> 01:21:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Eastern time on the Fridays after the episode launches.
01:21:39 --> 01:21:45 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll probably post about six like we usually do on on Fridays, you know?
01:21:46 --> 01:21:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, bless you for being awake and breaded and wish you tell that early in the morning.
01:21:49 --> 01:21:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not awake.
01:21:50 --> 01:21:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I, I just, I, you said it a lot.
01:21:53 --> 01:21:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll be programmed.
01:21:54 --> 01:21:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll pay true.
01:21:54 --> 01:21:55 [SPEAKER_00]: I posted it at that time.
01:21:55 --> 01:21:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I told Red Circle to posted it at that time.
01:21:57 --> 01:21:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:21:58 --> 01:21:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:22:01 --> 01:22:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, so yeah, please, please write into.
01:22:05 --> 01:22:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Found it.
01:22:06 --> 01:22:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's not a foundation.
01:22:06 --> 01:22:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, it's empire at thelorhounds.com because we're empire.
01:22:10 --> 01:22:11 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to fall at some point.
01:22:12 --> 01:22:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, please.
01:22:15 --> 01:22:17 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm just joking.
01:22:17 --> 01:22:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
01:22:18 --> 01:22:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I David said up this one.
01:22:19 --> 01:22:21 [SPEAKER_00]: So you'll have to ask him why he made us empire at the lowerhouse.com.
01:22:22 --> 01:22:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, maybe to distinguish between the two seasons.
01:22:25 --> 01:22:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe.
01:22:26 --> 01:22:29 [SPEAKER_01]: One season was about foundation and now this one's about empire.
01:22:29 --> 01:22:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, he said this up last season.
01:22:32 --> 01:22:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, well, last season empire at the lowerhouse.com.
01:22:35 --> 01:22:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Send us emails if you want to get things read on air and we will read feedback on air once we get a quorum around mid-season.
01:22:42 --> 01:22:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and it'll be a lot of fun.
01:22:44 --> 01:22:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I always love hearing what listeners have, say anything.
01:22:48 --> 01:22:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
01:22:48 --> 01:22:51 [SPEAKER_00]: And you could also just go on to the discord and chat with people.
01:22:51 --> 01:22:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody has a good time chatting on the discord.
01:22:53 --> 01:23:01 [SPEAKER_00]: And we've got episode by episode, siloed channel so that you don't have to get spoiled for the next episode if you're not caught up or something like that.
01:23:02 --> 01:23:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
01:23:03 --> 01:23:08 [SPEAKER_01]: And now I have to wait ten more days before there's any possibility of anybody posting on the spoiler.
01:23:09 --> 01:23:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, I know.
01:23:10 --> 01:23:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't wait to hear a people think about it.
01:23:11 --> 01:23:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Recording this quite early.
01:23:13 --> 01:23:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we are well out of necessity.
01:23:15 --> 01:23:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, right.
01:23:16 --> 01:23:18 [SPEAKER_01]: The blessing and the curse of screeners.
01:23:18 --> 01:23:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:23:21 --> 01:23:24 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, well, please check out the affiliates.
01:23:25 --> 01:23:29 [SPEAKER_00]: We have rings and rituals as you are aware Maryland because you host it.
01:23:29 --> 01:23:32 [SPEAKER_00]: If you want us to ring the power content go over there.
01:23:33 --> 01:23:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Please check out the radioactive ramlings podcast.
01:23:37 --> 01:23:39 [SPEAKER_00]: They are doing Fallout lore.
01:23:40 --> 01:23:45 [SPEAKER_00]: And they're doing, I think they're doing more red rising soon, but don't quote me on that.
01:23:45 --> 01:23:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Go to their feed and you can find out more about what they're doing, but fall out lower for sure ahead of the season two in December.
01:23:53 --> 01:23:56 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll shift to us, at least you just started a Purdue series.
01:23:57 --> 01:23:58 [SPEAKER_00]: It's been coming a long time.
01:23:58 --> 01:23:59 [SPEAKER_00]: She's started it.
01:23:59 --> 01:24:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Go check that out.
01:24:00 --> 01:24:06 [SPEAKER_00]: If you like foundation, you probably like doing to get into it and have a good time.
01:24:06 --> 01:24:07 [SPEAKER_00]: There's similar worlds.
01:24:08 --> 01:24:10 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very different stories in a little world.
01:24:11 --> 01:24:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
01:24:12 --> 01:24:14 [SPEAKER_01]: But you can definitely see how
01:24:15 --> 01:24:17 [SPEAKER_01]: the one led into the other.
01:24:17 --> 01:24:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
01:24:18 --> 01:24:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And check out Alicia Star Wars.
01:24:19 --> 01:24:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I tell my podcast too?
01:24:20 --> 01:24:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you're at it.
01:24:21 --> 01:24:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Probably Howard movie review is doing bacon wrapped.
01:24:25 --> 01:24:31 [SPEAKER_00]: This is a Kevin Bacon peamed season where they're covering a bunch of movies related to Kevin Bacon.
01:24:31 --> 01:24:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And I still don't fully understand how they did their draft.
01:24:34 --> 01:24:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So go listen to their draft episode if you want to find out how they pick the movies.
01:24:38 --> 01:24:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Really funny stuff over there.
01:24:39 --> 01:24:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So go listen to them.
01:24:41 --> 01:24:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But what I want to know is are they going to talk about bacon donuts?
01:24:45 --> 01:24:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
01:24:46 --> 01:24:48 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll have to, you'll have to listen, Marilyn.
01:24:48 --> 01:24:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
01:24:49 --> 01:24:49 [SPEAKER_01]: It is true.
01:24:50 --> 01:24:51 [SPEAKER_00]: I never run the music.
01:24:51 --> 01:24:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Every Tuesday, they've got a new episode about psychology and music together.
01:24:55 --> 01:24:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a lovely listen.
01:24:56 --> 01:24:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Please go check out Mark and Nicole over there on that feed.
01:25:01 --> 01:25:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, and on the lower-downs feed, we're wrapping up murder bots.
01:25:04 --> 01:25:10 [SPEAKER_00]: So the murder bot finale happens at the same time as, uh, or like right before the foundation premiere.
01:25:10 --> 01:25:12 [SPEAKER_00]: So the same day as the foundation premiere.
01:25:13 --> 01:25:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, we have screened just for that too.
01:25:14 --> 01:25:15 [SPEAKER_00]: So they're both coming out in the same day.
01:25:15 --> 01:25:16 [SPEAKER_00]: So all good.
01:25:17 --> 01:25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:25:17 --> 01:25:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but so for the watchers, the watchers are good.
01:25:21 --> 01:25:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, murder bots a twenty minute episode.
01:25:23 --> 01:25:24 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's right.
01:25:24 --> 01:25:25 [SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
01:25:25 --> 01:25:25 [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
01:25:25 --> 01:25:25 [SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
01:25:25 --> 01:25:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I still haven't managed to get around to that one yet.
01:25:27 --> 01:25:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And I do want to.
01:25:28 --> 01:25:30 [SPEAKER_00]: But you're going to watch murder bot?
01:25:31 --> 01:25:32 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought he said it was.
01:25:34 --> 01:25:35 [SPEAKER_00]: It gets a little gory sometimes.
01:25:36 --> 01:25:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's funny though.
01:25:38 --> 01:25:39 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very funny.
01:25:39 --> 01:25:41 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see.
01:25:41 --> 01:25:43 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a comedy, but it's it's definitely a little gory sometimes.
01:25:43 --> 01:25:44 [SPEAKER_00]: It is called murder bot, you know?
01:25:45 --> 01:25:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'd never even had Chen finish the final season of Doctor Who.
01:25:50 --> 01:25:51 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm way behind him.
01:25:51 --> 01:25:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to check it out.
01:25:52 --> 01:25:53 [SPEAKER_00]: You got to check it out.
01:25:53 --> 01:25:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I know I do.
01:25:54 --> 01:25:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I know.
01:25:54 --> 01:25:55 [SPEAKER_01]: And I want to.
01:25:55 --> 01:25:56 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not that I didn't like it or anything.
01:25:56 --> 01:25:59 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just serious.
01:25:59 --> 01:26:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Keep on happening, John.
01:26:01 --> 01:26:01 [SPEAKER_01]: What can you do?
01:26:02 --> 01:26:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I know David's got Ellie and Earth coverage coming.
01:26:05 --> 01:26:10 [SPEAKER_00]: But right now, you can actually check out some coverage from Alicia on what's the new Marvel show.
01:26:12 --> 01:26:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, um, yeah.
01:26:14 --> 01:26:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I heard hard.
01:26:15 --> 01:26:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I heard hard.
01:26:16 --> 01:26:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
01:26:16 --> 01:26:18 [SPEAKER_00]: My brain's not working tonight.
01:26:18 --> 01:26:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not caught up on Marvel right now.
01:26:19 --> 01:26:21 [SPEAKER_00]: But I earn hard at least just covering that with a John.
01:26:21 --> 01:26:24 [SPEAKER_00]: So you could check all that out over there.
01:26:24 --> 01:26:24 [SPEAKER_00]: We also did.
01:26:25 --> 01:26:27 [SPEAKER_01]: It's another series that I want to catch up on.
01:26:27 --> 01:26:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, they did three episodes at a time for that one.
01:26:29 --> 01:26:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Why are they doing that?
01:26:31 --> 01:26:32 [SPEAKER_01]: God's bless.
01:26:32 --> 01:26:33 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
01:26:33 --> 01:26:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we can't stop them.
01:26:34 --> 01:26:37 [SPEAKER_00]: These streamers are just just beating us down with all this content.
01:26:38 --> 01:26:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm telling you, maybe they hope we'll stop.
01:26:43 --> 01:26:46 [SPEAKER_01]: No way, we bring good things to them.
01:26:46 --> 01:26:47 [SPEAKER_01]: We bring in listeners.
01:26:47 --> 01:26:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, the podcast you're saying.
01:26:49 --> 01:26:50 [SPEAKER_00]: They're trying to get the best.
01:26:51 --> 01:26:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, who knows who knows.
01:26:55 --> 01:27:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, yeah, and check out the subscriber episodes if you want to get on the Patreon or Supercast.
01:27:00 --> 01:27:08 [SPEAKER_00]: We just did a Wes Anderson film fest with the Isle of Dogs and the Royal Ten and Bombs really fun episode to do with Alicia and David.
01:27:09 --> 01:27:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And we're doing Velkilmer this month.
01:27:11 --> 01:27:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I think Willow is in the lead right now.
01:27:13 --> 01:27:19 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're a subscriber, make sure you vote on what movie we're covering this month so that you get your say.
01:27:20 --> 01:27:20 [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
01:27:20 --> 01:27:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to thank everybody now.
01:27:24 --> 01:27:28 [SPEAKER_00]: our Discord server boosters, which are if I can scroll fast enough.
01:27:29 --> 01:27:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Herring Kay, Tila Vithriller, Dork of the Ninjas, Duv-Siviny-One, Athena A, Tina Lestu, Nancy M. Ghost of Partition and Radioactive Richard, and our lore masters, Samarshan, Michael G, Michelle E, Brian P. S. C. Peter O'Leach, Adam S. Nancy M. Duv-Siviny-One, Brian D. D. D. D. D. D. D. D. D. D. D. D. Frederick H. Sarah L. Garath, C. Matthew M. Sarah M. Andrby, Kwong Yu, Jedi Jedi Bob,
01:27:51 --> 01:27:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Nathan T. Alex V. Sub-Zero, Aaron K. Daly V. Mothership, Sixty-One, NARS.
01:27:58 --> 01:28:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Kathy W. Lestu, Jeffrey B. Elisee, you.
01:28:02 --> 01:28:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Neil F. Ben B. Scott F. Steven N. Julia F. Collie S. Ilmariel.
01:28:07 --> 01:28:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Forward slash Tim.
01:28:09 --> 01:28:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Paul K. Bobby C. and Audrey Han.
01:28:12 --> 01:28:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, everybody.
01:28:14 --> 01:28:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
01:28:14 --> 01:28:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so much fun to hear names that are now recognizable from conversations on the discord.
01:28:19 --> 01:28:19 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, right?
01:28:19 --> 01:28:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody's around now.
01:28:21 --> 01:28:21 [SPEAKER_00]: It's great.
01:28:22 --> 01:28:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Get on the discord.
01:28:22 --> 01:28:23 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a fun time.
01:28:23 --> 01:28:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And everybody's welcome.
01:28:24 --> 01:28:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Not just the subscribers.
01:28:26 --> 01:28:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
01:28:26 --> 01:28:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks everybody for listening.
01:28:28 --> 01:28:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Fun season of foundation ahead Maryland.
01:28:30 --> 01:28:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.
01:28:31 --> 01:28:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.
01:28:31 --> 01:28:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Can't wait.
01:28:32 --> 01:28:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for having me as your co-host, John.
01:28:34 --> 01:28:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And thank you, everyone, who's supporting us.
01:28:36 --> 01:28:38 [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll look forward to your emails.
01:28:39 --> 01:28:39 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see you next week.
01:28:40 --> 01:28:43 [SPEAKER_00]: The Lower Hound's podcast is produced in published by the Lower Hounds.
01:28:44 --> 01:28:49 [SPEAKER_00]: You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at the LowerHounds.com slash contact.
01:28:50 --> 01:28:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Get early and add free access to all Lower Hound's podcasts at patreon.com slash the Lower Hounds.
01:28:55 --> 01:29:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any employers or other entities.
01:29:01 --> 01:29:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for listening.