House of the Dragon - S02E07 - The Red Sowing

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[00:01:15] Welcome to the House of the Hounds. We are the Lorehounds, your guides to the Dance of the Dragons. I'm John.

[00:01:21] And I'm David. And this is our coverage of the HBO original series House of the Dragon, Season 2, Episode 7, titled The Red Sowing.

[00:01:31] Sowing. Sowing. Sowing, not Sowing. Sowing?

[00:01:34] Well, it's not a great title, I'm gonna be honest with you.

[00:01:37] And Alicia pointed out this is in the book. I totally forgot it was even in the book because they had another much better name in the book for the same event,

[00:01:45] which was called The Sowing of the Seeds, like The Sowing of the Dragon Seeds.

[00:01:49] Oh, I like that, yeah. Much better name. Showrunners.

[00:01:52] Just, it's not The Red Wedding. You're not gonna make it The Red Wedding. Let's move on.

[00:01:56] We're gonna start off with our hot takes for the episode before we get into a scene-by-scene breakdown.

[00:02:02] And they were hot, that is for sure. We have started to record a second podcast just for our feedback,

[00:02:09] because y'all are writing in so much. Hand of the Pod, our helpful Nancy M., who has been helping out with our feedback,

[00:02:19] she's on the other end of the email. You can send those emails to hotd at thelorehounds.com.

[00:02:26] You can also go to our contact page on our website, and there you can use a contact form or send us in a voicemail.

[00:02:33] I don't think we have any voicemails this week.

[00:02:35] Um, not yet.

[00:02:37] Not yet.

[00:02:38] Not yet.

[00:02:38] Uh, but all of those go to Nancy, and Nancy organizes them into a supremely well-organized document

[00:02:45] that we use to record our feedback. And we're probably gonna record that this week, uh, Thursday, I think, John?

[00:02:50] Was that our, our plan?

[00:02:52] I think so. That sounds good to me.

[00:02:54] Okay.

[00:02:54] So you've got until, like, Thursday afternoon-ish to send in your feedback.

[00:02:58] Support the community on Supercast or Patreon, join the conversation on Discord,

[00:03:01] and take a listen to our affiliate podcast. You can find all those links in the show notes via the link tree.

[00:03:08] John, how is the show guide going? This, uh, we're getting close to the end here.

[00:03:14] I know, I know. Not much more to add. Although today, I had to do a lot of moving around.

[00:03:18] Because we had some changing allegiances. We had a Kingsguard that we finally got a name for,

[00:03:23] you know, a bunch of stuff like that. Although, I wasn't sure where to put some people. Like,

[00:03:28] are the Brosguard still teams green?

[00:03:31] Right.

[00:03:31] Although, they don't even have show guide entries because they don't have names.

[00:03:33] Right.

[00:03:34] Uh, but, uh, yeah, I don't know. I don't know.

[00:03:36] So, if you're just dropping in at this stage for Episode 7 and you're wondering,

[00:03:40] what is the show guide thing that these guys are talking about?

[00:03:42] We use a platform called Notion, and it's a really cool kind of database application thing

[00:03:48] that does a lot of formatting for you.

[00:03:50] Retweet us, you corporate cowards.

[00:03:52] And you can click a button, and it makes a webpage live, a webpage version of it alive.

[00:03:58] So, we can update information and what John and Brian and Aaron have put together is a really comprehensive guide to Seasons 1.

[00:04:09] And you were helping today.

[00:04:10] I was doing a little bit on the margins of everything that's going on.

[00:04:15] And we do episode breakdowns.

[00:04:18] We have a dragon bestiary.

[00:04:20] We have a character guide.

[00:04:23] So, you can see who all the different characters are, and you can click on their entries, and you see all this information,

[00:04:28] who their siblings are, who they're married to, all kinds of great stuff.

[00:04:32] And it's just a really cool tool to help keep track of all this stuff that Gurm is like.

[00:04:38] No, it can't be ADAM.

[00:04:41] It's got to be ADDAM, right?

[00:04:42] But you can find out who the actor is and all that kind of stuff.

[00:04:45] So, it's a super helpful, non-spoilery resource.

[00:04:50] You don't have to go out on the internet and Google for something and find out all the secrets.

[00:04:55] Not the secrets, but the things that you don't want to know just yet.

[00:04:59] We'll get spoiled for you.

[00:05:01] Yes, exactly.

[00:05:02] Anyway, so, you get that if you're a subscriber, and you get that if you're a season pass holder or if you're a regular subscriber.

[00:05:11] Oh, yeah.

[00:05:12] And the season pass, of course, is a trade-off, as I put it last week.

[00:05:17] You know, if you're a regular subscriber, we love having you, and we love having you regularly.

[00:05:21] And so, with that recurring subscription, you get all of our early and ad-free podcasts about every show that we do.

[00:05:27] If you just want House of the Dragon content, and you don't want recurring billing, you can give us $10 one time and have just this season and last season of House of the Dragon content.

[00:05:40] It is, I think, a very good deal.

[00:05:42] It's a very good deal.

[00:05:43] And shout out to all the season pass holders.

[00:05:45] We are really happy with the product.

[00:05:47] We hope that you are happy with it.

[00:05:49] We got a lot of subscriptions.

[00:05:51] It's a thumbs up.

[00:05:52] It's a green.

[00:05:53] So, I think we're going to do season pass for Rings of Power.

[00:05:56] Right?

[00:05:57] I think we've tapped into some kind of resistance attitude toward subscriptions.

[00:06:02] Yeah.

[00:06:02] I think we're all getting nickel and dime to death.

[00:06:04] Oh, yeah.

[00:06:05] I'm completely on board.

[00:06:06] I get it.

[00:06:07] I get it.

[00:06:08] But I'm also very grateful for being a person who people pay for a recurring subscription for.

[00:06:12] So, I can't talk it down too much.

[00:06:15] You're right.

[00:06:15] We want both.

[00:06:17] Stick around.

[00:06:17] Yeah.

[00:06:18] I mean, if you want to be a – stick around and be part of the community, then we have that available as well for regular subscribers or just season pass.

[00:06:24] Because some people just pop in for just the show and then want to move on again.

[00:06:28] So, anyway.

[00:06:29] I think the point is –

[00:06:30] Yes.

[00:06:31] Options.

[00:06:32] We like options.

[00:06:32] There you have it.

[00:06:34] So, let's get into the actual content here now.

[00:06:39] Yes.

[00:06:40] Go ahead.

[00:06:40] I was going to say we – I missed a piece of feedback last week, which in fairness, the sender did not send through proper channels.

[00:06:48] I did not.

[00:06:49] It's my own fault.

[00:06:50] You wrote – here's the thing.

[00:06:52] I'm a lot like Boros Baratheon.

[00:06:54] If I get a letter, I can't read it.

[00:06:57] I have to give it to my servant to read to me.

[00:07:00] Not that Nancy's my servant.

[00:07:02] She's my hand.

[00:07:03] But, yeah.

[00:07:04] I'm feedback illiterate this season.

[00:07:07] That's fair.

[00:07:07] You know, I thought about that.

[00:07:08] I was like, when I posted it, I was like, oh, I'll just post it in the Discord and they'll have it and whatever.

[00:07:13] And I don't need to bother Nancy with it because she's doing so much anyway.

[00:07:15] But it would have been accounted for if I had actually followed proper procedures.

[00:07:19] I'm just joking.

[00:07:19] I should have remembered.

[00:07:21] And just to say, I was on vacation last week.

[00:07:23] We were across the pond visiting the cousins over in the country where they drive on the –

[00:07:28] I don't know.

[00:07:29] What are you doing on the other side of the road, people?

[00:07:31] What's wrong with you?

[00:07:33] What are you doing on the other side of the road?

[00:07:34] And we were visiting some friends and we had a really lovely vacation.

[00:07:36] And I'm still jet laggy because we just got back last night.

[00:07:40] But thank you to Maya and Alicia for jumping on the pod with you, John.

[00:07:44] I still haven't listened to the one with you and your wife, the hot take, because my podcast listening is all busted.

[00:07:49] It's all out of whack.

[00:07:51] I hear you.

[00:07:51] There's plenty going on.

[00:07:53] Yeah.

[00:07:53] Plenty going on.

[00:07:55] All right.

[00:07:56] Back to the feedback.

[00:08:02] David.

[00:08:03] Greetings, John and Alicia and fellow lorehounds.

[00:08:07] Greetings from across the pond.

[00:08:08] I was able to catch up with episode six the other night.

[00:08:13] Thankfully, I caught the episode sooner rather than later because my FYPs are just full of House of the Dragon stuff and it was getting harder and harder to dodge spoilers.

[00:08:24] Anyway, a few general thoughts about the episode.

[00:08:29] It was a very hot episode in many ways.

[00:08:33] I did feel like the episode lacked a little in energy.

[00:08:37] I think I was expecting something different for this particular episode.

[00:08:43] And so they and they zigged when I was expecting them to zag.

[00:08:47] So that's part of it.

[00:08:48] But also the episode was just kind of weirdly constructed in some ways.

[00:08:53] I'm not sure what was going on.

[00:08:55] Maybe it was some there was some sounded like some ADR problems and I don't know, some other things.

[00:09:00] It just felt like the energy was off in this episode.

[00:09:03] But like John said on the main podcast, it's still a good episode in a great season.

[00:09:08] So, you know, it's not that big of a deal.

[00:09:12] Some specific notes that I made here.

[00:09:15] So we've got a lot of confusion about dragon lore.

[00:09:19] Is the is the bond broken when the rider is dead or is that distance related or what's going on?

[00:09:27] But I thought it was really interesting that Seasmoak actively went out and sought a rider as opposed to just being chill.

[00:09:36] But like they said, you know, Seasmoak was acting a little pensive.

[00:09:39] So maybe it's just missing that human bond.

[00:09:42] And I feel badly for Lord Darkland, though.

[00:09:45] That was a pretty bad way to go.

[00:09:48] Also confirmation with Alan with the white hair.

[00:09:53] I can't remember.

[00:09:54] Was that Jean who was saying that in the discord or John?

[00:09:57] Was that you?

[00:09:58] There was somebody who was saying that they had a theory about that's why he keeps his head shaved.

[00:10:04] And so I think we got that clear confirmation in this episode.

[00:10:08] That was a very cool little detail is a nice passive detail.

[00:10:12] It was very show me, not tell me kind of thing.

[00:10:16] Really well done.

[00:10:18] Question.

[00:10:19] Will Corlys be the hand that Rhaenyra needs?

[00:10:23] I think this whole question of the hand is interesting because we also on the flip side.

[00:10:28] Where is Otto and what's going on with that?

[00:10:32] Lara's got smacked out.

[00:10:33] He was like, no, dude, you're not getting the job.

[00:10:36] You're just going to go find the guy that I want for the job.

[00:10:39] Which in an episode of bad Amon's decisions, that was the one smart decision he made was trying to figure out where Otto is and to bring him back.

[00:10:50] So Alice is real because Simon refers to her.

[00:10:55] So womp, womp.

[00:10:57] I was really loving that theory that she was just a ghost in Damon's head.

[00:11:02] But sadly, not to be.

[00:11:04] And yeah, I'm all in that she actively poisoned him.

[00:11:07] Like that was a total setup.

[00:11:09] She did that for sure.

[00:11:11] The Damon plot, speaking of that, it really needs to start making some forward progress.

[00:11:17] It's cool.

[00:11:18] It's cool.

[00:11:18] I like a lot about it.

[00:11:20] But it's dragging a little bit and we just need him to pick up at this stage of the game.

[00:11:26] I was thinking that we'd have a little bit more forward progress, even though we got a very interesting scene with him crying and expressing grief and remorse at, you know, the death of his sister-in-law and not being there for his brother in the way that his brother needed him to be.

[00:11:46] So I thought that was really interesting.

[00:11:48] So again, loving a show that can make us root for the bad guys or see the humanity in people who are acting in very monstrous ways.

[00:11:57] The clever tactic by Massaria, sending the food stuff in, that was great.

[00:12:04] Like I said for episode five, winding up the civilian population.

[00:12:08] It's a really dangerous plot and some people are going to die.

[00:12:13] But it's a really powerful powder keg.

[00:12:17] And I thought it was going to take a kind of a higher amount of effort, but it was pretty easy to get them to spark.

[00:12:24] And that was a pretty scary situation that Allison and Helena had to face.

[00:12:28] That's twice there.

[00:12:30] Poor Helena has had to face crowds where she doesn't really want to have to deal with them.

[00:12:36] Um, um, Alicent's only son that's not raised by her has, uh, some kindness as, uh, as Gwaine says.

[00:12:47] So that's, that's pretty rough.

[00:12:48] I'm, I'm feeling pretty bad for, for Alicent.

[00:12:51] Uh, and again, making us feel and care for characters who act in otherwise monstrous ways.

[00:12:58] The question of Rhaenyra and Massaria.

[00:13:02] I read the situation totally wrong or different from, from John, what you thought.

[00:13:09] Uh, I don't think there's anything wrong in this situation.

[00:13:13] Uh, Missaria exposed, you know, she, she, she was willingly sharing a powerful truth.

[00:13:20] Why she's really, uh, for Rhaenyra and Rhaenyra has felt very lonely.

[00:13:26] And, and, uh, she, you know, went to embrace in a sisterly way, in an empathetic way, in a supportive way.

[00:13:35] And then found suddenly that there was chemistry there.

[00:13:38] And I think, I don't think either one of them made the first move.

[00:13:42] I think it was one of those things where one person makes a little bit of move.

[00:13:46] And then the other person makes another little move and sort of builds like that.

[00:13:50] I didn't see any one person being dominant in that.

[00:13:54] I agree.

[00:13:55] It twists the story in a way that I'm not sure I was expecting for it to go.

[00:14:00] I'm not against it.

[00:14:02] Um, I don't think it's detracting from the story.

[00:14:05] It's just to see what we're, where they're going to go with this and how this is going

[00:14:08] to, uh, work out because yeah, awkward workplace scenario.

[00:14:12] I'm your Lord.

[00:14:15] I'm your, I'm your queen and you're my vassal, you know?

[00:14:19] So yeah, that is a little awkward on the power dynamics, but it's nothing that we haven't

[00:14:22] seen before in Gurm's world.

[00:14:25] The last thing I will say is hashtag dragons are cats.

[00:14:30] Peace out from London.

[00:14:32] All is well here.

[00:14:33] We're having a great time.

[00:14:34] London is, um, kicking my butt.

[00:14:36] It's been so long since we've been around so many people and doing so many, uh, things,

[00:14:42] but we're having a great time.

[00:14:43] So see y'all soon.

[00:14:45] Bye.

[00:14:46] Dragons are cats, aren't they?

[00:14:48] They really are.

[00:14:49] Also, who's the, who's the dialogue coach on this British David that wrote in?

[00:14:54] Cause it doesn't sound very, uh, very British to me.

[00:14:58] You don't want me to do that.

[00:14:59] You don't want me asking, asking for bottles of water and things like that.

[00:15:03] Um, you made me think of something in your feedback where you said, you know, see smoke

[00:15:08] goes out and seek somebody.

[00:15:09] I'm thinking like, is this like parents are trying to get their child to marry and they're

[00:15:16] like, Hey, you're going to go on all these dates.

[00:15:18] We set up, you up with a matchmaker.

[00:15:20] It's like, fine, I'll just find my own partner.

[00:15:22] They're right away.

[00:15:23] It's almost like, it's almost like Rhaenyra in season one.

[00:15:27] Yeah.

[00:15:27] That's funny.

[00:15:28] Being sent on her tour.

[00:15:29] And then she's like, no, fuck it.

[00:15:30] I'm picking my own.

[00:15:32] That's a good point.

[00:15:33] I'm just going to go find who I want to find.

[00:15:35] So I still haven't caught up with the full feedback episode.

[00:15:39] So I didn't know how much conversation was generated around the kiss, but, uh,

[00:15:44] Not a lot, honestly.

[00:15:46] Yeah.

[00:15:46] Yeah.

[00:15:46] Interestingly, I thought there was going to be more, but it kind of just blew by.

[00:15:51] I hope it does just blow by.

[00:15:53] You know what?

[00:15:53] You know what I think is weird is that it just, again, let's take away the debate of

[00:15:58] if it was problematic or not, because so many things are problematic in this world that I

[00:16:01] don't think we can even begin to dive into that.

[00:16:03] But just, I didn't feel like there was a hint of it until this episode.

[00:16:08] And that I think is, is not good writing.

[00:16:11] And so learning that because Alicia, Alicia loves the showrunner interviews and I give

[00:16:15] her a hard time about it because I think the showrunners should show not tell.

[00:16:20] And, and, uh, I think she went to an actor interview and they said, oh yeah, Emma Darcy

[00:16:24] came up with the idea.

[00:16:25] Okay.

[00:16:26] I'm like, okay.

[00:16:27] But if you have that idea that needs to be in the script from the beginning of the season,

[00:16:31] right?

[00:16:31] You can't just be on the fly unless you've really feel like that was sold before this.

[00:16:36] And I don't think, I don't think that's right.

[00:16:38] So Emma Darcy, I have a lot of respect for them.

[00:16:41] I don't know about on a, on a writing level.

[00:16:44] I thought it did.

[00:16:47] Yeah.

[00:16:47] I would agree with you that there, there hasn't been a lot of setup for it and where does it

[00:16:53] go?

[00:16:53] It didn't go anywhere in this episode, which is fine.

[00:16:57] And so whether it was just a brief moment and that's all we get of it, or is it going

[00:17:02] to be a major plot point?

[00:17:03] Cause if it's a major plot point, then yeah, that would have been helpful to lay those,

[00:17:08] you know, that track work at the beginning of the season so that you're moving towards

[00:17:13] that.

[00:17:13] So yeah.

[00:17:14] If it's a one-off, then it's kind of easy to just go, ah, didn't work for me.

[00:17:18] Let's move on.

[00:17:19] So, uh, but yeah, well, uh, London was fun and, uh, yeah, I was, we were at our friend's

[00:17:27] house and I was trying to record in the upstairs bedroom very quietly while, you know, all sorts

[00:17:31] of things were going around.

[00:17:33] So, but I was able to.

[00:17:35] Yes, we have friends.

[00:17:36] One of the traitors?

[00:17:38] Or I guess we're the traitors.

[00:17:39] We're the traitors.

[00:17:41] Yeah.

[00:17:41] Oh, well.

[00:17:43] I just mess with the British because I would, I would love to live in London or, or the

[00:17:48] British country on the English countryside or, or Ireland.

[00:17:51] So just give me, give me part of one of the islands and I'll be happy.

[00:17:54] But, uh, until then I will mock you out of jealousy.

[00:17:57] Should we, uh, move into the, uh, episode seven now that we've kind of recapped episode

[00:18:03] six a wee bit.

[00:18:04] Let's do it.

[00:18:05] What did you think of the episode?

[00:18:08] I thought that this was another one of those episodes that you can't sleep on be just because

[00:18:14] there's a, you know, not a lot of action going on over here, or there's like a really big bookend

[00:18:19] piece of action that is like, wow.

[00:18:23] And we saw dragon dragon fire and, you know, eating people and all that kind of stuff, because

[00:18:27] there's two things that happened in this episode that are, are again, major character shifts,

[00:18:32] both for Rhaenyra and for Alicent, but they're very subtle and they're, you know,

[00:18:37] easily missed in some ways.

[00:18:39] So, you know, it's, yeah, not, not a lot happened plot wise, but a lot happened character wise

[00:18:46] and substantially.

[00:18:47] So I thought that that was really interesting.

[00:18:50] And this whole season, each episode has just been sort of almost like more place setting.

[00:18:57] They do, they do a lot of establishing for things to, you know, uh, to happen, other things

[00:19:03] to happen, characters to be in certain places, things to trigger other things.

[00:19:08] And so they keep ratcheting up this tension, but I never feel like I'm not getting something

[00:19:13] from the story.

[00:19:14] You know, we can often talk about like, oh, this was a place that are not a lot happened,

[00:19:20] but there's a lot happening, but, but there's also not, I don't know.

[00:19:23] I don't know how to describe the setting.

[00:19:25] I'm very satisfied from a story standpoint, but constantly feel like the story is moving

[00:19:31] forward or more things are constantly being set up.

[00:19:33] Does that make sense?

[00:19:34] I think you're right.

[00:19:35] I think you're right.

[00:19:36] But I think that's hopefully a good balance is that we are continually putting pieces on

[00:19:42] the board while moving others in a way that feels like action.

[00:19:48] Yeah.

[00:19:49] Right.

[00:19:49] Resolving things as we set things up.

[00:19:51] Yeah.

[00:19:52] I think I always say like severance is the best thing that did that.

[00:19:54] And that's a very different show, but, uh, just, just the way that it was able to line

[00:19:59] up pieces one after another is something that I think all showrunners should, should aspire

[00:20:04] to and watch, watch season two be terrible.

[00:20:06] And then I can't use it as an example, but we'll see.

[00:20:10] We'll see.

[00:20:10] Well, this is our penultimate.

[00:20:12] So we've got one more to go.

[00:20:13] I think they're probably going to land this plane that said, um, this season just continues

[00:20:20] to visually wow me.

[00:20:22] It's so stunning.

[00:20:23] I was doing my rewatch today and I was, I kept taking screenshots because of these, uh,

[00:20:29] shots that they set up are just so gorgeous and visually interesting.

[00:20:35] And, uh, it's just, uh, uh, uh, an absolute masterclass in how to film and to use, you

[00:20:44] know, composite shots, right?

[00:20:46] Where there's practical sets layered in with CGI sets.

[00:20:50] I think they, it felt like they did some practical.

[00:20:52] I don't know how much practical they did for the dragons in this, but it felt very real in

[00:20:57] in certain circles.

[00:20:59] Yeah.

[00:20:59] I don't know.

[00:20:59] Cause some of the things like, you know, like it cannot be practical just based on

[00:21:02] the way it's moving, but it does look very close to practical.

[00:21:06] They are getting really good at those textures on the dragons.

[00:21:10] Amazing.

[00:21:10] Yeah.

[00:21:10] You want one of the, you know, when, when, um, not Ulf, uh, what's his name?

[00:21:15] Um, uh, Hugh, Hugh.

[00:21:17] Thank you.

[00:21:17] I wanted to say Hugo, but that's not right.

[00:21:19] Hugh and Hugh standing there and the dragon, you know, head comes close to him.

[00:21:23] It, it looks like one of those shots from Jurassic park or something like that,

[00:21:27] where they have, you know, the T-Rex moving in physically to the shot.

[00:21:31] So the actors are really looking at this animatronic thing, but it's just so incredible and lifelike.

[00:21:37] It's how could it not be CGI?

[00:21:39] Right.

[00:21:40] So.

[00:21:41] Right.

[00:21:41] I don't know how they're doing it.

[00:21:43] Uh, but yeah, this, this, and this whole thing that they've been doing all season where

[00:21:48] we get this big, uh, last act of the episode where there's some big dramatic element that

[00:21:56] drops and they've done it again on this one.

[00:21:59] So, you know, all, all episode, we were sort of moving up and then boom, they dropped this

[00:22:03] big thing on us.

[00:22:05] And, um, you know, I remember when we were doing our preseason coverage with Anthony and

[00:22:10] we talked about, well, you know, they're only doing eight episodes this season.

[00:22:14] I think with the content of the season, you know, I, I was wanting, I was advocating for

[00:22:19] 10 episodes, right?

[00:22:20] Like I really want to, you know, fully, I think eight I'm good because there's just so

[00:22:24] much that has happened.

[00:22:25] I feel kind of my emotional band, uh, with is just completely taken by the show.

[00:22:31] Um, because they're just hitting me visually.

[00:22:34] They're hitting me character wise.

[00:22:35] They're hitting me with plot and story.

[00:22:37] It's a, it's a really exceptional season.

[00:22:39] I am good with eight episodes because I need a break from hot Laura summer, but I, I do agree

[00:22:43] with you.

[00:22:44] And, and, um, I think somebody wrote in last week to the feedback and I believe we read

[00:22:48] this on air already, uh, that they apparently the show runners have opted.

[00:22:54] I think they were given the option to do either three seasons of 10 or they can get a fourth

[00:22:57] or fifth season if they do eight.

[00:22:59] Oh, interesting.

[00:23:00] So I think they are still going to flesh out the story, but just over more seasons.

[00:23:05] Okay.

[00:23:05] That's fine because the intensity of this story is, you know, I think it's okay.

[00:23:10] I think it works if we're, um, a little shorter season, but I never feel like the

[00:23:18] story is being compromised by what the studio and the writers are deciding on how to break

[00:23:25] up the story.

[00:23:26] You know what I mean?

[00:23:27] In some seasons, some other shows that we've covered in the past were like, uh, this feels

[00:23:31] like they're really stretching the material a little bit thin here.

[00:23:35] Uh, you know, Ted Lasso, I think did a, uh, kind of had a rough final season because they

[00:23:40] were trying to pack in 12 episodes as opposed to doing it in 10 or whatever it was.

[00:23:45] Like 16, something crazy.

[00:23:46] But also I think Ted Lasso, the issue was, it wasn't that the studio was pushing, it was

[00:23:50] actually that the writers wanted to put in like every joke they ever thought of.

[00:23:53] No, that too.

[00:23:54] So, but then that's the hand of the writer, right?

[00:23:57] And as opposed to the story breathing and living in the way that the story wants to work.

[00:24:02] And I think this, it doesn't, I don't feel like the studio or the, or the, the showrunners

[00:24:09] are trying to contort the story into this season and this number of episodes.

[00:24:14] Right.

[00:24:16] Fair enough.

[00:24:17] What about you?

[00:24:18] Yeah.

[00:24:18] I mean, I, I love the episode.

[00:24:20] I've been waiting all season for this, right?

[00:24:22] This is what I've been saying.

[00:24:23] Another one.

[00:24:24] This is boiling.

[00:24:26] I said, the kettle is steaming.

[00:24:28] It's the cup floweth over.

[00:24:31] And yeah, here we are.

[00:24:33] Just to add one note on that too.

[00:24:37] After watching the episode, it's so obvious.

[00:24:40] It's like, oh, duh, of course, you know, of course, Olf and, and Hugh are going to be

[00:24:45] dragon writers as well as Adam.

[00:24:48] Of course that's going to be.

[00:24:49] Oh, you're saying the people we've been following all seasons are the ones that are going

[00:24:52] to succeed.

[00:24:53] Exactly.

[00:24:54] Yeah, exactly.

[00:24:55] And only ones with character development and not the red shirts.

[00:24:57] But you know, in, in season, in episodes, uh, one, two, three, four, I had no idea where

[00:25:03] they were going to go or what they were going to do with it.

[00:25:05] But now on the backside of this, of seven, it's like, oh, of course it's obvious.

[00:25:10] Right.

[00:25:10] Right.

[00:25:11] And that's again, good, good job writers.

[00:25:13] Right.

[00:25:14] You know, you kept me in the dark all the way up until this moment.

[00:25:18] And then now that the moments come, it's clearly obvious what you were driving us towards.

[00:25:23] So it feels very smooth.

[00:25:25] Right.

[00:25:26] Yeah.

[00:25:26] I, I think they're doing a really great job bringing this to life.

[00:25:30] They did a really good job of being like, see dragonless rider, riders over here.

[00:25:35] Uh, he, see riderless dragons over there.

[00:25:38] What are we going to do about it?

[00:25:40] You know, I think, I think there was, they were really good about teasing it.

[00:25:43] Um, like you said, I thought that the visuals were amazing.

[00:25:45] I did this one.

[00:25:46] I got this one shot for the show guide with Eamon looking out the window at, at silver

[00:25:51] wing.

[00:25:52] Yes.

[00:25:52] I think that might be my favorite shot in all of the song of ice and fire universe.

[00:25:56] It's so good.

[00:25:57] It looks like a painting.

[00:25:58] Mm hmm.

[00:25:59] Yeah.

[00:25:59] A lot of these things just look like paintings.

[00:26:01] They're so beautiful.

[00:26:02] I think who is it in our discord?

[00:26:04] I think, uh, Cyrus, Cyrus posted another one when I was doing my little posting storm.

[00:26:08] Um, that yeah, that of, uh, Adam and, uh, Corlys totally looks like an oil painting.

[00:26:15] Yep.

[00:26:16] All right.

[00:26:16] Shall we get into the main episode?

[00:26:18] Yeah, let's do it.

[00:26:19] All right.

[00:26:20] So we start off with the dragon double date.

[00:26:23] Rhaenyra and Adam meet with their respective dragons, Cyrax and Seasmoke.

[00:26:28] The Rhaenyra is cautious.

[00:26:30] Adam immediately pledges fieldy to her and asked to learn how to be a dragon rider.

[00:26:34] Can I just say before we get into substance that I can not relate to riding a dragon, but

[00:26:40] I can relate to my child being so loud while I'm trying to have a conversation.

[00:26:46] Like I felt the anxiety and the secondhand like frustration for Rhaenyra there.

[00:26:52] I'm trying to talk here.

[00:26:54] And then Cyrax and Seasmoke are just like, ah, haven't seen you in a while.

[00:27:01] It was pretty funny.

[00:27:03] The, uh, and you, you know, when you're around dragons, you've got to be on your toes a little

[00:27:08] bit, even if you're a dragon Lord, right?

[00:27:11] You, you, you never quite sure what they're going to do or how they're going to react to

[00:27:14] certain situations.

[00:27:15] Right.

[00:27:17] So another beautiful opening image too, on the beach there with the two dragons facing

[00:27:21] off and you know, the, the long shot and we can get that scale.

[00:27:24] We can see the human figure, uh, versus the, the, the dragons is I, it looks like Seasmoke

[00:27:32] is slightly larger than Cyrax.

[00:27:35] I believe so.

[00:27:36] Uh, yeah.

[00:27:37] I'm, I'm looking at it right now.

[00:27:38] It's, it's, I, I, it looks like it.

[00:27:41] Yeah.

[00:27:41] A little bit, a little bit bigger.

[00:27:44] The, uh, the camera work on this scene was great too.

[00:27:47] The way that they were following and they were swooping around behind Adam or as Rhaenyra

[00:27:51] is walking up.

[00:27:52] Um, and they just, it really gave you that sense of here's these two people facing off

[00:27:57] with each other, sizing up, like what is going on?

[00:28:00] Who are you?

[00:28:01] What are your intentions?

[00:28:02] And they, they communicated that tension in how they use the camera and how the camera

[00:28:09] move and sort of circles around.

[00:28:11] So you get sort of a half circle with Rhaenyra and as, as the camera follows her and then

[00:28:16] you get another half circle of Adam sort of from the other direction.

[00:28:20] So it's like, you know, two fighters in a, uh, uh, you know, on, on, uh, on the field

[00:28:26] trying to size each other up.

[00:28:27] Right.

[00:28:28] So.

[00:28:29] Yeah.

[00:28:30] And I don't think Adam was ever going to go with the greens, right?

[00:28:34] He's, he feels like a Valerian.

[00:28:36] He wants to be a Valerian.

[00:28:38] Right.

[00:28:38] And the Valerians have sided with the blacks.

[00:28:40] Therefore he is one of the blacks.

[00:28:42] Right.

[00:28:43] And Clinton Liberty, the actor who plays Adam, I just really love him.

[00:28:47] I think he's great.

[00:28:47] He has such a charm and an easy going nature.

[00:28:50] And it just looks like a fun guy to hang out with.

[00:28:53] I really hope we get, well, it seems like we're going to see him a bit more in the next

[00:28:57] coming seasons.

[00:28:59] Yeah.

[00:28:59] And he and Alan, the two actors there, they really do a great job of doing that whole fire

[00:29:05] and blood, sea and smoke, uh, thing.

[00:29:07] Sorry.

[00:29:07] Salt and sea thing.

[00:29:08] Uh, because that's a good point.

[00:29:10] Yeah.

[00:29:10] See the kind of joy, the lightness in Adam's step.

[00:29:14] And you can see that Alan's basically just the grim fucking reaper, right?

[00:29:17] Like he is Davy Jones right there.

[00:29:19] He's the older serious brother.

[00:29:21] Exactly.

[00:29:22] He's got to get the mortgage.

[00:29:23] Exactly.

[00:29:26] Anyway.

[00:29:27] Emma Darcy, her, sorry, their face in this was the act, the facial acting, the looking

[00:29:34] over the shoulder, like, who are you?

[00:29:36] What's going on?

[00:29:37] Right.

[00:29:37] That was also just really incredible.

[00:29:39] I felt very tense watching them this whole sequence.

[00:29:43] Right.

[00:29:44] Um, and as Rhaenyra is like, yo, I'm the queen who the hell for you and what are you doing

[00:29:49] with my dragon?

[00:29:51] Right.

[00:29:53] Yeah.

[00:29:53] Yeah.

[00:29:53] And, and I just really like how she kind of just starts to break, right?

[00:29:58] She starts to break from the serious system.

[00:30:00] Like you just did something awesome, dude.

[00:30:03] Like as much as I am the queen now, I am also a dragon rider first and foremost, and

[00:30:08] you are a cool freaking dude.

[00:30:10] Yeah.

[00:30:11] That, that you get, that just dragon picks you up.

[00:30:14] Did you, I have a question for you in general about the Gurm world.

[00:30:22] In this scene, uh, Adam says, you know, the gods called me, you know, she says, you kneel

[00:30:29] quickly.

[00:30:29] And he says, well, the gods brought me here.

[00:30:31] So what am, who am I to, um, go against the will of the gods?

[00:30:37] I don't get a lot of sense of that sort of fate and destiny question or thing or vibe

[00:30:47] in this world.

[00:30:48] People are really making their way.

[00:30:51] Yeah.

[00:30:51] There might be some gods out there.

[00:30:52] We may, you know, sort of, you know, give them a nod or, you know, we pray to them a little

[00:30:59] bit, but people in their day-to-day actions don't seem like, you know, kind of, they don't

[00:31:03] have that inshallah sort of, um, uh, vibe.

[00:31:07] Like if God wills it, well, God willed it.

[00:31:09] So that's why I'm here.

[00:31:10] And, but in this episode, I got a lot more of that and it doesn't seem like it's a normal

[00:31:15] thing, um, that we get, we just get people like raw, you know, power, I've got to do

[00:31:22] this or I've got to achieve this goal or I've got to do that kind of thing.

[00:31:25] And they don't do a lot of fate and destiny talk about it.

[00:31:29] Does that make sense?

[00:31:30] Yeah.

[00:31:31] I see what you're saying.

[00:31:32] I think even if you go into the real world, even when you go into less religious societies,

[00:31:38] such as the one that we're living in right now, right?

[00:31:41] A society that is less focused on religion as a whole.

[00:31:45] I'm not saying that there aren't religious people within the States, but I think you still

[00:31:50] see things saying like, oh, well the universe willed it, right?

[00:31:53] Oh, invisible string theory.

[00:31:55] Like people want that kind of sign from the universe, not explicit predestination, but I'm

[00:32:01] being nudged in this way, even if they don't believe in a deity, right?

[00:32:04] And the language of this world is through gods.

[00:32:08] Pretty much we're in a, in a state of this world where, you know, there are several religions

[00:32:14] to choose from.

[00:32:15] People don't really convert between them as far as I've seen.

[00:32:18] Uh, well, yeah, Beric Dondarrion converting to the, to the fire religion.

[00:32:22] But anyway, the point is, I think he's just being like, well, seems like I'm meant to be

[00:32:27] here, so let's go with it.

[00:32:29] You know, I, I think that it's, it's definitely relatable even from a, from a modern day standpoint.

[00:32:36] Right.

[00:32:37] Yeah.

[00:32:38] Cause he, Adam is just very clearly like, well, you know, fate brought me here, whatever

[00:32:43] that may be, however we describe it.

[00:32:45] And so therefore, you know, therefore it, it must mean something.

[00:32:50] And, and that just really struck that line really stood out for me because I don't hear

[00:32:54] a lot of other characters saying that.

[00:32:56] Like when Corliss lived, he didn't go, oh, it must've been, you know, it was God's miracle

[00:33:01] that I survived, you know, dah, dah, dah.

[00:33:03] I was like, nah, my bastard son pulled me out of the drink and I just got lucky.

[00:33:09] My body just healed.

[00:33:10] So, whew, good, good for us.

[00:33:12] But he didn't make it a big religious thing or a big, uh, you know, God-willed it fate,

[00:33:18] you know, kind of, uh, of scenario.

[00:33:21] And I don't think Adam is either.

[00:33:22] I think that's just kind of, again, like an expression almost like.

[00:33:26] Right.

[00:33:26] I hear what you're saying.

[00:33:27] Yeah.

[00:33:27] In real life.

[00:33:28] Like, oh, well, it seems like the universe pulled us together.

[00:33:31] Ha ha ha.

[00:33:32] You know?

[00:33:33] Let's go with it.

[00:33:34] Yeah.

[00:33:35] You know what I mean?

[00:33:35] That's how I read it at least.

[00:33:37] Okay.

[00:33:37] Fair enough.

[00:33:38] I was just, yeah, because Gurm's world doesn't seem very drawn by fate and destiny.

[00:33:44] Oh, the destiny of the world.

[00:33:46] I mean, he does have quite a lot of prophecies.

[00:33:48] He's got prophecy, but that's different, isn't it?

[00:33:51] Is it?

[00:33:52] That's, yeah, because when we talk about in the fantasy, uh, realm of things like, oh,

[00:33:58] the fate of the world is in, you know, the hands of the hobbits.

[00:34:01] Right.

[00:34:01] You know?

[00:34:02] And if, but for, you know, uh, this one little thing happening, well, that was just the hand

[00:34:07] of, you know, uh, Eru or Lovatar.

[00:34:10] Right.

[00:34:10] Well, don't, don't talk to Tolkien about that because Tolkien will tell you had Frodo not

[00:34:15] done it, somebody else would have.

[00:34:17] Like the, the will of Eru would have been accomplished some way.

[00:34:21] It just depends with the, what free will there is, is who gets to do it.

[00:34:25] Right.

[00:34:26] Anyway.

[00:34:27] Oh yeah.

[00:34:27] Anyway, off, off on that note.

[00:34:29] Well, we're going to talk plenty of Tolkien this week.

[00:34:31] So, so save that, put a pin in that.

[00:34:33] Okay.

[00:34:34] Sounds great.

[00:34:35] All right.

[00:34:36] Alicent wears blue is the next scene.

[00:34:38] As the rats take over the Red Keep, Alicent is stitched up by Grand Maester Orwell.

[00:34:43] I almost said Pycelle and that guy is long in the future.

[00:34:46] Yeah.

[00:34:47] Yeah.

[00:34:47] Long in the future.

[00:34:47] That's right.

[00:34:48] Leaving a scar to match Rhaenyra's.

[00:34:51] Alicent asks Kingsguard Rickard Thorne to accompany her on her retreat to the Kingswood.

[00:34:58] I really don't understand what's going on with Alicent.

[00:35:02] With this whole thing, the closest that I could get is that, and this is what I was saying before about this episode, there's two big shifts happening.

[00:35:12] Something has happened for Alicent that is yet to be resolved.

[00:35:17] Like it didn't resolve in this episode.

[00:35:19] But this is a pretty major shift for her to check out and to go off on her own this way.

[00:35:27] This is major for her character.

[00:35:30] Right.

[00:35:30] And I don't know yet what it signifies.

[00:35:34] Well, I think it's just she's been kicked off the council, right?

[00:35:37] She does not have a place at home.

[00:35:40] What can she do?

[00:35:41] And she can't even go to her favorite place, the Sept, anymore because she's going to get murdered on the way back.

[00:35:46] That's a good point.

[00:35:47] That's a good point.

[00:35:48] I just don't know what else she has.

[00:35:49] And her lover is gone.

[00:35:50] There is nothing else for Alicent in Kingslanding right now.

[00:35:54] And she's really seeing that and not even trying.

[00:35:58] Not even trying to work back channels or try to show her feet off to Laris again or anything like that.

[00:36:04] She's really giving up.

[00:36:05] Laris is like, I'm powerful enough to buy my own feet now.

[00:36:08] That's right.

[00:36:09] I don't need your feet anymore.

[00:36:10] I got what I needed.

[00:36:12] So yeah, I think it's just really an interesting shift.

[00:36:15] And she even says to Orwell, nothing is clean here.

[00:36:20] And that has been a theme that she's been dealing with this whole time is scrubbing her soul and all this guilt that is dirtying up her sense of self and sense of place.

[00:36:39] And it seems like she's trying to get away from that finally.

[00:36:42] Like, I got to get out of the Red Keep.

[00:36:44] Yeah, she's been kicked off the council.

[00:36:46] And anybody that she was involved with before, her father's gone, right?

[00:36:51] Laris and Crispy Cole.

[00:36:55] So yeah, like you said, I think you make a good point.

[00:36:57] What does she have?

[00:36:59] But to actually take the step to check out of the Red Keep and get a different point of view, different vantage, that's a big deal for this character.

[00:37:09] Yeah.

[00:37:09] It's a major shift because she's been locked in the whole time up until this moment.

[00:37:14] Right.

[00:37:16] It's tough.

[00:37:17] It's tough.

[00:37:18] I think that she just...

[00:37:21] I think she really wants to reflect, right?

[00:37:23] Like, I think she contemplated suicide this episode.

[00:37:25] I don't think she landed there, but I think she definitely thought about it, right?

[00:37:31] Mm-hmm.

[00:37:33] Yeah, and we talked about this on the hot take the other night that we both thought that, oh, wait, is this a scene where she takes her own life?

[00:37:42] Right?

[00:37:42] Because it felt like that.

[00:37:44] She could have been on the edge of that, right?

[00:37:47] She could have been.

[00:37:48] And again, that's not what happens in the book there.

[00:37:52] It's not like she died there, but anything could happen, really.

[00:37:56] And I want to make that clear for people who are worried that I'm going to give them a spoiler.

[00:38:01] Like, the book has changed quite a bit into the show.

[00:38:05] Mm-hmm.

[00:38:05] And stories that we were told in the book are not necessarily what we're going to see in the show.

[00:38:11] Right.

[00:38:12] Which I'm glad about, because it lets me be surprised and delighted along the way.

[00:38:16] Huzzah.

[00:38:17] Huzzah, dude.

[00:38:18] I did love the fact that they gave us a little shot of the rats eating on the table.

[00:38:23] And it's like, well, yeah, because you killed all the rat catchers.

[00:38:29] They haven't figured out an interim solution anymore.

[00:38:31] It goes to the point that Amund may be a really good strategic thinker and a very cunning and wartime leader.

[00:38:45] But to manage a keep and manage a city and manage a kingdom on a day-to-day basis is radically different.

[00:38:54] And unless you're scanning, good management really requires you to be looking from top to bottom, bottom to top.

[00:39:02] Right.

[00:39:02] And the lack of a few functionaries like the rat catchers can actually have a really big impact on the quality of life in the Red Keep, right?

[00:39:14] They can.

[00:39:15] And I believe it's by the time of Game of Thrones, they have cats now.

[00:39:22] Okay.

[00:39:22] Right.

[00:39:23] That's what they settle on is, all right, well, let's just get some freaking cats.

[00:39:26] At least they can't murder the kids.

[00:39:29] For sure.

[00:39:30] But it's a great little detail, you know, that the showrunners put in there.

[00:39:35] And they put it right in the forefront, right?

[00:39:36] Like, you can't miss it.

[00:39:37] No, exactly.

[00:39:38] There are rats now here.

[00:39:39] This is a gross place now.

[00:39:42] And that grosses Alicent out even further.

[00:39:45] She's starting to actually realize how gross of a place the Red Keep is.

[00:39:50] The rot is both internal and external for her.

[00:39:54] Yeah.

[00:39:55] Yeah.

[00:39:55] Good point.

[00:39:56] Something that we didn't really talk about is the blue dress.

[00:39:59] You know, this is the first time she's worn blue since before the time skip, before the first time skip.

[00:40:04] Yeah.

[00:40:05] Yeah.

[00:40:05] She dons green at Rhaenyra's wedding to Laenor, and then we haven't seen her in anything else since.

[00:40:11] Yeah.

[00:40:12] So, again, big shift for this character in this episode.

[00:40:17] She no longer feels emboldened.

[00:40:21] She's got nobody.

[00:40:22] Yeah, as you said, all of her...

[00:40:26] How does she affect power?

[00:40:28] Well, you've got to have people who believe in your power, and there's nobody even there to challenge her power anymore.

[00:40:34] She's become irrelevant.

[00:40:36] Her father's not working against her or with her or trying to put her into a position.

[00:40:41] Cole is gone.

[00:40:42] Laris has moved on.

[00:40:44] She's got nothing.

[00:40:47] Yeah, and that's the thing, right?

[00:40:48] Like, it's not even she can work against somebody.

[00:40:50] She's just, like, discarded.

[00:40:52] They're like, ew, you're over there?

[00:40:54] You can't sit with us.

[00:40:56] So, yeah, I think it's interesting.

[00:40:58] It's a really interesting change for her.

[00:41:00] I'm really curious to see where she ends up next episode.

[00:41:03] Now, I want to talk about it later when we get to the forest scenes, but if you look, actually, her undergarment is green.

[00:41:12] Interesting.

[00:41:12] If you look, the shift that is under the dress, it's poking out very prominently.

[00:41:18] This was definitely meant to be seen.

[00:41:20] Okay.

[00:41:20] It is decidedly green.

[00:41:22] Interesting.

[00:41:23] And I think that that might be a signal like, okay, well, she might be sad and feeling like a child right now, but underneath is still that warrior.

[00:41:35] Okay, I see.

[00:41:35] You get a shot in the show guide here of her.

[00:41:37] Right, exactly.

[00:41:39] Yeah, and there is.

[00:41:40] And they show it.

[00:41:41] It's very clear, isn't it?

[00:41:42] Right.

[00:41:42] We are meant to see that for sure.

[00:41:44] Yeah, right.

[00:41:45] Yeah, there's a few more things I want to talk about when we get to that, too.

[00:41:48] There's a couple of questions I have and a couple of very cool visuals.

[00:41:51] So, yeah.

[00:41:52] Next up, the Brosguard changed into black.

[00:41:56] Jasper Wilde tells Laris Strong about the rumor that Seasmoke has been seen with a rider.

[00:42:01] Laris says this could not have been Raina because Seasmoke tried to kill her when she tried some years ago.

[00:42:08] Laris welcomes Jasper to tell Amen about the rumor, but costings him that it's not likely true.

[00:42:14] Meanwhile, the Kingsbros are sent to the wall.

[00:42:19] It was always going to end this way, right?

[00:42:21] Right.

[00:42:22] Great humor, right?

[00:42:24] We talk a lot about the little moments of humor in this season and how necessary they are.

[00:42:29] And this is just one of those funny little scenes.

[00:42:32] Yeah.

[00:42:33] Yeah.

[00:42:35] You're like, oh yeah, okay, that's fitting.

[00:42:37] That totally works.

[00:42:38] It's funny, too.

[00:42:39] I think it opens up with Jasper going, well, are they going to kill them?

[00:42:44] And he goes, oh no, the wall.

[00:42:45] Our lord is merciful.

[00:42:46] Like, what?

[00:42:48] Oh, man.

[00:42:49] And it says they started a riot, right?

[00:42:51] And I don't even think, were they even the ones to slash off a wrist?

[00:42:57] Yeah.

[00:42:58] Wasn't it the other guy?

[00:42:59] I thought it was not one of the Brosguard.

[00:43:01] Okay.

[00:43:09] They're going to the wall.

[00:43:10] Gonna have to go back and look at that scene because they definitely did not.

[00:43:15] It was a, granted, it was a tough situation, too, right?

[00:43:18] How do you get out of there without, but yeah.

[00:43:21] It was one of those somebody's gonna take the fall situations, though, right?

[00:43:24] Yeah.

[00:43:25] Yeah.

[00:43:25] And I think it's, if you're Aemon and you want to get rid of these dudes, perfect opportunity.

[00:43:30] Exactly.

[00:43:30] Exactly.

[00:43:31] Perfect opportunity.

[00:43:31] The other thing I wanted to point out is that Lara says that Reyna tried, I think they

[00:43:38] said when she was four and ten, to ride Seasmoke.

[00:43:44] Now, if we are going on the theory, and again, this cannot be spoiled by book.

[00:43:49] There is nothing in the book about this.

[00:43:51] But if we're going to go on the theory that Laenor recently died, allowing Seasmoke to

[00:43:55] take a new rider, could it be that she just almost died because she thought that Seasmoke

[00:44:01] had no rider, but Seasmoke did have a rider and she could have tamed a dragon the whole

[00:44:05] time, but she got scared away all because of Rhaenyra's lie?

[00:44:09] Wait, I'm trying to follow the logic here.

[00:44:12] So, Laenor's gone.

[00:44:14] Mm-hmm.

[00:44:15] They try to set her up with Seasmoke.

[00:44:17] But Laenor is not really gone.

[00:44:19] Got it.

[00:44:21] Oh, I get it now.

[00:44:22] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:44:23] Lightbulb moment.

[00:44:24] Right, because...

[00:44:26] Leading Rhaena to a doomed attempt.

[00:44:30] Interesting.

[00:44:30] Was never going to work.

[00:44:32] Interesting.

[00:44:33] And so she thought she couldn't claim a dragon all because her uncle was still alive.

[00:44:39] And Rhaenyra lied to everybody.

[00:44:41] Right, exactly.

[00:44:42] Oh, man.

[00:44:44] It's a messy, messy story, isn't it?

[00:44:47] Also, what did Rhaenyra do when that happened?

[00:44:51] I have a lot of questions here.

[00:44:52] Like, did Rhaenyra know she was going to try to claim Seasmoke?

[00:44:56] Mm-hmm.

[00:44:56] Did she not try to stop?

[00:44:58] Like, oh, Seasmoke doesn't seem to want a rider.

[00:45:00] Why don't you try Vermithor or Silverwing?

[00:45:04] Right.

[00:45:05] Yeah, no, no.

[00:45:06] It's not going to work out today, honey.

[00:45:07] We got to go shopping.

[00:45:08] We got to get some eggs and some milk.

[00:45:10] Right.

[00:45:11] Dragon store today.

[00:45:13] It just seems like this was, you know, I will say it's another example of how Rhaenyra's

[00:45:21] deceptions come back to bite her.

[00:45:23] Right?

[00:45:24] She now has one less dragon rider because of the lies she told.

[00:45:29] She's compromised.

[00:45:31] Both Alicent and her have just compromised in so many positions and so many circumstances.

[00:45:35] They are neither are morally clean.

[00:45:37] Right.

[00:45:37] I think the listeners have been telling us we're too nice to Rhaenyra and too mean to Alicent.

[00:45:42] So here's my critique of Rhaenyra is she does weave these webs of lies that cannot, that do

[00:45:50] bite people in the butt, you know?

[00:45:52] It just takes a little while longer, maybe, for things to come around.

[00:45:56] I guess so, yeah.

[00:45:57] Yeah.

[00:45:57] Well, in this episode, and this is what I was saying about her change, she, in this episode,

[00:46:06] intentionally sacrifices a whole bunch of people.

[00:46:08] Yeah, she does.

[00:46:09] For her aims.

[00:46:10] And we can talk about that later when we get to that scene.

[00:46:12] But yeah, she is not innocent in this episode by any means.

[00:46:18] People have been quoting Lord Farquaad from Shrek where he says, some of you may die, but

[00:46:24] that's a price I'm willing to pay.

[00:46:26] That's exactly, that's exactly the line.

[00:46:29] That is, that is totally right.

[00:46:32] So here's a question for you is, do you think Laris thinks that the rumor is true or false

[00:46:40] when Wilde tells him, and then we can talk about the whole like, you know, oh, oh, why

[00:46:45] don't you tell him?

[00:46:46] No, no, please, sir.

[00:46:46] After you, you know, no, no.

[00:46:48] After you.

[00:46:48] And by the way, where did this come from?

[00:46:50] Oh, well, my father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate told me, right?

[00:46:55] Are you doing a Spaceballs reference there?

[00:46:56] That was a Spaceballs reference.

[00:46:57] That's great.

[00:46:57] Very good.

[00:46:59] Very good.

[00:47:00] I'm honorary Gen X for the night.

[00:47:02] I had to Google the line to make sure I had it all properly.

[00:47:06] I had most of it by memory, but I had to.

[00:47:08] What does that make him?

[00:47:10] Absolutely nothing.

[00:47:11] Nothing.

[00:47:13] So is, you know, is he going to, what's going on with Laris?

[00:47:17] What's his real motivation here?

[00:47:18] Why didn't he pick up on this?

[00:47:19] Why didn't he push Wilde forward or take the whisper for himself and say, oh yeah, I'll take

[00:47:25] care of this for you.

[00:47:27] I could see several motivations.

[00:47:29] The way I'm going to choose to read it, and I have no evidence for this other than preference,

[00:47:35] is that Laris thinks that whether it's true or not, and he can't substantiate it, but whether

[00:47:42] it's true or not, he's pissed at Aemond.

[00:47:45] He doesn't want him to have an advantage.

[00:47:47] And I think he might think if Vhagar dies because of a surprise attack, it might work

[00:47:52] out for him in the end, right?

[00:47:53] Like it might work out for Laris in the end.

[00:47:55] He might be able to play that to his advantage because he definitely can't control Aemond.

[00:47:58] And he knows Aemond is really dangerous.

[00:48:01] So maybe he's like, let's let Aemond get taken out and let's see what happens after that.

[00:48:06] I am 100% with you on this.

[00:48:09] I had a very similar thought.

[00:48:11] Anything that puts Aemond into a more difficult position, the better for Laris because they

[00:48:18] show us later that Laris is really team Aegon, right?

[00:48:24] Right.

[00:48:25] He's there trying to rehabilitate Aegon, get him up and moving and getting him back onto

[00:48:30] the throne.

[00:48:31] He's going to give him weird pep talks every day for the rest of his life.

[00:48:36] Uncle Laris is here to give you your pep talk.

[00:48:39] Fuck off.

[00:48:41] So yeah, I totally agree.

[00:48:43] I think it's whatever the veracity of the rumor or not, because he's clearly trying to work

[00:48:51] out like, is this a credible rumor?

[00:48:54] He, I think by withholding the information and then being able to dismiss it as, well,

[00:49:01] it was, you know, the father's brother's nephew's cousin's roommate that said it.

[00:49:05] So clearly, you know, it was unreliable and I couldn't second check it.

[00:49:10] You know, we didn't have any other additional information about it.

[00:49:13] I think that puts Aegon in a bad position because it's a lack of information.

[00:49:18] So.

[00:49:19] Or Aemond in a bad position.

[00:49:21] Sorry.

[00:49:21] Yes.

[00:49:21] Aemond.

[00:49:21] My bad.

[00:49:22] Yeah.

[00:49:22] That's all right.

[00:49:22] There's a lot of A's here.

[00:49:23] Yes.

[00:49:25] All right.

[00:49:26] Shall we move on to the Black Council becoming anxious?

[00:49:30] This is a pretty short scene, but Lord Bartimos Keltagar chastises the council for allowing

[00:49:36] one of the small folk to become a dragon rider.

[00:49:39] Corlys defends his queen and suggests they wait to hear her plan.

[00:49:43] And here's where we get Jason his mewing streak.

[00:49:47] Yeah.

[00:49:48] Does he huff off at the end of the scene?

[00:49:50] Yeah, he does.

[00:49:51] Uh, Keltagar seems a little drunk in his cups there.

[00:49:55] You know, he seemed like.

[00:49:56] Oh, you think?

[00:49:56] Yeah.

[00:49:57] I was like, hmm, this is not going to be a great council meeting if you're already so

[00:50:01] far into your wine.

[00:50:03] He's not happy.

[00:50:04] I mean, he has already been slapped by her.

[00:50:07] True.

[00:50:08] That's true.

[00:50:08] He's just not a fan of anything she does at this point.

[00:50:11] I'm kind of surprised that he's even still there.

[00:50:13] Mm-hmm.

[00:50:15] And he was one of the ones who was like super duper loyal, like would not bow down.

[00:50:19] Or actually, I think he did bow down briefly.

[00:50:21] But then he just snuck out anyway.

[00:50:24] Do we know what, um, does he have a position?

[00:50:28] I doesn't.

[00:50:29] You don't have anything in the show guide about like.

[00:50:31] He's just a member of the council.

[00:50:33] Okay.

[00:50:33] I don't think that he has.

[00:50:34] Well, I don't know.

[00:50:35] I don't know.

[00:50:35] I haven't heard the position at this point.

[00:50:37] That's why I don't know anything.

[00:50:39] Because on the green council, well, on the king, you know, whatever the, the region's

[00:50:42] council, uh, region's council, whatever that, whoever the ruler is, be the king or queen,

[00:50:48] um, for the actual administration of the realm, you have laws, coin, you know, uh, the

[00:50:55] fleet, the sailing, you know, all of this stuff.

[00:50:56] Well, they don't have any of those things to govern yet.

[00:50:59] Exactly.

[00:50:59] Like he's on the black council.

[00:51:01] It's really a war council only.

[00:51:03] Right.

[00:51:03] Right.

[00:51:03] So I don't know what he actually controls or does.

[00:51:07] I don't know how big the Keltgar, uh, house is.

[00:51:11] Yeah.

[00:51:12] I mean, I don't know.

[00:51:14] I think this is just going to be a war council.

[00:51:16] I don't think, I mean, she didn't even have a hand at the last episode, right?

[00:51:19] It's true.

[00:51:19] Yeah.

[00:51:20] Yeah.

[00:51:20] And the council is looking real thin right now, especially after she sent a broom off,

[00:51:26] uh, in a previous episode.

[00:51:27] Right.

[00:51:29] I wonder what he's up to.

[00:51:31] Yeah.

[00:51:31] Yeah.

[00:51:31] Nothing, right?

[00:51:32] We, well, he should be arriving at, um, at Harrenhal just about the time that the river

[00:51:39] lords are, are marshalling.

[00:51:42] Yep.

[00:51:43] So.

[00:51:44] All right.

[00:51:45] Well, any other thoughts about this scene?

[00:51:47] Nope.

[00:51:50] We'll be right back with more house of the dragon.

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[00:52:54] And we're back with more house of the dragon.

[00:53:00] Moving on to Mysaria rounding out the plan.

[00:53:03] Rhaenyra, excited about the prospect of more dragonriders, tries to search the histories

[00:53:08] again.

[00:53:09] Mysaria suggests she would do better to look for bastards as the Targaryen men have been

[00:53:14] busy.

[00:53:15] She emphasizes the reliability of small folk compared to other noble houses.

[00:53:19] I want to ask you, do you think that Mysaria is right that you can trust one of the small

[00:53:24] folk more, or do you think she is just trying to even the odds a little bit between the small

[00:53:30] folk and the nobles?

[00:53:32] That's an interesting angle.

[00:53:33] I hadn't actually thought about that because she has said that before, that her point of

[00:53:45] view, who she is, where she comes from, is from the small folk.

[00:53:50] For the realm.

[00:53:51] Sorry, I always have to quote Barras when I can.

[00:53:54] For the realm.

[00:53:54] For the realm.

[00:53:55] I have to cross my arms in the very cozy way he does.

[00:53:58] Right.

[00:53:59] And then, Eamon's, the woman who runs the house that Eamon goes to also said that, you

[00:54:06] know, when you princes fight, we're the ones, it's me who gets hurt.

[00:54:10] It's people like me who get hurt.

[00:54:12] Right.

[00:54:12] And so, for Mysaria to say that, to bring that up, is really interesting that you bring

[00:54:17] that up because I hadn't thought about it.

[00:54:19] I was just thinking more on the lines of Mysaria, again, proving value and proving her worth

[00:54:27] to her queen.

[00:54:28] She's given her a couple of really, I mean, she saved her life with the whole twins thing.

[00:54:34] You know, the whole food flotilla thing works as it was working out pretty well.

[00:54:38] This works out, you know, getting the dragon seeds works out pretty well.

[00:54:41] So, she's delivering a lot of really good tactical and strategic advice to Rhaenyra.

[00:54:48] So, that was where my thinking was going.

[00:54:50] But the fact that she actually might be thinking of the point of view that the small folk are

[00:54:57] actually a little bit more honorable in this position rather than your full-blood brothers

[00:55:01] who are, you know, who are being real assholes, being real shits here.

[00:55:06] Right.

[00:55:07] Yeah, they're a little sneaky, those Targaryen brothers.

[00:55:13] But I do like how Mysaria is like laughing.

[00:55:15] She's like, you're all obsessed about these scrolls.

[00:55:18] I can find you a hundred Targaryens by throwing a stone in King's Landing.

[00:55:23] What's the line?

[00:55:24] The sheets in the wood pile.

[00:55:27] Right.

[00:55:27] The bedsheets in the wood piles.

[00:55:29] Look under those.

[00:55:31] That's really good.

[00:55:32] This, and it, the whole, the whole issue of raising this army of bastards and, you know,

[00:55:39] bringing the lowborn up, you know, obviously Jace deals, you know, we've got, he has to

[00:55:44] confront that later on.

[00:55:46] He has a big confrontation about it.

[00:55:47] So, you know, one of the themes that we were dealing with before in earlier episodes was

[00:55:54] sort of young versus old, right?

[00:55:56] The imperative of youth versus the, you know, wisdom and countenance of the old people versus

[00:56:04] now we've got, well, who's more honorable?

[00:56:08] You know, small folk or high, high born or low born.

[00:56:11] Right.

[00:56:12] Right.

[00:56:13] And who has access to power and who's wielding power.

[00:56:16] Right.

[00:56:17] My, and it's interesting because Rhaenyra basically says, look, I get what you're saying, but the

[00:56:25] nobles know the rules of the game.

[00:56:27] Hmm.

[00:56:27] Hmm.

[00:56:28] And I think what Missari's point is exactly, they know the rules of the game and they know

[00:56:34] how to break them and they know how to manipulate.

[00:56:37] Hmm.

[00:56:37] Hmm.

[00:56:37] Whereas the small folk will be, you know, grateful for what you've given them.

[00:56:42] The question is, is that true?

[00:56:44] Will they be happy, you know, just being raised up?

[00:56:48] Will they, will they let go of any resentment they held towards the walls before?

[00:56:53] Or, uh, and, and will they, will they even come to Rhaenyra side to begin with?

[00:56:58] Right.

[00:56:58] Like what if Adam had chosen the green right then?

[00:57:01] What if Adam was just like, you know what?

[00:57:02] I don't think a woman should be able to roll.

[00:57:04] I'm going to go to King's Landing and pledge to them.

[00:57:07] Hmm.

[00:57:08] Would have been a bad time for Rhaenyra.

[00:57:09] Or I'm going to go across the sea and, uh, you know, pick one of the free cities and

[00:57:14] I've got a dragon.

[00:57:15] Nobody else does.

[00:57:15] Find my brother, you know?

[00:57:17] Yeah, exactly.

[00:57:19] Yeah.

[00:57:20] That's interesting.

[00:57:20] Uh, well, as Masari says, the order of things has changed.

[00:57:26] Right.

[00:57:27] And the question is, is it changing in Rhaenyra's favor?

[00:57:31] Hmm.

[00:57:33] That's going to be interesting.

[00:57:34] Sure will.

[00:57:35] Sure will.

[00:57:37] All right.

[00:57:38] Let's go to Adam meeting Corliss, which is again, another short scene, but essentially

[00:57:44] Adam walks into a room.

[00:57:46] He admires all his new stuff and Corliss comes and.

[00:57:51] Greets him.

[00:57:52] Congratulates him on claiming a dragon and does not say hi, son.

[00:57:58] Clearly does not, uh, recognize his, uh, patronage there.

[00:58:03] They're doing a really good job of aging Corliss.

[00:58:05] Can I say that?

[00:58:06] Like he does look noticeably older than last season.

[00:58:09] Mm-hmm.

[00:58:11] Yeah.

[00:58:11] And, and he has had to recover from like near death.

[00:58:15] Right.

[00:58:16] So it takes a while.

[00:58:17] The body doesn't, um, heal as fast as it, as it gets older.

[00:58:21] Right.

[00:58:22] This is where, uh, Cyrus posted a, uh, a screenshot in our discord as well of, of Corliss at the

[00:58:27] door with, uh, Adam in front of him saying, you know, this looks like an oil painting.

[00:58:31] And it absolutely does.

[00:58:32] It's just the visuals of the scene where, where beautiful.

[00:58:36] They've gotten a lot better with the lighting in the season.

[00:58:38] Last season I had a lot of complaints.

[00:58:40] So this season I really have none.

[00:58:42] Adam's really funny here too.

[00:58:44] He's so uncomfortable in this room.

[00:58:46] He doesn't, he's, he's probably starving.

[00:58:48] Like, oh yeah, I've just been riding around on a dragon.

[00:58:51] I'm, I'm a little hungry.

[00:58:53] Uh, but he won't even touch the figs on the table, you know, or whatever they were.

[00:58:56] Cause it's just like, oh, this is just so weird for me to be in this space.

[00:59:02] Right.

[00:59:03] To be a guest in this space.

[00:59:05] I don't know how to interact with this.

[00:59:06] Again, do the, do the low born know the rules?

[00:59:10] Right.

[00:59:11] Right.

[00:59:12] That's the question.

[00:59:13] And I think it's interesting because Adam does know some of the rules because he does,

[00:59:20] he comes correct when Corliss comes in and he says, you know, I ask your leave.

[00:59:26] Can I, you know, I need your permission because my queen has, you know, our queen has asked

[00:59:33] me to be a dragon writer, but I'm still initially pledged to you as a shipwright.

[00:59:38] So, you know, you've got to give, you know, I'm in a bind here.

[00:59:42] So I need to ask your permission to be able to do this other thing.

[00:59:46] And that's, that's kind of correct in a way, right?

[00:59:48] Sort of, uh, allegiance wise, you know, he's, he's got to get, uh, get clear, which

[00:59:54] is interesting because we have another young guy in this episode who does something very

[00:59:59] correctly in terms of these power politics as well later on.

[01:00:03] Right.

[01:00:03] Right.

[01:00:04] Oscar.

[01:00:05] Yeah.

[01:00:06] Very interesting stuff.

[01:00:08] Very interesting stuff.

[01:00:09] I am curious to see where Adam will go with all this.

[01:00:12] And if Corliss will ever say, hello, son, come to Thanksgiving.

[01:00:16] Mm-hmm.

[01:00:17] Dragon's giving, whatever.

[01:00:20] You know, something interesting that, uh, Corliss says to Alan later, I guess I'm just

[01:00:26] going to jump to it now is, you know, we might be Valyrian, but we're not dragon riders.

[01:00:32] So what is your mother's parentage?

[01:00:35] Because it should not have come from me.

[01:00:37] That's a good point.

[01:00:38] That's a good point.

[01:00:39] So, so again, uh, in the, in the wood pile, there was somebody else who was, uh, fire and

[01:00:48] blood.

[01:00:50] Right.

[01:00:50] Cause that's the whole thing, right?

[01:00:51] I mean, Laenor and Lena did not have dragons because they were Valyrians, but because their

[01:00:57] mother was Rhaenys Targaryen.

[01:00:59] Mm-hmm.

[01:01:01] Anyway, something to chew on.

[01:01:03] Yeah, no, I think that's, that's actually a really good point.

[01:01:06] Hadn't, hadn't quite thought that as well.

[01:01:09] Yeah.

[01:01:09] Because if they're, but then Alan is saying he's Sultan seat, but they're, they're full

[01:01:18] brothers, aren't they?

[01:01:19] Maybe.

[01:01:20] I think, I think Adam even says last episode, like, well, we think we might be full brothers.

[01:01:25] You know, it's, it's kind of, it's kind of in the air.

[01:01:28] I don't think that they, uh, what is, was it that Adam said was like, my family is not

[01:01:34] the kind to keep records.

[01:01:35] Yeah.

[01:01:36] That's right.

[01:01:37] That's what the line was.

[01:01:38] Right.

[01:01:38] Because Rhaenyra is like, oh, what's your noble birth?

[01:01:41] And Adam's like, no, shut it down.

[01:01:45] No idea.

[01:01:46] Anyway.

[01:01:48] The new Lord Tully's in town.

[01:01:51] Oscar Tully meets Daemon, who tries to manipulate him immediately.

[01:01:56] When Daemon presses him, he stands by his grandsire's oath to Rhaenyra.

[01:02:01] As they address the river Lords, Oscar meets opposition to his rule.

[01:02:05] If it leads to serving Daemon, Oscar forces Daemon to take responsibility for the atrocities

[01:02:11] committed against the Blackwoods and to execute Willem Blackwood.

[01:02:16] Sorry.

[01:02:16] Against the Brackens.

[01:02:18] I have to change that in the show guide.

[01:02:19] Against the Brackens were the atrocities.

[01:02:24] This was a pretty big scene, I think.

[01:02:27] Yeah.

[01:02:28] I mean, good for, good for Oscar over there.

[01:02:31] Yeah.

[01:02:32] Great scene when we're coming up on Harrenhal at the beginning, at the very beginning of

[01:02:38] this.

[01:02:40] There's two things that I noticed was one, we get a greatest, just the establishing shot

[01:02:45] of Harrenhal and then the writers going along.

[01:02:49] That's Oscar, you know, with a couple of guards in front of him.

[01:02:52] And if you don't know to look for him there, it's easy to miss him riding by.

[01:02:57] But at the same time, as they're riding sort of from right to left on the screen, flying

[01:03:03] overhead from left to right in the sky is a bird, and I'm guessing it's a raven.

[01:03:10] Right.

[01:03:11] And later, when Alicent is laying in the, you know, or floating in the pool, she sees a bird

[01:03:19] flying overhead as well.

[01:03:21] So, and earlier in the season, we had the point of view of a raven flying.

[01:03:27] Going to, what's the Stark's, Winterfell.

[01:03:33] Yeah.

[01:03:34] Yeah.

[01:03:34] And it's just interesting shots that we don't ever, we haven't ever seen these kinds of

[01:03:40] points of view before in this world.

[01:03:42] And I don't know how much significance either seeing these two birds in this episode have,

[01:03:50] other than it's just visually interesting at a minimum.

[01:03:53] But is there, is this one of those little things where later on by the end of the season,

[01:03:57] we'll be like, oh yeah, there was that bird that flew by.

[01:04:00] That was that thing, that message that came through or what have you.

[01:04:03] You know what I mean?

[01:04:04] One of those little, right.

[01:04:05] One of those little mechanical bits that the writers put in and just that little attention

[01:04:09] in detail, like the rats on the table.

[01:04:11] Right.

[01:04:12] Right.

[01:04:12] And, you know, going to the wall too, I wanted to mention, I forgot to say it before when

[01:04:17] we had the Kingsboroughs going to the wall, but we haven't seen anything going on there

[01:04:22] for the entire season since episode one.

[01:04:24] Right.

[01:04:25] And now we are going to have two people who are buddies with Aegon with eyes at the wall.

[01:04:32] And I just wonder, and I'm not waffling anything.

[01:04:35] I just, I'm wondering if they're going to do something with that in the show.

[01:04:39] Hmm.

[01:04:40] Interesting.

[01:04:40] Is to have eyes in the North.

[01:04:42] Hmm.

[01:04:43] Okay.

[01:04:45] Interesting.

[01:04:46] Okay.

[01:04:46] Something to chew on.

[01:04:47] Yep.

[01:04:47] Fair enough.

[01:04:48] Fair enough.

[01:04:50] Drip, drip, drip with Damon.

[01:04:53] There's just constant like water, little water dripping things going on around him when he's

[01:04:59] sleeping or when he's sitting here trying to think there's water dripping in, you know,

[01:05:04] there's had leaks over his bed and this kind of stuff.

[01:05:07] And it's just a great way to signal the fact that, you know, is this guy going slowly insane?

[01:05:12] You know, is he really bluesing his marbles?

[01:05:15] I think he's lost his marbles quite so.

[01:05:18] I mean, you know, you remember in Hook, there's that guy who lost his marbles.

[01:05:22] I'm going to say that's, that's Damon at this point.

[01:05:25] Right.

[01:05:26] Yeah.

[01:05:27] Go ahead.

[01:05:28] Well, I was going to say, is this set up for the Targaryens going crazy later on in the

[01:05:33] histories between the...

[01:05:34] I don't think so.

[01:05:35] Okay.

[01:05:35] I think this is just witchy, witchy, witchy.

[01:05:38] Okay.

[01:05:39] And again, I, there was no like Damon in Harrenhal going crazy plot like this in the book.

[01:05:45] This is all Joe Christian.

[01:05:47] Yeah.

[01:05:47] I mean, he does go to Harrenhal, but I, it's not like this elaborate kind of thing.

[01:05:51] And so I don't know exactly where they're going with it.

[01:05:54] I hope it's going somewhere.

[01:05:55] My one critique of this season basically is just this plot line is just dragging.

[01:06:01] And there was a, a, a person who wrote in last week, I don't remember who it was, who

[01:06:07] said, I wonder if they just wanted to keep Matt Smith as a regular.

[01:06:12] Hmm.

[01:06:12] And I kind of think that.

[01:06:14] Okay.

[01:06:14] I kind of think that's where we are because Damon's story just kind of slowed down for

[01:06:18] a while and they wanted to keep him in the season.

[01:06:21] So they just wrote this in.

[01:06:22] I just think it was a mistake.

[01:06:24] That'd be a shame because that'd be the one place where we do see the hand of the writer

[01:06:28] in this season, right?

[01:06:29] When we're just at the beginning of this podcast, I was saying, oh, they're doing such a good

[01:06:33] job of us not seeing that kind of mechanical, uh, forcing of characters or actors into, into

[01:06:40] stuff.

[01:06:41] So that would be kind of a bummer if that, that was the case.

[01:06:45] I think it may be.

[01:06:46] So do you want to talk about that quick?

[01:06:48] The, uh, Viserys offering Damon, the crown.

[01:06:51] Sure.

[01:06:53] Uh, and then we'll come back, back to the, uh, come back to the river Lords.

[01:06:57] Yeah.

[01:06:57] We could talk more about that, but let's, let's finish up our demon thought.

[01:07:00] Sure.

[01:07:02] What do you think this whole scene is about?

[01:07:04] I mean, Viserys is like, Hey, you want it?

[01:07:07] This, all of his visions.

[01:07:09] I was trying to think about that today.

[01:07:11] Like what is, what did this one particularly mean?

[01:07:15] And it's less, you know, ghosts of, uh, past, present, future, you know, Scrooge McDuck kind

[01:07:24] of situation.

[01:07:25] I think in more his inner psyche, these are all the different ghosts that are in him and

[01:07:35] his different desires, his different regrets, his different ambitions, his different hopes

[01:07:41] for things.

[01:07:43] So this is really his psyche, I think, turned inside out.

[01:07:47] Okay.

[01:07:48] And so in one moment we have, um, his wife, I got to go to the character guide, um, and

[01:07:55] look up on the deceased column, try to remember her name now.

[01:07:58] Lena.

[01:07:59] Thank you.

[01:08:00] Lena saying, Hey, there's a war happening.

[01:08:03] Things are getting a little dicey.

[01:08:05] Have you checked in on our kids to, um, you know, his, you know, grieving with his brother

[01:08:14] to, you know, this whole conversation of you've always wanted the crown, you know, do you still

[01:08:19] want it?

[01:08:20] Right.

[01:08:20] You know, these are just all these different aspects of, of his inner life and inner personality.

[01:08:27] Right.

[01:08:28] That's the best I can make of it.

[01:08:30] I mean, I don't know what, what you might be thinking or what other people are thinking.

[01:08:33] I have no better clue than you do.

[01:08:36] Okay.

[01:08:37] It is a weird situation here with Damon and I don't know exactly where they're going with

[01:08:43] it, but, um, back to the river lords.

[01:08:45] Oh, well, quickly.

[01:08:47] Oh, go ahead.

[01:08:47] Go ahead.

[01:08:48] It was really fun to see, um, Patty Constantine again actually have words in this, in this

[01:08:54] particular episode.

[01:08:54] Is it?

[01:08:56] I do like Patty Constantine a lot.

[01:08:58] He's so good.

[01:08:59] Uh, and I think actually you've got him like several times in this season now that I think

[01:09:03] about it.

[01:09:03] But my, my other thought was that black Phillip that we saw there, the goat in the corner

[01:09:08] of when, when Damon's walking up the stairs, he looks over into a corner of another room

[01:09:13] and there's a goat over there.

[01:09:16] That's the second time we've seen a goat.

[01:09:17] Exactly.

[01:09:18] Yeah.

[01:09:18] And Abby had mentioned something about the goats and the dogs and some other little seeding

[01:09:23] things of, of, you know, future houses that will be occupying Harrenhal.

[01:09:28] But this particular goat seemed a little bit more like black Phillip from, uh, V.

[01:09:33] Vitch, you know, the, the, the horror film, right?

[01:09:37] You know, the bad goat.

[01:09:38] Yeah.

[01:09:38] Yeah.

[01:09:40] I could see it.

[01:09:41] I could see it.

[01:09:42] I think, you know, uh, I, I accidentally 40 and slipped Damon as demon last week and,

[01:09:48] and Alicia was like, Oh, well that fits.

[01:09:50] And yeah, that is an archaic spelling of demon.

[01:09:53] Right.

[01:09:53] So yeah, that totally seeing his own demon.

[01:09:56] Maybe that's the whole thing, right?

[01:09:57] He's, he's looking at his inner demons.

[01:09:59] I think so.

[01:09:59] I think that's exactly what it is.

[01:10:01] All right.

[01:10:02] But to the river Lords again, what do you think about how, how Oscar kind of handled them?

[01:10:10] Oscar, like it'd be one thing to, to kind of handle Damon or kind of handle the river

[01:10:16] Lords a little bit and you kind of muddle through and, and, and things work out.

[01:10:22] But this was like pure genius level manipulation and running the rapids of, uh, all of this.

[01:10:34] Cause it would have been very easy for him to come a foul of, uh, different sub factions within

[01:10:40] the river Lords of pissing off his King consort to the point that, you know, he gets his head

[01:10:45] cut off rather than you push Damon too far.

[01:10:47] And that's that like, people not even think about it.

[01:10:52] Simon, Simon's looks a couple of times when Oscar challenges him and Simon's like a highbrow

[01:10:57] raised, like, Oh dear.

[01:10:59] I think there's even a line where he says, Oh dear.

[01:11:01] He does.

[01:11:01] Yeah.

[01:11:03] Simon is, is excellent comic relief.

[01:11:05] And I did not expect him to be that when we first met him.

[01:11:08] So good.

[01:11:08] Such a great, great character.

[01:11:10] You need to clip that, uh, that Oh dear line for your soundboard.

[01:11:14] That'd be a good one.

[01:11:16] Uh, but yeah, Oscar.

[01:11:18] Great, great actor.

[01:11:19] Great job by, by this guy.

[01:11:22] I mean, can you imagine, uh, being Archie Barnes, the, the actor playing Oscar playing against

[01:11:29] Matt Smith in the, especially the opening scene where there's a lot of challenge going on and,

[01:11:36] uh, you know, and really pushing back against this, not only this character, but this actor,

[01:11:43] you know, Matt Smith, it's just, you know, who's a powerful, you know, actor and you're

[01:11:49] just this kid actor like, Oh gosh, here I am.

[01:11:52] Right.

[01:11:52] Exactly.

[01:11:53] Um, yeah.

[01:11:54] Yeah.

[01:11:55] I mean, great for him.

[01:11:56] It's very hard to be very hard to go up against Matt Smith.

[01:11:59] Although he does seem like a joy to work with.

[01:12:01] I'm sure.

[01:12:02] Actually, I'm sure he was very like, Oh yeah, let's do it this way.

[01:12:06] And here's how we can do it better.

[01:12:07] You know?

[01:12:07] I just feel like he's a joy of a person who's playing an awful person right now.

[01:12:11] Yeah.

[01:12:12] The, um, the fact that Oscar is able to go, well, look, you know, the, um, house Tully

[01:12:20] by tradition, the reason we're in the position that we are and that we're able to keep the

[01:12:26] peace among the river lords is because of our oaths and traditions.

[01:12:30] And we swore an oath to Rhaenyra to break that oath would be to undo everything that we

[01:12:36] are and who we are.

[01:12:38] And for such a young guy to be able to see that so clearly and then exercise power from

[01:12:47] that stance is really exceptional.

[01:12:51] Like it's a really dicey situation.

[01:12:53] Right.

[01:12:54] It's tough.

[01:12:56] It's tough.

[01:12:56] I, and I think he's navigating it really well and better than most could.

[01:13:00] Yeah.

[01:13:00] I don't think we've seen anybody.

[01:13:02] I really don't think we've seen anybody play Damon quite like a fiddle the way that

[01:13:07] he has.

[01:13:09] And Damon does the math and he's like, well, yep, I guess I got to kill this guy.

[01:13:15] Yeah.

[01:13:16] When he, when, when he decides to act, you know, he acts swiftly.

[01:13:20] So that's good.

[01:13:21] Right.

[01:13:21] You know, and get it over with, get, get through it.

[01:13:23] Well, I don't know.

[01:13:24] I think, I think, uh, Willem Blackwood was really like, oh, this is not what I was expecting

[01:13:30] from this.

[01:13:30] I thought I was getting in with the King, the King.

[01:13:34] And, and he does call him a Prince, by the way, Oscar calls him a Prince at one point

[01:13:38] during this whole thing, which I thought was great.

[01:13:42] And this, uh, this whole point of his house, the Tullys have pledged their allegiance to

[01:13:50] Vizzy T, right?

[01:13:52] Right.

[01:13:52] And Vizzy T said, Rhaenyra is my heir.

[01:13:55] So they're like, okay, cool.

[01:13:57] Right.

[01:13:57] We transfer to the heir.

[01:14:00] And then Damon's trying to go, but I am the power here, right?

[01:14:04] I am the King, not King Consort, the King.

[01:14:08] Mm-hmm.

[01:14:08] And, um, you know, Oscar's trying to navigate that whole little thing there going, no, we

[01:14:15] didn't pledge to you, Damon.

[01:14:16] We pledged to your queen, right?

[01:14:18] You're, you're the representative of the crown here.

[01:14:21] Right.

[01:14:22] But Damon keeps saying and keeps flexing, oh, you know, to me, you've, you've, you've sworn

[01:14:28] to me, to me, to me.

[01:14:30] And Oscar just keeps looking at him and I'm like, no, I didn't swear to you.

[01:14:34] I swore to the queen.

[01:14:35] Right.

[01:14:36] But Damon keeps hearing what he wants to hear, right?

[01:14:39] He keeps saying, well, you know, I'm, I'm the power in this situation.

[01:14:42] Right.

[01:14:44] He's like, do not mess with me.

[01:14:46] Mm-hmm.

[01:14:47] And, uh, everyone keeps messing with him.

[01:14:49] That's the thing is Damon is a weak man who wants to be strong.

[01:14:52] That's really, that's really what it is.

[01:14:54] Whereas I think you, you look at, um, you know, Rhaenyra and she's very much a strong woman

[01:15:02] who is being forced to be weak by her counsel.

[01:15:05] They're kind of mirrors there.

[01:15:07] Yeah.

[01:15:08] And then Rhaenyra, finally, this episode is just like, you know what?

[01:15:12] I'm gonna, I'm gonna be strong.

[01:15:14] At the same time, I think Rhaenyra has kind of been pushed into this very hasty, short

[01:15:18] sighted plan because she was not allowed to act in any other way all season.

[01:15:23] Mm-hmm.

[01:15:26] Mm-hmm.

[01:15:27] Interesting.

[01:15:28] It's tough character motivations.

[01:15:29] I think, I think they're doing a really good job of painting a complex picture.

[01:15:32] Yeah.

[01:15:32] I've seen some like complaints of like not a lot's happening this season.

[01:15:34] And I'm like, I don't know, I, I don't think you understand that the action isn't just the

[01:15:39] dragon battles.

[01:15:40] Right.

[01:15:40] No, this is as much a character drama as it is a, yeah, dragon, you know, fight scene stuff.

[01:15:46] Right.

[01:15:46] In fact, I think that the character stuff is more interesting than any of the fight scenes.

[01:15:50] I've always thought that way about the Game of Thrones stuff.

[01:15:53] All of the fight scenes result from characters doing something or not doing something, either

[01:15:59] growing or not growing or, or getting entangled with each other.

[01:16:03] Right.

[01:16:04] Right.

[01:16:04] We wouldn't have this whole war if Alicent and Rhaenyra were just, you know, if, if the

[01:16:08] bad blood between them didn't come to what it was.

[01:16:12] Exactly.

[01:16:13] Exactly.

[01:16:14] And so you need that.

[01:16:15] And I'm glad you, you, you know, that Alicent and Rhaenyra were much different in age in

[01:16:20] the book.

[01:16:20] Right.

[01:16:21] Right.

[01:16:22] Younger, right.

[01:16:22] Much, much, much younger.

[01:16:24] Well, actually Rhaenyra was about the same age.

[01:16:26] I think maybe a little bit younger, but the, um, but, uh, Alicent was basically her like

[01:16:32] actual step-mom.

[01:16:32] Like she was a generational or, oh, oh, oh, no, I hadn't, no, I had no idea.

[01:16:36] They made that choice when they went into the series to do this this way.

[01:16:40] I think it paid off.

[01:16:42] Um, but yeah, I mean, I, I think that they really made a choice when they did this show

[01:16:48] to make sure that it focused on character drama and it worked.

[01:16:51] Mm-hmm.

[01:16:52] Yeah.

[01:16:53] And, and I think this is what we were talking about before, you know, the, the lifespan of

[01:16:59] this show, the, the structure of the seasons and the storylines that are going on here.

[01:17:07] If it were just, uh, dragons and fighting and blood and gore, I, I don't know.

[01:17:13] It'd be, it would be empty fare.

[01:17:14] It'd be kind of cotton candy.

[01:17:15] It looks pretty.

[01:17:16] Game of Thrones season eight.

[01:17:19] Exactly.

[01:17:20] Exactly.

[01:17:21] It would be empty calories.

[01:17:23] And where, where this is a season, like when we did our season one rewatch, it was as satisfying

[01:17:29] as anything.

[01:17:30] It really held up really well.

[01:17:32] Right.

[01:17:33] Because character work was happening.

[01:17:35] Right.

[01:17:35] Not just, um, you know, uh, blood and dragons.

[01:17:38] Right.

[01:17:40] All right.

[01:17:40] Let's move on.

[01:17:42] We've got to get to Aegon's physical therapy.

[01:17:44] Obviously, Larys arrives to check on Aegon's physical therapy under Grand Maester Orwell.

[01:17:50] When Aegon falls, Larys insists Orwell must be more cautious, but that it must continue.

[01:17:59] Tom Glyn Carney is having a hell of a season.

[01:18:03] Yeah.

[01:18:04] And he, he makes me feel so badly for a person that I've thought the entire time was kind of

[01:18:09] a vile person.

[01:18:10] Exactly.

[01:18:11] And his act, even in this scene where he doesn't really say much, he just screams.

[01:18:16] He's just eating the cedar.

[01:18:18] He's just pushing it to, to the maximum.

[01:18:21] Doing a great job.

[01:18:22] Doing a great job.

[01:18:23] So much fun.

[01:18:24] Something else I noticed in this scene too was the, uh, the incense pot, the incense pot

[01:18:28] that was in the window was like just spewing smoke out.

[01:18:34] So I was just thinking, oh, how bad does it stink in this room?

[01:18:39] Probably a lot.

[01:18:40] Yeah.

[01:18:41] Probably a lot.

[01:18:41] I think you're right.

[01:18:42] Yikes.

[01:18:44] Not great.

[01:18:45] Yikes.

[01:18:47] So, Larys.

[01:18:50] Mm-hmm.

[01:18:51] What's, we, we've been wondering what his real game is this whole season.

[01:18:58] And, you know, oh, you know, just, oh, shadow power.

[01:19:01] But he's clearly in Aegon's corner here.

[01:19:05] Well, I think now he is.

[01:19:07] Now that, now that he realized that he can't control.

[01:19:10] Aemon.

[01:19:11] But before that, I think it was very debatable what was going on here.

[01:19:15] Okay.

[01:19:15] Okay.

[01:19:15] You think he would have gone with Aemon if he didn't real, didn't come to the realization.

[01:19:20] If Aemon would have made him hand there, he would never have thought of Aegon again.

[01:19:24] He might've even killed him himself.

[01:19:25] Interesting.

[01:19:26] Okay.

[01:19:27] All right.

[01:19:27] He's playing both sides.

[01:19:29] So that way he always comes out on top.

[01:19:30] That's a quote from Otoe Sonny in Philadelphia.

[01:19:32] But I think it applies here, right?

[01:19:34] Like he just plays whatever side he thinks is going to get him a little further.

[01:19:37] Okay.

[01:19:39] Because it's interesting.

[01:19:40] He also has a very clear sense of the rehab that, you know, needs to happen for somebody because, you know, because of his own condition.

[01:19:50] Yeah.

[01:19:50] Your gait will adjust, right?

[01:19:51] Like that was, that was an interesting.

[01:19:53] Every time somebody mentions gait, I think of that stupid lock in Kaleidoscope where they had to match the gait of the owner.

[01:20:00] Right.

[01:20:01] Yes.

[01:20:02] That, that again, one of the dumbest plot points I've ever seen in my life.

[01:20:07] They thought it was really clever and it really wasn't.

[01:20:10] Yeah.

[01:20:13] But yeah, it's, it's interesting to see Laris try to kind of bond, but also be really like, he needs to get better now because we don't have time.

[01:20:20] His brother is crazy.

[01:20:22] Hmm.

[01:20:23] Hmm.

[01:20:23] I didn't read the, the, the, the hastiness, but that's a really good point that it's, he's like, yeah, you got to keep working with him.

[01:20:31] You got to make sure that the guards alert you sooner in case anybody comes because this is secret, right?

[01:20:35] This is all secret rehab that's happening.

[01:20:37] And I think that in Laris's view, the longer that, the longer that Aegon stays incapacitated, the longer that Eamon is in power, the more he cements himself as the rightful leader.

[01:20:49] Totally.

[01:20:49] Totally.

[01:20:50] Totally.

[01:20:50] The harder is it can get rid of him.

[01:20:51] So we got to fix this now.

[01:20:52] Mm-hmm.

[01:20:52] Otherwise, this is going to be a permanent change, even if you do survive.

[01:20:57] Yeah.

[01:20:57] You're never going to fully get rid of him unless you're going to, you're going to be forced

[01:21:01] to abdicate the throne or something.

[01:21:02] Sure.

[01:21:02] Which I think is very possible with the way Eamon is running.

[01:21:06] But it's going to be, man, that's going to be, that's a tough road for Aegon to, to go, right?

[01:21:10] Yeah.

[01:21:10] To actually get to the point of being able to sit at council meetings and, and, and, you know, preside over court and, you know, hearing the petitions of the small folk and all of the stuff that a king has to do.

[01:21:23] Right.

[01:21:25] Can he do it?

[01:21:26] Yeah.

[01:21:27] We'll have to find out.

[01:21:28] Wafo.

[01:21:28] Somebody asked if we have a Wafo sticker in the discord yet.

[01:21:31] Oh.

[01:21:31] I need one.

[01:21:32] That's good.

[01:21:32] I need one.

[01:21:33] As much as I didn't want that one to stick, it has stuck.

[01:21:36] It has.

[01:21:37] It's, it's stuck more than, than any of the others.

[01:21:39] Yeah.

[01:21:40] All right.

[01:21:42] Salt and sea.

[01:21:43] Corliss strikes out again when he tries to recruit Alan of Hull to the Dragon Rider Hunger Games.

[01:21:50] As Bela described Raina, Alan describes himself as salt and sea.

[01:21:57] Yeah.

[01:21:57] Quick scene here between father and son.

[01:22:02] Uh, he's, it's an interesting relationship because, uh, Adam now is like actually in the castle and Alan is, uh, over here.

[01:22:18] And yet Corliss can't bring himself to relate to either of these two men as anything but just normal vassals.

[01:22:29] Right.

[01:22:30] And can I just say kind of hilarious that Corliss has tried to give Driftmark to two people now.

[01:22:37] And well, I guess he didn't explicitly do that here, but I think he was basically trying to do that here.

[01:22:41] He's been trying to like get someone to be his successor twice now.

[01:22:45] And everyone's like, I don't want that.

[01:22:46] No, thank you.

[01:22:48] No, thank you.

[01:22:49] I don't, I don't want to be a Lord or a lady.

[01:22:52] I just want to do my own thing, but thank you.

[01:22:55] And as a second son, he was, he's fought hard for Driftmark, right?

[01:23:01] He's fought hard for the Driftwood throne and now he can't give it away.

[01:23:06] Wait, Corliss?

[01:23:07] He's not a second son.

[01:23:08] Yeah, that's, yeah, he's a second son.

[01:23:10] He's not.

[01:23:11] No, he's not.

[01:23:12] He said he was.

[01:23:12] He said he was.

[01:23:13] He was the second son.

[01:23:13] Hmm?

[01:23:14] The way he tried to, so the way that Corliss did the second son thing is he said,

[01:23:18] the Valerians are the second sons to the Targaryens.

[01:23:22] Right, right, right, right, right.

[01:23:22] That's, you're right, you're right.

[01:23:24] Yeah, he said basically my house is a second son.

[01:23:27] Yeah.

[01:23:27] So that's how I know how you are, Damon.

[01:23:29] Good point.

[01:23:30] Yeah, so the fact that he's.

[01:23:31] Before we get at it, sorry.

[01:23:32] Yeah, yeah, no, no, it's a good correction.

[01:23:34] It's a correct correction.

[01:23:36] But the way that he's tried to build, I guess the way to say it then would be the way that

[01:23:40] he's tried to build up Driftmark and now he can't give it away.

[01:23:46] Like nobody wants his throne.

[01:23:48] Right, which is kind of crazy.

[01:23:50] Like who is his successor right now?

[01:23:52] I don't think we know.

[01:23:53] He doesn't have one at all.

[01:23:56] Well, by default, it would go to the eldest male descendant, right?

[01:24:00] Which would be Joffrey Valerian.

[01:24:03] Right.

[01:24:04] In kindergarten, as they say in Good Will Hunting.

[01:24:07] And he's just being packed off to the free cities.

[01:24:10] Or not the free cities, but to.

[01:24:12] He's actually going to stay in the Vale.

[01:24:14] Oh, right.

[01:24:15] Okay.

[01:24:15] He's staying in the Vale and then the others are going to Pentos.

[01:24:19] Bravo or Pentos?

[01:24:20] Pentos.

[01:24:21] Pentos.

[01:24:23] Yep.

[01:24:24] Yep.

[01:24:24] So I thought they were going to set up some sort of invasion or flotilla, some sort of

[01:24:28] secret plot that was going to carry over for a couple of episodes here.

[01:24:32] And I'm just really glad they just told us exactly what was happening.

[01:24:36] No, this is what we're doing.

[01:24:37] This is why you need to go do your mission and just really move the plot forward.

[01:24:42] I was just very grateful that we didn't have any more hidden agendas.

[01:24:48] Yeah.

[01:24:49] Yeah.

[01:24:49] You know, again, people who are saying that not a lot has been happening in these episodes,

[01:24:53] compare this to an episode of Game of Thrones early on.

[01:24:56] Mm-hmm.

[01:24:57] We are moving at lightning breakneck speed.

[01:25:00] Because the Game of Thrones plot did not move very fast, which was one of its strengths,

[01:25:04] right?

[01:25:04] We would sit there and we would walk through the forest with Arya and the Hound and it

[01:25:09] would be a great conversation and people will be talking about it for weeks and it would

[01:25:12] take us forever to get from here to there.

[01:25:15] And then they went at breakneck speed and it didn't work.

[01:25:17] I think it does work here.

[01:25:18] I think in part because most of the story takes place in the Blackwater Bay, like in this one

[01:25:24] body of water.

[01:25:25] It's true.

[01:25:26] But yeah, I think it's just I don't understand the whole nothing's happening plot.

[01:25:31] This is a ton of stuff.

[01:25:32] And speaking of stuff happening, Reyna is about to try again.

[01:25:36] Jane Arryn sends the Targaryens and Valerians on their way to Pentos.

[01:25:42] When she looks away, Reyna runs off to find a wild dragon.

[01:25:49] So my first thought of this was that's a pretty small retinue to be transporting such, you know,

[01:25:56] escorting such precious cargo.

[01:25:58] Or do you want it to be small so you're inconspicuous?

[01:26:01] Yeah, but still, it still seemed pretty thin to me.

[01:26:06] I would have been very nervous.

[01:26:08] They got a long way to go.

[01:26:09] Maybe they'll pick up some more people on the road.

[01:26:12] Maybe the main unit is further down.

[01:26:13] Yeah.

[01:26:15] They're just getting to the boat right now.

[01:26:18] And Jane Arryn didn't seem to be very happy or sad that they were leaving.

[01:26:25] She seemed pretty cold-hearted at the gate there.

[01:26:28] I think she's been that way all season.

[01:26:30] Just very emotionless the whole time.

[01:26:33] Not happy about having some dragon hatchlings.

[01:26:37] Right.

[01:26:38] Right.

[01:26:39] So which dragon is this that's out there?

[01:26:41] Is this the sheep stealer that everybody keeps talking about?

[01:26:44] Yeah.

[01:26:46] It's not the most creative name George has ever made.

[01:26:50] Yeah, I guess we could just say it's sheep stealer.

[01:26:52] It doesn't really give anything away.

[01:26:54] It just tells you what it does.

[01:26:56] Yeah.

[01:26:56] Well, clearly they've been showing us that with the burnt sheep's carcasses.

[01:27:00] I wonder if they'll change it in the show because it's such a lame name.

[01:27:05] They haven't said anything officially, have they?

[01:27:07] No, they haven't said a name.

[01:27:09] That's why I was hesitant to use it.

[01:27:11] Yeah.

[01:27:11] Okay.

[01:27:12] Because, yeah, I was looking in the bestiary on the show guide and you don't have one there.

[01:27:16] So I was like, hmm.

[01:27:17] You got to have a name.

[01:27:18] Right.

[01:27:18] You got to have a name to get in.

[01:27:20] Okay.

[01:27:21] Also, again, I was just like, do I say sheep stealer?

[01:27:23] But again, it's not really like a cool Valeria name, right?

[01:27:27] It just tells you what it does.

[01:27:28] Hmm.

[01:27:29] That's true.

[01:27:30] Okay.

[01:27:31] So we'll see.

[01:27:32] Well, that could be one, two, three, four, five.

[01:27:37] That could be five dragons.

[01:27:38] Like if she gets one.

[01:27:40] Yeah.

[01:27:41] Right.

[01:27:41] Is that right?

[01:27:42] Am I counting right?

[01:27:43] Caraxes, Cyrax, Vermax.

[01:27:46] Right.

[01:27:47] That Vermax is too young though, right?

[01:27:49] No, Vermax is fine.

[01:27:50] Okay.

[01:27:51] He's reds.

[01:27:51] He's good.

[01:27:52] Oh, right.

[01:27:53] Right.

[01:27:53] A moon dancer.

[01:27:54] That's what?

[01:27:55] One, two, three, four.

[01:27:58] Silver wing, sea smoke, and Vermasaur.

[01:28:01] So that's six.

[01:28:03] That could be seven dragons that they would have.

[01:28:06] They've got the numbers if they get sheep stealer.

[01:28:09] Right.

[01:28:10] That's, yeah.

[01:28:11] That's pretty significant.

[01:28:12] And you see, even at the end of this episode, Aben sees, you know, several dragons on Dragon

[01:28:19] Zone.

[01:28:19] He's like, I don't know if I could do that.

[01:28:22] Yeah.

[01:28:22] He's like, no.

[01:28:23] He backs off.

[01:28:23] And when have we ever seen him be cautious?

[01:28:26] Never.

[01:28:26] Never.

[01:28:27] Not like that.

[01:28:28] Not when he's, you know, in sort of hot pursuit.

[01:28:31] Right.

[01:28:33] All right.

[01:28:33] Shall we go to Allison's field trip?

[01:28:37] Mm-hmm.

[01:28:37] Mm-hmm.

[01:28:37] She arrives at the Kingswood with Rickard Thorne.

[01:28:41] When he asks when they will return to the Red Keep, she replies, yeah, I'm not sure I really

[01:28:45] will.

[01:28:46] Yeah.

[01:28:48] Not much to say, a lot, not a lot to say on this episode, on this particular scene.

[01:28:52] It's really just to communicate to us that she's not going back to the keep anytime soon.

[01:28:59] I think it's funny that, you know, you see his face and he basically looks like, as the

[01:29:04] kids say, we are so cooked.

[01:29:05] But, like, we are, something's wrong here.

[01:29:08] Yeah.

[01:29:09] I don't know what's going on.

[01:29:10] This job was never that hard, and now it is, and I don't know what I'm doing.

[01:29:14] My queen is sleeping into this, like, lean-to tent.

[01:29:18] Good night.

[01:29:19] I'm going to bed in this, like, burlap sack in the forest.

[01:29:22] Right.

[01:29:23] Very strange.

[01:29:24] I really think she's, the whole point of this retreat is she's trying to recapture her

[01:29:27] childhood.

[01:29:28] Right?

[01:29:29] She's really trying to.

[01:29:30] Like, she probably went on walks here with Vraera, right?

[01:29:33] She probably went on little campouts.

[01:29:34] They did the hunt in the Kingswood when she had her first child.

[01:29:37] And I think she's really trying to recapture some of her innocence.

[01:29:42] Okay.

[01:29:43] She hasn't felt very innocent recently, has she?

[01:29:45] No.

[01:29:45] She's felt very guilty.

[01:29:47] Yeah.

[01:29:48] All right.

[01:29:50] Jay speaks his mind.

[01:29:51] He speaks to his mother very openly of his true father, Harwin Strong.

[01:29:55] He says the only thing making him a legitimate heir in the eyes of the realm is his dragon,

[01:30:01] and worries that giving silver-haired bastards dragons will only make him be challenged after

[01:30:06] her death.

[01:30:07] All right.

[01:30:08] This has generated, I think, the most debate in our Discord.

[01:30:13] Okay.

[01:30:13] But before we get to that, I just want to say, how the fuck do I pronounce this name?

[01:30:18] Because they keep saying Jacaris in some scenes, and then Jacaris is what his mother just called

[01:30:24] him.

[01:30:25] So I don't know what it is.

[01:30:26] If anyone asks me about how to pronounce it, I'm calling you out.

[01:30:29] They have not given me a consistent thing, and the showrunners should be embarrassed.

[01:30:35] Who's your dialogue coach?

[01:30:36] I'm going to keep that Deadpool line forever.

[01:30:38] All right.

[01:30:39] Did you see the movie?

[01:30:40] Yeah.

[01:30:41] I'm talking with Alicia and Jean about it tomorrow morning.

[01:30:43] Oh, very good.

[01:30:46] I don't think I'm going to make it to the movie, so I'm glad that you're able to join

[01:30:50] them.

[01:30:50] Did you enjoy it?

[01:30:51] You've got to see it.

[01:30:52] It's very good.

[01:30:53] Okay.

[01:30:53] And it's a lot of fun.

[01:30:55] I would recommend seeing it on the big screen.

[01:30:57] Okay.

[01:30:57] I just, Deadpool was never really a big character for me, so.

[01:31:01] You like Wolverine, though?

[01:31:05] Okay.

[01:31:06] Okay.

[01:31:06] See, for me, the X-Men universe of Marvel, the X-Men sort of focus is my favorite part

[01:31:14] of Marvel.

[01:31:15] That's the one that's always felt more legit to me.

[01:31:17] Right.

[01:31:18] I like how they're kind of a ragtag group, and so, yeah, I was glad to see this.

[01:31:23] I was very glad to see this.

[01:31:24] And I will say, if you have been following, which I know you have, if you've been following

[01:31:28] superhero movies since they started with the original X-Men movie, this whole, and even

[01:31:34] beyond, even before that, into like the nascent superhero movie genre, this is basically a

[01:31:40] love letter and eulogy for everything that came before.

[01:31:44] Oh, wow.

[01:31:46] Okay.

[01:31:46] That's what this movie is, really.

[01:31:47] It's not just Deadpool.

[01:31:49] Wow.

[01:31:49] All right.

[01:31:50] Well, I'm glad there's a summer superhero blockbuster that actually has worked itself

[01:31:56] out as opposed to some of the other stuff that they've tried to be.

[01:31:59] I was so pleasantly surprised.

[01:32:00] In fact, I would say it's less about the plot and it's more about let's say goodbye to the

[01:32:04] Fox universe.

[01:32:06] Wow.

[01:32:06] Wow.

[01:32:07] Okay.

[01:32:08] Interesting.

[01:32:08] That's good to hear.

[01:32:10] I'll have to listen to your hot takes on the podcast.

[01:32:12] Oh, yeah.

[01:32:13] Oh, yeah.

[01:32:13] So anyway, back to House of the Dragon.

[01:32:15] Let's get to the debate.

[01:32:17] Let's get to the debate, the great Jace debate, which is, was Jace right here and does it

[01:32:24] matter?

[01:32:26] Two separate questions.

[01:32:27] Take them one at a time.

[01:32:29] It doesn't matter.

[01:32:30] His feelings don't matter in this moment.

[01:32:33] Okay.

[01:32:36] It's fine that he has feelings and it's fine that he's expressing them with his mother.

[01:32:41] And one thing I noticed, and we've talked about this before, she doesn't just blow him off

[01:32:46] or slap him, but she goes up to him and they have this sort of intimate moment, you know,

[01:32:50] and he's trying to, she's trying to work it out with him.

[01:32:53] But I think that's what she leaves him with at the end, which is, you know, yeah, I don't

[01:32:58] like that we have to do this, but we're doing this.

[01:33:01] So, you know, sorry, kid.

[01:33:04] You just got to figure out how you're going to deal with this.

[01:33:07] And he stomps off, right?

[01:33:09] And he's got no power to change it and no power to affect what happens.

[01:33:15] Do you think that, so to put aside feelings, do you think that he's right that this will

[01:33:21] only lead to challenges after her death?

[01:33:25] Because I think that point has merit.

[01:33:28] Look at what situation they're in right now.

[01:33:31] Like Viserys named her heir.

[01:33:33] He explicitly told the realm publicly many times, this is my heir.

[01:33:37] And after they died, after he died, the Greens were just like, no, let's go back to the yield

[01:33:45] standard.

[01:33:46] And people mostly went along with it in King's Landing because they're not going to rock the

[01:33:51] boat.

[01:33:51] So the question is, after Rhaenyra dies, will they want this person who is very obviously

[01:33:57] a bastard who has the look of a Targaryen or not?

[01:34:04] Well, and who says it?

[01:34:06] I forget who says the line that men will pay more to sleep with a silver haired woman.

[01:34:12] Hugh, right?

[01:34:13] Because he was talking about his mother.

[01:34:14] Which, by the way, I've seen people incorrectly saying this was Seyra, which was one of the

[01:34:20] daughters of Jaehaerys, the old king.

[01:34:24] And that cannot be true because Hugh said, didn't Hugh say that my mother had brothers

[01:34:31] Viserys and Daemon?

[01:34:33] Yeah, isn't he?

[01:34:34] Hugh is like more up the line, right?

[01:34:36] Yeah.

[01:34:37] So we are two generations removed here.

[01:34:40] Or we're one generation removed from where Sero would need to be.

[01:34:43] So I just think that that theory is incorrect, but maybe it's an homage.

[01:34:48] I actually read that his mother was a Targaryen bastard herself, not a trueborn Targaryen.

[01:34:56] Okay.

[01:34:58] Anyway.

[01:34:59] Well, yeah, I don't know.

[01:35:00] I'd have to see a chart because I can't keep that kind of stuff in my head.

[01:35:05] But anyway, the point being, does that open up the question?

[01:35:11] Does it?

[01:35:13] I mean, I kind of go back to the answer or the question that our friend Varys had, which

[01:35:21] is, you know, who actually has power in any given situation?

[01:35:27] And if you can, if a bastard, if a lowborn child can build support, build an army and, you

[01:35:38] know, gather people to their cause, then do they have more legitimacy?

[01:35:45] Because what does Rhaenyra say?

[01:35:47] She says, oh, we're the legitimate heirs.

[01:35:50] And Jay says, why?

[01:35:51] Because we've got dragons?

[01:35:52] Right.

[01:35:53] You know, so who, again, this, I think this all goes back to this question of who has the

[01:36:01] ability to access and use power?

[01:36:05] And how do you generate access or how do you gather power?

[01:36:09] I think it's all an interesting question.

[01:36:11] On an individual basis, would any of these dragon seeds be able to pull something off?

[01:36:18] I don't think so.

[01:36:20] Well, I don't know.

[01:36:21] Look at the size of their dragons compared to Vermax.

[01:36:23] But they're inexperienced riders, right?

[01:36:27] But those dragons aren't inexperienced.

[01:36:29] That's true.

[01:36:29] That's a really good point.

[01:36:30] That's a great point.

[01:36:31] In fact, Vermithor lived while there was war.

[01:36:34] Mm-hmm.

[01:36:35] So this is actually a battle-hardened dragon.

[01:36:37] I think Hugh tells Vermithor to attack Vermax and you're done.

[01:36:41] Mm.

[01:36:42] That's a good point.

[01:36:44] Yeah.

[01:36:45] I don't know.

[01:36:46] I think the question is interesting and I'm really interested to see how they not answer the question but examine the question.

[01:36:56] Yeah.

[01:36:57] Because it's this whole question of legitimacy, right?

[01:37:00] I really do see the validity of Jace's point here which is what is the point of winning a war to install a claim that is uncertain?

[01:37:13] Mm-hmm.

[01:37:13] Why make this even shakier than it is?

[01:37:18] The whole thing that she's trying to do is to minimize the bloodshed, right?

[01:37:25] Mm-hmm.

[01:37:25] And she's trying to do it as fast as possible.

[01:37:28] She's hoping that with dragon superiority, she can get them to capitulate.

[01:37:33] Mm-hmm.

[01:37:34] I think that's what she would like mostly.

[01:37:38] And if there has to be some small battles, so be it, there'd be some small battles.

[01:37:42] But to forestall large-scale death and destruction.

[01:37:47] Right.

[01:37:48] But then does this strategy of elevating these dragon seeds actually create more future conflict potential?

[01:37:56] Like a generation later is what I'm saying.

[01:37:58] It's like look at the way that Viserys would put like short-term thanksgivings in, you know, taking precedence over long-term stability of the realm and look where it got us.

[01:38:09] I think that, I think Jace has a good point here.

[01:38:12] And I'm not even doing a Wafo thing.

[01:38:13] I'm just, I'm just speculating on, on what he's saying.

[01:38:18] He's feeling very threatened individually, personally, right?

[01:38:21] And then this whole question of the legitimacy of his birth.

[01:38:25] On paper, he's legitimate.

[01:38:28] But in practical, in biological terms, he's not and everybody knows it.

[01:38:34] And so he's challenged and feeling threatened and confused about his own lineage.

[01:38:40] But yeah, the larger political point, I hadn't really gone down that road very far.

[01:38:46] Yeah, I, I, I see, I see where people are saying like, oh, he's in the wrong.

[01:38:52] And I, I understand why that is.

[01:38:53] But I think they're really just saying that not because he is in the wrong politically.

[01:38:58] I think they're, they're sensing that this is coming from a really defensive and insecure place, which it is.

[01:39:04] But that doesn't mean that he doesn't have a political point here.

[01:39:09] Exactly.

[01:39:10] Which is, this could go really bad for us, mom.

[01:39:13] I think the thing that caught me in this scene when he uses the line, these people.

[01:39:23] And, you know, when we talk about our own social and political history in the United States, you know, these people, you know, there, there's a, that's a very charged phrase.

[01:39:37] And he drops it in this line.

[01:39:40] And so I think it, it really gets everybody activated.

[01:39:45] It's a very activating phrase.

[01:39:47] And so it opens up the question in a different way.

[01:39:52] But if we think about the political ramifications of what he's actually trying to point to, which is what you're saying, which is he's got a point here.

[01:40:00] He's got a very legitimate point here, which is what are we doing?

[01:40:04] And is this really good long-term decision?

[01:40:06] You can have a good idea with impure motivations, right?

[01:40:12] Like that's not mutually exclusive.

[01:40:15] And I think that's what we're missing here.

[01:40:17] Yeah.

[01:40:17] So again, there's a lot happening in this episode, even though it doesn't seem like it.

[01:40:23] Or if it gets blown up because, you know, we have a big dragon barbecue cookout at the end of this episode.

[01:40:30] There's a lot more subtle stuff that's happening significantly, significant stuff happening in this episode.

[01:40:35] Right.

[01:40:36] Speaking of other things happening in this episode, we are taking a break.

[01:40:42] We'll be right back with more House of the Dragon.

[01:40:51] And we're back with more House of the Dragon.

[01:40:57] So Missaria posts on ZipRecruiter.

[01:41:00] You too could get ZipRecruiter.

[01:41:01] I just like doing fake ad breaks.

[01:41:03] We're not sponsored by them.

[01:41:04] Don't worry.

[01:41:05] As far as I know.

[01:41:06] Someday we could be, and then you could do them for real.

[01:41:09] I think I'd be good at finding the places to do host red ads.

[01:41:13] Yeah.

[01:41:14] All right.

[01:41:14] So Missaria sends the job advertisement to her people in King's Landing, leading Ulf and many other silver-haired bastards to answer the call.

[01:41:24] Not a lot of substance here, but you know.

[01:41:27] I love a montage.

[01:41:29] Yeah.

[01:41:29] I'll say that.

[01:41:30] I enjoyed seeing a montage.

[01:41:32] We haven't got a lot of montages in this season so far.

[01:41:36] So it was kind of fun.

[01:41:38] It was good.

[01:41:38] I thought of Linda, though, running around the streets in a very red cloak, in a very sort of red riding hood cloak.

[01:41:44] It was a little bit like, oh, yeah, the lady in red.

[01:41:47] Yeah, yeah.

[01:41:47] I saw her just a minute ago.

[01:41:49] I mean, if anybody wanted to follow up on where these rumors were coming from, she's not looking inconspicuous.

[01:41:56] That's one of those things where it's like, all right, the showrunners want us to be able to track her, so that's fine.

[01:42:01] Good point.

[01:42:01] Yeah.

[01:42:01] And let's just pretend she's not so conspicuous to anyone but the audience.

[01:42:07] And shame on Laris' spy network for not picking up on this whole subplot, right, that they've got cooking.

[01:42:17] Unless he did and he didn't say anything.

[01:42:21] They didn't tell us that, though.

[01:42:23] No.

[01:42:24] But there's always room for that.

[01:42:25] They don't show us anything.

[01:42:26] Yeah.

[01:42:27] Okay.

[01:42:27] Anyway, still, it's a big miss.

[01:42:29] It's still a big miss.

[01:42:30] Even if that is a ploy, it's not one that I think you'd want to get caught having done or not done.

[01:42:38] You know what I mean?

[01:42:39] Right.

[01:42:39] Like, it looks bad.

[01:42:40] It just looks bad.

[01:42:41] I see.

[01:42:42] I'm picking up what you're putting down.

[01:42:43] I get what you're saying.

[01:42:44] I did like Hugh and –

[01:42:46] Well, I was just going to say I did like the way that they unfolded the montage with the camera, the way it was following her around.

[01:42:55] And then if you look, like, the first people that she goes to talk to are some washerwomen.

[01:43:02] And then the camera – Alinda's off to the right side of the frame, I think.

[01:43:07] And then they're slowly creeping on two women who are sitting against a wall and they have a washing bucket and they're washing.

[01:43:15] And if you look, the one woman is kind of looking up at Alinda and she's got, you know, big blonde hair, right?

[01:43:21] Big blonde Targaryen hair.

[01:43:22] It's like, oh, that's good.

[01:43:23] Or she goes to a smithy and then there's a guy who kind of follows her and he's got blonde hair.

[01:43:29] So they seed these people very carefully into the background.

[01:43:36] They look like background actors.

[01:43:37] But they're actually the targets of this whole thing.

[01:43:41] Yeah.

[01:43:42] And again, the Targaryen men have been busy.

[01:43:46] Very busy.

[01:43:47] Very busy.

[01:43:48] Oh, boy.

[01:43:49] This was a really funny – great comic relief.

[01:43:54] Yeah, I did like – they're like, oh, you should do it.

[01:43:56] Oh, my knee.

[01:44:00] I'd be first in line if it weren't for my injury.

[01:44:04] Joke's on him.

[01:44:05] He's the one who's going to succeed.

[01:44:07] Exactly.

[01:44:09] Although I think anyone who would have stumbled on Silverwing would have succeeded.

[01:44:14] Silverwing looks like she just wanted a friend.

[01:44:16] Just a friend.

[01:44:16] Man, I'm lonely down here.

[01:44:18] No other dragons will play with me.

[01:44:19] Right.

[01:44:20] Right.

[01:44:20] I think if Ulf had ended up in front of Vermithor, dead immediately.

[01:44:25] Instant.

[01:44:27] Well, he did get knocked over.

[01:44:29] That's in the scene when he gets – he actually gets headbutted off to the side.

[01:44:33] Yeah, he stumbles down to –

[01:44:35] No, no, he gets knocked.

[01:44:36] That's what I mean.

[01:44:37] That's what I mean.

[01:44:37] Like he –

[01:44:38] Oh, right, right.

[01:44:38] He stumbles through life.

[01:44:40] Yes.

[01:44:40] And as part of that, he got knocked down into the caverns of – the lost caverns of Dragon Mount.

[01:44:49] So, Hugh, our other dragonseed, he tells Kat of his intention to answer the call to Dragonstone now that their child has passed away.

[01:44:59] Very sad.

[01:45:00] He tells her of his mother's parentage as she claimed to be the sister of Viserys and Daemon.

[01:45:07] Kat does not approve of the plan.

[01:45:10] Yeah, I really thought that this was top-notch storytelling, like not going through the whole, oh, our daughter died, but just like, you know, here we are catching up to these two characters and here's their reality now.

[01:45:26] And we didn't – you know, by not telling us of the – you know, not actually showing their daughter dying on screen, by just having it as a fact, a condition of where they are now, I think it has more of an effect as if they would have showed it to us.

[01:45:44] Yeah, I think so.

[01:45:45] And it's a really good character motivation for him to be like, I have nothing left.

[01:45:49] I'm going to go scream in a giant dragon's face until he lets me ride him.

[01:45:54] That's a good point.

[01:45:55] It really made me feel like this is a man with nothing left to lose.

[01:45:59] Mm-hmm.

[01:46:00] Mm-hmm.

[01:46:01] And it nicely counterbalances the previous scene with Ulf and the sort of humor.

[01:46:07] This was very gravely serious.

[01:46:09] And a man who – you know, Ulf wants to preserve everything as the way it is right now.

[01:46:14] He wants to drink for free forever.

[01:46:16] You know, it's not a bad plan.

[01:46:19] No.

[01:46:19] He does get free drinks just by being like, I was once a Targaryen bastard.

[01:46:24] Countered and –

[01:46:26] Countered with Hugh, like, I got nothing left.

[01:46:29] Yeah.

[01:46:29] I'm going to go do this thing.

[01:46:31] Very different people.

[01:46:32] I think they're doing a really good job distinguishing the dragon seeds and not having them be like

[01:46:36] a homogenous group, which would have been very easy to do, right?

[01:46:41] Just get some blonde extras and have them be on the dragons.

[01:46:45] Cool.

[01:46:45] All right.

[01:46:46] Allicent has her crisis.

[01:46:48] She is wearing blue, as we said, and she walks to a body of water where she floats in peace.

[01:46:59] So, something that's – I don't know what they're doing all with this scene, but there was an interesting way that they opened it,

[01:47:06] which is a bird's eye view down of her walking through the forest.

[01:47:09] And then later, they flip it so that, you know, we have her looking up at the sky.

[01:47:15] And then we see a bird fly across the sky.

[01:47:19] And I posted this in our Discord.

[01:47:22] I took a screenshot of the bird flying overhead.

[01:47:24] And then I went on the internet and found, like, this silhouette of a raven flying in the air.

[01:47:30] And this very well could be a raven flying.

[01:47:34] The tail feathers are a little bit off, but whatever.

[01:47:36] You know, it's close enough.

[01:47:37] So, in this moment, when the bird flies overhead, she suddenly activates, flips over, and starts swimming.

[01:47:47] So, something about this – seeing this bird triggers her into, I'm not just going to float here and be inactive.

[01:47:55] I actually have a thought, an inspiration, an idea, or something I'm going to go do now.

[01:48:01] Okay.

[01:48:02] I like that interpretation.

[01:48:04] Yeah.

[01:48:04] Also, I think, you know, water has always been this, like, baptismal cleansing kind of theme that people use in media.

[01:48:12] And here we are.

[01:48:14] Allison's trying to wash away her sins, of which there are many.

[01:48:19] It's very beautiful when she walks into the – it's very Lady of the Lake Inn kind of way of her walking out into there.

[01:48:26] But, yeah, that's a really good point.

[01:48:27] I hadn't thought about that.

[01:48:28] She's wearing white, and she's going to baptize and have her sins washed away.

[01:48:32] Totally.

[01:48:32] It could very well be an adult baptismal gown.

[01:48:35] Yeah.

[01:48:35] I got it.

[01:48:36] I like that.

[01:48:37] It's better than the, I think, Lady of the Lake.

[01:48:40] Yeah.

[01:48:40] I see where you're going with that.

[01:48:42] It was just a visual.

[01:48:43] It's just like, I don't know how we could fit that into the story.

[01:48:46] No, no.

[01:48:47] Watery tart throwing swords at people.

[01:48:49] It's not just a story.

[01:48:52] One thing I wanted to say visually about this, there's this great scene.

[01:48:56] I also posted a screenshot of this in our Discord, of her – the camera in the water looking up at the back of her head and her hair floating in the water.

[01:49:07] Mm-hmm.

[01:49:08] They actually, if you watch the scene a couple times, you'll notice that they actually run this clip backwards.

[01:49:16] Hmm.

[01:49:17] So that the hair, the way that the camera moves and the way that her body is moving relative to the camera, the way that they wanted to get the hair to – they wanted to introduce the shot and then have her – the camera panning.

[01:49:33] They have to run the shot backwards to get the effect that they wanted.

[01:49:38] It's just a very cool little piece of filmmaking.

[01:49:42] And it's just an incredibly beautiful shot of her hair streaming out.

[01:49:46] And the thing that it reminded me of was the threads in the tapestry.

[01:49:51] Just sort of on a visual rhyming standpoint, it just feels like those.

[01:49:55] Yeah.

[01:49:56] Yeah.

[01:49:57] I like that you caught that, that they reversed the footage because that's pretty cool.

[01:50:01] Yeah.

[01:50:02] It's fun.

[01:50:03] If you can get in there and scrub back and forth, rewind it a couple of times.

[01:50:07] You'll pick up on it.

[01:50:09] Nice.

[01:50:10] Want to go piss off some dragon keepers?

[01:50:13] Boy, they were not happy.

[01:50:14] They were not happy indeed.

[01:50:16] And the shot that they open up on of the cliffs of Dragonstone when they come in, I think, again, they're beautiful shots in this whole thing.

[01:50:27] They're giving us all these funky little different angles from different vantage points from up here down through there, looking through this archway.

[01:50:35] It's just such...

[01:50:37] I think we talked about this before.

[01:50:39] We may not be jetpacking around Westeros, but the show doesn't feel small because they're giving us these kinds of shots and different points of views.

[01:50:47] Yeah.

[01:50:47] I think it feels bigger this season.

[01:50:48] I think last season did feel a bit...

[01:50:51] Agreed.

[01:50:51] ...cramped.

[01:50:53] So the dragon seeds arrive at Dragonstone, where the dragon keepers protest the upcoming trials.

[01:50:59] Rhaenyra is shocked by the display of the dragon keepers, but proceeds with a pep talk for the attendees.

[01:51:06] Do you see the look on her face I got here?

[01:51:08] She's like, are you kidding?

[01:51:10] You're going to talk to me that way?

[01:51:13] She was...

[01:51:14] It's not an auspicious way to start this thing.

[01:51:17] This is a difficult thing that they're doing anyway, and to do it without dragon keepers?

[01:51:23] Yeah.

[01:51:24] Very difficult.

[01:51:26] Maribrand was looking like he was going to start punishing some of these dragon keepers.

[01:51:30] He was ready to beat on them.

[01:51:32] Yeah.

[01:51:33] At the same time, I think that she has a point where she goes, I thought I knew what it meant to claim a dragon.

[01:51:42] Apparently, I was wrong.

[01:51:43] Mm-hmm.

[01:51:44] And yeah, I think that she's right.

[01:51:47] These dragon keepers have been gatekeeping dragons in a way that doesn't make sense.

[01:51:55] That isn't really supported by facts, but it's just tradition.

[01:51:58] Mm-hmm.

[01:52:00] At the same time, he says the dragons are sacred.

[01:52:03] These are the magic of old Valyria and the last of it.

[01:52:07] What happens when you have competing factions?

[01:52:10] The reason the dragons have survived so long in Westeros is that one family had them.

[01:52:14] Mm-hmm.

[01:52:16] So, I think you have a point.

[01:52:19] I think that's a really interesting point because we don't have dragons in Game of Thrones.

[01:52:25] Right?

[01:52:26] Right.

[01:52:27] No one's seen a dragon in a very long time until Daenerys hatches her eggs.

[01:52:32] Because why?

[01:52:33] Because I think maybe what the dragon keeper is saying is, you know, this sad world, you know, if you start using dragons for your own short-sighted purposes, then we're not going to have them anymore.

[01:52:48] Right.

[01:52:49] Right.

[01:52:50] Yeah.

[01:52:50] Well, I guess that's something you're going to have to waffle.

[01:52:55] I mean, look, they spoiled the whole thing in Game of Thrones, but...

[01:52:59] Yeah, yeah.

[01:52:59] I mean, we don't have dragons there.

[01:53:01] Let's just not talk about the reasons.

[01:53:04] Right.

[01:53:04] Exactly.

[01:53:05] How we get there.

[01:53:06] That's the interesting bit.

[01:53:07] Which the reasons are in Game of Thrones 2 at certain points.

[01:53:10] So just to be clear, do not rewatch Game of Thrones until you finish this series unless you want to be spoiled.

[01:53:18] Oh, that's a good warning.

[01:53:19] That's actually probably pretty helpful.

[01:53:22] Certain characters say exactly what Raniro's future is.

[01:53:25] Huh.

[01:53:26] Okay.

[01:53:26] In Game of Thrones.

[01:53:27] All right.

[01:53:27] In the show.

[01:53:28] Not just the books, but in the show.

[01:53:30] Stay away from Game of Thrones.

[01:53:33] Yep.

[01:53:33] For the time being.

[01:53:35] Yep.

[01:53:35] She...

[01:53:36] It's interesting.

[01:53:37] I didn't really pick up on it on my first watch, but the second watch, how she's really trying to gaslight these poor bastards.

[01:53:43] Look, it's for a greater purpose.

[01:53:46] You know, you'll help end suffering.

[01:53:47] You know, it'll be great if you survive.

[01:53:50] She does give him...

[01:53:51] I don't know that she's giving him a choice, but she's also not saying,

[01:53:55] Look, you're just going to go pet a dragon at the petting zoo, and if you are successful, then you get to enroll in Raniro's magical dragon flying academy.

[01:54:07] Right.

[01:54:08] But she does lay it out to them.

[01:54:10] Like, you know, she actually says, if you survive.

[01:54:14] Right.

[01:54:16] Yeah, I think she does a good speech, and it sounds a lot like...

[01:54:21] Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice.

[01:54:23] Twice I am willing to make.

[01:54:27] Perfect.

[01:54:29] Yeah.

[01:54:30] All right, let's move on with the trials.

[01:54:32] Vermithor awakens.

[01:54:33] Raniro awakens Vermithor.

[01:54:35] When the first bastard tries to calm him, Vermithor goes on a rampage, killing most of the dragon seeds with fire or chewing them to death as Raniro's guards bar the doors.

[01:54:46] Ulf is knocked off the platform into the caverns in the dragon mount.

[01:54:50] The sound effects in this whole scene were wild.

[01:54:54] Did you like them?

[01:54:55] Because I didn't.

[01:54:56] Really?

[01:54:57] I did not like...

[01:54:58] It sounded like an EDM song.

[01:54:59] Like, I was like, when's the bass going to drop?

[01:55:03] Good point.

[01:55:04] Yeah.

[01:55:04] What is the bass going to drop?

[01:55:05] Somebody needs to remix that.

[01:55:08] There's a lot of remixing going on these days on TikTok.

[01:55:10] I know.

[01:55:11] I've seen it, and we don't talk about that on this podcast.

[01:55:13] But I hope everyone's enjoying, because I am.

[01:55:16] Very talented people out there.

[01:55:18] That's what I'm going to say.

[01:55:20] Yeah, no, I thought they were great.

[01:55:21] I thought they were wild.

[01:55:22] I've got my new TV.

[01:55:23] I'm pretty happy with the sound.

[01:55:25] And yeah, I was enjoying it.

[01:55:29] Fair enough.

[01:55:30] Fair enough.

[01:55:30] I guess it's a matter of preference there.

[01:55:32] But I was not with it.

[01:55:33] In fact, it's funny, because Maya was saying, like, oh, yeah, I really like that sound.

[01:55:37] I'm like, I did not.

[01:55:39] I'm just going to be quiet for now.

[01:55:40] Yeah.

[01:55:41] It's a you thing.

[01:55:42] Yeah.

[01:55:43] I think it is just a me thing.

[01:55:45] I will tell you who else was in trance, though.

[01:55:49] Rhaenyra was transfixed watching all of this happen.

[01:55:53] Yeah.

[01:55:53] And I don't know what to make of the looks on her face, because she was really locked in

[01:56:02] on what was going on.

[01:56:03] She wasn't looking away in horror.

[01:56:05] And in some, I don't know, wonder if it was like a fire and blood thing, right?

[01:56:10] She was like really feeling the dragon vibes in this moment.

[01:56:14] Yeah.

[01:56:15] That and, you know, I wanted to say they recreated a lot of the cover images of season one of Rhaenyra

[01:56:22] standing in front of Balerion and Rhaenyra standing in front of Cyrax.

[01:56:27] I think Rhaenyra standing in front of dragons is something that these showrunners love to show.

[01:56:33] Right.

[01:56:34] Well, this picture that you have in the show guide of her standing in front of Vermithor here,

[01:56:43] it's so gorgeous.

[01:56:44] Another one of these oil painting shots with, you know, Vermithor shrouded in darkness and

[01:56:52] Rhaenyra standing in front.

[01:56:53] Right.

[01:56:54] Right.

[01:56:54] Just incredible.

[01:56:55] Yeah.

[01:56:56] And then, of course, we get the horror of watching everyone burn alive on this platform.

[01:57:01] I mean, Vermithor goes from zero to ten immediately.

[01:57:05] He's like, do not come near me, you gangly little Targaryen bastard.

[01:57:11] When's the last time Vermithor's had a snack?

[01:57:13] Because...

[01:57:14] Yeah, right.

[01:57:15] Vermithor was certainly chomping down on anybody that they could get their hands on.

[01:57:20] I feel like the dragon keepers probably, like, keep a stock of sheep for them to munch on.

[01:57:27] But yeah.

[01:57:27] And did Vermithor actually eat any of these people?

[01:57:30] Yes.

[01:57:30] Okay.

[01:57:31] Yeah.

[01:57:31] I didn't know if Vermithor just chomped them or ate them.

[01:57:33] No, no.

[01:57:34] There was at least one, if not two, where we see Vermithor going,

[01:57:39] you know.

[01:57:40] Good for him.

[01:57:41] Snacking.

[01:57:41] Is it a he or she?

[01:57:42] Do we know?

[01:57:43] Vermithor is...

[01:57:44] Well, you know, the dragons are like, can they shift?

[01:57:47] I think Vermithor is generally referred to as a male dragon,

[01:57:50] and then Silverwing is generally referred to as a female dragon.

[01:57:54] I think...

[01:57:55] I think...

[01:57:56] Please at me.

[01:57:56] Please at me if you know.

[01:57:59] Right.

[01:57:59] We need some dragon maesters.

[01:58:00] Because Rhaenyra refers to him as the Bronze Fury.

[01:58:06] Is that the line?

[01:58:07] I mean, I know it's Bronze Fury, but I think Rhaenyra says he.

[01:58:12] I believe so.

[01:58:13] Yeah.

[01:58:14] Yeah.

[01:58:16] So, even in this horrific scene, there was some comical relief stuff,

[01:58:21] like the flaming body that comes flying down and lands in front of Ulf,

[01:58:25] or no, in front of Hugh as he's trying to run away.

[01:58:28] Mm-hmm.

[01:58:30] I don't know.

[01:58:30] It was funny.

[01:58:32] Yeah.

[01:58:33] Yeah.

[01:58:33] They try.

[01:58:34] Yeah.

[01:58:35] They try.

[01:58:35] And then, just the practical, and we talked about this already,

[01:58:39] so no need to go into detail about it,

[01:58:41] but just the balance of how they shot this scene.

[01:58:44] I can't tell if it's practical.

[01:58:46] I can't tell if it's CGI.

[01:58:47] I don't know what's going on from that standpoint,

[01:58:50] but it looked fucking good.

[01:58:52] Yeah.

[01:58:52] It all looked great.

[01:58:54] It really did.

[01:58:55] It really did.

[01:58:56] And the next scene, I think, is even more impressive with the whole CGI versus practical stuff.

[01:59:04] Hugh becoming a dragon rider.

[01:59:06] He comes face to face with Vermithor, and he responds well to Hugh screaming in his face.

[01:59:13] Yeah.

[01:59:13] I like how Vermithor just needed to be told to shut up.

[01:59:17] Right.

[01:59:18] Like, rah!

[01:59:20] And there's this thing that happens where they don't talk about it in the show,

[01:59:25] but we see it in the actors and their portrayal,

[01:59:27] that when a human and a dragon get into sync,

[01:59:32] we see it on the face of the dragon rider.

[01:59:35] There's this knowing that they have,

[01:59:38] and this, like, oh.

[01:59:41] Right.

[01:59:41] Yeah, we're connected.

[01:59:43] And so when Hugh is just like,

[01:59:45] yeah, we're connected!

[01:59:46] Right?

[01:59:47] Yep.

[01:59:48] Yep.

[01:59:49] It was good.

[01:59:50] And they do a really great job of, like,

[01:59:53] lighting the faces where it feels like the dragon is in front of them.

[01:59:56] Mm-hmm.

[01:59:58] Very impressive work.

[01:59:59] Ah, super good.

[02:00:00] Super good.

[02:00:01] And then I thought the episode was going to be over,

[02:00:04] and then it cuts to black,

[02:00:05] and then we get the scene with Ulf,

[02:00:07] and I was like, oh, whoa, we've got a whole extra.

[02:00:09] Yeah, but wait, there's more.

[02:00:09] That's right.

[02:00:11] Ulf stumbles into Silverwing.

[02:00:13] He steps on a clutch of dragon eggs

[02:00:16] as he stumbles through the caverns,

[02:00:17] finds himself with Silverwing,

[02:00:19] who is a lot more friendly than Vermithor,

[02:00:21] and invites Ulf aboard for a lovely ride.

[02:00:23] And Ulf even gets that look on his face,

[02:00:26] like, oh.

[02:00:27] I'm not going to die.

[02:00:30] Yeah, this is going to work out.

[02:00:32] Very cool.

[02:00:33] I love that he came here basically on a dare.

[02:00:35] Like, I triple dog dare you, Ulf,

[02:00:38] to go get a dragon.

[02:00:39] He couldn't stay there anymore

[02:00:41] and expect to get free drinks.

[02:00:43] Like, that was the end of it.

[02:00:44] It was like, no more free drinks or go die.

[02:00:48] Yep, buddy.

[02:00:49] Did you see Silverwing in the cave in the background

[02:00:52] when he first goes into that down there?

[02:00:57] Yeah, I saw Silverwing coming in.

[02:00:59] As soon as he fell, I was like,

[02:01:01] oh, he's got to run into Silverwing now.

[02:01:02] I mean, part of that is me knowing from the book

[02:01:04] that he's going to ride Silverwing.

[02:01:06] Right.

[02:01:06] But, yeah, just the minute he fell down there,

[02:01:09] I was like, oh, that's a clever way to do it.

[02:01:11] Yeah, and the dragon looks like a piece of rock.

[02:01:14] Mm-hmm.

[02:01:15] And I guess one of the questions is,

[02:01:19] surely one of these other bastards

[02:01:21] would be better at riding a dragon

[02:01:23] than this drunkard who has a bad knee.

[02:01:26] But this is a great explanation of how he,

[02:01:29] as opposed to the other, succeeded,

[02:01:31] rather than having like a formal,

[02:01:33] let's wait in line, somebody volunteer,

[02:01:35] first one to do it, gets them.

[02:01:37] Instead, we have Ulf literally just falling

[02:01:39] into Silverwing, basically.

[02:01:41] Yeah, yeah.

[02:01:42] I love that.

[02:01:43] That was an excellent, excellent adaptation

[02:01:45] from the book.

[02:01:46] Very cool.

[02:01:47] Ulf then spoils the plot for Aemond.

[02:01:50] He rides Silverwing above King's Landing

[02:01:52] where Aemond watches him from the council room.

[02:01:55] Do you like the way that they frame

[02:01:57] the dragon riders when they are holding on

[02:02:00] for dear life?

[02:02:00] Because sometimes I'm like,

[02:02:02] this looks like an animatronic.

[02:02:04] That's one place where, yeah,

[02:02:06] it can get a little bit,

[02:02:07] or you're not quite sure.

[02:02:10] But in this one,

[02:02:12] I posted this in the Discord as well.

[02:02:15] Ulf writing and holding on

[02:02:17] is very visually

[02:02:21] a very, very, very strong

[02:02:24] connection to

[02:02:25] a movie called Dr. Strangelove.

[02:02:28] I don't think you've,

[02:02:29] I would be surprised if you've-

[02:02:30] I have not watched it, no.

[02:02:31] Okay.

[02:02:32] So there's this great scene of

[02:02:33] Slim Pickens, very famous actor,

[02:02:36] riding an atomic bomb

[02:02:38] down onto its target

[02:02:40] and he's whooping and hollering

[02:02:41] like a Bronco rider.

[02:02:43] And so I posted

[02:02:45] the two side-by-side shots of that

[02:02:47] saying that that can't be coincidence.

[02:02:49] So people who know that scene

[02:02:51] know that scene

[02:02:51] and will recognize that.

[02:02:53] Okay.

[02:02:54] The connection.

[02:02:54] But it was very much

[02:02:55] of a Bronco riding-looking shot

[02:02:57] that Ulf riding here.

[02:02:59] You know,

[02:03:00] I'm just going to say

[02:03:01] something controversial here.

[02:03:02] I don't like

[02:03:04] the Star Wars cockpit shots either.

[02:03:06] Uh-huh.

[02:03:06] So I think that just might be

[02:03:09] something I don't like.

[02:03:10] Just amazing.

[02:03:11] I think I don't like it

[02:03:12] when I know that it's CGI

[02:03:14] or at least heavy,

[02:03:16] heavy pretending I'm in space

[02:03:18] or pretending I'm riding a dragon

[02:03:20] and then I get a close-up

[02:03:21] of the actor's face.

[02:03:22] It just feels so fake to me

[02:03:24] that it just takes me out of it.

[02:03:27] So I don't want any more

[02:03:29] and I know we will get more.

[02:03:31] But I don't like the close-ups

[02:03:33] of the dragon riders

[02:03:34] while they're riding

[02:03:35] and I don't like the cockpit shots

[02:03:37] in Star Wars.

[02:03:38] I'm going to get added for that one.

[02:03:39] And I hope I do

[02:03:40] because that's the name of the game.

[02:03:42] It's just triggering people

[02:03:43] enough to ride in.

[02:03:45] Right.

[02:03:45] Got it.

[02:03:46] Yes, that's true.

[02:03:48] Something that I was surprised at,

[02:03:50] Eamon rides out

[02:03:52] with no escort, right?

[02:03:53] He just bolts out

[02:03:54] to catch up with Vhagar.

[02:03:57] But it does take a little while

[02:04:00] to activate a dragon, right?

[02:04:01] It's not like the Air Force

[02:04:05] where they have pilots

[02:04:06] on five-minute standby,

[02:04:08] like literally in a break room

[02:04:12] next to their jets

[02:04:13] and their jets are warmed up

[02:04:15] and ready to take off

[02:04:16] in an instant.

[02:04:17] So if she's got

[02:04:18] three or four dragons,

[02:04:20] she could attack

[02:04:21] King's Landing

[02:04:23] very easily

[02:04:23] before anybody

[02:04:24] could mount a response.

[02:04:26] Especially they only have

[02:04:27] one dragon rider there.

[02:04:29] One dragon

[02:04:29] and one dragon rider.

[02:04:31] Right.

[02:04:32] Hmm.

[02:04:33] So, you know,

[02:04:34] I don't know why

[02:04:34] they don't exploit it,

[02:04:36] but, you know,

[02:04:36] it's certainly a flaw.

[02:04:38] Well, I think she's going

[02:04:39] to want to train

[02:04:40] the dragon riders

[02:04:41] before they go on

[02:04:42] a full expedition

[02:04:43] because Ulf certainly

[02:04:44] doesn't know

[02:04:45] how to control that dragon.

[02:04:47] So was this just an accident?

[02:04:48] Like, I think you said

[02:04:49] this on the hot take

[02:04:50] that Silverwing

[02:04:51] was just wanting to go,

[02:04:52] hey, I just want to go

[02:04:52] back to the Red Keep.

[02:04:54] Yeah, we used to hang out

[02:04:55] around there all the time,

[02:04:56] me and Vermi.

[02:04:57] And I'm just,

[02:04:58] I just want to,

[02:04:59] I mean, like,

[02:04:59] take a flight.

[02:05:00] Vermithor and Silverwing

[02:05:01] belong to husband and wife.

[02:05:03] Right.

[02:05:03] They belong to Jaehaerys

[02:05:04] and his wife,

[02:05:06] Alisand.

[02:05:06] So they were used

[02:05:08] to just riding together

[02:05:09] around the city

[02:05:09] and people were just like,

[02:05:10] oh, look,

[02:05:11] the king and queen

[02:05:11] are out riding today.

[02:05:13] You know?

[02:05:14] And I think that

[02:05:16] Silverwing hasn't gotten

[02:05:16] the memo

[02:05:17] that we're at war

[02:05:18] with that city.

[02:05:19] Right.

[02:05:19] We're not.

[02:05:20] Because, yeah,

[02:05:20] Silverwing's just been down

[02:05:21] and laying eggs

[02:05:22] and hanging out.

[02:05:23] Being lonely.

[02:05:25] Right.

[02:05:26] Yeah.

[02:05:26] Two things

[02:05:27] that I picked up on

[02:05:28] from this small council meeting

[02:05:32] with Eamond.

[02:05:34] One,

[02:05:34] that

[02:05:36] the Hightowers

[02:05:37] are beset

[02:05:38] by Beesbury

[02:05:39] and other

[02:05:41] Beesbury

[02:05:42] allied houses.

[02:05:43] So, like,

[02:05:44] there's a potential

[02:05:45] little thing

[02:05:45] going on down there.

[02:05:46] Yeah.

[02:05:47] But they mentioned

[02:05:48] Darion

[02:05:49] and that Darion's

[02:05:50] dragon has,

[02:05:51] Darion, thank you,

[02:05:52] Darion's dragon

[02:05:53] has taken flight

[02:05:55] and that

[02:05:56] it's going to,

[02:05:57] Darion is going to go

[02:05:58] join the Hightower host

[02:06:00] and when so,

[02:06:01] they will be

[02:06:02] sort of unstoppable.

[02:06:03] So,

[02:06:04] that's like a big

[02:06:05] piece of

[02:06:07] something.

[02:06:07] That's a big piece

[02:06:08] of intel.

[02:06:08] New dragon on the board.

[02:06:09] Yeah.

[02:06:09] Yeah.

[02:06:10] Yeah.

[02:06:10] And an army

[02:06:13] marching up

[02:06:14] from the reach.

[02:06:15] Yeah.

[02:06:16] Well, we've

[02:06:16] known about that.

[02:06:17] That has been,

[02:06:18] you know,

[02:06:19] the Hightowers

[02:06:20] have been trying

[02:06:21] to get from

[02:06:22] Old Town

[02:06:22] to King's Landing

[02:06:23] but

[02:06:24] they've been

[02:06:25] trying to meet

[02:06:26] up with

[02:06:26] the

[02:06:29] Tyrells

[02:06:29] in Highgarden

[02:06:30] but then there's

[02:06:31] this insurgency

[02:06:32] because of

[02:06:33] Kristen Cole

[02:06:34] stupidly killing

[02:06:34] Lord Beesbury

[02:06:35] which is amazing

[02:06:37] because that would

[02:06:38] have been a huge

[02:06:39] army that they

[02:06:41] could have just

[02:06:41] waltzed right into

[02:06:42] King's Landing

[02:06:43] and defended the

[02:06:43] whole city

[02:06:44] had Kristen Cole

[02:06:45] not been such a

[02:06:46] fucking moron.

[02:06:48] One guy

[02:06:49] ruined their shot

[02:06:50] to get this

[02:06:51] huge army to

[02:06:52] King's Landing.

[02:06:53] Wow.

[02:06:54] So I didn't

[02:06:55] realize that

[02:06:55] that's actually

[02:06:56] That's the guy

[02:06:57] he shoves into

[02:06:57] the chair.

[02:06:58] Right.

[02:07:00] I'm trying to

[02:07:00] find,

[02:07:00] do we have

[02:07:01] Beesbury in

[02:07:02] there?

[02:07:02] Yeah,

[02:07:02] there he is.

[02:07:03] Yeah,

[02:07:03] Lyman Beesbury.

[02:07:04] There he is.

[02:07:04] Yeah.

[02:07:06] Yep.

[02:07:07] He got shoved

[02:07:08] into his chair

[02:07:08] hard enough to die.

[02:07:09] Oh,

[02:07:09] that's right.

[02:07:10] Wait,

[02:07:11] his head

[02:07:12] got into

[02:07:12] the stone,

[02:07:13] wasn't it?

[02:07:16] I don't remember

[02:07:17] if it was the

[02:07:18] back of his head

[02:07:18] into the chair

[02:07:19] or the

[02:07:21] No,

[02:07:21] I think it was

[02:07:22] the back of the

[02:07:22] head into the

[02:07:23] chair.

[02:07:23] Oh,

[02:07:24] okay.

[02:07:24] Maybe I'm wrong.

[02:07:25] Yeah,

[02:07:25] no,

[02:07:25] I thought he

[02:07:25] knocked him

[02:07:26] down and his

[02:07:27] head hit the

[02:07:28] little balls,

[02:07:30] the little marble

[02:07:30] balls that they

[02:07:31] use.

[02:07:31] It could be,

[02:07:31] I could be

[02:07:32] misremembering.

[02:07:32] Anyway,

[02:07:33] the point is

[02:07:33] Kristen Cole

[02:07:33] killed him.

[02:07:34] We know that.

[02:07:35] And this was

[02:07:36] the same guy

[02:07:37] where they were

[02:07:37] like,

[02:07:38] nobody leaves

[02:07:38] the room,

[02:07:39] leave the body

[02:07:39] there.

[02:07:40] Right.

[02:07:40] Yeah.

[02:07:41] Yeah.

[02:07:42] Pretty dark.

[02:07:43] Pretty dark.

[02:07:43] And they knew

[02:07:44] immediately when

[02:07:45] people started

[02:07:46] disappearing that

[02:07:47] like that was

[02:07:48] the Greens

[02:07:48] doing it.

[02:07:49] So they're not

[02:07:50] happy with them.

[02:07:51] And yeah,

[02:07:52] all these people

[02:07:53] just pissing off,

[02:07:54] you know,

[02:07:54] the same way

[02:07:55] Damon pisses

[02:07:55] off the

[02:07:56] Riverlords.

[02:07:57] Cole ends

[02:07:58] up pissing off

[02:07:59] the half the

[02:08:00] people in the

[02:08:01] reach,

[02:08:01] it sounds like.

[02:08:03] And that's

[02:08:04] where Otto

[02:08:05] gets so frustrated

[02:08:06] with dealing

[02:08:06] with people at

[02:08:08] that level

[02:08:09] because it's

[02:08:09] like you're

[02:08:10] not seeing

[02:08:10] the bigger

[02:08:10] picture.

[02:08:11] You may be

[02:08:11] right in this

[02:08:12] little instance,

[02:08:13] but this little

[02:08:14] instance has

[02:08:15] wider implications

[02:08:16] or ramifications.

[02:08:17] Right.

[02:08:18] The rat

[02:08:19] catches.

[02:08:20] I love when

[02:08:21] he yells that.

[02:08:23] Yes.

[02:08:24] So good.

[02:08:25] Well,

[02:08:26] and then this

[02:08:26] final shot of

[02:08:27] Rhaenyra standing

[02:08:28] there with three

[02:08:29] dragons out of it,

[02:08:30] that's a pretty

[02:08:30] badass shot.

[02:08:32] Yeah.

[02:08:32] You know,

[02:08:33] Eamon seeing

[02:08:34] the dragon be

[02:08:34] like,

[02:08:34] get me to my

[02:08:35] dragon right

[02:08:36] now.

[02:08:37] He follows,

[02:08:38] I think he

[02:08:39] thought that he's

[02:08:39] like,

[02:08:40] okay,

[02:08:40] they got a

[02:08:41] rider for

[02:08:41] Seasmoak.

[02:08:42] I could still

[02:08:42] take Seasmoak

[02:08:43] and Cyrax.

[02:08:44] Easy because

[02:08:44] Seasmoak's

[02:08:45] pretty small.

[02:08:46] Yeah,

[02:08:46] especially

[02:08:46] compared to

[02:08:47] Vagar.

[02:08:48] Yeah.

[02:08:48] And so

[02:08:48] he gets there,

[02:08:50] he sees three

[02:08:50] dragons and he

[02:08:51] goes,

[02:08:51] fuck.

[02:08:52] And Cyrax wasn't

[02:08:53] even there.

[02:08:54] So he sees

[02:08:55] three dragons and

[02:08:56] then there's Cyrax

[02:08:57] and Vermax.

[02:08:58] I think he's

[02:08:59] like,

[02:09:00] this is going to

[02:09:01] be a problem

[02:09:01] now.

[02:09:02] I think he,

[02:09:03] next step for

[02:09:04] him,

[02:09:05] if it were me,

[02:09:06] I would try to

[02:09:06] convince Helena to

[02:09:07] ride Dreamfire so

[02:09:08] we at least had one

[02:09:09] more dragon.

[02:09:10] And at least be

[02:09:11] visible,

[02:09:12] right?

[02:09:12] Yeah.

[02:09:12] Flying around so

[02:09:14] that they know.

[02:09:14] that's a good

[02:09:15] point.

[02:09:16] Yeah.

[02:09:17] All right.

[02:09:19] That's the episode,

[02:09:20] isn't it?

[02:09:20] Yeah.

[02:09:21] Well,

[02:09:22] everyone,

[02:09:23] it's been a

[02:09:23] pleasure.

[02:09:24] You too can

[02:09:25] join the

[02:09:25] conversation by

[02:09:27] going to

[02:09:27] the lorehounds.com

[02:09:28] slash contact

[02:09:30] emailing HOTD

[02:09:31] at the lorehounds.com

[02:09:32] or posting in our

[02:09:34] discord and tagging

[02:09:35] two kids,

[02:09:35] two dogs.

[02:09:36] That is Nancy M,

[02:09:37] our hand of the

[02:09:38] pod.

[02:09:40] Any other notes

[02:09:40] on House of the

[02:09:41] Dragon before we

[02:09:42] get into our

[02:09:42] regular show

[02:09:43] notes?

[02:09:44] No,

[02:09:46] I think we're

[02:09:46] good.

[02:09:47] I'm,

[02:09:47] I'm,

[02:09:48] we've got one

[02:09:48] more to go

[02:09:49] and I think

[02:09:50] what are we

[02:09:51] going to do

[02:09:51] for,

[02:09:52] see,

[02:09:52] we haven't really

[02:09:53] talked about

[02:09:53] season wrap up

[02:09:54] stuff.

[02:09:54] Are we going

[02:09:54] to do a

[02:09:55] final wrap

[02:09:56] or just a

[02:09:57] regular feedback?

[02:09:58] Maybe we can

[02:09:58] just do a

[02:09:59] final feedback.

[02:10:00] Yeah,

[02:10:01] I do want

[02:10:01] to do a,

[02:10:04] I want to

[02:10:05] do a spoiler

[02:10:05] cast with

[02:10:06] Alicia.

[02:10:06] Okay.

[02:10:07] Because she's

[02:10:08] into the book

[02:10:08] spoilers too.

[02:10:09] And I kind of

[02:10:10] want to talk

[02:10:10] about where

[02:10:11] we're at,

[02:10:12] how they

[02:10:12] adapted certain

[02:10:13] things and

[02:10:13] what's next.

[02:10:15] You can get

[02:10:15] on with all

[02:10:16] your book

[02:10:17] cloakery.

[02:10:18] Exactly.

[02:10:19] Exactly.

[02:10:19] I think that

[02:10:20] would be a lot

[02:10:20] of fun for

[02:10:21] book readers.

[02:10:21] Yeah,

[02:10:22] I think,

[02:10:22] I think you

[02:10:23] guys should

[02:10:23] do that for

[02:10:24] sure.

[02:10:25] All right.

[02:10:27] This week's

[02:10:27] programming,

[02:10:28] which I didn't

[02:10:28] put together

[02:10:29] yet.

[02:10:30] We have a

[02:10:31] lot of

[02:10:31] podcasts.

[02:10:32] Actually,

[02:10:32] we have this,

[02:10:33] we have a

[02:10:34] feedback episode

[02:10:34] for House of

[02:10:35] the Dragon.

[02:10:35] Of course,

[02:10:36] if you missed

[02:10:36] it in your

[02:10:37] subscriber,

[02:10:37] you can get

[02:10:38] the bonus

[02:10:38] hot take

[02:10:39] that we just

[02:10:39] put out on

[02:10:40] Sunday night.

[02:10:41] My delirious

[02:10:42] hot take.

[02:10:43] I literally

[02:10:43] got off an

[02:10:44] airplane and

[02:10:44] then watched

[02:10:45] the episode

[02:10:45] and recorded.

[02:10:46] I know,

[02:10:47] I know.

[02:10:48] We've got

[02:10:49] an 11s episode

[02:10:50] where we're

[02:10:50] going to be

[02:10:51] talking about

[02:10:51] the Karate Kid

[02:10:52] that's also

[02:10:52] for our

[02:10:53] subscribers

[02:10:53] exclusively on

[02:10:54] Patreon and

[02:10:55] Supercast.

[02:10:56] We've got

[02:10:57] Deadpool v.

[02:10:58] Wolverine

[02:10:59] towards the end

[02:10:59] of the week

[02:11:00] will be coming

[02:11:00] out.

[02:11:01] We've still

[02:11:02] got the

[02:11:02] Acolyte season

[02:11:03] wrap up coming

[02:11:04] out this week

[02:11:06] and a

[02:11:07] Silmarillion

[02:11:07] story with

[02:11:08] New Better

[02:11:08] Do Better

[02:11:08] is coming out

[02:11:09] this week.

[02:11:09] So we have

[02:11:10] plenty of

[02:11:10] stuff coming.

[02:11:12] Do not fear

[02:11:12] your feeds

[02:11:13] will be

[02:11:13] plentiful.

[02:11:14] Also,

[02:11:14] Rings and

[02:11:15] Rituals is

[02:11:15] starting a

[02:11:16] rerun this

[02:11:17] week.

[02:11:18] We're going to

[02:11:19] be posting two

[02:11:19] episodes a

[02:11:20] week leading

[02:11:20] up to Rings

[02:11:21] of Power.

[02:11:22] And so check

[02:11:23] that out because

[02:11:24] it is a great

[02:11:25] podcast and

[02:11:26] deserves good

[02:11:27] listenership ahead

[02:11:28] of Rings of

[02:11:28] Power.

[02:11:29] You can get

[02:11:29] all of

[02:11:29] Marilyn's

[02:11:30] thoughts on

[02:11:30] season one

[02:11:31] before she

[02:11:31] joins us to

[02:11:32] cover season

[02:11:33] two.

[02:11:34] And we're

[02:11:35] going to do

[02:11:36] a season

[02:11:36] two preview

[02:11:38] trailer breakdown

[02:11:39] kind of

[02:11:39] conversation,

[02:11:40] right?

[02:11:40] That's true

[02:11:41] too.

[02:11:41] I forgot to

[02:11:42] mention that.

[02:11:43] Another podcast

[02:11:44] we're recording

[02:11:44] this week,

[02:11:45] which is my

[02:11:45] fault because I

[02:11:46] brought it up

[02:11:46] to Marilyn,

[02:11:48] is you were

[02:11:49] away.

[02:11:49] I wasn't sure

[02:11:50] if you wanted

[02:11:50] to do it when

[02:11:50] you came right

[02:11:51] back, but

[02:11:52] you're going to

[02:11:52] join us for

[02:11:53] a trailer

[02:11:54] breakdown for

[02:11:55] the San Diego

[02:11:56] Comic Con

[02:11:57] trailer,

[02:11:57] which we've

[02:11:57] already got a

[02:11:58] notion page

[02:11:58] started for

[02:11:59] it.

[02:11:59] That's going

[02:12:00] and that'll

[02:12:01] be a lot of

[02:12:02] fun once we

[02:12:02] get that

[02:12:02] together.

[02:12:03] A lot of

[02:12:03] speculation.

[02:12:05] Cool.

[02:12:06] Also on the

[02:12:08] Lorehounds

[02:12:08] network, we

[02:12:09] have Alicia

[02:12:10] busy on the

[02:12:13] Wolf of

[02:12:14] Dust

[02:12:15] silo season

[02:12:16] two San

[02:12:16] Diego

[02:12:17] Comic Con

[02:12:18] announcements

[02:12:19] that's coming

[02:12:20] later this

[02:12:21] year.

[02:12:22] She's going

[02:12:22] to be talking

[02:12:23] about the

[02:12:24] air date,

[02:12:24] casting news

[02:12:25] and more.

[02:12:26] And she's

[02:12:26] got a book

[02:12:28] club episode.

[02:12:28] That's her

[02:12:29] own Patreon

[02:12:29] setup for

[02:12:31] the third

[02:12:32] shift book

[02:12:33] breakdown.

[02:12:33] That is the

[02:12:34] third part of

[02:12:35] the second

[02:12:36] book in the

[02:12:36] silo series.

[02:12:39] All right.

[02:12:40] I think that's

[02:12:41] it for this

[02:12:42] week.

[02:12:43] That's all.

[02:12:44] Come on.

[02:12:44] That's like

[02:12:45] there's nothing.

[02:12:46] Come on.

[02:12:46] I know.

[02:12:47] I know.

[02:12:48] All the other

[02:12:48] podcasts are on

[02:12:49] a break, but

[02:12:50] yeah, we're

[02:12:51] having a good

[02:12:52] time here.

[02:12:53] Having a very

[02:12:53] good time.

[02:12:54] now, uh,

[02:12:56] Patreon shout

[02:12:57] outs are

[02:12:57] next.

[02:12:58] All right, David,

[02:12:59] you want to do

[02:13:00] the shout

[02:13:00] outs?

[02:13:01] Well, I play

[02:13:01] fat and lazy

[02:13:03] with pH from

[02:13:04] our sound

[02:13:05] pack.

[02:13:06] Question mark.

[02:13:06] Here we go.

[02:13:10] Wow.

[02:13:11] That's kind of

[02:13:11] funky.

[02:13:12] Hmm.

[02:13:13] Uh, to our

[02:13:14] discord server

[02:13:15] boosters,

[02:13:17] Gnarls, Aaron

[02:13:18] K, Tiller the

[02:13:19] Thriller, Dork of

[02:13:20] the Ninjas,

[02:13:21] Doove 71,

[02:13:22] Captain Gingy

[02:13:23] 56, and

[02:13:24] Athena Agilea.

[02:13:25] Thanks all so

[02:13:26] very much for

[02:13:27] making our

[02:13:28] discord a

[02:13:29] better place.

[02:13:30] And, uh,

[02:13:31] also just a

[02:13:31] quick shout out

[02:13:32] to our mods,

[02:13:33] to, uh,

[02:13:33] Aaron K, uh,

[02:13:34] Brian 8063,

[02:13:35] and Adrian,

[02:13:37] uh, for, you

[02:13:38] know, helping us

[02:13:39] keep the machinery

[02:13:40] running on the

[02:13:41] discord.

[02:13:42] To our

[02:13:43] lore masters,

[02:13:44] our top tier

[02:13:45] subscribers,

[02:13:46] uh, they

[02:13:47] help make our

[02:13:48] world go

[02:13:49] round.

[02:13:50] I always like to

[02:13:51] give them a

[02:13:51] shout out at

[02:13:52] the end of

[02:13:52] every podcast.

[02:13:54] Samarshan,

[02:13:54] Michael G,

[02:13:55] Michelle E,

[02:13:56] David W,

[02:13:57] Brian P,

[02:13:59] SC,

[02:14:00] Peter O.H.,

[02:14:01] Bettina W,

[02:14:02] Adam S,

[02:14:03] Nancy M,

[02:14:04] Doove 71,

[02:14:05] Brian 8063,

[02:14:07] Frederick H,

[02:14:08] Sarah L,

[02:14:09] Gareth C,

[02:14:10] Eric F,

[02:14:11] Matthew M,

[02:14:12] Sarah M,

[02:14:13] DJ Miwa,

[02:14:15] Andra B,

[02:14:15] Kwong Yu,

[02:14:16] Dead Eye

[02:14:17] Jedi Bob,

[02:14:18] Nathan T,

[02:14:19] Alex V,

[02:14:20] Aaron T,

[02:14:21] Sub Zero,

[02:14:22] Aaron K,

[02:14:24] Dally V,

[02:14:25] Mothership 61,

[02:14:27] Gnarls?

[02:14:28] Oh, did it

[02:14:29] stop?

[02:14:30] It did stop.

[02:14:31] Kathy W?

[02:14:32] We ran out of,

[02:14:33] let's go to

[02:14:33] intensity one,

[02:14:34] let's bring it

[02:14:34] down a little bit.

[02:14:35] Okay.

[02:14:36] Here we go.

[02:14:37] It's still loading,

[02:14:38] sorry.

[02:14:39] Here we go.

[02:14:40] This is the sausage

[02:14:41] getting made,

[02:14:41] folks.

[02:14:42] There it is.

[02:14:43] Kathy W,

[02:14:44] Stuart B,

[02:14:45] Jeffrey B,

[02:14:47] Alicia Yu,

[02:14:48] and Adrian.

[02:14:50] Thanks all so very much.

[02:14:51] We couldn't do it without you.

[02:14:52] Thank you to all of our subscribers.

[02:14:54] Thank you to all of our listeners.

[02:14:55] We do have a lot of fun here on The Lorehounds.

[02:14:58] We do have a great community and we couldn't do it without everyone's support.

[02:15:03] So until next time,

[02:15:06] have a pleasant day,

[02:15:08] evening,

[02:15:09] whatever,

[02:15:09] morning.

[02:15:10] I'm just delirious.

[02:15:11] That's fine.

[02:15:12] We'll talk to you later.

[02:15:12] I'm cutting them off.

[02:15:13] The Lorehounds podcast is produced and published by The Lorehounds.

[02:15:17] You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at thelorehounds.com slash contact.

[02:15:22] Get early and ad-free access to all Lorehounds podcasts at patreon.com slash thelorehounds.

[02:15:28] Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any

[02:15:32] employers or other entities.

[02:15:33] Thanks for listening.

[02:15:36] Wünschst du dir jemanden, der dich versteht wie kein anderer?

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