Jean, Elysia, and Luke are back to argue the finer points on what makes one murderer worse than another, what a villain's selection of cages says about them, and which romances are likely to be DOA in this mid-season check-in discussing the first four episodes of Daredevil: Born Again season 2: "The Northern Star," "Shoot the Moon," "The Scales & The Sword," and "Gloves Off."
Last season's coverage:
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00:24 --> 00:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to comics versus an MCU lorehounds podcast, your guides to supervillain boxing matches.
00:31 --> 00:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Alicia Bullseye's newest defender.
00:35 --> 00:37 [SPEAKER_04]: And I'm Joe, the KKK's aren't sorry.
00:38 --> 00:39 [SPEAKER_04]: I says, oh, no, sorry.
00:39 --> 00:42 [SPEAKER_04]: The A, V, T, F's biggest hater.
00:43 --> 00:45 [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm like, here to say, I told you so.
00:45 --> 00:50 [SPEAKER_02]: I just so told you so about my Murdoch's little wife.
00:52 --> 00:56 [SPEAKER_04]: And we're here to break down the first half of Daredevil.
00:57 --> 00:59 [SPEAKER_04]: Born again season two.
01:00 --> 01:07 [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll start out with a quick review of the season so far, and that is to be clear episodes one through four.
01:08 --> 01:15 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll start without any spoilers, but there will be no restrictions on season one spoilers in this episode.
01:15 --> 01:19 [SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to assume that you have seen season one or don't care if it's spoiled.
01:20 --> 01:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Check out last season's coverage that the three of us did if you haven't done so yet.
01:28 --> 01:55 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, we'll start out with our season two spoiler free fresh takes and then we will take a break and then launch into the full spoiler discussion stick around until after the outro closing music for one final full spoiler section briefly discussing some news from the set of season three, which is filming now and I didn't ask you guys why don't know if you responded if you wanted to be a part of that or if you were like Lala, I don't want to know.
01:56 --> 01:59 [SPEAKER_02]: Now, fine by me, but this will be brand new information to me.
02:00 --> 02:01 [SPEAKER_02]: So, I can't wait to tell you.
02:01 --> 02:02 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
02:02 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_01]: You know it, it is, huh?
02:03 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_04]: I haven't.
02:05 --> 02:05 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't.
02:05 --> 02:07 [SPEAKER_04]: Silence.
02:08 --> 02:10 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll hold you into suspense, so to very much.
02:13 --> 02:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, okay.
02:14 --> 02:29 [SPEAKER_01]: But in general, though, this is your blanket spoiler warning for all other Marvel films, TV shows, books, or comics that have ever been released, we will consider ourselves free to reference any and all of this lore at will.
02:29 --> 02:33 [SPEAKER_01]: since the last Marvel show is released, Marvel Zombies.
02:33 --> 02:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Sean, you and I did a one on that, back in October.
02:37 --> 02:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I mean, we did do a year overview.
02:40 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_01]: So there's a year we did that, but that was our last deep dive.
02:44 --> 02:49 [SPEAKER_01]: So we didn't get to talk about the fact that Marvel Zombies has been renewed for a season two.
02:50 --> 02:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Look, that's great.
02:52 --> 02:54 [SPEAKER_04]: I think we spoke off the mic.
02:55 --> 02:57 [SPEAKER_04]: It better be more than four episodes.
02:59 --> 03:01 [SPEAKER_04]: Or there will be problems, Feige.
03:01 --> 03:02 [SPEAKER_04]: There will be problems.
03:03 --> 03:07 [SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, I think since we've last been on the mic,
03:07 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_04]: Marvel has gotten something's done so I'm looking forward to the rest of this year, obviously you with the Spidey with you know, Doomsday and yeah just keep giving us the things that we really want to see and let's hope have a good time yeah.
03:27 --> 03:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, a lot's coming up this year as we laid out before so this is but beginning of it and so I guess for for this we're going to do obviously this is a midseason check in and then we'll do another wrap up at the end of the season and then the three of us will be back one week after that for the punishers special.
03:46 --> 03:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, really looking forward to that really looking forward to that.
03:50 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, first trailer is out so check it out if you have not yet.
03:55 --> 03:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, okay, so let's get into our fresh takes no season two spoilers yet.
03:59 --> 04:01 [SPEAKER_01]: We're free to talk about season one.
04:01 --> 04:04 [SPEAKER_01]: The show runner is remains Dario Scoutapone.
04:05 --> 04:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, the premise is Matt Murdock aka Daredevil finds himself on a collision course with NYC Mayor Wilson Fisk when their past identities begin to emerge.
04:16 --> 04:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And today, we're going to be discussing the first four episodes.
04:20 --> 04:24 [SPEAKER_01]: So episode one, the Northern Star, an episode two, shoot the moon.
04:24 --> 04:32 [SPEAKER_01]: We're both directed by Head Directors of the series, Aaron Morehead in Justin Benson, and written by the showrunner himself, Dario Scatterpone.
04:33 --> 04:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And then the episode three, the scales ensured, an episode four gloves off, were directed by Solven Slick,
04:42 --> 04:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And first of all, episode three was written by Heather Belsin, an episode four by Shuntel and Wells, and I'll just say at the top episode four is my favorite of a bunch.
04:54 --> 04:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But Luke, what's your overall fresh takes on the season so far?
05:00 --> 05:02 [SPEAKER_02]: My overall fresh takes are, I think, threefold.
05:03 --> 05:05 [SPEAKER_02]: Firstly,
05:05 --> 05:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Firstly, I don't, and I'm not enjoying Daredevil born again as a whole as much as I enjoyed the original Netflix.
05:13 --> 05:13 [SPEAKER_02]: OK.
05:13 --> 05:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Daredevil series, I think it's missing something, and I think the thing it's missing is foggy, not just as a character, but as
05:24 --> 05:38 [SPEAKER_02]: As an every man, as somebody who is in this extreme situation and is just trying to get to do the right thing and get through the day, like all of the characters in this show are larger than life in some way.
05:38 --> 05:46 [SPEAKER_02]: I guess the closest you get is the deputy man for communications, whose name I'm blanking on.
05:46 --> 05:49 [SPEAKER_02]: played by Michael Gandolfini, but right.
05:49 --> 05:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's really missing that perspective of Daniel.
05:53 --> 05:54 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Daniel.
05:54 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's really missing that perspective of the every man, the every woman who is just in this situation trying to get through it.
06:01 --> 06:10 [SPEAKER_02]: And also, I miss the, I miss the to the light relief comedic moments between foggy and Mount Murdoch as well.
06:10 --> 06:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I think
06:11 --> 06:32 [SPEAKER_02]: This show is obviously dealing with some very heavy themes and I've seen online that some people have that difficulty watching it and I can completely understand that with the parallels with real life events and I just feel like just occasionally there needs to be a stop there needs to be something in there to lighten the tone just a little bit.
06:33 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, the second thing in maybe a bit more lighthearted is, given what happened in the last episode, if the writers harm her hair on calm pages hair, I am going to choose violence.
06:46 --> 06:49 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just putting it out there.
06:49 --> 06:56 [SPEAKER_02]: And the third thing is, and I said this every time we do any media involved in their level, but it has to be said, oh, we're not over again.
06:57 --> 06:59 [SPEAKER_02]: Charlie Cox is just brilliant.
06:59 --> 07:02 [SPEAKER_02]: He just inhabits that character.
07:02 --> 07:10 [SPEAKER_02]: And the one thing I think is a big improvement this season over last is I can actually see the fight scenes.
07:11 --> 07:18 [SPEAKER_02]: Somebody is remembered to turn the white don't.
07:20 --> 07:24 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, one of the things I watched there double four is the choreography is the fight scene.
07:24 --> 07:31 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think this season they have up their game, they're much, they're much easier to follow, they're much more impressive.
07:31 --> 07:36 [SPEAKER_02]: And like Charlie Cox does the choreography of that beautifully.
07:36 --> 07:38 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just, it's really well done.
07:40 --> 07:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
07:40 --> 07:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And his stunt double, probably.
07:42 --> 07:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And his stunt double.
07:47 --> 07:58 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm real quick, I just want to touch on what Luke just said about the every person who I think as I was listening to him say that.
07:59 --> 08:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Something that I thought about while watching the first few episodes is that I want more
08:14 --> 08:19 [SPEAKER_04]: her and Matt had an interesting dynamic that I wanted to see more of.
08:19 --> 08:30 [SPEAKER_04]: And as I watch her on screen, now in this season, it's like, okay, this is I want that banter between them.
08:30 --> 08:40 [SPEAKER_04]: The
08:40 --> 08:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Can I piggyback on that?
08:41 --> 08:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's right.
08:42 --> 08:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Like that I thought this season they used more of her, but indeed not, you know, oh, yeah, we'll talk about it more, but we do start to see more about of her and Matt.
08:54 --> 09:00 [SPEAKER_01]: But what I really thought was I was waiting for them to raise the game on cherry, and he just feels so underutilized.
09:01 --> 09:02 [SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, yeah.
09:02 --> 09:06 [SPEAKER_01]: because that's the person who I was thinking of when Luke was saying we need an epiphany.
09:06 --> 09:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like Cherie's supposed to be thinking over that foggy, but they just don't do much of anything with it.
09:13 --> 09:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, I agree.
09:14 --> 09:18 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that's the whole thing supposed to fill, but it's just not on screen, you know.
09:18 --> 09:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
09:19 --> 09:23 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I think for both of them, I would agree.
09:24 --> 09:29 [SPEAKER_04]: The first thing that strikes me about this season is the cinematography.
09:32 --> 09:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Benson and more head.
09:33 --> 09:34 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, just...
09:34 --> 09:49 [SPEAKER_04]: It's unflinchingly beautiful, you know, it's mean, it's colorful, it's visceral, it's, you know, just wonderful to look at.
09:49 --> 09:59 [SPEAKER_04]: The way they stage things, the way camera,
09:59 --> 10:02 [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, you can't get any more beautiful than that.
10:03 --> 10:09 [SPEAKER_04]: It's not something that I would want my nine-year-old to rave about, obviously.
10:10 --> 10:19 [SPEAKER_04]: But it's just, yeah, I just can't stop thinking about the way that is shot and the scenes that we get and how
10:19 --> 10:29 [SPEAKER_04]: It's very comic booky because the vibrancy of the colors, the way they play off each other, is just astounding.
10:29 --> 10:36 [SPEAKER_04]: And I think they've done a great job, Jeffrey Wajra, and then Hillary Fry, separate, separate.
10:36 --> 10:37 [SPEAKER_04]: I think I'm going to pronounce her name correctly.
10:39 --> 10:39 [SPEAKER_04]: Sarah?
10:39 --> 10:39 [SPEAKER_04]: Sarah?
10:39 --> 10:40 [SPEAKER_04]: Sarah?
10:41 --> 10:42 [SPEAKER_04]: Just really great.
10:42 --> 10:43 [SPEAKER_04]: Just really great.
10:44 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_04]: The last thing that I say is that
10:50 --> 10:55 [SPEAKER_04]: And he had to show up, you know, you want to show up in Daredevil?
10:55 --> 10:56 [SPEAKER_04]: It doesn't have to be there.
10:56 --> 10:57 [SPEAKER_04]: He's already showing up in Daredevil.
10:58 --> 10:59 [SPEAKER_04]: You know, so we could talk about it later.
10:59 --> 11:01 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, you know, he, he, he, he, he.
11:01 --> 11:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think, he talk about, it's not a spoiler that at one point there's a broken window and you pointed something out that seems to have been confirmed.
11:09 --> 11:13 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it looks, the broken window looks like what do the watcher?
11:13 --> 11:16 [SPEAKER_04]: who was watching this, everything unfold.
11:17 --> 11:22 [SPEAKER_04]: So to me and it was confirmed by what's his name.
11:23 --> 11:23 [SPEAKER_04]: When the bomb?
11:24 --> 11:26 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, Brad.
11:27 --> 11:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, okay.
11:28 --> 11:28 [SPEAKER_04]: When the bomb.
11:28 --> 11:29 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, that's his name.
11:30 --> 11:31 [SPEAKER_04]: The Marvel TV guy.
11:32 --> 11:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
11:32 --> 11:33 [SPEAKER_04]: He said it is him.
11:33 --> 11:34 [SPEAKER_04]: That is the watcher.
11:35 --> 11:43 [SPEAKER_04]: So cast Jeffrey right in the role to play the live action watcher and I'll be a very happy person.
11:44 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so this is doing a lot and it's making me think about what's to come.
11:51 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_04]: Not only with Spider-Man, but we've also doomsday and we could talk about those things,
12:02 --> 12:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I thought that these, you know, we talked a lot about looking forward to this season too, because it didn't have the whole thing where season one was kind of a frank and season where, you know, they had two different teams and stitched that stuff together.
12:17 --> 12:18 [SPEAKER_01]: And this was a cohesive vision.
12:19 --> 12:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And for the first three episodes, I was like, there's some cool stuff in here, but I missed
12:23 --> 12:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Some, we'll get into the details, but I miss some of the, yeah, interpersonal stuff.
12:29 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Was what I felt was falling short.
12:31 --> 12:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And then it really was, I mean, but yeah, there were some epic fights.
12:35 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_01]: There was like a team up.
12:37 --> 12:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't even know how much I wanted until I saw it happening before my eyes, you know?
12:42 --> 12:45 [SPEAKER_01]: But I was kind of like the spy shenanigans parts.
12:45 --> 12:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like these parts aren't really working for me And yeah, I definitely understood people being like aspects of this with the AVTF It's in the safer streets initiative.
12:56 --> 12:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It's too real and cute fatigue.
12:58 --> 13:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I got that but then episode four happened
13:02 --> 13:07 [SPEAKER_01]: and that for me got me ignited for the rest of season.
13:07 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm glad because we were discussing like are we going to do two or three episodes, you know, maybe we would have done last week, but it's just yeah, that's not over complicated this.
13:16 --> 13:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm glad we waited the extra week to do the first
13:23 --> 13:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to say an exciting place, but you know, a place, a place that's going to give us some things to discuss, and just that whole episode with Bullseye.
13:34 --> 13:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Bullseye is now like one of my favorites, and I can't wait to talk about him with you guys.
13:40 --> 13:41 [SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be a fun discussion.
13:44 --> 13:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Random question for you, Jean.
13:45 --> 13:54 [SPEAKER_01]: So you have, as you said, a nine-year-old son, how old does he need to be before you let him watch his show?
13:54 --> 13:54 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, gosh.
13:54 --> 13:57 [SPEAKER_04]: He's not watching this until maybe he's 11.
13:58 --> 13:59 [SPEAKER_04]: OK. Or 12.
14:00 --> 14:02 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, I'm not going to watch it this year or next year, probably, no.
14:03 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no.
14:05 --> 14:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Good to know.
14:05 --> 14:06 [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
14:07 --> 14:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Did you guys have any other spoiler free fresh steaks?
14:12 --> 14:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's a very small flow fresh take, but it's so easy.
14:14 --> 14:16 [SPEAKER_02]: This was mentioned, I had to look it up.
14:16 --> 14:19 [SPEAKER_02]: Because in the mention, I would just bring my mind.
14:20 --> 14:23 [SPEAKER_02]: One bot shit is cubed.
14:25 --> 14:28 [SPEAKER_01]: That is very fresh in a different way.
14:31 --> 14:33 [SPEAKER_01]: No, yeah, yeah, for sure, for real.
14:33 --> 14:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I love walnuts.
14:34 --> 14:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I call one of my cats ghost.
14:36 --> 14:38 [SPEAKER_01]: The one who's vocal.
14:38 --> 14:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes you hear him on the podcast.
14:40 --> 14:42 [SPEAKER_01]: He is like a big stocky cat.
14:43 --> 14:45 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I named him after a dior wolf.
14:45 --> 14:47 [SPEAKER_01]: But I call him a warm cat when he's.
14:47 --> 14:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, my gosh.
14:48 --> 14:52 [SPEAKER_02]: But they never admit they literally do poop brick.
14:52 --> 14:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, they do.
14:57 --> 14:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I know I'm at note.
14:58 --> 15:01 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to take a quick early break.
15:02 --> 15:04 [SPEAKER_04]: And yeah, because I can't get that out of my head now.
15:04 --> 15:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to be back to square up the shit with you about the rest of the episode.
15:31 --> 15:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so we're going to be talking about all four episodes at once, so make sure that you are caught up on episodes one through four or don't mind being spoiled about them.
15:43 --> 15:47 [SPEAKER_01]: We are going to be talking plot arc by plot arc and not episode by episodes.
15:47 --> 15:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, well, if we haven't talked about your favorite bulls eyes at the end.
15:54 --> 15:57 [SPEAKER_01]: First question for you Luke.
15:57 --> 15:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Is this a love story?
15:58 --> 16:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And let me elaborate upon that.
16:01 --> 16:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have Matt and Karen.
16:03 --> 16:04 [SPEAKER_01]: We know there's been discussion.
16:04 --> 16:08 [SPEAKER_01]: You were waiting for them to get together.
16:08 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_01]: We saw them in these four episodes, even exchange, they all were.
16:13 --> 16:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But were we cheated of seeing that playout and then get together?
16:20 --> 16:35 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it is, I think it is a love story, I actually think it's two parallel love stories in the case of Matt and Karen and Vanessa and Wilson and I can't remember which episode is in, but I think it's episode three, they do this really nice side by side.
16:35 --> 16:39 [SPEAKER_02]: been yet of the two couples lying in bed.
16:40 --> 16:43 [SPEAKER_02]: And I thought that was really well done.
16:43 --> 16:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Do I feel cheated that we didn't actually see the moment they got together?
16:48 --> 16:51 [SPEAKER_02]: No, because I'm just really happy they all.
16:52 --> 16:56 [SPEAKER_02]: But something bad is going to happen, isn't it?
16:56 --> 16:58 [SPEAKER_02]: Something bad is going to happen to one of them.
16:58 --> 17:01 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just going to break my head.
17:01 --> 17:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's not going to be the one that shows named after.
17:04 --> 17:12 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think he's like, don't, don't, you should be shit corrupt, this relationship really goes.
17:12 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, as long as they don't bring a lecture back in to mess it up again.
17:16 --> 17:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no, no, no, no, no.
17:21 --> 17:28 [SPEAKER_01]: You know that season two of the original remains the lowest rated season, and it's not because of the punisher half.
17:28 --> 17:29 [SPEAKER_02]: No, it isn't.
17:29 --> 17:30 [SPEAKER_04]: That's fine.
17:30 --> 17:32 [SPEAKER_04]: But I'm just saying, well,
17:33 --> 17:34 [SPEAKER_01]: when Matt was with Karen.
17:34 --> 17:37 [SPEAKER_01]: No, they, they, I hope they know better to make that.
17:38 --> 17:41 [SPEAKER_01]: So I do feel cheated that we didn't get to see them get together.
17:41 --> 17:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and I'm hoping that that means they're not just going to break them up because that would feel cheap.
17:48 --> 17:53 [SPEAKER_01]: I think in general, we need more stories about how couples stay together, not just how they get together.
17:53 --> 17:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
17:56 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, John, what do you think about Daredevil in his black suit era?
18:01 --> 18:02 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not wearing red right now.
18:03 --> 18:04 [SPEAKER_01]: He's in stealth mode.
18:04 --> 18:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm cool with it.
18:07 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_04]: I love everything about the way this scene, the everything about the visuals is.
18:13 --> 18:21 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm point with me and I love that he's in black because that's a testament to where he's at right now.
18:21 --> 18:27 [SPEAKER_04]: And I just, I'll just say, I'm sorry.
18:27 --> 18:30 [SPEAKER_04]: Something bad is going to happen.
18:32 --> 18:36 [SPEAKER_04]: And it's always a lecture with Matt.
18:36 --> 18:47 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it's always, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's stupid thing about, get me, I think he'll make it a mescal like it does.
18:48 --> 18:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not disputing.
18:50 --> 18:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not disputing the.
18:52 --> 18:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Why is that stupid?
18:54 --> 18:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Because the killer is a type of mescal, not the other way around.
19:00 --> 19:00 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
19:01 --> 19:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And she's so snobby about it.
19:02 --> 19:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you can be wrong about things, but she's such a snob about it.
19:06 --> 19:06 [SPEAKER_01]: She did not.
19:06 --> 19:08 [SPEAKER_01]: She does not know that she's wrong about it.
19:08 --> 19:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And no one ever corrects her.
19:09 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, that show.
19:10 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.
19:11 --> 19:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Minor peppy.
19:11 --> 19:13 [SPEAKER_04]: So no this fine.
19:13 --> 19:17 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm not disputing
19:18 --> 19:23 [SPEAKER_04]: relationship between Matt and the lecture was not done well, not disputing that at all.
19:24 --> 19:33 [SPEAKER_04]: What I am saying is that Matt and the lecture is like Mary Jane and Spidey, Louis and Clark.
19:34 --> 19:36 [SPEAKER_04]: It's like Bruce and Selena.
19:37 --> 19:42 [SPEAKER_04]: I can go on, but it's always met in the lecture.
19:42 --> 19:52 [SPEAKER_04]: So I am very, very knowing that we're going to get the hand at some point in the MCU very soon.
19:52 --> 19:55 [SPEAKER_04]: I am very worried for carried.
19:57 --> 20:01 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, what if, and hear me out, what if instead of electrobessing it up, what if?
20:01 --> 20:02 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
20:02 --> 20:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Karen gets her head turned and she and Frank Castle finally give it a go.
20:08 --> 20:09 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a part.
20:09 --> 20:13 [SPEAKER_01]: So far, so far we've heard Frank, uh, he was in season one obviously.
20:13 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_01]: We talked about that then, but now he's been repeatedly mentioned, but in the first half of the season, at least nowhere to be seen, he says he's not going to be in the season.
20:21 --> 20:29 [SPEAKER_01]: His specials right after I never believe an actor when they say I can imagine him at least showing up in like a credit scene to connect things or something.
20:29 --> 20:43 [SPEAKER_04]: And you say that when that scene was done, when the exchange that I love's use, there was a slight hesitation with... Yeah, there was.
20:43 --> 20:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you think?
20:43 --> 20:46 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, there was a, there was a definite hesitation with Karen.
20:46 --> 20:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Frank, you got to say that.
20:48 --> 20:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, no, I absolutely believe that.
20:52 --> 20:56 [SPEAKER_04]: That it could be Frank that could become between the two of them.
20:56 --> 20:58 [SPEAKER_04]: That's the real possibility as well, yes.
20:59 --> 21:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so while we're talking about Frank, we said we're going to cover when it comes out, the Punisher, one last kill, airing, May 12th.
21:07 --> 21:19 [SPEAKER_01]: So one week after the Daredevil born again finale, the premise of this is Frank Castle tries to live a life without the need for revenge, only to be drawn into an unexpected conflict.
21:20 --> 21:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we really think this will be his one last kill?
21:25 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Are we worried about him?
21:27 --> 21:30 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, not, I think front castle could reappear.
21:30 --> 21:33 [SPEAKER_02]: The thing is, the act is getting a lot of work now.
21:33 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_02]: I could see him.
21:36 --> 21:38 [SPEAKER_02]: I could see him wanting to step away from the punishers.
21:38 --> 21:44 [SPEAKER_02]: He's a role, just as a scheduling thing to be honest, because he seems to be really busy at the moment.
21:45 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, John Bernthal.
21:46 --> 21:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
21:47 --> 21:48 [SPEAKER_01]: The Amin?
21:49 --> 21:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, what would say the thing against that is because it's just that like this was he he co-wrote this special.
21:57 --> 21:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
21:58 --> 22:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So this and it's his first time screenwriting like this.
22:02 --> 22:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So this character obviously he's very passionate about it.
22:06 --> 22:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I think it's definitely going to be one of the signature characters of his life probably maybe the most.
22:11 --> 22:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, and so if it's giving him a unique creative outlet, I could see from his side wanting to stick around.
22:20 --> 22:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
22:21 --> 22:22 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think, John?
22:22 --> 22:23 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think the title means?
22:23 --> 22:24 [SPEAKER_01]: One last kill.
22:25 --> 22:37 [SPEAKER_04]: I think it's symbolic, he's not, they're not getting rid of Frank before don't say it's not, they're not getting rid of it.
22:37 --> 22:38 [SPEAKER_04]: There's just no way I think.
22:39 --> 22:46 [SPEAKER_04]: I think he's gonna do something that causes him to have to go disappear for a little while.
22:46 --> 22:47 [SPEAKER_04]: I think that's what that means.
22:48 --> 22:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think Spider-Man or the Hulk?
22:49 --> 22:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, we know he's going to be in the new Spider-Man movie.
22:52 --> 22:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think Spider-Man will show up in the Punisher's special?
22:54 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Or the Hulk?
22:56 --> 22:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe more so.
22:59 --> 23:01 [SPEAKER_01]: He just because of TV rights.
23:02 --> 23:04 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't get how that's going to work.
23:04 --> 23:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Because in the UK, this ain't that spawning in my film is going to be a 12-A.
23:10 --> 23:14 [SPEAKER_02]: How can you have the Punisher and a film that kids can go and see?
23:14 --> 23:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Like that just doesn't work with that character.
23:18 --> 23:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe, I don't know, I don't know.
23:22 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, that's why Spidey's there to, you know, but a web on his mouth is about to curse.
23:29 --> 23:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
23:29 --> 23:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
23:30 --> 23:30 [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm of his guns.
23:30 --> 23:35 [SPEAKER_04]: And if the web on his gun on his barrel of the guns, it's no, when he can't think of anything.
23:35 --> 23:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It's his offscreen.
23:37 --> 23:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
23:37 --> 23:38 [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
23:38 --> 23:38 [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
23:39 --> 23:41 [SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, I just don't go ahead.
23:41 --> 24:02 [SPEAKER_01]: was it say they sometimes they can get around it I probably I don't think they're not fighting against Aliens I was thinking about like for example predator badlands they got around that rated our thing by being like it's not human blood right right yeah with this and they're healing here yeah no because this is very street level yeah
24:03 --> 24:09 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think I don't know if they're going to show up in the Punisher TV show in the album.
24:09 --> 24:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I always think it's definitely not Spider-Man because I can't see them giving the rights for that.
24:13 --> 24:20 [SPEAKER_01]: But so, but the Hulk sometimes, yeah, we've already seen the Hulk on TV stuff before.
24:20 --> 24:20 [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
24:22 --> 24:27 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see, okay, so on Matt's side, are we all relieved that it's over with Heather?
24:28 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
24:28 --> 24:29 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
24:31 --> 24:36 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you, what do you guys think about her going full team Fisk this season?
24:37 --> 24:38 [SPEAKER_04]: It tracks and makes sense.
24:40 --> 24:41 [SPEAKER_04]: You don't give them unless you went through.
24:41 --> 24:45 [SPEAKER_02]: It does make sense, given where she ended up in Season 1.
24:46 --> 25:04 [SPEAKER_02]: I think her whole sort of character arc in Season 1 didn't particularly make sense, and this is no strike against the actor, but I am kind of glad the role got down great a little bit in Season 2, because
25:04 --> 25:09 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a whole thing of like setting it up and never made any sense.
25:09 --> 25:11 [SPEAKER_02]: The relationship never made any sense.
25:11 --> 25:14 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think having a more of a background character.
25:15 --> 25:20 [SPEAKER_02]: Probably I think you improve the show and I did like they did like the prison interview scene.
25:20 --> 25:37 [SPEAKER_02]: She does was So that was I thought that I thought the so-called character overall was very well done And I just I love the fact that that character gets introduced basically as a joke in in Hawkeye
25:37 --> 25:53 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and actually it's now quite a, this quite developed character, I think it's really good when they can do that when they can take, essentially a background character and actually build them out in a different shot.
25:53 --> 25:54 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what to do with the wing.
25:55 --> 25:57 [SPEAKER_02]: I've got to burn these clothes.
25:58 --> 26:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, yeah, you know, he's a great character.
26:00 --> 26:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And I hope that they keep him in play.
26:03 --> 26:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Just a reminder for anyone who doesn't remember, he is Kate Bishop's stepdad.
26:07 --> 26:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Or I guess they weren't, I guess he and...
26:10 --> 26:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they know I'm married.
26:12 --> 26:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Broke up.
26:12 --> 26:14 [SPEAKER_01]: He got a new hearted.
26:14 --> 26:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Get, get Bishop.
26:15 --> 26:17 [SPEAKER_02]: You got, you got a, you got a, you got to do it.
26:17 --> 26:19 [SPEAKER_02]: And you got to do it in the accent.
26:19 --> 26:20 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, thank you.
26:21 --> 26:21 [SPEAKER_01]: He knew it.
26:21 --> 26:22 [SPEAKER_01]: We're mainly accent.
26:23 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
26:24 --> 26:28 [SPEAKER_04]: But then he got, I love that they let him get busy.
26:28 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_04]: You don't have to show his skills.
26:30 --> 27:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, that was the team up with their level that's I mean we'll talk about it later when we talk about the prison stuff But that was the team up that I was like, yeah, yeah, I didn't even know I wanted it But yeah, I was with Heather I was most shocked When she falsified his psych eval for fest goes like, oh Lord that's that's you know because I thought because it's not like like for example
27:01 --> 27:07 [SPEAKER_01]: like maybe there's some conscious, you know, some, you know, conscience, nibbling at his brain.
27:08 --> 27:14 [SPEAKER_01]: When he sees what's the stuff with Fisk, you know, he's not, like I haven't written him off.
27:14 --> 27:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Heather, when she falsified Jack DuKane's psych evaluation, I'm like, oh, no, you're done.
27:19 --> 27:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Bye.
27:20 --> 27:22 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure it's conscience.
27:22 --> 27:28 [SPEAKER_02]: I think Daniel maybe has a better sense of self-preservation than her than her than her than her than her than her.
27:28 --> 27:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
27:28 --> 27:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
27:30 --> 27:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like Daniel could end up on the right side of things, but Heather, I think I feel I felt that last season, like they only set up Heather and Matt to break them up this season.
27:41 --> 27:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's like, okay, fine, I'm glad they broke up, but now we see she keeps having visions of muse who tortured her last season or you know, and and she's kept his mask.
27:54 --> 27:55 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you?
27:55 --> 27:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Jean, do you have a thought about where that might be going?
27:58 --> 28:03 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't, I'm, I'm, I'm really excited to see.
28:03 --> 28:04 [SPEAKER_04]: Just like he's going to fill in Terry.
28:04 --> 28:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's what it seems like.
28:07 --> 28:14 [SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, the problem with that is unless there's something going off of screen, like she's got no particular sketch.
28:14 --> 28:19 [SPEAKER_02]: She's got no like powers or skillset, but we know of that would take her.
28:19 --> 28:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the same skillset going into her, like Harley Quinn's backstory.
28:26 --> 28:27 [SPEAKER_01]: She could be Marvel's Harley Quinn.
28:28 --> 28:30 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, maybe.
28:31 --> 28:31 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not convinced.
28:32 --> 28:33 [SPEAKER_01]: What were you going to say, Sean?
28:34 --> 28:45 [SPEAKER_04]: No, just, you know, like I said, I think everything for her character tracks, given what she's gone through, what she went through last in the season one.
28:45 --> 29:03 [SPEAKER_04]: and to see a playout in season two, I think that's a pretty good job of telling her story because she is totally on board with punishing no pun intended, you know, vigilantees and heroes that she sees fit because
29:03 --> 29:22 [SPEAKER_04]: You know, of what happened to her and she doesn't care of that devil actually saved her life She's only remembering the parts that put her life in danger So her reacting the way that she she is reacting by totally being on board with Fisk and everything that he's doing makes sense to me.
29:22 --> 29:29 [SPEAKER_04]: It makes because I see that You see that in the real world in all universe, you know, something happens to someone and they
29:31 --> 29:32 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, we see that happen.
29:34 --> 29:45 [SPEAKER_04]: So I am totally bored into her character, her art, what, the psychological damage that she has undergone because of that attack on her.
29:45 --> 29:47 [SPEAKER_04]: It just makes sense.
29:47 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_04]: And she's trained professional.
29:51 --> 29:58 [SPEAKER_04]: So it's interesting to see her develop this really intense.
29:58 --> 30:01 [SPEAKER_04]: you know, there's a mental break that's happening.
30:01 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_04]: Something is happening to her that she's not getting into help that she needs and what she's doing is actually just hurting other people.
30:09 --> 30:19 [SPEAKER_04]: So hurt people again hurt people and that's what she's doing and um yeah it's it's sad really when you think about her character art for me.
30:20 --> 30:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
30:21 --> 30:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I wonder, so we saw Vanessa was kind of pushing her toward romantically toward Buccashman, the handsome assassin of the court.
30:32 --> 30:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But, okay, so Buccashman, he is...
30:36 --> 30:46 [SPEAKER_01]: He's a murderer, but he is not like unhinged, like other characters, we'll talk about.
30:46 --> 30:53 [SPEAKER_01]: He seems very calm all the time, he does seem to have more empathy than sayfisk.
30:55 --> 31:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what do you think, like if she and Buck get closer.
31:02 --> 31:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Are they going to become some supervillain duo or will they, he even her out?
31:09 --> 31:09 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
31:11 --> 31:13 [SPEAKER_04]: Now, but I think he kills her.
31:14 --> 31:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you think because she has a liability.
31:17 --> 31:20 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah.
31:20 --> 31:22 [SPEAKER_04]: She's not long for this series.
31:23 --> 31:27 [SPEAKER_02]: By the way, I really want to fight scene between book and Frank Castle.
31:27 --> 31:33 [SPEAKER_02]: I really want to see don't go to this versus SAA, so just be fascinating to see how that plays out.
31:36 --> 31:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I love the conversation that Heather and Buck had about the looking at the so-called courts of Fisk, you know, with the King and the Queen, and I found the most interesting thing was what Buck said about Daniel.
31:53 --> 31:58 [SPEAKER_01]: He seems like the gesture, but is actually the heir apparent.
31:58 --> 32:02 [SPEAKER_01]: So, I know Fisk had a son in the comics.
32:04 --> 32:10 [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of, you can't just like manifest a son out of nowhere at this point in the TV canon.
32:11 --> 32:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think, do you see Daniel stepping into that role?
32:16 --> 32:20 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I can see Daniel being the successor to Fist, absolutely.
32:20 --> 32:31 [SPEAKER_04]: Which is why I don't think he's a conscious, you know, he's more consciously good person than the other people and Fist is orbit.
32:33 --> 32:35 [SPEAKER_04]: He knows what's happening and he's perfectly cool with it.
32:36 --> 32:45 [SPEAKER_04]: I think it's a smile and it's a smile, but he smiles about it, he laughs about it and he pretends Yeah, but some people laugh out of unease too.
32:45 --> 32:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
32:45 --> 32:59 [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like, yeah, I don't get Okay, no, no, the thing is, as well, he lies really casually to be baby all the time But she does to him too to be fast.
32:59 --> 33:00 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's the best example.
33:01 --> 33:04 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm thinking of is when they have dinner And he just said he followed the instructions.
33:04 --> 33:04 [SPEAKER_02]: No, he did
33:06 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Right, but speaking of Daniel, I'd recently watched There are many saints from Newark, which is the prequel movie to Dispronounce, yeah, and Michael Gandolfini played in like, obviously James Gandolfini's son, so he plays The young Tony soprano in that movie
33:27 --> 33:34 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's amazing because you wouldn't have said these two characters are played by the same person.
33:34 --> 33:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Even though they look fairly similar, the way you carry them, the way you've walked, the way you carry themself, the whole physicality of the performance is 180 degrees different.
33:47 --> 33:50 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's a really impressive...
33:51 --> 34:10 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a really impressive bit of acting, but I might kind of feel in these things to be one of these actors that has the capacity even though they have a very particular look and build just completely changed how you see them without like doing any kind of radical weight loss or anything like that just by the way they walk.
34:10 --> 34:11 [SPEAKER_04]: You're right.
34:11 --> 34:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, shout out to the official Daredevil podcast, I've said the official Marvel podcast to fake for me, but the official Daredevil podcast is actually I think it's actually quite good.
34:24 --> 34:28 [SPEAKER_01]: They do they have a format where every week they'll start with.
34:28 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_01]: to members of the cast or crew together like interviewing each other and then Yeah, transition to talking to other people in the crew and things like that And so there's some really interesting conversations, and he's been a regular on it and It just seems like very like a bull person, so That let me let me ask you guys a question Daniel has to choose between BB and Fizz who's each choosing
34:56 --> 34:57 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's a thing.
34:57 --> 35:02 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, is Daniel's interest in BB purely sexual?
35:02 --> 35:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Because, or does he care about her as a person?
35:05 --> 35:07 [SPEAKER_01]: That's to me, that's the rocks of the question you're asking.
35:08 --> 35:15 [SPEAKER_04]: Daniel has to choose between BB and Fisk, who is he choosing?
35:17 --> 35:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
35:18 --> 35:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the only hope at the end of the day is he chooses BB, but anytime it feels like he's mostly interested in her for romantic reasons.
35:28 --> 35:29 [SPEAKER_04]: So who are you who's he choosing?
35:32 --> 35:32 [SPEAKER_04]: I'd be there.
35:32 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I mean, he can try.
35:34 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_01]: He'd be there.
35:35 --> 35:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Surprise.
35:35 --> 35:37 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, okay, yes.
35:37 --> 35:38 [SPEAKER_04]: So who do you think he's choosing?
35:39 --> 35:40 [SPEAKER_02]: I said Fisk.
35:41 --> 35:41 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
35:41 --> 35:41 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
35:41 --> 35:43 [SPEAKER_04]: This is going to be a final scene.
35:43 --> 35:47 [SPEAKER_02]: The final scene, episode eight, he walks out, wearing the white suit.
35:47 --> 35:48 [SPEAKER_04]: There we go.
35:49 --> 35:50 [SPEAKER_04]: There we go.
35:51 --> 35:51 [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
35:51 --> 35:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, let's get into the game of government.
35:54 --> 35:58 [SPEAKER_01]: We're picking back up this Fisk slash kingfin situation.
35:58 --> 36:00 [SPEAKER_01]: He's mayor of New York City.
36:00 --> 36:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And we saw on the last season they set up how he,
36:05 --> 36:15 [SPEAKER_01]: In this alternate reality, not in the real world, but in this alternate reality, Red Hook Brooklyn is a quote unquote freeport, which means they can bend the rules a little bit.
36:16 --> 36:24 [SPEAKER_01]: So they are using it to import weapons, basically, and spread the weapons around from there.
36:24 --> 36:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And we get at the beginning of the season, there's this boat, the northern star, that Daredevil boards, and then the captain and first mate are commanded to sink it in the bay, causes this big public relations, bruhaha, and that's kind of, yeah, it goes off in this whole story there.
36:45 --> 36:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Luke, what, I mean, from a political perspective,
36:50 --> 36:55 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think like was that smart for them to sink the boat?
36:55 --> 36:57 [SPEAKER_01]: What was that?
36:57 --> 37:05 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't know why you I don't know why you sink the boat But also I don't get that I don't get that entire plot line
37:05 --> 37:21 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sorry, the entire plot line doesn't make sense because if the CIA wants to run guns, it doesn't run them into the United States from transport, but the CIA in the 1970s, it outends its own transport companies.
37:22 --> 37:43 [SPEAKER_02]: so that there's a very famous case of an airline called era commercial area, I think, which was actually a CIM from company that it used to smuggle weapons around the world and it was also like it was a proper commercial transport company as well, like 90% of its clients were just regular
37:43 --> 37:51 [SPEAKER_02]: regular companies wanting to get aircraft or ships to move stuff from point A to point B, but it was owned and operated by the CIA.
37:51 --> 37:56 [SPEAKER_02]: The CIA just doesn't need that kind of corporate.
37:56 --> 38:04 [SPEAKER_02]: I tell you what, the character played by Mr. Charles.
38:04 --> 38:05 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Matthew Lillard.
38:05 --> 38:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Matthew Lillard, really liked Mr. Charles, not just because of his animal knowledge, but really reminds me of like, um, gosh, Mr.
38:15 --> 38:20 [SPEAKER_02]: So there's a guy, I don't know if the character is based on it, but it's guy called Do We Courage?
38:21 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_02]: You guys have a hood of him?
38:22 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_02]: No.
38:23 --> 38:27 [SPEAKER_02]: So he's famous, he was infamous in the 1980s.
38:27 --> 38:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, because he was the CIA guy who was responsible for setting up and running a lot of the guns to the, the, the, the contras in the correct, and the way the, the way they've characterized Mr. Charles is just kind of larger than life.
38:52 --> 38:58 [SPEAKER_02]: They go really, really reminds me of doing Clara's or they're doing Clara's larger than life in a different way.
38:58 --> 39:12 [SPEAKER_02]: He was very sort of James Bond, Taylor's, Taylor's suit, it's kind of spy, but this is very much over the top person, now I think, because if you're a spy, you can either go one or two ways.
39:12 --> 39:14 [SPEAKER_02]: You can either be really taciturn.
39:14 --> 39:16 [SPEAKER_02]: and really difficult to notice.
39:17 --> 39:23 [SPEAKER_02]: But there's the famous line from Richard Helms that the ideal spy is a guy who can't get service in a restaurant.
39:24 --> 39:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Or you can go the other way and be so outlandishly over the top.
39:30 --> 39:33 [SPEAKER_02]: James Bond, what do you would ever suspect you actually being a spy?
39:33 --> 39:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
39:34 --> 39:43 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think Mr. Charles is definitely, Mr. Charles is definitely the latter rather than the former part, because I love the way you just walks into fish's office.
39:44 --> 39:45 [SPEAKER_02]: And I've just said one with one.
39:45 --> 39:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
39:46 --> 39:46 [SPEAKER_02]: The take one.
39:47 --> 39:52 [SPEAKER_02]: And yet that's there is a variety of spy who that fits.
39:54 --> 39:55 [SPEAKER_02]: That fits quite well.
39:56 --> 40:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I liked hearing in interviews while, I mean, I thought it was kind of funny hearing in interviews.
40:01 --> 40:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I've entered an Afro who plays Fisk, he's saying, you know, he's like, I've known Matthew Lillard for the longest time, but for some reason while he was doing this part, I just kept thinking that like, I can't stand this man anymore, so I can't realize this really hated his character.
40:20 --> 40:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, well, well, we're even then because I have no idea what the left-handed governor is anymore.
40:27 --> 40:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, John, were you, did you catch that he got a call in the first episode from Valentina Allegra, Defonte?
40:36 --> 40:38 [SPEAKER_04]: Allegra, yes, I did catch it.
40:38 --> 40:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
40:39 --> 40:42 [SPEAKER_01]: So do you want to explain who that is for anyone?
40:42 --> 40:47 [SPEAKER_04]: Well, again, the post of Avengers in game world.
40:47 --> 40:51 [SPEAKER_04]: There's no shield, there's no Nick Fury doing things.
40:53 --> 41:10 [SPEAKER_04]: So Valentina, the La Grande Fontaine is basically wants to be the new head-on troll of all things superhero and all things, government agency that shield used to be.
41:11 --> 41:16 [SPEAKER_01]: So she wants to be the new Nick Fury.
41:16 --> 41:18 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, in the novel.
41:18 --> 41:20 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, in the universe.
41:20 --> 41:20 [SPEAKER_01]: She's not in the real world.
41:24 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
41:24 --> 41:26 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so that's who she is.
41:26 --> 41:40 [SPEAKER_04]: And she's featured prominently in Thunderbolt, wanting to get a new Avengers team that she can control, and she can manage, and she can, you know, stand wherever she wants them to go, and do whatever she wants them to do.
41:41 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_04]: She's responsible for curating century,
41:46 --> 41:49 [SPEAKER_04]: Should I call him a villain of wood?
41:50 --> 41:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I'll tell you, bro.
41:51 --> 41:52 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, anti-hero.
41:52 --> 41:53 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm not on the voice of villain.
41:55 --> 42:01 [SPEAKER_04]: So yes, so she's really involved in the MCU currently.
42:02 --> 42:15 [SPEAKER_04]: And it's not surprising that he would be in contact with her, talking when he's talking to Fisk about elicid drug running
42:16 --> 42:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
42:16 --> 42:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
42:18 --> 42:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I mean, I have to say the boat plot for me.
42:21 --> 42:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad it seems to be wrapped up.
42:24 --> 42:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure.
42:24 --> 42:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So we got the ships captain was tortured for like nothing.
42:30 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_01]: And then we had the first mate stuck around for a while.
42:34 --> 42:38 [SPEAKER_01]: But then I guess we're supposed to care that he was killed in last episode.
42:38 --> 42:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, like it's like I don't want him to die, but it's also they didn't invest
42:44 --> 42:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the boat plots over and I'm glad for that.
42:48 --> 42:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, by the way, I just remembered the name of the CIA.
42:50 --> 42:51 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm lying in the sixties.
42:51 --> 42:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Was it error in my refrigerator?
42:53 --> 42:55 [SPEAKER_01]: OK. OK.
42:56 --> 43:10 [SPEAKER_01]: But I mean, I wonder if this plot line here, though, if it was also just a way to sort of re-establish the Goonsquad, the anti-vigilanti task force, we've got Cole North was back.
43:11 --> 43:20 [SPEAKER_01]: We saw him like the Punisher through a grenade and a building and we're like, oh, he was inside, but now he's back with just facial scarring.
43:20 --> 43:25 [SPEAKER_01]: But I think I don't know why bring him back because I haven't really used him.
43:25 --> 43:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe they will in the future.
43:26 --> 43:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But the person that everyone really hates now is the leader of the group, Connor Powell, who is a real reconcidist.
43:38 --> 43:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I do love the level of contempt but cats for the task force guys.
43:44 --> 43:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, when these torturing the captain, it's like, you really enjoy your work, don't you?
43:51 --> 43:57 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like sometimes, you know, smashing people's faces and there's not a good way of getting those caught right here.
43:57 --> 43:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
43:58 --> 43:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's see.
43:58 --> 43:59 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a thing.
43:59 --> 44:07 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I feel like busk, buck, a cashman has more morality than, um, no, I don't know.
44:07 --> 44:10 [SPEAKER_02]: I think I think you just heights an efficiency.
44:11 --> 44:13 [SPEAKER_04]: No, you have no morality.
44:13 --> 44:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
44:14 --> 44:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
44:14 --> 44:16 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think he has any morality.
44:16 --> 44:19 [SPEAKER_04]: There's no, it has no morality.
44:19 --> 44:21 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, and buck is the same.
44:21 --> 44:25 [SPEAKER_04]: There's no difference between, the buck is exactly the same.
44:25 --> 44:38 [SPEAKER_04]: There's no difference, whether you punch somebody repeatedly in the face or shoot them in the back of the head while they're not looking, telling them they're going home soon, doesn't make a difference to me.
44:38 --> 44:42 [SPEAKER_04]: I think there's a level of contempt for both acts.
44:42 --> 44:48 [SPEAKER_02]: I would kind of split the difference with the two of you because I don't think book.
44:49 --> 44:57 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think book is a good guy, but I do think he has a code of sense of honor because there is that set.
44:57 --> 44:58 [SPEAKER_02]: There is that scene.
44:58 --> 44:59 [SPEAKER_04]: What's his code?
44:59 --> 45:13 [SPEAKER_02]: There is that scene in the end of episode four, where Fisk is trying to send him away to kill the first right and book doesn't want to go because he doesn't want to leave Fisk, he doesn't want to leave his boss hanging out there.
45:13 --> 45:20 [SPEAKER_02]: I actually thought that was that was a really cool little scene, because it kind of always like when they do this with villains.
45:20 --> 45:28 [SPEAKER_02]: It shows the humanity of Fisk and book, not that these are good people,
45:28 --> 45:32 [SPEAKER_02]: and that they do like, they like each other with each other.
45:32 --> 45:33 [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
45:33 --> 45:36 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's independent from killing other people.
45:37 --> 45:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I would say, but I just, I, you know, I'm not saying Buck Hatchman's a good guy.
45:47 --> 45:53 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just saying that there are shades of gray and his is a different color than Connor Powell's, which is like,
45:54 --> 46:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I would if you line them up in front of me and said one of them has to go, I'm like kind of power out to like I see nothing redeemable in someone who is sadistic.
46:05 --> 46:08 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think that we don't think that's sadistic.
46:09 --> 46:10 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I don't.
46:10 --> 46:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't agree with you.
46:11 --> 46:14 [SPEAKER_01]: He's a murderer, but he's not sadistic.
46:14 --> 46:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I agree with you, Alisha.
46:16 --> 46:20 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think, but Powell gets a kick out killing people.
46:20 --> 46:22 [SPEAKER_02]: I think the book is just part of the job.
46:22 --> 46:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Right, exactly.
46:23 --> 46:23 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
46:24 --> 46:31 [SPEAKER_04]: Which makes it even more terrifying to me that you think that just killing someone is just part of the job.
46:32 --> 46:35 [SPEAKER_04]: And I mean, Edvin, then whole-humming for it.
46:35 --> 46:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Then having a good time with it.
46:38 --> 46:39 [SPEAKER_04]: But it's...
46:39 --> 46:42 [SPEAKER_04]: At least having a good time with it, you, you are.
46:42 --> 46:44 [SPEAKER_04]: No, there's no one with it.
46:44 --> 46:46 [SPEAKER_04]: No, what I'm saying is then.
46:46 --> 46:47 [SPEAKER_01]: No, the Pony don't.
46:47 --> 46:49 [SPEAKER_04]: Pony Pony is terrible.
46:49 --> 46:52 [SPEAKER_01]: I am not saying that he's more honest in his feelings.
46:52 --> 46:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I think Buck just doesn't have those same passionate feelings about it.
46:56 --> 46:58 [SPEAKER_01]: He's more cold and calculated.
46:58 --> 47:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I see why that's chilling, but I would rather someone who's cold and calculating.
47:03 --> 47:19 [SPEAKER_01]: In a way that's like, okay, well, how do I at least minimize the pain of the person rather than someone who's just getting their jolly's off of Making someone So in book cashmons fight, but that month's haircut is a macchio
47:35 --> 47:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's, but that's not, for me, it is really just, there's nothing that I personally hate more than someone who wants to cause pain to others.
47:45 --> 47:48 [SPEAKER_01]: That for me is the worst thing that's worse than all the other things that you did.
47:48 --> 47:50 [SPEAKER_01]: But Buck is, they can be wrong.
47:50 --> 47:52 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, we're causing pain to others.
47:53 --> 47:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's no, he just minimized it.
47:55 --> 48:04 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not like, he's not doing it for fun.
48:04 --> 48:06 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not painless, but it's quick.
48:06 --> 48:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if he doesn't write, it's over before me.
48:11 --> 48:13 [SPEAKER_04]: He doesn't write, no, he doesn't write.
48:13 --> 48:14 [SPEAKER_04]: He never does it wrong.
48:14 --> 48:15 [SPEAKER_04]: That's the problem.
48:15 --> 48:18 [SPEAKER_04]: I can't have no problem with calling you.
48:19 --> 48:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not saying, I'm not going to, I'm not saying he's a good guy.
48:23 --> 48:27 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, I'm not going to, I'm afraid to get the buzzer.
48:27 --> 48:31 [SPEAKER_04]: The book, oh my gosh, I refuse to accept the book cast with morality.
48:32 --> 48:34 [SPEAKER_04]: No, no, no, no.
48:34 --> 48:39 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, we felt we found the hills you're on the side of the house.
48:39 --> 48:41 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, this is what cash with this world.
48:42 --> 48:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's shred of decency.
48:43 --> 48:44 [SPEAKER_01]: He has none.
48:45 --> 48:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't say that he is moral.
48:47 --> 48:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I just said he's less immoral.
48:50 --> 48:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, I'm going.
48:52 --> 48:52 [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
48:52 --> 48:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so it is completely immoral that I just, I don't even understand why they would do this.
48:59 --> 49:00 [SPEAKER_01]: The freaking dog cages.
49:00 --> 49:03 [SPEAKER_01]: So they keep their political prisoners in.
49:03 --> 49:04 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, my goodness gracious.
49:04 --> 49:10 [SPEAKER_01]: That was- Oh, I got- That was supposed to look cheap to build to have all these individual dog cages like that.
49:11 --> 49:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but yeah.
49:13 --> 49:15 [SPEAKER_04]: That was what I've seen to us.
49:15 --> 49:16 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it was.
49:17 --> 49:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I need to though shout out the sound editing sound mixing that with that whole sequence where Kirsten went in to see Jack Dukain and I knew right away.
49:29 --> 49:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, oh, she's going to have to repeat this to Matt later because they really tuned in to all of the sounds.
49:34 --> 49:37 [SPEAKER_01]: The show has really good sound mixing in general.
49:38 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, they took the Greek restaurant owner, Ariana.
49:42 --> 49:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's where we got the fun Jack Duke Hayne fight.
49:46 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that was just when they walked into the space and you saw the cages filled with people who are just.
49:54 --> 50:11 [SPEAKER_04]: you know, obviously you have been there for a very long time, just gut-wrenching, because it immediately, you know, what to to mind, what's happening real world, and just get our stuff.
50:11 --> 50:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you took the word down, I'm out there, George.
50:15 --> 50:21 [SPEAKER_02]: You sort of see the footage of some of these
50:21 --> 50:24 [SPEAKER_02]: They're really not that much better.
50:24 --> 50:25 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just a difference.
50:25 --> 50:29 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a different scale rather than in concert.
50:31 --> 50:39 [SPEAKER_04]: One big cage instead of, you know, one individual cage for everyone, just yeah.
50:39 --> 50:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
50:41 --> 50:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean,
50:42 --> 51:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, maybe the fact that they made it, like, it's almost like more luxury that everyone has their own, is it in a way showing that, like, that Fisk is not just trying to be as cheap as possible, and he's trying to, he's trying to humiliate people.
51:03 --> 51:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he's different goals with it.
51:05 --> 51:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
51:07 --> 51:07 [SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
51:08 --> 51:13 [SPEAKER_04]: He is really like Luke said, trying to humiliate people.
51:14 --> 51:21 [SPEAKER_04]: Not only in prison, you, but have you locked up like a wild animal.
51:22 --> 51:24 [SPEAKER_04]: Case, like a wild animal.
51:25 --> 51:48 [SPEAKER_01]: you know well yeah just that was that was a tough scene to just the when you walk into that space was just like wow well that we've got quite the cadre of villains let's take a quick break and when we come back we're going to talk about two characters on the edge and then the other allies in this fight be right back
52:06 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, and we're back.
52:08 --> 52:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So let's check in on Sheila.
52:11 --> 52:21 [SPEAKER_01]: We didn't get much from her so far this season, but when we left her last season, she's kind of inherited her and she's always been,
52:22 --> 52:40 [SPEAKER_01]: not feeling great about working for Fisk, but it's like his job, she's his campaign director, she has last season, she realized that by telling him something about the police or former police commissioner,
52:40 --> 53:07 [SPEAKER_01]: uh... she got him killed and so she's carrying that guilt into this season uh... now there is a spoiler about her in this bottom and brand new day trailer i won't mention here but and a where do you think whether or not you know that where do you think her story is going is she going to land on the right side of things or is she tipped over on the villain side i think she lands on the right side of things
53:07 --> 53:18 [SPEAKER_04]: I think she lands on the right side of things, because out of all the players around Fisk, she's been portrayed, she's been portrayed as the one who actually gives a damn about what he's done.
53:18 --> 53:20 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think that's right.
53:20 --> 53:24 [SPEAKER_04]: About the ramifications beyond her own personal gain.
53:24 --> 53:29 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, she's been presented as this person who actually cares about him.
53:29 --> 53:30 [SPEAKER_04]: things.
53:30 --> 53:33 [SPEAKER_04]: She's going along with it, but I'm not sure right now.
53:33 --> 53:39 [SPEAKER_04]: She's going along with it because she wants to advance personally or if she doesn't want to get killed.
53:40 --> 53:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
53:41 --> 53:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
53:41 --> 53:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I thought it was because she, yeah, a lot doesn't want to get killed.
53:45 --> 53:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But all it first, it was because of her career and then I think it's fair.
53:48 --> 53:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
53:49 --> 53:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
53:50 --> 53:52 [SPEAKER_02]: And also, I mean, just add to that.
53:52 --> 53:55 [SPEAKER_02]: I also think it's because she doesn't see a clear alternative.
53:55 --> 54:02 [SPEAKER_02]: There's not an alternative path in front of her at the moment that she gets easily followed.
54:02 --> 54:07 [SPEAKER_02]: I do think it's a little bit curious that nobody is asking any questions about what happened to the police commissioner.
54:07 --> 54:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Where did he go?
54:09 --> 54:11 [SPEAKER_04]: They all know is I think that's why.
54:12 --> 54:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, why they're not asking.
54:18 --> 54:20 [SPEAKER_04]: We're not going to bring that up.
54:20 --> 54:22 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't want that same head crushing experience
54:23 --> 54:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So, the other questionable character is we have, we've met the New York governor now, play by Lily Taylor, and she is another one who seems skeptical, but then ready to comply.
54:38 --> 54:44 [SPEAKER_01]: So, Karen Page leaks the whole freeport situation.
54:44 --> 54:48 [SPEAKER_01]: The governor has the power to revoke this freeport status.
54:49 --> 54:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, Fisk doesn't want that and is applying pressure with, I suppose, to help with Mr. Charles.
54:57 --> 54:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Which way do we like at the end?
54:59 --> 55:07 [SPEAKER_01]: We see, and we'll talk more about what happens with Vanessa, the boxing match at the end of this episode, but we see that she,
55:07 --> 55:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Trust Vanessa more than Fisk fair.
55:10 --> 55:18 [SPEAKER_01]: She trusts Vanessa more to keep him in line, but then now with if Vanessa might be out of the picture, what are we things going to happen?
55:19 --> 55:37 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, this is the thing, the governor is not going to put her her own political career or her own sort of liberty at risk to try and say fisk on what she was saying to Vanessa and that meeting is, I don't trust, I don't trust Wilson's judgment, I don't trust the way he uses power.
55:38 --> 55:45 [SPEAKER_02]: So like, yeah, if there is something public, if there is something that can't be covered up.
55:45 --> 55:51 [SPEAKER_02]: If there's something that can't be like swept under the road, yeah, she's going to drop the fish in a heartbeat.
55:51 --> 55:58 [SPEAKER_02]: I really glad they didn't introduce the government because it was really, it was really, really bugging me in the first place.
55:58 --> 56:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, where, where are the authorities in New York State?
56:02 --> 56:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, the man doesn't exist, the man doesn't exist in our queue.
56:06 --> 56:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and I'm not, I'm not, I said, by the way, I'm not saying that this makes the plot any more realistic.
56:13 --> 56:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely doesn't, but I am glad they kind of filled in that government-shaped hole because it was really annoying me and season one.
56:23 --> 56:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and yeah, that whole meeting between the governor and Vanessa is just, it's one of those really well-written meeting scenes where I,
56:33 --> 56:36 [SPEAKER_02]: Nobody is sitting at to your own thing.
56:37 --> 56:42 [SPEAKER_02]: Malicia, nobody is communicating clearly, but everybody knows what everybody else and not meeting means.
56:43 --> 56:44 [SPEAKER_02]: It's really well done.
56:47 --> 56:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I feel like there's setting up a powder keg in the office.
56:53 --> 56:56 [SPEAKER_01]: And the all of the interconnected government offices.
56:57 --> 57:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And it kind of feels like maybe, BB, Yurik is the spark.
57:03 --> 57:19 [SPEAKER_01]: what you call it, the match that will light the fuse of where she's she's got her BB report in the streets and city without fear in the sheets, you know, where she's doing this massed fisc parody and
57:19 --> 57:21 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so obvious that it's her.
57:21 --> 57:23 [SPEAKER_01]: It was obvious to me the first time.
57:23 --> 57:26 [SPEAKER_01]: This is where I think Daniel Blake.
57:26 --> 57:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I am certain he knows it's her and he did ask her about it.
57:30 --> 57:41 [SPEAKER_01]: But he keeps pretending to be duped and like at the end we saw someone slips a drive into her pocket and he definitely clocks that and it's like ready to be like, okay, well,
57:43 --> 57:53 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's where I'm like, I don't know, is he just not want to turn on her or is he going to offer her up, you know, to Fisk to prove his loyalty?
57:53 --> 57:58 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think that's probably an episode seven episode eight.
57:59 --> 58:00 [SPEAKER_02]: event.
58:00 --> 58:12 [SPEAKER_02]: I do like the, the, the, the parodies of my first guy, do I particular the one about the all the vigilance he's going up going to a nice farm upstate, like your first pets.
58:12 --> 58:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Also, I know, I know BB the character is, is doing the parody of Fisk, but that's not that active in the mask, like it's just not.
58:22 --> 58:23 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't think so?
58:23 --> 58:24 [SPEAKER_02]: No, it isn't.
58:25 --> 58:26 [SPEAKER_02]: Why do you think that?
58:26 --> 58:30 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, because then, she's just got a completely different build to whoever is trying to do that.
58:30 --> 58:36 [SPEAKER_01]: See, I thought that fact that she has a small build was a giveaway that, you know, okay.
58:37 --> 58:43 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, maybe I'm wrong, but like, I didn't, I didn't think that was the actual, the actual, the play baby.
58:44 --> 58:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, but I did wonder at some point like what if it turned out that actually Daniel was doing it with her or something, and he was, yeah, I would be shocked, I would be shocked.
58:56 --> 59:11 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I would be shocked, getting back to real quick about the governor, just saying, well, I'll let, I'll turn a blind eye because I know you'll keep his worst attention, you
59:12 --> 59:17 [SPEAKER_04]: We won't have these things going on as long as you are around.
59:18 --> 59:20 [SPEAKER_04]: So let them round up whoever wants to round up.
59:21 --> 59:31 [SPEAKER_04]: Let them trample on people's rights, whatever, but the worst of the worst, I know you'll keep it down, or at least away from the public eye.
59:32 --> 59:59 [SPEAKER_04]: So problematic, so problematic and so true to you know politicians and I thought that was that's what the scene portraits hit so well for me and what it portrayed so clearly like the deals that people are willing to make with the worst of the worst in order to maintain
01:00:00 --> 01:00:13 [SPEAKER_04]: As long as you can keep the headlines to a minimal and keep the damage contained, then we're okay.
01:00:13 --> 01:00:14 [SPEAKER_04]: I trust you to do that.
01:00:15 --> 01:00:17 [SPEAKER_04]: And that is so despicable.
01:00:18 --> 01:00:20 [SPEAKER_04]: So downright despicable.
01:00:21 --> 01:00:26 [SPEAKER_04]: And then watching them shake hands and smile afterwards.
01:00:27 --> 01:00:30 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, yeah, we did this, we're going to be okay.
01:00:31 --> 01:00:32 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, it made my stomach turn.
01:00:33 --> 01:00:35 [SPEAKER_04]: I get it.
01:00:35 --> 01:00:35 [UNKNOWN]: BB?
01:00:36 --> 01:00:41 [SPEAKER_04]: Daniel, like I said before, I think he's going to have to make a decision.
01:00:41 --> 01:00:48 [SPEAKER_04]: It's going to be either Fisk or BB, and you guys already know, I'm already saying it's going to be Fisk that he chooses.
01:00:49 --> 01:00:52 [SPEAKER_04]: If he chooses BB, color me shocked, I will be.
01:00:53 --> 01:01:01 [SPEAKER_04]: But he definitely knows that she's the one who's doing the city without fear campaign.
01:01:02 --> 01:01:05 [SPEAKER_04]: I think he knows.
01:01:05 --> 01:01:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
01:01:06 --> 01:01:10 [SPEAKER_04]: And he's still given her the information anyway.
01:01:10 --> 01:01:14 [SPEAKER_04]: He's still allowing it to happen until he gets called out on it.
01:01:16 --> 01:01:18 [SPEAKER_04]: And that's where I'm waiting to see.
01:01:18 --> 01:01:20 [SPEAKER_04]: When does Daniel get called out?
01:01:21 --> 01:01:25 [SPEAKER_04]: Because I think this is the moral crux of the show.
01:01:26 --> 01:01:29 [SPEAKER_04]: In many ways, it is Daniel for me.
01:01:31 --> 01:01:32 [SPEAKER_04]: Because he has to make a choice.
01:01:32 --> 01:01:34 [SPEAKER_04]: He has to make a decision here.
01:01:34 --> 01:01:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:01:35 --> 01:01:39 [SPEAKER_04]: And what will be this, everybody else, you know, they're clearly clearly lined up.
01:01:40 --> 01:01:49 [SPEAKER_04]: Good bad, you know, you say gray, but catchment, whatever, but good bad, right?
01:01:49 --> 01:01:59 [SPEAKER_04]: And I think Daniel is the character that we can see who's straddling the the most clear line.
01:02:00 --> 01:02:03 [SPEAKER_04]: We have BB on one side, and you have Fisk on the other.
01:02:04 --> 01:02:05 [SPEAKER_04]: Where does Daniel fall?
01:02:06 --> 01:02:07 [SPEAKER_04]: And that's going to be interesting to watch.
01:02:10 --> 01:02:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Hmm, and also when is somebody going to admit that Karen's wigs are terrible?
01:02:14 --> 01:02:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And they can all see her even more clearly with she wears them.
01:02:19 --> 01:02:24 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah, could you tell me, and I, you're not fooling anybody with that, come on.
01:02:25 --> 01:02:31 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what, you know what, you know what that reminds me of, it reminds me of an arrow, the idea of the nobody knows who he is.
01:02:31 --> 01:02:35 [SPEAKER_02]: Just because it's got a wedding and he's pulled this thing out.
01:02:35 --> 01:02:39 [SPEAKER_02]: He's like, hey, that is a terrible wig.
01:02:39 --> 01:02:42 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, for me, you're just not going to be anybody.
01:02:42 --> 01:02:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I just call it's more attention to her.
01:02:44 --> 01:02:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:02:45 --> 01:02:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Your favorite wig.
01:02:46 --> 01:02:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Who's this?
01:02:48 --> 01:02:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Lady, would you get to a wig from?
01:02:52 --> 01:02:55 [SPEAKER_01]: She's just a blonde woman walking on the street, people wouldn't look twice.
01:02:57 --> 01:03:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe they would anyway.
01:03:01 --> 01:03:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I guess, you know what I find, I don't know, I want to call it a fun complication, but I think it's interesting that since Matt saved Fisk's life at the end of last season,
01:03:12 --> 01:03:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Fisk cannot, like, say Matt's a bad guy, even though he's trying to say Daredevil's bad guy, and Fisk knows they're the same person, but Daniel does not.
01:03:24 --> 01:03:31 [SPEAKER_01]: So Fisk, or, no, it wasn't even Daniel, sorry, it was with his face the sadist, Connor Powell.
01:03:31 --> 01:03:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, oh, I either have Matt Murdoch found and in your office or Daredevil dead, and Fisk is like, well, it could be one of the other.
01:03:40 --> 01:03:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Good luck to him both.
01:03:46 --> 01:03:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I think it's interesting that he's like, oh, I'm so worried for the missing lawyer and presenting out this sort of APP on him.
01:03:55 --> 01:03:57 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you guys think of that situation?
01:03:58 --> 01:04:03 [SPEAKER_02]: I actually took that was quite a smart thing for fit to do it.
01:04:03 --> 01:04:07 [SPEAKER_02]: I love the way it's filmed, like with Vincent de Mafro, sitting in that chair.
01:04:07 --> 01:04:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Like you can almost see the gears working in his mind when he comes up.
01:04:11 --> 01:04:16 [SPEAKER_02]: When he comes up with the idea, I thought it was really cool.
01:04:18 --> 01:04:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Because like, the way Matt explains it is, you know, the people of the people that think Matt Murdoch is a hero is going to look for him, the people who didn't think their devil is a villain.
01:04:27 --> 01:04:32 [SPEAKER_02]: They're going to be looking for him, everybody's going to be looking for him.
01:04:33 --> 01:04:44 [SPEAKER_02]: And the problem Matt Murdoch's got is, he's not exactly inconspicuous either as Matt Murdoch or as obviously as their devil, like,
01:04:45 --> 01:04:59 [SPEAKER_02]: I have this problem, this is slight digression, but I have this problem all the time of people coming up to me, who, because they recognize me, because they recognize the wheelchair, and I have no free idea who they are.
01:04:59 --> 01:05:24 [SPEAKER_02]: So I've just got to be polite because they know who I am, but I have no idea who they are because I'm just, I'm just recognizable and anybody with a physical disability is going to have that at some point that you are much more, you are much more easy to recognize than your average person.
01:05:24 --> 01:05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, but as a thing as if Matt Murdock, he can hide in some ways more easily because he actually has this, I don't know.
01:05:33 --> 01:05:36 [SPEAKER_01]: How do we want to say his power's work?
01:05:36 --> 01:05:42 [SPEAKER_01]: There's almost a sort of echolocation factor to the way he can actually, quote unquote, see.
01:05:42 --> 01:05:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yes.
01:05:44 --> 01:05:47 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm really, I'm really glad that don't explain how it works.
01:05:48 --> 01:05:54 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that's, I think that's actually quite small.
01:05:54 --> 01:05:55 [SPEAKER_02]: you can do these things.
01:05:56 --> 01:05:57 [SPEAKER_02]: That's fine.
01:05:57 --> 01:05:58 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't need it.
01:05:58 --> 01:06:02 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't need the science behind it.
01:06:02 --> 01:06:23 [SPEAKER_01]: But okay, but it's like if they are expecting a blind lawyer and instead just see a guy walking down the street in sunglasses who doesn't appear to be blind because he seems aware of everything in his environment, then that kind of helps him hide more in a way.
01:06:24 --> 01:06:34 [SPEAKER_01]: He can very well walk around like when he walks around with his with without it without the walk in Yeah, with his with his guiding stick and yeah, that's more about the people.
01:06:34 --> 01:06:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
01:06:35 --> 01:06:47 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, he doesn't need it so he's in a way he's presenting as as something to hide his real identity.
01:06:48 --> 01:06:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because he doesn't need that
01:06:52 --> 01:06:56 [SPEAKER_04]: So Matt Murdock is just as much as a secret identity.
01:06:57 --> 01:07:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And there they're there because he doesn't want to tell people that Matt Murdock is a superhero with superhero.
01:07:04 --> 01:07:06 [SPEAKER_04]: That he can actually see.
01:07:07 --> 01:07:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean.
01:07:08 --> 01:07:10 [SPEAKER_04]: Because then they'll put two and two together.
01:07:10 --> 01:07:16 [SPEAKER_01]: But if you stand in front of him, his eyes aren't going to focus on you because his eyes don't work the way he just sees it in a different way.
01:07:17 --> 01:07:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
01:07:18 --> 01:07:24 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think, Jean, about how we started to talk about this before the spoiler break?
01:07:24 --> 01:07:31 [SPEAKER_01]: But now we can talk about it full on, how do you feel about how Kirsten is being handled this season?
01:07:31 --> 01:07:45 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I just want more of her, and I want more of her and met together on talking about, you know, the legal ramifications of what Fisk is doing.
01:07:45 --> 01:07:58 [SPEAKER_04]: I think the idea that she would have that he and her had a law firm is something they should go back to and, you know, upcoming seasons because I think they can work well.
01:07:59 --> 01:08:04 [SPEAKER_04]: I'd like her character and I'd like how she portrays and I'd like how she bounces off of Matt.
01:08:05 --> 01:08:08 [SPEAKER_04]: So I just need more of Kristin.
01:08:10 --> 01:08:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
01:08:11 --> 01:08:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I, I liked, I feel like we got more of her on her own, which I liked, you know, with with her storyline with Jack to Kane is where he talks about a bit the swordsmen.
01:08:23 --> 01:08:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, just the frustration on her part and the sympathy that ever all the other people around her gave toward her for not being, you like, she's fighting to try to defend this client, but they are just jerking her around and not.
01:08:37 --> 01:08:56 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, they didn't tell her when the trial would be or, you know, give her time to prepare a defense, and then of course he's convicted as everyone expected.
01:08:56 --> 01:08:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But now he's yeah, we he had the team up fight with Daredevil.
01:08:59 --> 01:09:00 [SPEAKER_01]: We talked about it.
01:09:00 --> 01:09:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Which is great.
01:09:01 --> 01:09:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, which is great.
01:09:02 --> 01:09:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Love seeing that.
01:09:03 --> 01:09:04 [SPEAKER_01]: That was really fun.
01:09:04 --> 01:09:08 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not it's not quite as good as bulls are in the in the dyno.
01:09:08 --> 01:09:09 [SPEAKER_02]: But no, we'll get there.
01:09:09 --> 01:09:10 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll get there.
01:09:10 --> 01:09:12 [SPEAKER_01]: This is my second favorite action scene so far this season.
01:09:14 --> 01:09:16 [SPEAKER_01]: But so, but he's now broken out.
01:09:16 --> 01:09:21 [SPEAKER_01]: And she is having her office torn up because of it.
01:09:21 --> 01:09:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and meanwhile, she's also has Angela Del Toro, uh, Hector Ayala's niece, so the white tiger who died last season, she just had his case file line around, conveniently, and apparently his amulet of powers inside.
01:09:39 --> 01:09:41 [SPEAKER_01]: So now Angela,
01:09:41 --> 01:10:05 [SPEAKER_01]: as we would have predicted based on comic book stuff, she has picked up the white tiger amulet and do you think like it almost feels like it's going to fall to Kirsten to kind of mentor her although her aunt was kidnapped by the AVTF but now her aunt has been freed too but now is also on the run I suppose because she's supposed to be arrested.
01:10:05 --> 01:10:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
01:10:06 --> 01:10:14 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think Kirsten is, I think, is Matt that needs to be the mentor to Angela.
01:10:14 --> 01:10:17 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't, I don't want anyone else to mentor Angela.
01:10:17 --> 01:10:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I think, I mean, Matt should be the mentor to Angela and a superhero side, but I think Kirsten could provide a grounding sort of, let's not lose ourselves to it, because Matt is not, I don't think
01:10:35 --> 01:10:38 [SPEAKER_04]: but that's why I think it should be met.
01:10:40 --> 01:10:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think he should mentor her and fighting stuff, but I don't think he should mentor her on being of healthy individual.
01:10:49 --> 01:10:53 [SPEAKER_04]: But I think he can be a healthy individual by mentoring and just...
01:10:53 --> 01:10:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I see, I see what she means.
01:10:54 --> 01:10:58 [SPEAKER_01]: She saves him by giving him a...
01:10:58 --> 01:11:05 [SPEAKER_04]: Given him something else, someone else, because everyone that he knows
01:11:05 --> 01:11:08 [SPEAKER_04]: Everything revolves around him being Daredevil.
01:11:08 --> 01:11:12 [SPEAKER_04]: His relationship with Angela would revolve around, making her better.
01:11:13 --> 01:11:15 [SPEAKER_04]: You know what I'm saying?
01:11:15 --> 01:11:16 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah.
01:11:16 --> 01:11:22 [SPEAKER_04]: I think that would be a different way for Matt Murdock to view himself.
01:11:22 --> 01:11:35 [SPEAKER_04]: right as not just their devil making things right for everyone around me, but actually helping someone on a different scale, which he hasn't done in these areas.
01:11:36 --> 01:11:43 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it doesn't remind me a bit of there's this movie, not a superhero movie, we're just a movie that came out this past year from Columbia called a poet.
01:11:43 --> 01:11:50 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's about this poet who is, um, uh, yeah, just restructuring and a lot of different ways.
01:11:51 --> 01:12:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, ends up mentoring someone younger than him, which gives him something to something bigger than himself to discover his own morality or think.
01:12:03 --> 01:12:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, it's a good point.
01:12:04 --> 01:12:04 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a good point.
01:12:05 --> 01:12:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think that Kirsten knows Daredevilismat?
01:12:09 --> 01:12:11 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, man.
01:12:11 --> 01:12:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I think she knows who Karen is.
01:12:12 --> 01:12:14 [SPEAKER_01]: She knows who she's going now, right?
01:12:15 --> 01:12:17 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
01:12:19 --> 01:12:20 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know.
01:12:20 --> 01:12:23 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if she doesn't know, it's because she doesn't want to know.
01:12:23 --> 01:12:25 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's what they're.
01:12:25 --> 01:12:27 [SPEAKER_04]: I think maybe she doesn't want to know.
01:12:28 --> 01:12:31 [SPEAKER_04]: because she's a lawyer, right?
01:12:31 --> 01:12:36 [SPEAKER_04]: And that will bring up all sorts of ethical questions for her.
01:12:37 --> 01:12:39 [SPEAKER_04]: So I think maybe she doesn't want to know.
01:12:40 --> 01:12:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it is weird.
01:12:41 --> 01:12:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He's with Karen.
01:12:42 --> 01:12:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So they have a made a secret of that and I feel like when he showed up in her office and he was purposely sitting far away from her.
01:12:50 --> 01:12:59 [SPEAKER_01]: I suppose to be less noticeable to her, but I just, yeah, I think she's smarter than not figuring out that.
01:13:02 --> 01:13:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I already complained about this
01:13:10 --> 01:13:23 [SPEAKER_01]: I just have to wonder if the actor just wasn't available a lot this season because basically the only thing that's happened with him is he had a heart attack which was used as treated like it was a distraction for Matt.
01:13:23 --> 01:13:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And then he was taken to the hospital and apparently has been helped to escape the hospital.
01:13:28 --> 01:13:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So, but we barely have seen him.
01:13:31 --> 01:13:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't know.
01:13:34 --> 01:13:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I see
01:13:39 --> 01:13:50 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I don't think there's, I don't know what part of the story that he's going to to take up because they, like you said, they've sideline him.
01:13:51 --> 01:13:51 [SPEAKER_04]: He's had a heart attack.
01:13:52 --> 01:13:53 [SPEAKER_04]: He's recovering from that.
01:13:53 --> 01:13:55 [SPEAKER_04]: So what much help can he offer?
01:13:55 --> 01:14:01 [SPEAKER_04]: It would have to be in a different capacity than he did in season one, right?
01:14:01 --> 01:14:07 [SPEAKER_04]: Where he was much more active and, you know, doing surveillance and things of that nature, he can't do those things now.
01:14:07 --> 01:14:16 [SPEAKER_04]: So how would that, what role would he have in order to help their devil, Matt Murdoch now?
01:14:17 --> 01:14:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they're also, it feels like they're replacing him in that capacity with Detective Angie Kim, who is their ally on the NYPD.
01:14:28 --> 01:14:28 [SPEAKER_04]: That's a good point.
01:14:28 --> 01:14:29 [SPEAKER_04]: I didn't think about that.
01:14:29 --> 01:14:31 [SPEAKER_04]: That's a good point.
01:14:31 --> 01:14:31 [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe.
01:14:33 --> 01:14:46 [SPEAKER_02]: I did like the scene where he's in the hospital room and only his ex-coct buddies are there to sort of act as a funny guy and then they're doing the whole like squaring off thing with the anti-vigilante task force.
01:14:46 --> 01:14:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you want to bring the pizza or or shall we give it to each other just like yeah I'll come on guys fuck, fuck, fuck right there in the hospital room.
01:14:58 --> 01:15:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, and then bulls, I show up, but we'll get to him in a second.
01:15:00 --> 01:15:05 [SPEAKER_04]: And you can take, you can take the normal people, but you know, you don't come after our cop.
01:15:06 --> 01:15:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
01:15:06 --> 01:15:08 [SPEAKER_04]: We draw the line at cops, we draw the line.
01:15:09 --> 01:15:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And I mean, I think it's interesting they've already had, they have their AVT F collaborator, Alan Sonders, who,
01:15:18 --> 01:15:19 [SPEAKER_01]: testified in their behalf, too.
01:15:19 --> 01:15:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, that guy's dead, right?
01:15:22 --> 01:15:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's not been killed.
01:15:24 --> 01:15:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but I was like, ever seen, you know, episode five, seen one.
01:15:28 --> 01:15:33 [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe I don't really, I don't know if he's, I don't know if he's dead yet.
01:15:34 --> 01:15:35 [SPEAKER_04]: Not yet, not yet.
01:15:35 --> 01:15:36 [SPEAKER_04]: I think they was show us.
01:15:36 --> 01:15:37 [SPEAKER_04]: I think they were show us.
01:15:38 --> 01:15:39 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they were show us.
01:15:39 --> 01:15:40 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they were show us screen.
01:15:40 --> 01:15:41 [SPEAKER_04]: They were show us.
01:15:41 --> 01:15:51 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I mean, the last thing we saw, I think, was him recording something that I guess they're going to use against Fisk, but he showed his face, and I don't know why.
01:15:51 --> 01:15:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why Matt and Karen would ask that of him to be honest.
01:15:56 --> 01:16:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we think they're ever going to fix Josie's bar or just keep attacking it?
01:16:03 --> 01:16:08 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I do not want them going back in Jocelyn's bar unless foggy terms out.
01:16:08 --> 01:16:09 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, fair enough.
01:16:09 --> 01:16:11 [SPEAKER_04]: That's fair enough.
01:16:11 --> 01:16:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, okay.
01:16:12 --> 01:16:16 [SPEAKER_01]: So there is a comic book way that foggy could come back.
01:16:16 --> 01:16:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe next season.
01:16:18 --> 01:16:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And I do hope I know and there's a lot of people like don't do that.
01:16:22 --> 01:16:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Don't do that.
01:16:23 --> 01:16:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Like shut up.
01:16:27 --> 01:16:28 [SPEAKER_01]: It's comic accurate.
01:16:29 --> 01:16:29 [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:16:29 --> 01:16:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And so maybe they fix up Josie's bar and they have like the opening for it and look the turns up.
01:16:38 --> 01:16:39 [SPEAKER_01]: They get that.
01:16:40 --> 01:16:43 [SPEAKER_01]: That whiskey, whatever that whiskey is, they're always talking well.
01:16:46 --> 01:16:56 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, this is a good place to take our last break and when we come back we're going to talk about Bullseye and I'm a feeling we're going to have different feelings about.
01:17:19 --> 01:17:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so since I've titled this section, Baby Boy Bulls Eye, I feel like I need to say up front.
01:17:25 --> 01:17:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I again do not think he's a good person.
01:17:28 --> 01:17:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I really like the way that they're portraying it.
01:17:32 --> 01:17:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I think he thinks he's a good person, which I think is much more interesting.
01:17:38 --> 01:17:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Although.
01:17:39 --> 01:17:43 [SPEAKER_04]: So far, you know, there's going to be a bite, I knew it.
01:17:43 --> 01:17:55 [SPEAKER_01]: No, and so far, the thing that has disturbed me from him the most, more than the murdering people, is that he went to the church when we saw him, you know, he talked to the vicar there.
01:17:56 --> 01:18:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And he asked for Sister Maggie, which is the name of Daredevil's mother, who is a nun.
01:18:06 --> 01:18:19 [SPEAKER_01]: and then so we found out she's away on a mission somewhere, but why did he want, do you think, like, did he want her because he thought I need to confess to or talk to his mother or for something more sinister?
01:18:21 --> 01:18:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, maybe to get a message to my mother.
01:18:25 --> 01:18:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm, that's what I was wondering.
01:18:26 --> 01:18:32 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I don't think he had intense unharming her at this point, at that point though.
01:18:33 --> 01:18:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but we find out like he's been hiding out as not even hiding out like he did seem to be one of we found by Matt, but he's been playing the role of Tony the cat loving neighbor and you know, he's like given this cat eggs, which I'm not sure is completely healthy.
01:18:50 --> 01:18:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It is protein, but
01:18:53 --> 01:19:06 [SPEAKER_01]: and you know, but then as soon as Matt does find him and wants to fight, he has no problem grabbing this neighbor he's been chummy with who caught him such a nice boy and holding her a gunpoint.
01:19:07 --> 01:19:08 [SPEAKER_02]: This is neighbor or his land lady.
01:19:09 --> 01:19:10 [SPEAKER_02]: I couldn't quite tell.
01:19:11 --> 01:19:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's at least his neighbor.
01:19:13 --> 01:19:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
01:19:15 --> 01:19:18 [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't, it doesn't matter, but I thought your
01:19:19 --> 01:19:23 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, so where does it get in the money from to make red?
01:19:23 --> 01:19:28 [SPEAKER_02]: It's that, that is quite a noise apart, that it's not, but it's quite a noise apart.
01:19:28 --> 01:19:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, assassins are paid well in fictional worlds, right?
01:19:35 --> 01:19:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, okay, so you already set up the episode for Diner Opening.
01:19:42 --> 01:20:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And one of the greatest scenes, I think, in the show, from the milkshake into, like he calls in a fake Punisher sighting, which is so ironic that they, they descend there to go after Punisher, when the AVTF still has skulls on the uniform.
01:20:03 --> 01:20:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
01:20:03 --> 01:20:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
01:20:03 --> 01:20:06 [SPEAKER_01]: That we're modeled after Punisher.
01:20:06 --> 01:20:20 [SPEAKER_02]: What I love about that is it really brought to mind there's a famous Sam Ramey quote about the evil dead that the evil dead is a Three stuages movie except that except for doesn't have cream pies.
01:20:20 --> 01:20:30 [SPEAKER_02]: It has blood and actually I'd like I don't know whether they said it up that way, but that fight made me laugh because it's just it's just really good slapstick
01:20:31 --> 01:20:33 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just really, really good slapstick.
01:20:34 --> 01:20:36 [SPEAKER_02]: There's just like, there are a lot of good profiles.
01:20:36 --> 01:20:38 [SPEAKER_02]: I love the very jumps behind the counter fingers.
01:20:39 --> 01:20:42 [SPEAKER_02]: It really was a good, really wasn't good milk.
01:20:42 --> 01:20:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, just, yeah.
01:20:44 --> 01:20:46 [SPEAKER_02]: And also, what are we more impressed by guys?
01:20:46 --> 01:20:51 [SPEAKER_02]: And you managed to kill a person with a toothpick or with his own toothpicks?
01:20:51 --> 01:20:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, what about the lobster claw?
01:20:53 --> 01:20:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, yeah, the lobster claw is pretty good as well.
01:20:57 --> 01:21:02 [SPEAKER_04]: I think the laughs the clout takes the cake, I think the laughs the clout, by far.
01:21:02 --> 01:21:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was so worried for that little dog that the guy had, and he looks at him and goes, I wanted the good guys.
01:21:10 --> 01:21:20 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not, I'm by the way, by the way, both sides, absolutely right, you should, unless it's a, unless it's a service dog, you should not be bringing dogs into it.
01:21:20 --> 01:21:21 [SPEAKER_04]: Into a restaurant.
01:21:21 --> 01:21:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Listen, I live in continental Europe.
01:21:24 --> 01:21:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I understand some people are allergic, but I honestly don't mind.
01:21:28 --> 01:21:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Like in Amsterdam, we have cats and cafes all the time because they are mousers.
01:21:33 --> 01:21:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you would have most people would rather have a cat and a cafe than mice.
01:21:38 --> 01:21:43 [SPEAKER_01]: It's less dangerous, they're less likely to poop in your food, and... Like, I don't really want all you to be.
01:21:43 --> 01:21:45 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't really want all you have to be like that.
01:21:45 --> 01:21:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, and I do want $1 million, but it doesn't make it happen, unfortunately.
01:21:55 --> 01:21:56 [SPEAKER_01]: With Bulls, I, okay.
01:21:56 --> 01:22:07 [SPEAKER_01]: So I really, I just like the way they're portraying him, I think that Wilson, Bethel, is just obviously doing a great portrayal.
01:22:07 --> 01:22:13 [SPEAKER_01]: you know, in the original Daredevil show and obviously he showed up last season as well.
01:22:13 --> 01:22:26 [SPEAKER_01]: But what I really like of the story they're telling overall about him is that he is clearly, not just a sociopath, he's a psychopath, he's violent, but
01:22:26 --> 01:22:43 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I studied psychology and my favorite professor in University of talk about this elsewhere was actually he was a confess sociopath, you know, he would tell us about his experiences as a sociopath.
01:22:43 --> 01:22:52 [SPEAKER_01]: as an educational exercise, and I've since known other people, it's actually quite, you know, it's just another dimension of human experience.
01:22:52 --> 01:22:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Some people just experience less empathy than other people, and the question is how do you deal with that?
01:22:59 --> 01:23:10 [SPEAKER_01]: And what my professor would always say is as you know, the people, the good quote unquote sociopaths, the ones who fit into society best
01:23:11 --> 01:23:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And I feel like that is what they have set up with, you know, people telling point dexter, you know, it's bullseye dex to hitch his morality to someone else's star, like sort of follow after someone else.
01:23:29 --> 01:23:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I do think that that's a realistic way that people handle it.
01:23:32 --> 01:23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just obviously,
01:23:34 --> 01:23:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He has never hitched it to the right person, clearly hitching it to the Fisk's was a bad idea.
01:23:42 --> 01:23:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we think now that he seems to be studying Matt in that way?
01:23:48 --> 01:23:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we think that's better for him?
01:23:51 --> 01:23:59 [SPEAKER_02]: I have a horrible, horrible feeling that the way this is going to play out is Fisk is going to assume
01:24:00 --> 01:24:06 [SPEAKER_02]: that Daredevil and Bulls Eye are working together.
01:24:07 --> 01:24:15 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, like Bulls Eye's one of you, and that because Vanessa got hurt at the end of episode four, he's going to go outside the car room.
01:24:17 --> 01:24:18 [SPEAKER_02]: That's like, as payback.
01:24:18 --> 01:24:24 [SPEAKER_02]: I like to say, if that happens and being at Cameron, I am choosing violence.
01:24:25 --> 01:24:40 [SPEAKER_02]: But I just have a heart, you can see, you can see how this plays out, because bulls are kind of things to him and dare to have all our work together, or at least working towards the same ends.
01:24:40 --> 01:24:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He's been helping him, certainly.
01:24:42 --> 01:24:44 [SPEAKER_01]: He gave him your welcome knife.
01:24:48 --> 01:25:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but obviously Matt still holds a grudge against Dex against Bullseye for killing foggy, even though it was on Vanessa's command, do we think Matt will get over that?
01:25:00 --> 01:25:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Like should
01:25:04 --> 01:25:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if he, he killed him, not on his own, not to a big, but because it's Vanessa's fault.
01:25:13 --> 01:25:14 [SPEAKER_01]: People, yeah, but he pulled the trigger.
01:25:15 --> 01:25:18 [SPEAKER_04]: So this is what I think.
01:25:18 --> 01:25:24 [SPEAKER_04]: I think Daredevil is a hero, right?
01:25:25 --> 01:25:26 [SPEAKER_04]: And he wants to be a hero.
01:25:26 --> 01:25:27 [SPEAKER_04]: He wants to help people.
01:25:27 --> 01:25:32 [SPEAKER_04]: He wants to save people.
01:25:33 --> 01:25:35 [SPEAKER_04]: not a hero.
01:25:36 --> 01:25:47 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, I don't think Matt is solely focused on Bullseye because he killed foggy, yes, and he tried to kill Karen, yes, and he tried to kill him, yes.
01:25:49 --> 01:25:52 [SPEAKER_04]: But he's just a killer period.
01:25:53 --> 01:26:01 [SPEAKER_04]: His way of helping is indiscriminately targeting people and it doesn't matter who gets
01:26:02 --> 01:26:06 [SPEAKER_04]: right, I don't think Matt would ever be okay with that.
01:26:07 --> 01:26:12 [SPEAKER_04]: Because both I goes out of his way to not care about collateral damage.
01:26:13 --> 01:26:21 [SPEAKER_04]: You see it and when he strikes out at Vanessa, the people get harmed, you know, presumably killed.
01:26:21 --> 01:26:27 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think that's something that Matt would want to do in tandem.
01:26:27 --> 01:26:29 [SPEAKER_04]: So I don't think Matt,
01:26:30 --> 01:26:33 [SPEAKER_04]: vision and vision himself working with both sides.
01:26:33 --> 01:26:44 [SPEAKER_04]: Bullseye is, I mean, once he, now he's taken out Vanessa, who he feels like was the reason that he did the things that he did.
01:26:45 --> 01:26:46 [SPEAKER_04]: What's next?
01:26:47 --> 01:26:50 [SPEAKER_04]: What does he focus on next?
01:26:50 --> 01:26:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Who does he focus his attention on?
01:26:52 --> 01:27:02 [SPEAKER_04]: And that's the question that it's going to be, you know, important to tell, to answer because he's been focused on the Fisk.
01:27:02 --> 01:27:03 [SPEAKER_04]: Does he go after Wilson as well?
01:27:03 --> 01:27:04 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know.
01:27:04 --> 01:27:14 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know because he clearly blamed Vanessa because Vanessa's the one that talked him into what he did.
01:27:15 --> 01:27:19 [SPEAKER_01]: But who's going to blame next, especially if he's decided that Matt is his friend.
01:27:19 --> 01:27:23 [SPEAKER_01]: He's your enemy, you know, enemy of my friend is my enemy too.
01:27:24 --> 01:27:25 [SPEAKER_01]: He said, there's something goes like that.
01:27:26 --> 01:27:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, but if we're going to talk about Matt's willingness to team up with him, I feel like we have to draw both the parallels and the distinctions with the Punisher.
01:27:35 --> 01:27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, because we, we did, we've had some hot debates where I think we all ultimately landed on the side that Frank Castle is not a sociopath, but he is a murderer.
01:27:47 --> 01:27:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
01:27:49 --> 01:27:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
01:27:49 --> 01:27:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Benjamin Poindekster, Bullseye, is both.
01:27:53 --> 01:27:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
01:27:54 --> 01:28:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So we've seen Mac overcome his repugnance for murder in order to align with Frank on the regular.
01:28:05 --> 01:28:10 [SPEAKER_01]: but it can he do the same with with decks?
01:28:11 --> 01:28:24 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think so because Frank clearly with Matt identifies the same people as being villains.
01:28:24 --> 01:28:26 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think Bulls, I does that.
01:28:27 --> 01:28:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, now he does.
01:28:28 --> 01:28:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Now he's all like he hates all the meat Matt hates now.
01:28:32 --> 01:28:35 [SPEAKER_04]: but he hates all the people that math hates, but he also kills other people.
01:28:36 --> 01:28:37 [SPEAKER_01]: He's a person.
01:28:37 --> 01:28:41 [SPEAKER_04]: And pursuant of killing the people that math hates.
01:28:42 --> 01:28:43 [SPEAKER_01]: But you don't think that's the question, Frank.
01:28:43 --> 01:28:44 [SPEAKER_04]: Frank wouldn't do that.
01:28:45 --> 01:28:48 [SPEAKER_01]: No, Frank would do that because Frank's not a sociopath.
01:28:48 --> 01:28:49 [SPEAKER_04]: That's what I'm saying.
01:28:49 --> 01:28:50 [SPEAKER_04]: Frank wouldn't do that.
01:28:50 --> 01:28:52 [SPEAKER_04]: And I think there's a distinction between those.
01:28:52 --> 01:28:56 [SPEAKER_01]: But could Jack's learn not to do that?
01:28:56 --> 01:28:56 [SPEAKER_04]: No.
01:28:58 --> 01:29:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I think he's capable of learning.
01:29:01 --> 01:29:02 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you, he's smart guy?
01:29:03 --> 01:29:05 [SPEAKER_02]: What do you, what do you master at this point?
01:29:05 --> 01:29:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Like he's killed so many people.
01:29:08 --> 01:29:09 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, so has Frank.
01:29:13 --> 01:29:16 [SPEAKER_04]: What, what, what, Emma says has Frank killed.
01:29:16 --> 01:29:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Which, what, sorry, say, I mean, which innocent, which, which innocent, says he killed.
01:29:22 --> 01:29:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, which people.
01:29:24 --> 01:29:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he takes more care with bystanders.
01:29:27 --> 01:29:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:29:27 --> 01:29:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm going to I think there's probably a lot of cops who just happened to be in his way who hadn't done anything particularly wrong.
01:29:34 --> 01:29:37 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's true.
01:29:37 --> 01:29:39 [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, yeah, I don't know about that.
01:29:40 --> 01:29:41 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know about that.
01:29:41 --> 01:29:42 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's the old Austin Powers line.
01:29:42 --> 01:29:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Nobody ever thinks of the henchmen.
01:29:46 --> 01:29:46 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
01:29:47 --> 01:29:49 [SPEAKER_04]: I think those cops had a comment.
01:29:49 --> 01:29:53 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm just saying, I'm just saying, I was like, I had a comment.
01:29:53 --> 01:29:56 [SPEAKER_02]: So, you really, you really A.C.A.B.
01:29:56 --> 01:29:58 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, I am.
01:29:58 --> 01:30:00 [SPEAKER_04]: I am absolutely, absolutely.
01:30:00 --> 01:30:02 [SPEAKER_04]: When thousand to set.
01:30:02 --> 01:30:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I have known good cops.
01:30:05 --> 01:30:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just putting it out there.
01:30:06 --> 01:30:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I have known good cops.
01:30:09 --> 01:30:13 [SPEAKER_01]: They exist and I think we'll see.
01:30:13 --> 01:30:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, for instance, look at the guy who deflected it to give, you know, which is named Alan Saunders who left the AVTF to testify against them more or less.
01:30:26 --> 01:30:30 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, I must end up in a good carps, I'm not saying that.
01:30:30 --> 01:30:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Also, before we move off both sides, right, right, accidentally killed some.
01:30:34 --> 01:30:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Before we move off both sides and cops, do you think there's like a course actors can go on about going to fall down correctly?
01:30:47 --> 01:30:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Like when they are quote unquote killed,
01:30:50 --> 01:30:51 [SPEAKER_04]: Mm-hmm.
01:30:51 --> 01:30:52 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh yeah, I think they have to yes.
01:30:53 --> 01:31:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, cuz like I think I'm thinking of the I'm thinking of the two guys The two The driving task force guys in the elevator There he kills and they get to the bottom and they just both Oh, yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
01:31:14 --> 01:31:15 [SPEAKER_02]: way.
01:31:15 --> 01:31:21 [SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, it's like of course you can go on as an actor as the heart of all bad.
01:31:21 --> 01:31:22 [SPEAKER_02]: I think so.
01:31:22 --> 01:31:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
01:31:22 --> 01:31:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's definitely like I've taken acting courses and it definitely will do practice, I think sometimes I want one third place at an all night at a was a horror overnight marathon festival where there was a best death competition.
01:31:38 --> 01:31:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I got third place.
01:31:40 --> 01:31:43 [SPEAKER_01]: What was the prize for third point?
01:31:43 --> 01:31:45 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I got like a movie pass.
01:31:45 --> 01:31:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:31:47 --> 01:31:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah.
01:31:49 --> 01:31:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So, okay.
01:31:50 --> 01:32:01 [SPEAKER_01]: One thing that could bring you back to Dex and who he's going to go after next, Matt did warn him not to turn Fisk into a martyr.
01:32:02 --> 01:32:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And I am very much on that boat, too.
01:32:04 --> 01:32:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, don't because, you know, you see that people, even if they say they've been shot at, people are like,
01:32:12 --> 01:32:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Protect them and so I am very much like don't just if you if Dex takes Fisk out then it allows you know maybe Baby Ghetto Fini to take his place as the next.
01:32:28 --> 01:32:32 [SPEAKER_02]: fascist and chief, but I don't think that's could kill this.
01:32:32 --> 01:32:34 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think he's winning that fight.
01:32:34 --> 01:32:43 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, not if it's hand-to-hand, but if we go back to the, if we go back to the original episode four.
01:32:44 --> 01:32:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, okay.
01:32:45 --> 01:32:49 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, first gradually is able to deflect that.
01:32:49 --> 01:32:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Snow globe blasting, he's actually able to deflect it off the belts that he's carrying.
01:32:57 --> 01:33:06 [SPEAKER_02]: So he's already shown us that his reflexes are faster, or at least as fast as point X this.
01:33:06 --> 01:33:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, we saw like there's that famous three-way fight between Fisk, Bullseye and Daredevil.
01:33:13 --> 01:33:17 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so good in the, it was in three of the original show.
01:33:18 --> 01:33:23 [SPEAKER_01]: So we know like they're fairly evenly matched.
01:33:24 --> 01:33:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but I guess what I'm saying is we know they're fairly evenly matched up close.
01:33:31 --> 01:33:35 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I think that shot showed you is there in terms of reflexes.
01:33:35 --> 01:33:38 [SPEAKER_02]: They're also evenly matched match at a distance.
01:33:38 --> 01:33:43 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's not like it's not like point X to can do one of his ninth throwy thing.
01:33:44 --> 01:33:46 [SPEAKER_02]: It's from like across the road.
01:33:46 --> 01:33:48 [SPEAKER_01]: and this would have no challenge.
01:33:48 --> 01:33:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it depends if he catches him off guard.
01:33:51 --> 01:33:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, the question is should he, and I agree with Matt that he should not.
01:33:54 --> 01:34:04 [SPEAKER_01]: But okay, since that's let's get into this box, even match that you mentioned, which I hate the names, scrapping in the kitchen, I think that's so dumb.
01:34:04 --> 01:34:15 [SPEAKER_01]: But of course, Fisk has to do it in Fogwell's gym, which is where Matt's dad used to fight, and now it's been newly renovated, so he's definitely doing it there to like, need to let Matt.
01:34:17 --> 01:34:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I do think this is a behind-the-scenes thing Vincent and Alfred was talking about on the official podcast about how he, in general, he wears a pat suit to portray Fisk, because he's supposed to be,
01:34:31 --> 01:34:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And but for this he said, you know, I think we need to have bear arms would be weird if he was wearing long sleeves at the boxing match, so he had to go to the gym and beef up his arms for this scene.
01:34:45 --> 01:34:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Bad owner.
01:34:45 --> 01:34:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:34:46 --> 01:34:50 [SPEAKER_01]: First question, he was in a brutal boxing match.
01:34:50 --> 01:34:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Definitely knocked out the other guy.
01:34:52 --> 01:34:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Did he kill the guy?
01:34:53 --> 01:34:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm saying I am unclear is to whether he killed the other guy or not.
01:34:57 --> 01:34:58 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I think he did.
01:34:58 --> 01:34:59 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't think so?
01:34:59 --> 01:35:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think so.
01:35:00 --> 01:35:00 [SPEAKER_04]: No, I think he did.
01:35:01 --> 01:35:02 [SPEAKER_02]: How do you think he did?
01:35:02 --> 01:35:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
01:35:02 --> 01:35:06 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, he certainly certainly, like, massively messed up.
01:35:07 --> 01:35:08 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah, I think he's dead.
01:35:09 --> 01:35:15 [SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, maybe this is just me being done, but I've watched all four episodes, multiple times.
01:35:16 --> 01:35:22 [SPEAKER_02]: And I can't find where they actually announced that this fight is going to happen.
01:35:22 --> 01:35:46 [SPEAKER_02]: um they they like i guess it was earlier that episode they um so the yeah so it's not like they don't foreshadow it and i don't know no okay i don't think that one episode thing i think yeah okay because he's like good because i i thought i was actually what was going crazy i thought i'd miss something really obvious yeah because he was like the kind of thing they all to foreshadow the couple of episodes to go
01:35:47 --> 01:35:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I don't know.
01:35:49 --> 01:35:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm okay.
01:35:51 --> 01:35:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It's an episodic TV show.
01:35:52 --> 01:35:53 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm okay with that.
01:35:54 --> 01:35:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, that this was he was like, okay, this will be the trap that he's trying to lure in both.
01:35:59 --> 01:36:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, both Matt and Dex.
01:36:02 --> 01:36:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, okay.
01:36:03 --> 01:36:05 [SPEAKER_01]: So here's another question.
01:36:05 --> 01:36:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So we've talked about has wood mat team up with Dex.
01:36:09 --> 01:36:17 [SPEAKER_01]: But do we think if Matt had not promised the whatever the priest and training guy?
01:36:17 --> 01:36:40 [SPEAKER_01]: If he had not promised him that he wouldn't kill Bullseye, would he have killed him At the boxing match because it looks like he considered it at a moment No, I don't think he would kill them I just don't I don't I don't think so I'm not sure even if you wanted to that he could There I think they're probably too.
01:36:40 --> 01:36:45 [SPEAKER_04]: My question is do you think oh no Matt Matt could take Bullseye out Absolutely
01:36:45 --> 01:36:46 [SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
01:36:46 --> 01:36:54 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, there's no but it would be a fight that my question is like it's more of a moral one
01:36:55 --> 01:37:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Like even when when they were doing the fight in the cages with swordsman and I suppose it was more swordsman doing this But some of those hits against the AVTF looked fatal like it looked like it may be only Jack killing them But it looked like Daredevil was going harder than where he was to him.
01:37:13 --> 01:37:20 [SPEAKER_04]: I would not want to Be in a fight with with man Murdock
01:37:21 --> 01:37:26 [SPEAKER_04]: I would, that is, because he's not going to kill you, but he's really going to hurt you.
01:37:28 --> 01:37:49 [SPEAKER_04]: He's really going to hurt you, and it's going to take, it's going to take a very long time for you to recover, because he is, he's brutal, he's brutal, because he's not going to kill you, but he's going to make sure, yeah, he's going to make sure that you remember
01:37:50 --> 01:38:04 [SPEAKER_04]: He's got, that's one hero that if you are like a street-level criminal, you don't want to see Batman and you don't want to see there, don't.
01:38:04 --> 01:38:07 [SPEAKER_04]: And also, Moonlight, those are the three.
01:38:07 --> 01:38:18 [SPEAKER_04]: You don't want to see those guys because you end up in traction, it's bad, it's bad.
01:38:18 --> 01:38:23 [SPEAKER_04]: And he's not going to, and that's why I don't think he would have killed Bullseye.
01:38:26 --> 01:38:48 [SPEAKER_04]: What's interesting to me as we're talking and thinking about the two of them together, what I can see is not so much Matt teaming up with Bullseye, but Bullseye teaming up with Matt, and Bullseye taking on
01:38:50 --> 01:38:55 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, but bulls are bulls are going to take book down in right two seconds.
01:38:55 --> 01:38:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
01:38:56 --> 01:38:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:38:57 --> 01:38:58 [SPEAKER_01]: It.
01:38:58 --> 01:38:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.
01:38:59 --> 01:39:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I will be more okay with bulls.
01:39:01 --> 01:39:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I taking our book than vice versa to be honest.
01:39:06 --> 01:39:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Although, yeah, it does feel like the two of them should be coming in a confrontation at some point because you have the similar sort of thing going on.
01:39:15 --> 01:39:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
01:39:16 --> 01:39:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So talking about the whole Vanessa thing, you know, you're talking about Wilson blocking bulls I throwing that souvenir that Daniel had just bought that ironically was Fisk's head in glass and like the better Fisk knew your career, whatever.
01:39:38 --> 01:39:45 [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah, so it's ironic that Vanessa, she gets pierced in the neck by shattered glass from... Not the neck.
01:39:45 --> 01:39:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sorry.
01:39:46 --> 01:39:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sorry, the temple.
01:39:47 --> 01:39:48 [SPEAKER_01]: You're right, the temple.
01:39:48 --> 01:39:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:39:49 --> 01:39:51 [SPEAKER_01]: From this physics, New York.
01:39:52 --> 01:40:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And also, Fisk is the one who actually shattered the glass thinking he was protecting her, but ended up actually causing the injury that caused her to go down.
01:40:02 --> 01:40:07 [SPEAKER_01]: So just ironic, he, of course, he didn't want her to show up.
01:40:07 --> 01:40:09 [SPEAKER_01]: She showed up to support him.
01:40:11 --> 01:40:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, question is, do we think she's, do we think she's dead?
01:40:14 --> 01:40:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's yeah, that was going to be my question.
01:40:17 --> 01:40:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I kind of hope not to be honest, but I can see the, from a storytelling perspective, they want to like have Fisk be more unhinged, but I don't know, I think I'd be kind of frustrated if she was.
01:40:30 --> 01:40:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I really don't want I let Zure to leave the show.
01:40:34 --> 01:40:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I think she's such a key part of that dynamic and Fisk becomes less interesting without her.
01:40:39 --> 01:40:40 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
01:40:40 --> 01:40:40 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
01:40:40 --> 01:40:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Fisk is much less interesting character that when I said, also props to the costume department because that dress is amazing.
01:40:48 --> 01:40:51 [SPEAKER_02]: The dress she's wearing to the fight is amazing.
01:40:51 --> 01:40:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Mmm, especially for that final shot.
01:40:53 --> 01:40:53 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
01:40:53 --> 01:40:54 [SPEAKER_04]: Especially for that final shot.
01:40:55 --> 01:40:55 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think she's dead.
01:40:56 --> 01:40:57 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think she's dead.
01:40:57 --> 01:41:09 [SPEAKER_04]: I think she's, yeah, remains to be seen in what state that she's in, that he's keeping her alive.
01:41:09 --> 01:41:13 [SPEAKER_04]: I think she's a constant presence in his life, whether he knows that.
01:41:14 --> 01:41:21 [SPEAKER_04]: Breathing, you know, like walking around and talking or whether she's, you know, laid up with machines.
01:41:22 --> 01:41:24 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I don't, I just don't think she's dead.
01:41:26 --> 01:41:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Can I tell you my fan fiction on the other side of what happens here?
01:41:30 --> 01:41:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so she, she did get a gunshot wound in, uh, in Bullseye.
01:41:37 --> 01:41:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:41:37 --> 01:41:45 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we see the end, Matt just like takes Bullseye out of there and they both run away in the same direction, but he's got a gunshot wound obviously.
01:41:45 --> 01:41:55 [SPEAKER_01]: So my fan fiction is that Rosario Dawson shows up as night nurse and Matt takes Bullseye there to get his gunshot wound treated.
01:41:55 --> 01:41:58 [SPEAKER_01]: episode five opening, let's go.
01:42:00 --> 01:42:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be mad.
01:42:01 --> 01:42:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't be mad.
01:42:02 --> 01:42:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't be mad.
01:42:02 --> 01:42:03 [SPEAKER_04]: I wouldn't be mad.
01:42:03 --> 01:42:06 [SPEAKER_04]: I wouldn't be mad at it.
01:42:06 --> 01:42:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, Rosario doesn't was one of the best part of the, like, the, she was the connecting thread through the beginning of that whole defenders.
01:42:13 --> 01:42:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, absolutely.
01:42:14 --> 01:42:15 [SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
01:42:15 --> 01:42:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
01:42:15 --> 01:42:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I, I, yeah, I kind of tried and pretend that that version of the defenders didn't happen because
01:42:22 --> 01:42:34 [SPEAKER_02]: We're getting a new version of it, so, you know.
01:42:34 --> 01:42:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's price.
01:42:38 --> 01:42:52 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm probably taking another swing out of it, because, whoa, fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff
01:42:52 --> 01:42:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, we got an excited look from Luke.
01:43:00 --> 01:43:16 [SPEAKER_01]: We will, if you want to check out, you don't want to hear that stuff, then we will be back at the end of this season to talk about episodes four through eight together and then again, a week after that to talk about the connoisseur special presentation, what else is going on?
01:43:16 --> 01:43:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Luke, what's going on with, it could be said.
01:43:18 --> 01:43:23 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure what's going on with it could be sad at the moment because unfortunately one of my co-hosts
01:43:23 --> 01:43:26 [SPEAKER_02]: Simon Alvee is not well at the moment.
01:43:26 --> 01:43:28 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, sorry to hear that.
01:43:28 --> 01:43:30 [SPEAKER_02]: We haven't been able to record for a little while.
01:43:30 --> 01:43:32 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, man.
01:43:32 --> 01:43:36 [SPEAKER_02]: So hopefully he's feeling better, hopefully he's feeling better soon.
01:43:36 --> 01:43:39 [SPEAKER_02]: So we'll just have to, we'll just have to see how that goes.
01:43:39 --> 01:43:48 [SPEAKER_02]: But if anybody is waiting for the next episode of it, could be said, sorry, bear with us, but we, me and well took the exact decision.
01:43:49 --> 01:43:50 [SPEAKER_02]: We'd rather wait until it was all three of us.
01:43:51 --> 01:43:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
01:43:51 --> 01:43:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, so for anyone who wants to catch up on your back catalogue, do you want to tell people what it could be said?
01:43:58 --> 01:44:09 [SPEAKER_02]: So, it could be said is myself and two friends from university will cooling, who, by the way, is a really good follow-up, actually both well and so I'm in a really good part of that blue sky.
01:44:10 --> 01:44:16 [SPEAKER_02]: So, as myself will cooling in the guy called Simon Alve, we talk all things, British politics,
01:44:16 --> 01:44:27 [SPEAKER_02]: international politics, sport, and increasingly actually, increasingly actually culture, although it's really weird because we all have very different cultural spaces.
01:44:27 --> 01:44:36 [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm just talking about our gallery, so I'm talking about Marvel, so it's a very culture thing to make.
01:44:37 --> 01:44:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:44:40 --> 01:44:43 [SPEAKER_01]: And John, what do we have going on in the lower-hounds, baby feed?
01:44:43 --> 01:44:47 [SPEAKER_04]: Um, so the pit is ongoing, um, oh, so good.
01:44:48 --> 01:44:49 [SPEAKER_01]: So good.
01:44:49 --> 01:44:50 [SPEAKER_01]: There's only one more week left.
01:44:50 --> 01:44:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I won't.
01:44:51 --> 01:44:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but I know I know on the calendar.
01:44:53 --> 01:44:56 [SPEAKER_01]: I know there's only one more week left after just John.
01:44:56 --> 01:45:00 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what you know this, but the first season only just released in the UK.
01:45:00 --> 01:45:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wow.
01:45:02 --> 01:45:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wow.
01:45:02 --> 01:45:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I've got many streaming service in the UK.
01:45:05 --> 01:45:07 [SPEAKER_02]: So they saved season long to just release it.
01:45:07 --> 01:45:09 [SPEAKER_02]: So I've been bingeing.
01:45:09 --> 01:45:10 [SPEAKER_04]: That's amazing.
01:45:10 --> 01:45:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Like a maniac.
01:45:12 --> 01:45:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Well, John and David are covering it.
01:45:15 --> 01:45:18 [SPEAKER_04]: So that's good listening and good viewing.
01:45:19 --> 01:45:22 [SPEAKER_04]: We also have more shadow lord.
01:45:23 --> 01:45:29 [SPEAKER_04]: John, myself and David recorded, you should be able to find that about the first two episodes.
01:45:30 --> 01:45:33 [SPEAKER_04]: And there'll be ongoing coverage with that going forward.
01:45:33 --> 01:45:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they decide they're going to do weekly.
01:45:35 --> 01:45:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:45:35 --> 01:45:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:45:36 --> 01:45:38 [SPEAKER_04]: So you're going to be in for this in that as well.
01:45:38 --> 01:45:41 [SPEAKER_04]: Thank you for the Lord the Lord drops that you gave.
01:45:41 --> 01:45:42 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, which were awesome.
01:45:43 --> 01:45:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I'm just going to be doing more log drops.
01:45:46 --> 01:45:47 [SPEAKER_04]: one piece.
01:45:48 --> 01:46:06 [SPEAKER_01]: We had no the whole, so one piece season two is out and John and I released a while ago, like a month ago, the first, an episode covering the first three episodes of season two, and now we're scheduling this week, we're going to wrap up season two.
01:46:06 --> 01:46:13 [SPEAKER_01]: So watch out for that, come out and at least then I just released the day before we recorded this, the drama.
01:46:13 --> 01:46:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So about the new movie with Robert Pattinson and Zendaya, I love it.
01:46:18 --> 01:46:22 [SPEAKER_04]: And you did also have like, I'm like, no.
01:46:23 --> 01:46:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
01:46:23 --> 01:46:25 [SPEAKER_01]: You did have a family with friends and playing him.
01:46:25 --> 01:46:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:46:27 --> 01:46:27 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
01:46:27 --> 01:46:33 [SPEAKER_04]: So that's, that's, I haven't seen either the drama or the new family yet, but I plan on doing doing so.
01:46:34 --> 01:46:34 [SPEAKER_04]: maybe not the draw.
01:46:34 --> 01:46:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:46:36 --> 01:46:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Really?
01:46:37 --> 01:46:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:46:38 --> 01:46:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:46:40 --> 01:46:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I recommend it.
01:46:40 --> 01:46:41 [SPEAKER_01]: I recommend it.
01:46:41 --> 01:46:42 [SPEAKER_01]: But it is one.
01:46:42 --> 01:46:45 [SPEAKER_01]: It's, I mean, okay, I recommend it with caution.
01:46:45 --> 01:46:56 [SPEAKER_01]: It is a very dark comedy that is about complex moral boundaries and some people are disgusted by the nature of the humor.
01:46:56 --> 01:46:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:46:57 --> 01:47:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, not in like a vulgar way, but in like a how dare you make jokes about something so serious.
01:47:05 --> 01:47:05 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
01:47:06 --> 01:47:07 [SPEAKER_01]: But I I loved it.
01:47:07 --> 01:47:12 [SPEAKER_01]: It's one of it's definitely that in the bone temple or my two favorite films of the year so far.
01:47:12 --> 01:47:12 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh wow.
01:47:13 --> 01:47:15 [SPEAKER_01]: With a project tell marrying third place.
01:47:16 --> 01:47:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Which is a common one to project.
01:47:18 --> 01:47:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Hail Mary, just to make that clear.
01:47:21 --> 01:47:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and so supercast and patreon subscribers.
01:47:23 --> 01:47:26 [SPEAKER_01]: You always have ad free access to all of these.
01:47:26 --> 01:47:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And also extra episodes.
01:47:28 --> 01:47:34 [SPEAKER_01]: We just closed the Rob Reiner Requiem.
01:47:34 --> 01:47:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it says probably when Harry Metcelli here, it was not.
01:47:39 --> 01:47:40 [SPEAKER_05]: And good news.
01:47:40 --> 01:47:43 [SPEAKER_01]: We had a tie that I said at the end of the drama.
01:47:43 --> 01:47:46 [SPEAKER_01]: We had a tie between when Harry Metcelli and Missouri.
01:47:47 --> 01:47:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And there were three last-minute votes that came in.
01:47:49 --> 01:47:50 [SPEAKER_04]: Hello.
01:47:50 --> 01:47:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Two, one for when Harry Metcelli and two for Missouri.
01:47:55 --> 01:47:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So, Missouri.
01:47:56 --> 01:47:57 [SPEAKER_01]: One, two, one.
01:47:57 --> 01:47:58 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I'm sorry.
01:47:58 --> 01:48:00 [SPEAKER_02]: If it's got a few good men, then it's the wrong result.
01:48:01 --> 01:48:01 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry.
01:48:01 --> 01:48:03 [SPEAKER_01]: That wasn't even put up for the vote.
01:48:03 --> 01:48:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It was on the selection list, but none of them was there's it.
01:48:08 --> 01:48:12 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not why you don't like when Harry Metzallie would you be with that when Harry Metzallie?
01:48:13 --> 01:48:14 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, not really.
01:48:15 --> 01:48:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
01:48:15 --> 01:48:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, misery one.
01:48:17 --> 01:48:19 [SPEAKER_04]: I thought Boomerang is a better movie.
01:48:21 --> 01:48:26 [SPEAKER_04]: So give me boomerang over Erica Harry Medcelli any day of the week actually.
01:48:26 --> 01:48:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's it's misery.
01:48:28 --> 01:48:44 [SPEAKER_01]: So Stephen King year continues Yes So in the show notes you'll find links to it could be said you'll find a link tree with with links to all the other feeds including the affiliate feeds like
01:48:44 --> 01:48:54 [SPEAKER_01]: properly Howard, they're doing their newly wood season, where they're each watching films that the other hasn't other hasn't seen, radioactive ramlings, covering both invincible and the boys right now.
01:48:54 --> 01:49:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm really surprised at Amazon released those two shows at the same time, like that seems like, why would you do that?
01:49:01 --> 01:49:05 [SPEAKER_01]: They are like the same show, and they have the same audience.
01:49:05 --> 01:49:07 [SPEAKER_04]: It's crazy, it's crazy.
01:49:07 --> 01:49:09 [SPEAKER_04]: But they're crazy good season, though.
01:49:10 --> 01:49:12 [SPEAKER_01]: OK, I haven't started either of them.
01:49:12 --> 01:49:16 [SPEAKER_04]: the first episode of the boys were, yeah.
01:49:17 --> 01:49:20 [SPEAKER_04]: All right, I think they're, yeah, definitely.
01:49:20 --> 01:49:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And we have the Gen B crew there, too, because that's not yet.
01:49:24 --> 01:49:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm more passionate than Gen B's characters now than the boy's characters.
01:49:29 --> 01:49:30 [SPEAKER_04]: They're supposed to show up.
01:49:30 --> 01:49:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that's.
01:49:31 --> 01:49:35 [SPEAKER_04]: But these first two episodes were really, really good.
01:49:35 --> 01:49:36 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, all right.
01:49:36 --> 01:49:39 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to watch it with in the next couple of days.
01:49:39 --> 01:49:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Definitely, I'm going to be watching it on live.
01:49:41 --> 01:49:42 [SPEAKER_01]: And I have to catch up on invincible, too.
01:49:42 --> 01:49:44 [SPEAKER_01]: But I still have to catch up on fallout.
01:49:44 --> 01:49:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have so much to have so far, yeah, and of course never mind the music where music meets psychology I think the last episode they released was about Fleetwood Mac and grieving.
01:49:57 --> 01:50:11 [SPEAKER_01]: So definitely recommend that So you find all those links in the show notes and we have to do our guess what I have some music It's from the epic folder and in honor of Wilson Fisk.
01:50:11 --> 01:50:12 [SPEAKER_01]: It's called bully
01:50:15 --> 01:50:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you to our Discord server boosters, Erin Kay, Tiller the Thriller doves 71, Athena Agilella, Lestu Nensium, Ghost of Partition, Radioactive Richard and Adrienne.
01:50:27 --> 01:50:36 [SPEAKER_01]: And we thanks to our kind Discord server boosters, you can also get a Laura Hound's Discord tag, so playing yours if you are interested.
01:50:36 --> 01:50:55 [SPEAKER_01]: thank you to all of the listeners who are listening now if you enjoy this please share it with anyone else you think would enjoy this content and we would be forever great cool few left kind ratings and reviews wherever you are listening that helps us enormously thank you most of all to our subscribers especially the highest tier the lore masters
01:50:55 --> 01:51:00 [SPEAKER_01]: The Martian Michael G. Michelle E. S. C. Peter O. H. Nancy M. Du.
01:51:00 --> 01:51:00 [SPEAKER_01]: 71.
01:51:00 --> 01:51:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Brian 863.
01:51:01 --> 01:51:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Frederick H. Sarah L. Garrett C. Andrew B. Kwangu.
01:51:05 --> 01:51:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Nathan T. Sub-Zero.
01:51:07 --> 01:51:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Aaron K. Dally B. Mothership-61.
01:51:09 --> 01:51:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Narles.
01:51:10 --> 01:51:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Cathy, W Listoo, Jeffrey Beal, Lisa U, Ben V, Scott F. Steven N. Julia F. Calli S, Umariel, Rocky Sim, Jessica A, Red Sippy, the TCS, Dope Mini, LNR, Mrs. Tenet, AC Wilson, E-Light W, Cassie K, Chummerney, Katia, Josh Lue, Hington, Phoenix, Gory G, Quinch, Jenny L, and always last, Adrienne.
01:51:41 --> 01:52:07 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, stick around if you want to hear some spoiler talk about season 3.
01:52:11 --> 01:52:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, you're still here.
01:52:16 --> 01:52:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, this is this boiler warning.
01:52:17 --> 01:52:22 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to talk about things from the marketing of the rest of the season and next season.
01:52:22 --> 01:52:27 [SPEAKER_01]: And other things, for example, I tease this.
01:52:27 --> 01:52:27 [SPEAKER_01]: So let's start here.
01:52:28 --> 01:52:32 [SPEAKER_01]: We saw in the Spider-Man brand new day trailer.
01:52:32 --> 01:52:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Sheila Riviera, the, who was like the campaign manager for Fisk, who we said was having moral boundaries.
01:52:41 --> 01:52:45 [SPEAKER_01]: She appears to be acting as mayor of the city in the Spider-Man trailer.
01:52:45 --> 01:52:48 [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe, yeah.
01:52:48 --> 01:52:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, does that mean, yeah, Fisk is going to be going.
01:52:51 --> 01:52:52 [SPEAKER_01]: She's going to take over.
01:52:52 --> 01:52:56 [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe, yeah, maybe.
01:52:58 --> 01:53:09 [SPEAKER_01]: So just putting it out there on the more immediate side the thing that Luke was doing happy dance about is we know Kristen Ritter, AKA Jessica Jones is showing up next week.
01:53:09 --> 01:53:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And apparently she's a mom now.
01:53:12 --> 01:53:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Jean, do we think that we know who the baby's daddy is?
01:53:15 --> 01:53:22 [SPEAKER_04]: I'd be the better be Luke and they better make sure that he's a present father because he is, okay?
01:53:23 --> 01:53:25 [SPEAKER_04]: That's not what I don't want to do.
01:53:25 --> 01:53:26 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
01:53:26 --> 01:53:29 [SPEAKER_04]: Those two things have to happen.
01:53:29 --> 01:53:30 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
01:53:30 --> 01:53:34 [SPEAKER_04]: It better be Luke and he better be involved in that baby's life.
01:53:34 --> 01:53:44 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't want to hear anything else because if it's not those two things, then we have problems
01:53:45 --> 01:53:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the good news is that we have confirmed that Mike Colter and Finn Jones are going to be in season three.
01:53:56 --> 01:53:57 [SPEAKER_01]: There is a photo.
01:53:58 --> 01:54:02 [SPEAKER_01]: I wrote in the the chat about this like they're given these.
01:54:02 --> 01:54:08 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, robes with hoods to try to hide their faces for to prevent leaks like this allegedly.
01:54:09 --> 01:54:10 [SPEAKER_01]: We have my culture.
01:54:10 --> 01:54:15 [SPEAKER_01]: He's really trying like he's like looking down and pulling his hood forward and stuff.
01:54:15 --> 01:54:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Finn Jones is just like looking straight in the camera like, hey, does this put in free my face nicely?
01:54:23 --> 01:54:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm back.
01:54:24 --> 01:54:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Did either of you watch Bay to the new show with Riz Ahmed?
01:54:27 --> 01:54:29 [SPEAKER_04]: Not yet, not yet, but I have no intention.
01:54:29 --> 01:54:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'll just say this is just a beginning of episode one thing where he's auditioning to play James Bond and then he finds out that the paparazzi is waiting out a particular door and he's like, oh, maybe it'll help me actually if they catch me.
01:54:45 --> 01:54:47 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, Finn Jones is pulling back.
01:54:47 --> 01:54:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
01:54:48 --> 01:54:55 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I mean, Finn Jones, good actor, good as Laura's tie-rail.
01:54:56 --> 01:54:59 [SPEAKER_02]: just hopelessly miscasts done in your own.
01:54:59 --> 01:55:00 [SPEAKER_02]: Just...
01:55:00 --> 01:55:01 [SPEAKER_01]: He wants a second chance.
01:55:02 --> 01:55:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, so I infaced walls like...
01:55:05 --> 01:55:06 [SPEAKER_01]: The writing was bad, though.
01:55:06 --> 01:55:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the writing was the worst part.
01:55:08 --> 01:55:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And he was not fully committed.
01:55:09 --> 01:55:10 [SPEAKER_01]: He did not do the training.
01:55:10 --> 01:55:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because that is my problem.
01:55:13 --> 01:55:14 [SPEAKER_02]: That is my biggest problem.
01:55:14 --> 01:55:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Very infist.
01:55:15 --> 01:55:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, I've seen Tracy as the move.
01:55:17 --> 01:55:20 [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, as fast the pace than that, shall we?
01:55:20 --> 01:55:49 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and be like the the amount of camera trickery that were having to think about weird angles and fight scenes because like I'm sorry if you're going to if you're going to play a superhero you've have to nail the combat like not not to say what I mean shall I laugh about this what one of the reasons why I watched these shows is I'd like the fight career of the
01:55:49 --> 01:55:55 [SPEAKER_02]: for whatever reason, like it just looked bizarre.
01:55:55 --> 01:55:59 [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I'm I've been a noted Finn Jones hater.
01:56:02 --> 01:56:12 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm and let's see if the MCU machine, the Marvel entertainment machine can make a better
01:56:13 --> 01:56:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I do want to know I am going to be annoyed if they don't explain where Colleen Wing is and I know she's busy, she's in silo now.
01:56:24 --> 01:56:38 [SPEAKER_01]: So maybe there was some, you know, she wasn't prepared, she wasn't ready to film, but I just come on, bring back Colleen Wing.
01:56:38 --> 01:56:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, but especially Colleen, she was Iron Fist, yeah.
01:56:41 --> 01:56:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's the thing, she ended up as Iron Fist.
01:56:44 --> 01:56:48 [SPEAKER_02]: And she was, she was the, I'm sorry, but she was the only good thing in that show.
01:56:50 --> 01:56:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, that's fair, that's fair.
01:56:52 --> 01:57:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And I do blame the writing most of all in Finn, Jones, second of all, but he says he wants a second chance and he's trying harder and everything.
01:57:02 --> 01:57:06 [SPEAKER_01]: He's learned from his youthful mistakes or whatever.
01:57:06 --> 01:57:08 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm willing to give him a second chance.
01:57:08 --> 01:57:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Mostly, I would say, and I think this is a credit to the showrunners understanding this.
01:57:14 --> 01:57:22 [SPEAKER_01]: For me, the best part with him in the show wasn't even, I didn't even think he had chemistry with Colleen Wing.
01:57:22 --> 01:57:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought she was just better than him, but he did have chemistry with Mike Colter's Luke Cage and the page and Iron Fist or thing in the comics, so I'm glad they're bringing them back together.
01:57:34 --> 01:57:35 [SPEAKER_04]: I can agree with that.
01:57:35 --> 01:57:36 [SPEAKER_04]: I can agree with that.
01:57:37 --> 01:57:38 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
01:57:38 --> 01:57:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, well, let's hope it all pans out, but I really thought this would be an opportunity to get really cast because I could say I'm not being against Finn Jones.
01:57:46 --> 01:57:49 [SPEAKER_02]: I thought he was really quite good, just a lot of retirement.
01:57:50 --> 01:57:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, game in front of us, but he was just now, sometimes we're just a thing where the actor and the part just don't.
01:57:58 --> 01:57:58 [SPEAKER_01]: mesh.
01:57:59 --> 01:58:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Danny Rand is supposed to be a spoiled white dude.
01:58:05 --> 01:58:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, which is a problematic thing about like the whole white savior aspect of it in first place.
01:58:11 --> 01:58:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so I hope storytelling wise they lean away from that.
01:58:14 --> 01:58:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And that was why my favorite part of Iron Fist was at ending, not just because it was over.
01:58:22 --> 01:58:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Because Colleen Wing became the Iron Fist and that made a
01:58:27 --> 01:58:30 [SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely absolutely absolutely.
01:58:30 --> 01:58:33 [SPEAKER_02]: So just nothing else needs to be said next.
01:58:33 --> 01:58:41 [SPEAKER_02]: Have you a favorite part of I insist when it was so fun?
01:58:42 --> 01:58:52 [SPEAKER_01]: But you know that was and as far as Finn Jones is part obviously on the writing and show running side we're dealing with different writer showrunners yay for that.
01:58:52 --> 01:59:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but it was also what it was eight years ago that it ended and I think it's possible that he did mature in that time and become more dedicated to his craft and learned from Yeah, because wasn't wasn't the story that he wasn't basically showing up and he wasn't there in the rehearsals Yeah, he wasn't doing the fight practice He wasn't doing the fight practices
01:59:15 --> 01:59:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
01:59:16 --> 01:59:20 [SPEAKER_01]: So hopefully you got over the, like, if it were me.
01:59:21 --> 01:59:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and that I would be, you know, I'll be like, can I please?
01:59:25 --> 01:59:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, have the free flight training.
01:59:27 --> 01:59:27 [SPEAKER_01]: That sounds great.
01:59:27 --> 01:59:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
01:59:29 --> 01:59:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
01:59:31 --> 01:59:54 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, I don't know like you want to teach me to play the flute I'm I'm gonna freaking learn for the parts and because you're gonna make free lessons, you know Yeah, I mean it wasn't it was it was it wasn't all this fault like like you said Alicia the writing was bad Yeah We've had a complaint we've had people complaining about silo being slow pay you stand It's like now I will show you slow Stop it.
01:59:54 --> 02:00:01 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm show you why in fist like there are entire episodes
02:00:02 --> 02:00:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Nothing happened.
02:00:04 --> 02:00:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I'll say that it was created.
02:00:07 --> 02:00:24 [SPEAKER_01]: The show was created by Scott Buck, and it was, he was a showrunner, and Scott Buck is, he had some, he was known, he was brought in to make things happen more quickly, and basically to cut corners financially for the studio.
02:00:24 --> 02:00:32 [SPEAKER_01]: And he had some successes with that, where, you know,
02:00:32 --> 02:00:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but he kind of, he, at the same time as the iron fist was also doing the same with an even more notorious flop, perhaps in humans.
02:00:44 --> 02:00:45 [SPEAKER_01]: That was also Scott Buck.
02:00:46 --> 02:00:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:00:46 --> 02:00:50 [SPEAKER_01]: So that kind of, I think that kind of killed his career to be honest.
02:00:50 --> 02:00:51 [SPEAKER_04]: I think so.
02:00:51 --> 02:00:54 [SPEAKER_04]: That double whammy was.
02:00:54 --> 02:00:55 [SPEAKER_04]: Pretty bad rough.
02:00:56 --> 02:00:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, pretty bad.
02:00:58 --> 02:01:00 [SPEAKER_01]: And and I hope that studio.
02:01:00 --> 02:01:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I would say I hope this studio is learned not to cut corners, but then we get a secret invasion.
02:01:06 --> 02:01:16 [SPEAKER_02]: But anyway, we don't
02:01:17 --> 02:01:18 [SPEAKER_01]: that there might be a spin-off?
02:01:18 --> 02:01:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
02:01:19 --> 02:01:26 [SPEAKER_01]: I could see them doing at least a special presentation, but I could also see them just being like, let's keep the characters confined to this show.
02:01:26 --> 02:01:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
02:01:27 --> 02:01:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Although, I don't know.
02:01:28 --> 02:01:33 [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, but you know, the elephant in the room is doomsday and secret ones.
02:01:33 --> 02:01:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
02:01:34 --> 02:01:34 [SPEAKER_04]: And what happens?
02:01:35 --> 02:01:36 [SPEAKER_04]: Post that.
02:01:36 --> 02:01:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, because the thing that kind of worries me about Dhamster is the sheer volume of characters like I'm trying to pack into that.
02:01:46 --> 02:01:49 [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't think they need yet more characters.
02:01:49 --> 02:01:53 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they're going to, I don't think they'll bring these characters in for Dhamster.
02:01:53 --> 02:01:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I think they'll have to face secret wars and they're going to have to first kill off a bunch of characters to use today.
02:01:58 --> 02:02:06 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I think that's the thing, you know, we might get a special presentation of these characters.
02:02:05 --> 02:02:18 [SPEAKER_04]: This year or next year or whatever, but after secret war, the Marvel universe is going to, the MCU is going to, you don't reset, reset.
02:02:19 --> 02:02:31 [SPEAKER_04]: And I can't foresee many of these characters in the actors who are portraying, I can't foresee the actors portraying these characters all
02:02:31 --> 02:02:38 [SPEAKER_01]: No, especially anyone who's not a mutant, I think it has an ex on their back.
02:02:39 --> 02:02:59 [SPEAKER_04]: So we might have two years to get the actors who are playing these characters to be in some sort of series or TV show or whatever, because most secret wars into the mutant saga, they won't
02:03:00 --> 02:03:06 [SPEAKER_04]: So there's a finite time for storytelling involved in these characters, which is why they better do it right.
02:03:07 --> 02:03:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so we're getting, I mean, I don't, yeah.
02:03:11 --> 02:03:13 [SPEAKER_01]: So we're getting secret wars.
02:03:14 --> 02:03:15 [SPEAKER_04]: They could give us that else worlds, right?
02:03:16 --> 02:03:16 [SPEAKER_04]: I'm sorry.
02:03:16 --> 02:03:19 [SPEAKER_04]: They could give us that else worlds with these characters still there.
02:03:19 --> 02:03:21 [SPEAKER_04]: That's the only way I could see that happening.
02:03:22 --> 02:03:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't know because I don't know that they want to like spin it off and make it awkward again, like they did in the first place.
02:03:29 --> 02:03:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, these Netflix shows existed in that gray area of canonacity.
02:03:33 --> 02:03:40 [SPEAKER_04]: But those necks, the Netflix shows existed in the world that the MCU existed in.
02:03:40 --> 02:03:43 [SPEAKER_04]: They just, they was a fully acknowledged character.
02:03:44 --> 02:03:45 [SPEAKER_04]: No, they managed it.
02:03:45 --> 02:03:52 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I mean, but they weren't even allowed to say in the Netflix shows, they weren't allowed to say Hulk, for instance, they'd have to say the big green guy.
02:03:52 --> 02:03:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The big green guy, yeah.
02:03:53 --> 02:03:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, talk about the things.
02:03:54 --> 02:03:56 [SPEAKER_04]: But we knew, but that's what I'm saying.
02:03:56 --> 02:03:58 [SPEAKER_04]: They were firmly in the universe.
02:03:58 --> 02:04:02 [SPEAKER_04]: They weren't using the names, but they were in universe.
02:04:02 --> 02:04:06 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, from there, it's the same thing with agents of shield from the show's perspective.
02:04:06 --> 02:04:07 [SPEAKER_01]: They were in the universe.
02:04:07 --> 02:04:08 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what I mean.
02:04:08 --> 02:04:08 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what I mean.
02:04:08 --> 02:04:13 [SPEAKER_01]: From five geese perspective and movies perspective, it was just ignoring them.
02:04:15 --> 02:04:15 [SPEAKER_01]: What?
02:04:15 --> 02:04:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So, in a way, I mean, we're lucky we got them back at all.
02:04:18 --> 02:04:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
02:04:18 --> 02:04:20 [SPEAKER_01]: We know we're definitely getting season three.
02:04:21 --> 02:04:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It's obviously we just talked about it's being filmed right now.
02:04:25 --> 02:04:31 [SPEAKER_01]: The question is, you know, because, okay, so that will presumably come out next year.
02:04:31 --> 02:04:33 [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't think they'll be in Doomsday.
02:04:33 --> 02:04:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they're going to be aware of Doomsday, but I think they're going to have to be, I think everyone's going to have to be in secret wars, like you can't ignore what's going on there.
02:04:45 --> 02:04:48 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's the question is that it's season three the end for this show.
02:04:49 --> 02:04:51 [SPEAKER_04]: I think they will have to be aware of Doomsday though.
02:04:52 --> 02:05:08 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, after the fact, maybe, wow, yeah, season three is coming out after Doomsday, but then that's the question is like, so Punisher, obviously firmly in this world, going to be showing up in the Spider-Man thing, Spider-Man has to be involved in Doomsday.
02:05:08 --> 02:05:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I mean, Mark Murdoch shows up in the Spider-Man films as well, not for me at all, but it is there.
02:05:13 --> 02:05:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah.
02:05:14 --> 02:05:21 [SPEAKER_04]: I think they have, I think season three has to be a reaction to Doomsday.
02:05:21 --> 02:05:25 [SPEAKER_04]: And how these characters are dealing with that?
02:05:26 --> 02:05:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe that would be a reason for the gang to get back together in terms of the funders.
02:05:32 --> 02:05:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, obviously Jessica is showing up now.
02:05:35 --> 02:05:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's what I'm raising.
02:05:37 --> 02:05:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:05:37 --> 02:05:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:05:37 --> 02:05:37 [SPEAKER_04]: Who knows?
02:05:38 --> 02:05:38 [SPEAKER_04]: Who knows?
02:05:38 --> 02:05:39 [SPEAKER_04]: Who knows?
02:05:39 --> 02:05:40 [SPEAKER_04]: Who knows?
02:05:41 --> 02:05:42 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't wait.
02:05:42 --> 02:05:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't wait to find out this.
02:05:44 --> 02:05:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:05:45 --> 02:05:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:05:46 --> 02:05:49 [SPEAKER_01]: What the deal is with Jessica is going to be and what she's bringing to the story.
02:05:50 --> 02:05:55 [SPEAKER_04]: Look, I'm all in for Danielle Cage to be canon and more of a universe.
02:05:55 --> 02:05:55 [SPEAKER_04]: Let's go.
02:05:57 --> 02:05:59 [SPEAKER_02]: All right, should we call it time there, guys?
02:05:59 --> 02:06:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Yep, there we go.
02:06:00 --> 02:06:07 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, well, we will see you again, or you will hear from us again after the end of the season.
02:06:07 --> 02:06:10 [SPEAKER_01]: So watch out for that and then the Punisher, one week later.
02:06:10 --> 02:06:14 [SPEAKER_04]: But I did reserve the right to call an emergency pod in case.
02:06:16 --> 02:06:16 [SPEAKER_04]: It's neat.
02:06:17 --> 02:06:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, yes, that's fair.
02:06:18 --> 02:06:19 [SPEAKER_01]: That's fair.
02:06:19 --> 02:06:21 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you have a message to send us out?
02:06:22 --> 02:06:22 [SPEAKER_04]: Sure.
02:06:22 --> 02:06:45 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no
02:06:46 --> 02:06:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, like I said, I said at the beginning, I don't say anything happens to Karen.
02:06:53 --> 02:06:54 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm coming for you, Kevin.
02:06:54 --> 02:06:58 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm coming for you.
02:06:58 --> 02:07:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Bye, sleep well.