The Rings of Power - S02E04 - Eldest

[00:00:01] Nicole, did you ever notice how the sign by Ace of Base has really strange key changes?

[00:00:06] I did not, Mark. I'm a real person.

[00:00:08] Well, let me tell you about it. I'll let you talk about neuroscience gal di guc.

[00:00:12] Yes! I thought you'd never ask.

[00:00:13] This is the Never Mind the Music Podcast.

[00:00:15] We're one psychologist.

[00:00:17] And one musician.

[00:00:18] Deep dive into the songs you love.

[00:00:20] So you don't have to.

[00:00:21] And there's plenty of time to get off topic.

[00:00:23] From semi-charmed life to the way you move.

[00:00:25] And who could forget the crossroads?

[00:00:27] Is it THE crossroads or THE crossroads?

[00:00:29] Save it for the episode, Mark.

[00:00:31] Listen to Never Mind the Music.

[00:00:33] Wherever you get your podcasts.

[00:00:56] Welcome to The Rings of Power Podcast. We're the Lorehounds.

[00:00:59] Your guides to Tolkien's world of Middle Earth.

[00:01:01] I'm David.

[00:01:02] I'm John.

[00:01:04] And I'm Marilyn.

[00:01:05] This is our coverage for Prime Video's original series,

[00:01:08] The Lord of the Rings, The Rings of Power Season 2, Episode 4.

[00:01:13] In this podcast, we're going to start off with some notes about our coverage plans,

[00:01:16] our hot takes for the episode.

[00:01:18] Then we've got some miscellaneous notes and a short discussion of the opening credit sequence.

[00:01:22] And then we're going to get right into our detailed scene by scene breakdown of the episode.

[00:01:28] If you'd like to contact us, send emails to lotrathelorhounds.com.

[00:01:32] By the way, that was misspelled in the show notes.

[00:01:35] It was LOTD.

[00:01:36] So LOTR, Lord of the Rings.

[00:01:39] LOTRathelorhounds.com.

[00:01:40] Make sure you send to that.

[00:01:41] Oops.

[00:01:42] Sorry.

[00:01:43] If you want to join our Discord server or support the community by subscribing with either Supercast

[00:01:48] or Patreon, check out the link tree in the show notes below.

[00:01:52] And if you're not into recurring subscriptions, you can find a link to our season pass where

[00:01:59] you can pay just a flat $10 and you get access to ad free episodes.

[00:02:05] You get access to the one guide to rule them all and some other bonus material that we're

[00:02:11] putting on as well as all of our weekly lore casts.

[00:02:15] Good stuff.

[00:02:18] So let's breeze right into a little bit of our coverage plans.

[00:02:22] I just want to make a few notes.

[00:02:25] The show guide is happening.

[00:02:30] John, how's it going over there with the show guide?

[00:02:32] Oh, it's going great.

[00:02:33] Notion skills.

[00:02:35] We're moving right along.

[00:02:36] I tried to figure out how to hide things so that I can preload them for...

[00:02:41] It doesn't work.

[00:02:44] And it's just going to have to be manual after the episode drops.

[00:02:47] But that's okay because, you know what?

[00:02:50] Most of it's done already.

[00:02:51] We've got the full recap done because that's what we're using for our outline and it's

[00:02:56] going well.

[00:02:57] We've got a lot of takers on the season pass and I think people are really enjoying

[00:03:01] it.

[00:03:01] Yeah, and I want to give a shout out to all of our new season pass holders.

[00:03:05] Wow.

[00:03:05] Yeah.

[00:03:06] Wow.

[00:03:06] Thank you all so very much.

[00:03:08] I think we're going to top House of the Dragon easily with...

[00:03:12] Oh, we already have.

[00:03:13] Yes, we have.

[00:03:14] It's really exciting.

[00:03:16] Thank you to the new regular subscribers as well.

[00:03:18] So maybe somebody came around and they were like, oh, you know, brings a power.

[00:03:22] Oh, wow.

[00:03:23] Look at all this other great content that these guys do.

[00:03:26] It's like there's a lot of podcasts.

[00:03:28] Yes.

[00:03:28] So thank you everyone who's subscribed no matter how you have subscribed.

[00:03:33] It's made the show guides a real success and it's making this podcast a real success.

[00:03:37] So we really appreciate that.

[00:03:40] The quick note about screeners, we are...

[00:03:45] Amazon was generous and we are beneficiaries of screeners.

[00:03:49] So we're able to watch the episodes ahead.

[00:03:52] We're going to be very cautious about spoilers.

[00:03:54] So if some of us...

[00:03:56] I didn't do anything.

[00:03:58] Don't point your rings over at me.

[00:04:02] We will be sure to contain ourselves and not do the nianianiania thing.

[00:04:07] We just won't even pretend.

[00:04:08] We'll just pretend like we didn't even see them.

[00:04:10] I mean, we already have to be careful because the whole story was written 50 years ago.

[00:04:16] So, you know, like we got to just...

[00:04:18] We just got to not spoil things.

[00:04:21] Right.

[00:04:21] Yeah, it's tricky.

[00:04:22] One thing about the screeners though, there's no episode titles.

[00:04:26] So we don't know the episode titles before.

[00:04:28] There are no subtitles either on these.

[00:04:31] So there are sometimes a word or a phrase we might not catch immediately,

[00:04:35] but that's just the price we pay for being able to get you guys podcasts immediately

[00:04:42] once the episodes drop or, you know, once the embargo lifts, which I believe is 9 a.m.

[00:04:48] Yeah.

[00:04:48] The other thing they give us is translation of some of the languages other than English.

[00:04:53] Mostly, they're giving us subtitles for Elvish.

[00:04:56] Right.

[00:04:58] I got to tell you, there are some characters this episode that I do not know the freaking names of

[00:05:04] because the sub...

[00:05:05] I just need the subtitles for some of these character names that are just very quick.

[00:05:12] And so sometimes on the show guide, there'll be a slight delay in John updating that,

[00:05:16] but John is very diligent at getting to those things as soon as he can.

[00:05:20] Oh, John deserves props, my goodness.

[00:05:22] Yeah.

[00:05:23] And as to what we all...

[00:05:24] But let's keep going on this because we got a lot to talk about tonight.

[00:05:29] We do.

[00:05:30] So really quick, we'll refer if you have any questions about our backgrounds.

[00:05:34] Marilyn's a scholar, John's a super fan, I'm a casual fan.

[00:05:37] Any of our backgrounds and deep history about our relationship to Lord of the Rings,

[00:05:42] go back to the season two episode one podcast where we talk about that.

[00:05:47] And then for feedback, our dear hand of the pod, Nancy M is on the receiving end of the

[00:05:54] emails.

[00:05:55] She's collating all that stuff, putting in a document for us every week and we're going

[00:05:59] to have an email feedback episode out this week.

[00:06:05] We've got a bunch of great feedback.

[00:06:06] So Nancy's doing that.

[00:06:08] She may contact you, ask you for some clarifications, that kind of stuff.

[00:06:11] And we just are so appreciative of Nancy.

[00:06:14] She did a great job on House of the Dragon and she's doing even a better job now for the

[00:06:19] Rings of Power.

[00:06:20] You can also send in voice mails.

[00:06:22] You can go to our website and you can use the built-in system on the website, on the

[00:06:27] contact page or you can just open up the voice memo app on your smartphone and then

[00:06:33] email that audio file to lotr at the Lord Hounds and then Nancy will integrate those

[00:06:38] into our workflow.

[00:06:40] We're going to rely a little bit less on discord feedback as we did a lot for House of

[00:06:44] the Dragon.

[00:06:45] We're going to do that a little bit less.

[00:06:46] So if you really want to share your feedback, make sure you send in something to the

[00:06:51] email.

[00:06:51] That's because that's really where we're taking a first look at feedback and such.

[00:06:57] All right.

[00:06:57] Let's move into our hot takes really quick.

[00:06:59] Marilyn, what did you think of this episode, episode four?

[00:07:03] Well, I think we're really seeing the benefits of being released from COVID

[00:07:06] restrictions.

[00:07:07] I'm just so impressed.

[00:07:11] It's almost like going from two dimensions to three.

[00:07:14] We're finally seeing vast landscapes.

[00:07:17] We're seeing large crowds.

[00:07:18] We're seeing a lot more interactions, I guess is the best way to put it.

[00:07:26] It's really hard to be six feet apart in a hobbit hole.

[00:07:29] I'm telling you.

[00:07:31] And don't get me started about a barrow.

[00:07:34] No.

[00:07:35] Even worse.

[00:07:35] Even worse.

[00:07:38] I suspect that people are either going to love this episode or they're going to

[00:07:41] hate it depending upon how they feel about lore.

[00:07:45] Because there's a couple of significant events and characters.

[00:07:50] You know, Marilyn, if only there were a podcast somewhere that would help you

[00:07:55] understand the lore that you're encountering in the television show.

[00:07:58] David, what a brilliant idea.

[00:08:00] Come on.

[00:08:01] We should monetize that.

[00:08:03] We're doing our best.

[00:08:05] John, what did you think of the episode?

[00:08:07] My favorite episode yet.

[00:08:08] Absolutely my favorite episode yet.

[00:08:10] And you know what?

[00:08:11] I talked to Alicia.

[00:08:12] It was her favorite episode yet.

[00:08:13] So I have backing.

[00:08:15] I have backing.

[00:08:16] There are dozens of us.

[00:08:18] The rule of two.

[00:08:22] I thought that introducing this story was fantastic.

[00:08:27] I really enjoyed that culture.

[00:08:28] I really enjoy that the Harfits have a reason for wandering.

[00:08:32] We're filling in a lot of backstory that I felt like we were missing last season.

[00:08:37] Really loved that.

[00:08:38] I think they are really showing their hand about what's coming this season with

[00:08:43] some of these ring visions, which is cool.

[00:08:46] I mean, I'm down for that.

[00:08:48] It's cool.

[00:08:49] But I'm really excited to see it now because it seems like things are

[00:08:53] coming that I'm not expecting.

[00:08:55] Yeah, I feel as though they're doing a lot more foreshadowing this time.

[00:08:59] Yeah.

[00:08:59] And it keeps coming up to me like I think the sorrow and stabby death is a

[00:09:04] clear foreshadowing of a future event.

[00:09:07] But the thing I want to touch on the most is I am furious that they nailed Tom

[00:09:13] Bombadil.

[00:09:15] I'm furious because I came in and look, I try to be positive about these

[00:09:21] things.

[00:09:22] But Tom Bombadil was something where I was like, I don't know how they're

[00:09:25] going to do that right on screen.

[00:09:26] Peter Jackson couldn't figure it out.

[00:09:29] And then we kept getting told it couldn't be done on screen.

[00:09:32] And then in the trailers, I was getting really nervous because he was

[00:09:35] looking really glum.

[00:09:37] He was looking like he was in House of the Dragon, not Rings of Power.

[00:09:41] And then we get to him and he's just humming along, singing about his

[00:09:45] yellow boots.

[00:09:46] I was I was delighted.

[00:09:48] I was delighted by the entire Tom Bombadil sequence.

[00:09:50] It was largely pulled from the text.

[00:09:53] Most of his dialogue and I was I'm just ready.

[00:09:56] I'm just ready for him and we're going to do our lower cast on him.

[00:09:58] Right?

[00:09:59] Yes, absolutely.

[00:10:00] Yeah, I agree.

[00:10:01] Bombadil was brilliant.

[00:10:03] If you've been wondering too, whether oh, should I get season pass?

[00:10:07] Should I get the, you know, the lower cast or we're going to be

[00:10:09] talking about Bombadil and I even do a reading of Bombadil.

[00:10:14] A spectacular reading.

[00:10:16] So either people are going to cancel their subscriptions or they're

[00:10:19] going to want more.

[00:10:21] Well, guess what folks?

[00:10:23] Your season passes one time so you can't cancel it now.

[00:10:25] That's true.

[00:10:26] Yeah, no refunds.

[00:10:27] Sorry.

[00:10:28] Oops.

[00:10:29] Well, I am mixed on this episode.

[00:10:34] Marilyn, like you said, people, you know, love or hate.

[00:10:36] I really enjoyed the first half of this episode.

[00:10:40] Even the Harfoot storyline, which, you know, it's always been a little bit.

[00:10:44] Great.

[00:10:45] It's on the media.

[00:10:46] Yeah, exactly.

[00:10:47] And the introduction of the Stoors was very cool.

[00:10:52] But I was even okay with the idyllic village trope, right?

[00:10:56] Which is one of the ones that just.

[00:10:57] That's just a setting.

[00:10:58] That's not a trope.

[00:10:59] I'm going to yell this every time you bring it up.

[00:11:02] Crazy, crazy.

[00:11:03] Also, if anyone's allowed to do the idyllic village trope.

[00:11:06] The Harfoot.

[00:11:07] It's Tolkien, right?

[00:11:09] The Shire.

[00:11:09] Yeah, totally.

[00:11:10] And I suspect that there are some aspects of that life that are

[00:11:14] not idyllic, but.

[00:11:16] You know, medicine, you know, clean water, you know,

[00:11:20] these kinds of things.

[00:11:21] You know, wizards hunting them.

[00:11:23] Yeah, that too.

[00:11:24] Threats about what their faces are going to look like after if they

[00:11:27] don't obey the great wizard.

[00:11:29] So somewhere around the back half of the episode,

[00:11:33] around the Southland or plot line, it just kind of started to

[00:11:36] come apart for me in different ways.

[00:11:38] And I really, there are things.

[00:11:41] Again, if I take individual pieces and parts, I'm like,

[00:11:44] oh, that's a great little bit.

[00:11:45] That's a little great little bit.

[00:11:46] But then when the gears all fit together,

[00:11:48] just sort of kind of was a little bit awkward for me.

[00:11:50] And we'll talk about it when we get there.

[00:11:52] But like you said, this was another Lorebom episode with

[00:11:55] Stewards, the Barrowdowns, Nameless Things.

[00:12:00] Nameless Things.

[00:12:01] Ents.

[00:12:02] Like, this was so much.

[00:12:05] This was a ton packed into here.

[00:12:08] And it's hard to believe that we're halfway through this

[00:12:12] season.

[00:12:12] Good point.

[00:12:13] And what I'm going to be really looking forward,

[00:12:15] looking for now going forward is, okay, four episodes,

[00:12:20] a lot of setup.

[00:12:22] Now let's start to work through some of these issues.

[00:12:27] And are you going to be able to bring us to episode eight?

[00:12:30] Because if we have to wait another two years for the

[00:12:33] episode, like, oh man, that's going to be tough.

[00:12:36] And they've got a lot yet to do for this episode.

[00:12:39] I think based on the visions alone,

[00:12:41] I think we are in for an interesting end of the season.

[00:12:45] Okay.

[00:12:46] Just looking at the visions everyone's having,

[00:12:49] I'm like, okay, that's a lot of foreshadowing to get

[00:12:52] done in the last few episodes.

[00:12:54] So I'm going to take a little personal point of privilege

[00:12:57] here and I watched episodes six through eight of season

[00:13:03] one over the long weekend.

[00:13:07] Ed and Nancy, they were giving me a little guff on

[00:13:10] the Patreon.

[00:13:11] I was like, you really shouldn't watch that one.

[00:13:13] So I did.

[00:13:14] I did.

[00:13:14] And thank you because I'm really glad I did.

[00:13:16] Thank you, Ed.

[00:13:17] Thank you, Nancy.

[00:13:17] I appreciate it.

[00:13:19] I have some quick notes that I just wanted to share

[00:13:22] coming up and I'll just run through these pretty quick.

[00:13:25] Season one, episode six through eight,

[00:13:27] the pacing felt about the same.

[00:13:29] I was kind of complaining about the pacing of season two.

[00:13:33] It's about the same.

[00:13:34] Like they feel comparable to each other.

[00:13:37] And when season one, when it hits, man, it hits.

[00:13:42] It's fire.

[00:13:43] Yeah.

[00:13:43] And then when they stumble, they stumble,

[00:13:46] but I think the stumbles outweigh our perceptions

[00:13:49] of the season overall.

[00:13:51] And so that sort of lumpiness in the season,

[00:13:53] I think does it a disservice.

[00:13:55] But boy, when it's on, it is on point and it's really good.

[00:14:00] The visual language is super strong across both shows

[00:14:04] and across the movies as well.

[00:14:06] There's so much going on visually.

[00:14:08] They are very attentive.

[00:14:11] I also watched Lord of the Rings,

[00:14:12] Jackson's Lord of the Rings over the weekend as well.

[00:14:14] All of them?

[00:14:15] No, no, no.

[00:14:16] Just the first one.

[00:14:16] Oh, I was going to say.

[00:14:17] Yeah.

[00:14:17] No, not all three.

[00:14:18] You got a lot of time this weekend.

[00:14:20] Seriously.

[00:14:22] And so there's a lot of continuity.

[00:14:23] They're really conscientious about that.

[00:14:25] And I think they're walking a very,

[00:14:27] a very good fine line.

[00:14:29] Somebody wrote in,

[00:14:30] I think it's in our feedback,

[00:14:31] which we'll get to later this week,

[00:14:32] but somebody was like, how do I,

[00:14:34] how do I relate to these characters?

[00:14:36] And I was having the same problem and something that

[00:14:38] I think helped me is when I relate to what I'm seeing on screen,

[00:14:43] as these characters are mytho-heroic characters,

[00:14:46] these are characters,

[00:14:47] even though they seem mundane to me,

[00:14:50] these are second age beings.

[00:14:54] These beings exist in a time and a place

[00:14:56] and in a bigness that I don't relate to necessarily,

[00:14:59] even though they're being portrayed as

[00:15:03] people I could relate to or things that I could more relate to.

[00:15:06] And I think that's like a little bit of a mismatch.

[00:15:10] I mean, if you lean back a little bit,

[00:15:12] squint your eyes a little bit

[00:15:13] and think of these as mytho-heroic characters,

[00:15:16] then I think it will be,

[00:15:18] there'll be a little bit more elevation of the story

[00:15:21] as opposed to, oh, well, these are just people

[00:15:23] and I'm just watching succession or something like that.

[00:15:27] Does that make sense?

[00:15:28] It does.

[00:15:29] It sounds very similar to what Sotra and I experienced

[00:15:32] when we were doing our Rings and Rituals podcast.

[00:15:35] The way we expressed it was taking them on their own terms.

[00:15:39] You exist in the context.

[00:15:42] Or the interstices,

[00:15:44] better than existing in the matrix probably.

[00:15:46] Yeah, probably.

[00:15:48] The last little general note

[00:15:50] that I had on a couple of key specific episode notes,

[00:15:53] the whole identity of the Halbrann and the Stranger thing,

[00:15:57] that's done, right?

[00:15:59] They did that to trick us.

[00:16:01] It's kind of a gimmick

[00:16:02] and I think maybe a little bit of the sour taste

[00:16:06] of season one might be because it was like,

[00:16:08] we knew it was a gimmick

[00:16:09] and we were still all hooked

[00:16:11] and then they did it, I am good.

[00:16:12] You know that?

[00:16:13] It was like, you know,

[00:16:15] and I think they've learned from that

[00:16:17] but that was something that I noticed

[00:16:18] it was like a little bit,

[00:16:20] oh, that was maybe a little bit of a sour note.

[00:16:22] I will say covering it week to week

[00:16:25] because you were, I recall, gone for episodes like four through seven.

[00:16:29] Yeah, and I was watching them on mobile phones

[00:16:30] and well that's enough to make anybody crazy.

[00:16:33] So just covering it week to week

[00:16:34] and talking about it a lot with people week to week,

[00:16:37] we were not sure that Halbrann was Sauron

[00:16:40] even until it happened.

[00:16:42] Sure.

[00:16:42] There was still a lot of debate over who was Sauron.

[00:16:45] Is Sauron even not part of this story yet?

[00:16:49] Right.

[00:16:49] Yeah, so I will say,

[00:16:51] I think that the flip with Halbrann

[00:16:54] was actually one of my favorite parts of season one.

[00:16:56] Okay, that's good.

[00:16:57] That's good recollection.

[00:17:01] Quick couple of notes, episode six,

[00:17:03] that's a really key episode.

[00:17:05] It sets up so much.

[00:17:07] It sets up the relationship between Isildur and Beric.

[00:17:10] It has the seeds, you know,

[00:17:12] the Adar's planting seeds,

[00:17:14] Galadriel plant seeds in episode one of season two

[00:17:17] and then there's that scene where Adar is talking about

[00:17:21] the Uruk and their creations of the one secret fire

[00:17:25] and all that.

[00:17:26] It was just like, wow, this is amazing.

[00:17:28] It's a really, really good episode

[00:17:30] and it's very well rooted and pacing.

[00:17:35] It was just a great episode of television period.

[00:17:37] And people were talking about it

[00:17:38] because that was the most downloads we ever had on a podcast.

[00:17:41] That was that episode, yeah.

[00:17:43] Well, it was the most emotionally connected,

[00:17:49] this whole question of orcs.

[00:17:52] And suddenly massive amounts of space and air are opening up

[00:17:56] and you're saying, oh, Galadriel the genocide er...

[00:18:01] Great.

[00:18:03] Yeah, it's a real question.

[00:18:04] Maybe these aren't all names that face those red shirts.

[00:18:06] It's a real question.

[00:18:08] Tolkien struggled with it towards the end of his life

[00:18:10] and they went for it.

[00:18:12] And I just, I really admired their courage

[00:18:15] and their commitment to it.

[00:18:16] And I got to say something at the end of this episode

[00:18:20] kind of connects with that.

[00:18:21] Yeah, right, right.

[00:18:23] Something that I really actually like,

[00:18:25] just from this conversation we're having

[00:18:27] is that Galadriel is taking up this moral quandary

[00:18:32] that Tolkien died in the middle of.

[00:18:35] Yes.

[00:18:35] And Tolkien was also in the middle of working Galadriel

[00:18:38] into the second age stories,

[00:18:40] the first and second age stories at the time he died.

[00:18:44] So it's kind of beautiful that this character

[00:18:46] that he was finally focusing on towards the end of his life

[00:18:50] is the one to take up the mantle of what's answered this question.

[00:18:53] Mm-hmm.

[00:18:54] Very cool.

[00:18:55] I hope we can do a lore cast on orcs as well.

[00:18:58] I think that would be a really interesting topic.

[00:19:00] Yes, for sure.

[00:19:01] That's right.

[00:19:01] They prefer orcs?

[00:19:03] Yeah.

[00:19:04] First lesson, yeah.

[00:19:05] I can really see individual seeds,

[00:19:09] I'll use that metaphor, being planted

[00:19:12] that are going to lead to the Lady of Lorian.

[00:19:15] Mm-hmm.

[00:19:17] Yeah.

[00:19:17] I'm already seeing them.

[00:19:18] Great.

[00:19:19] Episode seven, I think we...

[00:19:22] I didn't remember this very well,

[00:19:24] but Man, Disa is super pissed at Durin III

[00:19:28] and the argument between the Durins

[00:19:30] is super, super intense and really destructive.

[00:19:33] Mm-hmm.

[00:19:34] And so I think it kind of helped for me to remember

[00:19:37] how bad that was, how bad of an argument,

[00:19:40] and how mad Disa was, even though Disa's preaching

[00:19:43] forgiveness this season,

[00:19:45] she was pissed at her father-in-law, like, seriously.

[00:19:49] Yeah, they did a bit of a turn around that

[00:19:52] in this season, I think perhaps.

[00:19:55] Again, this is one of the things

[00:19:57] that I think about frequently is relationships develop

[00:20:01] so fast, as we were saying earlier.

[00:20:03] This is one example of that.

[00:20:05] Right.

[00:20:05] That, you know,

[00:20:07] and in the first up season,

[00:20:09] we saw Disa saying, you know,

[00:20:11] we're going to be king and queen in this mountain

[00:20:13] and this Mithril will be ours

[00:20:14] and nobody can stop us.

[00:20:15] Ha-ha-ha, Lady Macbeth.

[00:20:17] Suddenly in this season,

[00:20:19] she is the honored and respected stone singer.

[00:20:23] Mm-hmm.

[00:20:24] And she's talking with the king

[00:20:25] and she's giving him information

[00:20:27] and he says, yes,

[00:20:28] let's follow the advice of our stone singers

[00:20:32] and then afterwards tell me about my son

[00:20:34] and she wisely says, uh-uh,

[00:20:36] you got to talk to him.

[00:20:37] I'm not making a triangle of this conversation.

[00:20:40] And then, but then meanwhile,

[00:20:41] she's preaching sort of temperance

[00:20:43] and forgiveness behind the scenes

[00:20:45] and saying, well, you fix this thing.

[00:20:47] Of course.

[00:20:47] Yeah.

[00:20:49] The barrack scene of,

[00:20:52] oh God, Isildur's father?

[00:20:54] Elendil.

[00:20:55] Elendil, yes, thank you.

[00:20:56] Elendil, that's one door.

[00:20:57] I don't remember the name of Elendil.

[00:21:00] I know, I feel so bad.

[00:21:01] They lifted that one-to-one out of season one

[00:21:05] and plopped it into season two.

[00:21:06] Yeah, it was an exact cut.

[00:21:08] Yeah.

[00:21:08] And then episode eight,

[00:21:10] I just want to keep going here

[00:21:11] so we can get on to,

[00:21:12] because we're going to talk about

[00:21:13] the opening credit sequence,

[00:21:14] the sequence after this.

[00:21:17] Mm-hmm.

[00:21:17] The, just on the visual language thing,

[00:21:19] the raft that Sauron or Halbrand

[00:21:22] and, well, Sauron really.

[00:21:25] And Gladriel are on when she's having

[00:21:27] the vision.

[00:21:28] It, the way that it's designed,

[00:21:29] looks like the, the sort of chamber

[00:21:33] where he is, where he ended up,

[00:21:35] he gets killed and that kind of stuff.

[00:21:36] The way that it's spiky wood pointing out,

[00:21:39] it's the same.

[00:21:41] So they're really doing a consistent job

[00:21:42] making things look and speak and rhyme

[00:21:45] and sort of talk to each other

[00:21:46] across scenes and across seasons.

[00:21:48] So really, really cool to see that.

[00:21:53] The Finrods dagger thing,

[00:21:54] oh my God,

[00:21:55] because it was like a little boat

[00:21:57] on a funeral pyre

[00:21:58] and then there's like an eye swirl

[00:22:01] going on and just an exquisite scene.

[00:22:04] But really, I think the real key

[00:22:06] in episode eight is Halbrand

[00:22:10] touched the me-thrill,

[00:22:12] Halbrand Sauron,

[00:22:13] touched the me-thrill,

[00:22:14] he handed it over,

[00:22:16] but otherwise he didn't have a direct involvement

[00:22:19] in making the rings.

[00:22:20] He didn't, you know,

[00:22:21] you know, any secret,

[00:22:23] he just, he touched the me-thrill

[00:22:24] for a little bit and then he was gone

[00:22:26] and then Calibrymbor forged the rings.

[00:22:30] So Sauron was already,

[00:22:32] had already left the area

[00:22:34] by the time the rings were forged.

[00:22:36] So when he held the me-thrill

[00:22:39] and he put it in Calibrymbor's hand,

[00:22:41] he sort of held it for a second.

[00:22:43] In this season?

[00:22:44] In last season.

[00:22:46] In season one.

[00:22:49] He touches the me-thrill,

[00:22:50] but he doesn't forge the rings.

[00:22:53] Right, he touched the me-thrill at one point.

[00:22:55] Yes, at one point, very briefly,

[00:22:58] he handed it over.

[00:22:58] You're saying he tainted it during that touch.

[00:23:00] But he did not, he was not able to,

[00:23:02] exactly.

[00:23:04] So he was not able to really do

[00:23:06] a lot of deep magic work on it.

[00:23:08] He only had it for a moment.

[00:23:10] Which he certainly had for more

[00:23:12] than a moment in this season.

[00:23:14] A lot of people have pointed to that.

[00:23:17] Yeah, yeah.

[00:23:17] So I think that's a key thing is why

[00:23:19] the elven rings are not,

[00:23:21] you know, at least in this show,

[00:23:23] in this show I'm not talking about

[00:23:24] the written words, in the show

[00:23:27] that's why he may not have as much control

[00:23:29] over the elven rings.

[00:23:31] Which is another amazing

[00:23:34] moral quandary of

[00:23:37] using potentially dangerous

[00:23:39] weapons, well I mean all weapons are dangerous

[00:23:41] in some sense.

[00:23:42] But that kind of

[00:23:43] level of danger to accomplish good things.

[00:23:46] Right.

[00:23:47] You know, this ongoing conversation

[00:23:48] and the reminder that

[00:23:51] Elrond contributed to the making of the three rings

[00:23:54] but it wasn't until afterwards

[00:23:56] that he realized

[00:23:58] that Elrond was

[00:24:00] giving input into the whole concept.

[00:24:03] Right, the concept

[00:24:04] and design and what not

[00:24:06] but yeah, not the actual forging.

[00:24:09] And yet, Elrond needs

[00:24:10] Calibrimbore.

[00:24:11] And I find that interesting

[00:24:14] and a possible weakness to this.

[00:24:15] Why would he need Calibrimbore's skill?

[00:24:19] How could Calibrimbore outforge

[00:24:22] Amaya?

[00:24:24] Particularly Amaya who studied with Aule.

[00:24:27] Something to think about I guess.

[00:24:29] Good questions.

[00:24:31] Okay, so those are my

[00:24:32] notes for Season 1

[00:24:35] and now we want to talk about the Season 2

[00:24:37] opening credit sequence.

[00:24:38] We're just going to kind of breeze through this really quick.

[00:24:41] I think the analysis is

[00:24:43] pretty straightforward.

[00:24:46] So the first scene we see

[00:24:48] are of sort of a red

[00:24:49] colored sand that's a little bit more chunky

[00:24:52] and it's erupting from a

[00:24:54] central source which sort of speaks to the

[00:24:56] Mount Doom

[00:25:00] volcano aspect of it.

[00:25:02] And then

[00:25:02] the red rocks start to

[00:25:04] flow out and bisect

[00:25:06] the gray sand.

[00:25:07] It's kind of like almost like the tendrils breaking

[00:25:10] out of the Mordor area that we

[00:25:11] see on the map.

[00:25:12] And then they flow out into a pattern

[00:25:15] and at first I thought that this was

[00:25:17] sort of a southlander heraldry thing.

[00:25:20] But

[00:25:20] I caught a scene

[00:25:23] where in Season 2

[00:25:25] in this season

[00:25:26] where we see Calibrimbore's

[00:25:28] forge and then I went back and I looked at the

[00:25:31] sequence and this pattern

[00:25:32] is the forge and this is the

[00:25:34] red lava flowing out

[00:25:36] and swirling in these little cup swirls

[00:25:38] that are on the outside

[00:25:39] to forge the rings.

[00:25:42] And then we get

[00:25:45] it was in this scene from Episode 3

[00:25:48] when Duran and Disa are visiting with Calibrimbore

[00:25:50] there's a nice perfect picture

[00:25:52] of the whole thing and you can see how it sort of

[00:25:53] matches up.

[00:25:56] Did you count the number of rings?

[00:25:58] Well that was the next

[00:26:00] major image is

[00:26:01] a whole bunch of connected rings

[00:26:03] and there's a string of 9 that are connected

[00:26:05] a string of 7 that are connected

[00:26:07] and a string of 3 that are connected.

[00:26:08] Yep, so we get the 20 rings.

[00:26:11] Right, and then that pattern breaks

[00:26:13] and dissolves and then

[00:26:15] I don't know what this one is

[00:26:16] a crown with 7 stars.

[00:26:19] Well just prior to that we have the Newman-Aught image.

[00:26:21] Ah, okay right, right.

[00:26:23] And then it's a crown with 7 stars

[00:26:25] and I think that's the Duran's

[00:26:27] crown design that we see

[00:26:29] on the doors of Duran.

[00:26:31] Okay, yeah.

[00:26:33] And then we get some sort of circular

[00:26:34] design that I don't recognize.

[00:26:37] Is that the one that looks like

[00:26:38] the Eastern Goddess form?

[00:26:40] It's a circular design, it's kind of

[00:26:42] a

[00:26:44] Sunfire-like

[00:26:44] design.

[00:26:46] I don't know where the Eastern Goddess is.

[00:26:46] Oh, that's been used as the Newman-Orient symbol.

[00:26:49] Yeah, Sun symbol.

[00:26:52] The Goddess image I'm thinking of

[00:26:53] if you look at it with that in mind

[00:26:56] it has a head

[00:26:57] and then the two arms curve around

[00:26:59] almost like handles on a jar.

[00:27:02] Okay.

[00:27:02] And then there's a sort of

[00:27:04] implication of a body coming down below

[00:27:06] and it's in size with these sort of

[00:27:09] zigzag patterns.

[00:27:10] Interesting, okay so that would be helpful

[00:27:11] if they had an image for the rune storyline

[00:27:14] in this opening sequence.

[00:27:15] Well I think that's what this is.

[00:27:16] Yeah, because there's no other place

[00:27:18] that I see rune in this.

[00:27:19] Right, right.

[00:27:20] And it's very evocative of

[00:27:24] Mesopotamian

[00:27:24] and other Goddess forms.

[00:27:26] Okay.

[00:27:27] And then I think

[00:27:29] that's pretty much it of

[00:27:31] the significance.

[00:27:32] There's one other

[00:27:34] design I think that

[00:27:35] I can't remember now, I don't have all the images

[00:27:38] in front of me so

[00:27:39] any other notes or thoughts?

[00:27:41] Well I had a colorful sun shape

[00:27:43] following that Goddess form.

[00:27:45] The sun shape is what I was thinking of.

[00:27:47] Okay well then the Goddess form is just before that.

[00:27:49] Okay, gotcha.

[00:27:50] Gotcha.

[00:27:51] So if that's Newman-Orient and it's got

[00:27:52] it's ringed in red

[00:27:53] that goes into the

[00:27:55] whole make Newman-Orient again

[00:27:57] wear red for future.

[00:27:58] Oh okay, it could also have been

[00:28:00] representing the east because of the powerful sun

[00:28:02] but I think probably what you said about

[00:28:04] the Newman-Orient

[00:28:05] Something I noticed in

[00:28:07] Season 2

[00:28:09] as well is when

[00:28:11] Aearean goes to

[00:28:12] see the Palantir, she's wearing

[00:28:15] red in that scene.

[00:28:17] Yeah, red is

[00:28:19] definitely something to pay attention to

[00:28:21] in this season.

[00:28:22] Yeah red seems to be the color

[00:28:23] of the

[00:28:25] of the Farazon

[00:28:28] Farazonianx

[00:28:29] Farazonia.

[00:28:30] It sounds like a skin disease.

[00:28:34] Okay, any other

[00:28:35] notes for the opening sequence?

[00:28:36] If anybody's got anything more they want to add

[00:28:38] send us a voicemail or an email.

[00:28:41] I think that's it for me.

[00:28:42] I'm gonna look at it again and I'll add my thoughts

[00:28:44] to the show guide once I

[00:28:46] I'm probably this weekend I'll have

[00:28:47] I'll have a guide

[00:28:50] to the intro in there.

[00:28:52] That'd be awesome.

[00:28:53] Very cool.

[00:28:55] Alright well why don't we take a quick break

[00:28:57] when we get back we will get into

[00:28:59] our full recap.

[00:29:21] And we're back.

[00:29:22] Commander Elrond is the first

[00:29:24] scene. Elrond and Galadriel

[00:29:27] struggle to settle into their new

[00:29:28] balance of power but Galadriel

[00:29:30] acedes to his command.

[00:29:33] The small team attempts to travel

[00:29:34] to Euregion but a critical bridge is destroyed.

[00:29:37] Galadriel sees that the hills ahead

[00:29:39] are filled with evil but Elrond

[00:29:40] overrules her and sends

[00:29:42] them into the danger.

[00:29:45] So is this

[00:29:47] Mythlaund, the Greyhavens

[00:29:50] in the Gulf of Lune?

[00:29:52] Yes

[00:29:52] and I love that they decide that the Greyhavens

[00:29:55] has loons because

[00:29:56] Were there loons on there?

[00:29:58] Loons has special significance to us manors.

[00:30:00] Yes they do.

[00:30:02] I didn't know there were loons in the scene.

[00:30:04] There were loon calls in the back.

[00:30:06] Nice good pickup.

[00:30:07] That's great.

[00:30:08] I could hardly not hear it.

[00:30:10] Yes

[00:30:11] I really like this

[00:30:17] because Elrond is trying

[00:30:19] to kind of

[00:30:21] work with Galadriel while

[00:30:23] also distrusting everything she says

[00:30:25] and kind of going with a, well anything

[00:30:27] you say is tainted by the ring so I'm not

[00:30:29] going to trust any of it.

[00:30:31] It's a really flawed approach

[00:30:33] he doesn't even consider that what she says

[00:30:35] is correct.

[00:30:36] Yeah it's kind of hard to work with somebody when you

[00:30:38] tell them up front I'm not going to trust anything you say.

[00:30:40] Exactly.

[00:30:41] I mean how does that function?

[00:30:43] I don't see that at all.

[00:30:45] Right and Elrond is hard

[00:30:48] he is cold as ice.

[00:30:51] Yeah

[00:30:51] They established that with one shot

[00:30:54] at the very end of season one

[00:30:56] and so now it's almost

[00:30:58] the flip of what the relationship was before

[00:31:01] it gets painful

[00:31:03] it really does.

[00:31:04] Which I think plays into future stuff

[00:31:07] right into the third age stuff.

[00:31:09] Well I'm not sure how

[00:31:10] that's the thing.

[00:31:11] Well just in their general relationship to each other

[00:31:15] which in the third

[00:31:17] age it is definitely not harsh

[00:31:19] Oh it's not?

[00:31:20] Yeah they're besties.

[00:31:23] Okay then I have a family

[00:31:25] by then.

[00:31:26] I know that but that doesn't mean

[00:31:28] that's fair but

[00:31:30] they are definitely friends.

[00:31:33] For some reason I had

[00:31:34] in my head that they are not but that's just

[00:31:36] something I must have made up.

[00:31:37] Well there's a reason why and I'll be interested to see

[00:31:40] if the show points

[00:31:42] towards the one critical

[00:31:45] softening that Elrond

[00:31:46] will have to

[00:31:48] undertake

[00:31:49] or not.

[00:31:51] Because if they don't make that bridge

[00:31:54] to the third age then

[00:31:55] I think they'll be

[00:31:57] leaving

[00:31:58] a bridge sticking out and nowhere

[00:32:00] chopped off by the magic of Sauron basically.

[00:32:03] Bridges are not doing too well in this episode

[00:32:05] I mean the path is

[00:32:07] not clear ahead.

[00:32:09] The AXA bridge

[00:32:11] again lack of subtitles

[00:32:13] I couldn't tell the name of this bridge.

[00:32:15] Is there any lore check there?

[00:32:17] I don't know anything about it.

[00:32:19] You mean the bridge that they come to the end of

[00:32:21] and it's I think

[00:32:23] that's entirely a show creation.

[00:32:24] Okay because it's named because

[00:32:26] these 12 year old soldiers

[00:32:28] who don't look like they're battle

[00:32:30] hardened soldiers for a special forces

[00:32:32] mission. Ah, they're elves.

[00:32:34] Yeah but still

[00:32:37] the one map

[00:32:38] guy who's not the soldier

[00:32:40] he says something about the AXA

[00:32:42] or is it Elrond? Somebody says something

[00:32:44] about the AXA bridge or I couldn't hear it.

[00:32:47] Well speaking strictly

[00:32:48] from lore perspective

[00:32:50] Euregion just was not that developed

[00:32:52] at this point. I mean

[00:32:53] they may be somewhere in the vicinity of the Shire

[00:32:56] right at that point.

[00:32:58] Well according to the map

[00:33:00] and then as they showed us

[00:33:02] on the show and then when I was looking

[00:33:04] I mean they're on a bridge

[00:33:06] line, they see a big lake that has to be

[00:33:08] Lake Evendim

[00:33:11] and they

[00:33:12] definitely have to pass through the Shire

[00:33:14] and that's the river

[00:33:16] that they're crossing has to be the Brandywine

[00:33:19] because if they're going to go down

[00:33:20] to the hills of Tierengothart

[00:33:23] if I can say that

[00:33:24] Gothart? I don't know

[00:33:25] Oh, look at you!

[00:33:28] People in our iTunes reviews are very angry

[00:33:30] at us rolling ours.

[00:33:32] Anyway, the Barrow Downs

[00:33:34] if they go to the Barrow Downs

[00:33:35] they have to be north of the Shire

[00:33:38] crossing the Brandywine.

[00:33:40] Right and I'm kind of disappointed that they did that

[00:33:42] I wish they had just made them some random

[00:33:44] barrel somewhere because they're saying things like

[00:33:46] well yes these are the dead men of a thousand

[00:33:48] years ago.

[00:33:51] These are the kinds of things that I said

[00:33:53] either they're going to love it or they're going to hate it.

[00:33:56] I can roll with it

[00:33:57] it's what they did, it's fine

[00:33:59] nobody else has ever portrayed

[00:34:01] a Portrayed Barrow Whites

[00:34:03] and so fine.

[00:34:04] I think my thing with this is

[00:34:06] this is trivia, right? Timelines are trivia

[00:34:09] they are not

[00:34:10] this doesn't change

[00:34:13] any kind of

[00:34:15] character motivations

[00:34:16] or anything like that. This is literally just

[00:34:18] oh this wouldn't have existed at that time

[00:34:20] that's just a fact

[00:34:22] I'm totally fine with them changing things

[00:34:24] like that to have a more interesting story

[00:34:26] and have more interesting visual languages

[00:34:28] and tie things back

[00:34:30] to the Lord of the Rings

[00:34:31] especially because we didn't get Barrow Whites

[00:34:33] in the Lord of the Rings movies

[00:34:35] Two things in this episode are things that

[00:34:38] we did not get in the movies

[00:34:40] that a lot of people complained about

[00:34:42] not getting in the movies

[00:34:43] so here we are

[00:34:44] now they're going to complain that they did get them because

[00:34:46] they weren't their perfect vision and that's not what I'm saying

[00:34:49] Exactly, so change up

[00:34:51] the trivia questions that's fine

[00:34:53] as long as we are

[00:34:55] not changing who characters are fundamentally

[00:34:57] I'm fine with that

[00:34:58] well I still think the whitelification of that

[00:35:01] elf happened far too fast but

[00:35:03] whatever

[00:35:05] Fair enough. It's a trap

[00:35:07] it sure was

[00:35:08] I just had to call out Admiral Ackbar

[00:35:11] but then I also have to call out Duke Lido

[00:35:13] of Trades for saying that

[00:35:15] knowing where the trap is, that is the first step

[00:35:17] in evading it but they didn't do a very good

[00:35:19] job of evading it in this episode

[00:35:20] Well, because

[00:35:23] Elrond made his decision

[00:35:24] Yeah

[00:35:26] I wonder at what point if they ever

[00:35:29] are going to kind of

[00:35:31] say well yeah actually you were right Galathriel

[00:35:35] However I mistrusted your information

[00:35:37] it was still the right information

[00:35:39] Yeah, right exactly. He's literally just

[00:35:41] doing opposite

[00:35:43] day because he's angry at Galadriel

[00:35:45] he's saying oh well you said this

[00:35:47] so I'm gonna do that and that's

[00:35:49] just an awful way to live your life

[00:35:51] especially because he's taking her advice on

[00:35:53] some things like sure I'll take your advice

[00:35:55] for archers but on

[00:35:57] whether there's danger he's like

[00:35:58] no you've you may

[00:36:01] have way more battle experience than me

[00:36:03] but I'm just gonna decide my own

[00:36:05] thing I'm gonna do the opposite of what you say

[00:36:07] mmm that's not a very successful

[00:36:09] strategy it isn't particularly

[00:36:10] since she's known for her

[00:36:12] intuition and that will only continue to grow

[00:36:15] develop as time goes on

[00:36:16] and this hubris got someone killed

[00:36:19] it should have more than one

[00:36:21] someone yeah

[00:36:23] anyway

[00:36:25] can I just say though I am

[00:36:26] loving the costume changes for

[00:36:28] Galadriel they keep putting her

[00:36:30] really great outfits and I just love

[00:36:33] the fact that

[00:36:34] main characters

[00:36:35] a lot of times main characters just ride the same

[00:36:38] costume through the entire series

[00:36:40] or show you know season

[00:36:41] and nope they're changing her up almost episode to

[00:36:44] episode and I'm here for it

[00:36:45] her fashion sense is on point

[00:36:48] absolutely

[00:36:50] shall we move on to the man of the hour

[00:36:53] hey dog

[00:36:54] man every duck

[00:36:55] I love his subtle singing but so the stranger

[00:36:58] follows a goat

[00:37:00] to the home of Tom Bombill

[00:37:01] by chance sorry

[00:37:04] actually I want to bring that up

[00:37:06] alright so the stranger

[00:37:07] follows a goat to the home of Tom Bombill

[00:37:09] who gives him only vague responses

[00:37:11] and songs

[00:37:12] the stranger sees a branch on a large tree

[00:37:15] and tries to take it as a staff but

[00:37:17] the tree traps him and absorbs him

[00:37:22] you know when

[00:37:23] they told me Bombid

[00:37:24] was gonna be in the show and then I saw the glow in this

[00:37:26] I think what I wanted was

[00:37:28] I wanted him to be like kicking trees

[00:37:31] down as he runs through the forest

[00:37:33] and bellowing his song

[00:37:35] I think if you put me in charge of this

[00:37:37] series I'd do a terrible job because that's what I

[00:37:39] would have done I would have had him just stomping through

[00:37:41] the forest you know yell singing

[00:37:43] his song thank god you're a good

[00:37:45] podcaster seriously

[00:37:47] listen this is what we needed right

[00:37:49] this is just a quiet gardener

[00:37:50] never giving you a straight answer

[00:37:52] just singing his song softly

[00:37:56] and being

[00:37:57] completely aloof yet so wise

[00:37:59] I mean that's the perfect balance

[00:38:01] I think and demonstrating tremendous

[00:38:03] power at the same time

[00:38:04] I have to say Rory

[00:38:06] Keneer I don't

[00:38:09] recognize him

[00:38:10] that much I'm just looking at some of his

[00:38:13] filmography

[00:38:15] and he's not been in a lot a lot

[00:38:17] and he is

[00:38:18] owning this role

[00:38:20] he absolutely delivers

[00:38:25] and let us also

[00:38:27] say he's been getting a lot of good lines

[00:38:30] some of them are

[00:38:31] Tolkien's lines so of course they're good but

[00:38:33] there's a bunch of other ones

[00:38:35] that I made note of we haven't gotten to yet

[00:38:38] but we will

[00:38:38] so just maybe a quick note

[00:38:41] we are going to do our lore cast this week

[00:38:43] on Tom Bombadil

[00:38:45] but just

[00:38:47] for a quick historical

[00:38:49] note I think

[00:38:51] Bombadil's first appearance is in

[00:38:53] 1934 in a poem called

[00:38:55] The Adventures of Tom Bombadil

[00:38:57] Yes it was published

[00:38:58] by itself

[00:38:59] and then you can find it now in The Adventures of Tom Bombadil

[00:39:03] and other verses from the red book

[00:39:05] which is a 1962 publication

[00:39:06] and you can also find I found it

[00:39:09] online I found the whole poem online

[00:39:11] and I'm going to do a rendition of it

[00:39:13] for our lore cast

[00:39:14] I read the whole thing so it was a lot of fun

[00:39:17] so we're going to have a lot more

[00:39:19] on Bombadil but we'll talk about

[00:39:21] the scene is there much more we want

[00:39:23] to talk about in this scene

[00:39:25] I mean there's not a lot here I mean they do kind of

[00:39:27] the whole old man willow thing here

[00:39:29] I mean they do

[00:39:31] if you're not familiar just go read

[00:39:33] the two or three chapters of Tom Bombadil

[00:39:35] in the Fellowship of the Ring he's

[00:39:37] there for a while like you

[00:39:38] spend time with Tom Bombadil and he's

[00:39:41] just completely absent from the movie so

[00:39:43] people who have not read the books are just

[00:39:45] completely sometimes oblivious to his existence

[00:39:48] but not anymore

[00:39:50] anymore

[00:39:51] can't overlook him now

[00:39:53] outside of the fact that he's in Rune

[00:39:54] which I don't think has ever been alluded

[00:39:56] to before

[00:39:57] no but he's also eldest so he could have done anything

[00:40:00] he could have gone over anywhere he wanted

[00:40:02] over any period of time

[00:40:03] one thing but I was just going to say

[00:40:06] that a lot everything that you're seeing with Bombadil

[00:40:08] like I was like oh what's this what's that I didn't know

[00:40:10] I read the poem and I was like oh my god

[00:40:13] like this is just

[00:40:14] they're just pulling stuff straight up out of the text

[00:40:17] one for one

[00:40:18] and just putting it into the scene so

[00:40:20] the tree swallowing

[00:40:23] the stranger

[00:40:25] that's that actually

[00:40:26] happens to Bombadil in the poem and

[00:40:28] yeah so

[00:40:31] at some point

[00:40:32] the bad wizard refers to Tom

[00:40:34] Bombadil as the hermit

[00:40:37] which made me wonder

[00:40:38] if this has any connection with the constellation

[00:40:41] the hermit's hat

[00:40:43] which the stranger has been seeking

[00:40:44] and then it occurred to me to wonder

[00:40:47] maybe the stranger will end up

[00:40:49] with Tom Bombadil's hat

[00:40:51] oh

[00:40:51] oh what do you think

[00:40:55] because I don't see a feather in this hat

[00:40:57] it's Tom Bombadillo

[00:40:58] it doesn't look like

[00:41:00] Tom Bombadil's hat that we see

[00:41:02] in the Shire

[00:41:03] just saying

[00:41:05] there's a feather missing from this hat

[00:41:07] and this one

[00:41:10] the top tilts back

[00:41:12] in a very distinct way

[00:41:14] from another movie

[00:41:15] yes

[00:41:18] yeah I mean

[00:41:20] I will say what's going on with the goat

[00:41:22] why is it a goat because usually

[00:41:24] goats are used to symbolize a dark thing

[00:41:27] because

[00:41:28] sheep cannot survive in such territory

[00:41:30] you'd like to have goats for milk

[00:41:33] and cheese and whatnot

[00:41:34] do you know my guilty pleasure on tiktok

[00:41:36] right now is I've gone from

[00:41:38] hoof trimming videos to

[00:41:40] sheep shearing videos

[00:41:41] oh sheep shearing is fun

[00:41:43] sheep shearing and llama shearing

[00:41:45] oh my yeah yeah yeah

[00:41:46] it's a whole thing

[00:41:49] did John did you get any

[00:41:50] strong vibes of Yoda on Dagobah

[00:41:54] yeah

[00:41:55] that's a good poll

[00:41:56] as well as earth sea vibes because

[00:41:59] what's in a name

[00:41:59] your name is yours to command if you want to

[00:42:02] command it and your staff is there for you

[00:42:04] oh you're jumping ahead here

[00:42:06] yes am I

[00:42:07] oh okay my notes I have my notes out of

[00:42:09] order that I well as I think I already said

[00:42:11] as soon as I saw the goat I said

[00:42:13] oh Ged yes

[00:42:15] yeah the goat heard

[00:42:17] but I do have something to observe about

[00:42:19] the whole Star Wars Association when

[00:42:21] we are ready to have that okay

[00:42:23] alright let's save it for in the house of

[00:42:25] Tom Bombadot which is one scene away

[00:42:27] but right now we have to go to Nori and Poppy

[00:42:29] meeting a friend Stoors

[00:42:31] Nori and Poppy

[00:42:32] awaken the wilderness of rune and stumble upon

[00:42:35] another halfling who's never heard of

[00:42:37] Harfuz they learn his name is Mary Mack

[00:42:39] or perhaps nobody

[00:42:41] and force him to take

[00:42:43] hint to take them to his home

[00:42:45] there they learn that the halflings there

[00:42:47] call themselves Stoors and live in

[00:42:49] holes the leader of the Stoors

[00:42:51] can I ask you to what is the name of

[00:42:53] the leader of the Stoors I could not

[00:42:55] get it straight

[00:42:57] grund

[00:42:59] grund

[00:43:03] grund

[00:43:03] remember no subtitles I need the

[00:43:05] goon goon I didn't have an or in there

[00:43:07] goon yeah goon

[00:43:09] I will have to wait until

[00:43:13] alright the leader of the Stoors mistakes

[00:43:15] them for allies of the dark wizard

[00:43:17] and orders them imprisoned

[00:43:19] meanwhile the dark wizards tells

[00:43:20] the razor the dark wizard

[00:43:23] tells the raiders he will deal with the

[00:43:25] stranger while the raiders capture

[00:43:27] the Harfuz

[00:43:29] and I didn't

[00:43:31] state this openly so I cannot claim any

[00:43:33] internet points but I rather

[00:43:35] thought that the whirlwind was going to carry the two

[00:43:37] Harfuz to the ruined version of proto

[00:43:39] hobbits so

[00:43:41] I can pat myself on the back because

[00:43:43] I figured that you can have a bowl of cereal

[00:43:45] that's fine oh great

[00:43:47] wonderful make it over and it's

[00:43:49] gonna be a little soggy by the time we get there

[00:43:51] or limp

[00:43:52] and I like the way the store music

[00:43:55] is both like and unlike the

[00:43:57] Harfuz music

[00:43:58] mostly the connection seems to be

[00:44:00] the hammer dulcimer

[00:44:01] but

[00:44:04] it's definitely not suggestive

[00:44:06] to my ears of

[00:44:08] Irish

[00:44:10] music and there's sort

[00:44:12] of a flavor of the desert going on there but

[00:44:14] yeah I thought

[00:44:15] once again the magic of bear McCreary

[00:44:18] I thought he did a good job with that so

[00:44:20] you can believe based

[00:44:22] on the musical cues that these people

[00:44:24] do have this connection that we eventually find out

[00:44:26] about the school I didn't get to pull off

[00:44:28] to go back and listen to the music

[00:44:30] and check the name of the leader

[00:44:32] when I check the name of the leader

[00:44:34] I'm also wondering and this is my Star Wars

[00:44:36] thing I wonder how much of the Star Wars

[00:44:38] associations with Rune are

[00:44:40] due to the fact that it is so hard

[00:44:42] for anyone past

[00:44:44] post-1977 to

[00:44:46] see a desert situation and not think Star Wars

[00:44:48] mm-hmm

[00:44:50] so many of the series

[00:44:52] in that world used Tatooine at one

[00:44:54] point or another and it just

[00:44:56] it's almost a reflex at this point

[00:44:58] I'm wondering if it was

[00:44:59] the same way with Lawrence of Arabia back

[00:45:02] in the day mm-hmm anything to do with the desert

[00:45:05] was a Lawrence of Arabia yeah

[00:45:06] because I got Lawrence of Arabia vibes

[00:45:08] and the very first time we saw

[00:45:09] an image from Rune of the horseman

[00:45:12] with the

[00:45:14] banner riding across the desert at sunset

[00:45:16] a classic Lawrence of Arabia going on

[00:45:18] so for all the people who are

[00:45:20] going oh it's just like Star Wars

[00:45:22] yeah but think about how many

[00:45:23] other desert images you do or don't

[00:45:25] have in your mind

[00:45:27] maybe there's a reason why that's what we go to

[00:45:29] I think it's also because Mary Mack is about

[00:45:31] as smart as Luke when he starts off his journey

[00:45:35] if I would have caused you nobody

[00:45:36] doesn't anybody call you somebody

[00:45:38] yeah I love that and oh

[00:45:39] of course we are shipping Poppy and Mary Mack

[00:45:42] well they were shipping each other

[00:45:44] yeah it was a little

[00:45:45] on the nose I thought actually

[00:45:47] wait a little bit

[00:45:48] sorry John the correct

[00:45:50] turn of phrase is on the ears

[00:45:52] okay on the ears

[00:45:54] the ears the ears the steward's

[00:45:56] ears are different than the harfors

[00:45:58] oh fair point okay yeah I just

[00:46:00] thought it was a little overdone like like be subtle

[00:46:02] about it at first and then and then grow into

[00:46:04] that don't be like

[00:46:06] Googling and then having Norrie go

[00:46:07] hello I'm Norrie that was

[00:46:10] yeah that was pretty funny

[00:46:12] I do I also I will say one other thing

[00:46:14] that was on the nose was never going harfors

[00:46:16] living in holes

[00:46:18] all right all right we get it

[00:46:20] we're not

[00:46:22] stupid quick

[00:46:24] Stoors lore check I just did a

[00:46:26] quick scan of the

[00:46:28] article on the Tolkien Gateway

[00:46:30] website so

[00:46:32] Stoors grew facial

[00:46:33] hair and had an affinity for water

[00:46:36] boats swimming and wore boots

[00:46:37] yes the fallow so there's

[00:46:40] three tribes of

[00:46:42] hobbits there's Stoors

[00:46:43] and then there's fallow hides they were fair

[00:46:45] tall and slim I'm just taking this

[00:46:47] straight off the website right and

[00:46:49] more adventurous friendlier and more open

[00:46:51] to outsiders and then the harfors were

[00:46:53] the most numerous and instituted

[00:46:55] living in burrows and later days the

[00:46:57] harfoot traits became the norm

[00:46:59] right but something that

[00:47:01] should be important besides the

[00:47:03] ear differences is that

[00:47:05] among the Stoors

[00:47:07] there were Degel and Smeagol

[00:47:09] yes the Stoors were the ancestors

[00:47:11] of Gollum

[00:47:13] yes

[00:47:15] Gollum

[00:47:16] also you can find a very quick

[00:47:19] summary of this in Tolkien's own words

[00:47:21] if you go to the preface to Lord of

[00:47:23] the Rings where he writes concerning

[00:47:25] hobbits and he breaks us all down

[00:47:27] which one uh where is this again

[00:47:29] at the very beginning of fellowship it's

[00:47:31] it's the preface to the whole Lord

[00:47:33] of the Rings got it he does a whole

[00:47:35] little kind of whimsical

[00:47:37] essay on hobbits okay cool and then

[00:47:40] also he wants you to make sure he wants

[00:47:42] to make sure you know where their pot

[00:47:44] came from

[00:47:47] it's not

[00:47:48] pot it is Nicosiana

[00:47:50] he states it very clearly

[00:47:53] yeah

[00:47:54] whatever pj whatever

[00:47:56] image pj wants to have

[00:47:58] Gandalf was all up in that secret fire

[00:47:59] that's all i can say

[00:48:03] sparkiness

[00:48:04] you do you

[00:48:07] my guy was red-eyed

[00:48:09] for 500 years

[00:48:15] hard he went back to the shire it wasn't

[00:48:17] for the birthday party it was that he needed to score

[00:48:19] again exactly they had the best

[00:48:22] the best

[00:48:24] pipe weed in all

[00:48:25] of the land all right yeah let's go

[00:48:27] to uh the house of bombadil

[00:48:29] which by the way i titled this section in the house

[00:48:31] of tom bombadil because that's the name of the chapter

[00:48:33] and the fellowship of the rings yes it is

[00:48:36] tom bombadil

[00:48:37] rescues the stranger

[00:48:38] and sends him to take a bath

[00:48:40] there the stranger hears tom singing

[00:48:43] with goldberry but tom seems to deny her

[00:48:45] presence

[00:48:45] tom as as cryptic as ever

[00:48:48] about his identity calling himself

[00:48:50] eldest tom recounts when rune was

[00:48:53] green and says he came

[00:48:55] to see the dust for himself

[00:48:57] tom tells the stranger

[00:48:59] he is not yet worthy of his name

[00:49:01] or staff but they'll

[00:49:03] soon discover if he will

[00:49:05] be

[00:49:06] they hear the raiders approach and the stranger

[00:49:08] learns it's his duty to face both the dark

[00:49:11] wizard and sauron

[00:49:13] yeah

[00:49:14] so how are you both on

[00:49:17] your theories of the strangers

[00:49:19] identity because we have some

[00:49:20] i mean with the hats

[00:49:23] that's like leaning one way

[00:49:25] but then

[00:49:25] if he's got to face both is he

[00:49:29] still a blue or is

[00:49:30] is he more Gandalfian

[00:49:32] no i think he's a blue still

[00:49:34] still okay i'm still on team

[00:49:36] Gandalf i still see nothing to

[00:49:38] contradict it okay the hat

[00:49:40] you don't think that he gets a bombadil

[00:49:42] hat that's not again doffy and thing

[00:49:44] no it's a wizard

[00:49:46] okay it's a wizard thing

[00:49:47] all right all right they were sent as equals

[00:49:50] you know like they were sent as

[00:49:52] five equals it's just that

[00:49:53] four of them failed their task

[00:49:56] or they were sent as

[00:49:58] two who went out first and went far

[00:50:00] east and you know yeah

[00:50:02] discovered the one of

[00:50:04] them discovered the joys of creating cults

[00:50:06] and the other one said you know that's a pretty

[00:50:08] bad idea and we might

[00:50:10] find that they destroy each other

[00:50:13] it kind of i guess

[00:50:14] i in my

[00:50:16] mind i made the implication that you know they're both

[00:50:18] sent out east as if they went out together but in this

[00:50:21] they didn't know one went and then the other so yeah

[00:50:24] yeah i mean that's that's i think that's a show

[00:50:26] winner thing got it there was an

[00:50:28] impression that the two traveled out to the east yeah that's yeah

[00:50:32] and the the sort of bottom line from a lore

[00:50:35] perspective is they didn't quote

[00:50:37] succeed in so far as they weren't destroying

[00:50:39] sauron but they

[00:50:42] removed the possibility of

[00:50:45] other armies arriving

[00:50:47] from the east to aid sauron and his dirty

[00:50:50] work so you know it was the sort of well

[00:50:53] you know we're gonna die but at least we prevented

[00:50:56] this and this and this ask any political

[00:50:58] campaign it's hard to set up a field office

[00:50:59] you know and

[00:51:01] and the dark wizard tried to set up a field

[00:51:05] office and i guess probably not gonna work out for

[00:51:07] him well i hope it isn't left in the hands they

[00:51:11] were placed in this din yeah great line

[00:51:14] i absolutely love the way that tom

[00:51:16] lights one candle on his chimney stack and then

[00:51:19] they all light up so that was a beautiful

[00:51:22] image and a wonderful conception i just thought

[00:51:24] that was nifty i'm very interested that the dark

[00:51:27] wizard actually met tom

[00:51:30] he says you're not the first wizard to eat

[00:51:32] honey by my fire right right was that one

[00:51:36] that wizard first arrived and you know how

[00:51:39] did that conversation go i mean it did

[00:51:42] there they're teasing us there with a

[00:51:44] whole lot of stuff and i don't know if we'll

[00:51:46] ever see it or not well does that have to

[00:51:48] do with tom's function i mean we can talk

[00:51:52] a little bit about this more on the

[00:51:54] lower cast but you know they're they're

[00:51:56] sort of giving tom a job in this season

[00:52:00] of television because if he's if if the

[00:52:03] stranger's been you know directed here

[00:52:05] and tom is saying well we're gonna see

[00:52:09] if you're worthy of your name and your

[00:52:11] staff it's it's a it is a yoda luke

[00:52:16] kind of situation where you got to show

[00:52:19] me that you've got the chops and you know

[00:52:22] i'm gonna i'm gonna observe and because tom

[00:52:25] is like a non like he doesn't involve

[00:52:29] himself in the affairs of a lot of things

[00:52:31] so he's kind of working as an observer

[00:52:34] role in some way so is that like giving

[00:52:38] the stranger a path somebody like look i

[00:52:42] can do it oh like oh i can do what should

[00:52:44] i do with this magic or how should i do

[00:52:46] this and and tom's just kind of giving

[00:52:47] them his cryptic answers but in a way

[00:52:50] it's drawing the stranger to take actions

[00:52:53] and to learn and to grow in his his role

[00:52:56] yeah it's it's the enigmatic sensei

[00:53:00] approach which i think is appropriate

[00:53:03] i don't see tom as a trainer of wizards

[00:53:06] no right i see him as a very potent

[00:53:09] force who is only interested in things

[00:53:14] as they are it was really weird when he

[00:53:16] took out the wax on say can you walk wax

[00:53:18] my car but he did tell him to watch his

[00:53:23] face at hands so what's the deal with the

[00:53:26] lamb gloar gloar wine i he named the lamb

[00:53:30] picked it up and was irwin irwin anyway

[00:53:33] you've you've seen the things i haven't

[00:53:35] well no but hey i don't have the i don't

[00:53:37] have subtitles so as you know so i was

[00:53:40] only hearing what i could hear and i

[00:53:42] okay he named the lamb something you

[00:53:44] did so i guess we'll find out when we

[00:53:46] get subtitles you know what one thing

[00:53:48] you go at mariland i just think it was a

[00:53:51] random indication of how tom behaves

[00:53:52] okay that he's interested in everyone

[00:53:55] and has no desire to dominate anyone

[00:53:58] and if you know of black wizard fresh

[00:54:02] from his meteor came up meteorite

[00:54:06] came up to him and said teach me the

[00:54:08] powers of darkness and he's like hey

[00:54:10] doll married all here's my little lamb

[00:54:13] and the black wizard said right fine

[00:54:15] because he knows of it he calls him the

[00:54:18] hermit yeah is the did the first wizard

[00:54:21] go you know eat honey with tom and then

[00:54:25] he went out and then he was corrupted

[00:54:27] or did or was he you know like when did

[00:54:29] the dark wizard become dark right when

[00:54:31] it's you know when did sourmon become

[00:54:33] sour yeah sourmon was good for a very

[00:54:36] long time right yeah no i my

[00:54:39] understanding is that somehow in this

[00:54:42] time period that we have yet to see the

[00:54:46] dark wizard as he is now encountered

[00:54:48] souron because he's corrupted and he's

[00:54:52] clearly the head of this cult

[00:54:55] right right of course of course duh

[00:54:57] because the white wings are out looking

[00:55:00] for souron exactly so that they can

[00:55:03] join forces and then tom specifically

[00:55:05] says that if those two flames combined

[00:55:07] then the world's gonna burn the words

[00:55:09] gonna burn and we don't really know

[00:55:11] where the rumors started that the

[00:55:14] meteorite would be a sign that souron

[00:55:17] was going to return and so remember the

[00:55:20] the three cultists initially thought

[00:55:23] that that was souron you know sign of

[00:55:26] his return well it is his return and

[00:55:28] that's why they were tracking it down

[00:55:29] and trying to find so forth and then

[00:55:31] later on found out that no it is

[00:55:33] the other so again someone somewhere

[00:55:37] knew that there would be a second

[00:55:38] wizard now maybe tom bombardill told that

[00:55:40] to the first wizard and so he got set up

[00:55:43] for that so you know they kept coding

[00:55:45] the stranger with this i motif right

[00:55:48] which is partially designed to you know

[00:55:51] mislead us as to his identity but then

[00:55:53] I'm thinking about the opening sequence

[00:55:55] and there's that suns star you know

[00:55:58] that sun circle symbol that we see

[00:56:01] that we're thinking is new menorian

[00:56:03] what if that's relative to the east

[00:56:06] star well I thought that at least one

[00:56:09] of the sunsigns was relating to the

[00:56:12] east to rune and so right now

[00:56:14] extension but there's that one you know

[00:56:16] do you remember which one I'm talking

[00:56:17] about it we don't have the image to look

[00:56:19] at together way not it's it's the one

[00:56:21] that we thought was new menorian

[00:56:23] okay that was ringed in red

[00:56:25] okay the circle one that's a sorry

[00:56:27] right I wonder if that's I wonder

[00:56:29] if that's something to do with the

[00:56:31] stranger and the east star and what

[00:56:33] not because they kept giving us that

[00:56:35] visual round I shape for him

[00:56:39] so could be could be so I mean to me

[00:56:46] I'm just gonna posit my theory here on

[00:56:48] what Tom is this is something that I

[00:56:49] thought about a long time probably

[00:56:51] longer than most should I think he

[00:56:54] is the embodiment of the music of

[00:56:56] the iron ore I think that is that is

[00:56:58] who he is and which is why he's

[00:57:00] able to interact without power over

[00:57:04] things power in conjunction with

[00:57:06] things because he is part of all

[00:57:08] creation and that's why he's able to

[00:57:10] sing to goldberry when she's not really

[00:57:12] there right or is somehow able to be

[00:57:16] there in you know see if it'll pull

[00:57:18] her in for a minute sure why not so

[00:57:22] yeah and I think it's really

[00:57:23] interesting that in hit this scene

[00:57:24] we get clear statements that he has

[00:57:28] already been to the withy window which

[00:57:30] is where he was when he met the

[00:57:31] hobbits right right which is very

[00:57:35] interesting to me because we were all

[00:57:36] thinking oh this is gonna be before

[00:57:37] when we saw the trailers it'll be

[00:57:39] before he ever goes west but now we

[00:57:41] know he has been west and he's come

[00:57:43] back east to check on things and he

[00:57:46] could end up back there he came out

[00:57:48] he will end up yeah he will yeah he

[00:57:50] came out because he heard that this

[00:57:53] place that had been green was now

[00:57:56] dust right and he's that's classic

[00:58:00] Bombadil because he's an observer

[00:58:01] right he is not intended to try and

[00:58:04] make changes or to force anyone that's

[00:58:07] just not what he does he'll tell

[00:58:09] stories he'll point things out to you

[00:58:11] that should be obvious but aren't

[00:58:13] right and and that's who he is and

[00:58:16] that's great I think we can dive into

[00:58:18] the nature of Bombadil more in our

[00:58:19] lower cast cool but there's a lot

[00:58:22] of really good stuff here I think he

[00:58:25] bears a resemblance to Qtodon actually

[00:58:27] now that I think of it they're both

[00:58:29] they're both contemplatives yeah so

[00:58:33] let's go back to near culture to the

[00:58:35] with the windel Barrow whites Elron

[00:58:39] and Galadriel's team wanders into the

[00:58:42] Barrow Downs where ancient lords and

[00:58:45] kings are buried the Barrow whites

[00:58:47] awaken and attack the team seems

[00:58:50] hopeless but Elron remembers that

[00:58:52] Barrow whites can be defeated with

[00:58:53] the weapons they were buried with one

[00:58:55] elf is killed Galadriel implies that

[00:58:58] Sarron is awakening evil across Middle

[00:59:01] Earth so I just want to say in this

[00:59:04] scene Elron makes a successful arcana

[00:59:07] check the scene is so this is such a

[00:59:11] D&T scene it's so like hold on let me

[00:59:15] roll let me roll for strength so I can

[00:59:16] lift up the exactly let me help and

[00:59:20] that gives you a you know an extra die

[00:59:22] right for your role not 20 yep yeah well

[00:59:27] that's what he rolled for his arcana

[00:59:29] check so I really can't wait for the

[00:59:33] episode proper to come out because I

[00:59:35] want to rewatch this scene it's hard

[00:59:38] without the subtitles well but I'm

[00:59:41] thinking of the watermarking in the

[00:59:43] small screen I want to see this on I

[00:59:45] want to see the detail because these

[00:59:47] Barrow whites look great the CGI looks

[00:59:49] amazing I think they just did a very

[00:59:52] very cool job there was there was a

[00:59:55] little bit of Pirates of the Caribbean

[00:59:56] there too sure there was a skull that

[00:59:58] got knocked back and then came forward

[01:00:00] that's true yeah yeah that's right

[01:00:01] that's right yeah yeah and they're

[01:00:04] taking these visions from the ring and

[01:00:06] they're putting them right around

[01:00:08] right they're not delaying them and I

[01:00:10] wondered how much are they kind of

[01:00:13] reacting to season one where they

[01:00:14] had they set up these season long

[01:00:16] like what ifs wink wink nudge

[01:00:19] and now they're like now we're going to

[01:00:20] give you a vision at the beginning of

[01:00:21] the episode and then we're going to

[01:00:22] give you the play out in the middle

[01:00:24] yeah they're not getting their hands

[01:00:26] burnt by holding back well it's also

[01:00:29] more more chalcini and because he's

[01:00:32] constantly spoiling himself for the

[01:00:33] Silmarillion mmm yeah also there

[01:00:37] somebody had written in I forgot who

[01:00:39] but basically they were already they

[01:00:41] had already written season two before

[01:00:43] they aired season one basically

[01:00:45] so yeah a lot of this is just this

[01:00:48] is where they were at with the story

[01:00:50] and I also have a feeling they did a

[01:00:52] fair bit of yeah I'm sure they always

[01:00:55] do editing they always do that and I

[01:00:58] think not having the code restrictions

[01:01:00] like you brought up in the beginning

[01:01:01] Maryland yes a big deal it has to

[01:01:04] have been I mean the wheel of time

[01:01:07] is the is the biggest casualty to

[01:01:09] covid I think you know because

[01:01:12] they had to completely rewrite the

[01:01:13] finale for a lot of reasons and so

[01:01:17] I'm not going to go deep into that go

[01:01:19] back to our wheel of time coverage if

[01:01:20] you want to hear about that but but I

[01:01:23] think Amazon in particular seems to

[01:01:25] have suffered quite a lot from covid

[01:01:26] production issues mm-hmm

[01:01:30] so yes go on yes I got a couple of

[01:01:34] notes a small technical detail I

[01:01:37] heard Elron say the barding is from

[01:01:39] Lyndon yeah that a barding or barb

[01:01:43] or bard is body armor for war horses

[01:01:46] right and I kind of feel dumb for not

[01:01:49] picking up on the visual clues of the

[01:01:52] messengers getting captured by the

[01:01:54] chains in that previous episode and

[01:01:56] what I thought they were work and oh

[01:01:59] yes oh yeah I think I got you

[01:02:04] figured out yes how could have

[01:02:07] did anybody okay I feel so much better

[01:02:10] thank you David it was it was not

[01:02:14] gloomy and ghostly no it was not pull

[01:02:18] away it was not well they were doing

[01:02:19] their best not to in any way he had to

[01:02:21] but they dragged away bodies with chains

[01:02:24] and I thought what is that all about

[01:02:26] is this dinner you know but yeah it

[01:02:29] wasn't sour on not directly I knew it

[01:02:31] couldn't have been orcs and I have to

[01:02:33] say BDDF black dude dies first yeah

[01:02:39] they can be only black actor like

[01:02:41] that's a whole separate issue but I

[01:02:43] wanted to call it out yeah it's a

[01:02:46] thing in television and movies the

[01:02:48] blood dude dies yeah yeah yeah yeah

[01:02:50] especially in horror yep yeah well

[01:02:53] that's unfortunate well let's go back

[01:02:57] to the search party for Arandir who

[01:03:02] leads a search party through the

[01:03:04] forest to find Theo when they

[01:03:07] return to Gloria Arandir figures out

[01:03:09] that Estrid is hiding her true

[01:03:11] identity as one of the wild men he

[01:03:13] puts her in shackles and forces her to

[01:03:16] lead them to the rest of the wild men

[01:03:19] is sealed or feels betrayed as the trio

[01:03:21] sets out to find Theo who is trapped

[01:03:24] in a tree with the wild men from the

[01:03:26] camp sealed or falls into a sinkhole

[01:03:29] and Arandir falls in after him

[01:03:32] Estrid free to escape chooses to

[01:03:35] help him sorry to help them

[01:03:38] allowing them to slay one of the

[01:03:41] nameless things and go free this

[01:03:45] things was my favorite comic moment

[01:03:49] oh really okay absolute spit take

[01:03:51] moment uh-huh there are many nameless

[01:03:54] things in the dark places of the

[01:03:56] world this one we shall call supper

[01:03:58] yeah that was that was great because

[01:04:02] it combined a talking quote with

[01:04:04] humor right exactly exactly and I got

[01:04:08] to say I mean she was in a tight

[01:04:10] corner and I'm kind of desperate but

[01:04:11] this is the first time that Estrid

[01:04:14] showed very little common sense in

[01:04:17] street smarts when she was trying to

[01:04:18] say oh yes I was lying too close to

[01:04:20] the fire your hair would have gone

[01:04:23] before that came anywhere near that

[01:04:25] mark yeah I was curious if she was

[01:04:27] gonna get herself out of the cranky

[01:04:29] Moses yep did uh I don't know that

[01:04:33] the when they were opening the

[01:04:34] aqueduct speaking of Estrid and

[01:04:36] she forces the thing open then he

[01:04:38] gets spit on the face that whole

[01:04:41] scene read very sexual to me and I

[01:04:43] don't know if that's just me of course

[01:04:45] no role reversal stuff going on

[01:04:48] you're good okay wasn't just you oh

[01:04:54] man uh so quicksand shout out to

[01:04:57] quicksand the bug the bugaboo of

[01:05:00] generation x we all feared quicksand

[01:05:02] we thought it was gonna be around

[01:05:04] every corner and we got some interesting

[01:05:07] in the middle a bit about that didn't

[01:05:09] you know me yeah there's a whole

[01:05:10] bunch of comedians and other you know

[01:05:13] memes and stuff about like I thought

[01:05:14] that was gonna be a big concern in

[01:05:16] adulthood totally totally well thank

[01:05:19] you for clarifying that for me because

[01:05:21] I think this is the first time we

[01:05:22] encounter quicksand yeah well and a

[01:05:26] nameless thing of which seems like it's

[01:05:29] the you know not dissimilar to the

[01:05:30] watcher in the water outside the

[01:05:32] Moria gate there's a quote I forgot

[01:05:36] who says it is an Aragorn or

[01:05:38] Legolas who said he's like there are many

[01:05:40] names like basically what our under your

[01:05:41] says in the ring says far far below the

[01:05:45] deepest delving of the dwarves the world

[01:05:47] is gnawed by name that's even sauron

[01:05:51] knows them not yeah older than he

[01:05:53] okay now I have walked there but I will

[01:05:56] bring no report to darken the light

[01:05:58] of day it's Gandalf 2.0 when he

[01:06:02] comes back is Gandalf the way he's

[01:06:03] telling them what's spoilers just

[01:06:05] gonna everybody knows everybody knows

[01:06:07] about wizard Jesus you you got it at

[01:06:12] some point let go of I know I'm just

[01:06:14] giving the Lord of the Rings is very

[01:06:15] very pretty that's fair game I would hope

[01:06:17] so so there's a whole class of monsters

[01:06:21] and in here but name that just fall

[01:06:23] into the nameless things right so I

[01:06:25] mean I think it's really interesting

[01:06:26] that Tolkien takes that because that's

[01:06:27] a biblical thing too right that's

[01:06:29] that's something in Genesis oh you see

[01:06:31] they're like God created all these

[01:06:34] nameless things and and then Leviathan

[01:06:37] now that's in Job sorry well but so

[01:06:40] there's all the nameless things in Genesis

[01:06:42] and then yeah you you then have people

[01:06:44] like HP HP Lovecraft who then explore

[01:06:48] that idea right that there are nameless

[01:06:50] things in the depths and so this is

[01:06:52] it's a trope that I really like yeah

[01:06:54] yeah I would push back slightly on the

[01:06:57] HP Lovecraft and I'm no no I think

[01:07:01] it's more of a minor point which is

[01:07:03] his thing came from his deep deep seated

[01:07:07] racism and xenophobia so it was mapped

[01:07:10] there but I think it's still a of a

[01:07:12] similar elk of like yeah I mean I think

[01:07:15] I think different I think people have

[01:07:18] different influences right he can sure

[01:07:19] you can have his cat dudes don't look up

[01:07:21] the name but he can also know his

[01:07:24] biblical history and yeah yeah I'm not

[01:07:27] I'm not I'm not trying to invalidate

[01:07:28] your point I think I'll just add to it

[01:07:30] so yeah I'm certainly I'm not defending

[01:07:34] the morality of HP Lovecraft

[01:07:36] well I think that notion of creatures

[01:07:39] in the deep it doesn't matter what

[01:07:42] religion you are if you're anywhere near a

[01:07:44] coastline it's gonna be a thing and we

[01:07:46] have to make sure that we don't judge

[01:07:48] the creation by its creator right

[01:07:51] right Gilgallit right Keerdon whoever

[01:07:55] said score good call it was Keerdon

[01:07:58] yeah Darren insufferable so is the big

[01:08:03] shark whale creature in season one and

[01:08:09] and of course in the episode one of this

[01:08:11] is that a nameless would that fall into

[01:08:12] a nameless thing category I'd put it

[01:08:14] there I would too though of course

[01:08:16] they've given it a name by now yeah I

[01:08:21] think that's right I think that's

[01:08:22] right and we could see that big long

[01:08:25] trail of how it was moving so I don't

[01:08:27] know was it if oh what if well now they

[01:08:30] killed this one so hmm because what if

[01:08:33] this is comes up to a Reggion and then

[01:08:36] plants itself at the you know at the

[01:08:38] outside of Moria it just looks more

[01:08:41] like a slug to me now okay it looks

[01:08:44] like yeah I don't think this is I

[01:08:47] don't think this is that is a watcher

[01:08:48] in the water yeah no no I think there

[01:08:50] are many nameless things right there

[01:08:52] we were just told that fairness when

[01:08:54] we this one we will call supper

[01:08:58] exactly so let's go to the fate of the

[01:09:01] Harfuz the leader of the stores

[01:09:03] announces that the Harfuz will be cast

[01:09:06] out at sunrise nori says saddock boroughs

[01:09:09] would have done the same thing leading

[01:09:11] the store leader to show her their

[01:09:13] history in ancient history a store

[01:09:16] named Rory mass boroughs set out to

[01:09:20] find the sousat a land where the

[01:09:23] stores could settle nori says she does

[01:09:25] not think worry mass ever found the

[01:09:27] sousat as the Harfuz do not have a home

[01:09:31] the Raiders arrived to demand the

[01:09:33] Harfuz but the leader covers for them

[01:09:37] the Raiders leave and vow to come back

[01:09:40] with the dark wizard interesting they

[01:09:44] didn't just say right we're going to

[01:09:46] trash your village until we find them

[01:09:47] yeah exactly right maybe they thought

[01:09:50] they couldn't fight off all those

[01:09:51] Harfuz at once I don't know yeah I

[01:09:53] think that was all those stories are

[01:09:54] really sorry only explanation I just

[01:09:58] loved not only the concept of making

[01:10:03] Rory mass boroughs's journey into the

[01:10:08] walking song but also the way again

[01:10:11] bear used the melody in the music in

[01:10:14] this scene just the two of them

[01:10:17] together we're just incredibly beautiful

[01:10:21] I didn't even pick up that that was a

[01:10:23] song in that scene it absolutely was

[01:10:26] nice completely different orchestration

[01:10:30] to call it that so how do we think that

[01:10:33] the sousat is going to become the

[01:10:35] Shire in name yeah well you know this

[01:10:38] this sousat sounds more like a runic

[01:10:41] term so I couldn't find no reference

[01:10:45] online to anything that was like

[01:10:47] sousat so that's I think it's a

[01:10:50] creation okay yeah did you notice the

[01:10:53] big on the big rock wall painting at

[01:10:56] the top of the painting is a big big

[01:10:58] tree cool yeah it was too dark for me to

[01:11:03] see all the details tree and the

[01:11:05] ceiling at that point yeah yeah no there

[01:11:06] is part of their design is a big tree

[01:11:09] so follow the trees as all the trees

[01:11:12] although Ronde was following the

[01:11:15] pedals in this that's true particular

[01:11:17] episode that's true pedals came for the

[01:11:19] trees so mm-hmm I really do like this

[01:11:23] whole scene though I mean for me at

[01:11:26] first I was like is good who is the

[01:11:30] leader moving too fast in her change

[01:11:32] of motivations but then you're like I

[01:11:34] don't think she really wanted to send

[01:11:36] them out at any point you get the

[01:11:37] sense that she's much like saddock

[01:11:38] burrows and that she's kind of rough

[01:11:42] on the outside but has a tender

[01:11:44] heart mm-hmm I think I think that's kind

[01:11:47] of when you're when you're dealing with

[01:11:49] a group like this and you need to rule

[01:11:52] them in a way where you can manage

[01:11:54] resources and not get caught I think

[01:11:56] you just have to kind of be like that

[01:11:58] and she she and saddock both did that

[01:12:01] absolutely that's exactly what Norie

[01:12:03] says but I think she was so startled

[01:12:07] by that connection mm-hmm that it

[01:12:10] kind of disarmed her entirely and so

[01:12:13] her defenses were down and suddenly

[01:12:15] it's like okay you're not strangers you

[01:12:17] know your great great great great great

[01:12:19] grandnises or something mm-hmm do you

[01:12:21] buy that the last name stuck in that

[01:12:24] nothing ever changed and nobody ever

[01:12:26] married they never only had a daughter

[01:12:29] who then took the last name of the

[01:12:31] other birth you don't I mean I was

[01:12:33] a little bit like wait so you still

[01:12:35] have a pathfinder with that same last

[01:12:37] name how many hundreds or thousands of

[01:12:40] years later well it worked for me

[01:12:42] I'm not sure that it's thousands of years

[01:12:43] later yeah probably hundreds because

[01:12:46] it's really hard for songs to last that

[01:12:48] long in such a similar form

[01:12:51] yeah I think they would because you

[01:12:54] know if boroughs is the trailfinder

[01:12:58] and that becomes not just a family but

[01:13:01] a job if you will mm-hmm it's much

[01:13:06] more likely that they're gonna keep

[01:13:08] those names and keep that

[01:13:12] tradition that the two are the same

[01:13:14] thing and I think hobbits proto-hobbits

[01:13:17] are gonna have a lot of kids because of

[01:13:20] the hazards of life so I have no problems

[01:13:22] with them having that kind of a descent

[01:13:24] going down okay so many years all right

[01:13:27] well I certainly lead the groundwork

[01:13:29] for the Shire yeah I'll see you at

[01:13:32] the sousat mm-hmm where it's easy to

[01:13:35] dig out a hole and what it was I

[01:13:37] forget what there was some sort of you

[01:13:39] could do it in a month or something I

[01:13:40] think right right I think I'm going to

[01:13:43] have to change the name of my occasional

[01:13:46] patreon thing to a sousat side chats

[01:13:51] you better practice saying it first

[01:13:54] mouthful even worse than Shire side chats

[01:14:02] all right shall we move on to a new

[01:14:05] oath

[01:14:06] Elrond and Galadriel debate whether the

[01:14:08] cost of victory will become too great

[01:14:10] Elrond says a odd and deal told him one

[01:14:13] day killer brimboar's life would be in his

[01:14:16] hand and did that day is come isn't it

[01:14:18] yeah Galadriel sees a vision of

[01:14:20] Sauron's crowned I'll Elrond being

[01:14:24] held at knife point by orcs the

[01:14:26] statue of feanor being pulled down in

[01:14:28] a reggae on kill a brimboar being

[01:14:30] shoved to the ground and a dark haired

[01:14:33] man ish Sauron she asks Elrond to put

[01:14:36] the defeat of Sauron above all else

[01:14:39] including her life he makes the promise

[01:14:41] one of the elves arrives to announce they

[01:14:44] have heard drums

[01:14:47] so they have established that all of

[01:14:51] these ring vision things are going to

[01:14:53] happen very soon so I you know these

[01:14:56] aren't big mysteries they're setting up

[01:14:58] they're just straightforward

[01:15:01] not even foreshadowing like this is

[01:15:04] highlighting this is what's going to

[01:15:06] happen yeah it's almost as if they're

[01:15:08] warning people okay the last three

[01:15:10] episodes are going to be terribly

[01:15:11] violent right yeah we're going to have a

[01:15:14] battle you were to beware right and

[01:15:16] then hopefully well you know if

[01:15:20] we'll see how the season goes but

[01:15:22] sometimes you know ending a season

[01:15:25] on a downbeat like what will happen

[01:15:27] to our heroes next season you know

[01:15:28] that kind of stuff I will throw up on

[01:15:31] the microphone

[01:15:34] satisfy a plotline I think they will I

[01:15:36] think yeah I really do well they'll give

[01:15:38] us enough satisfied plotlines yeah

[01:15:40] yeah but if I do tease something else

[01:15:42] the next I mean you know

[01:15:45] Calrissian heading off into the stars

[01:15:47] to bring Han back and at the end of

[01:15:50] season two I mean classic ending so

[01:15:53] this is where we get more of this

[01:15:56] development of Galadriel saying that

[01:15:59] she's always felt these premonitions but

[01:16:01] now she can see them yes which is a

[01:16:04] wonderful way of pointing back to the

[01:16:07] lore which says that these rings will

[01:16:09] enhance the abilities that you already

[01:16:12] have hobbits get a little Heidi and

[01:16:17] Galadriel gets a little CE and as I

[01:16:21] said I can absolutely see in this the

[01:16:24] early seeds of the lady of Lorian and

[01:16:27] not just in the visions but in this

[01:16:28] exchange right between the two of them

[01:16:31] you know let's figure out what our

[01:16:34] priorities are here and if we have to

[01:16:37] use a flawed instrument to bring about

[01:16:39] positive outcome you know why are you

[01:16:43] so resistant to that mm-hmm and Elrond

[01:16:47] equally is is there no point at which

[01:16:49] the cost of victory becomes too great

[01:16:50] well interestingly that is kind of

[01:16:54] also going to be the question for new

[01:16:57] and or and and we've already heard

[01:17:01] Miriel and Elendil in the first season

[01:17:03] exchanging their views of what it means

[01:17:07] to be one of the faithful and being

[01:17:09] willing to pay the price however great

[01:17:13] so they're kind of playing with those

[01:17:15] themes not just between Elrond and

[01:17:18] Galadriel but maybe for all the different

[01:17:20] peoples of Middle-Earth mm-hmm yeah I do

[01:17:25] I do like that Elrond swore an oath

[01:17:28] here because he's so anti oath in the

[01:17:30] third age yes and I and I have a feeling

[01:17:33] that's going to be part of it mm-hmm

[01:17:36] could be could be I mean he's already

[01:17:38] that was basis of his childhood of course

[01:17:42] seeing having been brought up by

[01:17:44] my thrust son right his brother and

[01:17:47] seeing the horrible ravages that that oath

[01:17:50] must have taken yeah and in oh where is it

[01:17:56] both in season one and in this season

[01:17:59] she's there's there's a lot of promises

[01:18:01] passing between Elrond and Galadriel

[01:18:04] there's other because I'm trying to remember

[01:18:06] now I had it in a note somewhere I

[01:18:08] think something I think it was in

[01:18:10] season one he says to her like oh you

[01:18:13] know I won't not trust you again like

[01:18:16] you have my trust he does I should have

[01:18:17] trusted you before I promise that will

[01:18:19] never make that mistake again so he's

[01:18:21] making promises is me a lot of promises

[01:18:23] and then later on towards the end of the

[01:18:25] series you know he starts to question

[01:18:29] her and she says do you remember that

[01:18:30] promise he made right as your you're

[01:18:32] making it very hard for me yeah yeah

[01:18:35] it's it's funny breaks it he has broken

[01:18:37] it right mm-hmm he's absolutely broken

[01:18:39] it at this point so and doesn't he

[01:18:41] make some promises with durin as

[01:18:44] well no maria I can't remember now anyway

[01:18:50] but Elrond is a lot of people like Elron

[01:18:53] a lot of people depend on Elrond like dude

[01:18:54] you got I gotta trust you you got to do

[01:18:56] this thing like you know you have my

[01:18:58] voice you got to do this like he's a

[01:19:00] really pivotal character yes absolutely

[01:19:03] is and this is why it distresses me so

[01:19:06] much that he's basically become an

[01:19:08] absolutist mm-hmm yeah but I mean I

[01:19:12] look a lot of real hazard flaws to you

[01:19:14] ever watch how I met your mother a few

[01:19:15] you ever watch how I met your mother

[01:19:17] where they had they have this whole thing

[01:19:20] where they go you owe me and no questions

[01:19:21] asked and so if they ever get into

[01:19:24] like a really sticky situation like one

[01:19:25] gets like stuck in a mailbox like a

[01:19:28] postal box it's like that they're

[01:19:31] like it's a no questions asked you

[01:19:32] can't ask me how I got here and I

[01:19:34] feel like a lot of rules going around

[01:19:36] everyone saying you owe me a no

[01:19:37] questions asked mm-hmm and it's just

[01:19:41] not gonna work for her because no one

[01:19:42] else is asking for one in return

[01:19:45] yeah I mean she's definitely not

[01:19:47] defying her king now as she was in the

[01:19:49] first season mm-hmm so that much has

[01:19:52] changed for her mm-hmm but the whole

[01:19:55] business about oaths

[01:20:00] it's it's a it's a challenge

[01:20:04] because it implies okay sometimes I'm

[01:20:09] gonna lie to you but if I take an oath

[01:20:10] I won't which is why in Quaker

[01:20:14] tradition we don't do oaths because

[01:20:16] we're supposed to always say what is

[01:20:18] true now we don't have to say all the

[01:20:19] truth or whatever I mean you know

[01:20:21] obviously people can be very shifty

[01:20:22] about that too and never actually tell

[01:20:25] lie but it just got me thinking about

[01:20:28] that whole concept of why does an

[01:20:30] oath make it different if you are

[01:20:33] not trustworthy to begin with why

[01:20:36] should I trust your oath yeah and

[01:20:41] there's some there's some good stuff

[01:20:43] that goes back I'm trying to remember

[01:20:45] now I'm trying to claw back some

[01:20:49] freshman college courses on literature

[01:20:52] and stuff about was it edipus stuff

[01:20:55] or was it Gilgamesh stuff about you

[01:20:58] know your name and the only thing you

[01:20:59] have is your name and your word your

[01:21:01] word is your bond and if you break

[01:21:03] your word if you break your oath you

[01:21:07] that is that is going against so many

[01:21:10] things in society because if we can't

[01:21:12] what's your name what's your lineage

[01:21:14] who are you from and then you give me

[01:21:16] your word about something now you're

[01:21:18] fixed within society and if you if

[01:21:20] any of that is a lie or you break

[01:21:23] that you've now broken a fundamental

[01:21:25] compact of human society and and

[01:21:29] grave with grave consequence yeah

[01:21:32] there's there some cultures have this

[01:21:35] tradition of you know classification

[01:21:38] and if you are of an upper class then

[01:21:41] one of the signals of that is that you

[01:21:43] do not lie then you have the angle

[01:21:46] Saxon concept of okay there's two

[01:21:48] people they have a disagreement each of

[01:21:50] them brings to the hearing their

[01:21:54] supporters mm-hmm and one by one

[01:21:57] you know these supporters to have

[01:21:58] been say I know this person I know

[01:21:59] that he's the truth and therefore I

[01:22:01] trust what he says and you know if you

[01:22:03] brought six and your other opponent

[01:22:05] brought ten well you know that might

[01:22:08] actually say the decision of who's

[01:22:09] telling the truth and there's also a

[01:22:12] magic tradition that says your magic

[01:22:13] is only as strong as your word mm-hmm

[01:22:16] and so if you're somebody whose word

[01:22:18] is mm-hmm kind of soft then you may

[01:22:21] not be able to do whatever you want

[01:22:23] to do as effectively which brings us

[01:22:25] back around to earth see yes and the

[01:22:28] power of names mm-hmm and the need to

[01:22:31] know as many names as possible in

[01:22:33] order to enact that particular

[01:22:37] power that we call magic well let's

[01:22:41] take a quick break when we get back

[01:22:43] we will finish up the episode and

[01:23:05] we're back the last couple scenes

[01:23:08] we've got here the first one is

[01:23:10] meet the ants around here gives the

[01:23:14] key to estrogen shackles to a

[01:23:16] sealed or to decide whether to free her

[01:23:18] he does an estra immediately takes a

[01:23:21] sword and tries to escape around here

[01:23:23] knocks an arrow to stop her but they're

[01:23:26] interrupted by an ant attack around

[01:23:28] here in his sealed or talk are you

[01:23:33] would you like to share with the

[01:23:34] class I'm just it's attack around

[01:23:40] here in a sealed or talk the end and

[01:23:42] and wife down and meet winter bloom

[01:23:46] the ants tell them of an orc army

[01:23:49] traveling through Middle Earth and

[01:23:51] deliver Theo back to them is sealed

[01:23:54] or an estra almost share a kiss before

[01:23:56] her betrothed wild man Hagan finds her

[01:24:00] around here in Theo embrace and both

[01:24:02] set off on their respective missions

[01:24:04] did I get that name right that's what I

[01:24:06] heard I've repeated it a couple times

[01:24:08] over like winter bloom right that

[01:24:11] sounds right I think that was the

[01:24:12] name of the ant wife okay I think so

[01:24:16] that was the only named one I thought I

[01:24:18] didn't I didn't yeah right yeah where

[01:24:22] are you guys at with the introduction

[01:24:25] of ends we had to bomb a deal and ants

[01:24:28] like this is kind of a huge episode and

[01:24:31] barrel whites and barrel whites right

[01:24:32] which was more of a oh my yeah you know

[01:24:38] I'm good with the ends they've

[01:24:40] obviously been around a long time I like

[01:24:45] when you know there's a whole thing

[01:24:46] where tree bird asks the hobbits oh well

[01:24:49] your shire sounds a lot like what the

[01:24:52] end wives used to like and so have you

[01:24:54] seen any of them I mean this isn't quite

[01:24:57] by the shire but you know just just

[01:25:00] them being in a different area with

[01:25:02] the ends I it's interesting to see that

[01:25:05] in the second aids they are still

[01:25:06] together at the ends of the end wives

[01:25:08] mm-hmm that was an interesting choice

[01:25:11] and I'm still wondering why they did

[01:25:13] that there what I heard in this episode

[01:25:17] is the two of them had taken

[01:25:19] responsibility for protecting that

[01:25:21] particular forest mm-hmm and I'm a

[01:25:23] little vague on which one it is and

[01:25:25] where it is but I'm afraid it's going

[01:25:26] to get completely eradicated in the

[01:25:30] future by certain sea people but

[01:25:32] yeah to me they are to me they are

[01:25:37] leading us towards some kind of division

[01:25:40] between the ends and the end wives where

[01:25:43] the end wives want vengeance against the

[01:25:45] orcs mm-hmm and the ends themselves are

[01:25:49] very passive and they want to stay by

[01:25:52] the forest and rebuild and it's just

[01:25:54] two different paths that each one wants

[01:25:56] to take and they just never find each

[01:25:58] other again mm-hmm yeah that would be

[01:26:01] very interesting to see them work

[01:26:04] that out in that particular fashion I

[01:26:07] found it absolutely heartbreaking when

[01:26:09] a reindeer had to confess to having cut

[01:26:12] down live it would yeah that was a

[01:26:14] whole big thing wonderful callback

[01:26:16] mm-hmm to that scene in the

[01:26:19] orchid trenches in season one where he

[01:26:22] apologizes to the tree before he

[01:26:24] starts job mm-hmm I forgot about

[01:26:26] that yeah yeah what really it was

[01:26:29] heartbreaking and he's from Greenwood

[01:26:31] the great which becomes Merckwood yes

[01:26:35] that's legal this is hood right and

[01:26:38] thread wheel and all yeah and he's got

[01:26:40] that armor of that looks like an ant on

[01:26:43] his you know yeah it's interesting that

[01:26:45] neither of the ants mentioned that

[01:26:47] maybe they just weren't paying attention

[01:26:49] so what they did pay attention to

[01:26:51] excuse me David they did pay attention to

[01:26:53] the fact that he spoke elvish and so

[01:26:54] okay elf right and I guess the

[01:26:59] the ends didn't wholly work for me and

[01:27:02] maybe maybe there's some lore things if

[01:27:03] I had a little bit more I just maybe

[01:27:05] I've got Jackson's ends in my head you

[01:27:08] know with up the deep low voice and the

[01:27:11] slow talking I wanted the ends to be a

[01:27:14] bit more vocally present in the show

[01:27:18] mm-hmm and I guess I don't know enough

[01:27:21] about ent wives really understand the

[01:27:23] relationship but well not many people

[01:27:25] do nobody does nobody does okay fair

[01:27:28] enough but I think it would make a lot

[01:27:29] of sense if they were faster talking

[01:27:31] faster moving quicker to anger and they

[01:27:35] were you know more vengeful and that

[01:27:37] just that's what divided them I think

[01:27:38] that that's actually good storytelling

[01:27:40] okay okay the thing the thing I like

[01:27:42] best about them is they were not

[01:27:45] figures of fun we weren't supposed to

[01:27:48] laugh at them yeah ridiculous okay they

[01:27:52] genuinely looked great like creatures

[01:27:54] who you could mistake for trees and at

[01:27:58] the same time to my mind they were very

[01:28:01] entish okay and what they had to say was

[01:28:05] good I mean it was also interesting that

[01:28:07] the aunt wife talked a lot more than the

[01:28:09] end did mm-hmm it's kind of like he

[01:28:12] knew that she was she was definitely on

[01:28:16] a mission mm-hmm and they were a couple

[01:28:19] and so he is supporting her in this so

[01:28:21] again John's notion of the entwise being

[01:28:25] extra protective I find very interesting

[01:28:27] okay I think from because of what the

[01:28:29] Lorce says I expected to first meet an

[01:28:31] entwife in some kind of a garden setting

[01:28:34] but it could be at this stage in the

[01:28:37] proceedings the gardens have all been

[01:28:38] destroyed mm-hmm and she's already going

[01:28:41] out and hunting wild men and orcs right

[01:28:45] because they've been chopping down

[01:28:46] trees living trees so that she raised

[01:28:51] from seed mm-hmm would would a ron deer

[01:28:54] have he certainly knows about ens and

[01:28:58] knows sort of the right protocols but I

[01:29:02] was just wondering if he had ever and I

[01:29:04] couldn't find anything really online

[01:29:05] about Greenwood Merckwood ens you know

[01:29:10] where insert to be found and that kind

[01:29:12] of stuff and so I was just kind of I

[01:29:14] was looking to for a ron deer to be

[01:29:16] a little bit more I guess have a little

[01:29:20] bit more protocol orientation towards

[01:29:22] them like seeing certain forms and

[01:29:25] bowing in certain you know just sort of

[01:29:27] cow-towing in the right way he's still

[01:29:29] he'll he still calms them and unlocks

[01:29:31] him he still knows how to handle the

[01:29:32] situation I guess I was looking for a

[01:29:35] little bit more ceremonial formality

[01:29:38] to to his interaction but that's a

[01:29:40] little maybe that's a me thing it might

[01:29:42] have been there if you know she wasn't

[01:29:44] about to strangle right yeah I think

[01:29:46] you might have caught off guard there

[01:29:47] fair enough yeah point and I think he

[01:29:50] handled the situation beautifully I mean

[01:29:52] he spoke very slowly mm-hmm and calmly

[01:29:56] and yeah gently and touch it was very

[01:29:59] important to come into physical

[01:30:01] contact yeah I was wondering about

[01:30:03] that yeah very tactile which I think

[01:30:07] it's harder to be an opposition to

[01:30:10] someone who has actually been touched

[01:30:12] in a gentle way obviously not in a you

[01:30:15] know punch your nose or even poke

[01:30:17] way yeah poke poke away as far as where

[01:30:21] the insolucid it's an interesting

[01:30:22] question because they say at one point you

[01:30:24] know there was this whole massive force

[01:30:26] but I think the misty mountains coming

[01:30:29] down the middle I glare as the old

[01:30:32] would say seems to have been something

[01:30:34] of a dividing line mm-hmm but treebeard

[01:30:37] has said that one at one point and

[01:30:40] could walk all the way from a

[01:30:41] Reggae on to linden mm-hmm and it

[01:30:44] was one long forest so and wouldn't

[01:30:48] there a line in this where it's like I've

[01:30:50] tended these forests since before the

[01:30:52] mountains split the garden into oh

[01:30:55] excellent yes you're right was it in

[01:30:57] this episode yeah it was okay split and

[01:31:01] on a lore basis it was more than off

[01:31:04] who raised up the misty mountain

[01:31:06] to interfere with the writing of

[01:31:09] or me and of course subsequently became

[01:31:13] a barrier for the all of the elves who

[01:31:15] are migrating to valley north mm-hmm so

[01:31:18] that's that's a good catch John I like

[01:31:20] that nice yeah these guys know their lore

[01:31:22] don't they oh they know their lore they

[01:31:25] absolutely do so Theo did you just

[01:31:31] become lord of Plank here I have the same

[01:31:34] question David I was very lord of

[01:31:37] larger unless L unless a reindeer has some

[01:31:41] foresight going on here but which then

[01:31:44] sort of feeds all of the the rumors and

[01:31:48] theories about what you know will Theo

[01:31:50] become something in future right again it

[01:31:54] could easily lead to him becoming the

[01:31:56] king of the dead or Nazgul yeah yep

[01:32:00] yeah I guess I hope he doesn't become

[01:32:03] that I was just so glad that they

[01:32:07] had this reconciliation mm-hmm it just

[01:32:09] I was really really glad and appropriate

[01:32:13] to their characters you know they weren't

[01:32:16] weeping in each other's shoulders mm-hmm

[01:32:19] what right no no but you know just this

[01:32:23] basic statement of thank you for keeping

[01:32:25] your promise right your promises you

[01:32:27] know and of course Bronwyn is hanging

[01:32:30] hanging between them yeah yeah yeah but

[01:32:32] doesn't get name checked because you

[01:32:35] know that's not what these people do

[01:32:36] right these two people do so yeah I mean

[01:32:41] I guess it's a question of state watch

[01:32:43] the space to see what happened all right

[01:32:45] well I listeners if you have any ideas

[01:32:47] right in yeah I mean I know there was some

[01:32:49] chatter on the discord about Theo and

[01:32:51] yeah when he's and if you go to certain

[01:32:54] parts of the internet there's lots of

[01:32:56] conversations about Theo's future so

[01:32:58] oh sure yeah I mean that's been

[01:33:00] going on yeah since last time it's

[01:33:02] beginning down that first time we saw

[01:33:03] him in season one yep well why don't we

[01:33:08] go back to Galadriel yes team elf spots

[01:33:12] the orc army and none of the elves is

[01:33:14] shot sorry one of the elses shot with an

[01:33:16] arrow

[01:33:17] Galadriel heals the wound with the power

[01:33:19] of Nenya then gives the ring to Elrond

[01:33:22] and tells him to take the other elves

[01:33:25] back to Linden to tell Gilgallad to

[01:33:28] send the armies to a Reggion instead

[01:33:29] of Mordor

[01:33:31] Galadriel holds her own against the

[01:33:33] orc army until Adar captures her

[01:33:35] Elrond says she protected the ring

[01:33:37] not them and golly don't I hope you just

[01:33:42] think she'll pitch it into the nearest pond

[01:33:46] well this is their second meeting now

[01:33:49] right because she got our in Galadriel yeah

[01:33:52] yeah yeah yes and wow am I ever looking

[01:33:54] forward to some of the things that I

[01:33:56] saw in teasers and

[01:33:59] in stills there were there was one

[01:34:01] still in particular that I saw and I

[01:34:03] said holy cow

[01:34:05] I don't think I've seen that one so

[01:34:06] I wonder if what I think is going

[01:34:08] to happen is happening okay cool so I

[01:34:11] didn't know how it was going to happen

[01:34:13] but I didn't know that she was going to

[01:34:15] wind up in his hands

[01:34:17] are you guys liking the new Adar

[01:34:22] I think he's doing a good job it's about

[01:34:24] yeah he's fine yeah he's fine

[01:34:26] I like him I in some ways I like him

[01:34:28] a little bit better

[01:34:29] oh yeah that's interesting yeah he's

[01:34:31] he's got a little bit more of a

[01:34:33] subtlety

[01:34:33] the and I apologize I don't remember

[01:34:36] the actor's names um

[01:34:37] but the previous actor there was a

[01:34:39] little bit more of a bigness to his role

[01:34:41] the way his that was Joseph mall Joseph

[01:34:43] mall thank you and this is Sam hazel

[01:34:45] dine

[01:34:45] so hazel dine has a more there's a he's

[01:34:49] more subtle and he's a little bit more

[01:34:50] of a flat affect which I think for me

[01:34:53] works better in his sort of

[01:34:55] evilness because he's not crazy

[01:34:58] haha I'm not saying the other guy was

[01:35:00] but there's just this very cold

[01:35:04] calculating methodicalness so I'm

[01:35:06] liking it and he is all about protecting

[01:35:09] his children until the name southern

[01:35:11] comes up and then all that's a rough

[01:35:15] it's got to be we have to destroy

[01:35:17] southern because I saw what you did

[01:35:20] right and I saw his power and we were

[01:35:22] very fortunate to escape at the first

[01:35:24] time

[01:35:25] right

[01:35:27] right and what do you think about

[01:35:29] this whole idea that el ron is

[01:35:31] saying oh well she protected the ring

[01:35:33] not us

[01:35:35] he's being a jackass I'm sorry

[01:35:39] you know he is trying so hard to not feel

[01:35:44] the part of him that is saying this is

[01:35:46] my dearest friend who saved my life

[01:35:48] when I was a child

[01:35:51] it's it's the grief of how can you

[01:35:53] disagree with me when I feel this so

[01:35:54] strongly

[01:35:55] I thought you were my best friend

[01:35:58] it's it's a genuine fear I suppose

[01:36:02] and yet as Kyrgyzstan says in the beginning

[01:36:05] you know these are the people you trust

[01:36:06] the most

[01:36:08] who are taking on this risk I mean I

[01:36:12] don't think any of the ring bearers

[01:36:14] doesn't believe that having a ring is

[01:36:16] a risk

[01:36:17] but they're also saying this is power

[01:36:20] and we're going to need some kind of

[01:36:22] power beyond what we've had before

[01:36:24] in this circumstance

[01:36:27] and being aware that they can be

[01:36:29] dangerous

[01:36:31] is about the closest you can come to

[01:36:33] using safe

[01:36:37] I don't think

[01:36:40] Elrond can be being a jerk here but he's

[01:36:44] also not wrong

[01:36:46] no but that's the thing neither of them

[01:36:47] are wrong

[01:36:49] it's the paradox

[01:36:50] you know both of them are correct

[01:36:53] and yet

[01:36:55] you cannot go forward with both of

[01:36:57] them being correct all the time

[01:36:59] there has to be some kind of

[01:37:01] give and take the flexibility

[01:37:03] Elrond is being completely inflexible

[01:37:05] and I've all read it right like John

[01:37:07] said he's playing opposites

[01:37:08] that gets up my nose more than anything

[01:37:10] else

[01:37:11] just I do not like absolute he's just

[01:37:13] going now every time she talks

[01:37:16] yeah yeah the only the only time I

[01:37:18] would say

[01:37:18] that you know the only absolute is

[01:37:21] that there are no absolutes and so

[01:37:23] that's the paradox right

[01:37:25] but also Galadriel seems to be

[01:37:27] putting a lot of faith in her

[01:37:28] visions without questioning whether

[01:37:30] they were put there

[01:37:31] do you think so I'm not sure I

[01:37:33] think she's

[01:37:36] I think she's receiving them in a way

[01:37:38] that says I have to sift this

[01:37:40] I don't know she has the vision on

[01:37:43] the bridge and then she goes

[01:37:44] we gotta go that way right now

[01:37:47] yeah well let me ask you if she

[01:37:49] didn't have the ring

[01:37:50] you still trusted her intuition

[01:37:52] before I assume

[01:37:53] I don't know about that at this

[01:37:55] point I think the fact that she

[01:37:57] has been corrupted by Sarron

[01:37:59] at one point he is now wary of the

[01:38:03] influence that Sarron has on her

[01:38:04] mind

[01:38:05] with ring or no ring

[01:38:06] I wouldn't go so far as to say that

[01:38:08] she was corrupted she was certainly

[01:38:09] deceived by so that's what I mean

[01:38:11] I think the tendrils of Sarron

[01:38:13] are within her mind

[01:38:15] he has a lot of reason to

[01:38:17] distrust her because she was on

[01:38:19] the boat to Valinor and turned away

[01:38:21] and they were and like he said

[01:38:25] he is you know he is

[01:38:30] taking advantage of what is already

[01:38:32] in you right you know so you

[01:38:34] already have a darkness within you

[01:38:37] and he's using that and so his whole

[01:38:39] he's I think he's questioning his

[01:38:42] whole trust in her

[01:38:43] but we all have that darkness in this

[01:38:45] David

[01:38:45] well till that day Elron

[01:38:47] don't talk about it

[01:38:48] not if you're Elron

[01:38:49] Mr. Perfect Son of the Ardiel

[01:38:52] and Elwing

[01:38:54] that's what I'm saying

[01:38:55] Oh Ramos

[01:38:57] no it you know Galadriel has the

[01:39:00] knowledge of how close she came

[01:39:02] to darkness Elron goes ever been to

[01:39:06] Gondolin

[01:39:08] and that is the best possible

[01:39:10] defense against trespassing into

[01:39:14] that when you've come back close and

[01:39:16] step back

[01:39:17] which I don't know how close

[01:39:19] Elron has come to darkness at this

[01:39:21] point he may come to it

[01:39:22] that's a good point

[01:39:23] in this season

[01:39:24] yeah yeah

[01:39:24] and recognize that an inflexible

[01:39:27] stance on just about anything

[01:39:30] ultimately is not going to serve you

[01:39:31] that makes me think of the scene in

[01:39:33] the Jackson movie where Frodo wants

[01:39:36] to give her the ring

[01:39:38] yeah sure

[01:39:39] and she comes right up and then

[01:39:40] turns away

[01:39:42] right and that takes enormous

[01:39:44] strength and wisdom

[01:39:46] and that's what I see her developing

[01:39:48] now

[01:39:48] and I'm going to be faceted

[01:39:52] to see how the showrunners

[01:39:54] imagine the conversations between

[01:39:55] herself and Adod and what comes

[01:39:57] yeah it's gonna be this is me juicy

[01:40:00] really looking forward to that

[01:40:02] it was cool to see

[01:40:03] Morphe and Clark do some bad ass

[01:40:05] shit

[01:40:06] oh my lord

[01:40:07] yeah fantastic choreography here

[01:40:09] yeah

[01:40:10] I mean when she lays down on the

[01:40:11] horse and starts shooting arrows

[01:40:13] around I was like come on that's

[01:40:14] awesome

[01:40:14] she was fire or sent to the sky

[01:40:18] brings fire down on them I mean

[01:40:19] you truly see the fire of a noldo

[01:40:23] in rage

[01:40:23] right and I think that's very very

[01:40:26] cool you can see how

[01:40:27] you know it wasn't the noldor was the

[01:40:31] what am I trying to say here

[01:40:32] the vanyar

[01:40:34] the vanyar came with the

[01:40:35] with the Valar

[01:40:38] to fight against morgoth

[01:40:39] you can definitely see how elves

[01:40:41] were able to fight against morgoth

[01:40:43] you can see the way

[01:40:46] Fingolfin went toe to toe with

[01:40:48] morgoth and wounded him

[01:40:50] right right there

[01:40:51] these are powerful beings

[01:40:53] and you can see how Luthien

[01:40:55] confronted Mordoth in his own dungeon

[01:40:58] right

[01:40:59] but she wasn't using the weapons of

[01:41:01] power over

[01:41:02] unless you call a sleep spell power

[01:41:04] over which I suppose it is

[01:41:05] and and

[01:41:06] Finrod had a battle of

[01:41:07] a song with Sarron so yeah

[01:41:10] I mean these elves are really

[01:41:11] powerful they are able to go up

[01:41:13] against divine beings

[01:41:14] and not fully fail

[01:41:16] right yeah

[01:41:19] so the ring has some even more

[01:41:23] magic powers we see here

[01:41:24] she is able to

[01:41:26] she's able to heal

[01:41:27] heal yeah

[01:41:29] yep intuition healing

[01:41:30] all of those things

[01:41:32] are what we eventually see in the

[01:41:34] fully formed gladriel and in loryan

[01:41:36] and for 99.99 a month

[01:41:38] you too can have Nenya

[01:41:40] the ring of power

[01:41:43] yeah I really love it anytime

[01:41:46] action shows

[01:41:48] give us scenes in which

[01:41:50] the power that it's usually used to

[01:41:53] shoot arrows and kill people is also

[01:41:54] used to heal

[01:41:55] yeah I like I like that balance

[01:41:58] well and she's doing the

[01:42:01] all of that

[01:42:03] ass kicking without the ring on

[01:42:07] right right because that's just

[01:42:09] not the nature of the ring

[01:42:11] it's not the nature of the

[01:42:12] she'd already given it to elrond and

[01:42:14] she's still right yeah yep

[01:42:16] she's just a noldo in rage

[01:42:18] and the qualities of

[01:42:22] Nenya the ring of water

[01:42:24] also of adamant

[01:42:26] you know those qualities of

[01:42:28] intuition healing and so forth

[01:42:30] are traditionally associated with

[01:42:32] the element of water in a lot of

[01:42:33] magical system

[01:42:36] Tolkien knew him his lore

[01:42:39] cool

[01:42:41] all right well great episode my

[01:42:43] favorite yet

[01:42:44] I know I know not universal opinion on

[01:42:47] this podcast but

[01:42:49] I had a great time and I'm really

[01:42:51] looking forward to episode five which

[01:42:52] I definitely haven't watched yet

[01:42:56] I definitely haven't watched a lot of it yet

[01:42:59] I've been I have been pure

[01:43:02] I just haven't had time

[01:43:06] episode four left me so want

[01:43:08] wanting for more I was like I got

[01:43:10] I got to watch some episode yeah

[01:43:11] I don't know how you're processing the

[01:43:13] guide so fast man it's like taking

[01:43:15] it took me

[01:43:16] like three hours to do my notes

[01:43:18] yesterday or and and three hours the

[01:43:20] day before it took me like two days

[01:43:22] to process this episode

[01:43:23] I do one watch through for enjoyment

[01:43:26] and then another watch with the guide

[01:43:28] yeah yeah I do the opposite

[01:43:30] my first watch I take all my notes

[01:43:33] and then my second watch I'm

[01:43:34] watching okay for I did that for

[01:43:36] and or I'll still take down notes

[01:43:38] as they occur to be the second time

[01:43:40] around because there's things you miss

[01:43:41] obviously I did that with and or I

[01:43:43] couldn't not watch a scene and not take

[01:43:45] five pages of notes and then I would

[01:43:48] go back and watch for enjoyment after

[01:43:49] and then we had some three hour

[01:43:51] podcast on 30 minute episodes

[01:43:54] all right oh by the way one ritual

[01:43:56] you didn't mention yet we see an

[01:43:58] elf grave of the sword

[01:43:59] oh yeah I was good thrust into it

[01:44:02] okay for a second I was like is that

[01:44:04] glam during because it was similar

[01:44:06] art and then I looked at I realized

[01:44:07] I was like now this can't be

[01:44:09] glam drink that's there's no way

[01:44:10] because this isn't gondolin

[01:44:11] yeah yeah yeah yeah not

[01:44:14] again doff sword here no so um I want

[01:44:18] to do some programming notes we do

[01:44:20] have an announcement to make I want

[01:44:22] to talk about on here on the feedback

[01:44:24] podcast we will have some uh

[01:44:28] introductory remarks about rings of

[01:44:30] power from mark from a new podcast

[01:44:35] that we're going to be hosting

[01:44:36] called nevermind the music

[01:44:38] mark and Nicole are going to be

[01:44:40] hosting the that podcast it is a new

[01:44:42] affiliate we're really excited to have

[01:44:44] them David you want to talk about them

[01:44:45] a little bit cool uh I'll say that when

[01:44:49] they contacted us and they gave us some

[01:44:52] some access to some of their shorter

[01:44:54] episodes you know these little um

[01:44:57] they have longer episodes and then

[01:44:58] they have some shorter in between

[01:44:59] ones all three of us were like oh

[01:45:03] these people are us this is

[01:45:06] this is our kind of show it's like

[01:45:08] take a song and do a lorhounds treatment

[01:45:11] on it and go into like psychology or

[01:45:13] go into mythology and then but also go

[01:45:16] into the chord structure and why these

[01:45:18] chords resonate in this particular way

[01:45:20] and how that applies into Jungian

[01:45:21] psychology yeah it is awesome

[01:45:23] fantastic stuff and it is so well

[01:45:26] produced mark is an amazing engineer

[01:45:28] and producer he's an actual uh

[01:45:31] college professor teaching music

[01:45:34] musicology i'm not sure what his stuff is

[01:45:38] and musicology is a whole is a whole

[01:45:40] thing now you're mixing up some terms

[01:45:42] here all right i am i'm not i'm talking

[01:45:44] outside of my lane so uh but we're

[01:45:46] really excited they're great people

[01:45:48] mark's been listening for two lorhounds

[01:45:51] for a while and some other podcasts

[01:45:54] and um when they they were just like hey

[01:45:56] we need some advice and we're like

[01:45:58] you should become a lorhound affiliate

[01:46:01] they're like whoa okay

[01:46:04] they're really great mark and nicole

[01:46:05] both and i'm excited to hear more from

[01:46:08] them i've got we you know we've had the

[01:46:10] delight of getting a sneak peek at some

[01:46:12] of their content but it sounds like

[01:46:14] they are going to be starting next

[01:46:15] week so keep an eye on that feed never

[01:46:18] mind the music i will put it in the

[01:46:20] linkry in the show notes so you can

[01:46:22] find it now start subscribing you

[01:46:24] they have a little teaser on there now

[01:46:26] so you can listen to their voices

[01:46:27] for the first time and then like i

[01:46:29] said mark has put together some bits

[01:46:31] for the rings of power feedback

[01:46:33] episode so tune into the feedback

[01:46:35] episode and you'll hear all his

[01:46:36] goodness there yeah and a lot more

[01:46:40] coming so they've i think they've like

[01:46:42] re pre-recorded they have i can tell

[01:46:44] i'm ready to go so it's gonna be really

[01:46:46] exciting yeah good um i don't know

[01:46:50] exactly what alicia is putting out

[01:46:51] this week but i know we have more

[01:46:52] coming on the star wars canon

[01:46:55] timeline podcast you know she'd been

[01:46:57] recording with maryland on the

[01:46:59] miss of it's the midst of the old

[01:47:01] republic is that the topic

[01:47:03] basically yeah there's there's miss and

[01:47:05] even more there's legends and some of

[01:47:07] them focus specifically on the

[01:47:09] particular sith lord and there's even

[01:47:13] one sort of folk tale type style story

[01:47:15] and uh yeah a lot of different very cool

[01:47:18] different and interesting stuff very

[01:47:19] cool and alicia is continuing her

[01:47:21] wool shift dust book club now on the

[01:47:25] lorhounds patreon supercast feeds now

[01:47:27] these are the recurring

[01:47:28] subscriptions only you will be

[01:47:30] getting shortly the v for vendetta

[01:47:33] 11 z's that we recorded so we it was

[01:47:35] honestly like an hour and a half breakdown

[01:47:37] of the movie it was kind of a full

[01:47:38] breakdown of the movie but it was it

[01:47:40] was a lot of fun alicia went really hard

[01:47:42] on it she read the graphic novel for

[01:47:44] it

[01:47:45] so yeah it was really great podcast i

[01:47:47] thought we we pulled out a lot of

[01:47:48] really cool themes on fascism and

[01:47:52] and totalitarianism and whatnot and

[01:47:53] and how the movie was made kind of

[01:47:56] american instead of british like it

[01:47:58] was in its source material so very

[01:48:00] interesting conversation i hope you

[01:48:02] want to finish the edit and listen to

[01:48:05] to the edit and it's a really good

[01:48:07] conversation it was i'm really pleased

[01:48:09] with the episode so it'll be out

[01:48:11] shortly we went deep on it like hearted

[01:48:14] topics yeah exactly exactly by the

[01:48:17] trauma and fascism right by the way

[01:48:20] for alien romulus we finally have a

[01:48:22] recording date

[01:48:23] yeah we're going to be recording on the

[01:48:25] 14th uh and then it'll be out after

[01:48:28] that but i think we've got ron

[01:48:30] john and alicia and myself so that

[01:48:33] should be a good one so very cool it

[01:48:36] just took a while to get schedules

[01:48:37] realigned post summer you know what not

[01:48:41] oh yeah it's hot for the summer right

[01:48:44] and not the new kids song is it another

[01:48:46] they do chapel ron don't know is that

[01:48:48] not the right is that not the right

[01:48:50] lyric i don't know somebody write in

[01:48:52] tell me what you know ron does all i

[01:48:54] would thought it was fellowship fall

[01:48:56] which is eminently appropriate for

[01:48:57] getting a new affiliate it is fellowship

[01:48:59] fall yeah i'm i'm super happy to

[01:49:01] finally be able to talk about never mind

[01:49:03] the music we've been sitting on this one

[01:49:05] for a bit

[01:49:06] so i've got authorization from mark today

[01:49:08] to talk about it so very exciting

[01:49:10] yay

[01:49:11] all right everyone go listen to other

[01:49:14] podcasts go listen to more of our

[01:49:16] podcast whatever you want to do for now

[01:49:18] we have thank yous to give david i'm

[01:49:20] going to hit you with some music are

[01:49:22] you ready i am uh ready go

[01:49:30] no jazzy piano discord server boosters

[01:49:36] gnarls erin k teller the thriller dork of

[01:49:39] the ninjas duve 71 captain gingy 56

[01:49:43] athena agilea adrian tina and listu all

[01:49:48] support the server by giving us their

[01:49:51] little discord bit things and that makes

[01:49:54] a better environment for us to have

[01:49:56] more emojis and other kinds of cool

[01:49:58] features to our lore master subscribers

[01:50:01] there are top tier they really uh are

[01:50:05] the lifeblood of this podcast samaritans

[01:50:08] michael g michelle e david w brian p

[01:50:12] sc peter oh h butina w adam s

[01:50:16] nancy m duve 71 brian 80 63

[01:50:20] frederick h sarah l garith c eric f

[01:50:24] matthew m sarah m dj miwa andra b

[01:50:28] kong you dead i dead i bob nathan t

[01:50:31] alex v erin t sub zero erin k

[01:50:35] dally v mothership 61 gnarls

[01:50:39] kathy w listu jeffrey b alisa u and

[01:50:45] forever last never least adrian thank

[01:50:48] you all so very much for your ongoing

[01:50:50] support we couldn't do this podcast

[01:50:52] without you no matter how you listen

[01:50:54] no matter how you subscribe we're just

[01:50:55] glad you're here thanks for being a um

[01:50:59] a lore hound listener in all forms

[01:51:01] thank you thank you thank you in all

[01:51:03] fashions thank you everyone we will

[01:51:05] see you on the feedback pod

[01:51:07] hi the lore hounds podcast is produced

[01:51:09] and published by the lore hounds

[01:51:10] you can send questions and feedback

[01:51:12] and voicemails at the lore hounds dot com

[01:51:15] slash contact get early and ad free

[01:51:18] access to all lore hounds podcasts at

[01:51:20] patreon.com slash the lore hounds any

[01:51:22] opinions stated are ours personally and

[01:51:24] do not reflect the opinion of or

[01:51:25] belong to any employers or other

[01:51:27] entities

[01:51:27] thanks for listening think of a song

[01:51:31] you really love don't you want to

[01:51:33] know why you love it so much well we

[01:51:35] can't answer that no but we can deep

[01:51:38] dive into it anyway unless we get to

[01:51:40] sidetracked we're the nevermind the

[01:51:41] music podcast one musician and one

[01:51:44] psychologist talking about iconic

[01:51:46] songs the musical tricks that blow our

[01:51:48] minds and what they show us about our

[01:51:50] minds join us each week as we pick

[01:51:52] apart everything from tlc to weasel

[01:51:54] and from billy islis to bruno mars

[01:51:56] with plenty of distractions in between

[01:51:58] check out nevermind the music wherever

[01:52:00] you get your podcasts