Oscars 2025 – About that ceremony...

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[00:01:40] Welcome to the Lorehounds. Alicia and David here with a quick reaction to this weekend's Oscars. And yeah, there's no intro, no outro. We're just getting to the core. David, what did you think of the ceremony overall? And we'll talk about the Hulu issue in a sec.

[00:02:39] Well, I had a big Hulu issue, so that'll certainly, I have some things to say. It took me an hour to actually get a workaround to get into watching it, so we missed the whole thing. My family and I, we sat down, we were going to have dinner Sunday night. Our daughter was really interested because of the Aria Grande stuff and everything. And Blackpink. And Blackpink.

[00:03:02] And yeah, Lisa and all of that. And an hour later, we finally got to watch the show. And from there on in, it was pretty good. And then this morning, I hopped back onto the YouTubes and watched a few of the clips from the ceremony, specifically Conan's intro. Mm-hmm.

[00:03:56] So that they start earlier in LA, but then that just gives them more time to not worry. Party after or... What's that? Oh, to not worry. Yes, I get you to say. I said party after. Yeah, well, and that too. It gives them more time to party after.

[00:04:13] So, and I'm sure for a lot of logistics too, just having the daylight hours and that kind of stuff makes it a little bit easier. So yeah, I just felt like it was a... It felt, you know, given all the topsy-turviness that's been going on, all the things that are happening in the world, not to mention the devastating fires and the impact that it's had on so many people in that region, the fact that they were able to pull it together and it was a good watch. It was a good hang.

[00:05:09] Mm-hmm. I had a chat with my mom throughout it. So yeah, that was a lot of fun. Just watching. I think it was a good, fun ceremony. And I think that it paid just the right amount of tipping the hat to bigger issues in the world, but also with like, you know, let's just, you know, let loose a little bit tonight and take this victory lap for these films.

[00:05:36] Yeah. And that's something that I've been wrestling with too, for us as podcasters and podcasting about popular culture and, you know, things that are concurrently on TV. And obviously we deep dig back into different things time and again, but how do we approach that? And how do we, how do we balance that when there are some extremely serious things that are affecting us as a country, as individuals, as a world?

[00:06:05] Mm-hmm.

[00:06:36] But the idea that we could take a couple of hours out of our day and do something communally, have a monocultural event, be it the Super Bowl, the World Cup, Oscar ceremony. Yeah.

[00:06:51] And, and, and come together and entertainment is an important part of the human experience. It always has been from painting on cave walls to, you know, making, you know, multimillion dollar movies. And so I too felt that it was balanced nicely. The humor wasn't crass. It was never crass. It was, you know, some of the jokes played better than others.

[00:07:17] And there was a lot of the jokes. And there was a lot of fun. And there was a lot of fun.

[00:07:38] And there was a lot of fun. And then within community. And then within community, we can recharge ourselves so that when we're dealing with all of these other difficult things in the world, we have a little grace. We have a little humor. We have a little bit of courage because we know other people have courage as well. So I thought that it was, like you said, finely balanced. And I really appreciate that the humor was never crass and it was fun and it was lighthearted and they had a good time poking fun.

[00:08:06] And everybody who got fun poked at them was into it and it was cool. And because the jokes were never harsh. Right. Right. Yeah. I mean, credit to Conan O'Brien, who it's I knew he would weave that line well that he has a level of taste where he's like, I'm not going to pull my punches. But he also understands how to you can poke fun without going too far. Yeah. He knows where the line is.

[00:08:31] Exactly. Exactly. Is he your guide? Was he of your your generate? Did you follow him generationally? Yeah. I mean, definitely. From, you know, before he joined the Tonight Show, especially I yeah, I was I was a fan of his late night show for sure. Yeah, I'm definitely a Conan fan. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. He was just after me for when I would have watched him.

[00:08:57] So like I was aware of him and I interacted with some of his stuff, but I was never he wasn't my guy. Like Letterman was my guy. Carson was certainly there as well in my life. So but I so I've never really known him. I've never really dug into his humor or hung with him in that sort of parasocial way. And so I was a little bit like, huh, OK, how is you know, is this is this the right guy? And I think I think he's the right guy. I think he's I think they should keep him around for the next few.

[00:09:27] Yeah, I think that was that's a good and I think, you know, I just want to call back to your point that you made about about this being about monoculture events being important for bringing people together. And I think we do really need that, especially in a world that feels so, you know, divided in so many ways. Yeah, I think a highlight, an example of that was the the documentary win for No Other Land.

[00:09:55] That was one it's been winning awards all around the world, but it hasn't been able to get distribution in the US. And so a lot of people, including myself, I thought Porcelain War, which is about artists in Ukraine, would win. But it was kind of heartening, A, to see that they went ahead and voted for this, even though, you know, there's a lot of controversy in the US.

[00:10:19] And B, just the acceptance speech that the two, the Palestinian and the Israeli filmmakers gave together was considered by many a real high point. And just showing how when you, you know, I know in that conflict, one of the most successful things in the past has been daycares where the children play together.

[00:10:40] Because when you are coming together and interacting with people, when you're sharing something, even if it's something silly like film awards, it just you're talking to each other and you're realizing this other person. Yeah. Yeah. We're all human. We're all we all hope for the same things. At this base level, we are. Yeah, exactly. We love our children. And yeah.

[00:11:02] Yeah. So I think I mean, I do want to see apparently the the ratings last night were slightly down over last year. But and this, you know, we'll talk about the music in a bit, but it was up with younger groups. And, you know, you said you were watching with your daughter and she was enjoying it as well. Yeah, she was. There was a lot that went over her head. There were things that caught more, you know, certain things that caught her eye more than others.

[00:11:30] It was funny because when we were on the the Lorehounds Discord live chat and the Bond retrospective music thing came on. Mm hmm. Our daughter was interpreting. Oh, she was like, oh, that's Lisa and that's this other person. And they're all on this album together. And it's like we're looking over at our nine year old going, OK. And then I was posting that back onto the Discord chat and people were like, thank your daughter for us. Yeah, I said that. Yeah.

[00:11:58] I said she she educated me because I was because, you know, I was talking to my mom at this point about, you know, we were both like, oh, why isn't Adele singing her song? But exactly. Your daughter explained it because Ray, this UK artist, is on this album with Lisa. Which just dropped the other day, apparently. OK. All right. Well, that makes more sense. Going back to the No Other Land thing really quickly.

[00:12:24] Would you believe that the one acceptance speech that I was really, really interested in hearing? Mm hmm. That's when. Well, so, you know, to be able to watch the episode, the Oscars, I had to use something that starts with a P and or V and ends with an N. Ends with an N. Maybe there's a P in there. Yeah. Maybe there's a P in there. Maybe not. I don't know. That's the mystery letter for you. It's you got to refine it. It's mysterious, but important. And that's when it decided to burp.

[00:12:53] And like, it was so frustrating because it also felt like that moment that if there is a big conspiracy government thing, that's when they were like, did they cut the transmission? Just as the one director was turning to the other director and saying, this is my brother. And, you know, their life is, you know, is conflicted, is constricted because of these things. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Because, you know, he doesn't have the same freedoms as I do.

[00:13:20] And then, wait, did they cut the transmission? What was going on is just something, you know, in the Internet, you know, had to be reset. And it was like we were back on afterwards. But then we had missed most of the speech. So I was like, and I haven't gone back yet to go go rewatch it. Yeah, I did see that they had a clip for that on Oscars on the YouTube channel. But most of the Oscars YouTube clips are region locked to the U.S.

[00:13:47] So I might need to revisit with that mysterious V something. And you need to refine the bits. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah. So the Hulu problems, the reason why you were using that is what's interesting is this was especially bad timing for Hulu. Like, first, there was the problem at the beginning where, you know, you face that first problem.

[00:14:12] A lot of people were complaining on, like, Letterboxd and Blue Sky and stuff about this, that they just couldn't even get on in the first place. And then those who did get on at the end, they had it cut off right before the Best Actress and the final award. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, including Doug in our chat. And they just said, it was just like, thank you for watching. It's over now. Like, what?

[00:14:36] I heard something today that that might have been sort of baked into some of the code that they had set up to allow it. They said, oh, this is a three-hour performance. So we'll block this. And then when that timer ran out. You've never heard of the Oscars before. It never ends on time. Come on. Obviously. I mean, it's a live performance. Or they have, Hulu has a live streaming system. Why didn't they give it to that team? That understands a lot. I don't know. I don't know.

[00:15:05] But it was bad timing because the day before that, it was announced. So ABC's been the partner in the U.S. for airing the Academy Awards since 1976. Right. And their contract is coming up. And they had an exclusive negotiating period. And apparently they're not coming eye-to-eye on, like, licensing fees and stuff. Sure. So they had just announced before this whole snafu that they are looking around for other partners. So Hulu was like, okay.

[00:15:36] Yeah. Right? They're like, whatever. Well, I don't know. I feel like this is not – this was really bad for Hulu because who's going to rely on them right now to do a live event? Yeah, that's a good point. But then again, Netflix – Netflix is doing great with live events now. I watched SAG on Netflix. That went off without a hitch. That was perfect. But Netflix – remember their first live event? I didn't watch it, but it was like the finale of a reality show or something.

[00:16:06] No, I don't know. I remember there being like a big brouhaha that it all went wrong the first time they tried to do it. Sure. And now they've worked it out. So I was – when we were saying, oh, okay, are we going to watch the Oscars? Yeah. Okay. How are we going to watch it? Because we've had – trying to watch the Super Bowl or trying to watch anything, the Olympics. At least this year, the Olympics were a lot better accessible. But it's always been this like nightmare kind of thing. Do you sign up for this service or not? Are you supposed to blah, blah, blah.

[00:16:36] Yeah. So they were like, oh, watch it on Hulu. And we were like, okay, we have Hulu. Great. No problem. Like I'm not going to stress about it. I'm not going to pre-check anything. We have a Roku device, you know, an external device to the TV. So I flicked on the Roku. Oh, I wonder if that's what the portion of people who are affected, I wonder if it was because of that. Well, so Roku is pushing an ad saying watch live on the Roku channel. So I was like, oh, okay, why not? So I clicked that. So I clicked that.

[00:17:05] It takes me to ABC News and they're airing the show 2020, which is their news magazine show. I'm like, it's seven o'clock. Yeah. Google, like when does the Oscars start? Seven o'clock. Okay. So that doesn't, that's a bust. Right. So what's up with that? So I'm like, oh, okay, well, whatever. That's weird. I'll just go to Disney, go to my Hulu tile on Disney, go to Disney. Disney, no Oscars. There's an Oscars collection.

[00:17:34] There is, you know, of like, oh, these are the movies that we have that are best, you know, or that are nominated. Go to Hulu, nothing on the tile that says anything about Oscars. So I'm like, okay, that's weird. So, well, let me bounce out. Let me go to the Hulu standalone app. Oh, you got to use your Disney, my Disney password, right? Because it's all unified now. Okay. Here's my password. You know, here's my user login. Here's my password. Sorry, there's an error.

[00:18:03] Just error. Like nothing. Like, you know, it's not even like it's expired. You put in the wrong thing. It was just like, we can't do that. And then so I spent an hour chasing my tail until I finally went across the pond to find a source. Yeah. Yeah. I had some streaming glitches. So I ended up watching it in a couple of different countries. My family's like looking at me going, are we watching this thing or not?

[00:18:32] And I'm like, and people on the discord are like, try this, try that. And I was like, thank you. And I'm like in this hell of passwords and accounts and double checking things. Oh, it was horrible. It was the absolute worst. And I, and I really thought, oh, oh, it's on Hulu. Okay, great. Yeah. You would have had me if it had worked. Right. I would be like, oh, that's awesome. Like, I'm so glad it worked. But no, now I'm pissed. Well, they, they have a few more years to work it out because even if they do switch, it won't be till 2028.

[00:19:00] That's when the contract is officially up. But, um, I do hope, I mean, it would be nice if we could just all be watching the same broadcast because there was another point where I was watching in Brazil and Conan did this faux commercial for the movie theaters. I ended up watching the clip online later, but at the time I, the Brazilian hosts, I think they didn't realize it wasn't an actual commercial. So they just like, we're like, oops today, you know, and just talked right over it. And then, you know, finally.

[00:19:30] Right. It's back. You know, it's just stuff like that where it just seems like we're cutting into this monocultural experience a little bit. Right. Yeah. But yeah. I apologize to the listeners. I guess that was a little overindulgent walking you through my agony of Hulu experience. I apologize. I'm sure a lot really. I just need to, I appreciate you allowing me to vent. And I have a little catharsis. So thank you. This is a safe space for Hulu Fata. Right.

[00:20:00] So let's talk more about the actual Oscar. But yeah. So the, what you missed was you watched some of it. You said already the opening, we opened with this Cynthia Erivo and Ariana Grande medley of three. Oh, is that very, very first? Because I watched it all out of order. Yeah, that was very, very first. So it was, we had somewhere over the rainbow. We had home from the whiz and then the iconic, obviously defying gravity from wicked. Right.

[00:20:26] And then Conan O'Brien was crawling out of a back, you know, a substance reference. I saw that. Which my mom didn't watch the substance. I told her like, don't watch the substance. It's not for you. It's fine. But she was like, ew, what the hell? What is that? I can imagine if people didn't understand what they were watching, that that would have been a bit of a shocker. Like to start the Oscars with that, that was pretty bold. It was funny. It was funny. It was funny.

[00:20:56] It was on point. It was on point for her. Can I ask you a quick question about Cynthia Erivo? Mm-hmm. I don't know her from before this movie. Oh. But damn, that woman, the way she held the crowd, the way she held the music and the space. Mm-hmm. It was incredible. Yeah.

[00:21:22] She is a, she's a, an, just a, without words. Just an incredible performer. Yeah. And I was like, whoa, wait a minute. What's going on here? That was great. It was absolutely great. Yeah. This was her third Oscar nominee. The last two were for the movie Harriet for acting and song. Okay. And if she had won, then she would have gotten her EGOT. Wow. So she's. Yeah. She's. Very close to an EGOT. Okay. Very cool.

[00:21:52] And obviously she has another chance this coming year because there's going to be another Wicked movie. Okay. I didn't realize. Yeah. I don't know her from at all from before. So I, I'm going to, I'm like, okay, let's bring her. Bring me some more, please. Well, I think it's funny that like, cause normally the opening is, is a tribute to all the movies and this one was like, just wicked. Right. Right. And, and nobody was complaining because they're like, that's fine.

[00:22:20] If these two just want to sing the rest of the ceremony we're in. It's all good. Yeah. But I mean, yeah, Conan, you, you already alluded to, he was, he did a great job as a host. I think one example of how he really threaded the line well is, you know, so Carla Sofia Gascon, she's best actress nominee for the controversial Emilia Perez, and she made it even more controversial. So, um, he had to address that, but he did it in just like the most tasteful way, you know,

[00:22:48] where he's, he's like, Oh, saying more expletives than Carla Sofia, the Gascon's, uh, publicist and the camera flashes to her. And he's like, if you want to tweet about me after this, my name is Jimmy Kimmel. I'd have to say to her credit, she seems to be learning a little bit. She responded on Instagram the next day. Uh, thank you to the Oscars, blah, blah, blah. Uh, and thank you to the host, Jimmy Kimmel, who looks more and more like Conan O'Brien every day. Nice. Good, good, good. She's learning. She's learning.

[00:23:18] It doesn't undo all the things that she said, but she's learning. Right. I also loved, um, when Latvia won for flow, this is the first time Latvia has been nominated. So two nominations for flow, one, one of them going and turns to the camera and says, your move, Estonia. Thank you. Yeah. Um, were you surprised that Nick Offerman was the announcer?

[00:23:41] I, um, I think it was, I, you know, obviously cause we came in late and then what was the bit where he was toying with somebody on stage who was like going to present, I forget who it was. And then that's when I realized that the, I recognized the voice and then actually he was part of the skit and then, uh, my wife and I were like, Oh, and it's Nick. Oh yeah. Get it. And I, he's got a great voice for it.

[00:24:09] Uh, he, he sounds like the, the voice that we want for the Oscars. So yeah, I w I really liked it. Yeah. I didn't realize for a while until. Yeah. Yeah. No, he had that. Something. He had that big announcer voice that sort of disassociated his personality from his voice. So. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you said that you went back and watched the Kieran Culkin speech, which, you know, everyone loves Kieran Culkin speeches. Um, but you missed the first speech was best actor winner.

[00:24:38] And so it was Adrian Brody and it was the longest acceptance speech in Oscar history. It was, I think five minutes and 40 seconds long. That's the one where he stops the music. He tells them to stop the music and he does. Yeah. Yeah. I saw that. And I was cringing. Yeah. Two big cringe moments. And that was the second one. That was a, okay. So there was the, yeah, he starts with the gum toss and then he's like, oh, I've been here before and stuff. Um, yeah. And then he didn't say anything. Yeah.

[00:25:07] Really. In the end, there was nothing profound about what he said. It was just sort of him sort of spouting off. And he's like, I'll be short. I'll be short. I'll be short. I'll be short. It's like when characters on a TV show, I don't have time to explain to you. So, you know, I'm going to explain to you three times that I don't have time to explain to you this critical plot point in our storyline. I'm like, bro, like seriously, if you're going to say what you're going to say, say it. Yeah. Well, we were also bitching in the chat because, uh, there was, you know, we did the ESPN pool to do our bets.

[00:25:37] And the last tiebreaker question was how long do you think the first speech will be? And we all were like, I don't know, a couple of minutes, you know, I think I said 91 seconds, which is actually quite optimistic if I think about it. But yeah, he ruined all of our tiebreaker questions. Was the other cringe moment, the El Mal acceptance song? Yeah. And it got, it was kind of fine.

[00:26:03] It was like, okay, you're, you know, you're an artist, you're a little bit self-absorbed. That's all cool. And then the, when she started to sing, I was like, yeah, you, I think you said this on the discord, you know, she didn't know how to read the room and, uh, you know, or she didn't bother to or whatever. Yeah. I was like, yeah, that, that, that's about sums it up. Apparently Jacques Oudillard, the director was on stage with him because he was also credited as a songwriter in that song.

[00:26:29] Um, and he apparently people heard him say under his breath, like wrap it up. Yikes. And, and people were like, how could she not let him talk? But yeah. Um, the sad part about this is that this means that Diane Warren has lost for the 16th time. So we're all watching. There's actually a documentary that's coming out in theaters, uh, soon called Diane Warren relentless.

[00:26:59] And so we're all watching that in preparation for next year. So it'd be great if she finally got her Oscar for a movie about herself. Right. Yeah. There you go. That would be pretty funny. But how, uh, how exciting was it to see Mick Jagger come on stage? Uh, you know, it wasn't. No. Oh, my mom and I were excited. Sure. Yeah. I think I thought it was cool. I was like, Oh, you know, that was nice. It was very cool. Yeah. Of course.

[00:27:23] I think maybe my Mick surprise was a little bit less just because I'd seen him featured in one of the Saturday night live documentary pieces that they had for SNL 50. And so they had him on a camera, a bunch conversing, and then they played an extended part of one of his, um, skits that he had. So I was kind of like, I don't know, I guess I was pre pre-micked and then I was like, Oh, it's again, you know?

[00:27:53] So, Oh, okay. Well, I guess, um, Bob Dylan was, was less game because I bet they would have had Timothy Chalamet sing Bob Dylan songs if Bob Dylan had let them. Right. Yeah. I think that would have been a little weird, but yeah, it was cool to see Mick. Um, but you, your daughter liked at least the bond, uh, the bond tribute. Well, I, she hasn't, she doesn't know James Bond from the singers. Yeah. Yeah. And that's kind of why they did it. I think. Yeah. I mean, for that part. Right.

[00:28:22] So she liked Lisa and is it Ray? And then, uh, who is the other person? Uh, Doja Cat. Doja Cat. That's right. I thought I was interested with Doja Cat because it musically there's, there was something weird about that song, but I kind of, I don't know. I did. Was it Doja Cat's outfit? My, our, my daughter really keyed on one of the outfits, somebody who had a really sparkly outfit. I don't remember who it was now, but anyway. Halle Berry maybe. Hmm. Yeah. I think it might've been.

[00:28:52] I think it might've been, but, uh, yeah, Doja Cat. I, you know, I don't really know her, her music that much. And I was kind of, I was sort of impressed by her performance because it was a very stately performance. And I think of her as a meme artist and not as a, uh, a classically presented, uh, entertainer in that way. So. I mean, these are obviously, I know Lisa from Blackpink from, from the White Lotus. That's basically. Right. Exactly. This is the first time I think I might've heard all these people sing, but I've heard

[00:29:20] of, I've heard of Blackpink and I've heard of Doja Cat, but I, yeah, they're, they weren't there for me. They were there for your daughter. Exactly. And Lisa seems to be everywhere right now. So she's, she's doing a lot, uh, obviously Blackpink, but Lisa herself and, uh, Blackpink and specifically Lisa have eclipsed Taylor Swift in my, uh, my daughter's estimation. So. All right. Big shoes, Phil. Exactly.

[00:29:49] But yeah, I mean, a lot of people were baffled by the whole Bond tribute because there's no Bond movie this year or next. Uh, but so the broccoli family who were the ones being honored there, they're the ones who have held control creatively of the Bond movie franchise. And they just recently sold the rights to Amazon and that's been quite controversial. So I think there was something of like a hidden entertainment business political statement in this, uh.

[00:30:16] Which I thought was interesting because to get, uh, three very hot singers, right. In, in terms of, uh, of the corner of the market that those singers dominate in to get stage time at the Oscars to, and to not have a tie in other than the fact that licensing is transferring to Amazon. Mm-hmm.

[00:30:42] I thought, well, that's a hell of a coup because the Oscars are planning, like they're already planning Oscars, you know, for the future. Right. Mm-hmm. The, the, the next year's Oscars planning started today. I would assume. Cause that's a huge technical. Yeah. Yeah. The basics. But of course they don't even know what movies are going to be. No, no. Until like two, a month before, two months before maybe. So yeah.

[00:31:09] So they have to have the machinery in place to be able to execute on all that kind of stuff. And so to, to pull a number like that, to get the songs, to get the queuing, the state, all that stuff. That's a pretty big deal to get anything on stage at the Oscars. That's a big deal. So like, what was that all about? I don't really know. So, and is it coincidental that, or did Amazon, did they intentionally release the, the, the news about the licensing change ahead of the Oscars intentionally?

[00:31:40] Because they had this. I don't know. I, I, I don't understand it. I don't understand how the pieces. I mean, I think you'd be surprised how much has to be pulled together last minute just because like they can't. Yeah. Because they can't really, until they get the nominations, they don't really know exactly who they're asking for what and, yeah. And to, to pair the presenters appropriately and, oh man, to prepare all the graphics packages. It's a huge deal. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:32:07] And they also, they managed to, they had that Quincy Jones tribute. So we had Queen Latifah. Right. We got some more whiz, some whiz nods. Yeah. The year of Wizard of Oz, we were calling it on the discord. But also they pulled together very last minute because he'd only died like a day or so before that Gene Hackman tribute. Right. Yep.

[00:32:29] For my, for our 11z's movie podcast, I will be doing a Gene Hackman film festival. I think I'm January, February, March, April. What am I? March, April. Am I April or May? I just put the spreadsheet together. I don't even remember. Anyway, we're going to do a Gene Hackman film festival. So, you know, subscribers look forward to that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was surprised. Speaking of our last film festival, I was really surprised that they, they had like

[00:32:57] a little extra time for Lynch in the regular in memoriam. Yes. But yeah, I was really surprised that he didn't get his own tribute because I would say David Lynch is one of the most influential filmmakers ever. And he was nominated, I think like four times. Right. So, although Isabella Rossellini wore a blue velvet dress, like in the movie, blue velvet. So she's a classy lady.

[00:33:25] I watched the in memoriam and it, it, it was strange because some people got less time than more time and more time. And there are different, there were certain actors who are like, wow, that is, that person was huge. And they got like nothing on screen. And then they paused and lingered with others, which was all fine. So I didn't really understand the in memoriam this year. Uh, it, it felt a little, uh, it didn't seem right to me in some way. Yeah.

[00:33:52] I mean, I know, um, well, I was most upset that Michelle Trachtenberg who, you know, she just died at the age of 37, uh, something about a liver transplant. So that's, I found that really personally sad because that's an actress who I grew up, you being is my peer, uh, watching her from a young age. And, and she wasn't, she wasn't in there at all, which I was surprised by. I mean, she's not nominated for an Oscar, but she was still a film actress. Right. Yeah.

[00:34:22] And this covers a lot of people. So, right. Yeah. Yeah. And I, um, I personally, I love Mozart's Requiem, which is, I understand quite dark. And so I understand that there's been complaints about the tone of the music that it should have been something more bittersweet rather than just, but I also just feel like dark is the moment, you know, it's, it's dark out there and, uh, I need some sounds that recognize the pain in me. Yeah. Sorry. That's a verve lyric. That's always in my head. Yeah.

[00:34:51] And there I'm looking variety even has an article about the people who are, uh, not included like Shannon Doherty and Tony Todd. Yeah. So yeah, it's strange. It's a head scratcher. I don't, I don't know why. Yeah. I don't know what happened. Yeah. It does feel, yeah, that did feel off, but we lost some, a lot of big people this year too. So it looks like I didn't realize it was a heavy year for that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, on the lighter side, what did you think of the best costume presentation?

[00:35:21] I think that is when we just joined. And so I kind of missed some of that, but I went back and got the beginning of it with, uh, Yang and Lithgow's little funny thing. And that was cute. I thought that was quite funny. And I love the through line of Lithgow's scowling face. That was a good gag for the whole thing. I was just talking about this with John last night when we were recording, uh, Empire Strikes Back for the Star Wars film festival, speaking of film festivals.

[00:35:50] And in that movie, there's a couple of through lines that they have, like with the Millennium Falcons, uh, uh, jump drive networking or Vader as he's always like killing his top, you know, uh, top commanding officers. And those two things work really well to, to create some bones for the movie. So having a through line and not even a gag gag, but just something that people could refer to or, or grab onto and make a little joke of all the way through, I think really helps

[00:36:19] narratively with some structure. So I thought that was a, that was a really good gag to bring into play. Yeah. Yeah. I know. I, I think, uh, Bo and Yang and John Lithgow were secret. Yeah. They were second MVPs of the night. Um, it was also, it was a good win. I think Wicked was the deserving win for this, you know, see our tech episode for why our production design and tech episode for why. Um, but yeah, it was also Paul Tazawall. He became the first black man to win costume.

[00:36:49] So that was a landmark. I think we dropped into the, the, the broadcast right about that point. So. Okay. Okay. Uh, we also had a, obviously I mentioned the landmark for Latvia's first Oscar nomination and thus win. So, uh, you know, in Riga in the capital of Latvia, they built a statue of the black cat from flow. Oh, that's awesome. That's great. And I heard some commentary today too, that, uh, this movie had flow had the least number

[00:37:17] of people on the crew and that it was done with free software that anybody can do. I used to work there. Yeah. Oh, wow. Amazing. So like, that's, I was like, oh, that's really cool. You know? So, um, yeah. Yeah. And I love the fact that something like it, again, with Anora, right. There's the, the, this, an outsider has to be an outsider, but like when an outsider crawls in through the window or sort of slips in through a unexpected zone somehow, like,

[00:37:46] and you welcome them in, it's like, it's great to see that outsiders are still getting on the inside. Right. With this kind of stuff. So I, and I don't know anything about the flow production team, but the fact that a small team could use some free software, you know, some available software like that to make a Oscar winning hit. That's great. That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah, definitely check out the animation and international episodes for more information

[00:38:11] about how flow was made, but it was a very, very impressive. And, uh, I love to see it when I, I kept calling my cat shadow, a little Oscar winner all day yesterday. Um, I loved, I was so glad that I'm still here one in international and I'm sure that I know Brazil wanted actress as well. Uh, but I hope they were celebrating that, that win in international. Um, for sure.

[00:38:40] The, on the Dutch side, the Dutch were up for two shorts. One was expected to win the animated short wander to wonder. And that one actually lost. Although it, it, the one that won is, was my second favorite in that category in the shadow of the Cyprus, which was an Iranian film, which is, it's just nice to see Iranian film, uh, had a moment at the Oscars, despite the censorship problems that they're facing there. Good.

[00:39:05] Um, but the, everyone told me I'm not a robot was not going to win live action shorts and ha ha it did. The Dutch did get an Oscar, but it was also, that was my favorite live action short and you should be able to find it on YouTube. I'm not a robot. It was from the New Yorker, but of course the big winner was a Nora with five Oscars. Were you surprised? Were you happy? Uh, I was, um, I guess a little mildly surprised. I think it's a big deal.

[00:39:34] I, I, I heard another commentary, some other commentary that, uh, remind me the director's name. It's not Sean Baker. Yeah. Sean Baker. Thank you. Has four Oscars to his name. And I think that's more than Lucas has or something like that. Well, so he took, he took home for editing. He took him four Oscars in one night. Yeah. Editing, directing, writing and film. Um, and so that is a record. It ties for the record. Walt Disney got four Oscars in one night.

[00:40:04] That's right. Yeah. Right. But Walt Disney got it for four different films and Sean Baker is the only person to ever get four Oscars for a single film. Okay. So, and, and is that the mode, uh, and, and then who, so for, so who, yeah, I'm just curious as to who individually has the most Oscars. Overall. Oh, definitely people have more than four. Okay. Yeah. But it's, it was a big deal for it in one night, but, um, I mean, it was also as a big deal.

[00:40:30] The budget for Nora was 6 million and it's now it earned 41 million globally, which makes it the lowest grossing best picture winner ever. Okay. Okay. But it was, it drove. Well, first of all, yeah, it was the second winner of the Palm door, um, at the Oscars after parasite a few years ago. And neon is the, uh, the, the studio behind it. The distribution company is now a force to be reckoned with because, uh, neon was also behind

[00:41:00] parasite, but also they have been, they've had the Palm door winning, uh, film at con for the last five years. And these are previous Oscar nominees, like triangle of sadness. And well, Tishian wasn't nominated for an Oscar, but anyway, it's yeah. Neon is definitely a studio, a, uh, distribution house to watch. They're making a big name at the Oscars and it drove to a somewhat surprising win of Mikey Madison over Demi Moore.

[00:41:28] Um, because Demi Moore got the SAG, but Mikey Madison got a lot of awards. So. Right. It didn't, um, didn't Demi Moore, uh, sort of run the table on all of the other, uh, award ceremony. Um, they, they split them, but she got, but she got the SAG win. So people thought that meant, yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. That's a nod to the Oscars. So yeah. Right. Cause they're the biggest voting body at the Oscars, the actors. So. Right. Yeah.

[00:41:53] Um, but yeah, they were really kind of spread the wealth with the winners overall this year, which I thought was a good thing. It did. It was, it, there was no, yeah. Other than Anora, which then it didn't even, Oh, it didn't over dominate. Right. It won. It dominated, but not, not in a, in a crazy way. And the brutalist was another one that was originally expected to be a best picture winner. It got three.

[00:42:16] So, um, sub, I mean, conclave, which was considered to be a front runner for best picture ended up only walking away with one. It should have gotten actor. Yeah. I, I really, yeah. I think fines is, his performance was pretty sublime in that. I really liked, I, I, I personally enjoyed it more than the brutalist, but that's just on a personal taste level. So. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then Amelia Perez got their actress and song, Oh, sorry. Supporting actress.

[00:42:45] It's category fraud. Well, I, and I have to say for, for Zoe Saldana, she's a hardworking actor. She's a hardworking actor. And she's been in a lot, uh, for both TV and film. And I'm not sure is she on stage at all. I wouldn't be surprised if she is. Yeah. But I mean, uh, So I was happy for her because she, I, I, I respect a hell out of her and the stuff that she puts out. And I thought she did a good job in the, in the movie. She was compelling. Sure.

[00:43:13] But, um, the, my joke was my snide remark was in the direction that no one who was actually a supporting actor walked home with a statue. Uh, it was given to, cause Karen Culkin was also the second lead of his movies. I've only watched half of a real pain. My wife and I, uh, started watching it, uh, the other night. And we're going to come back to it. And I think you and me and John wanted to talk about it once we, uh. Yeah. I, yeah, that was one of my favorite, one of my favorite films of the year. So I definitely want to talk about it.

[00:43:42] Um, yeah. Wicked got two production design awards. Doom got two technical awards. That was expected. Substance got one technical award. Um, and yeah. And then, you know, there were four categories. It's interesting though. There were only four categories in which all five nominees were only nominated in that category. And that was the three shorts categories and documentary feature. And, um, every other category, the winner was nominated for more than one award.

[00:44:12] Okay. So basically, yeah. For people who are predicting in the future, whenever you see a film like flow nominated for more than one award, that's more likely to win its category. Even if it's up against, uh, the favorite was wild robots. Um, and also obviously, uh, inside out two was the highest grossing film of the year. Mm hmm. Um, but also, so it's kind of a, a strength, right? If you're, if you're showing up in other places, it means you're registering on people's radars. Right.

[00:44:42] Yeah. And I think there was also, you know, with, with everything that's been going on with the big studios and the strikes and everything, I think it was a year where people really wanted to reward independent cinema. And I think Nora benefited from that flow benefit from that. Um, yeah, definitely is quite a few beneficiaries of that. Right. Yeah. And so it's a weird year and there's a lot that's changing in the marketplace as well with streamers.

[00:45:11] And, you know, uh, streamers subsuming traditional studios. And what does that mean from small screen to big screen? I did really appreciate all of the effort to remind people that going out to theaters is a great cultural event. It's a great cure for loneliness. It's a great cure for being with your neighbors, because I think that's probably a lot of what we're dealing with. Uh, culturally is, is that we're not around other people. We're isolating ourselves.

[00:45:40] And so tolerance and understanding and all of those kinds of things. So anyway, I really appreciated their push on go out to the theaters. And, and I wish I could have seen more of these in, in theaters. And it's just hard modern life and kids, families, the time you have to devote to get someplace to go see it. You know, you have different constraints in your life, but even you, I think we're struggling to get to the theaters and, you know, in balancing life. Yeah. I, you know, yeah.

[00:46:08] Just trying to keep up with endless work. Right. Got podcasts to edit, man. Got content to put. Well, yeah, this is the endless job search, but, um, the, it was a lot of them were not even released in theaters until after nominations or even I'm still here. Wasn't released in theaters until after the Oscars. Like, come on. Right. What are we doing? Frustrating. Yeah.

[00:46:33] So I would love to see more, uh, more films from earlier in the year nominated. So everyone go see Mickey 17. I haven't seen it yet, but I'm trusting it's going to be good. And let's all talk it up all year long. Is that a high on our list? I think it's on our, on our show tracker or, uh, for the year is Mickey 17 is, is one, something I remember seeing an entry for. So yeah, it's coming up. Yeah, it definitely should be. It's so it's, uh, from Bong Joon-ho, who's the South Korean filmmaker. Oh, great. He was the one who made Parasite.

[00:47:03] So he's definitely on the Oscar radar now. He also made like Snowpiercer and the host and Okja. He's one of my favorite directors personally. So, all right. Yeah, no, that's, that's a must see. That is absolutely a must see. Yeah. Yeah. It's sci-fi. It's Robert Pattinson as he's Mickey, but then, uh, he has a job where he gets, he gets killed and reprinted over and over again. Okay. Sounds perfect. Yeah. Yeah. Sounds perfect.

[00:47:30] But yeah, so that brings us to the 2026 Oscars death race starts now. So I will put a link in the, uh, to my letterbox list in the, in the show notes that it's a list of films to keep an eye on. It's a very long list. So it'll look overwhelming. I am getting it in some sort of release order slowly as I have time.

[00:47:52] Um, but, and, and of course there's like a heavy emphasis on things that I personally like, like horror and science fiction, but Hey, horror and science fiction did pretty well this year. So. Yeah, it did. And that we actually got a horror film as a, as a nominee is pretty wild. Yeah. Two. Yeah. Well, as a best picture. Yeah. And two that were overall, uh, any final thoughts that you had about the ceremony, the season?

[00:48:16] Uh, I, uh, outside of that frustration, uh, I enjoyed the ceremony and it was good. Uh, I thought that we're, um, I think we're creating a nice tradition within the lorehounds community with this. And I think it's just great. The, the amount of work that you do and the other, the voices that you bring in from around the globe, because it's very easy for this podcast to be very U S centric. And we have more listeners around the world.

[00:48:45] And I, I think that it's a great service that you do for the community that you're able to pull in different people with different experiences and backgrounds, both directly in, you know, especially around directly, uh, related to film. So I, I really love to see that there's a certain part of our community that are into films that are into the Oscars. And then that is starting to generate momentum. I was surprised by the ESPN poll thing that you guys pulled together. Cause I wasn't monitoring that channel. And I was like, Oh, that's great.

[00:49:14] We should totally do that next year and make sure that that's part of our activities and our events. So I'm just really looking forward to, uh, you know, talking with our community and seeing what ideas that you come up with and seeing how we can year on year. Have more fun with this and improve the experience for, for all of us. And I I'm interested in one thing that I'm kind of interested in is, okay, next year will be my third year doing this Oscars stuff.

[00:49:41] And so starting to look at some of the historical trends or what was it, you know, what was our betting for last year for this one or what have you in doing some comparisons. So, uh, I, I guess that's just a broad general of, of, uh, reaction to in, uh, being enthusiastic for next year because we've, we've been building something for these last two years. And I think it's great. Yeah.

[00:50:06] And I think you had a great idea that, uh, we should, I should check in, um, in December when the short lists are dropped and just, and we can have like a little conversation about, okay, these are the films that people should be paying attention to. Because these are most likely to dominate nominations, things like that. Okay. That's a good idea. Yeah. Yeah. And to get sort of, cause it's, it's a, this year particularly was awkward because of the delays and the changes and the, and that kind of stuff.

[00:50:33] But to start thinking at the beginning of the year about what, you know, catching up on some of the, the easier ones to get to so that the end of the year is not such a crunch. Right. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And I was pleasantly surprised how many of them that we had already covered, um, at least five of them before the Oscar nominations were even announced. So. Yeah, that's true. That's right. That's right. Yeah. So do you have any other films that you're going to watch from this year's Oscars, uh, now?

[00:51:03] Yeah. Still up on my watch board. I have a complete unknown. I got to finish. I'm still here and I got to finish wicked are definitely going to get there. I'm going to throw flow onto our family watch list. Yeah. For sure. Um, and I'm curious, uh, to see if, if, uh, if we're able to get, um, what was the, uh, documentary that won the, um, I'm forgetting. Oh yeah. Um, no other land, no other land. Yeah.

[00:51:33] I think that would be an important one to, to watch as well. Yeah. And I did, by the way, in the documentary episode, um, because that one, that documentary really throws you in the middle of the conflict and it does a good job of making it, um, you know, visceral in that way. But also I would suggest, um, people might want to look up John Oliver did a 30 minute, uh, bit of, I mean, you know, not a bit like a report about the entire conflict there six months ago.

[00:51:58] So if you just go on YouTube and look up John Oliver, uh, West bank, then, you know, you, you, that gives all the context that you need for what the film's actually throwing you in the middle of. Gotcha. Sounds good. Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, and a real pain and yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Real pain as well. Yep. We're going to finish watching that. Uh, and sing, sing. I recommended to you and better man. That's right. Yeah, that's right. I think I've got, I don't know.

[00:52:23] I have many lists around because there's like the things that I'm trying to keep track of. And there's the things that, uh, I want to watch with, uh, you know, with my wife. It's funny because the day that you, we recorded, I think the book end and you had recommended a real pain that night. My wife was like, oh yeah, let's watch a real pain. I was like, oh, okay. It was funny. Cause also, uh, John and Maya were watched it. That same night. Yeah. Exactly. Same night. It was perfect. Yeah. Well, I guess it's breaking through into, you know, the cultural zeitgeist. So I'm glad to see.

[00:52:53] Yeah. Hear it. Yeah. Definitely excited for more from Jesse Eisenberg. For sure. Yeah. I think it was, uh, so far from what I've seen, it's a real strong, uh, real strong story, a clear vision. And I really, I could see his career, uh, his filmmaking career really going forward from here. Yeah. All right. Balls in your court, Jesse Eisenberg. Hope you're writing next year's best picture winner. Everybody go see Mickey 17 and whatever else in the theaters. I'm hearing good things about the monkey. I want to go see that this weekend. I hope to. Okay.

[00:53:23] Go to cinemas if you can, you know, not to, not to shame anybody if you can, but like, yeah, the idea of being able to go, I'm actually looking forward to, to the point where our daughter's able to, you know, she's starting to make food, you know, make her own lunch. She was making some ramen earlier today and, and, uh, doing more and more things on her own and being home alone by her, you know, for us to be able to go out. So I'm really looking for, we're on the cusp of that, uh, time period in our life.

[00:53:51] So I'm, I'm really looking forward to, oh, I can go to the movies. I can block a couple of two, three hours out of my day and not feel guilty or worried. So, you know, right, right. And share something with her. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Well, yeah. Okay. That's a good note to end on. Go to the cinemas and take your families if you can, or friends or yourself. I like going by myself. Fair enough. All right. Thank you, David. And looking forward to talking more movies with you this year. Uh, bravo, Alicia.

[00:54:21] Really great job on this whole season. I know you pulled it together because we were waiting for the list and then you had to pull your guests and stuff like that. So you really did an excellent job. And I just, uh, I, I think on behalf of the community, I know there's a lot of community members who really appreciate the work that you put into this. So on behalf of all of them, thank you for bringing this to our community. Well, thank you. And hopefully we can spread out the episodes a bit more next year. Well, every year we're going to just keep, yeah.

[00:54:51] We're going to keep iterating. Yeah. And hopefully no fires, obviously for more reasons than that. And God, it sounds like the Carolinas and Georgia right now are being affected, which is terrible as well. Just after there. My thoughts are with those in the fire zone and may this not be another year of such intensely on point documentary fodder. Yeah. Okay. Let's, uh, let's think of those people. Be courageous in the world. Think of people complexly. Thank you, Alicia, for all your work. Thank you. Bye all.

[00:55:21] Thank you all for listening. The Lorehounds podcast is produced and published by the Lorehounds. You can send questions and feedback and voicemails at thelorehounds.com slash contact. Get early and ad free access to all Lorehounds podcasts at patreon.com slash the Lorehounds. Any opinions stated are ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any employers or other entities. Thanks for listening.

[00:55:54] Hey, everyone. David here. Severance is back. The Lorehounds are partnering with Properly Howard to bring you in-depth weekly coverage of season two. Join me, John, Anthony, and Steve as we unpack every twist, theory, and revelation. We've created a dedicated feed just for our Severance coverage.

[00:56:17] Simply search for Severance Lorehounds in your podcast app or find the direct link in our link tree. Our weekly episodes dig deep into the show's mysteries, themes, and bigger questions about identity and consciousness that make Severance so compelling. Season Pass and regular community subscribers get ad-free access to our weekly episodes, plus

[00:56:42] exclusive content like our Supply Closet bonus series, featuring fascinating conversations with experts like the team from Nevermind the Music. We've explored the neuroscience of memory and personality, decoded the hidden meanings in the show's musical themes, and there's much more to come. You'll also get Steve and Anthony's complete season one rewatch series. We believe in total transparency with our listeners.

[00:57:10] And unlike Mammalians Nurturable, we're happy to share all of our secrets. Find the link for the Severance feed in the show notes below, or search Severance Lorehounds wherever you get your podcasts. Come theorize with us about what's really happening at Lumen.

[00:57:29] Of the episode that thinks it's about to be a...